# Aristo Heavyweights.....and other issues?



## Cap'nBill (Dec 27, 2008)

I have an Aristo Pennsy diner I bought used a while back. It had 3 axle trucks. I notice in the Aristo catalog, looks like they come with 2 axle trucks. I also notice some 3 axle trucks on ebay for $85! What was/is standard?
I tried to order some parts from Aristo, diaphrgm and steps. I got steps which really didn't fit very well, and no diaphrgm. I wonder if this was bad timing, or they just don't sell parts. Guess I think for the MRP of these, there would be basic stuff available..............Oh well.


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## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

Are you asking what the Pennsy used, or whether to Aristo's came with 2 or 3 axle trucks? I can't help you on what the Pennsy used for trucks, but at one time, I believe that Aristo heavyweights could be purchased with a choice of 2 or 3 axle trucks, at least for some car types. I have found that the Aristo heavyweights run better with two axles per truck, especially if they were supposed to have three axles to start out with. I have some that came with two axle trucks and some cars with three axle trucks. All the trucks now all have two axles, whether they started out with 2 or 3 axles. The three axle trucks did not like my 10' diameter curves, they were worse than bricks. There wasn't enough play in the middle axle. I removed my middle axle on all of them, it isn't noticeable and they run better. It has been mentioned, that the newer cars with 3 axle truck run better, I don't have any, so I can't speak on that issue. I've had mine for many many years.

Greg E. does some magic on the center axle and his work with out having to remove them. 


Chuck


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## Tom Parkins (Jan 2, 2008)

The real Pennsy diners were almost all 3 axle trucks. Pennsy did use 2 axles on other cars, notably coaches and baggage cars but even some others.


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## Cap'nBill (Dec 27, 2008)

Thanks for the info! I honestly never thought of what was prototypical for the various types of cars, nor the Railroad. That would be an interesting 'chart' for RR lovers. While the big '3 wheelers' look good, I think one needs a 12' minimum radius. I'll have to check Greg's site on this, thanks again, Bill.


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## Paul Burch (Jan 2, 2008)

Ball bearing wheels will do wonders for tighter radius curves but that can get pricey.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

The 3 axle trucks, at least the newer versions will run fine on 10' diameter and somewhat smaller curves.

Most times, people having trouble have not lubricated the trucks so that they swivel freely... read my page:

*http://www.elmassian.com/trains-mai...ainmenu-90* 


Basically, they come so dry from the factory, that the trucks will lock up when hitting a curve, my brand new ones derailed out of the box, and after lubing performed perfectly.

Some of the older 3 axle trucks did not have enough play in the center axle, but I have never seen a set that could not be made to work correctly.

Greg


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## jfrank (Jan 2, 2008)

I have found that the wheels are almost always out of gauge on these cars..........way out. Aristo uses a cheap plastic axle that easily slips out of gauge. It easy to tell as they bounce over the switch frogs and derail.


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## aceinspp (Jan 2, 2008)

Sorry to say the heavy weights come with metal axles and wheels. I did install BB in the journals and made a big difference for rolling. My LS Mike can now pull all six of mine up my 1% grade. Later RJD


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## artgibson (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Cap'nBill on 27 Aug 2011 11:55 AM 
I have an Aristo Pennsy diner I bought used a while back. It had 3 axle trucks. I notice in the Aristo catalog, looks like they come with 2 axle trucks. I also notice some 3 axle trucks on ebay for $85! What was/is standard?
I tried to order some parts from Aristo, diaphrgm and steps. I got steps which really didn't fit very well, and no diaphrgm. I wonder if this was bad timing, or they just don't sell parts. Guess I think for the MRP of these, there would be basic stuff available..............Oh well.

I did not know that Aristo made diaphrams for there heavyweights. I got some from USA and they worked fine on some of my cars. 
I have since ordered some from David Leech for my UP heavyweights that i pull behind the BB and hopefully behind the ------------.


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## aceinspp (Jan 2, 2008)

AC diaphragms not of the greatest. I bought some from USAT and installed on my heavy weights and it sure made a big difference. Even closed the gap between the cars with out having to redo the couplers. later RJD


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## jfrank (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By aceinspp on 29 Aug 2011 01:18 PM 
Sorry to say the heavy weights come with metal axles and wheels. I did install BB in the journals and made a big difference for rolling. My LS Mike can now pull all six of mine up my 1% grade. Later RJD 

I don't know why you are sorry. If they made this improvement all I can say is it's about time. However, there are still a lot of the old ones out there and they are crapola and they show up on ebay and elsewhere all the time. As I said, the problem is easly fixed by either repairing and regauging the existing wheels or just replacing them.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

John, I think you are describing the earlier versions where they did indeed have metal wheels, but each wheel had a metal half axle, and a piece of plastic tube held the 2 axles together. 

If this is what you are describing, I agree, that wheel "assembly" type is aptly described as "crapola". They don't hold gage well, sometimes they split, and some do not run very true. 

There are other differences between the old style trucks and new style. The newer ones track better IF you have them lubricated. 

Regards, Greg


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

The most recent heavyweights are much improved. They have excellent led interior lighting, they no longer have the gold trim around the windows, and they have a slightly different truck--the difference being the "rib" on the flat where the truck meets the body. They also have a different and better way of mounting the steps. They come with conventional aristo metal wheels, not the old style Greg described, with the plastic tube axle. I recently bought a PRR coach with the correct-for-PRR two wheel trucks, and a B&O coach which also came with two wheel trucks, which I prefer although though I think the two wheel trucks would have been more accurate. 

As Greg mentioned lubing them makes a big difference. And if you can swing the cost, ball bearing wheels make a very big difference.


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## jfrank (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Greg Elmassian on 30 Aug 2011 11:22 PM 
John, I think you are describing the earlier versions where they did indeed have metal wheels, but each wheel had a metal half axle, and a piece of plastic tube held the 2 axles together. 

If this is what you are describing, I agree, that wheel "assembly" type is aptly described as "crapola". They don't hold gage well, sometimes they split, and some do not run very true. 

There are other differences between the old style trucks and new style. The newer ones track better IF you have them lubricated. 

Regards, Greg 


Yes Greg. Thank you for clarifying that for everyone. As you say the old style wheels are really bad. Reason I posted that was because we encounter that problem all the time here. Someone shows up at the track with some nice new cars they bought off ebay and they immediately jump off the track and make a big mess and tie up everything. I have to get out my gauge and show them how far off the wheels are. Ane they are just amazed as am I at how poorly designed those plastic tubes and axles are.


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## aceinspp (Jan 2, 2008)

Well all I can say is I have never seen these types of wheels come stock from AC on the heavy weights. Could it be that some one has changed out the wheels sets. I have a very early version and it does not have the plastic axle as described. Later RJD


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## Torby (Jan 2, 2008)

As was explained to me by an old, rotund railfan:

Heavyweight cars were right on the borderline of too heavy for 2 axle trucks. So lighter ones had 2 axle trucks and heavier ones had 3. 
I have 2 Pennsy cars dated 2004 or so, one had 3 axles and one has 2. Both ran very nicely in my shop layout with 15 and 16.5 ft diameter curves and #6 crossover. For a time at the Botanic, every wreck was blamed on 3 axle trucks, even if it was a freight that wrecked.



There was an old "Steel" wheelset that had 2 halves joined by a piece of plastic tube. With time the tube broke and the train wrecked. Was a pretty easy repair. I haven't seen one of those for a long time. My heavyweights have bright colored metal wheels (plated brass). They're on a shelf in a book store in Macomb, and I haven't actually seen them in some time. Ethan tells me they were there a few weeks ago. Maybe I'll go down there one weekend when the Botanic closes for the season.


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## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

The axles with the plastic sleeve must have been phased out very early in the production of the heavyweights. I just went out and checked mine and they are all metal axles. I purchased my heavyweights in the mid 90s sometime after we moved to Virginia in 1993. I remember a member of the Denver Garden Railway Society bringing some to a show we were running, that had to be before our move. I have no idea when they first came out.

The material that Aristo uses for the diaphragms has changed. My original B&O heavyweights have hard plastic diaphragms. The heavyweight baggage cars that came out a few years ago are a soft flexible plastic (silicon rubber?).


Chuck


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