# NT: How much of my iPhone's data plan will three hours of watching video chew up?



## joe rusz (Jan 3, 2008)

My wife wants to watch her favorite TV show (NFL football) while sitting in an area where wi-fi may not be available. That means using our ATT data plan, which is not the unlimited package. How much of that will three hours of a game eat up?

What if there is wi-fi? Then we don't need to use ATT, right? And if it's free, then we're home free, right?

Sorry to ask such a simple question, but we are simple (minded) people.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

what are you using to watch it with? (program / service ) 

what resolution? 

yes, on wifi you are not using your data plan 

Greg


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## joe rusz (Jan 3, 2008)

Greg, we'd be watching it on our iPhone 4S. I wasn't aware that there's an option to change resolution. "NFL To Go," or whatever the program is called can be accessed by computer or portable device (iPad, iPhone, etc).


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

ok, so without specific information on the name of the program, I cannot give you specific information on the resolution of the picture you receive. (There's TONS of different services) 

That makes a HUGE difference in the data sent. 

What I suggest is check your current data usage (most services have an app or you can usually send *DATA# (you do it like a phone call) and it tells you your month to data data usage) 

Now watch a show for an hour, and then check your data usage... 

Then you will know how many bytes per hour. 

Of course you need to turn off wifi to do this. 

Greg


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## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

How much of that will three hours of a game eat up 
Joe, 
I was recently in the Verizon store asking about the MiFi (it's a cellular phone that acts as a WiFi hub and can support multiple users. Same as you have in your iPhone but more flexible.) 

I then googled "how many GB is a HD movie" and there were some replies from the Apple support forums. The general answer sems to be about 1GB per hour - more if it is 1080p HD and less if it is just DVD quality. (But it could be as much as 2-3GB/hour it seems - as Greg says - it depends.)

I seem to recall Verizon were offering 5GB/month in the basic data plan, so that would be only approx 5 hours of movie per month. It didn't work for me but check your plan limits.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

That's how big the file is on a computer. 

It does not take into consideration compression and overhead. 

It's probably close. 

Greg


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## joe rusz (Jan 3, 2008)

Thanks guys. Now here's another question. While watching the aforementioned "NFL To Go"--sending the signal by connecting cable from our laptop to our flat-screen TV--we noticed that some games' picture quality was better than others, and not even close to being as good as the HD games being sent directly to our TV through the same cable and by the same cable provider (Oceanic). I realize that there is a huge disparity among broadcast cameras, equipment, etc. (it seems the "A" games have the best picture), but why do the games we download from our cable-fed computer look so inferior? Bandwith?


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

What interface did you connect your laptop to the TV? VGA, DVI, HDMI? 

Makes a difference to the TV... also, remember the comment I made about the resolution of the data you receive, and the compression? 

What resolution is the data file you downloaded? 

What data type? (h.264, AVI, MPEG etc?) 

There's a number of factors. 

If it is not becoming clear, this is a complex question if you don't know all the parameters. 

Even with all this data, most people could not answer the question accurately. 

Greg


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## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

sending the signal by connecting cable from our laptop to our flat-screen TV 
I assume you were getting 'cable from your laptop' by using the internet service, not the television service? 

some games' picture quality was better than others, and not even close to being as good as the HD games being sent directly to our TV 
Joe, 

As Greg said, it depends... 

I have been connecting my laptop to my TV for similar purposes [though not the NFL! Wife read about Nashville while we were in CA and wantd to watch it, so I played it back from ABC when we got home.] 

First issue: my TV connection is HDMI -- BUT the TV is only a "slave" monitor from a PC. So the TV won't display anything better than your laptop can show. (Yeah - that was a bummer. I was recordng HD over the air on the laptop but couldn't play it back at native resolution!) My old laptop is something like 1400 x 768 resolution, and my HD TV wouldn't even pay attention at 768. I reconfigured the display to 1200 x 720 and the TV was happy to display a 720p picture. 

The second problem is the nature of the internet that you used to watch "NFL to Go". Most services, like Netflix or abc.com (and NFL to Go, I bet) use their own "player", which is a program/add-on loaded into the browser - i.e. your computer - to play the video, and they check your connection speed *at that instant* and throttle down if they can't get as much as they want. The throttling down is done by cutting the resolution of the playback - 720p doesn't require as much bandwidth as 1080p. This throttling can be even more pronounced if everyone else is trying to watch at the same time - particularly a live NFL game! 

The "live" game issue is particularly bad for the internet. Your HD picture via cable to the TV is just one picture that is sent to everyone on the cable - a true "broadcast" of '1 to many'. There is no 'broadcast' on the internet - you establish a connection to NFL and they send you data packets of video which your laptop displays. They also send the packets to the guy next door, and the guy down the block, and to everyone who connects. None of the internet users shares the incoming picture/video/data packet - they all get their own individual copy. So for a live game, the TV signal is just broadcast as usual, and the internet is thoroughly congested with all the different people connecting to NFL and demanding the data. Not only is the network straining to cope, but the NFL website has to deal with a gazillion simultaneous users. 

If you watch NFL to Go and I watch Nashville from abc.com whle the kid next door plays an online game, the network congestion is similar, but the websites aren't quite as strained. (But now you know why CNN.com crashes when there is a global crisis!)

Until recently, my local cable company was claiming true HD but actually sent 720p. (Not HD in my book.) Now they are 1080i, which is 1080 resolution but only half as fast, so you may see movement problems. You should ask your provider what they actually send. 

It is extremely complicated trying to figure this stuff out. The information provided is sketchy at best, and the sellers haven't a clue - ask a Verizon guy how much data it takes to watch the NFL on an iPhone and he won't have a good answer. 

So my new laptop is true HD: 1920 x 1080 and I don't have to reconfigure to watch HD via the internet. I just plugged it in to the TV last night and we watched last Wednesday's 'Nashville' pilot episode. The next problem is that laptops don't have remote controls. . .


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## joe rusz (Jan 3, 2008)

Thanks again, guys. Pete, since you mentioned these things, our TV--a 42-inch Zenith (nee, LG, I'm told)-- has HDMI inputs and outputs, but my six-year-old Dell laptop is linked to the TV via the TV's RGB-PC input, which the TV does a pretty good job sniffing out ("Do you wish to use this?"). So the TV acts as a monitor as far as the laptop is concerned. And that means, as Pete said, my resolution is determined in part by the laptop. As for what we receive from Oceanic Cable (owned by Time Warner): it's pretty much the only game in town in Hawaii, especially in West Maui, where I don't think there's any broadcast signal except possibly Dish Network. So we are at Oceanic's mercy. The condo we're in is 44-years-old with built-in cable that's the same age. It is reasonably fast, but no FIOS. It does, however, play back 1080i nicely on our TV and we love the picture quality. As for computer throughput (is that the correct word?), when I enabled WI-FI to download the latest iPhone operating system into my phone, the message said it would take like two hours, or something. I went up to our lobby, where I heard it was faster, but it still took maybe, an hour? I seem to recall that in SoCal at the Apple store, the clerk downloaded what was then, the latest OS, in just a few minutes. So I dunno... 

To hijack my own thread and since I mentioned clerks that work in computer stores like the Apple store, the eldest son of our best friends in Atlanta who's trying to make it in acting, has landed a gig on a Lifetime Network reality-type TV show called "Prank My Mom," where kids try to mess with their mothers by fooling them. Anyway, in his second skit, Eliot (that's the kid) plays a computer store's geek, who discovers bad stuff on various moms' laptops and calls in the FBI whose agents accuse the mothers of plotting nasty things and of being traitors. Pretty funny, in a simple-minded way. And not our kind of show. But at least the kid has something to do when he's not working as the night bellman at a luxury hotel in Beverly Hills.


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## tmejia (Jan 2, 2008)

Hi Joe,
West Maui - I'm headed to East Maui (Wailuku-Waihee) to visit my brother on Wednesday. Supposedly we will be in Lahaina and Ka'anapali Sunday and Monday. 

Aloha

Tommy








Rio Gracie


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Like my first question, before Pete's post, "What interface did you use"... 

Of all the possible ones, VGA would be one of the worst... you could only make it worse if you had S-video or composite. You are using an analog interface, which is affected by many things that can degrade the signal. 

Did you check your laptop to see what resolution it is sending? 

You could buy a USB to HDMI converter and then most likely get a better signal, but the laptop is likely older, so the video card may be the limiting factor still. 

The best bet would be a card that goes on the laptop PCI buss, like a PCMCIA (which probably cannot be found), or a PCI Express card if you computer is so equipped... then you could get a modern video card and a modern interface. 

Greg


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## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

As for what we receive from Oceanic Cable (owned by Time Warner): it's pretty much the only game in town in Hawaii, 
I guess we should all have your Hawaii problems.









There's a website called speedtest.net that lets you test your connection. (Just give it time to load and click the right place - there's a lot of ad clutter and browser offers!) Note it tests speed to a nearby place - you want to test to a mainland server; the map behind the 'start' button lets you pick a new one. 
P.S. I tried it from here (MD) to U. Hawaii in Honolulu and got half the speed I get locally.


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## joe rusz (Jan 3, 2008)

Easy things first. Tommy, Monday would be best for a meet and greet (and eat), as Sunday is NFL day and a tsunami would not keep my wife away from our TV. So think about Monday. We are at the Maui Eldorado, which is about 1000 feet across two greens of the golfcourse from the entrance of the Sheraton. Anyway, send me a message and we'll plan something. 

Greg, you know way more than I do (electronically speaking) so I'm sorry if I didn't provide the correct answer. However, after your latest questions, I dug out the instruction book which lists the various ports which are: S-video, external monitor (the one I'm using), expansion port 3, RJ-45 network jack (the one I plugged the Oceanic cable into), RJ-11 modem jack, two USB ports, a 1394 port, and a digitial media slot (for CF or SD cards, I guess). Optional, and not installed on our laptop, which is an HP, not a Dell, as I may have said, is an HDMI port (wish we had that). I tried to find out the computer's resolution and such, but got nowhere. Besides, at this stage of the game (translated: we're not buying a new laptop until this one blows up), it is what it is. Thanks anyway. 

Yes Pete, we should all have Hawaii problems. Sorry, but someone had to do it.


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## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

I tried to find out the computer's resolution 
Joe, 
Right-click on your screen (not on an icon or other image) and you'll get a menu that should have "screen resolution" or "graphic properties".


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

And you MIGHT be able to have better quality to the TV... 

Tell us what operating system you are using (XP, Vista, Windows 7, Windows 8) 

Then you might be able to get better resolution if we ensure you are running the TV as a separate display as opposed as a "clone" of the laptop display. 

Basically you should be able to see (under properties or screen resolution) TWO representations of screens... the idea is to set the one to the TV to be the highest you can. 

There is a mode where the 2 displays are "clones" of each other, or "mirrored" and that mode will limit the TV to the resolution of your laptop screen. 

(confused yet?) 

Greg


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## joe rusz (Jan 3, 2008)

Yes, Greg, confused yet/still. But I will go through everything you said and try to do the right thing. FYI, we have Vista Home Premium with the latest Service Paks installed, I think, because MS keeps bugging me to install 'em. Concerning the two screen thing: one Sunday when we tried to get hooked up (I unplug the cable when it's not in use) the computer gave me that screen where it asks you to chose between screen 1 and screen 2. I never could figure that out and was getting desperate because the games were on and DW was champing at the bit. Finally, the TV displayed the computer's screen and we were good to go. This week, I hooked the TV to the laptop with everything turned off, reasoning that the TV and the computer would work it out amongst themselves, which they did. We called up the NFL site, then clicked on the NFL on Demand program and the game we wanted and zoom-bam! we had liftoff. The only glitch we had and have is that if you don't periodically wiggle the mouse, the computer takes a nap. I believe you can fix that in Settings, right? 

Anyway, I'll play around some more. 

And Pete, I'll try to see what speeds we're working with here.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

So you want to "extend" the desktop to the tv, not mirror it... those keywords should show up. 

You start with only one screen "on" (but the TV should be plugged in and electrically on) ... if you keep getting the same thing on both screens, it's not what you want... that will be controlled by a keyboard setting... there will be a key that says "Fn" on it, usually lower left corner of the keyboard, and usually in a different color. Then on the top rows of the keys, they should also have some extra markings on them, like the antenna tower, a picture of a soup can, the sun, a volume setting, etc. 

One of the little pictures will look like one or 2 tv screens side by side... 

Holding the Fn key and pressing that key will toggle between: 
TV only 
TV and Laptop 
Laptop only 

the mode you want is NOT the TV and Laptop.... the best one is TV only, then right click with the mouse, and set the resolution as high as it will work. 

(there's variations in this procedure, but I'm trying to give you the most foolproof way) 

The "sleep mode" is under the Windows control panel... select power... and set the computer to never blank the screen if it's plugged in... also you need to separately set the screensaver to never come on... 

Good luck... 

Greg


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## joe rusz (Jan 3, 2008)

Greg, that's kinda where I went before, but got lost in the procedure. When I did try the toggling bit, I had trouble finding the Fn key and read that it may be a key between Ctrl and Alt labeled Start and marked with a little flag, which I'm guessing is the Microsoft logo, since this a Microsoft keyboard. 

As for the top keys, I'm guessing you mean the 'F' buttons (F1, F2, etc) which have no symbols, but have Help (F1) Undo (F2) Redo (F3) and so on written on them. However, strung out in an arc over the F keys are round buttons for My Documents, My Pictures, My Music, Media, Mail, Web/Home, Messenger, which I'm thnking is not what we want to use, right? 

Additionally, some of the alphabetical keys have secondary markings on the edges (Cut, Copy, Paste located on the X, C and V keys). 

Anyway, thanks for being so patient and so thorough. If I see you at the Fairplex show I'll buy you a soda.


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## joe rusz (Jan 3, 2008)

Greg, here's what I found in Wiki. My keyboard has both keys, assuming that the key with the flag described above is indeed the function key. 

Fn, short for function, is a modifier key on many keyboards, especially on laptops, used in a compact layout to combine keys which are usually kept separate. It is typically found on laptops due to their keyboard size restrictions. It is also found on many full-sized "multimedia" keyboards as the F-Lock key. 

When I went to the Microsoft site, they described the whole process of wht F keys don't always do what they're supposed to, if the F Lock is on or off. Maybe that's why I had trouble trying to toggle between screens in the manner you described.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Nope, the one with the flag is NOT the Fn (function) key, that is the Windows key... 

F-lock is not that key, and you will only find this key on the original keyboard on the laptop. 

The "function" keys are the F1 through F12.... and they are the same physical keys, but the "Fn" key gives them alternate functions. Please ignore the Wiki, that is a different subject. 

Take a picture of the laptop keyboard and post it if the following does not help:










See the Fn key on the bottom left... it is clearly not the Windows (flag) key.... now, to search of a picture of a keyboard with the alternate symbols...

Here's one:










see the Fn key is in blue? Now look up on the top row, see the function keys? See the blue logos?

the F7 key, when the blue Fn key is pressed and held FIRST, will swap displays... see that the icon shows a laptop screen, a slash (meaning either or) and then a CRT screen?

That means it toggles between the internal laptop (square) screen and a CRT (even though those rounded corners are passe)

Greg


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## tmejia (Jan 2, 2008)

Hi Joe,
Not sure how to get a message to you. Today we spent watching NFL and ended up in West Maui at a sports bar for the last 2 afternoon games. We are now staying at the Honua Kai Resort Spa at Kaanapali Beach until Tuesday. I think that is about 2 -3 miles north of you. We are headed to Lahaina tomorrow for a bar hopping, eating and shopping excursion. I'm here with 4 of my brothers.

Tommy Mejia








Rio Gracie


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## joe rusz (Jan 3, 2008)

Tommy, check your message thingy. 

joe


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