# brand new bachmann spectrum a no go What!



## blumule (Jan 2, 2010)

Hey guys im fairly new to this hobby and having some really frustrating situations. I bought this bachmann mogul on ebay back in dec 09 but have been in the process of laying my track for the last 8 months. Anyway, today i pull out my mogul for its first run on my new railroad, set everything in place , give the track its juice and nothing. I know my track is good because ive run other trains on it minutes before.I can hear the motor turning but its not moving. I turned the train over applid power to the wheels and you can see the plastic gear turning but not the worm gear. I can move the wheels themselves but the gear doesnt move with it. I know this sounds bad , but im having a hard time beleiving this train is junk out of the box. This is not a cheap loco. Please tell me im missing something or forgetting to do something. Yes i did lube it prior to running like it suggested.Whats up with this loco?


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## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

Some of the Bachmann engines have problems with stripped gears or loose screws in the gear box. The Consolidation (2-8-0) has had this trouble. I do not have the mogul, so I do not know if this is a common problem with that locomotive as well.

Barry, of Barry's Big Trains (BBT) has replacement drive trains for some of the Bachmann engines. He is a regular viewer of MLS, so I would imagine that he will answer your question within a few days. His replacement blocks are supposed to be bullet proof. 


His user name is BarrysBigTrains. If you scroll through some of the forums and search for him, you should be able to send him a message with your specific problem. 


Chuck N


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## Gary Armitstead (Jan 2, 2008)

It could in fact, have stripped gears, even though NEW. The drive-trains on Bachmann engines is weak. As chuck mentioned, the Bachmann Connie has this problem. I have one and I don't run it because I don't want to strip the gears. I will eventually have Barry replace the drive-train with one of his "bullet-proof" replacement blocks for my Connie. I don't have a mogul and I'm not sure if these had weak gears like the Connie.


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## blumule (Jan 2, 2010)

This thing is brand new,never run. Are you kidding me?


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Not even unusual. 

Greg


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## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

Bachmann has a lifetime warranty, so all you can do is call the service center - they'll probably tell you to pack the loco and ship it to them. They will return it in working order (or replace the whole thing.) 

They are a bit overworked (guess why) so be patient, and don't expect overnight return. Figure a few weeks.


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## rmcintir (Apr 24, 2009)

I'll be talking to: http://www.nwsl.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/Price_lists/Product_Price_Lists.pdf 

for replacement 2-8-0 gears soon. It will still get itself around the track but no real load. My Mogul and 4-4-0 are still working great. Not planning on pulling much more than a realistic load (~ 4 cars).


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## blueregal (Jan 3, 2008)

If you bought it on Ebay are you sure it was new?????? but like Greg with Bochmann anything is possible. Regal


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## blumule (Jan 2, 2010)

Yeah it was brand new in the box.. Im sorelly dissappointed in this loco. Even if bachmann fixes it how long does that last? This isnt a big hauler but the spectrum series. What a ripoff!.


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## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

Welcome to the Bachmann Locomotive Club. They make very nice looking locomotives. I have had problems with the Connie and one of my two K-27s. As I said earlier my Connie had loose screws in the gear box and my first K-27 had counterweight problems. I tightened the gear box and added shims to the counterweights. On my second K I had the vendor correct the counterweights before he shipped it. The only Bachmann engine series that I haven't had a problem with is the Climax. 

I have four Bachmann engines, Two that developed problems (Connie and K-27) and two that so far are Okay (Climax and K-27). 50% failure isn't very good Quality Control and design. It might have been 75% if I hadn't had the counterweight fixed on the second K before I bought it. 


None of my problems were out of the box. It took several weeks for the K axles to start slipping and almost a year before the Connie just sat there with the motor spinning. 


Chuck N


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## TonyWalsham (Jan 2, 2008)

Caveat Emptor. 

Do your homework *BEFORE* buying anything. 

Try getting Bachmann to publicly acknowledge they have an ongoing problem with drive systems and see how far you get.


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## JonScott (May 12, 2010)

I had my fun with stripped gears and the Bachman Connie, took them nearly 3 months to get it right! 

John


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## Stan Cedarleaf (Jan 2, 2008)

Mule, I recently fixed 4 gear boxes in the Spectrum line. One for the Connie and 3 in the Moguls. The Connie and two of the Moguls had a split axle gear which can be replaced by the black OSO Delrin gear. It's very strong. 

The third Mogul had one of the idler gears disintigrate. 

Take extreme care and notice of where all the pieces and parts for the fancy valve gear on the Mogul go. It's a beast to take apart much less putting it back together. 

Personally, I'd box up the Mogul and ship it back to Bachmann. 


Email me if you'd like a tutorial on the disassembly and assembly. [email protected].

Sorry to post such uplifting words...


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## Steve Stockham (Jan 2, 2008)

Y'know (just to keep the record straight), there _was_ a certain gentleman that used to do product reviews, first in Outdoor/Finescale Railroader and then in Garden Railways. He would take these new "Botchmann" offerings and put them through their paces. He was extremely objective in his reviews (but that is not necessarily germain to this particular discussion.) Anyway, he would discover these little "problems" and would then inform "Botchmann" what he had found so that they would have time to respond and fix whatever was discovered! In addition, this gentleman turned around and devised "fixes" for the myriad of problems that were found over the years and through the various offerings. Apparently, he was the only person doing this because everyone over at "Botchmann" was too concerned about "spinning" these things into the never-never! (Heck, we were even told by The Botch-man that complaining about problems could get the whole project cancelled so we should zip it and just be happy!! (Okay, that's a paraphrase by me but the gist of the message was that Botchmann wasn't happy with our complaining and it was_ our_ fault for daring to voice our opinions!! Who the H*LL made them god?!!)

Politics (corporate style) reared it's ugly head and people who _should_ have been listened to weren't and those who _shouldn't_ have been (IMHO) were!! The head honchos at Botchmann wanted reviews done by someone who wasn't pedjudiced against them and they decided that a certain gentleman had made his opinions well known. They exerted pressure to have him removed as a reviewer. They tried to marginalize him by completely freezing him out of the loop! The result of all of this has been products that have significant problems and a growing reputation to match! Botchmann's customer relations are almost non-existent compared to what they were only five years ago (again, IMHO)! Instead of using the customer's feedback to improve quality, they seem to be trying to "go it alone!" I used to get my blood pressure worked up about the unfairness and simple stupidity of it all but I have decided that life is too short for me to worry about this! I still like Botchmann's engines and my top four locomotives are all Botchmann but I have really been more impressed with AMS's offerings these last few years... Oh yes, that "certain gentleman?" He still devises the fixes (_somebody_ has to!) It's just that he doesn't call Botchmann first to give it to them so they can do something about it before it reaches the public! _Caveat emptor!_


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## blumule (Jan 2, 2010)

Stan, does bachmann have the oso delrin gear or is that aftermarket? Its definately going back to bachmann this time. Next time ill do it myself. I guess it wouldnt be a hobby if everything worked right the first time. And to steve i just think botchman has the bestest bestest ever ever trains in the whole wide world, and i wouldnt ever think about buying anything else. wink wink!


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## Stan Cedarleaf (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By blumule on 05 Sep 2010 06:46 AM 
Stan, does bachmann have the oso delrin gear or is that aftermarket? Its definately going back to bachmann this time. Next time ill do it myself. 

Mule, the delrin gear is only available from OSO as far as I know. Bachmann will replace the gears with their own stock gears. 

Just a word when you do get it back... It might be tempting to pull a whole string of cars with it. That would lead to the demise of the gearing again. 2 or 3 at the most, Bachmann passenger cars with metal wheels with no electrical pickup wipers should do fine. Maybe 3 Bachmann freight cars and caboose. Again with metal wheels. Keep the journals well lubricated. 

The Bachmann cars look nice and are light weight for pulling. 

I started out many years ago pulling Bachmann cars and most of them are still running with metal or ball bearing wheels.

Flat track, wide curves and less than 1% grades will make for good running as well. 

If you can justify the extra cost, ball bearing wheelsets really make a positive difference.

Hope all works out well...


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## Axel Tillmann (Jan 10, 2008)

Since this thread mentioned K27 as well, may I ask the question (in order to help a customer).

Are there known problems (and solutions) for a K27 derailing every 3-4 time on a 5' radius (10' diameter) curve? When it happens the first driver pops out of the rail. This woul dnormally indicate a too narrow curve, but Bachmann claims 4' radius (8' diameter) is OK for the engine?

Any suggestions?


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## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

Axel:

I would check the back to back spacing on those drivers. All of the curves on my layout are Aristo wide radius (5' radius, 10' diameter). I have two K-27s and they go through these curves with out any problems. It doesn't matter whether the engines are going clockwise, or counter clockwise. 


Does your problem K derail going in both directions?

What puzzles me is that it will go around several times before the problem happens. I had a similar problem with an Accucraft K-28, but it derailed every time it went around. It took me several years of tinkering before it would go around my track without derailing. I ended up removing two of the three springs in each axle. That engine had very stiff suspension. My experience is that the Bachmann Ks have a very soft suspension.

Chuck N


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Mr. Goodsen has recently discovered yet another manufacturing "gotcha" on the K that explains random derailing. It has to do with the construction of the 2 piece axles. 

Since he has not published this information, I would advise contacting him directly. It's a very interesting situation, but took some real digging to figure it out. 

Regards, Greg


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## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

Part number for the replacement Delrin gear from Northwest Short Line (carried by OSO) for the 4-4-0/2-6-0 is *2223-6 #1 Bachmann 4-4-0 axle gear 24T SGd x 15.5mm OD x 1/4″ ID* The part number for the 2-8-0 replacement gear is *2226-6 #1 Fn3 Bachmann 2-8-0 axle gear 25T SGd x 15.8mm OD x .250″ ID* 

I don't know how long the Delrin gears will ultimately last, but they're of the same material that's in the gears inside NWSL's motor blocks, which have been giving my dad faithful service on his railroad for upwards of 20 years. That's not too shabby. (And that's pulling 10-car trains up 4% grades.) 

As for the length of trains you can pull with the stock gearing, don't let Stan scare you. I routinely pull 6 - 8 car trains with all of my B'mann locos. I can't say that my gears aren't going to fail at some point, but in the 10 or so years I've been running them, I've only had one complete failure and one hub crack so it slid off the center of the axle. (And both occurred this spring.) The length of train is only part of the equation. If your loco picks a switch or hits a rock or twig and you stall the drivers, you're putting a lot more strain on the gears than you would with a train. (That's what broke my 2-8-0 gear.) 

I do think Bachmann has improved their drive trains with their latest locos. We haven't been hearing these kinds of issues with the locos introduced beginning with the K-27. (People complain about the gear _ratio_ in the K, but the gears seem to be solid.) Of course, the street price for those locos is almost tripple the street price for the 2-8-0, 4-4-0, and 2-6-0. 

Later, 

K


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Kevin, just for calibration, the grades that are on the layout must be considered when people are discussing length of trains pulled. From the pictures I have seen on your layout your grades are minimal. 

Please correct me if I am wrong. (would actually like to know) 

So a person, especially a beginner, needs this information, since many layouts have steep grades, thus more wear and tear on loco gear trains, and shorter trains (usually). 

Regards, Greg


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## SteveC (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By: East Broad Top on 05 Sep 2010 10:55 AM
I don't know how long the Delrin gears will ultimately last, but they're of the same material that's in the gears inside NWSL's motor blocks, *which have been giving my dad faithful service on his railroad for upwards of 20 years. That's not too shabby. (And that's pulling 10-car trains up 4% grades.)*


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## blumule (Jan 2, 2010)

thanks for the help guys.


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## Stan Cedarleaf (Jan 2, 2008)

Gary.... You are so right about Barry's conversion for the Connie. It's bullet proof. It would be wonderful if he could make one of his gearboxes for the 4-4-0 and the Mogul. They're such nice looking locomotives. 

Kevin..... Don't mean to "scare" anyone,









Just advising to be cautious pulling too many cars with those gear boxes on tight curves and 3% or more grades with curves. The last B'mann Mogul I fixed was a product of a consist of 10 cars with electrical wipers, tight diameter curves going up 3% grades. Gears were taken out of the B'mann Mogul and an LGB Mogul. The LGB Mogul's idler gears were worn smooth...









Your layout is nice and flat with sweeping curves which is very easy on any locomotive.


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## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

...the grades that are on the layout must be considered when people are discussing length of trains pulled. 
Absolutely, but the limitations I put on my train length have little (nothing) to do with my assesment of the strength of the drive relative to the grades on my line. They are rather mild (2% ruling grade), and my curves are moderate (5' radius). I don't run trains longer than 6 - 8 cars because trains longer than that simply look out of place given the size of the railroad. I'd have no qualms putting more cars behind the locos if I had the room. My B'mann 4-4-0 spent the first few years of its life in service on my dad's railroad, which has much steeper grades (8% at one point, with much of the line at 4%.) It handled 4 - 5 car trains very well on that, though it would occasionally slip on the 8%. (Not much doesn't--it's helper district for anything over 4 cars.) 

While limiting the stress on your gears through reduced train length certainly can't hurt, I'm not convinced it helps. There are too many other factors in play that have nothing to do with train length, grade, or curves. The derailments I mentioned earlier, and sudden stops and changes in direction are prime causes for the extreme shocks that split gears. Heck, you don't even need power to the motor; you need only slide the locomotive along the rails to introduce stress on the gears that could potentially cause failure. The thing with the Bachmann gears is that it's absolutely a crapshoot whether they're going to fail or not. You could have two identical locomotives new in the box, one may already have a split gear straight from the factory having never turned a wheel, the other may last for years and never show any problems. I'm not sure how you "plan" around something that may or may not happen for no other reason than just turning on the power to the motor. Just run them and know you can get replacement parts. 

Later, 

K


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## Torby (Jan 2, 2008)

Since nobody has said it yet,

*"What a bummer!"*

And my cheap Bachmann Annie has been such a work-horse. Also the Botanic's Ely Thomas 0-4-0, though it pulls only 3 or 4 cars.


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## blumule (Jan 2, 2010)

thanks east broad top for that part number.Ordered it today.you saved me a lot of work.hope to get started later in the week tearing it down. hopefully stan can assist in that.


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## Treeman (Jan 6, 2008)

How would one contact Mr. Goodsen.


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## BarrysBigTrains (Sep 4, 2008)

Dave Goodson; 


425-823-3507

Barry - BBT


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## blumule (Jan 2, 2010)

to all watching this post. sure enough a split axle gear straight from factory! Ive already talked to stan about this, but there was a small spring in the gear box just laying in there . I cant figure out where it goes or if it even belongs in there.Anybody else familiar with this gearbox?Dont want to button her up missing some of her innards.maybe bachmann just threw it in there to confuse us plain folk.


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## Totalwrecker (Feb 26, 2009)

Strange, I don't usually find those extra parts until I've put the beast (any loco, your choice) back together! 

I heard tell the split gear was caused by incorrect plastic formula shrinking too much.... 

John


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## Steve Stockham (Jan 2, 2008)

Bloody H*LL!!! (I'll give you three guesses and the first two don't count!) What was that number for NWSL again......


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