# Track, Rail, What To Do



## VentureForth (Dec 10, 2013)

Alright - I did do a cursory search of this forum and couldn't find exactly what I was looking for.

I understand that Bachmann's steel track is OK, good for indoors, but not the best for outdoors. But it's what I got - 20' worth...

Then I've heard that for outside, Aluminum track is an inexpensive, inferior, but capable product for use outside.

But alas, the Brass - The brass seems to be the track most popular for outdoors.

I presume that once you start, it's best to stick with the same track. Does the Bachmann track actually attach (without mods) to other track pieces? Is brass that much more worth it than aluminum?

I've founds lots of track on eBay for around $3/pc for LGB brass track. This seems to be the lowest, with sometimes prices rising to $5-10 per piece. Is this a solid range?

One thing about the aluminum is that I can get it in flexible, long lengths. Are there other flex track to consider? Are there secret places hiding on the net that have great bulk track prices?


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## jjwtrainman (Mar 11, 2011)

From what I've seen of Bachmann, it is best to leave that for the Christmas display inside. The brass track that Bachman has, I suppose works outside, but I strongly suggest going with something other than Bachmann for track simply because if nothing else, Bachmann lacks the variety of track products required for an outdoor railway. That said, there are plenty of other track manufacturers who provide both the quality and the variety needed for an outdoor railway.

With that out of the way, I'll give a rief rundown on the different type of track material:

Steel (not stainless) such as bachmann will rust through and basically disintegrate after a couple seasons. This is not recommended outside for any purpose.

Steel (stainless) is made by some manufacturers and is quite excellent for outside running.

Nickel Silver is also a very good choice for running, but is expensive just like the stainless steel

Brass is the most common, and works well when set up correctly for track power. From what I've done, Brass needs to have a feeder wire for every section of brass, or solder the joints shut, in order to ensure that the brass is getting electricity. Brass also oxidizes, but frequent running combined with a maintenance schedule takes care of the oxidation problem in almost every case.

Aluminum is my choice for indoors, since the climate can be regulated. If you plan to go to battery power, within say about two years, Aluminum is a great way to save money. However aluminum in most instances is not the recommended choice for outdoors. In theory, if every piece of track had a solid physical connection to the power supply, the track would not have any electrical gaps. However oxidation of aluminum occurs much faster than Brass, and cleaning can be frequent.

What would I recommend for you?

If you plan to stick with track power, or go with DCC, I would say that brass, nickel silver or stainless are the choices you want outside. If you plan to go with battery power for the locomotives, then aluminum will save you some money.

Ultimately, what you choose also depends upon your climate and your budget. Aluminum can be done successfully, but people have higher success rates with brass and nickel silver with track power. Assuming you go with track power, if you live in a very dry place that doesn't get a whole lot of moisture, aluminum will work if you're careful about how you lay it. If you live in a very wet place, I would not recommend aluminum, and probably would not recommend brass either.

And for battery, really is up to you.

If you find a manufacturer that sells good quality track, I'd certainly stick with that. Otherwise, as long as the track can connect together, you can mix and match manufacturers. Unfortunately Bachmann is incompatible with most other manufacturers. However LGB, Aristo, Train Li, and others should work fine together

For flexible sections, if you don't mind hand laying track, you can get 96' of rail in 6' sections from switchcrafters.com for a fraction of the cost of ready made track. If going that route, switch crafters also sells composite ties which are more durable than the wood ties many modelers go with. Also turnouts are very well priced. Otherwise, look around the Internet and somewhere I'm sure you can find a deal. Whatever you buy, if it's ready made expect to have to pay somewhere between 3 and 6 dollars a foot.

One last thought, I've never tried this, but if aluminum was painted everywhere except for the rail head, I wonder if that would help with the oxidation? 

Good luck with your choice, be sure to post it when construction comes. And of course be sure to ask here if you have any questions.

--James


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## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

Aluminum oxides immediately. Further oxidation should not happen. Unless the protective oxide coating is broken. Aluminum is also a soft metal. It is easily bent if you or another large animal steps on it. I walk on my brass track all the time. Aluminum is good for battery and live stream, but I think there are mixed results for track power. Your choice depends on your power source. I have used brass track outside for over 30 years, without a single soldered rail join. I use rail clamps and a couple of different types of screw connections. Chuck


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## BigRedOne (Dec 13, 2012)

I wonder if brass is really the most popular, or simply in many cases the default of someone who began with a starter set and / or sectional track, and then kept using it from familiarity or to maintain consistent appearance? 

My indoor railway is brass sectional track, but that's what came in my starter sets. 

I'm contemplating an outdoor railway, and I want to run live steam. I'm leaning toward aluminum due to the lower cost. 

It seems that manufacturers of aluminum track also make brass or stainless, so you can get the long lengths in other materials. Long lengths minimize the number of joints, and presumably improve electrical performance. 

Flex track allows you to stagger the rail joiners. Not sure how important this is, but it does replicate prototype practice.


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## JPCaputo (Jul 26, 2009)

I have actually soldered the bachmann track to brass track ( outside of the rail only ). It needs a wire straight between the 2 types, without any slack to reinforce the solder. I just removed the steel connector to hold the bachmann track sections together. That bachmann track aligns with code 332 track. 

The plating on the bachmann steel track takes solder easily. The brass track needs a lot more heat to take solder, so I ended up using a large solder gun to do it. It's been holding up indoors for a few years now.


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## Dan Pierce (Jan 2, 2008)

Note that the Bachmann steel track has ties that are not UV resistant and will rot outdoors. 

I do use bachmann track at my repair station and found it very easy to solder. 3 foot long for testing engines on rollers and sound/lit cars with power pick wheels. 

I have been using this for 10 years, and only issue is the Aristo rollers need cleaning every year due to aluminum oxidizing.


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## josephunh (Mar 27, 2013)

Everyone always mention the nickle silver but what about the nickle plated brass track Train Li sells? Anyone have much experience with that?


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## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

Aluminum is also a soft metal. It is easily bent if you or another large animal steps on it. I walk on my brass track all the time. 
Most brass track is tall and overscale - code 332 [which simply means .332" tall.] So you can walk on it - maybe. Aluminum tends to be more scale sized - code 250 [.25" tall] and is, as noted, softer, so you do not want to step on it. 

I'm contemplating an outdoor railway, and I want to run live steam. I'm leaning toward aluminum due to the lower cost. 
Most live steam tracks are elevated, making it easier to see what is going on and to work on the locos. If elevated, the chances of stepping on the track are slim, so many such tracks use aluminum. 
That being said, my ground-level live steam and battery track was all code 250 and code 215 aluminum, and I never stepped on it !


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## VentureForth (Dec 10, 2013)

What are the various codings? Who manufactures which codings? What's "mainstream"?


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## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

The code is the height of the rail in thousandths of an inch. Thus code 332 rail is 0.332 inches high, 250 rail is 0.250 inches high (1/4"). 
Chuck


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## jjwtrainman (Mar 11, 2011)

Code refers to height of the track in thousandths of an inch, so code 332 track is roughly 1/3 of an inch high. The Coding for large scale I have seen are: 332, 250, 215, and somewhere I swear I saw 148 (modified atlas O track).

Trouble with large scale, there are very few standards which all manufacturers follow. Thankfully, most manufacturers have gravitated towards one sectional track design which is similar in design to atlas HO track, but blown up to G scale proportions. Bachmann, unfortunately, has gone with an alternate system of track.









I don't know what you imply by "mainstream" but my experience has been that is not in the Garden Railroader's dictionary. Everyone, in time, finds the solution which works best for them. If I had to say what was the most mainstream, it would probably be code 332 brass track for reasons others have given. It comes in most starter sets, it is readily available, moderately priced compared to other materials, durable, and best of all can be soldered which makes wiring the layout for track power much easier than any other material.

If going with battery power, aluminum I believe has become the standard in that area, but only because the electrical capacities of the material don't matter. You could, in theory, build a wooden railroad track and it would be fine with battery power. 

In all, and this may be a bit confusing, so here is my point: The best way to figure out what works for you is to try a few different types of track and settle on one brand and type as your railroad expands. You don't need to buy hundreds of dollars of each kind of track, but I would pick a few favorites and purchase about 20 feet each to make up a test loop. After a few months you'll definitely know which track is right for you in your area. We can give recommendations, but we can't give a definite 'this is what you want to do' answer because we simply do not know. Each situation is different and hence why there are so many ways to build a railroad.

My previous post I gave my recommendations, so that was my one cent, and this is the other. While we can't say for sure what is best in your situation, we are still here to help you with suggestions and experience. Have fun!









Regards,

James


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## Scottychaos (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By BigRedOne on 12 Dec 2013 06:31 PM 
I wonder if brass is really the most popular, or simply in many cases the default of someone who began with a starter set and / or sectional track, and then kept using it from familiarity or to maintain consistent appearance? 


Well, if that is true (which it probably is..clearly those things are a factor) then that really does make brass the most popular doesn't it. 
basically you said "I wonder if brass is really the most popular" and then "here is why brass is probably the most popular"
the first part asks the question, and the second part answers it! 

I have seen many garden railroads in person, and indoor holiday displays at garden centers, and layouts at train stores, and large scale set-ups at train shows.
brass, brass, brass, and brass...

I think have seen stainless rail in person once..and aluminum in person never..
probably 99% of every piece of large scale track I have ever seen has been brass..
and take a look through railroads featured in Garden Railways magazine..overwhelmingly brass.

Scot


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## VentureForth (Dec 10, 2013)

All facinating experiences by all. Thank you for the replies. 

I wonder if anyone has made a prototypically steel track - one that lightly rusts except for the head that stays shiny when trains are run upon it... It could be an electrical nightmare, but if we're talking battery ops...


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## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

I wonder if anyone has made a prototypically steel track 
Well, yes, but it didn't rust to scale. Llagas made some mild steel rail very briefly, and it does rust to a nice color. Unfortunately, the rust on the rail head turned out to be heavily pitted 1:1 scale rust, and polishing it off means you have no rail head left in very short order! 

I painted my alum rails rusty brown primer before I assembled the flex track. Worked just as well.


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## jjwtrainman (Mar 11, 2011)

You can always paint the track like they do in smaller scales with an airbrush, If running on battery, you wouldn't have to worry about the electricity, so really you could do just about anything.

--James









Whoops, that was already brought up, sorry.


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## Dick Friedman (Aug 19, 2008)

I use aluminum code 350 rail outdoors and with track power. Since aluminum is the second best conductor of electricity (after copper, not brass) power conduction is NOT a problem. The oxidation, however, IS a problem sometimes. For me, the problem was not pick up by the engines as much as it was conduction through the sections of rail. I was using brass joiners and got electrolysis which caused stops at many joints. I tried to keep them clean, and greased them to keep water out. Later, I found putting aluminum foil in the brass joiners reduced that problem. 

Don't just dismiss AL. I don't walk on my track, and the biggest critters in my yard are squirrels. It's less expensive than brass, and looks much more realistic in code 250.


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## Totalwrecker (Feb 26, 2009)

After being teased for using brass track when nickle silver was available, the 10 year old me swore he would never use brass again. You want the starter circle? 

I've got 143' of Stainless up and running including two reverse loops. Looks Good to me. 

I've been a thinkin that a couple of foam paintbrushes coul be fashioned to a car and pushed around the layout. The outer brush cover the whole rail from head to foot, the inner trimmed to paint the rail from foot to under the head. Pick a paint good for metal, not so for plastic and Ma Nature will clean the spike detail. Drippers to feed the brushes..... 

Happi Holidaze 

John


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## mtemenski (May 12, 2008)

While it may not be a major concern in all parts of the country, one reason to consider stainless steel (if you can get it) instead of brass is the fact that stainless experiences less expansion/contraction with temperature changes. With summer temps frequently over 110 this is an issue for me. I have just over 1000 feet of stainless, and have experienced only 1 expansion related problem (which was my own fault due to a layout design issue.)


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## Trains (Jan 2, 2008)

Have a friend who has a nice layout with Bachmann track, left the window open one night. 
The track is all rust from humidity. 
Don


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## CliffyJ (Apr 29, 2009)

Posted By josephunh on 13 Dec 2013 06:33 AM 
Everyone always mention the nickle silver but what about the nickle plated brass track Train Li sells? Anyone have much experience with that? 
Really good stuff. A little more expensive than brass, but much less than SS. And it stays clean as SS, which was a big concern for me. The plating is super tough, not like something that flakes off. Electrically, the brass core and nickle plating are great conductors. Really good product support too. And if you join MLS, you get 10% off. 

Cliff


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## Blk69 (Dec 6, 2009)

If you are thinking about going G scale on a budget, you have a tough road head of you. Your $3 a foot for LGB sectional track is about as cheep as you are going to find on line. 

One point, the track is only a small part of the cost outdoor railroad. Suggest you really look at your budget before you get 1/2 way in and realize the costs are out of your range. This is a certain way of derailing your plans. 

It is better to have a small nice well build layout with good materials then a large troublesome layout with inferior materials.


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## JPCaputo (Jul 26, 2009)

Start looking on craigslist and thriftshops and hobby shoppes that sell used trains and track. I've been lucky to keep my track costs down under $3/ft. Now and then $1/ft. It's slim pickings and takes a long time to gather enough track up.


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## dcraig (Jun 23, 2010)

I would suggest if your railroad is outdoors you go to battery power. I have about 700 feet of brass track outdoors. Originally I had track power and spent all my time cleaning it and looking for bad connections. Now that I use battery power I spend all my time running trains. I used 250 and 332. I finally ended up converting all to 332. 250 looks really nice but trains just seemed to run better on 332. All my stuff is Aristo brass now. It has been a while since I purchased any large amounts. I found I can get small amounts for repairs ( gardener is clumsy boob and walks on the track occasionally) for about $3 a foot on EBay. I strongly suggest that for outdoors you go with battery power. As others have said you can use any kind of track and it reduces your maintenance time dramatically.


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## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

If it is possible make local contacts. They can tell you what works in your local climate and what may not be best. I've been using track power for 30 plus years. If you have good rail connections you will be fine. I can polish my track in a couple of minutes. Where I live, Virginia, it would take a minute or so to clear twigs, leaves and pine needles. My dry wall sander with a green scotch bright pad polishes the track and removes the debris. Get your feet wet with track power, then with experience you will be better prepared to make a decision as to whether you want battery, DCC, etc. chuck


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