# Playing with fire



## NTCGRR (Jan 2, 2008)

Richard Snyder and I went to the 
Chippewa Northwestern RY in Geohnar NE today









YES, a coal fired 1" scale RR


















I "felt" like I was sinning against G.









they had 4 or 5 trains running, we learned the rules faily fast.
I do miss the sitting back and just watching them with scenery.

Very well done RR and a great bunch.
NNAAA I'm still thinking......


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## iceclimber (Aug 8, 2010)

That is a very nice Mikado.


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Did you get a chance to drive it? 

Thinking of what?? Getting into 1" perhaps.


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## iceclimber (Aug 8, 2010)

I had a great time when at Ridge live steamers meet back in February and got a chance to ride on a battery powered locomotive, but could feel the pressure as the driver had to make sure all signals were properly observed.


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## sbaxters4 (Jan 2, 2008)

Marty you have the room!! Go for it!! You could even run it out to the parking area and give rides to the G-Scale layout for the open house!!!


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## afinegan (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By iceclimber on 17 Aug 2011 07:23 PM 



I had a great time when at Ridge live steamers meet back in February and got a chance to ride on a battery powered locomotive, but could feel the pressure as the driver had to make sure all signals were properly observed. 


Thats because your "Driver/Engineer" never ran bidirectional before (but fully knew the rules and the signal system) and there where a lot of people that weren't quite following the rules that day lol (or were too old to notice the signals lol). The tunnel signal is what got me, it switched to red kind of fast, low and behold an big mikado was coming down the tracks and through the tunnel lol. You got to be careful lol.

BTW, We had a club members steamer up there the next day, doh! 

That all aside, It was still fun and I didn't miss a signal!


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## iceclimber (Aug 8, 2010)

You did drive that excellently Andrew. I was never worried, but I know I didn't want to trade places with you either.


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## NTCGRR (Jan 2, 2008)

whats funnyis I e-mailed my contact person (just because I was lazy) and asked what is the standard off the rail to center of coupler measurement? 

I guess no one has built a car for awhile so couple of them got back with me and said 2 7/8" .


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

International Brotherhood of Live Steamers (IBLS) is the holy grail standard

IBLS Wheel Standard 

1" coupler height 2.89"


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## NTCGRR (Jan 2, 2008)

I hate it when they do that. 2.89 in carpenter terms is ,2 7/8" ???? close to.


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

2.89 = 2-7/8 in my shop. The guys around here are 7.5" gauge. They get trucks from Tom Bee in PA. Tom has a standard method of building rolling stock, which most of the guys around here follow. So when you ask "what's the coupler height", the answer is "it's Tom Bee"


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## Stan Cedarleaf (Jan 2, 2008)

It was bound to happen.... I guess Marty will add a loop of 7 1/2 track around the house, back behind the lower workshop and in the "South 40" beyond the shop...

Oh my.......


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## livesteam53 (Jan 4, 2008)

Here you go Marty... 

You can start looking...... 

http://discoverlivesteam.com/discoverforsale/locomotive.html


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## NTCGRR (Jan 2, 2008)

WOOW Mark 
thats a site and half 
I just placed an order for 4,3/4" roller bearing trucks and couplers just to play around with it. Jim at Goehner is the master of 1" scale. and willing to help. 

we'll see. 
I need to check out my steel supplier 

does anyone one want to buy a G RR?????? NOT


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By NTCGRR on 22 Aug 2011 06:35 PM 
WOOW Mark 
thats a site and half 
I just placed an order for 4,3/4" roller bearing trucks and couplers just to play around with it. Jim at Goehner is the master of 1" scale. and willing to help. 

we'll see. 
I need to check out my steel supplier 

does anyone one want to buy a G RR?????? NOT 



yer' hooked


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## Gary Armitstead (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By xo18thfa on 22 Aug 2011 07:53 PM 
Posted By NTCGRR on 22 Aug 2011 06:35 PM 
WOOW Mark 
thats a site and half 
I just placed an order for 4,3/4" roller bearing trucks and couplers just to play around with it. Jim at Goehner is the master of 1" scale. and willing to help. 

we'll see. 
I need to check out my steel supplier 

does anyone one want to buy a G RR?????? NOT 



yer' hooked 
I love it when a plan works Bob. He is definitely hooked now! Next step is to get him into the "hernia" gauge....1.5"/foot or finescale 1.6"/foot!!!


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Gary Armitstead on 22 Aug 2011 07:58 PM 
Posted By xo18thfa on 22 Aug 2011 07:53 PM 
Posted By NTCGRR on 22 Aug 2011 06:35 PM 
WOOW Mark 
thats a site and half 
I just placed an order for 4,3/4" roller bearing trucks and couplers just to play around with it. Jim at Goehner is the master of 1" scale. and willing to help. 

we'll see. 
I need to check out my steel supplier 

does anyone one want to buy a G RR?????? NOT 



yer' hooked 
I love it when a plan works Bob. He is definitely hooked now! Next step is to get him into the "hernia" gauge....1.5"/foot or finescale 1.6"/foot!!!









Kansas City Live Steamers. I think if Marty got down that way -- well, you never know.


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## NTCGRR (Jan 2, 2008)

OK, exsplain to me this 1.5" which I know, what is 1.6" stuff???


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## Gary Armitstead (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By NTCGRR on 23 Aug 2011 10:50 AM 
OK, exsplain to me this 1.5" which I know, what is 1.6" stuff??? 
Marty,

1.6"/ft. is considered finescale ride-on. The distance between the rails in 1.5 AND 1.6 is 7 1/2 inches here on the west coast and midwest and south. 7 1/4" in New England. An analogy would be 1/32 and 1/29 on our 45mm track. The 1.6" stuff is more accurate to the distance between the rails. Does this make any sense??


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## ChaoticRambo (Nov 20, 2010)

Or the ever popular 2.5" scale on 7.5" gauge track for 3' narrow gauge


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## NTCGRR (Jan 2, 2008)

Good , so G "gauge" is not the only confusing ,,gauge. 
I know Richard wants to do 3ft gauge on 5" track . so I guess that would be 1.5"???


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By NTCGRR on 23 Aug 2011 12:51 PM 
Good , so G "gauge" is not the only confusing ,,gauge. 
I know Richard wants to do 3ft gauge on 5" track . so I guess that would be 1.5"??? 
It's worse then "G" gauge. "G" gauge uses only Gauge 1 (45mm) track. "Ride-on" is 3.5", 4.75" and 7.25"/7.5" gauge track modelling 24", 36", std gauge and some odd balls and throw in "finescale". It's calculus.

But, yes, 3 foot on 4.75" track would be 1.5"

Are you starting with a piece of rolling stock? That's what I did. Built a 2.5" flat car on 7.5" (3 foot gauge). It's going to get converted to an exterior frame box car and used as a riding/water/fuel/tool/spare parts/lunch box/cooler car for the engine I am building. 


A good friend of mine has a 2200' 1 inch layout up in Overton. The 1 inch guys are a close knit group.


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## Gary Armitstead (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By xo18thfa on 23 Aug 2011 04:13 PM 
Posted By NTCGRR on 23 Aug 2011 12:51 PM 
Good , so G "gauge" is not the only confusing ,,gauge. 
I know Richard wants to do 3ft gauge on 5" track . so I guess that would be 1.5"??? 
It's worse then "G" gauge. "G" gauge uses only Gauge 1 (45mm) track. "Ride-on" is 3.5", 4.75" and 7.25"/7.5" gauge track modelling 24", 36", std gauge and some odd balls and throw in "finescale". It's calculus.

But, yes, 3 foot on 4.75" track would be 1.5"

Are you starting with a piece of rolling stock? That's what I did. Built a 2.5" flat car on 7.5" (3 foot gauge). It's going to get converted to an exterior frame box car and used as a riding/water/fuel/tool/spare parts/lunch box/cooler car for the engine I am building. 


A good friend of mine has a 2200' 1 inch layout up in Overton. The 1 inch guys are a close knit group. 



Bob and Marty,

I started with my caboose, built for our first daughter, Janet. Then the wood gondola for our second daughter, Laura. Finally the refrigerator car for our son, Thomas. In the middle of all this confusion, I built mt Gene Allen ten-wheeler, live steamer!




























It's a great hobby Marty!!


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## NTCGRR (Jan 2, 2008)

My mind is all over on this, right now have have some rail I bought from Robby way back. 
I keep learning, 
I still LOVE modern mainline. 
trucks and couplers can always be sold. but for now its winter project. 
I time manage by getting all the info and parts together, and when the cold rains of fall comes and Sept is over. OH, its popcorn and shop time. 

I'm going to the 1" club on Sat on labor day and helping them reroute the mainline. Kinda hands ON thingy.


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## ChaoticRambo (Nov 20, 2010)

Before reading the following, it is careful to note the difference between gauge and scale. Some people confuse the two. Gauge is the distance between the rails, scale is the scale of the equipment for a specific gauge. So no matter what gauge the railroad is, people can build models to any scale (standard, 3', 2', or whatever else)



The most prominent "ride on" (commonly referred to as live steam as an umbrella term) gauge in the US is 7.5" gauge

Now, the three most common scales for 7.5" gauge are 1.5" scale (standard gauge, slightly off scale), 1.6" scale (standard gauge, perfect scale), and 2.5" scale (3' gauge) - some others also model 3.75" scale (2' gauge) but this is far less common.

On the east coast, some railroads use 7.25" gauge (as well as many European railroads that are into this large scale)



The next two most common gauges in the US are 3.5" and 4.75" gauges. Typically these are made into elevated railroads, in which the trains run on an elevated structure and people ride sideways on the cars or straddle them. Some railroads do have ground level tracks for these gauges, but they are quite uncommon due to the difficulty in riding such a small model.


Keep in mind, there is something for everyone. Here is a list of some of the prominent gauges being used around the world for ride on model trains:


2.5", 3.5", 4.75", 5", 7.25", 7.5", 8.25", 8.75", 10", 10.25", 10.5", 12", 14", and 15"


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## JEFF RUNGE (Jan 2, 2008)

I was alway told that the 7 1/2 was a screw up, someone was told to measure the gauge on 7 1/4 track, but pulled a tape from the OUTSIDE of one rail to the INSIDE of the other.... SOOO they went to 1.6 to match their NEW track gauge.. Maybe the 1:29 guy will follow the same track....


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## ChaoticRambo (Nov 20, 2010)

Posted By JEFF RUNGE on 23 Aug 2011 08:18 PM 
I was alway told that the 7 1/2 was a screw up, someone was told to measure the gauge on 7 1/4 track, but pulled a tape from the OUTSIDE of one rail to the INSIDE of the other.... SOOO they went to 1.6 to match their NEW track gauge.. Maybe the 1:29 guy will follow the same track.... 

There does not seem to be one definitive answer to how the gauges got separated. Rumors are abound, ranging from Walt Disney ordering the equipment and his hand writing was sloppy so instead of one gauge, he got the other, others say small scale modelers scaled up the gauges differently. 

In either case, 7.5" is primarily only in the US, and is the prominent gauge. The vast majority of the very large railroads use 7.5".


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By NTCGRR on 23 Aug 2011 06:29 PM 
My mind is all over on this, right now have have some rail I bought from Robby way back. 
I keep learning, 
I still LOVE modern mainline. 
trucks and couplers can always be sold. but for now its winter project. 
I time manage by getting all the info and parts together, and when the cold rains of fall comes and Sept is over. OH, its popcorn and shop time. 

I'm going to the 1" club on Sat on labor day and helping them reroute the mainline. Kinda hands ON thingy.

Work party is a lot of fun. Get to work around 0700, have an official bs hour (err -- I mean plannng session) then get to work. Dirty hands is the sign of a clean soul.

My 1" buddy in Overton runs a battery operated diesel. It's a gorgeous machine. I don't know what it is, but it has an "A" unit and a "B" unit. I think most guys run std gauge. Narrow gauge equipment gets big and heavy. Guys that run diesel equipment appear to stay with more modern era. Starting out small and easy is not a bad way to go. Follow the lead of the club, kind of do what they do. You can all operate together and if you have a problem/question, they can help work through it.


I wonder why it's 4.75" in the US and 5" everywhere else. 


Edit, edit: My friend's diesel is the same as you have in your "it it real" picture. Except his is silver.


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Gary Armitstead on 23 Aug 2011 05:54 PM 
Posted By xo18thfa on 23 Aug 2011 04:13 PM 
Posted By NTCGRR on 23 Aug 2011 12:51 PM 
Good , so G "gauge" is not the only confusing ,,gauge. 
I know Richard wants to do 3ft gauge on 5" track . so I guess that would be 1.5"??? 
It's worse then "G" gauge. "G" gauge uses only Gauge 1 (45mm) track. "Ride-on" is 3.5", 4.75" and 7.25"/7.5" gauge track modelling 24", 36", std gauge and some odd balls and throw in "finescale". It's calculus.

But, yes, 3 foot on 4.75" track would be 1.5"

Are you starting with a piece of rolling stock? That's what I did. Built a 2.5" flat car on 7.5" (3 foot gauge). It's going to get converted to an exterior frame box car and used as a riding/water/fuel/tool/spare parts/lunch box/cooler car for the engine I am building. 


A good friend of mine has a 2200' 1 inch layout up in Overton. The 1 inch guys are a close knit group. 



Bob and Marty,

I started with my caboose, built for our first daughter, Janet. Then the wood gondola for our second daughter, Laura. Finally the refrigerator car for our son, Thomas. In the middle of all this confusion, I built mt Gene Allen ten-wheeler, live steamer!




























It's a great hobby Marty!!











Any grand kids in your future??


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## R Snyder (May 12, 2009)

It's 4.75" because that is almost exactly 4' 81/2" in 1" scale.


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## Gary Armitstead (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By xo18thfa on 23 Aug 2011 09:28 PM 
Posted By Gary Armitstead on 23 Aug 2011 05:54 PM 
Posted By xo18thfa on 23 Aug 2011 04:13 PM 
Posted By NTCGRR on 23 Aug 2011 12:51 PM 
Good , so G "gauge" is not the only confusing ,,gauge. 
I know Richard wants to do 3ft gauge on 5" track . so I guess that would be 1.5"??? 
It's worse then "G" gauge. "G" gauge uses only Gauge 1 (45mm) track. "Ride-on" is 3.5", 4.75" and 7.25"/7.5" gauge track modelling 24", 36", std gauge and some odd balls and throw in "finescale". It's calculus.

But, yes, 3 foot on 4.75" track would be 1.5"

Are you starting with a piece of rolling stock? That's what I did. Built a 2.5" flat car on 7.5" (3 foot gauge). It's going to get converted to an exterior frame box car and used as a riding/water/fuel/tool/spare parts/lunch box/cooler car for the engine I am building. 


A good friend of mine has a 2200' 1 inch layout up in Overton. The 1 inch guys are a close knit group. 



Bob and Marty,

I started with my caboose, built for our first daughter, Janet. Then the wood gondola for our second daughter, Laura. Finally the refrigerator car for our son, Thomas. In the middle of all this confusion, I built mt Gene Allen ten-wheeler, live steamer!




























It's a great hobby Marty!!











Any grand kids in your future??








Hey Bob,

As a matter of fact, our daughter Laura is expecting in January!


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## ETSRRCo (Aug 19, 2008)

Only scale Im going to go up to from 1:20.3 is to 15 inch gauge. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iLskZi0m1-M&feature=related


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## ChaoticRambo (Nov 20, 2010)

Posted By ETSRRCo on 24 Aug 2011 11:50 AM 
Only scale Im going to go up to from 1:20.3 is to 15 inch gauge. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iLskZi0m1-M&feature=related 
If you have the type of money 15" gauge requires, more power to you!


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## Gary Armitstead (Jan 2, 2008)

MBG (Mega Bucks Guys) are the only one's that can afford this scale! I only knew one personally that could afford this stuff. Seymour Johnson, son and heir to the founder of Johnson Controls, died 1990?. He had a beautiful 15" railroad in the hills of Montecito, California (just south of Santa Barbara). He used to run his Hudson live steamer and a friends Atlantic. Later on they added another Hudson (sister to the one he already had. All of this on 40 acres of prime hill-top land and sharing with a 2 mile 7 1/2" gauge layout! It ONLY takes money!









I believe the property was sold a few years ago for about $40 million with a 10,000 sq. ft. contemporary home.


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## aceinspp (Jan 2, 2008)

Marty are you talking about Genoa, NE? I think you misspelled the location of the RR. 


Stan I don't think Marty will be adding 7 1/2 inch track gage as He is looking at 1 inch scale. Later RJD


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

It will fit, just shim the rails a bit ha ha! 

Greg


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Gary Armitstead on 24 Aug 2011 11:39 AM 
Posted By xo18thfa on 23 Aug 2011 09:28 PM 
Posted By Gary Armitstead on 23 Aug 2011 05:54 PM 
Posted By xo18thfa on 23 Aug 2011 04:13 PM 
Posted By NTCGRR on 23 Aug 2011 12:51 PM 
Good , so G "gauge" is not the only confusing ,,gauge. 
I know Richard wants to do 3ft gauge on 5" track . so I guess that would be 1.5"??? 
It's worse then "G" gauge. "G" gauge uses only Gauge 1 (45mm) track. "Ride-on" is 3.5", 4.75" and 7.25"/7.5" gauge track modelling 24", 36", std gauge and some odd balls and throw in "finescale". It's calculus.

But, yes, 3 foot on 4.75" track would be 1.5"

Are you starting with a piece of rolling stock? That's what I did. Built a 2.5" flat car on 7.5" (3 foot gauge). It's going to get converted to an exterior frame box car and used as a riding/water/fuel/tool/spare parts/lunch box/cooler car for the engine I am building. 


A good friend of mine has a 2200' 1 inch layout up in Overton. The 1 inch guys are a close knit group. 



Bob and Marty,

I started with my caboose, built for our first daughter, Janet. Then the wood gondola for our second daughter, Laura. Finally the refrigerator car for our son, Thomas. In the middle of all this confusion, I built mt Gene Allen ten-wheeler, live steamer!




























It's a great hobby Marty!!











Any grand kids in your future??








Hey Bob,

As a matter of fact, our daughter Laura is expecting in January!










The passenger stock generation -- perhaps?


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## Gary Armitstead (Jan 2, 2008)

No, I'm done building in this scale. That's why I'm into this "little" stuff now.


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## Nutz-n-Bolts (Aug 12, 2010)

Hi Gary, That's an interesting transition, usually it's the other direction. Care to elaborate on why? 

Congrats Marty!


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## Gary Armitstead (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Nutz-n-Bolts on 25 Aug 2011 06:23 AM 
Hi Gary, That's an interesting transition, usually it's the other direction. Care to elaborate on why? 

Congrats Marty! 

Age, loss of sight in one eye and health issues.







Other than that, everything is good!







I've been doing 1.5"/ft stuff since 1980, 1"/ft since 1956 (Jr. Hi) and the 1/22.5, 1/29 since 1985 and the 1/20.3 since about 2006.


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## NTCGRR (Jan 2, 2008)

Chippewa Northwestern in Goehner NE. Seward County .


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## NTCGRR (Jan 2, 2008)

well I got tired of working on my RR so

I went and learned how to lay 4 3/4" ,by 5/8" track.









I was helping this guy Jason install rail joiners with spacing. The other guys came along and finished out the filler ties that was not on the sections done in the shop.
Time flew by.
They used a gas powered tamper on the base, then will ballast. I had to leave.


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## blueregal (Jan 3, 2008)

Posted By aceinspp on 24 Aug 2011 06:25 PM 
Marty are you talking about Genoa, NE? I think you misspelled the location of the RR. 


Stan I don't think Marty will be adding 7 1/2 inch track gage as He is looking at 1 inch scale. Later RJD 

Nope, he said Goehner ne. Just west of Lincoln ne. Regal 



The Chippewa Northwestern Railway is Nebraska's Smallest Railroad | AmericanProfile.com


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By NTCGRR on 04 Sep 2011 04:16 PM 
well I got tired of working on my RR so

I went and learned how to lay 4 3/4" ,by 5/8" track.









I was helping this guy Jason install rail joiners with spacing. The other guys came along and finished out the filler ties that was not on the sections done in the shop.
Time flew by.
They used a gas powered tamper on the base, then will ballast. I had to leave.

Yer hooked bro. Hooked, hooked, hooked. When's the next work party??


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