# HYDE-OUT MOUNTAIN LIVE DIESEL



## F7 (Jan 29, 2008)

Hello all,
I know this is not the correct place, but I have a Hyde-out Mountain live *"Diesel"* electric locomotive, built on Marklin F7 chassis.  
Who else has has one? 
Maybe we can compare notes?
Cheers


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## tacfoley (Jan 3, 2008)

Tony23 here in yUK has one, and he seems to be very pleased with it, too.

Maybe he'll look in and comment.

And welcome to the forum!

tac
www.ovgrs.org


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

I have one also. But, I have to keep it a secret since the CMBY RY is the Forever Steam railway. 

I have run it on a friend's pike, and it managed to pull just itself (just barely) up a 3 or 4 percent curved grade. With only one powered axle and at least half of the weight over the non-powered truck it is a bit weak. I pulled a hopper, a boxcar and a caboose with it, but they tended to pick the switches at my friends pike so I removed them and ran light on the hill. I don't think it could have pulled them up that hill anyway. 

It has an exhaust-pressurized fuel system and I had to fiddle with the fuel tank to eliminate some minor leaks. I also find I have to put my finger over the exhaust pipe to increase the fuel pressure to get it started, so maybe I still have some leaks somewhere. 

Does yours tend to have lots of fuel all over the engine area? ...another reason I think I may have a leak someplace, but I understand that these model airplane engines do tend to get quite wet with their own fuel when running. I just can't figure out where it is coming from since the exhaust is piped out of the body of the locomotive.


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## scottemcdonald (Jan 11, 2008)

Hello all, 
I know this is not the correct place, but I have a Hyde-out Mountain live "Diesel" electric locomotive


That's a question that has been rased a couple of times, and I think the majority of the live steamers on this forum are tolerant with us "diesel dogs" posting here, as the majority that I personally know who do diesel, are also live steamers. It would be interesting to know the percentage of live steam/live diesel fans as to the elec/live diesel fans. 

Does yours tend to have lots of fuel all over the engine area?


At Diamondhead, my Wada Zephyr was spewing a trail of lubricant from the exhaust stack down the side, so the secondary trap was not capturing as much as the GP'9's do. which I suspect is because of the size difference between the traps. Are you getting that in addition to the fuel leakage? Could that be the source of your mess more than the fuel? Just curious. 

Scott 
www.livedieselmodels.com


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## F7 (Jan 29, 2008)

Hello All, 

Thank you for the nice welcome. 

Yes there was a big problem of fuel oil leaking-out all over the engine, down the sides and worst of all going iinto the blades of the cooling fan. I clean my cooling fan with cotton buds. 
I think I have traced this to the fitting of the exhaust to the engine. It is held on with two long bolts which give four possible leak holes, also there is the butt joint against the engine , which is another leak point. 
I have taken the exhaust to bits, cleaned it up and reasembled it with extra sealant. 

The fuel oil is also a problem, try and get one with synthetic oil, mine has only 9%. which makes for a fairly dry exhaust compared with ordinary buggy fuel. 

I agree with you Scott I am not sure the trap system idea works well enough and sometimes when there is a build-up of gunge in the trap it can sometimes come out in big sticky glumps sending the soft plastic exhaust thingy flying out like a howitzer shell.. This effect would be even worse on a grade as the gunge would flow back towards the engine. 

I am thinking of doing away with the whole oil trap idea and going for a very short exhaust, which the OS15 motor will prefer and will be easier to tune for slower running.


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

I have only run mine 6 times, mainly because of the trouble I started having just to get it started.  Once I figured out that it was the fuel pressurization not working properly, it got way too cold to go outside to play.

I usually get some residue in the exhaust pipe, which I clean out with the syrninge like the instructions say to. I do not have a good measure of how much accumulates on mine, but it is not very much.  I think there was more the first time I ran it, than any time since.

I wad the filter sponge in a paper towel and squeeze it many times to wring the oil from it.  I have not had it come completely out of the pipe while running, though once, after about 35 minutes of running, it had been pushed up so that about 1/4-inch was exposed above the loco body.

Yes, my cooling fan behind the cylinder of the OS Motors engine is very well oiled! /DesktopModules/NTForums/themes/mls/emoticons/sick.gif But there is oil on the opposite side of the cylinder also.  I know very little about these glowplug engines so I don't have a good idea of what all the parts are or what they do or where the fuel and air passages are.  There is a hole in the front of the motor that has a silicone tube over it, I assume that is the air intake.  There is lots of fuel all around there also as though fuel is (back)flowing out that hole.  But there is not enough to account for the quantity on the loco frame below the motor.  Tipping the loco up on the back end after a long run will cause a "stream" of fuel to dribble off the frame.  If that is normal, I don't care and will put up with it.  If that is excessive, I will investigate further and maybe get better gas mileage! /DesktopModules/NTForums/themes/mls/emoticons/crying.gif I will look at the exhaust port fittings.


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## Tom Lapointe (Jan 2, 2008)

Charles, if the engine is a typical OS 2-stroke glow engine (I believe the one thats used in these is either a ""10" or "15" (0.1  or 0.15 cu.in displacement), they are typically VERY messy /DesktopModules/NTForums/themes/mls/emoticons/sick.gif after running!  (I speak from glow-powered RC airplane /DesktopModules/NTForums/themes/mls/emoticons/hehe.gif experience).  Since the fuel is ALSO the lubricant, they like to run with a "rich"/DesktopModules/NTForums/themes/mls/emoticons/doze.gif fuel mixture (relatively high mix of fuel to air).  On RC airplanes, normal practice after a day of flying with glow-powered engines is to wipe the aircraft down with glass cleaner to get rid of what's often referred to as "plane poop"!/DesktopModules/NTForums/themes/mls/emoticons/crazy.gif  That (along with the noise issue  from glow engines) is one of the reasons "sparky"/DesktopModules/NTForums/themes/mls/emoticons/tongue.gif (electrically-powered) aircraft have gained popularity in recent years among the RC airplane crowd (going that way myself, planning to either retire/DesktopModules/NTForums/themes/mls/emoticons/doze.gif or remotor my remaining glow-powered planes).  There are adjustments on the carburetor (needle valves & perhaps an air inlet adjustment screw) to adjust the fuel / air mix; if it's set too "lean" (too much air), the engine will overheat & quit/DesktopModules/NTForums/themes/mls/emoticons/pinch.gif; repeated over-lean operation can permanently damage /DesktopModules/NTForums/themes/mls/emoticons/crying.gif the engine.  It's also a good idea to squirt a bit of "after-run oil" down the carburetor throat (and turn the engine over by hand to distribute it), especially if you go a long time between runs; regular "Dextron ATF" automatic transmission fluid is a good a"after-run" oil.  The fuel mixture also usually needs to be adjusted towards the "rich" side for warm weather running, "leaner" for cool weather.

                                                                                                                                                             Tom


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## JEFF RUNGE (Jan 2, 2008)

Charles,
 You may want to look around on this web site: http://www.osengines.com/
 These engines can can have carbs with 2 or 3 needle valves adjustments on the carb.  I found the 3 needle to be the best for racing but the 2 should be fine for the locomotive application. They need to tuned  with the change in temp, and humidity  to avoid overheating (instant DEATH) or fouling glow plugs  As you will see on the above web site there are different engines for different applications and there are also different fuels. The *right fuel* is important for long engine life and good performance.  Under race conditions (lean and mean) engine life is about 10 gallons of fuel.  The most important tuning tool is a digital temp gauge ( about  $30 to $40 last time I got one)
 You may want to check out some RC car and truck forums. ( Traxxas, OFNA,) or pick op a magazine like *RC car Action

*BTW  I find our LIVE STAEM engines much more economical to run and maintain then R/C cars and trucks!
just my  $.02  

Jeff


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## F7 (Jan 29, 2008)

Hello All,

Sorry, but I have not been able continue as when the forum crashed, being only a very new member, I could not get back to you.

Thank you all for your advice about glow plugs and OS engines. 
The engine fitted is the 15 model and Jerry has said that the motor must not exceed 6000 revs which is only about 33.3% of what it is capable of, which almost a tickover speed.  
I have purchased a head temperature  gauge, but what is the amount of heat I should be looking for? Max?
I have also purchase a rev counter which should be very useful when setting the min and max settings.


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## JEFF RUNGE (Jan 2, 2008)

Normal tenp should be 220 to 250f, after a wide open run.


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## F7 (Jan 29, 2008)

Thanks, Jeff. I will have to change my temperature gauge back to old money as it is on C. 
By "wide open run" do you mean at the normal 18,000 revs? I only take this OS15 up to a max. of 6,000 revs.


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Is that Head Temperature Gauge a "contact" gauge or an infrared type? Where exactly does it measure?  Just the head "generally" or some specific place?

Should the temperature be taken after the engine is stopped?
Should it be taken with the cooling fan in operation?

Does all that make any difference at all?


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## JEFF RUNGE (Jan 2, 2008)

I always tried to take the temp reading with the engine running, they cool quickly. Infrared or contact is OK,both shound take the temp beside the glow plug. Yes with cooling fan. If you can read the temp as the engine speed by on the track after a few laps, that may give you your most usefull reading. 
Jeff


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## hydeoutmountain (Feb 10, 2008)

Hello All, 
If you have questions, problems or would like trouble shooting help, PLEASE JUST CALL ME @ 740-946-6611. I am here most of the time & would like to help you. This is the best & easiest way to get correct answers & avoid frustration. You can email directly to me at; [email protected] , but a slow cumbersion one way conversation, is not condusive to discussions of a technical nature. I usually check my email at least every other day. 
Thank you, 
Jerry 
Hyde-Out Mountain Live Steam 
(& Diesel)


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## F7 (Jan 29, 2008)

Hello All, 
I can confirm that Jerry's aftersale service is excellent. He has helped me out with many little challenges on the F7.


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## aceinspp (Jan 2, 2008)

How about some photos?  Later RJD


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Jerry,

Please, forgive me if our comments here were not directed to you first. It is not dissatisfaction with your product, but a point of being completely alone in understanding the engine. I don't know if I have the BEST one you ever built, or the worst. I have never seen another one so I have no basis of comparison.

I know I can call you if I get stuck with a problem. But, I am not sure what constitutes a problem. (I don't wanna be a PEST, either!)

I do know that I am *quite pleased* with it.  The "gee wizz" factor that Live Diesel actually works is one thing. Learning what it is capable of, is another. I have proudly  shown it off a couple of times and expect to do so many times in the future.  I am, at present, uneducated as to its capabilities and eagerly anticipate some experiments to find out, but I won't be able to conduct them until the outdoor temperature has gone up at least 70 degrees (and been in that general vicinity long enough to melt a couple of feet of ice and snow off the tracks!)  At my usual Sunday run time today, it was MINUS 2 degrees (F.) outside... I suppose it is possible that your Live Diesel might run at that temp but "I" DON'T /DesktopModules/NTForums/themes/mls/emoticons/sick.gif and have no intention to find out!  (Okay, Steam has a higher appeal to me so I tried my Aster Mike at 0 deg. a couple of years ago --- uh, NO, it didn't work well enough to attempt it ever again.)

I am still in, what I figure will be, a somewhat long learningg curve with the Live Diesel, not because your product is difficult, but because I am. /DesktopModules/NTForums/themes/mls/emoticons/hehe.gif I know a lot about Live Steam from book learning of full size practice, and hands-on of miniature stationary engines and 2 Large Scale Aster Mikes.  I have "some" book learnin' about infernal combustion engines (and I "can" change the oil in my car!), but I know very little about miniature Diesels, (other than some short stints with some toy airplanes, where all I learned was leveling off at 3-ft underground is a bad idea!/DesktopModules/NTForums/themes/mls/emoticons/sick.gif)

I come here to either commiserate with and/or brag to others who own Live Diesels from you and similar products from others.

I would like to know more about the design decisions you made and what ALL the parts inside do (and why), but I don't know enough at present to form a cogent question for you.  I know that e-mail and forum "discussions" are slow and cumbersome, but my verbal babbling trying to ask a question over the phone could certainly be even slower and more frustrating for both me and you.

I do have one subject I think you can address here.  What time of day and day of the week would be conducive to a civil /DesktopModules/NTForums/themes/mls/emoticons/blink.gif discussion with you?  Like I said above, I don't want to be a pest, and I figure 3AM /DesktopModules/NTForums/themes/mls/emoticons/pinch.gif your time would be a poor choice for a quick question about anything at all.


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## F7 (Jan 29, 2008)




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