# Locomotive Brands to stay away from?



## DanH (Nov 20, 2012)

What brands should I stay away from? If I spend money I want a good quality locomotive that will last a long time


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

You basically get what you pay for, although many people will tell you LGB is overpriced. 

I have never purchased a locomotive that did not eventually need work, nor one that did not have some flaws in design or workmanship. 

I have however managed to get all of them working to my satisfaction except for a couple that will require new machined parts. 

Many beginners ask this question, and there's several threads on the subject. 

So, besides encouraging you to be more specific (locomotive era, type, etc.), and to search the forums and read older existing threads, I recommend staying away from the "cheapies". 

Again, you basically get what you pay for, so expressing a locomotive type and budget would be the next helpful step from you. 

Greg


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## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

to search the forums and read older existing threads 
Dan, 
There's a trick to the search - the one on this site is a pain. 

Use Google and be 'site-specific', e.g. search for "site:mylargescale.com beginner locomotive" for example.


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## Gary Armitstead (Jan 2, 2008)

Good advice from Greg regarding "you get what you pay for". I haven't bought very many engines in my 27 years in the LS hobby. The brands and prices are all over the map! My first engine was an LGB 2018D. Paid over $500 for it in 1985. I didn't know any better at the time. But it STILL runs like a Swiss watch-outstanding quality and workmanship. LGB was made in West Germany at that time. Then I purchased a USA SD-40-2 in 1999 (change of interest)/ About $300. Change of interest again and purchased a brand new set of LGB Santa Fe ABBA F7's. About $2000 then. Then in 2007. my interest went to Colorado NG......Fn3 finescale. Bought a Bachmann Connie (around $275) and added Airwire/Phoenix sound (around another grand) installed by Jonathan Bliese at EMW. Also added BBT drive because the gears were stripped! A year later, I bought an Accucraft C-19 and had Jonathan install Airwire/Phoenix. About $3300 into this engine. Around July this year, I bought a used Berlyn work Goose #6 for $850. Excellent quality....brass model. As you see. you can spend a little or LOTS. The Bachmann engines can be hit or miss on quality. USA is pretty good. Accucraft is upper end. But I DO enjoy all of them. 

Good luck with your quest. You just need to peruse this site and the internet to get a sampling of what folks have to say about what brands to avoid. AND most likely you will different answers regarding the SAME brands. Your "mileage may vary".


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## vsmith (Jan 2, 2008)

Avoid cheap crappy battery op toys: 

New Bright 

New Ray 

Scientific Toys 

Lionel large scale 

Newquida (locomotive only) 

Be wary: 

Bachmann: 
Early 4-6-0 Big Haulers, generally the oldest were the most trouble prone ones, the units produced in the last 5 years or so are very good. Look for metal siderods and your good to go. 
Consolidated: Older can have gear issues, can be fixed 
Shay, Older can have gear issues, replacing bricks with new can be expensive as the replacements are now hard to find, new models are good. 

Aristo, has some real hit and miss issues with almost everything, some stuff is terrific, some not so much. Most issues have been with the steam line. 
almost all their diesel line is OK, particularly the older line like the FA1 RS3 and GP9 

LGB: the stubby 2-4-0 was known to strip its gears if you looked at it funny, as was the little red Playmobil like diesel that was part of the Toytrain lineup. 
Otherwise pricey but reliable.


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## DanH (Nov 20, 2012)

I should have clarified by locomotive I meant diesel and steam types and also I only look forward to running rail power


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## Randy Stone (Jan 2, 2008)

While all the above advice is great, let me try to me more specific. 

Accucraft: While an expensive brand, these engines can require some tinkering to get the best performance from them. 
Aristo Craft: Buy only engines that come in the yellow box. The gray (REA) and Black (ARISTO) boxes are old product that is more likely to cause you problems. 
Bachmann: Buy only the Spectrum Series as the rest is a mixed bag of problems. Do not buy any 2 truck Shays with plastic trucks. 
Buddy L: Stay away from this brand as it is the bottom of the barrel. 
LGB: One of the best, but not indestructable if you try pulling a lot of cars. 
Lionel: Here is another mixed bag. the 4-4-2 Steam Engines needs mods to the motor mounting. The newer 2-8-2 is much like the New Bright brand. 
Marklin: Expensive but like the LGB, not indestructable if you try pulling a lot of cars. 
MTH: No real complaints that I know of except the scale is 1/32. The scale really limits you to what rolling stock is available. 
New Bright: Stay away from this brand as it is the bottom of the barrel. 
REA: Also known as Arito Craft: Stay away from these. Buy the newer Aristo Craft in the yellow boxes. 
Scientific Toys: Stay away from this brand as it is the bottom of the barrel. 
USAT: One of the best, but not indestructable if you try pulling a lot of cars. 

I'm sure I missed some brands or specific models of a brand, but the most common issue is over loading. Some of the above engines do good to pull 3 or 4 cars on level track. 

So, when you find an engine you are interested in, post a thread specific to that engine and let those who have one tell you their experience.


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## DanH (Nov 20, 2012)

Thanks for all the great info and knowledge


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## Madstang (Jan 4, 2008)

Theres' not a one engine I haven't had to tweek, at one time or another...from Accucraft to USA, to LGB.

I even purchased a BubbyL Circus train, works like a champ..just took 3 engines to get it right from the company!

Even my USA Hudson had to have screws lock tightened..

My LEAST problematic engines are

LGB Mikado, Mogul, of course without much grade, Uintah all run flawlessly....my USA Hudson, after I lock tightned it, it is my best puller/runner.....USA GP-9, only thing I have to do with those is constantly RE-GLUE parts on them, but them and my F-3s' run flawlessly, my Aristo converted Pacific Camelback runs great, and my LGB ASTER K-28 FLAWLESS!!
My Bachmann 2-6-6-2, after I lock tightened all the rod screws it runs great..just have to keep an eye on them..no problems yet.

But the ones I run the most are the GP-9s' and the Hudson..and they are never any problem year after year and I let them run for hours at end. The rest get some run time but not much.


MOST PROBLEMATIC are my USA Big BOY, Accucraft K-36...(sick of tweeking this one..would like to sell it, even though it is my favotrite looking engine..there is NOTHING wrong with it EXCEPT my layout!) It needs to have PERFECT track or it will not stay on the track..has those RIDICIULOUS prototypical flanges...I suggest unless your layout is on a board or has PERFECT trackage stay away from ACCUCRAFT! That brand will bring you nothing but fustration and or heartache! 
It is made for layouts that are steam track perfect!

I have found that diesels run great, steamers take a little more....


IMHO

Bubba


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## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

Bubba, I had a similar problem with my Accucraft K-28. I had it for almost two years before I could get it to go around my layout. My track work isn't the best and I have Aristo 10' diameter curves. I mentioned this to someone who had a K-28 running on similar curves without a problem. He said that originally he also had problems. The K has very stiff suspension on the drivers. There are three springs where each axle passes through the frame. He removed the two outside springs on each axle, on each side leaving the center spring and that solved his problem. When I got home I tried it and after removing 2 of the three springs (leaving the center spring) and my problem was solved. It now runs beautifully. I don't know if the K-36 has similar suspension, I don't know if this will help you. If it does, it is worth a try.

Chuck


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## Russell Rutalj (Dec 7, 2010)

I purchased a Three Truck Shay and a 4-4-0 from Bachmann. Both have run well . I am happy with there preformance and also the price.


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## NorthwestGarrattGuy (Oct 18, 2021)

Randy Stone said:


> While all the above advice is great, let me try to me more specific.
> 
> Accucraft: While an expensive brand, these engines can require some tinkering to get the best performance from them.
> Aristo Craft: Buy only engines that come in the yellow box. The gray (REA) and Black (ARISTO) boxes are old product that is more likely to cause you problems.
> ...


ahem reverse the brands i can't afford LGB USA trains or Accucraft
so new bright newqida bachmann big haulers eztec for me


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## Dan Pierce (Jan 2, 2008)

There are many companies that made good products, but are now out of business so I would caution anyone that does not do their own repairs to avoid these products unless you have a good friend that can help you. Gone are Delton, Aristocraft, HLW, Kalamazoo. Parts are difficult to find for these esp motors/drive train parts.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

"reverse the brands" ???

The question asked was with the priority of quality.

Your priority seems to be cost.

Clearly a different priority than this thread was based on. So yes, as in post #2, you get what you pay for.

Pay less, get less (in general)

Greg


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## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

Greg Elmassian said:


> The question asked


 . . in 2012. Though I guess an update is timely!


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

The posts before seem fine... and the update is fine.... I was commenting on this statement:
"ahem reverse the brands i can't afford LGB USA trains or Accucraft "

ahem what? The subject of the thread is "What brands should I stay away from? If I spend money I want a good quality locomotive that will last a long time "

so if you have a different goal, that is fine, but it's not what this thread is about... "ahem what"?

Thanks for the update Dan, good advice to people starting out and looking for good quality.

Greg


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## NorthwestGarrattGuy (Oct 18, 2021)

Greg Elmassian said:


> The posts before seem fine... and the update is fine.... I was commenting on this statement:
> "ahem reverse the brands i can't afford LGB USA trains or Accucraft "
> 
> ahem what? The subject of the thread is "What brands should I stay away from? If I spend money I want a good quality locomotive that will last a long time "
> ...


oh sorry i often miss chunks of sentences or words


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Don't think we don't appreciate your priorities, we get it, just don't negate the thread that has a different thrust...

So we definitely know your priorities, but trying to make good reliable locos from the really cheap knock offs is very tough, as usually the drivetrains are weak. Best advice is keep your railroad flat, and do not try pulling long trains.

Also, maybe start researching inexpensive drive trains on Ali Express that you can modify to fit the locos.

Of course, keep looking for really good deals on used trains, but normally you want more quality.

Greg

p.s. I will have to disagree a bit with one post above, Buddy L can be pretty robust and reliable, but hard to find.


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## NorthwestGarrattGuy (Oct 18, 2021)

Greg Elmassian said:


> Don't think we don't appreciate your priorities, we get it, just don't negate the thread that has a different thrust...
> 
> So we definitely know your priorities, but trying to make good reliable locos from the really cheap knock offs is very tough, as usually the drivetrains are weak. Best advice is keep your railroad flat, and do not try pulling long trains.
> 
> ...


well i was planning on bashing cheaper locos into garratts and mallets to take some strain of the drive trains and still have some pulling power


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Umm, normally the amount of work is pretty large making these articulated locos... a cheap gearbox might spoil all the fun, but heck, if you have more time than money, go for it. In theory you should be able to pull longer trains, but the added complexity of making these locos work well might be the wrong direction.

Might be best to find a used Bachmann 2-6-6-2 and work from there.

here's a loco people have had success with:








BUDDY L G SCALE 2-6-2 LOCOMOTIVE/TENDER #9 (BACHMANN, DELTON KEYSTONE) NICE | eBay


NICE BUDDY L G SCALE 2-6-2 LOCOMOTIVE #9 AND TENDER IN VERY GOOD CONDITION. LOCOMOTIVE HAS WORKING HEADLIGHT, SYNCHRONIZED CHUFFING SOUND, AND SMOKE. (REQUIRES 3 AAA BATTERIES---NOT INCLUDED), AND NON-FUNCTIONING BACKUP LIGHT.



www.ebay.com





Greg


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## NorthwestGarrattGuy (Oct 18, 2021)

Greg Elmassian said:


> Umm, normally the amount of work is pretty large making these articulated locos... a cheap gearbox might spoil all the fun, but heck, if you have more time than money, go for it. In theory you should be able to pull longer trains, but the added complexity of making these locos work well might be the wrong direction.
> 
> Might be best to find a used Bachmann 2-6-6-2 and work from there.
> 
> ...


but all the bachmann 2-6-6-2 locos only sell at scalper prices now


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## NorthwestGarrattGuy (Oct 18, 2021)

and i was planning on trying to make a mallet with some new bright locos then work my up to higher quality parts for a Garratt


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Yeah, sadly they used to come up reasonably priced on the used market. What you need good mechanisms on locos that may be poor cosmetically.

Many people look for the sale by Bachmann where they sell the entire Big Hauler chassis... when they are on sale the price is really good (relative to normal price)

Maybe out of your price range, but might consider making one good loco as opposed to 2 marginal ones. 

greg


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## NorthwestGarrattGuy (Oct 18, 2021)

Greg Elmassian said:


> Yeah, sadly they used to come up reasonably priced on the used market. What you need good mechanisms on locos that may be poor cosmetically.
> 
> Many people look for the sale by Bachmann where they sell the entire Big Hauler chassis... when they are on sale the price is really good (relative to normal price)
> 
> ...


well my plan was to make a 4-6-0+0-6-4 Garratt from to bachmann big hauler chassis after i make a mallet from new bright as pratice since i have never any kitbashing before


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