# 45 Ton bash



## PVRR_Adam (Nov 17, 2010)

A few years ago, I had the opportunity to pick up a Bachmann 45 ton at a price that was too good to pass up. Since then, I've been searching for something I could kitbash it into to backdate it to something that looks more appropriate for the late 1920s. Keeping the side rods is a must. I recently ran across an old drawing I had done of a pair of ON30 Davenport shells made into a centercab, on a longer frame and using powered archbar trucks. I remember there being at least one prototype for this, but I don't know anymore where I could find one.

Anyway, my question to all of you would be, how the size of the 45 ton and the Davenport compare. I know the 45 ton is probably pretty huge next to the Davenport, but I have been planning on shrinking it as part of this bash anyway, so that is not a problem. I'm thinking I can take two Davenport hoods and a cab, mount them on the downsized Bachmann frame, and replace the GE sideframes with archbars (I know I've seen archbars with siderods somewhere, too.) Does this sound possible, and how difficult would it be?

Adam


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## PVRR_Adam (Nov 17, 2010)

I found the drawing:

Link


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

I'm not an expert, but were their any diesels in the 1920s? I thought they came a decade later, and the GE centercabs were 1940s designs. I'm not sure what diesels running in the late 1920s looked like. 

The drawing is cool!


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## PVRR_Adam (Nov 17, 2010)

It doesn't have to be a diesel, an oil-electric or gas-electric works fine. Even if it's more along the lines of something from the 30s, at least it's older looking.


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## Scottychaos (Jan 2, 2008)

Most diesels of the 1920's were the boxcabs..

Diesel boxcab of 1925:









although there were also a few very early switchers that came out in the late 20's and early 30's..

Alco switcher, 1931 

IR switcher, 1935 

Westinghouse, 1930 

EMC model SC..the ancestor of the EMD SW1 

Im not sure if there was a a diesel model that was *not* a boxcab prior to 1930..
but non-boxcab "end-cab switchers" began to appear as early as 1930..

There is apparently a GE center cab locomotive (boxcab variant) from 1933, but I havent found a photo of it yet..

Scot


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## Scottychaos (Jan 2, 2008)

GE built one of the earliest diesel locomotives in the USA in 1917..
they used the body of already existing all-electric locomotives..

According to :GE switchers
The earliest versions of the classic GE center-cab switcher did not appear until 1938.

Scot


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

It will be hard to have connecting rods and archbar trucks


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## PVRR_Adam (Nov 17, 2010)

Thanks for the input so far. It's not so important to me that the date is correct for the late 20s, but more that the "look" is right for an earlier locomotive. Just so it's older looking than the stock GE. If the trucks won't work due to how the sideframes are mounted, I can live with them being how they are, but the Davenport body is the main thing I need to know dimensions on. I know I've seen archbars with siderods on a French locomotive, but unfortunately I don't know where there are any pictures online.


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## Ralph Berg (Jun 2, 2009)

Davenport made a 44 ton centercab. No siderods though. 
There's a picture about half way down the page 

http://www.nctrans.org/Exhibits/Rail-Equipment----Diesel-Locomotives.aspx


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

GE made 45 ton centercabs, some with siderods starting in 1939. For something really interesting, look up the Plymouth XL model, built in the late 1920s. 
Porter built a number of 45 ton center cab engines with side rods in the 1940s, Whitcomb also built a number of them during the 1940s. 
All this info is from the book "Critters,Dinkys, And Centercabs"


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## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

If you're looking to use the Bachmann Davenport on top of the 45-tonner trucks, I think it would work out well, though you'll probably want a taller/wider/longer cab. 

Davenport hoods: 
2 5/8" tall 
3 5/8" long 
2 1/4" wide 

Davenport cab: 
3 1/2" tall 
2 3/4" long 
3 3/4" wide 

45 tonner hood: 
3 1/2" tall 
5 1/4" long 
2 1/4" wide 

For proportional comparison, here's a center cab I just redid for my dad's railroad using the trucks from the B'mann 45 tonner: 










It's based on a 40-ton Whitcomb built for the US Navy in 1941. 

Cab dimensions: 
4 1/2" tall 
3 3/4" long 
4" wide 

Hood dimensions: 
2 1/4" tall 
3 3/4" long 
1 3/4" wide 

The Davenport hood is about the same length, and actually a bit taller and wider than what I built for this model. If you use the Davenport cab, I think the loco will be too short. The 45-tonner trucks are fairly large, with 33" wheels in 1:20.3/ That scales to a whopping 39" in 1:24 (the scale to which the Whitcomb is built). 

I also think you're going to have a rough go in terms of swapping out the sideframes for archbar trucks. I don't know how they're attached to the motor block, but just on aesthetics alone, if you were to go with an archbar style truck, I think it would be too open to look good. You can get away with it on the Shay and Climax because the trucks are so much smaller. It's harder to see through the openings. Not so much on this one. That, and a steel frame would have been plausible (if not absolute) on a diesel of that size and weight. There's a traction motor on that truck, it's pretty heavy, and would need something fairly substantial to hang from. That, and I'm not sure the strap iron of an archbar truck would withstand the pounding inherent in having a siderod transfer power from one wheel to the next. If something were to bind up, that strap would snap fairly easily. 

Having said that, it's your loco. Build what you want if that's what you're after. If I were to do something like that and make it plausible for the 1920s, I'd have a riveted cab like a cut-down box cab, and probably borrow heavily from the automotive industry for the design of the hoods. Maybe doors opening to the side, but maybe also panels that would swing up to reveal what's underneath. Keep the trucks as is. 

Later, 

K


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## PVRR_Adam (Nov 17, 2010)

Love that Whitcomb! Thanks for the measurements K, I like the ideas you've offered. Looking at my model I don't think it would be as easy as I had thought to change the sideframes, so I'll probably leave those as is. Good to know the Davenport hoods at least should work, though.

Edit: Looking at some of the dimensions, I'm wondering if 3D printing at least a new cab might be the way to go. If I was to print new hoods, something like this, a 1931 gas electric, might not be too bad:

http://www.rail-pictures.com/1024/the-thousand-islands-railway-originally-6723.jpgLink


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## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

I don't know what 3D printing will run you, but a 12 x 24 sheet of .080" styrene and an x-acto knife will run you about $20 total. The cab's the easy part, even with the rivets as shown in that photo. On the Whitcomb, I cut the main cab walls out of the .080" styrene, leaving the window openings about 1/8" wider all the way around than what I wanted to end up with. Then I laminated .010" styrene sheet on top of that with the window openings cut to size. The glass for the windows is glued into the opening. This loco had a welded cab, but I could very easily have embossed rivets around the edges for a riveted look. 

Later, 

K


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## PVRR_Adam (Nov 17, 2010)

I have a few connections regarding 3D printing, and a lot more experience modeling on the computer than in styrene. But, I do really want to learn how to build in styrene, and this would be a fairly simple way to learn, so maybe I'll give it a shot.


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