# Any interest in a locomotive running stand?



## clifforddward (Jan 2, 2008)

As a result of becoming an instructor at our local "Techshop" location, I now have access to a whole array of equipment not available in my home shop...this includes larger lathes, mills, and other metalworking equipment, plus a complete woodworking shop. Now I can finally take on several projects I have pondered over the years....

One thing I have often thought of producing is a locomotive running stand, along the lines of the "Rolling Road" previously marketed by the late John Prescott in the UK. For those not familiar with this device, here is a photo:









Unfortunately John would not sell directly to those in Canada and the USA, and as a result many have never seen one of these in use. 

The typical device used in the USA some version of the ball bearing wheel stand as marketed by Accucraft:










There is a certain advantage to the Prescott rolling road type device...that being that the plain bearings provide a small about of resistance and provide some load for the locomotive drivers to work against...I have found this better than the super free rolling bearings of the Accucraft treadmill rollers.


Here's the question...would there be interest from the Live Steam community for a rolling road type device available here in the USA?


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## Cougar Rock Rail (Jan 2, 2008)

Hi Cliff, 

Just a suggestion in case you do go ahead and produce one....perhaps build into it an adjustable friction brake so it can act almost like a dynamometer, I think that would be handy for adjusting timing etc. 

Keith


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## Charles (Jan 2, 2008)

Cliff

Yes, would be interested but would have to accommodate a variety of locomotive sizes.


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## David Leech (Dec 9, 2008)

Cliff, 
I think as is normal in this type of item, it comes down to cost. 
If one has Big Boys or Challengers, how much will it cost for all those wheels? 
Personally, I have never had any desire to own one, and just test all my locos on the track. 
I think once, as there was too much snow on the track to be bothered to clear it, I blocked up my Hudson to test it after re-timing it. 
So, I'm sorry, but I doubt that I will be a customer, but as they say "build it, and they will buy". 
Good luck, 
Regards, 
David Leech, Delta, Canada


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## Jerry Barnes (Jan 2, 2008)

Is this adjustable, or do you need one for each type of locomotive?


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## clifforddward (Jan 2, 2008)

Charles....thanks for the reply...you are right, in order to be practical any locomotive test stand would need to be adjustable to fit a wide range of locomotives...the Preston Rolling Road I have is adjustable...the one thing I worry about is the minimum driver spacing...on the Preston model the minimum driver spacing is 1.5"...not a problem for my 7/8" locos, but I wonder about the 1:32 locos....can you advise what is the minimum driver spacing you run into with your engines?


I think closer driver spacing may be possible, although I'm not sure by how much.


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## Jerry Barnes (Jan 2, 2008)

My Aristo live steam Mikado is 2 1/8". 
Good page with lots of spacing here:
Large Scale Motor Block Spacing


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## BigRedOne (Dec 13, 2012)

Regarding the comment about some friction versus free-spinning bearings, for the purpose of initial break-in or testing to find and eliminate friction in the engine, would it not be better to have free-spinning bearings? 

It looks like the roller assemblies can slide along the rails? So, with rails available in a variety of lengths it seems easy to accommodate many engines by selecting the appropriate rail length and number of rollers. 

Is the unit infinity adjustable? I can't see for sure, but the photo looks like there are three holes in the roller carriages and a row of them in the rails? Infinite adjustability seems best, since this assures level support for as many axles as the locomotive has. 

I suggest materials which won't rust, or suffer from water and steam oil; support for leading and trailing axles; and robust enough not to bind or get out of square if carried around. 

I'd look at the cost of a set of model car bearings and aluminum angle stock, but I'd be interested if the adjustability and quality were there at the right price.


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## jbwilcox (Jan 2, 2008)

Is it ethical to use school equipment to produce items you intend to Sell?

Looks like that could result in some trouble down the line.

John


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## iceclimber (Aug 8, 2010)

i don't think it would be an less ethical than using MLS classifieds to sell your wares without having to give MLS a percentage like you would with Ebay. If done during off hours then I see no ethic clash.


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## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

to use school equipment 
I don't think Cliff is using 'school' equipment. 

"TechShop is a membership-based do-it-yourself workshop that provides members with the use of tools and equipment, classes and.." 

I think there are a few opening in various parts of the country - I'd welcome one in the DC/Baltimore area!


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## clifforddward (Jan 2, 2008)

Thanks to all for the feedback....yes, the John Preston type rolling road is infinitely adjustable. 

With regards to the school comment, to set the record straight Techshop is not a school, but rather a membership type "shared workshop" establishment. I will be a part time instructor for some of the introductory classes to teach safe operation of the various woodworking and metalworking equipment....use of the tools is one of the side benefits of being an instructor.

Here is a link to the Techshop web site for those interested:
http://www.techshop.ws/index.html
If you are close to one of their locations it is a nice facility to have access to...certainly fills in the gaps for anything I don't have here at the home shop.

Charles, I won't be able to make it to Cabin Fever this year...but will be at Jim's in June...we'll talk more on exact rolling road design needs for your various engines at that time.


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## clifforddward (Jan 2, 2008)

Hi Pete....I think our posts went in about the same time....your explanation is correct.

I believe there is a Techshop in the planning stages for the DC area...I'll ask around this week and see if I can get any more details.


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## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

I believe there is a Techshop in the planning stages for the DC area 
Oh dear. More complicated engineering tools to learn . . .


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## clifforddward (Jan 2, 2008)

Funny you mention that Pete...I was a student in the CNC mill class last night at Techshop...gonna be a steep learning curve on that piece of equipment!


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## aopagary (Jun 30, 2008)

Posted By clifforddward on 08 Apr 2013 01:48 PM 
... the one thing I worry about is the minimum driver spacing...on the Preston model the minimum driver spacing is 1.5"...not a problem for my 7/8" locos, but I wonder about the 1:32 locos....can you advise what is the minimum driver spacing you run into with your engines?


i have a set of Aster rollers which are mounted on 1.5" bases. with the majority of their locomotive designed to 1:32 scale, there is no caveat on their roller bases as not being able to work with any of their models. 1.5" in 1:32 works out to be 48" and although there are some small switchers with driver size in this range, they are usually stretched out on the frame quite a bit over their diameter. i think you should be ok with that dimension.

cheers...gary


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## clifforddward (Jan 2, 2008)

Thanks for the spacing comment Gary...much appreciated.

Unfortunately I received notification the other day that our local Techshop is closing down as of today....apparently they could not make the business model work out to be profitable for this location...no immediate plans to reopen in the local area...of course this means I have lost access to the specialty equipment, and several projects involving larger metal processing, as well as laser cutting, will now need to be placed on the back burner....

Since that door is now slammed shut, I'll be looking for the next one to open down the hallway of life...

Best Regards,
Cliff


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## Mike Reilley (Jan 2, 2008)

Be careful of adding friction resistance to the rollers....or you could have an engine just run off the rollers, fall, and break.


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## Chris Scott (Jan 2, 2008)

Never have understood the "wont sell to US" because we're too litigous yet the UK hasz redgulations governing nearly everything. You cannot buy a gallon of distilled water or what we take for grantedd buying a few 8oz cans of butane. Oh well, there are a lot of things I can't figure out... 

Mooving on... 
I've seen two types of rolling roads, maybe three. 1.) The Accucraft type above; 1a.) the same type but no axel the bearings atttached to the (same type of) frame. 2. A single bearing that supports two drivers. I have never heard one works better than the other. The latter just saves on rollers. 

I don't think it matters whether two drivers are supported, or all drivers. Either method puts all weight on drivers. The weight is either distributed on two driver or as many drivers as the loco has supported. You could have rollers under just one driver with blocks at each end and all weight would be on that one driver.


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

You really want all the drivers supported equally. Letting one or more sag from the others will produce binding in the side rods.

As for running off the rollers,... I put my rollers on a board with end stops that are high enough to capture the ends of the loco (and tender for backwards running). Only one set of rollers is rigidly attached to the board, the others are free to fit under the other wheels and can be adjusted as necessary for different wheel spacing if necessary, but, of course, the end stops are pretty much designed to fit my Aster Mike.

I considered adding a coupler to the rear stop to grab the tender coupler and make its spacing to the tender adjustable to fit different length engines.

I put two long handles on the board that straddle the board from one side to the other, wide enough to raise above the engine without touching the sides of the engine and long enough to touch at the top so that I can carry the engine and tender in one hand. The handles keep the engine from falling off the sides and the end stops keep it from rolling off the ends. Not real stable for long distance carrying, but good enough to move from a work table to the side of a nearby track so I can pick it up (gingerly, if it is a hot engine) to move it from the board to the track if I want.


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## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

Never have understood the "wont sell to US" because we're too litigous yet the UK hasz redgulations governing nearly everything. 
Just to digress for a moment to address Chris' issue . . . The difference is that you can't sue someone easily in the UK for negligence or bad product design, etc. [It's called 'tort reform' over here, and one reason healthcare is so expensive is that you need insurance in case you get sued. I carry a $3M umbrella personal liability policy - how about you?] 

Not only is it difficult to sue someone, but UK law requires that you pay ALL the opposing party's legal costs if you lose. That will stop and make you reconsider. 

However, I can't see why the UK vendors are so squeemish. I've not heard of any lawsuit involving a consumer product made overseas. Those Chinese guys seem to get away with murder .. .


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## David Leech (Dec 9, 2008)

Pete, 
To continue your conversation! 
I also get the impression that some people just don't want to be bothered with filling in forms if they have to send something outside their own country. 
Then, if the buyer complains due to a damage or other issue and wants to send it back for a refund, there is a battle as to who pays for what! 
Perhaps keeping in ones own 'country' just makes life simpler. 
All the best, 
David Leech, Delta, Canada


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