# Nuther question about slope



## CliffyJ (Apr 29, 2009)

Hate to bring up the subject of max design slope again, but WTH.

I'm planning a storage yard-shelf under my deck (my better half doesn't know about it yet, but that's a different thread I suppose...







). To get to it, like everywhere else on the layout, I'm sticking with a 2.5% max grade.

For transfers of trains from the yard to the house, I've also roughly planned on a leg that abides by that same "rule." It's not going to be used much, only for occasional swapping of trains, and indoor winter storage. Otherwise, in-use trains will stow on the (covered / lockable) storage yard-shelf, and have a consist of 6 or 8 cars max. At least that's the plan. 

BUT. Now that I'm planing this out more, it would sure be nice to allow myself 3%, 3.5%, or even 4% on that (seldom-used) transfer leg. 

Do I hear an Amen? Or will I be trashing gearboxes, stalling motors, slipping wheels, killing cats, etc.? 

===>Cliff


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## BigRedOne (Dec 13, 2012)

If it were me, I think I'd put the priority into making the often-used parts of the railway better or more conveinant, even at the expense of a seldom-used storage access. 

Perhaps transferring shorter consists or using a helper engine could be a solution? It's certainly prototypical.


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## Paul Burch (Jan 2, 2008)

With those kind of grades your biggest problem probably won't be the grade but the transition in and out of it.


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## Scottychaos (Jan 2, 2008)

I am also considering building a similar "transfer" leg on my garden RR.. 
I have already done the math..5% grade! 
but it also will only be used to move trains and locos from the basement to the railroad, 
it will never be a part of the "operating" railroad.. 
in fact, im planning to have "track on a board", about 10 feet long, that will only be put in place while transfers are going on, 
to reach from the deck to the railroad.. 

To deal with the steep grade, I have a simple plan.. 
Locomotives can run up and down the hill solo, with no train attached, 
and segments of rolling stock will be "powered" up and down the ramp via the "0-5-0 switcher" method..by hand!  
this should work fine for me I think.. 

Scot


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## Totalwrecker (Feb 26, 2009)

No room for a Tehatchapee (well I butchered that one) loop? Or a helix? 

If not I see the 0-5-0 helper doing a lot of pushing. 

John


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## jake3404 (Dec 3, 2010)

Well, my ruling grade is 4.5% on the mainline. The rule of thumb is its too steep, but necessity outweighed rule-of-thumb. I dont have very long trains so it seems just fine. My vote is dont worry about the grade in your storage yard access. Like you said, it is seldom used. 

Plus, it can add an interesting operating scheme to your railroad. If you count that grade as "points beyond" you could have the train split and two halves pulled up to the top of the grade. It was done a lot around my area on the Deadwood Central and Black Hills and Ft Pierre. There were areas on those lines where the train had to pull as much as a 6% grade to access certain mines.


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## Totalwrecker (Feb 26, 2009)

Splitting a train is often called: Doubling the hill. 

Unfortunately the Chinese can't make our toys as strong as we made locos. It's not a question of what the prototype did as much as what can your gears handle? 
Jake I applaud your luck, but I'm not sure I'd suggest others follow suit. 

I tend to err on the side of 'playing it safe' as I never want to hear: 'Hey Dingbat, I followed your advice and now my G $cale loco is a shelf Queen! Whaddya gonna do 'bout it?' 

See ya down the line, 
John


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## CliffyJ (Apr 29, 2009)

0-5-0... shelf queen... still chuckling after 10 minutes. That's a long time for me. 

Thanks Jake, John, and everyone for your comments. Since I didn't hear a clear Amen-concensus, I'll back things off a bit for that transfer leg. But since I don't have much choice, it will still be ~3.5% grade. 

This is under a short head-banger deck, where I need things to be easy maintenance. I don't have the model done yet, but here's the area in question:










The layout roadbed (not shown) comes in from the lower left, and butts up to the lower boxy leg shown here. It slopes up at a 2.3% grade until it reaches the storage yard/shelf (to the right-middle), where it flattens out. The transfer leg is the split-thing curving left-center towards left-top. I hope to bridge to a shelf against the house with a fold-down or drop-in magical something, and procede into the basement to an indoor winter layout that I'm planning for my retirement. While I still have the wits and energy to do so.









At least, that's the plan. My main thing now is to get the storage shelf plans squared away, and at the right elevation. So thanks again for everyone's input. Thanks Paul for your comment about the vertical transition; it concerns me. All I can opine is that a PT plywood -on- PT shelf frame approach should allow for shimming and gradual transitions, as long as the plywood joints are located in consistent-slope areas. 


===>Cliff


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## Totalwrecker (Feb 26, 2009)

Consider a ladder type solution, Ed in Flagstaff has a nice patio type mostly free standing ladder. You coul build it in the open and slide it in for minimum head banging. I see a light weight truss bridge spanning your chasm, if you need occassional passage. 

I demand a good time, you're welcome. 

John


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