# Testing Batteries



## rpc7271 (Jan 2, 2008)

I just got a smokin' deal on 10 used Ryobi 18 volt batteries and some tools. I intend on putting the batteries into battery locos. They all charge. So how do I test or check out these batteries so I can make sure I don't waist time installing a battery that konks out in 3 months.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

To be able to understand how much "life" is left in a battery is a very tricky thing. 

The short answer is charge them fully, and then run a load on the battery and time how long it runs. 

You will cull the weak ones out right away. 

Run a load that draws the same amps as your loco. 

Regards, Greg


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## izzy0855 (Sep 30, 2008)

Actually, the best way to tell how much time or milliamps you have left on each battery is to put an analyzer on it. An analyzer will charge and discharge each battery-pack three times and will measure the amps draw and display that on a digital readout. Your local battery store can test each battery for you for, or you can send it to us and we can do the same. 

Rick Isard 
Cordless Renovations


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

not bad way, but you want a analyzer that does draw the current you want. 

Something that flexible is pretty expensive... 

Regards, Greg


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## izzy0855 (Sep 30, 2008)

Hello Greg, 

Sorry for not getting back toyou sooner...but, yes that is correct...all of our analyzer that we manufacture you can set the voltage and how many amps you would like to draw out of the battery...but to get a true mah reading, usually a 1amp draw is sufficient. 

Rick Isard 
Cordless Renovations


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## Del Tapparo (Jan 4, 2008)

Rick - In looking at your web site, I see no mention of battery analyzers; even did a search. Where might we find info on these? Do you manufacture them in Cedar Rapids?


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Very nice Rick, did not see that the current draw was also settable... could you email me a manual? I'm interested in your charger, I have a Maha, but always looking for something better, yours is a bit more "controllable" it seems. 

Regards, Greg


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## izzy0855 (Sep 30, 2008)

Hello Del, our analyzers are manufactured by Battery-Tech Central...that is the parent of Cordless Renovations (Both companies are in the same family...Father & Son) and you can see our three & six station analyzers @ www.batterytechcentral.com. We are currently rebuilding Cordless Renovations website, so within the next month you will see a revamping of the site with several new categories including chargers & analyzers. It will be easier to navigate around in. 

Hello Greg, not a problem...visit www.batterytechcentral.com to view information and pricing. 

Rick Isard 
Cordless Renovations


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## izzy0855 (Sep 30, 2008)

Guys, I forgot to tell you that each cup on our three and six station analyzers / chargers are interchangeable to alligator clips with wire leads from a rotary dial that you can select how many cells your charging at one time. 

Rick Isard 
Cordless Renovations


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

I went there, nice stuff, but the analyzers are pricey, $650 and $1000. 

Not trying to give you a hard time but your post sort of implied that there was an analyze function in the charger you sell, or I took it to believe in the same price area. 

It would be nice to have a programmable discharge rate for testing, even if dip switches, possibly for a future product. 

Another point, and again, do not take this as combative, but I know a lot about batteries, and have designed custom consumer electronics and been the VP of engineering and similar positions in several companies. 

Your charger texts say (on most products) that they will charge all 3 chemistries (I assume lithium-xx is the 3rd one).... 

You do NOT use negative delta V to determine end of charge on any lithium chemistry, in fact that is why in early times people often damaged them because the voltage does NOT drop at end of charge like Nicad... in fact that negative delta v (this means slight drop in voltage) is not best for nickel metal hydrides either... normally they are end of charge when the voltage "flat lines"... 

So, I'm guessing since you have a successful company running, you test for end of charge in lithium rechargeables correctly. 

As an engineer, I would never buy a lithium charger based on the description you have there... I would update it to say something like "properly senses for the unique end of charge conditions for each chemistry" or somesuch. 

Again, just a suggestion, but I am way too familiar with all these chemistries... I have been using rechargeables including liithium since about 1975, and actually had some of the original Molicell lithium rechargables.... the first commercially available AA sized ones... the ones that go off like a roman candle if overcharged... and I've done it! 

We will keep tuned for more from your company, and please continue to share your products, as we need more alternatives and choices, competition is good. 

Regards, Greg


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## izzy0855 (Sep 30, 2008)

Hello Greg, yes our three and six station chargers are competitively priced compaired to Motorola and I-Tech. You can get it in a single station charger, but again it's in the $349.00 range, and if we convirted the CR-1 or CR-2 into a analyzer / charger with a digital read out, the price would be in the $179 - $229 range. I did not want our chargers to out price themselves...but we are coming out with an inline battery gas gauge / voltage & mah indicator. It's about the size of a business card and we're testing it as we chat...but I would like to see that it can indicate the voltage of your battery during a charging / discharging cycle while reading the mah's during a discharge. Check back with me in a month. In our CR-1 manual I did not want to get to technical with what voltage range a lithium-ion or polymer battery discharges at, and how much voltage does it take to wake up a sleepy cell. My main goal here was to manufacture a product that is easy to use, charges multiple chemistries from one unit, and helps the novice train enthusiasts get started...and I think I've done just that. But one thing I forgot to add to the functions of the CR-1 is that it can also charge Lithium-Polymer batteries in addition to Lithium-Ion. Our new manuals will have an updated version when our new website is online within the next month. Greg, you can always suggest, criticize, or give us an idea to upgrade our products...I will never take offense to it, but I encourage it! They only way we're going to make great products, is from great suggestions from our customers and train enthusiasts like yourself. Oh! and I appologize if I came across that the CR-1 is an analyzer/charger, it is not...it is only a charger that has a battery gas gauge that indicates your batteries charging & discharging cycle during operation, and can charge NiCd/Nimh Lithium-Ion/Polymer batteries from 7.2V - 18.5V . . . we are coming out with an extended voltage model that will charge NiCd/Nimh batteries from 14.4V - 24V & Lithium-Ion/Polymer batteries from 14.8V - 25.9V. 

I hope I've answered your questions? 
Rick Isard 
Cordless Renovations


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## Del Tapparo (Jan 4, 2008)

Posted By Greg Elmassian on 24 Aug 2009 07:41 PM 
... 

It would be nice to have a programmable discharge rate for testing, even if dip switches, possibly for a future product. ...




My $100 E-Flite Pinnachle NiMH charger does that.


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## Del Tapparo (Jan 4, 2008)

Just to clarify, I don't sell the E-Flite charger, just a user.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Sorry Del! (I called him up to buy one!) 

Well, ya can't blame a guy for trying! 

Greg


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