# Problem with my LGB Stainz 2020



## Sedda (Oct 19, 2009)

Hi everyone. 

I'm having trouble with my LGB Stainz 2020 locomotive.

I bought it second hand about 3 years ago. I'm not sure how old it actually is but it is pre-sound and pre-smoke.

Anyway, the problem I'm having with it is that it is very sluggish (when it's actually working). You have to push it to get it going but then it only goes about half pace. If you stop and reverse it, it just sits there until you push it again and the same thing happens. Up until now the only problem I've had with it is the traction tire which I replaced about 1 year ago.

I know the track works fine as, since the loco has gone, well, loco, I have been running my trolley car and the track and controls work fine.

I've tried to clean up the wheels and have replaced the spring pick up shoes (which were pretty worn anyway) but it's still very sluggish and doesn't even go half pace unless you push it. It also doesn't respond straight away if you are to shut the power off suddenly (which I noticed when trying to test it). 

From that rather primitive description, would anyone know what may be the matter with it?


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## kormsen (Oct 27, 2009)

i'm afraid, that there might be a problem with the gears. 

i would buy just another one. on german ebay used ones are between 50 to 120 US$ at the moment. or you could buy a replacement brick.


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## mbendebba (Jan 22, 2011)

Hello Sedda: Flip the loco upside down, grap the two rear wheels firmly and try to turm both of them a the same time in one direction and then in the opposite direction. If the wheels turn freely in both directions, the problem could be the motor, if the wheels do not turn freely, or you hear a clicking noise as you turn them, the problem could be the gear box. A new motor usually cost around 55 to 60 dollars, the gear axles are about 10 dollars per axle. The 2020 has screw-on wheels, make sure that the screws are firmly tight (no play in the wheels).

Mohammed BenDebba
*http://www.allaboutlgb.com*
*http://www.massothusa.com*


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## Sedda (Oct 19, 2009)

@import url(http://www.mylargescale.com/Provide...ad.ashx?type=style&file=SyntaxHighlighter.css);@import url(/providers/htmleditorproviders/cehtmleditorprovider/dnngeneral.css); Posted By mbendebba on 16 Oct 2011 09:57 AM 
Hello Sedda: Flip the loco upside down, grap the two rear wheels firmly and try to turm both of them a the same time in one direction and then in the opposite direction. If the wheels turn freely in both directions, the problem could be the motor, if the wheels do not turn freely, or you hear a clicking noise as you turn them, the problem could be the gear box. A new motor usually cost around 55 to 60 dollars, the gear axles are about 10 dollars per axle. The 2020 has screw-on wheels, make sure that the screws are firmly tight (no play in the wheels).

Mohammed BenDebba
*http://www.allaboutlgb.com*
*http://www.massothusa.com*

I tried to turn the back wheels and I think they are the same as normal. They weren't hard to turn and they weren't easy to turn. They seemed normal. Although I suppose, if I had to guess, they moved more freely than being hard to turn.


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## Dan Pierce (Jan 2, 2008)

I would test this engine using a current meter. With no load, it should never go over 1/2 amp. If over 1 amp, then the motor is bad. 

I do assume that the engine is properly quartered, that is the side rod is aligned meaning the wheels both have the side rod screws in the smae position. I check this by making sure that both wheels have the drive rod screw at the 6 o'clock position by turning the wheels slowly or manually. Side rod binding can cause the motor to work harder.


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## mbendebba (Jan 22, 2011)

Sedda:

That would indicate that the motor is the most likely source of the problem.

Mohammed BenDebba
*http://www.allaboutlgb.com/*
*http://www.massothusa.com/*


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## Spule 4 (Jan 2, 2008)

How are the brushes behind the wheels? I had one that ran just like this that the brushes had deteriorated. The only pick up was the skates and it would jerk around the track. 

Otherwise, it may be time to clean/replace the motor as others have posted. Most common on the old ones is brush failure, but unfortunately, unlike others like Lonel and Marklin, LGB do not sell just the brushes. The newer motors are sealed and one cannot get to the brushes.


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## Sedda (Oct 19, 2009)

I don't suppose it could be the brushes (or whatever they are called) behind the wheels?

By the way - why does the following come up every time I post (I have to edit the post and even then it doesn't disappear). 
@import url(http://www.mylargescale.com/Provide...ad.ashx?type=style&file=SyntaxHighlighter.css);@import url(/providers/htmleditorproviders/cehtmleditorprovider/dnngeneral.css);


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## mbendebba (Jan 22, 2011)

Posted By Sedda on 18 Oct 2011 01:47 AM 
I don't suppose it could be the brushes (or whatever they are called) behind the wheels?

By the way - why does the following come up every time I post (I have to edit the post and even then it doesn't disappear). 
@import url(http://www.mylargescale.com/Provide...ad.ashx?type=style&file=SyntaxHighlighter.css);@import url(/providers/htmleditorproviders/cehtmleditorprovider/dnngeneral.css); 

Sedda: have you ever repalced the brushes? If you have not, you should do it regardless of what other problems you may have, you are going to end up doing any way.


Mohammed Bendebba
*http://www.allaboutlgb.com*
*http://www.massothusa.com*


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## stevedenver (Jan 6, 2008)

having recently dealt with similar problems in an older stainz type -NOS and unrun-but water damaged adn which had corroded motors (2017 type) 

the first thing i do and agree with the above-is to clean everything-the wheel backs, the gears, the metal cylinder holding the brushes- 
things get dirty and this really can affect running-lightly lube the gears with lgb or good teflon hobby grease-and a drop of oil where the axels meet the chassis 

gears do wear out-especially when pulling hard -if this is the case-id strongly suggest buying an entire new motor block-the reason is that older gears and wheels arent always compatible with newer-i know this first hand 

if the gears are OK-look for basically a groove in the center-where the worm will actually wear down the white nylon teeth 


i presume yours is a clamshell-open these over a clean towel-and be mindful of the following 
there are tiny ball bearings seated in the block at the end of the motor shafts-dont lose them-clean them ( and possibly the shell interior too) and re-glue in place with clean grease 
next-lgb stuff fits with ease-never force anything-sometimes the motors little copper tabs will not be properly alinged with the slots and closing the clam will have resistance-correct the alingment and you ll have no problems (the motor also has an pin that fits into the shell to help-find it ) 

and of course get the thing quartered properly- 
and then test the block before you reassemble the vavle works and engine -to avoid a complete do -over 

then 

i willing to bet 


its the motor 
the simple solution is to buy another 

if however the engine has relatively little running (i dont know) 

and if it is and-im guessing its the older buehler type with the red and black plastic brush holders-im willing to bet that the commutator (copper ring on the shaft under the brushes is filthy-or 
the brushes have worn out -or that the springs which gently push to brushes against teh commutator ring may be stuck or broken 

i have sucessfully repaired these-and its not difficult- 
there is a black plastic ring over the end-which prys off-then the plastic portions can be pried out-look for the guide grooves to determine this- 
then a loop , some cleaning agent, and patience can free up a lot of stuff-i clean the brushes and riing with pipe cleaners, fine metal polish or an ink eraser/track cleaning block 

if the spring have failed and there is plenty of brush left-then tiny spring can be inserted from teh top and a small piece of stiff cardboard used to hold them in place-if you need more info let me knwo and ill run you through this brain damage-the motors get dirty but have an incredibly long life-the key is to really clean them and leave no residue to later build up again-i have used both napth and denatured alcohol with sucess-if you use an electrical lube-clean it off as it will help but then it will create gunk 

if there is rust-penetrating oil -liquid wrench-will help break this up on the delicate parts and it too must be thoroughly rinsed-ie lighter fluid-and then dried


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## Sedda (Oct 19, 2009)

@import url(http://www.mylargescale.com/Provide...ad.ashx?type=style&file=SyntaxHighlighter.css);@import url(/providers/htmleditorproviders/cehtmleditorprovider/dnngeneral.css); Posted By stevedenver on 18 Oct 2011 10:12 AM 

then 

i willing to bet 


its the motor 
the simple solution is to buy another 

if however the engine has relatively little running (i dont know) 

and if it is and-im guessing its the older buehler type with the red and black plastic brush holders-im willing to bet that the commutator (copper ring on the shaft under the brushes is filthy-or 
the brushes have worn out -or that the springs which gently push to brushes against teh commutator ring may be stuck or broken 

i have sucessfully repaired these-and its not difficult- 
there is a black plastic ring over the end-which prys off-then the plastic portions can be pried out-look for the guide grooves to determine this- 
then a loop , some cleaning agent, and patience can free up a lot of stuff-i clean the brushes and riing with pipe cleaners, fine metal polish or an ink eraser/track cleaning block 

if the spring have failed and there is plenty of brush left-then tiny spring can be inserted from teh top and a small piece of stiff cardboard used to hold them in place-if you need more info let me knwo and ill run you through this brain damage-the motors get dirty but have an incredibly long life-the key is to really clean them and leave no residue to later build up again-i have used both napth and denatured alcohol with sucess-if you use an electrical lube-clean it off as it will help but then it will create gunk 

if there is rust-penetrating oil -liquid wrench-will help break this up on the delicate parts and it too must be thoroughly rinsed-ie lighter fluid-and then dried 

Hi Steve, I stripped it all out and tested the Buhler motor. It only works intermittently. Most times I have to push the worm thing and then it starts up. I'm not sure how to access the insides and if anything will break or unwind if I open it up. 


Looking on the net it appears the motors cost a fair bit and, as the engine is quite old, and I'm not collecting them - I only want a loco that looks like a steam type of train but is strong and supposedly bullet proof, I may just look at getting another second hand LGB loco.

The other thing that worries me is that I did put the motor block back together (with the wheels properly quartered) but the wheels were then very hard to turn when they got to a certain position. If I install a new motor it may be for nothing if I've stuffed something up somewhere else.


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## Spule 4 (Jan 2, 2008)

Unfortunately these days, the motors are cheaper than another used loco. IMO, I would get a motor and be happy. The quartering can take work and the advantage of a new-NEW motor is no ball bearings.


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## Sedda (Oct 19, 2009)

Hey guys. Thanks for all the help. I finally stripped the loco down and then found a web site where it explains how to clean the motor. I will list the web site below (if that's allowed).

Anyway, I cleaned it up best I could several times but it was still only working intermittently. I took the motor out to try again and then accidentally dropped the motor.







Luckily it didn't land on one of the ends. I tried it again and, HEY PRESTO, the motor is working now every time power is applied and not intermittently.









I then put it all back together again continually testing it until it was all back in one piece. 

I'm crossing my fingers that it will continue to work but, at least, it's working for now.









The funny thing is I actually bid on two locos on ebay but didn't win either. 

The site I found about pulling the motor apart and cleaning it is: http://www.gscalecentral.co.uk/f/m163076.aspx


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## smcgill (Jan 2, 2008)

Now you know why some mechanics have all those hammers! 
Lucky you. 
Sean


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