# Acrylic Paints



## chrisb (Jan 3, 2008)

What is the difference between craft acrylic paints and model acrylic paints? The model paints are around $4 and the craft around $1. I would guess that durablity
and water resistance are the reason for the price difference. I realize that for the price of brushes there is ne sense in trying to save on the paint. Any comments?


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## Mik (Jan 2, 2008)

Craft paints are thicker (almost creamy?) Model paints usually cover in one coat better- especially the whites, yellows and metallics. While there are zillions of craft colors, few are an exact match for railroad colors. Craft paints tend to be either really flat or high gloss. Satin doesn't seem to be in their vocabulary on many colors. Lastly craft paints seem to chip and scratch easier. 

I use both. Craft paint for boiler jackets (usually a 'hunt club' type green), valve handles (cadmium), roofs ('barn red' of all things) and I managed to find a decent gold for brass. But for most blacks, flat aluminum and gunmetal, etc. I use good old Polly S or Tamiya. 

For figures I use craft paints except for flesh because the thicker craft paint hides too many tiny details. 

YMMV (your mileage may vary)


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## joe rusz (Jan 3, 2008)

Good advice, Mik. I'll add it to my file of useful stuff.


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## Mik (Jan 2, 2008)

I was asked backchannel about my acceptable looking gold that I found for painting brass stuff. It is Delta Ceramicoat Gleams brand gold with a tiny bit of barn red stirred in (into the whole bottle, color matching in small batches is an exercise in futility for me) to look more like the red brass you see on valve bodies.


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## Paul Burch (Jan 2, 2008)

I believe that in the model paints the pigments are ground much finer for better coverage with a thinner coat. Higher manufacturing costs. You kind of get what you pay for.


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## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

Probably 90% of my painting and weathering is done with the cheap acrylic paints. I've never had any durability or fading issues with them compared to the more expensive paints. I almost always thin the paints with a bit of water when using them, so I don't worry about covering up details. I don't know if one is any more UV stable than the other. Floquil is notoriously _not_ UV stable, and I'm not sure if that translates to their water-based lines. The craft paints I've used on buildings seem to hold up well enough outside in the sun--certainly better than the Floquil I used to use--but I've never seen a scientific experiment done like I saw with Floquil. My rolling stock is seldom outside long enough for exposure to become a problem. I have left a few cars out for a week or two as an experiment, and have not noticed any troubles. 

The pigments in the model paints are definitely finer, and much easier to run through the airbrush. I've pushed craft paints through the airbrush, but it tends to clog more frequently. If I'm not using the craft paints, I'll use Badger's "Accuflex" line of model paints. It's airbrush ready straight out of the jar, so there's no need to thin it. It's also water based, making clean-up a breeze. It also brushes surprisingly well for such a thin paint. Some colors may require an extra coat for a good finish as opposed to using the craft paints, but if you're painting a model where you're airbrushing some parts and have to brush paint others, this is top-drawer stuff to use. The only downside--any correlation between the color chips on the store display and what's in the bottle is purely coincidental. If you're looking for an exact shade, buy a few bottles and hope one comes close. 

The one thing I really like about the craft paints is that when I'm weathering or painting figures, mixing the paints to get subtle variations in color (lighter, darker, browner, etc.) is very easy to do. I have a small plastic palate onto which I place a small dollop of the various colors I'm working with, then grab paint from each dollop as needed to mix in the middle of the palate to get the shade I want. You can't do that with the thinner model paints, at least not without having a small cup for each color, then mixing it in another cup. 

Later, 

K


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## Stan Cedarleaf (Jan 2, 2008)

Chris... This may be a different twist to your question... but here goes...

I do most of my painting with the standard colors in the regular Krylon Acrylic rattle cans. However, I needed a match to Milwaukee Road Orange so I took my Doodlebug to the paint department at ACE Hardware where they scanned the car and mixed a quart of interior Latex Acrylic trim paint to an almost exact match. I painted 2 boxcars and a reefer with a soft trim brush. The cars are wood grained and the paint worked very well. After the decals and other trim went on, you have to get real, real close to see the it's not sprayed and the results are most acceptable.











Just last week, a friend wanted a battery car done for his Rio Grande SD70.... 










This time I took the locomotive to the local Sherman Williams store where they scanned the locomotive and mixed a quart of exterior Latex Acrylic Satin Trim paint. I poured a glob of it in my airbrush bottle, added some water, shook it up real good, tested the consistency for good spraying and after 3 applications over a white undercoat, the color matched very, very close. The mountains were added with Krylon Rattle Can black and the decals applied. He was very pleased with the results...


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## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

Archbars and a wood frame behind an SD-70? The FRA's not going to like that!  

What's the smallest container you can get from ACE or wherever? Can you get small half-pint cans for a reasonable cost? I use outdoor latex paint on most of my buildings with good results, but the gallon (leftover from painting my front door!) has done 5 structures for the railroad and has shown no sign of being depleted. I can't imagine how long it would take to go through a quart of Milwaukee Road orange... 

Later, 

K


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## Stan Cedarleaf (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By East Broad Top on 04/22/2009 10:57 AM
Archbars and a wood frame behind an SD-70? The FRA's not going to like that! 

Yeah, I know, K.... That's what he brought me.... 

What's the smallest container you can get from ACE or wherever? Can you get small half-pint cans for a reasonable cost? I use outdoor latex paint on most of my buildings with good results, but the gallon (leftover from painting my front door!) has done 5 structures for the railroad and has shown no sign of being depleted. I can't imagine how long it would take to go through a quart of Milwaukee Road orange... 

From what they told me, the quart size is the smallest they will custom mix. Now, that's at the store closest to me. You might see what another store would do. Yes, the quart of MKE orange should last for a couple of hundred years or so.... Quart cost is $12-14 depending on the store.    

Sherman Williams has a high gloss in that same paint. It dries rock hard and very shiny. There are standard colors in the gloss finish as well as the satin. I was quite please with the way it handled with the airbrush. I had to increase the air pressure to make it work though.


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## RimfireJim (Mar 25, 2009)

Stan,

That's really interesting that you got such good results with "house" paint. I would have guessed that it would be way to thick and obscure the details, but it sounds like that when you thinned it a little, it was very usable for the scale we work in.

The nice thing about this approach is that the paint stores don't charge anything extra for the color matching, and can get dang close to what you want, though there is still some skill involved by the person doing the match. I was trying to get just a certain shade of yellow for my dining room, and (believe it or not) none of the production colors of four or five paint brands were what I wanted. I wound up using one of them as a starting point, then added artist's acrylic colors to get what I wanted, tested by painting it out on an index card and holding it up on the wall under various light. Then I took the card in to The Home Depot and asked them to match it. The first person that tried it wasn't successful. Then a more experienced person took over, and I also told her what colors I had added to the original, and she saw right away why that worked.


Which reminds me about another acrylic paint option: the Liquitex Basics artist's acrylics. They come in big tubes and fewer colors compared to other artist's paints, but cost a lot less per ounce. The line includes burnt and raw sienna, burnt and raw umber, ochre, black, white plus bright colors like reds, blues and greens. I've used them to mix up custom colors for Christmas decorations, I don't see why they wouldn't work for large scale trains stuff. I don't know anything about their weather and UV resistance other than that the orange "carrot" nose on my plywood snowman has survived numerous mild southern California winters.

Jim McKim


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## Stan Cedarleaf (Jan 2, 2008)

Yes, Jim... there's just all kinds of ways to make our hobby work.....   

The latex WAS very thick and I was wondering if it would thin enough to use in the airbrush yet opaque enough to cover. 

It worked....


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## Lawrence Wallace (Jan 2, 2008)

Have you tried windshield washer fluid to thin the water base paints. 
I find that using it to thin paint for my air brush helps keep the tip from clogging so fast. 
I think it's the alcohol in the fluid that makes it better to use then water for thinning paints.


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## Stan Cedarleaf (Jan 2, 2008)

Yogi.... That sounds like a great idea. I'll pick some up and try it next time I use the heavy acrylics...

Thanks for the tip...


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## Torby (Jan 2, 2008)

I won't think of it next time


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## Dr G (Jan 16, 2008)

Stan, 

I agree on the windshield washer fluid idea--I know it works well with Poly Scale acrylics--I also use it to clean the airbrush between colors. With respect to the alcohol--Cody from the Model Railroader staff used 70% isopropyl alcohol to thin the Poly Scale in an online video on airbrushing. Have not tried it, but I will with my next project. I am also going to try the latex house paint idea--I really like the cost and the custom matching possibilities. 

This forum is always full of great ideas. 

Regards, 

Matt


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## Stan Cedarleaf (Jan 2, 2008)

I use Isopropyl alcohol to clean the air brush at the end of a job. Might try to thin the latex paint with it as well. 

Yes, many great ideas and techniques are shared here. 'Tis a great site.


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## pinewoods (Jan 20, 2009)

I have used isopropyl alcohol with many of the craft paints in an airbrush with good results. I usually put down a coat of white, gray or red primer from a spray can down and put the craft paint over that. I never gave consideration to using house paint before, sounds like a good idea if you need to closely match an existing color or paint several matching cars.


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## joe rusz (Jan 3, 2008)

Interesting ideas from all. I'm a windshiled washer fluid guy too. 

Stan, the way to get thick paint to flow is to turn up the air pressure to about 100 lb.  

Also, Stan, it was nice of you to compliment the MR guys. I have spoken to Cody on the phone--about painting--and he is super nice. And contrary to the naysayers, I love my train magazines and get enormous pleasure from reading (and rereading) them.


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## Stan Cedarleaf (Jan 2, 2008)

Joe.... Yerrite..... I was pushin' 100 lbs through the brush. Had a nice pattern and a goodly amount of paint in the pattern...


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## Lawrence Wallace (Jan 2, 2008)

When using alcohol in an airbrush remember your mixing air with it and that can be very combustible and precautions should be taken to remove the mixture. 

A paint booth vented outside is one way of caring the fumes away. 

Here is a easy booth to make and will do the job. 










http://home.interlog.com/~ask/scale/tips/booth.htm


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## Stan Cedarleaf (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Lawrence Wallace on 04/23/2009 10:01 PM

A paint booth vented outside is one way of caring the fumes away. 







Yer absolutely right, Yogi.... Here's the well ventilated spray booth I've constructed for use out here in the Arizona High Desert..


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## Dr G (Jan 16, 2008)

Stan, 

I got one much like that. I took an old computer printer stand and added a lazy susan top of plywood and added an air regulator to the side. Just wheel it out on the dirveway and plug in the air line. My wife would kill me if I built a spray booth in the house. Does make it difficult to paint in the summer in Fl--way too much humidity (and too hot to be outside anyway). Not much of a problem in AZ I expect. 


Matt


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## joe rusz (Jan 3, 2008)

Hey Stan, Ya stole my garbage can! I wasn't through usin' it! 

Yogi, them's real fine plans. Maybe, someday, after the alcohol mist settles, I will build one. Frankly, whash shtuh prolbums wisht falcofume halls? (Hick!) 

Actually, I once paid a visit to a very well known large scale railroader and airbrush expert who does clinics at all the shows and is on retainer with a large airbrush and paint manufacturer and he says he jes paints all his stuff in the garage. With the door open, I assume, but I wasn't there to watch him actually paint anything so I can't say. Didn't strike me as on OSHA kinda guy, though. 

I'm just sayin' so no "Tsk, tsk, you should know better" posts. 

Peace out


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## Ray Dunakin (Jan 6, 2008)

Currently I use exterior latex house paint for some things, mostly stuff like painting trestles or wooden ore bins. I also used it to weather the rails and ties on my track. 

For other things, I use Apple Barrel craft acrylics. I especially like their flat finish. So far they seem to hold up outdoors pretty well. 

I had previously tried Ceramcoat craft acyrlics and had really bad results -- the colors faded and shifted badly after just a few weeks in the sun. 

For painting the skin tones on my figures, I use Tamiya "flesh" acrylic. Goes on much thinner, without filling in fine details.


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## chrisb (Jan 3, 2008)

How about artists acrylic paints in a tube? I asking mainly in regards to painting figures. I tried some by adding water to it. Does anyone use atists paints?


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## Torby (Jan 2, 2008)

I tried "moving up" to thicker acrylics in tubes. I can see why artists like them for canvas, but I went back to the thinner bottle paints for figures.


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## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

BTW, I saw on a commercial last night that Lowe's will mix up an 8oz "sample" can of whatever colors you'd like. I don't know what/if they charge for that, but the can would take up less space, and probably still last you a good while. 

Later, 

K


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## Ray Dunakin (Jan 6, 2008)

I tried artist's acrylic paints on my figures, and it didn't work very well. You have to thin it a lot with water, but worst of all, it's very shiny. Now I use the flat finish craft acrylics, either Apple Barrel brand or "Craft Smart" which is Michael's "house" brand.


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