# STEAM OIL



## F7 (Jan 29, 2008)

What do you think is the best oil to use in your live steam locomotive?

1. *STEAM OIL* which is manufactured from mineral crude oil.

2 *CASTROL M* which I understand is maufactured from the firsts cold pressings from the castor oil plant.

3. *CASTOR OIL* which is the ordinary oil that we can buy almost anywhere.

4. *TALLOW* which was used before mineral steam oil was invented.

I ask as one day mineral crude oil will be so expensive that it will be used as an ornament and we will have to return to what was used before steam oil was invented towards the end of the the 19th century.


----------



## JEFF RUNGE (Jan 2, 2008)

*STEAM OIL*


----------



## Alan Wright (Jan 9, 2008)

Steam oil is by far the best for many reasons. Some say it is too viscous but we all use it here in Canada all year round (almost). Some cut it by up to 25% with 30w oil but you need to experiment with that.


----------



## JoelB (Jan 3, 2008)

Steam Oil, no question. Anything else will get scoured off working surfaces (i.e. valves and cylinders) by steam.


----------



## Dave -- Use Coal (Feb 19, 2008)

No question about it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Use Steam Oil!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The Steam Oil to use is the type sold by Roundhouse Engineering http://www.roundhouse-eng.com/ or the type sold by several US Dealers. Try http://www.svrronline.com/ , http://www.southernsteamtrains.com/index.htm , http://www.quisenberrystation.com/

I suggest you take a look at "Steam Oil" on the Technical page of the Roundhouse site. The point being made is to use steam oil suitable for small scale live steam.

This is a topic that comes up every once in a while on MLS. You may want to look at some of the past threads on this subject.


----------



## F7 (Jan 29, 2008)

So it is *Steam oil *for now, but what are we going to use when steam oil is no longer available.

*Steam oil* was invented in about 1880 and is made from crude mineral oil and this will run-out or become too expensive to be manufactured.

Before 1880 *Tallow* was the stuff that was used, but as it a solid unless kept warm we need to consider what is going to replace *steam oil* in the not too distant future.

We need a sustainable product that may be grown, which is why I mentioned the other products.


----------



## JEFF RUNGE (Jan 2, 2008)

Steam oil will be around longer then I will, so I'm not too worried about what will be used 30 or 40 years from now.


----------



## tony23 (Jan 2, 2008)

I notice nobody has mentioned which grade steam oil should be used or are you guys using any old steam oil, for the big stuff 5" and 71/4" SAE1000 should be used for your Gauge 1 SAE 460 this is slightly thinner and best for the smaller steam pipes.


----------



## Charles (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By F7 on 01/30/2009 12:24 PM
So it is *Steam oil *for now, but what are we going to use when steam oil is no longer available.

*Steam oil* was invented in about 1880 and is made from crude mineral oil and this will run-out or become too expensive to be manufactured.

Before 1880 *Tallow* was the stuff that was used, but as it a solid unless kept warm we need to consider what is going to replace *steam oil* in the not too distant future.

We need a sustainable product that may be grown, which is why I mentioned the other products.



I doubt we will see that in our life time given the suppliers like Roundhouse, Quisenberry Station, Green Velvet, etc have invested in keeping the hobby going. Keep in mind that we need only a very small amount to make the wheels go around. Just in case keep us up to date on your efforts to bring about the alternative supply that will be cheaper given our very, very small market.


----------



## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

I use the SAE 460. Got it from Sulphur Springs. A one quart can will last a very long time. I think 460 is used in industry as a heavier gear oil.

Some folks use an oil conditioner product from Lucas. It's available at any auto parts store.


----------



## JEFF RUNGE (Jan 2, 2008)

Can label: STEAM OIL 
ISO VG 320/460 2000 SUS @ 100 

This was a product I got from Sulphur Springs Steam Models Ltd. I am sure it was repackaged from a bulk container. I also have some from our Sponsor: Quisenberry Station that appears to be a bit lighter viscosity I use it in cold weather.


----------



## Dave Sykes (Jan 3, 2008)

Here we go again. 
My son and I have been using Lucas oil for about (5) years in 
rubys to K27s. in temps from 20to 106 degrees.no failuresof 
any kind. Learned this from none other than the king of steam 
DAVE HOTTMAN !!!!!! 
So I will sit back and listen to all the Naysayers.


----------



## JEFF RUNGE (Jan 2, 2008)

Well Dave S. I have two thoughts on that 
1) Their your engines do what ever you want.... but; 
2) Dave H. has the machines and knowledge to rebuild his cylinders and valves, make new over sized pistons etc., so I doubt he has done any long term testing. Why would he waste his time. 
I have emailed LUCAS their response " No steam compatible products" but again Its your engine.... 
You may want to open the steam chest up and have a look before you say " no failures "


----------



## Charles (Jan 2, 2008)

From the notes of other "steam master" Kevin O'Connor:
Steam oil 



No nay sayer....just a proven way...


As Jeff as indicated there is a lot of stress due to the pressure relative to the scale size of our parts:
"The result will be metal-to-metal contact between the internal parts of the steam engine assembly, which will result in the scoring and galling of mating wear surfaces,: relative to using any other oils than "steam oil." Bottom line is that cost steam oil is not prohibited in comparison to any suggested alternative oil, so why not utilize what is specifically designed for steam engines....unless one wants to experiment with a quite expensive piece of lab equipment.


----------



## Dave -- Use Coal (Feb 19, 2008)

If you buy a gallon from Roundhouse or one of the US suppliers you will have enough steam oil to last your lifetime and your children will have some to use after you and I are long gone. If you do so you will have the "right" steam oil. Actually, I bought two liters from Rounghouse about five years ago and have used less than one quarter of one of the bottles. My engines are certainly run at least an average amount of time.

Given the articles about steam line blockage, I threw away a quart I had purchased from Sulfur Springs and gave away a five gallon pail of a similiar type to the guys running on seven and one half gauge track.


----------



## AsterUK (Jan 2, 2008)

Most of the Steam Oil sold in the UK is Shell Valvata 460. I suspect that the Roundhouse oil is this brand but I don't know that as a certainty.

Shell Valvata can be purchased quite cheaply in 20 litre drums. I'm surprised that groups of live steamers don't co-operate and buy a drum and share it out.


----------



## Dan Pantages (Jan 2, 2008)

Here we go again as Dave says. This topic comes up every few months and it’s the same old thing. If you look at it, the real question is what’s the cheapest. It’s disguised as “what should I use or what do you use” but it always comes down to what’s the cheapest. Why would a person not use steam oil, you can buy it labeled “Steam Oil” so there is no mistake, instead of wasting time trying to save money. In Canada it is $50 for 20 liters, that’s about $7 US a US gallon. Why would you take a chance on a $5,000, $8,000 or $10,000 or for that matter even a $1,000 engine to save what, $3 a year at the most? I have used SAE 460 Steam oil down to -20C outside air temperature up to 45C or maybe higher or lower but I’m not going to stand around in those temperatures so why always the question. It’s the oil to use in engines from “O” gauge to 7 ½” If you need a heavier oil to seal the piston rings then it’s like putting sawdust into a car transmission so you can sell it. The proper thing to do is fix it, not cover it up. But you do what you want. 

Don't give them any hints Andrew, I sell it for $5 per 8oz or $412 per 20 liters.


----------



## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

People ask because it is not readily available at the local grocery store or on the shelf at the hardware. It is not so much as wanting cheapest but easiest to obtain. Sure, it can be mailordered... just like the locomotive was, but it is another "order" to place for an unknown product from an unknown vendor. I think it is that bunch of unknowns that get folk to ask about it.


----------



## Jerry Barnes (Jan 2, 2008)

Anyone hear if anybody bought Sulphur Springs?


----------



## rkapuaala (Jan 3, 2008)

I think someone on this list told me mobile 600 was what steam oil is.... is that right? I bought mine from accucrafts online store, so I don't know for sure.


----------



## Joel779 (Jan 2, 2008)

Whenever I run low on steam oil, I just purchase another locomotive. All my vendors I deal with, including my local hobby shop, will throw in a free bottle of steam oil with my purchase. Or is it that I pay $2000.00 for an 8 oz bottle of steam oil and they throw in a free steam engine. Never could determin the economics there.


----------



## tacfoley (Jan 3, 2008)

Posted By F7 on 01/30/2009 12:24 PM
So it is *Steam oil *for now, but what are we going to use when steam oil is no longer available.

*Steam oil* was invented in about 1880 and is made from crude mineral oil and this will run-out or become too expensive to be manufactured.

Before 1880 *Tallow* was the stuff that was used, but as it a solid unless kept warm we need to consider what is going to replace *steam oil* in the not too distant future.

We need a sustainable product that may be grown, which is why I mentioned the other products.



Well, Sir, I have eight five gallon cans of the stuff, so I'm not too worried about running out. I use it on our 1/3rd scale steamer as well as on my little ones, and so far, in almost eighteen years, I've hardly made a dent on the stuff. As I live in heartland of live-steam road locomotive/agricultural tractor country, with over at the very least four hundred of them knocking in our county alone - all using steam oil - lack of steam oil is not something that I lie awake wurriting over. If I DO run short, my pal Dally Coulson has about three or four hundred gallons knocking around to beg from - he builds 1/2 scale and full-size steam road locomotives based on his grandfather's patent design. He'll do one for you if you have a spare $1/4M....

I'm sure somebody down the line will come up with a substitute eventually, but by then I'll be a swirl of ashes on Cannon Beach.

tac
www.ovgrs.org


----------



## tacfoley (Jan 3, 2008)

Posted By Joel779 on 01/30/2009 11:00 PM Whenever I run low on steam oil, I just purchase another locomotive. All my vendors I deal with, including my local hobby shop, will throw in a free bottle of steam oil with my purchase. Or is it that I pay $2000.00 for an 8 oz bottle of steam oil and they throw in a free steam engine. Never could determin the economics there. 


Sounds reasonable to me.

Cheap way of getting a new loco, to my way of thinking.

tac
www.ovgrs.org


----------



## Dave -- Use Coal (Feb 19, 2008)

Posted By rkapuaala on 01/30/2009 9:58 PM
I think someone on this list told me mobile 600 was what steam oil is.... is that right? I bought mine from accucrafts online store, so I don't know for sure.

Steam Oil comes in different viscosity just like motor oil. The (originonal) container will not only statethe viscosity but will also state that it is steam oil.

The statement that oil is mobile 600 does not provide all the information required to determine the intended use of the product.

I repeat myself here *Roundhouse and Green Velvet is steam oil intended for use in small scale live steam engines. *I have no knowledge reguarding the Accrucraft online store or what Accrucraft recommends for steam oil in their engines. 

By the way, I believe Green Velvet makes more than one formula of steam oil and that their formula 3 is for small scale live steam.


----------



## gwscheil (Aug 6, 2008)

The reference to Mobile 600 is almost certainly Mobil 600W steam cylinder oil, ISO 375, mentioned by Wade on the Southern Steam Trains article. Designed for low pressure steam use (up to 120 psig). The direct descendant of the Gargoyle 600 oil patented by the Vacuum Oil Company in 1869. Apparently the first compounded steam oil. Since Mobil Oil is still proud enough of it to give a detailed history on their website, I bought a 5 gallon pail last summer. Two ounces used, a couple of sample bottles given away. 4.9 gallons left. Miss Ida loves it. Just thin enough to be able to get it in & out of a syringe and decent water separation time.


----------



## John R (May 17, 2008)

*Semper, you are dead right, I cannot buy the damn stuff in Perth Western Australia,*


*When I tried to order some from Roundhouse the Chap there advised me it*


*would cost a "Kings Ransom" in air frieght if they would except it as Airfrieght.*


*My nearest shop that sells the stuff is just down the road, "Melbourne" 3000 miles*


*away!.*


*And with my luck, Australia post would probably call me a Terroeist and have me*


*locked up!. Then again, S.W.M.B.O. would probably reckon that would be a chuckle!.*













*Regards,*


*John.*


----------



## Taperpin (Jan 6, 2008)

John, 
Try contacting AMRA garden railway group.. they have atrack at Bassendean, attached to the museum there I think they steam most weekends..you want Shell valvata460..contact a Shell industrial oils supplier..they sell it here. 

 Gordon.


----------



## Skip (Jan 2, 2008)

I'm quite satisfied with Lucas Oil heavy duty oil stabilizer in my three Accucraft steam engines. Its cleaner, runs cooler with less burn-off, less varnishing and easier to clean than either of the two versions of steam oil that I have. Our steam engines don't even come close to the environment of commercial (full size) steam or IC engines.


----------



## JEFF RUNGE (Jan 2, 2008)

ROFLMAO..... Lucas oil Stabelizer.... You should try some STP while your at it, then some Marvel mystery oil... Maybe melt some bees wax... ROFLMAO hey if want easy clean up LEAVE IT ON THE SHELF and run a sparkie...


----------



## Kovacjr (Jan 2, 2008)

Im with you Jeff - If it cleans off so much easier just think what happens inside the cylinders...I dont understand why people dont just use the oil designed for the use... Why use Lucas, bar oil and whatever someone feels is good to use. Had anyone erer mixed lucas with water to see that it does.


----------



## jfrank (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By JEFF RUNGE on 02/24/2009 7:22 AM
ROFLMAO..... Lucas oil Stabelizer.... You should try some STP while your at it, then some Marvel mystery oil... Maybe melt some bees wax... ROFLMAO hey if want easy clean up LEAVE IT ON THE SHELF and run a sparkie... 


I like that stuff Steve used that turns green in the tank. He squirted some of it on the ground and the next day when he came out in the yard it attacked him.


----------



## Old Boy (Feb 9, 2009)

Its cleaner, runs cooler with less burn-off, less varnishing - Skip
I don't care what lubrication anyone chooses to use, but I can't wait to hear an explanation of how you were able to collect the data and determine these facts. Miniature thermocouples and intra-lubricator carbon emissions sensors? Micro-miniature oil line video-cams? Come on, give us the particulars.


----------



## Skip (Jan 2, 2008)

It seems ignorance knows no bounds on this forum. 

RUNGE What, no lower case on your keyboard? Need a magnifying glass to read? STP might actually work although as I recall, the viscosity is too light. Do your homework on the high-temperature properties of Lucas, compared to steam oil, assuming you even know what oil you have labelled "steam oil". I have several bottles of "steam oil" as supplied by both Accucraft and other suppliers - absolutely no idea what's in the bottle. Do you know, with certainty? My engines run fine on Lucas, thank you for asking. 

I don't suppose any of you clued into the fact that commercial steam oil was never compounded to run in engines as small as ours. There is nowhere near the shear, pressure and temp in these little steam engines to approach the design requirements of commercial oil. Commercial steam oil is not necessarily any more appropriate to run in these engines than any other high viscosity non-detergent oil. 

Old Boy - its called "observation". I don't need any high tech equipment to determine those features, but then my university degree in chemistry helps a lot there. What, you don't know how to determine those things qualitatively? Guess you'd better stick with steam oil then. 

There's a reason why Hottman uses Lucas (several, actually), and unlike you guys, he doesn't pull his answers out of his ass, nor do I.


----------



## Kovacjr (Jan 2, 2008)

Well when someone else mentioned to use Lucas I looked at what is was composed of. For one it doesnot mix with water/steam. Designed to use around 200 deg. Max temp 425. Boiling point of 500 deg. Viscoisity of 110. They also state to not use in an excessive heat environment. After looking at that I'll keep using the oil from Royce or Green Velvet. Both are designed for small bore locomotives, and are around a 460 viscosity


----------



## Skip (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Kovacjr on 02/24/2009 11:34 AM
Well when someone else mentioned to use Lucas I looked at what is was composed of. For one it doesnot mix with water/steam. Designed to use around 200 deg. Max temp 425. Boiling point of 500 deg. Viscoisity of 110. They also state to not use in an excessive heat environment. After looking at that I'll keep using the oil from Royce or Green Velvet. Both are designed for small bore locomotives, and are around a 460 viscosity







As I said, ignorance knows no bounds. 460 viscosity index - at what temperature? certainly not at 100 deg C or it wouldn't go through the pipes. Lucas is rated at 110 vi at 100deg C, the boiling point of water, and the temperature of unpressurized steam. It barely pours at room temperature. The operating temp of the cylinders is around 100 deg C in our engines - which don't run high pressure steam. It doesn't have to mix with water, and better that it doesn't. It only has to be emulsified in steam, which it does. Its designed high film strength characteristics, at the temperatures the cylinders run is right where it should be. Doesn't have the tallow to burn in the cylinders and in the superheaters. As I said before, these engines do not provide the same operating environment that steam oil is designed for. Ask Royce or the guys from Green Velvet for the model steam engineering data they used to compound their oils, or, ask Accucraft - see if they can tell you, and compare... Lucas is not being used in an "excessive heat environment". Jason, are you actually able to evaluate the specs of an oil?

Roundhouse recommends "steam bearing oil ISO 220" which isn't even a steam cylinder oil, with a viscosity of 220 at unknown temperature (don't know what temp ISO std is measured at). The point is, there are many products to run these engines on, because most of them have low requirements. All you know about most of the "steam oils" sold for model steam engines is that they what "somebody" says is right for the engine, which in most cases translates to "it didn't burn it up". 


I've run my three Accucraft engines on Lucas from day one, because oil was not supplied with them (shipping restrictions, apparently) and there was none to be had locally. Each one was brought up carefully on the Lucas and carefully monitored for lubrication - all have behaved perfectly. Since then, I've had the opportunity to use "real" steam oil ("might" be Green Velvet, because it is green), and frankly, the Lucas is better in my engines. That's just my opinion, not everybody's experience will be the same. More complex steam systems than Accucraft may have different requirements, especially in more complicated valving.


----------



## hcampbell (Jan 2, 2008)

I've tried a 50-50 mix of steam oil in an old loco that is so worn it wouldn't run well on straight steam oil. 
This was to be just until I got around to a rebuild. It worked so well that it was about 10 years before I needed 
to schedule that rebuild. 
No science or research, just a practical observation. 

Back to the safety of the workshop 
Harvey C. S.A.1838


----------



## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By hcampbell on 02/24/2009 1:27 PM
I've tried a 50-50 mix of steam oil in an old loco that is so worn it wouldn't run well on straight steam oil. 
This was to be just until I got around to a rebuild. It worked so well that it was about 10 years before I needed 
to schedule that rebuild. 
No science or research, just a practical observation. 

Back to the safety of the workshop 
Harvey C. S.A.1838 



"50-50 mix" with what?


----------



## Shay Gear Head (Jan 3, 2008)

50/50 = Steam Oil/Burbon?


----------



## David BaileyK27 (Jan 2, 2008)

I use 50-50 mix of Lucas oil and 680 steam oil for piston valve engines, but only straight steam oil for slide valve engines, the mix seems to seal the piston valves better. 
David Bailey www.djbengineering.co.uk


----------



## jfrank (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By David BaileyK27 on 02/24/2009 3:11 PM
I use 50-50 mix of Lucas oil and 680 steam oil for piston valve engines, but only straight steam oil for slide valve engines, the mix seems to seal the piston valves better. 
David Bailey www.djbengineering.co.uk


David, I have to agree. Thanks to Dave Hottman I use the 50/50 mix on my piston valve engines also. It does seem to work better. Otherwise I use Green Velvet Steam Cylinder Oil Formula 3, Fill Code 011109-1 House Drum SAPON-A-MAX Compounded Cylinder Oil which according to them is fomulated for our little engines. I buy it by the gallon and it last me a long time and is much cheaper than buying those little bottles for $10 each. Others in our group use Roundhouse steam oil.


----------



## JEFF RUNGE (Jan 2, 2008)

Well I used to think it was safe to buy used live steamers.... not so much anymore. 
David, are these "high milage" piston valve engines that they require a heavy oil film to help seal?


----------



## hcampbell (Jan 2, 2008)

Sorry, 50-50 Lucas and steam oil. 
Something got lost in the editing. 

Harvey C.


----------



## Rob Meadows (Jan 6, 2008)

After reading such compelling arguments, I have decided to throw away all my Green Velvet steamoil and replace it with Hair Oil! Bryle-cream to be precise, A little dab will do ya! My locomotives may not run but at least they will appear well groomed for the mantle.


----------



## Old Boy (Feb 9, 2009)

But Rob will it run COOLER, which we are told by a superior intelligence is better and is easily observable.


----------



## afinegan (Jan 2, 2008)

I hear soul glo works good.....
"Let you SOUUULLLLL GLOOOoo"











Stick with green velvet and you cant go wrong, all the larger steam engines in my 7.5 gauge club use their stuff too.


----------



## Jack - Freshwater Models (Feb 17, 2008)

From andrew in another group - http://steamenginelube.com/cylinderoil.htm Looks like a great source! 

Jack


----------



## Jack - Freshwater Models (Feb 17, 2008)

http://steamenginelube.com/cylinderoil.htm


----------



## Jack - Freshwater Models (Feb 17, 2008)

http://steamenginelube.com/cylinderoil.htm


----------



## Jack - Freshwater Models (Feb 17, 2008)

http://steamenginelube.com/cylinderoil.htm


----------



## Jack - Freshwater Models (Feb 17, 2008)

what happened?? sorry about that Jack


----------



## Shay Gear Head (Jan 3, 2008)

*Jack,*

*We get the message!!!!!!!!!*


----------



## afinegan (Jan 2, 2008)

That andrew in the other group is me


----------



## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

I happen to agree that using anything other than a lubricating oil specially formulated for use in a steam engine is not the ideal.

But I am incensed by the comments some people are making here about what others have said seems to work okay for them. Disparaging comments about another person's experience or preferences are without merit. 

Present your own experience and information.

If you have information that corrects any misinformation given then present that information, but 

STOP THE PERSONAL ATTACKS.

I AM FED UP WITH THEM!


----------



## John R (May 17, 2008)

*Thank you Taperpin, I will do that, At $120.00 a 20 Litre Drum thats a bit heavy on*


*Price when your a Pensioner!.*










Thank you,


John.


----------



## steamboatmodel (Jan 2, 2008)

If you talk nice to your local oil distributor (Shell, Esso etc.) and explain what you want, you can sometimes get them to sell (give) you a lab sample usually a pint tin. 
Regards, 
Gerald 
PS if you do get one be sure to thank them and maybe invite them out to see your engine run


----------



## k5pat (Jan 18, 2008)

Here is an excellent article written by Harry Wade for Steam in the Garden and now appears on the Southern Steam Trains website.

The truth about Steam Oil 


Harry appears to have done extensive research on the subject and concluded that genuine "Steam Cylinder Oil" is the best way to go.
However, it's your engine to use or abuse as you see fit.


----------



## Jack - Freshwater Models (Feb 17, 2008)

Whats in the artical should be common knowledge amoungst live steamers. I've heard of all sorts of oil being used but steam oil is really the only good choice. One thing I noticed back in the early 1980s was that when I used, in a pinch, a friends "steam oil" which was probably just non detergent oil the loco, an early aster, didn't seem to perform as well as on real steam oil. I do wnder if a mixture of "way oil" and tallow would work but why bother when real steam oil can be purchased. 

Hopefully this will only post once!!!!!!! 

Jack


----------



## Skip (Jan 2, 2008)

Stick with green velvet and you cant go wrong, all the larger steam engines in my 7.5 gauge club use their stuff too. 


Gee, that would be odd, you think maybe that's because that's exactly what Green Velvet Formula 3 is compounded for "...tough glazing additive to lubricate wet cylinders and prevent rust after shutting down" - how many of you are running cast iron pistons and cylinders in your G gauge trains...? Are their formulations suitable for brass? Formula 3 is 9% animal fat. That is a very high percentage for small steamers. Most other sources quote 4-6% . If you feel you need tallow to lube 3 sq in of cylinder wall, carry on. The recommendation for 50/50 Lucas and Green Velvet is fair. This cuts the tallow content back to 4.5% and blends in a high viscosity, high quality cylinder oil with the GV. 

As to the many "opinions" expressed, I will only say it diminishes the credibility of some of you, not that that appears to be too difficult. I'm off. my time is better spent elsewhere.


----------



## Steve S. (Jan 2, 2008)

I think that I will stick with half water and half GREEN algae in my lubricator.














After all, the best run I ever got from my Berk was when the tank was half full of algae.

What we are seeing on this thread is that all the above mentioned products work. IMHO, because most of the steam in our small scale is saturated.............the "wet steam" itself works as a lubricant. Yes, you should use a type of oil that works with this steam in your engine but this bickering over which one works best is silly, but fun to read and entertaining. I am happy to see that so many things work well, makes sense to me.


I might start lubing my chassis and axle boxes with bacon grease.


----------



## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

I remember a "Dennis the Menace" comic where he is sitting on the driveway with his wagon all apart, Mr. Wilson is standing next to him looking at the jar of peanut butter on the ground. The caption is, "I always grease my wheels with peanut butter. Why do you ask?"

With the present scare of Salmonella in peanut products it might be a good use for the stuff that is being recalled!


----------



## JEFF RUNGE (Jan 2, 2008)

Steve, when you start using bacon grease on your guns just send your Break Free and un-used steam oil to me.


----------



## jfrank (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Skip on 02/25/2009 6:31 PM
Stick with green velvet and you cant go wrong, all the larger steam engines in my 7.5 gauge club use their stuff too. 


As to the many "opinions" expressed, I will only say it diminishes the credibility of some of you, not that that appears to be too difficult. I'm off. my time is better spent elsewhere.


BYE


----------



## sparks (Jan 2, 2008)

I don't know about bacon grease but *Bore Butter *works really well and smells like something you would rub on your self if you had a bad chest cold.

How is that for thread degeneration. 

Steve, loved your comments. Way to go guy. Keep it sane.

Chuck


----------



## afinegan (Jan 2, 2008)

Here is my attempt to keep the naysayers too busy researching, and let this thread die, 


When the tangential force F overcomes the frictional force between two surfaces then the surfaces begins to slide relative to each other. In the case of a body resting on a flat surface the body starts to move. The sliding frictional resistance is normally different to the static frictional resistance. The coefficient of sliding friction is expressed using the same formula as the static coefficient and is generally lower than the static coefficient of friction 













Read this website about coefficients of friction to understand metal on metal friction http://www.roymech.co.uk/Useful_Tables/Tribology/co_of_frict.htm. Then write a Doctoral Thesis about which steam oils lower the friction and by how much in a tested environment. This also needs to be tested on the moon, mars. (never know when we will have to run live steam engines on mars, astronauts need there hobbies too) Also we need to know the degregation of said steam oil so that we know how much to supply our cylinders in order to set our lubricators correctly. Then we need an electron microscope to study at the atomic level physical metal on metal degregation.


I expect this paper to be on my desk tomorrow.


If you need me for help this weekend on this problem I will be at ridge live steamershttp://ridgeclub.org/having fun with my steam engines running green velvet sapon max formula 3 (gauge 1 and 7.5).


(I am trying to be funny







)


----------



## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Andrew:

I have completed my thesis and sent you two copies, "2nd day air". I had the 8000 pages hard-bound (in 16 volumes). You should receive them tomorrow morning directly from the publisher/book binder via a courier that will release them to you when you pay the publishing and delivery costs. I expect a critique and response by Monday afternoon.

The gist of my research is that for those below the equator, especially in Australia, Vegemite is a completely semi-anadequate substitute for any lubrication in present use, except on even or odd numbered months, unless the user is non-qua-sequiter. For those in the Northern hemisphere, if neglecting the Coriolis effect of the lubrication mixing with the steam, any oil of sufficient tackiness and lacking any solids with a Rockwell hardness above 1/10 of the engine metals or seals will produce the desired reduction in friction without damage to the cylinder walls or piston rings beyond acceptable levels.

The ideal lubricant will have a molecular structure that will bond permanently to any surface except itself, thus producing a perfect lubrication. The only consideration being whether it can be of a large enough molecular structure that can seal gaps to prevent blow-by of the steam.

I must plead with you to not let the courier leave without your retaining research publication. After I had finished it and sent it to the publisher I went on to experiments in using other liquid to gas conversion media, and decided to try gasoline as the medium. Unfortunately, I accidentally left the blower valve open on the locomotive and as I was building up a head of steam the blowtorch effect from the stack on the smokebox was so tall that it set fire to the cat that was asleep on the shelf over my workbench. The cat, upon finding his tail aflame bounded from the shelf and landed on my RAID drive equipped computer system and set fire to the keyboard. As I was frantically trying to stop the cat from getting out of the shop area whereupon it might set fire to the rest of the CMBY RY research complex the entire computer system was burned to a crisp and all 8 of the RAID drives were destroyed. Thus I no longer have a copy of the reseach. I have contacted the publisher and they said they had already deleted the data I sent them for publication, thus the two sets of 8 volumes you should get tomorrow AM are the only remaining copies. When you have completed your review, please pay the courier to send them back to me. (I realize it is more expensive, but I'd appreciate it if you were to also send it 2nd day guaranteed delivery.)

Thanks


----------



## Dave -- Use Coal (Feb 19, 2008)

After a considerable amount of research and reverse engineering I must conclude that Steve forgot he was using Green Velvet steam oil. LOL


----------



## Old Boy (Feb 9, 2009)

we need to consider what is going to replace steam oil in the not too distant future.
What's happening in the not too distant future?


----------



## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Old Boy on 03/03/2009 4:25 PM
we need to consider what is going to replace steam oil in the not too distant future.
What's happening in the not too distant future? 



The prelude to the more distant future.


----------



## JoelB (Jan 3, 2008)

The prelude to the more distant future. 


Which is, of course, what precedes the too distant future. By that time, either petroleum-based steam oil will be replaced by a synthetic substitute, or some bright bulb will have developed a way to put a coating on valve and cylinder surfaces that will make lubrication less critical, or possibly unnecessary.


----------



## k5pat (Jan 18, 2008)

ROFLMAO!!










Andrew is right.  Time to put this one to bed!


----------



## Steve S. (Jan 2, 2008)

Time to put this one to bed! 

I don't know about that. This steam oil thing comes up about every 3 months or so. I always get a kick out of how people can get so "Steamed Up" over Steam oil. I kind'a look forward to it.


----------



## Kurt Sykes (Feb 28, 2008)

Never mind the steam oil, 
What kind of car do you drive? American,or Foreign. 
Me..........I drive American. 

Kurt


----------



## steamboatmodel (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Kurt Sykes on 03/07/2009 6:00 AM
Never mind the steam oil, 
What kind of car do you drive? American,or Foreign. 
Me..........I drive American. 

Kurt
I bought steam oil, can't afford a car
Regards,
gerald


----------



## Charles (Jan 2, 2008)

Stanley steamer....well, I can dream!


----------



## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

I drive an AMERICAN car... yessireee! 

Assembled in Mexico, from parts made in Argentina, China, Japan, Hungary and a some other countries.


----------



## JEFF RUNGE (Jan 2, 2008)

I drive a "foreign" car built here in the USA


----------



## Dave Sykes (Jan 3, 2008)

I also drive American and use LUCAS Oil


----------



## Dave Sykes (Jan 3, 2008)

We used LUCAS Oil in those R2800s in Korea also


----------



## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Steve S. on 03/06/2009 10:05 PM
Time to put this one to bed! 

I don't know about that. This steam oil thing comes up about every 3 months or so. I always get a kick out of how people can get so "Steamed Up" over Steam oil. I kind'a look forward to it.










Religion, politics and gender debates are no where near as fun as a good steam oil fight.

Bob


----------



## JEFF RUNGE (Jan 2, 2008)

I only use AMSOIL in my cars, 100% synthetic, but not in my steamers however, they don't make steam oil.


----------

