# Quit your whining Aristo!



## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

* http://www.aristocraft.com/vbulletinforums/showthread.php?p=165918#post165918*

More blather about why Aristo cannot stock parts.

Funny, USAT has always been able to stock parts, and so has Bachmann.

Just a bunch of excuses, and now Bachmann, USAT and Aristo all in the same factories, owned by Kader...

I guess the default size of Kool Aid container just went from a quart to a 55 gallon drum.

Drink up.

Greg


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## aceinspp (Jan 2, 2008)

Slurp,slurp,slurp. I,m good.







Later RJD


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## toddalin (Jan 4, 2008)

Posted By Greg Elmassian on 18 May 2011 06:55 PM 
*http://www.aristocraft.com/vbulletinforums/showthread.php?p=165918#post165918*


Funny, USAT has always been able to stock parts, and so has Bachmann.


Greg 





Guess again! Not in my experience.

USA will ship the rest of the order without the part without telling you or asking if another similar part can be substitued. Then when when your order comes, minus the part, and you call to ask where it is, they finally will send a substitute (e.g., different color truck frame because the right one is out of stock with no expected date), but will charge for shipping again. They should ask before they send out the order!


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

I have the same experience with partial orders. 

But I call Mike, he tells me what he has, and it comes in the mail days later. 

If you don't talk to a person, you get the same thing happening like not talking directly to Navin at Aristo, or a human at Bachmann. 

Greg


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## Mik (Jan 2, 2008)

Here is the way I read it: 
1. Their crystal ball is cracked, so they are having a hard time predicting what parts will be in demand a year after the product was finished. 
2. They don't want a bunch of capital and space tied up with stuff that may or may not move for years. 
3. The margin on parts is pretty small, so their profit motivation lies elsewhere. 
4. They may need to consider re-negotiating their contract with the Chinese to allow for additional smaller runs at a better price break point. 
5. They just don't understand why folks are beating them up over the non-availability of a $5 part, when you can get the whole thing for $250.-- In a society where most folks throw out a $1500 TV instead of fixing it


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## markoles (Jan 2, 2008)

Allan,

Exactly. Seriosuly, it is their money and they have to decide what they want to do with it. 

In the few times I needed a spare part, I have been able to get it from LGB, ARisto, USA and Bachmann. No problems at all.


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## NTCGRR (Jan 2, 2008)

I have found its better to ask around here and a few of my contacts before I ask any company.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Yep, or maybe you can use a conspiracy! 

This DOES work... 

You need a SD45 cab, your buddy needs SD45 handrails, another buddy needs SD45 motor blocks, and all you need to do is find someone who needs the circuit board. 

Then what happens is Navin is justified in "cannabilizing" a SD45 and sending out all the pieces to all of you.. 

You have to be careful though ha ha! Dribble the requests in over 2 weeks... 

Disclaimer: I NEVER said this, it just looks like I typed it... 

Greg


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA Do i really need to get involved with this topic ???????????????? Why cant the people UNDERSTAND........................

You need to F---in support the product you sell.......What Frigen part of that Dont you Ding Dong Heads UNDER F---in Stand DAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA




*You sell it you support it you dumb A-s's* 


I luv you guys............ HE HE HE
















Nicky knows Best....................................









*You BETCHA .......LOL...........You Sugar Sweet Meat heads.....................*


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## Del Tapparo (Jan 4, 2008)

Well, I don't get his (Lewis's) message. Whining cause they can't afford to order parts, but says they are getting parts with every order. Do they, or will they have spare parts or not?

The only locos I own that even require spare parts are Aristo. My rail buses break on a regular basis.


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## aceinspp (Jan 2, 2008)

AC has had these Locos and cars for years now so they should know by now what parts they need to stock. Some are just common knowledge. So just make the parts. Same for USAT stuff and when you do order from state what Loco you have and if the parts are there you will get the right ones. Later RJD


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## todd55whit (Jan 2, 2008)

Aristo is the only manufacturer I have ever had massssssive difficulties getting any replacement parts! Mike @ USA is great, if he doesn't have it he knows what might work. Ever get that from AC? Not bloody likely. I needed windows for a RS-3( you know the loco many railroads had and has been released at least 3 times that I know of). I emailed, I called Navin...no luck! Finally got a email stating they didn't stock a complete cab window set. Any way got feed up, made my own, like them better than new. Imagine if Ford or Chevy didn't stock extra parts, they would go the way of the Studebaker!!!


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## Mik (Jan 2, 2008)

Not to defend Lewis, but I gotta ask: Why is it some folks expect Rolls Royce caliber service when they chose to purchase a Yugo? 

If there was money to be made in parts, they'd make them available. Or somebody else would. Folks part out everything from atvs to tractors every day. If you think there is that much demand, invest your own money do the same with used Aristo trains


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## Totalwrecker (Feb 26, 2009)

My fellow rocket scientist.... 

AC's model seems to be 'order and disperse' From factory to shipping container to US to dealer shelves. 
Parts; can order 200 with production OR 1000 as a stand alone order. 
So for 1000 units you get 200 parts and hope 201 don't break. 
Or you order 1000 and have to store 799 because only 201 ordered replacements.... 

It's one thing to store a packaged unit in a ready to ship container and another to keep one open for parts inventory... and then it's at least one container per loco aand higher priced labor that can read, fill orders and change inventory numbers.... for throw away toys? Parts? We don't need no stinking parts! 

You want parts? Pay higher retail and have some of those costs covered. 

5, 4, 3, 2, 1 we have lift-off!! 

John


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Just to be clear, the "whining" I am referring to is all the excuses about too many parts, too many items in the computer database, too low profit, needing another whole warehouse, etc. 

The real problem is twofold: 

1. New locomotives are ordered without a reasonable parts order at the same time (minimum quantity 200) 
2. Not ordering parts with each successive order. 

The results, no parts for owners of new locomotives for 2 years (when the second run happens), or running out of critical parts between parts orders. 

We waited 2 years for weights for the E8, some people waited 2 years for parts for their live steamers. 

All the examples and proof is over there on the forum, so I just object to the whining. 

Aristo, learn from USAT and Bachmann, they have parts. Even Accucraft, with a much smaller production has parts. They do make a profit too. 

Even with people as great as Navin, the lack of ordering enough and frequently enough is obvious. 

After making trains for many years, it does not take a genius to know new diesels need handrails, pilots, bells, horns, etc. 

Steamers need bells, sand domes, cabs, pilots, valve gear. 

If you don't want to order stuff because you don't want to spend the money, or are overworked, then just be quiet or admit it. But do not insult the intelligence of your loyal customers with balderdash. It just does not wash in the real world. 

Greg (still waiting for spring hangers and a exploded diagram for a pacific)


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## Dave Meashey (Jan 2, 2008)

I don't know how many of you have seen this thread: http://www.mylargescale.com/Community/Forums/tabid/56/aff/8/aft/120575/afv/topic/Default.aspx#217854 It may provide an eventual resolution to the parts problem. I would suppose as long as you were only using it for non-profit essential replacements, you would not be violating any copyright laws. 

Anyway, it's interesting to see the cost coming down for this technology. 

Best, 
David Meashey


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Well, it will have to come down a lot to justify the cost for 99% of the people I would guess... also notice the coarse resolution of the finished product? A cheap unit will give you like results, not the fine and smooth detail of a molded part. 

And then you make a few for your friends, charge them a couple of bucks, and Aristo's lawyers are knocking at your door? 

All of that notwithstanding, a great idea for those who can afford/justify one... 

Greg


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## Dave Meashey (Jan 2, 2008)

Greg;

Well, the operative word was _eventual_.







A few years ago it was science fiction. Perhaps in a few more years the smooth replicas will be produced by a device that only costs what a 1990 desktop system went for. Heck, my most recent printer/scanner/copier cost me less than my first dot matrix printer cost.

And yeah, I'm not sure what kind of entanglement could be caused by copyright laws. Probably like what you wrote. I'm better versed with print, since I spent three decades as a technical writer.

Anyway, it will be interesting to see how both the technology and the legal ramifications from said technology develope.

Yours,
David Meashey


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

I'm sure you are right about it getting cheaper Dave... that's one thing positive about electronics related to microprocessors... 

I have been eying them for some time myself... 

Greg


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## aceinspp (Jan 2, 2008)

Well Gents I'd say most of you are all barking up the wrong tree and most reply's do not add up to the final results of producing the parts. Money can be made in parts. If you couldn't then you would never see any from anyone. Later RJD


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## Truthman (Dec 13, 2008)

Posted By Mik on 19 May 2011 06:55 PM 
Not to defend Lewis, but I gotta ask: Why is it some folks expect Rolls Royce caliber service when they chose to purchase a Yugo? 

If there was money to be made in parts, they'd make them available. Or somebody else would. Folks part out everything from atvs to tractors every day. If you think there is that much demand, invest your own money do the same with used Aristo trains


Right on Mik. It is possible that someone could have a side business parting out "new" Aristo parts by purchasing several new locomotives and rolling stock at a time and dissect them for parts resale. I guess the profit return would be painfully slow but hey, if you had extra cash burning a hole in your pocket and you did it because you love it or because you could, nothing wrong with that. I don't believe you would face product infringement or legal problems either. 


Nate


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## Del Tapparo (Jan 4, 2008)

Posted By Truthman on 20 May 2011 06:33 PM 
Posted By Mik on 19 May 2011 06:55 PM 
Not to defend Lewis, but I gotta ask: Why is it some folks expect Rolls Royce caliber service when they chose to purchase a Yugo? 

If there was money to be made in parts, they'd make them available. Or somebody else would. Folks part out everything from atvs to tractors every day. If you think there is that much demand, invest your own money do the same with used Aristo trains


Right on Mik. It is possible that someone could have a side business parting out "new" Aristo parts by purchasing several new locomotives and rolling stock at a time and dissect them for parts resale. I guess the profit return would be painfully slow but hey, if you had extra cash burning a hole in your pocket and you did it because you love it or because you could, nothing wrong with that. I don't believe you would face product infringement or legal problems either. 


Nate 


That's exactly what Aristo is doing now, and it doesn't work. Buy a complete loco to stock the most commonly used parts (4 or 5) and just sit on the rest because nobody needs them? Not a money making proposition. Clearly you stock the commonly used parts, and not the rest. Or at least stock more of the common parts and only a few of the others. This isn't rocket science. Very basic business. As previously stated, they already have the history on parts usage (or at least they could have).


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## norman (Jan 6, 2008)

Hi Greg and others:

As Lewis explained:

1) Lewis does not own a factory, Lewis is a customer of a factory
2) minimum extra parts order is 200 when the product is being produced, the factory has set up costs to do a mold run, my guess is Lewis could order 50 parts at four times the normal pricing , but then we would really complain!
3) I wish that I was Lewis' boss to determine what is produced, but that will never happen! , I would like an expanded line of 1:24 locomotives, will never happen
4) bottom line is any of us could gather sufficient capital and approach the China factories as customers in the identical manner as does USA Trains, Aristocraft, Lionel Trains, who is game to risk their personal capital? There is of course no longer any Lionel trains produced. Just a trademark applied to foreign non-American product. No real American heritage.
5) the best parts solution is to offer customers the option of ordering parts when the product is about to be manufactured
6) if Lewis stocks parts, there is no magic here, the cost of Lewis renting warehouse space and buying parts from the factory is factored into the pricing of the original locomotive for which we later want parts
7) remember LGB ? , impossible to order their "spare" parts for modeling purposes, those parts were reserved to replace future damaged locomotive parts because the cost of LGB producing and stocking those parts was covered by the original sales of those locomotives, the parts cost really covered storage costs and the personel costs to mail the part
8) I am frustrated by what the Aristocraft , Accucraft , USA, etc don't produce but it is not my personal business capital to risk
I knew the Canadian Pacific Royal Hudson was a mistake. Canadian Pacific 2816 would have been a sell out within one year.
The New York Central J1e and J3a are guaranteed sellers. So USA Trains built the diecast J1e. MTH also built a beautiful J1e model but failed to produce 1:32 scale heavyweights.

The Southern PS4 is another classic sure winner. Why Accucraft still has not built this locomotive is a mystery to me.

Too bad MTH chose 1:32 scale instead of 1:29. MTH would have forced 1:29 scale competitors to raise detail levels as they did in O Gauge by forcing Lionel to produce finer scale and finer detail locomotive models.


Norman


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

One thing that seems to be continually missed: Aristo, USAT and Bachmann made in same factory. If Bachmann and USAT can have parts, so can Aristo. 

There is no technological or logistic hurdle they have that is unique to them. It's a matter of choice. That is why I titled this thread as such. 

Greg


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

Posted By Truthman on 20 May 2011 06:33 PM 
Posted By Mik on 19 May 2011 06:55 PM 
Not to defend Lewis, but I gotta ask: Why is it some folks expect Rolls Royce caliber service when they chose to purchase a Yugo? 

If there was money to be made in parts, they'd make them available. Or somebody else would. Folks part out everything from atvs to tractors every day. If you think there is that much demand, invest your own money do the same with used Aristo trains


Right on Mik. It is possible that someone could have a side business parting out "new" Aristo parts by purchasing several new locomotives and rolling stock at a time and dissect them for parts resale. I guess the profit return would be painfully slow but hey, if you had extra cash burning a hole in your pocket and you did it because you love it or because you could, nothing wrong with that. I don't believe you would face product infringement or legal problems either. 


Nate 


What a Dumb Dumb ideal................................................. DAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA You sell it you support it..........


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

Posted By Greg Elmassian on 20 May 2011 09:04 PM 
One thing that seems to be continually missed: Aristo, USAT and Bachmann made in same factory. If Bachmann and USAT can have parts, so can Aristo. 

There is no technological or logistic hurdle they have that is unique to them. It's a matter of choice. That is why I titled this thread as such. 

Greg 
The one thing you need to understand is its the [Polkyman] Screw your customers is his motto........... Got a broken part ? Buy a new engine is his motto............


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## Truthman (Dec 13, 2008)

Posted By Nicholas Savatgy on 20 May 2011 09:05 PM 
Posted By Truthman on 20 May 2011 06:33 PM 
Posted By Mik on 19 May 2011 06:55 PM 
Not to defend Lewis, but I gotta ask: Why is it some folks expect Rolls Royce caliber service when they chose to purchase a Yugo? 

If there was money to be made in parts, they'd make them available. Or somebody else would. Folks part out everything from atvs to tractors every day. If you think there is that much demand, invest your own money do the same with used Aristo trains


Right on Mik. It is possible that someone could have a side business parting out "new" Aristo parts by purchasing several new locomotives and rolling stock at a time and dissect them for parts resale. I guess the profit return would be painfully slow but hey, if you had extra cash burning a hole in your pocket and you did it because you love it or because you could, nothing wrong with that. I don't believe you would face product infringement or legal problems either. 


Nate 


What a Dumb Dumb ideal................................................. DAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA You sell it you support .it.......... 
I didn't say it was a good idea, I think it would a lousy return on investment even for a hobby/side biz. Eventually I could see Aristo going to pre-order only like Atlas O does.


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

Posted By Truthman on 20 May 2011 09:13 PM 
Posted By Nicholas Savatgy on 20 May 2011 09:05 PM 
Posted By Truthman on 20 May 2011 06:33 PM 
Posted By Mik on 19 May 2011 06:55 PM 
Not to defend Lewis, but I gotta ask: Why is it some folks expect Rolls Royce caliber service when they chose to purchase a Yugo? 

If there was money to be made in parts, they'd make them available. Or somebody else would. Folks part out everything from atvs to tractors every day. If you think there is that much demand, invest your own money do the same with used Aristo trains


Right on Mik. It is possible that someone could have a side business parting out "new" Aristo parts by purchasing several new locomotives and rolling stock at a time and dissect them for parts resale. I guess the profit return would be painfully slow but hey, if you had extra cash burning a hole in your pocket and you did it because you love it or because you could, nothing wrong with that. I don't believe you would face product infringement or legal problems either. 


Nate 


What a Dumb Dumb ideal................................................. DAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA You sell it you support .it.......... 
I didn't say it was a good idea, I think it would a lousy return on investment even for a hobby/side biz. Eventually I could see Aristo going to pre-order only like Atlas O does. 
*Again you dont seem to understand, If you sell it you need to support it or maybe they should go play with dolls and leave the Big Boy Toys to the companys that know how to do it.*


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Posted By norman on 20 May 2011 08:33 PM 

Hi Greg and others:

As Lewis explained:

1) Lewis does not own a factory, Lewis is a customer of a factory
>>> ok, so are USAT and Bachmann, what's the difference? 

2) minimum extra parts order is 200 when the product is being produced, the factory has set up costs to do a mold run, my guess is Lewis could order 50 parts at four times the normal pricing , but then we would really complain!
>>> order 200 parts... or do exactly what USAT and Bachmann do... since they are successful, it's obviously possible 

3) I wish that I was Lewis' boss to determine what is produced, but that will never happen! , I would like an expanded line of 1:24 locomotives, will never happen
>>> not germane to this discussion 

4) bottom line is any of us could gather sufficient capital and approach the China factories as customers in the identical manner as does USA Trains, Aristocraft, Lionel Trains, who is game to risk their personal capital? There is of course no longer any Lionel trains produced. Just a trademark applied to foreign non-American product. No real American heritage.
>> not germane to this discussion, again, USAT and Bachmann built in same factory, they have parts.. 

5) the best parts solution is to offer customers the option of ordering parts when the product is about to be manufactured
>>> nope, the best option is to take care of your customers when you produce a locomotive, does not take a rocket scientist to know what parts to make, they have years of experience in what people want 

6) if Lewis stocks parts, there is no magic here, the cost of Lewis renting warehouse space and buying parts from the factory is factored into the pricing of the original locomotive for which we later want parts
>>> pure whining, USAT and Bachmann do it, so again, balderdash 

7) remember LGB ? , impossible to order their "spare" parts for modeling purposes, those parts were reserved to replace future damaged locomotive parts because the cost of LGB producing and stocking those parts was covered by the original sales of those locomotives, the parts cost really covered storage costs and the personel costs to mail the part
>>> fine, the people that need the parts most are the ones with broken or missing parts... 

8) I am frustrated by what the Aristocraft , Accucraft , USA, etc don't produce but it is not my personal business capital to risk
I knew the Canadian Pacific Royal Hudson was a mistake. Canadian Pacific 2816 would have been a sell out within one year.
The New York Central J1e and J3a are guaranteed sellers. So USA Trains built the diecast J1e. MTH also built a beautiful J1e model but failed to produce 1:32 scale heavyweights.

The Southern PS4 is another classic sure winner. Why Accucraft still has not built this locomotive is a mystery to me.

Too bad MTH chose 1:32 scale instead of 1:29. MTH would have forced 1:29 scale competitors to raise detail levels as they did in O Gauge by forcing Lionel to produce finer scale and finer detail locomotive models.
>>> none of that is germane to the thread

Not trying to be confrontive, but I wanted to address all the things you said that relate to Aristo whining about why it SOOO HARD to have parts.... 


p.s. agree with you on the choices of locos, and MTH, etc... it would be great if MTH "entered" the fray!

Regards, Greg


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## Truthman (Dec 13, 2008)

Posted By Nicholas Savatgy on 20 May 2011 09:18 PM 
Posted By Truthman on 20 May 2011 09:13 PM 
Posted By Nicholas Savatgy on 20 May 2011 09:05 PM 
Posted By Truthman on 20 May 2011 06:33 PM 
Posted By Mik on 19 May 2011 06:55 PM 
Not to defend Lewis, but I gotta ask: Why is it some folks expect Rolls Royce caliber service when they chose to purchase a Yugo? 

If there was money to be made in parts, they'd make them available. Or somebody else would. Folks part out everything from atvs to tractors every day. If you think there is that much demand, invest your own money do the same with used Aristo trains


Right on Mik. It is possible that someone could have a side business parting out "new" Aristo parts by purchasing several new locomotives and rolling stock at a time and dissect them for parts resale. I guess the profit return would be painfully slow but hey, if you had extra cash burning a hole in your pocket and you did it because you love it or because you could, nothing wrong with that. I don't believe you would face product infringement or legal problems either. 


Nate 


What a Dumb Dumb ideal................................................. DAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA You sell it you support .it.......... 
I didn't say it was a good idea, I think it would a lousy return on investment even for a hobby/side biz. Eventually I could see Aristo going to pre-order only like Atlas O does. 
*Again you dont seem to understand, If you sell it you need to support it or maybe they should go play with dolls and leave the Big Boy Toys to the companys that know how to do it.*

Nick, I understand you. Aristo should be able to play with the big boys like USAT and Bachmann who do stock parts and especially in the case of USAT, have a heck of all more stock on hand of everything at all times. Mik just mentioned a practice that goes on in many other industries and I was talking about that.


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## Ray Dunakin (Jan 6, 2008)

Posted By Nicholas Savatgy on 20 May 2011 09:18 PM 
*If you sell it you need to support it...*


They only support they are obligated to provide is whatever the warranty covers.


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

Posted By Ray Dunakin on 20 May 2011 10:06 PM 
Posted By Nicholas Savatgy on 20 May 2011 09:18 PM 
*If you sell it you need to support it...*


They only support they are obligated to provide is whatever the warranty covers. 



You are correct, But they preach they are the best in the Hobby so Stocking Repair parts as most good companys do is just common sense. *Am i incorrect ?????????? *


For Example my PCC car didnt work properly out of the box and after 3 emails and 2 calls which i was told it would be repaired they backed out of the repair and without looking at it said there wasnt a problem cause the old man didnt want any bad PR on a new item ................ And its not Navins fault he's only doing his job and he has a Family to feed. I blame it soley on the current owner. A typical B.S. When i Talked to Scott about it at the show he shook his head and said they would fix it no matter what, but by then Greg had it repaired properly and i thank him. This is why i like Scott he does as he says........... Aristocraft does have a good future as long as Scott is in charge.................My opinion of course. HE HAS MY RESPECT AND THATS HARD TO COME BY.


*Some of you guys may not like what i say but its always the truth whether you like it or not.............* 


A Quote

Dear All,

We got an early report that the PCC did not have round wheels and we checked and they were well within our specs and had no running problems. We had run a few for months without a glitch and by the time we got any other comments they we all sold out.

We've had some more recent comments that the gauging was not correct and there seems to be a variation in production. None of the ones we checked had that condition, but if you have one that does just e-mail me at [/i]_[email protected]_ and we will send a pickup tag from UPS and fix the gauging.[/i]_

_Obviously, in the second run there will be a q.c. check on this point that we did not specify as the early samples were right on a back to back wheel measurement at our specified 39.8mm to 40mm. 

We apologize if you've had any working difficulty with the PCC coming off the track, but we will make it right!

All the best,

Lewis Polk

The PCC motor is an H.O. motor from Sanda Kan that has been long used in H.O. loco from the major brands. We needed this smaller motor due to the space requirements of this low profile loco.

The lighting is the same LED arrangement from the RDC-3, which was received with much acclaim. We will try to use a golden color LED on the next run, but personally I think the super bright white shows off the interior much better. We will look at the golden color option again and then make a final decision. [/i]


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## Johnn (Jan 5, 2010)

I agree, and thats why i no longer will buy anything Aristocraft. Ive been screwed over too many times by them.

I recommend any manufactures but Aristocraft in Largescale, seems they tend to deceive more than any thing else.
They need to back there product instead of screwing the customers that keep their lights on.


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## Chris France (Jan 3, 2008)

OK, so I'm not going to defend Aristocraft's parts policy, but I have to ask. If USA's customer support is so great and they back their products so well, then why was I told when the paint was flaking and peeling off my F unit that they best they would do was sell me another shell...Oh and guess what? No MEC shells in stock. So now I have a useless locomotive and even if they had a solution I would have had to pay. Yeah, USA has wonderful service.....


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

Posted By Chris France on 21 May 2011 07:39 PM 
OK, so I'm not going to defend Aristocraft's parts policy, but I have to ask. If USA's customer support is so great and they back their products so well, then why was I told when the paint was flaking and peeling off my F unit that they best they would do was sell me another shell...Oh and guess what? No MEC shells in stock. So now I have a useless locomotive and even if they had a solution I would have had to pay. Yeah, USA has wonderful service..... I dont think this topic was about USAT service but leave it to you to divert the conversation away from its intended topic.


I'm thinkin that USAT was kind enough to stock extra bodys so when to needed one it was there for you.

Ask Aristo if they stock bodys let alone ANY kind of repair parts. the only thing Aristo stocks is there customers butts full of BS









I kid cause i luv you Koolaiders. 

Quote.

If you put all the Koolaiders minds together you still dont have one normal Brain unquote..................

Nicholas Savatgy...............


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## Truthman (Dec 13, 2008)

Sorry about your dilemma. I don't think anyone should expect to have all replacement parts especially bodies for free. No one will have everything at any time every time we need them either. But USAT does do a pretty good job at maintaining inventory of new products and replacement parts at all times. Look at the selection of avaiolable USAT loco's and rolling stock and then compare that alone to Aristo's on hand stock list. I'm not trying to be argumentative at all. In the past few years I have purchased over 20 Aristo locomotives and another 20 pieces of rolling stock, some track and electronics so I've done my share in supporting Aristo. But it truly is a unique situation with Aristo. I try not to bash anyone but it seems with all the Aristo bashing going on, they still buy their stuff including the new PCC trolley. But I have way more invested in USAT than Aristo because I like the product selection, the quality and the detail better. But you know, we all love G scale so i say buy what you like, run trains and enjoy them for what they are!


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

Posted By Truthman on 21 May 2011 09:03 PM 
Sorry about your dilemma. I don't think anyone should expect to have all replacement parts especially bodies for free. No one will have everything at any time every time we need them either. But USAT does do a pretty good job at maintaining inventory of new products and replacement parts at all times. Look at the selection of avaiolable USAT loco's and rolling stock and then compare that alone to Aristo's on hand stock list. I'm not trying to be argumentative at all. In the past few years I have purchased over 20 Aristo locomotives and another 20 pieces of rolling stock, some track and electronics so I've done my share in supporting Aristo. But it truly is a unique situation with Aristo. I try not to bash anyone but it seems with all the Aristo bashing going on, they still buy their stuff including the new PCC trolley. But I have way more invested in USAT than Aristo because I like the product selection, the quality and the detail better. But you know, we all love G scale so i say buy what you like, run trains and enjoy them for what they are!


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

I think anyone could find an example of an out of production road name that cannot be gotten. 

The part WAS available for your USAT loco, the shell.... the specific, out of production color scheme was not. That is an unrealistic expectation. If you have a car out of production, and you order a plastic trim piece for the interior, you will find that it comes in black and you have to paint it to match. 

Again the part is available, just has to be painted to match. 

Do any of you Aristo people remember how long we (and Marty) bugged Aristo for brake wheels for box cars? We were happy to get them in any color. 

By the way, I talked to Charlie Ro yesterday at the BTS about parts. Not putting Aristo down, just asked him how USAT views parts and how they are able to do it.


He said: "We stock parts as a service to our customers"... He did now whine about the costs, or difficulty.

He did indicated that they were not losing money, and yes, it takes some work to warehouse and inventory them.

But remember the first thing from his mouth: "a service to our customers"....


Regards, Greg


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## aceinspp (Jan 2, 2008)

In my book if a company has a warranty for the product then parts should be available plain and simple. So what is so hard to understand for a company that they need parts. Later RJD


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## krs (Feb 29, 2008)

Posted By aceinspp on 22 May 2011 01:12 PM 
In my book if a company has a warranty for the product then parts should be available plain and simple.


Warranty has nothing to do with making parts available to the enduser - not for any product.
The warranty obligation typically is to repair or replace a defective product or refund the purchase price within the warranty period.


I just had to throw out a $100+ steam cleaner because a $5.- switch became defective.

I found out who the switch manufacturer was, they refused to sell me the part - they only sell to OEMs.
And the company who made the steam claener wanted more to repair it than what a new one would cost if one includes the shipping costs back and forth.

In the past, we in G-Scale I think had great spare parts service, at least with the manufacturers I have dealt with, but that seems to be drying up.
The reply I now usually get is to return the item under warranty and have it fixed or replaced - not always practical.


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## aceinspp (Jan 2, 2008)

Well KRS don't know what to tell ya but they are obligated to fix or repair or replace so it goes back to either parts or replace but a warrenty is a warranty. Sounds like your ran out. Later RJD


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## Chris France (Jan 3, 2008)

Greg, sure a shell might have been available in a different roadname, but I would have had to BUY it. That's what ticked me off. Why should I have to pay to replace a defective body shell?


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Yeah, I agree, you should have gotten an undec shell free. I assume this was in warranty? 

Greg


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## Chris France (Jan 3, 2008)

Unfortunately it was two years old, so I was out of the extensive 1 year warranty. That's why I didn't argue any further with them, but I still feel I got the short end of the stick. I don't run it anymore and have debated trying to sell it. My remaining USA engines are great, I have 2 S-4s that are among my favorites and a GP-9 none of which have I had any problems with. I know, however, that if I ever do have a problem with them that I'm on my own.


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## Pterosaur (May 6, 2008)

Problem with most warranties in G-scale is we, the experienced user, often know what is wrong and find it cheaper to fix it ourselves. My Aristo motor blocks don't "whine" but I have had several USA ones "whine" like dentist drills. It is cheaper for me to just buy a replacement motor block than to pay for shipping the heavy engine both ways (not to mention the risk of shipping damage compounding a problem). I'm just happy the parts are available. Unless it's "dead" out of the box I rarely return anything for service...Quicker and cheaper to fix it myself. 

Note: There is no malice toward any manufacturer in the above. Love USA, love Arito...Both for different reasons.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

So Chris, even though you didn't like it, it was out of warranty, and you knew (or could know) the warranty beforehand. I have a couple of F units that have had peeling paint also. They were also out of warranty. 

In this case I have to agree with USAT. Do I think the paint should last 10 years? Yes. Does it usually? Yes. 

Greg


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## Chris France (Jan 3, 2008)

I'm not arguing that they were technically right according to their policy. Only offering a comparison against other companies with 5 year warranties that usually make an effort to help make the customer happy in similar situations, some times even when things are not under warranty anymore. Some were extolling the virtues of USA customer service, I was offering a differing opinion.


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## Mik (Jan 2, 2008)

Having spent the last 3 days trying to either defuse a fight, get folks to work together towards a solution, or simply be left alone. I will offer this bit of observation..... When you choose to get involved AT ALL, either you're part of the problem, or you're part of the solution. Complaining about what the Polks (or any other mfger). cannot or choose not to do is --- which? 

I suggested a few days ago that those who think there is this huge need for Aristo parts to start parting out 2nd hand Aristo locos themselves and maybe cast a few detail parts. Folks have done that with 0-scale Lionel and AF for DECADES. It's now a pretty big cottage industry. So why is it a "stupid idea" in LS? Because it ISN'T about the PARTS, you really, really just enjoy griping? Because that would require YOU to actually become part of the solution, and perhaps tie YOUR money rather than someone else's up? Because you expect everybody else to kiss your butt and cater to your whims with no effort from you? Or just because da Mikster suggested it? 

If it's a "stupid idea" for you to "fill the need" by going into biz and doing it yourself. Then there ISN'T really a NEED and it's an equally stupid idea to expect Aristo to stock beyond what they reasonably expect to need for warantee work, too. You cannot usually get parts directly from Nintendo or Mattel either. 


If you like Aristo, buy Aristo. If parts availability is your primary concern, then buy off another mfg or start a parts biz. It isn't YOUR business to tell the Polks how to run THEIR business unless you're their consultant. You who see this need that isn't being met, and it bothers you so much, then put YOUR money where your mouth is.... Then let the market decide how right your opinion is. If you aren't willing to become the solution, then....?


If I need a part, I make it, or buy a parts loco, or try to swap for what I need, or sell the broken one FOR parts.... or do without. 


Yes, I'm out of sugar coating. And if you choose to get mad, ask yourself why.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Actually, their customer service was fine... and that's my "rub" here... their warranty is not as long... you really need to be fair, especially if you are coming into a thread about something specifically Aristo and trying to make a counterpoint. 

This thread is about Aristo complaining about how hard it is to have parts, and other manufacturers have no problems having parts, and they are all from the same company. 

Your experience has really nothing to do with the topic, nor really customer service. 

Greg


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## Joe Mascitti (Oct 30, 2008)

Here is my .75 cents (the government gets the other 1.25).....anyways....if a company wants to charge out the ass for products, and have 10%+ price increases, they better have parts to fix their products....even under the most careful handing stuff brakes....if I pay $400.00 for a dash 9 and have to wait 2, 3,4,5,6+ months for parts, that's a problem......most of the parts requested costs pennies to produce in bulk, so cost is an excuse... The only excuse that i have not heard for not having parts is "It is Bush's fault"......

Joe


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## Truthman (Dec 13, 2008)

Posted By Chris France on 23 May 2011 06:30 AM 
Unfortunately it was two years old, so I was out of the extensive 1 year warranty. That's why I didn't argue any further with them, but I still feel I got the short end of the stick. I don't run it anymore and have debated trying to sell it. My remaining USA engines are great, I have 2 S-4s that are among my favorites and a GP-9 none of which have I had any problems with. I know, however, that if I ever do have a problem with them that I'm on my own. Send me a PM and maybe I can buy it?


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## krs (Feb 29, 2008)

Posted By aceinspp on 22 May 2011 04:36 PM 
Well KRS don't know what to tell ya but they are obligated to fix or repair or replace so it goes back to either parts or replace but a warrenty is a warranty.


Yes - "fix or repair or replace" if within the waranty period but there is no obligation to make parts available to the enduser - that was my point.

I just had two situations with damaged items in G-Scale, one from LGB the other from Kiss.
I could not get spare parts in either case, in one case they offered a free replacement of the whole car, in the other a refund since they were sold out of those cars.
I didn't really want a refund or a replacement car - I just wanted the part to replace the broken one in each case, but that apparently wasn't possible.

Maybe in the end it's cheaper for these companies to just refund/replace items under warranty rather than stock a multitude of spare parts.
Sales volume of G-Scale has dropped drastically compared to years ago when tens of thousands of just one specific item were sold, so I would think the need for replacement parts has also dropped by a similar amount.


Knut


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## Mik (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Joe Mascitti on 23 May 2011 09:26 AM 
Here is my .75 cents (the government gets the other 1.25).....anyways....if a company wants to charge out the ass for products, and have 10%+ price increases, they better have parts to fix their products....even under the most careful handing stuff brakes....if I pay $400.00 for a dash 9 and have to wait 2, 3,4,5,6+ months for parts, that's a problem......most of the parts requested costs pennies to produce in bulk, so cost is an excuse... The only excuse that i have not heard for not having parts is "It is Bush's fault"......

Joe 


Part I - Having read Aristo's warantee. If it breaks, they will AT THEIR OPTION 1. Fix it. 2. Replace it. Said replacement MAY OR MAY NOT be the same roadname OR even the same locomotive, as long as it is of equal or greater value. ALL of these fulfill their legal warranty obligations. Your (possibly unreasonable) expectations of parts, or EXACT replacement, or even objections to the cost of shipping, DO NOT enter into the equation.

Part II - While these bits may cost 'pennies to produce', they also cost not insignificant money to ship, to store, to sort, to inventory, to pull and inspect, to ship again. IF a company CHOOSES to make these available to the consumer, then that is THEIR option. IF they choose NOT to, that is also their option. --AND-- YOU can always choose to buy of their competition if you don't like their policy. If enough folks vote with their wallets the company will revisit their choices, or fail.


Part III - Having dealt with foundries, and having owned my own business. The LAST thing these folks want to do is to lose money. Right now they see excess inventory and small orders/production runs of parts as a money loser. 


Whinging about their choices is easy. So is gambling with somebody else's money. Until you've BEEN there, IMO all the 'shoulda, coulda, wouldas' that have been presented have about as much value as marital counseling from a priest, or child rearing advice from somebody who doesn't have any. And I really don't give a rip if you choose to disagree with that statement either. When I was in biz I met too many folks who'd pretty much gripe if you GAVE them a $100 bill - because it was wrinkled.


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

See, When people like us turn up the HEAT......... Things do get done to benefit the hobby and some of the cry babys out there.

Example A......... 


Mallet parts	
p21600-12	smoke box door
p21600-101	drive box pivot
p21600-102	bolster
p21600-103	bolster
p21600-35	safety valve
p21600-39	cab vent
p21600-63	cab lower support
p21600-64	rear step
p21600-71	rh rear piping
vanderbilt tender	
p21850-06	front deck and steps
p21850-11	rear ladder
p21850-14	lamp housing
p21850-15	light lens van.tender
p21850-17	short platform
p21850-18	waterfill hatch
p21850-19	long platform
mallet parts	
p21600-166	pilot mallet
p21600-	motor w/ hex
p21600-112	drive axle flywheel
p21600-37	generator
p21600-38	lubricator dry pipe
p21600-119	screw 
p21600-120	short main drive rod lh 
p21600-121	short main drive rod 
p21600-43	hand rail stanchion 
p21600-23	hand rail lh 
p21600-14	bell harp 
p21600-26	front steam pipes rh 
p21600-31	front steam pipes rh 
p21600-33	whistle 
p21600-36	steam valve aux 
p21600-72	distributer valve rh 
p21600-04	forward grab iron lh 
p21600-05	forward grab iron rn 
p21600-09	rear grab iron rh 
p21600-10	rear grab iron lh 
p21600-13	light bulb 
p21600-20	short hand rail stanchion
p21600-21	long hand rail stanchion
p21600-22	hand rail right hand
p21600-13	bell 
p21600-110	front & rear wheels
p21600-152	front railing
p21850-28	5 watt 8 ohm speaker
p21600-155	headlight
p21600-07	cab window rear
p21600-08	cab sliding window
p21600-117	long main drive rod lh
p21600-118	long main drive rod rh
p21600-126	main eccentric crank
p21600-15	number board lh
p21600-156	headlight lens
p21600-166	number board rh
p21600-22	marker light assembly rh
p21600-23	marker light assembly lh 


And to all the koolaiders and others out there looking for parts, your Welcome









Your Buddy Always

Nicky


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

Posted By Mik on 23 May 2011 11:06 AM 
Posted By Joe Mascitti on 23 May 2011 09:26 AM 
Here is my .75 cents (the government gets the other 1.25).....anyways....if a company wants to charge out the ass for products, and have 10%+ price increases, they better have parts to fix their products....even under the most careful handing stuff brakes....if I pay $400.00 for a dash 9 and have to wait 2, 3,4,5,6+ months for parts, that's a problem......most of the parts requested costs pennies to produce in bulk, so cost is an excuse... The only excuse that i have not heard for not having parts is "It is Bush's fault"......

Joe 


Part I - Having read Aristo's warantee. If it breaks, they will AT THEIR OPTION 1. Fix it. 2. Replace it. Said replacement MAY OR MAY NOT be the same roadname OR even the same locomotive, as long as it is of equal or greater value. ALL of these fulfill their legal warranty obligations. Your (possibly unreasonable) expectations of parts, or EXACT replacement, or even objections to the cost of shipping, DO NOT enter into the equation.

Part II - While these bits may cost 'pennies to produce', they also cost not insignificant money to ship, to store, to sort, to inventory, to pull and inspect, to ship again. IF a company CHOOSES to make these available to the consumer, then that is THEIR option. IF they choose NOT to, that is also their option. --AND-- YOU can always choose to buy of their competition if you don't like their policy. If enough folks vote with their wallets the company will revisit their choices, or fail.


Part III - Having dealt with foundries, and having owned my own business. The LAST thing these folks want to do is to lose money. Right now they see excess inventory and small orders/production runs of parts as a money loser. 


Whinging about their choices is easy. So is gambling with somebody else's money. Until you've BEEN there, IMO all the 'shoulda, coulda, wouldas' that have been presented have about as much value as marital counseling from a priest, or child rearing advice from somebody who doesn't have any. And I really don't give a rip if you choose to disagree with that statement either. When I was in biz I met too many folks who'd pretty much gripe if you GAVE them a $100 bill - because it was wrinkled.


What !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! are you talking about again ?


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

Posted By Joe Mascitti on 23 May 2011 09:26 AM 
Here is my .75 cents (the government gets the other 1.25).....anyways....if a company wants to charge out the ass for products, and have 10%+ price increases, they better have parts to fix their products....even under the most careful handing stuff brakes....if I pay $400.00 for a dash 9 and have to wait 2, 3,4,5,6+ months for parts, that's a problem......most of the parts requested costs pennies to produce in bulk, so cost is an excuse... The only excuse that i have not heard for not having parts is "It is Bush's fault"......

Joe 


All good points Joe.


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

OOOOO And Uncle Lewis, How about a few body and cabs shells for just in case problems.









Your Diehard Fan.

Nicky


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## Joe Mascitti (Oct 30, 2008)

Mik...you said you were in business...are you still in business?. IF you are a company that produces a product, then you are obligated to have spare parts available. So, we should be glad that car manufactures stock replacement parts, or you car may be sitting in the driveway for 6 months waiting on a part..... There is not that much $$ tied up in parts that cost pennies to produce...Is Aristo loosing money on producing replacement parts, or ar they loosing money because they basically have no product on the market? How many of us put down deposits on products that were promised in 2010 and still have not been made? You want a dash 9, well you better like SF or UP because that's all that is there? You want a gp-40...good luck...you want an sd-45 good luck....


They don't lose money on stocking replacement parts, they lose money on not having product and it does not take a genius to figure that out. How many of us would spend $$ right now looking for a specific item that is not available and may not be available for 6 months? Put the product on the market, have the parts available for us to get and revenue will go thru the roof.... plain and simple....



Joe


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## Mik (Jan 2, 2008)

No, Joe. I am NOT in business. You wanna know why? I had a supplier that carefully hid his financial distress do a bunk owing me a few thousand dollars worth of undelivered and paid order, and was basically told tough sh-- by the Ohio Atty Gen. I had 4 guys fraudulently charge back a few more thousand against their CCs after their orders were shipped, delivered, and signed for (not their siggies, they said). I got 2 largish bad checks at shows that I was informed that I had to drive to the other end of the country to sue to try to collect on. I got ZERO help from the bank and CC companies to resolve ANY of these. AND 'real' sales were way, way down due to that nice little hiccup called a recession. 

I just couldn't survive those kinds of combined losses. You're welcome to criticize me..... IF you could eat nearly $8K and smile. 

AND, since I was IN the hobby sector, just about everyone's attitude was that it "wasn't a REAL business"... except for the tax man and the bill collector. 

As I said, Aristo OWES you a warantee fix or replacement if it's broken. They don't OWE you anything else. They OWE you a refund on yourpre production deposit only if THEY, not somone else collected it AND they decide not to produce the product. You cancelling your pre-order falls under the terms of the contract. You can WANT whatever your little heart desires, but until it's YOUR name on the masthead and signature paying the bills, those wants simply don't mean all that much... especially from a legal standpoint. 

Bottom line, YOU can always start a toy train manufacturer or parts company. YOU can always buy out Lewis too - if you got deep enough pockets. YOU could always contract a run of 100 units to be special painted,or 500-1000 of whatever different unproduced model -- And YOU can TRY to negotiate whatever stipulations you desire IF you wanna pay for it... possibly in advance. 

Those automobile comparisons are a canard, and a lousy one at that. MOST parts for them are outsourced - the OEM supplier (and low budget copycats), not the auto company makes all those extra bits to sell to the parts stores. The auto company orders them as needed as part of another large order. They also have production runs of similar units in the tens or hundreds of thousands, use the same parts across MANY models, and cost a LOT more than "$400" No, I'm NOT going to explain all the economies involved, but the differences are legion, and they are huge. It's not even apples to oranges, it's apples to airplanes.


Also how much of those griped about 'price increases' folks mentioned were due to the increased cost of raw materials, or transport? If you expect the company to just absorb it, dream on. You don't stay in biz long at a loss... unless you're the US Congress. If you didn't get a CoLA to match, complain to your union rep. 


Just face the fact that reality rarely chooses to kiss your butt unless you're paying a LOT of cash for it, and work from there.


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## Dave Meashey (Jan 2, 2008)

"If you expect the company to just absorb it (_increasing cost _), dream on." 

I remember as a kid in the mid-1950s that Hershey was trying to hold the price of the almond bar to $0.10. The bar originally had whole almonds in it. Then the bar went to half almonds. Finally the bar had slivered almonds. My Mama worked in the wrapping room at Hershey Chocolate. One day I asked her, "Mama. why do the almond bars only have slivered almonds when they used to have whole almonds?" Mama responded, "Because honey, a full almond would not fit into the molds." The chocolate factory had gradually been decreasing the size of the molds for those bars to keep the price at $0.10 per bar. As part of that process, the almonds had to be slivered so they would stay in the chocolate. 

After several years of this exercise in futility, Hershey Chocolate learned that it was better to keep the bars the same size and increase the cost per unit. 

Yours, 
David Meashey


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## Joe Mascitti (Oct 30, 2008)

Lets see...produce a product, sell a product, accept payment for the product...and if it breaks....umm...it will be 6 months until we produce that part etc, etc....I don't give a hoot about legal, balance sheets, etc...etc...that's for those who started the company to figure out, and the successful ones figure it out before(or soon there after) they start their business... For all of those who do not think it is a company's obligation to provide replacement parts, let's just make it simple for you to understand....it's bush's fault....now it's all clear.....


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## Ltotis (Jan 3, 2008)

A manufacturer of a product should have replacement parts in stock. If they run out and they need to wait until they rerun the item that the part is for is something I can agree with them about. If an item is still under warranty and no parts are available then the should replace the entire product based on what is stated in their warranty. We all agree on that. Should they have parts for items made ten years ago, maybe. One way for a manufacturer to decide on what parts are needed to support a product is to see what has been the usage of parts by the repair department to support the product. It is up to them on how they spend their money though. 
I remember having to wait for IBM to bring a keyboard in from Mexico to repair a Thinkpad Laptop under warranty as there were supposedly not any in the US available unless I wanted to send the laptop in to them. Here in MAssachusetts there was an owner of a new car that was within warranty who had to wait for a part to repair his new car. It died and the Car Manufacturer did not have a replacement for over 3 or 4 months. The dealer did give the person a loaner to drive. It wasn't until a local news organization contacted the manufacturer that the part all of a sudden became available. 
LAO


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## Mik (Jan 2, 2008)

If it breaks, send it back and they will replace it with something else. I'm sorry, but obviously YOU rejected that option, not them.

So we have determined (ad nauseum) that the part is NOT in stock, nor do they currently have a warranty return parts loco that they can strip to get it......... Now, in case you missed it, I'll remind you that Aristo does NOT have ANY of their molding done in-house.-- So YOU now are actually expect them to call their supplier, have them pull the mold, bump whatever project said supplier is currently doing, just to run a few of whatever part you need TODAY? Industry simply does NOT work that way. Oh sure, it CAN be done. If you really, REALLY want a $2,000 to $20,000 part for your $400 train. Kader (the folks in China) makes stuff for a LOT of companies. They schedule production runs for each one in rotation months in advance. Disruptions to their schedule costs extra... a LOT extra. As in, "you could easily buy a few cases of trains for the cost of that part" extra. Think the Chinese are bad? Most US foundries won't even consider a run of less than 500 sets of parts anymore... and an order that small gets fit in when they eventually get a break in their other work.


Another consideration. Most detail parts are on a plate/die that makes not just those, but several OTHER parts as well. Plan on paying for those, too. 


When I need a part that's currently unavailable from the manufacturer, I make it, I trade for it, I buy a parts loco to get it, I sell the broken one, I wait for it, or I run it without. Why? Because I understand the realities of the situation. Complaining won't change anything. There is NOT enough volume in LS to change the economies of scale to MAKE stocking and storing parts that you probably WON'T sell profitable enough to offset that it could inconvenience to the


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## aceinspp (Jan 2, 2008)

Does not really matter about in house moldings. When you run the unit then make the part. Plain and simple. I waited two years for a fuel tank for my LS. As I said you do not buy a car if there is no warranty or parts to fix it. I can see ya fabricating a micky mouse part to keep it running but now you have just voided the warranty. Later RJD


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## Del Tapparo (Jan 4, 2008)

I think this one has been beaten to death .............


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## Joe Mascitti (Oct 30, 2008)

I agree...


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## markoles (Jan 2, 2008)

Isn't that what this is all about? Whining and complaining?


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

Posted By Mik on 24 May 2011 09:21 AM 
If it breaks, send it back and they will replace it with something else. I'm sorry, but obviously YOU rejected that option, not them.

So we have determined (ad nauseum) that the part is NOT in stock, nor do they currently have a warranty return parts loco that they can strip to get it......... Now, in case you missed it, I'll remind you that Aristo does NOT have ANY of their molding done in-house.-- So YOU now are actually expect them to call their supplier, have them pull the mold, bump whatever project said supplier is currently doing, just to run a few of whatever part you need TODAY? Industry simply does NOT work that way. Oh sure, it CAN be done. If you really, REALLY want a $2,000 to $20,000 part for your $400 train. Kader (the folks in China) makes stuff for a LOT of companies. They schedule production runs for each one in rotation months in advance. Disruptions to their schedule costs extra... a LOT extra. As in, "you could easily buy a few cases of trains for the cost of that part" extra. Think the Chinese are bad? Most US foundries won't even consider a run of less than 500 sets of parts anymore... and an order that small gets fit in when they eventually get a break in their other work.


Another consideration. Most detail parts are on a plate/die that makes not just those, but several OTHER parts as well. Plan on paying for those, too. 


When I need a part that's currently unavailable from the manufacturer, I make it, I trade for it, I buy a parts loco to get it, I sell the broken one, I wait for it, or I run it without. Why? Because I understand the realities of the situation. Complaining won't change anything. There is NOT enough volume in LS to change the economies of scale to MAKE stocking and storing parts that you probably WON'T sell profitable enough to offset that it could inconvenience to the


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## Doug C (Jan 14, 2008)

I could use at least 40 brake wheels similiar to what is mounted on the AC evans and 100T cars !! 


doug c


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Just refreshing the original link to the Aristo forum, since they changed the url to the forums, all old links are bad:



*http://w...



Not *trying to start this all over.. just fixing references for people who may read this stuff and want to see what the official opinion on parts is.

Greg


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Repair parts as far as the eye can see. Infinite, infinite, infinite.


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## Totalwrecker (Feb 26, 2009)

Yeah Bob, but a tad expensive for a single part we each need. 
When ya taking orders? ha ha 

John


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Sure, can I have a couple of E8 horns? 

How about the Aristo Mikado brake hangers? That would basically be impossible without NC added to your setup. 

Greg


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