# LGB - RHB GE 4/4 II Electric Locomotive "KLOSTERS"



## Merlin83 (Sep 23, 2011)

I have waited a long time to find the right pre-owned LGB RhB locomotive, and I have finally found one. I am so excited to add this to my ongoing collection of LGB trains. I'm just wondering if there are any specific recommendations by others for either passenger cars or freight cars I should be hauling around the track ? Although what I do is only a hobby - I do strive to make what I pull and how I operate my rail road as real and accurate as possible...as best I can - even though for now there's track run around all over the place in a section of the house


There are many RhB LGB passenger cars available on eBay - and I have looked and compared many of the pictures from RailPictures.net - but just want to know, can I basically add any passenger or freight car with the "Klosters" GE 4/4 ?

Also, are there any recommendations for enhancing the sound (or overall appearance or performance ? I am all analog (for now) and just wondered if add-on card from a company like Phoenix would be good ?

Thank You,
Brett


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## Cougar Rock Rail (Jan 2, 2008)

Hi Brett, 

Fortunately your first RhB locomotive is one of the most versatile one of all and has been used to haul pretty much all their rolling stock at one time or another. I guess it depends how fussy you want to get. For example, your locomotive has round headlights and black undercarriage, which were gradually updated to rectangular ones and gray undercarriage (say like the LGB #618 Ge4/4ii), so that would date your locomotive to a certain period of rolling stock. If you're not going to worry about details like that, then pretty much anything RhB that LGB makes goes. There are some exceptions, where LGB made reprints of passenger cars that are nothing like the real RhB rolling stock. 

Here's an example of something I would avoid: 
http://www.gbdb.info/details.php?image_id=1427&l=english 

Any derivative of these are fine and can be found for reasonable prices on Ebay: 

http://www.gbdb.info/details.php?image_id=1679&l=english 

And any of the Fad hoppers, sliding door cars, box cars etc. are good too. 

As for sound, you could go Phoenix but I would be tempted to put in a modern sound decoder since the price will be about the same and you will have the motor control and sound working together. Massoth or Zimo are good and will operate well under DC and then if you ever go DCC you'll be ready to roll.

Keith


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## mbendebba (Jan 22, 2011)

Merlin: 

if you want to have a good prototypical sound without converting the loco to DCC, I recommend the Massoth S sound module. The module can give up to 10 different sounds in analog module, and is as easy to install as connecting 2 wires to track power. If you ever decide to go to DCC, the S module is also suitable for DCC operation. 

I recommend a visit to the Massoth website to learn more about the S sound module. 

Mohammed 
http://www.massothusa.com 
http://www.allaboutlgb.com


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## Axel Tillmann (Jan 10, 2008)

When adding sound the question always arises, would you enjoy correct protopical sound, or do you just want to sound it like an elektro engine, and you don't care which?

Mostly poeple enjoy on any sound installtion the idea that if they would ever ride on trains with that enginem, they recognize correct or incorrect sounds of their model.

SoundDesign's Heinz Daeppen is with his studio work a master of many American Steam sounds and RhB. Being Swiss of course he has a close vacinity to everything Swiss and his personal interst lies in US railroads.

I can guarantee you that ridiing a Ge 4/4 II on the RhB and having his sound implementation are as close to identrical as possible. I enjoy those sounds which bring back great memroies of riding ont he RhB. Also watching YouTube videos of the real stuff and then its counter part implementations from various vendor you might come to the conclusion of many before you that they lioke the realism of the Daeppen sounds.

Daeppen Sounds are exclusively in ZIMO decoders, which are the most modern decoders on the market right now. MX695x series just enterd the market and replaced the MX690 and has all the latest bills and whistles in the decoders, coupled with the smoothed operation one wants.

Searching on YouTube for Ge 4/4 II with ZIMO sound will always give you Daeppen sound bites.


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## Merlin83 (Sep 23, 2011)

Thank you for all of the great replies - as always I get a great response from the other fellows on the forum. I am interested in pursuing the add-on of a sound card and comfortable with things electric/electronic and mechanical in nature. That being said I also want to make the first time I open a 'new' loco - a positive one - 

So here's what I need help on - of the the two the Massoth or the Zimo, which one will be easier for the 1st timer ? And also, this is mostly for the nice folks at Train-Li - the nickel track, from the Train-Li website I see (I think) 50 feet of nickel track available. Is that right ? and can I simply add that onto my existing LGB brass track without any issues ?

And I had one other question too:

And perhaps this should be asked in the DCC forum - But there is the DCC approach control with 'main' control box and then hand-held 'navigator' units. And then I have seen that there is a lot of PC software out there to control your lay-out. It appears that with a serial connection (DB9 or USB) to a main control box you can use the software to write out a CV value directly to loco's with decoders and also issue write commands to the main control unit to manage the switches.


So which is better ? Seems like you could layer in the software to write out values and validate the registers with a read command for CV values you have changed in a particular loco - and then have the graphical ability to see the state of your switches and other control mechanisms to semi-automate your lay-out. I see that LGB was just starting to do this with their LGB computer module - and that I think Massoth still makes this little blue box - although the LGB Windows based software looked a bit 'wonk' - like perhaps it was the first version ?


I still like the analog control I have now - but very much want to be able to semi-automate the switches and gates - I have read through a ton of LGB documentation and basically can probably create some simply circuits with an add-on supplementary switch (relay), I just have not bought any yet. I pay my bills working in the world of power metering and data acquisition - so taking the next step in controlling my railroad is something that very much interests me.



Thank You,
Brett


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## mbendebba (Jan 22, 2011)

Brett: 
My answer to you is based on the following premise: you wish to continue with an analog operation and you want to add sound to an LGB 22430 RhB GE 4/4 II. 

The Massoth S sound is extremely easy to install, all you need to do is connect the 2 wires attached to it to track power. You can fix the S module in the locomotive by using the 2-sided tape included with module, or you can permanently mount the module onthe lead weights by using screws and spacers we can provide. All Massoth speakers have attached connecting wires that plug directly into the Massoth S decoders. 

You can have the bell and whistle sounds triggered by a magnet (avaialbe from Massoth) affixed to the bottom of the locomotive and reed switches (available from LGB) embedded in the track. In analog mode, you will hear the squealing of the brakes as the locomotive rolls to a stop, and 6 to 8 other sounds as the locomotive travel around the track. 

BTW: LGB offers a number of products to control lights and switches in analog operations, you can start with the LGB 50750 and LGB 50080 switch boxes. 

Mohammed 
http://www.massothusa.com 
http://www.allaboutlgb.com


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## Axel Tillmann (Jan 10, 2008)

Brett:

Yes you can definately add Nickel plated track to your brass track.

Now one caution to just enhance the Klosters with sound. The Klosters still had the old 3-wire motorblocks. Not knowing your electrical and mechanical skill sets yet, I don't believe that this is difficult to convert and if you contact Train-Li-USA they will send you a PDF on the conversion.

Now another point on sound only upgrade, once you decide to go to DCC, at that poiint in time you need to introduce a DCC docoder (Klosters came only as an analog locomotive). You will be opening up the engine again, and make another modofication, versus doing it right from the get go.

And nver forget modern DCC boards are analog and DCC capable.


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## mbendebba (Jan 22, 2011)

Bret: 

If you do not wish to convert your locomtive for DCC operation, you wouldn't need to convert its motorbloks from 3 to 4 wires to have sound. The Massoth S sound Module can be installed in any LGB locomotive regardless of which type of motorblock it has. 


Converting a Klosters from 3 to 4 leads is relatively easy to do for anyone with the following basic skills: drilling and soldering; a bit of advice from someone who has previously done is generally required. There are several excellent forum postings that can be helpful. 

Iif you wish to have someone else do it for you, there a few of us out there. 

Mohammed 
http://www.allaboutlgb.com 
http://www.massothusa.com


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## Axel Tillmann (Jan 10, 2008)

Brett:

If you only do sound, you can use a smaller and more affordable decoder such as the ZIMO MX 645, MX 646 (all under $100). The only reason why I don't recommend going the "Add a sound only" board is that modern boards drastically enhance your DC experience. I can best describe this with ZIMO tedchnology:

MX695 series of boards use so called upconverters. At 5V track power they upconvert to 10V and hence activate the sound board. At teh same time the motor regulation is delayed, so the engine doesn't move at 5V at all. THis results that you can actually apply 5V to the track and feed the engine enough power to generate sound.

THis results ina more realistic experience, versus the seperation of motor and sound board. If the sound board doesn't control the motor the eninge starts moving as soon as you increase power from the track, and the sound kicks in later.

And of course as previously mentioned, once you go to DCC you have to touch the enigne again. You know how th eold saying goes: 

"A stitch in time saves nine"


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## Merlin83 (Sep 23, 2011)

Ok,

I just got the LGB Klosters yesterday, and I know for sure that I want to add sound to it - to be honest I was a little disappointed it did not have sound 'out-of-the-box' of course I knew this going forward with this purchase of the unit, never the less it's hard to beat the experience I have had with my other LGB locomotives where, right away I get to hear really great and LOUD sounds coming from the locomotives. 


So, if I go *Zimo *or *Massoth *- how do I control the sound ? and what about the *LGB *sound unit that I have seen ? Is that any good ? I notice that unit (the *LGB*) has a small volume control - where is this placed to allow access ? Do you I have to drill an access hole ?

Also, how or where do I mount the speaker ? 


I should have maybe thought this through a little bit more, but I really like the look of the RhB locomotives, the freight cars and passenger cars too - so I kind of just decided to 'jump in' and get started with it.





Thank You,
Brett


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## Axel Tillmann (Jan 10, 2008)

There are several different ways to go about this.

But lets start out in the first place and ask you if you want just some generic electric engine sound or do you want prototypically correct sound? The LGB sound is just a generic electro engine sound. 

Heinz Daeppen (SoundDesign) is the best sound I have heard that really makes you feel like you are next to the real thing. Watch the proper YouTube videos of the Prototype and the Sound Design sounds.

All the driving sounds are automatic in DC and DCC. However, no driving sounds can be triggered but only in DCC with the exception of sounds that can be trigger by track magnet and additional read relays you have to install.

The engine has good space for a nice Visaton speaker FRS7 one of the best in the market for a full and good sound picture.

You need to consider the right sound that start operating without the engine already moving. All of this is accomplished by ZIMO with SoundDesigns sound. However, the Kloster's engine needs to be converted from 3 wire to 4 wire. If you don't want to do this you are loosing the delay of the driving in comparison to the sound. 

If you are OK with that loss you can use a smaller HO decoder from ZIMO ($~100) and you still get the drving sounds.


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