# New scratch built Ortner Hopper begins.



## Dr G (Jan 16, 2008)

Here is my next project. An FEC Ortner rock hopper, a 40 ft 100T steel hopper. The FEC has a lot of 'em, I figured I need at least one!









Here is the prototype:










I could not really figuer a good way to kitbash anything commercially and satisfy the inner rivet counter in me (ironic actually the car is all welded--no rivets).

So I am going the scratch built route. Here is the begining of the frame:










I need some help. First--how much should a 40 ft car weigh to track properly? The NMRA has recommendations for other scales, but I could not find info for 1/29.
Second, I need help finding a good material to do the grating on the end porches. It is really key to the car's character.

Here is the prototype:










I was thinking roof walk from a USA Trains Covered hopper, anyone know where to get some, or any other suggestions would be welcome.

I will post more photos as work progresses. Have patience, I work SLOWLY!!!









Regards,

Matt


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## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

In terms of weight, just put metal wheels on the trucks and you won't have to worry. That's the beauty of large scale. Just the simple amount of material in even the most basic model gives it enough heft to track fairly well. I've got a few flat cars built from basswood--no added weight at all--just metal wheels. If you have concerns, just dump a bunch of bird shot (that's with an "o") down the middle of the center beam. 










Here's a flat car I did from styrene, filling the bolsters with lead bird shot. It tracks very well with just that small amount of weight. 

On the end grates, look at USA Trains. I know their roof walks are open, and a few folks have used them for step treads. I'm not sure if they've got anything that large for an entire end of the car, but it's worth a look. You may be able to glue a bunch of sections side by side to achieve that look. 

Later, 

K


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## Dr G (Jan 16, 2008)

K, 

Great car! Couple of questions--where did you get the shot (sorry--don't own any guns). And second I see you put what looks like a block of wood in the center of the bolster, I am guessing for the truck screw. What size screws do you use and did you have a "post" on the bolster, or just a screw in a "hole" for the truck. Hope that makes sence. 

Matt


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## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

I got the bird shot at the local sporting goods/hunting supply shop. I don't know if the big-box places stock it or not; mine was a mom-and-pop shop. I know next to nothing about guns either (except which end I don't want to be on), so I just asked for the smallest bird shot they had. The shot is around 1/16" diameter. If I'm filling a space like this, I'll mix it with 5-minute epoxy and scoop it in place. If I'm using it to add weight to a boiler, I pour it into a zip-loc bag and then stuff that in the loco. Haven't had a bag break, and if it gets cold, I don't have to worry about the loco getting freezer burn!  

For mounting the trucks, I'm decidedly low tech. A block of wood and a 1 1/4" deck screw. I do pre-drill the wood so not to split it, but once that deck screw bites in, it doesn't come loose over time. I use the deck screws because the heads are large enough to hold a Aristo or Bachmann truck without having to fill the mounting hole with styrene or use some kind of post. The tapered underside of the screw head is also nicely self-centering. (I do have to cut the ends of the screws off for the flat cars so not to stick through the deck.) Generally, I'll tighten on truck down to the point where it can just swivel, and the second one I keep looser so the truck can rock a bit side to side. The Aristo trucks are sprung, so there's a bit of up and down play on them already. The Bachmann ones are rigid, but with just a hint of up-and-down play on one seems to still keep the side-to-side rocking at bay. Even though the threads are coarse, you can really finesse the screw to get the right amount of play. 

Later, 

K


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## Dr G (Jan 16, 2008)

I love it--I really need to think out of the box more!! I was planning on drilling and tapping for a machine screw in a styrene rod post-- I need to try the block of wood and a deck screw!! 

On another note I found 1/2" steel bar stock at Home Deopt that will fit down in the center sill--should add some weight and vanish when painted. I called Charles Ro and they keep the roof walk material for the USA trains coverd hopper on hand--got 3 sets on the way--should work well. 

Thanks for the help, I'll post more photos as work progresses--should be like watching paint dry, or grass grow


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## aceinspp (Jan 2, 2008)

Now these would look good in a unit train. later RJD


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## Dr G (Jan 16, 2008)

Ah you are right, but that means building lots of 'em. I still ain't got one done yet. Now if this were Burl's car, resin castings could make that happen!? 

Matt


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## bruce a m (Jan 2, 2008)

Hi it looks like a good car to make


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## yutzk (Jan 2, 2008)

Matt, 

Cant wait to see the finished project...Im actually now intrigued to build one of these so please post what you did throughout. Conrail has some Ortner's so I might do one or two in there if its do-able.


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## Dr G (Jan 16, 2008)

I'm working on it but it is going slow.







I am putting a lot of detail into the model, I am building it with the intention of entering it in an NMRA model contest. If I build more (when I build more) I think I will simplify the frame, possibly so I can make a resin castings to build multiple cars. I am just not that good at casting yet.

I almost have the basic frame done--I'll try and post pictures this weekend.

Matt


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## Dr G (Jan 16, 2008)

Ok progress this week--VERY SLOW.







Rome wasn't built in a day ya know.

Here is the almost completed frame with trucks and couplers and the frame for each "porch."

Top:









And the bottom detail:










The trucks still need some work--I am going to trim up the bolster and change out the wheels on this model for some semi-scale wheels when they arrive. Normally I would stick with these--factory Aristorcraft steel wheels in rollerbearing trucks. Next I need to add some detail to the frame, and some of the brake piping before moving on to the hoppers--I think I will build one and cast the rest.

Just an observation for those interested--the Kaydee height guage is too low for 1/29, I think it is 1/32. Since all my other equipment is set to this standard, as a compromise to operation this car's coupler is set to the standard Kaydee height. I think there was an article in GR on correcting this, but I never did. It does not bother me much, same as the track guage disparity in 1/29. Guess it is another one of those places where universal standards would help--but I don't think I want to go there!









Thanks for looking. 

Matt


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## DTI356 (Jan 3, 2008)

Matt,

Nice work so far!

You want the Kadee 'G' gauge coupler height gage, not the #1 height gage. 
The #1 is for 1/32 and the 'G' gage one works out correct for 1/29 if you use #1 couplers.
It's all very convoluted.


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## Dr G (Jan 16, 2008)

Brian, 

I think you are correct. However, I used the #1 guage for my lone locomotive (the FEC GP-38-2) and after custom built pilots--it aint gonna change, so I will live with the 1/8" or so difference. Besides, there is no standard height or coupler in this scale so as long as my equipment operates together it don't matter so much. 

I got some USA roof walk from their covered hopper today from Charles Ro. Will be perfect for the porches, couldn't have asked for a better prototype match--not bad for $15.00. 

Matt


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## Michael Smith (Dec 27, 2007)

Dr G, any more progress on the Ortner car? I see them almost daily here in Dania Beach Ft Laud area. I did do a FEC Gondola after taking photos of it at Ft Laud Int Airport siding a couple years ago. And I am now working on a FEC bay window caboose in G scale. It will take a while for that one. I am president of TARR Tradewinds & Atlantic Railroad so that also takes a lot of my time.

Mike


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## harvey (Dec 30, 2008)

A nice little project you have going here. Going slow is alright unless like me you go so slow you forget what you were doing in the first place. Anyway, I'm not sure what track radius you will be using, but depending where your wheels close in on your couplers sometimes you (I) need to remove the side screw holes on the couplers for that little extra clearance.
On coupler height all I do now is slide a 1/8" piece of plasticard between the curved coupler arm and the rail head and that's enough clearance for me. The un-coupler magnets also have no problem with this height.
Have fun and show us more.
Cheers.


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## SD90WLMT (Feb 16, 2010)

This guy dried up...OP opened in 2009...that was..oh ya..many years ago...
Any one know the OP???
Interesting car .. None the less...but...lost in train land me thins...
Someone else want to build us one to watch??

Dirk


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## harvey (Dec 30, 2008)

Hi Dirk,
I guess you're right on this one, I completely missed the dates. The project nevertheless looks very interesting and it would certainly be nice to find out if he ever completed it.
Cheers.


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