# Aristo-Craft 2-8-0 Consolidation



## Jerry McColgan (Feb 8, 2008)

I saw what Navin said is a production model of the new Aristo-Craft 2-8-0 Consolidation at the NGRC. This was the first I had seen of the Consolidation that was not a photo of a partially painted pre-production model.

I liked what I saw. Compared to the new Pacific and Mallet the Consolidation was noticeably smaller (which pleased me). I was also pleased with the fact that it was running very quietly and the PNP connection for the Revolution was right under the coal load so it should be very easy to install a Revolution in it as I intend to.

As it happens the loco Aristo had running at their display was the Undecorated version which is the same as what I have on order. I had been expecting the 2-8-0's to be shipped around the end of the year but now I have found that they are already being shipped to the distributors so I am expecting the two that I have on order to arrive any day now. 

If they run as well as the Pacific a friend bought recently I will be very happy. Al loves his new Pacific.

I will post photos and add more as soon as they get here.

Jerry


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## Jerry McColgan (Feb 8, 2008)

FedEx just left and the Consolidations are here.









So far I have one out of the box and soon the other will be out as well.

My first reaction is that they look identical to the one I saw at the NGRC.

I will post more later but first I have to go play with them.

Jerry


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## Adam Anderson (Apr 21, 2011)

Pictures Please. Thank you.

Adam


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## Jerry McColgan (Feb 8, 2008)

I got the Connies out of the box and onto the track to take these photos but it is a zillion degrees outside (notice how all the little people have collapsed from heat exhaustion) so as soon as I took the photos I closed up the boxes, put the locos in the Train Barn and came back inside to the air conditioning.










My first impression is that I like them. I think they are perfect for what I wanted - plain Jane work locomotives such as were used on dozens of old Arkansas railroads.










There were a few extra goodies in the box but I just picked them up and stashed them with the locos. I'll figure out what they are for later.










My biggest surprise was to discover they have ENGINEERS inside them. I thought this was something new until I went to put them away and discovered the GP-40s also had engineers. I wonder when Aristo started doing this?

It was too hot to even think about putting power to the tracks (maybe in the morning). I still need to get sound systems for them as I had been hoping the new Aristo sound might have become available in time to use it. I'm not even sure if I have Revolutions to put in them as I finished my last installation a long time ago.

I noticed that someone brought up an old topic by Paul Burch about the Consolidations. 

http://www.mylargescale.com/Communi...spx#224013

I did not know it was there but that is good because it appears that Paul has a couple Consolidations coming as well. Perhaps he will want to do some sort of advanced evaluation of these locos and I think he will do a fair job of it.

For me, my plans don't go much further than slapping Revolutions in them, adding Dallee sound systems to them and putting a couple of little trains together to pull with them just like the original ones did.

I'm not sure which Dallee sound I will go with. I wonder if the small steam loco sound will be too little? I may go with two different sounds so I can tell one Connie from the other by the sound it makes. I will probably phone Dallee and see what they recommend.

If anyone should happen to have any particular questions about these locos feel free to ask and I will try to help as long as it does not involve taking anything apart to get an answer. I hate working on (any of) my trains and I try to avoid doing any unnecessary work on them or taking them apart. Removing screws from plastic locos have a bad habit of stripping out the threads (any Chinese made products) when removed so I do my best to never remove any screws I don't have to.

Taking photos are fine. I can do that and upload them either in high or low resolution if anyone needs them.

Jerry


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## NTCGRR (Jan 2, 2008)

Connie,, man am I slow. I won't buy one for sure now. Nothing with a sissy name. 
Boy , wonder how I ever put two and two together???


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## Totalwrecker (Feb 26, 2009)

Can't we Consol you?


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## Pterosaur (May 6, 2008)

Those boilers look way to high. 

Sorry!!!  

I am dying to know how they run, you have way more self control than I do! They really do look nice. I'm hoping these will be good replacements for my Lionel Atlantics...I love the size of the 4-4-2 but they're...well...Lionel Atlantics. 

Who did you order yours through?


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## Jerry McColgan (Feb 8, 2008)

Posted By NTCGRR on 08 Jul 2011 03:28 PM 
Connie,, man am I slow. I won't buy one for sure now. Nothing with a sissy name. 
Boy , wonder how I ever put two and two together??? Sissy is as sissy does. I never cared much for the look of Moguls and Consolidations preferring passenger locos but all the dang books I read about old railroads are Mogul this and Connie that. Worse yet it appears that almost all of the old Arkansas railroads used doggone Moguls and Connies for everything - even pulling passenger trains. Didn't anyone tell them they were NOT supposed to do that?

Heck, the Connie - thats CONNIE - I mean CONNIE was the HE MAN of its time. All the Connies put together probably pulled more total freight than those sissy Big Boys running up and down a single mountain.









What Marty is probably wondering is where he would put a battery in the CONNIE's - thats CONNIE's tender.

Heck, you want to talk about sissies - lets talk about AIR CONDITIONED diesels. HE MEN ran STEAM LOCOS like the CONNIE. Yep the CONNIE I say.









Its taken me all these years to force myself to buy an ugly old Connie and I ain't gonna have my new STEAM LOCOs called sissies by anyone running AIR CONDITIONED diesels. Them's fighting words.









Jerry


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## BodsRailRoad (Jul 26, 2008)

Looks like a really nice locomotive.
I wonder if one of the great kitbashers here can lower the boiler to make it more the PRR version, and then post about it?
I have a very special PRR version on it's way and would be very interested in that project (yes I'm to chicken to do it myself first







)
Ron


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## Jerry McColgan (Feb 8, 2008)

Posted By Pterosaur on 08 Jul 2011 03:56 PM 
Those boilers look way to high. 

Sorry!!!  

I am dying to know how they run, you have way more self control than I do! They really do look nice. I'm hoping these will be good replacements for my Lionel Atlantics...I love the size of the 4-4-2 but they're...well...Lionel Atlantics. 

Who did you order yours through? 

Yep! You are right. The boilers do look way too high but so do the boilers on a bunch of old Consolidations I've seen photos of. I think I read somewhere that it had something to do with the size and shape of the firebox. One thing I like about the Connie is its straight boiler. For some reason I like this better than the tapered boilers of older locos.

I think they will be a great improvement over the Lionel Atlantics but for what it is worth I have a couple of old Lionel Rail Camera 0-4-0'Ts that I added a small trailing boxcar with track contacts, inexpensive sound units, LGB smoke units and cheap decoders to and they now run pretty well. Like you say, they are still Lionel's but for the money they were well worth it. I will never understand why Lionel chose the ultra-cheap route when they got into G Scale.

I ordered mine years ago with a deposit down from a dealer who fortunately kept my cost down. I usually shop the main dealers who advertise in Garden Railways and especially those who sponsor MLS. Some give me a bit better price when I buy a lot from them.

Normally in hot weather I check out new stuff on the crawl space layout but when I noticed the Connie does not have any blind drivers I realized I would not be able to run the Connie on it with its 4' and 5' diameter curves. I did not check but I am sure the Connie needs at least 8' diameter curves.

Jerry


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## bottino (Feb 7, 2008)

Jerry, did you run them yet. I am curious how they run. I am still waiting for mine to show up. Aristo has been putting engineers in their diesels for a really long time. My old Uboat even has one. 
Paul


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## Pterosaur (May 6, 2008)

I wish there was a "joke font"...I was 'funnin' about the high boiler. At first it put me off but the more I saw it the more I liked it. I likely mentioned it before but I have an undecorated coming as well. I have some dry transfers for the Duluth Missabe and Iron Range left over from a 4-4-2 re-paint I am hoping will be of appropriate size. Can't wait!


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## Jerry McColgan (Feb 8, 2008)

Posted By bottino on 08 Jul 2011 06:00 PM 
Jerry, did you run them yet. I am curious how they run. I am still waiting for mine to show up. Aristo has been putting engineers in their diesels for a really long time. My old Uboat even has one. 
Paul 



Hi Paul,

No. I have not fired them up yet but I probably will the first thing in the morning when it is not too hot.

I guess I just never noticed about Aristo putting engineers in their locos. At least I did not make a fool out of myself by telling Scott he should do it.

Look for some more info in the morning. I promise to get them fired up.

The one I saw running at the NGRC was VERY smooth and VERY quiet. The same is true of a friend's Pacific that he bought recently and that I put a Revolution and sound in for him.

I am unaccustomed to Aristo locos running quiet out of the box. In the past it took several hours running time for them to quiet down. Heck, maybe that is old hat also.

Jerry


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## Jerry McColgan (Feb 8, 2008)

OK. I fired up the Connies (Consolidations to Marty) and they run very nicely. There are a few comments I think may be worth mentioning.

The instructions say to push down on the back of the coal bunker and lift up. This did not seem to work for me so I used a thin flat screwdriver and lifted up the front of the coal load. All the switches are off so the motor and lights need to be turned on. The track/battery switches were in the track position which was fine.

The loco came with both knuckle and hook and loop couplers. I put the knuckle coupler on one loco and a LGB hook & loop coupler on the other. I was pleased to find they both fit OK.

Then I put both locos on the track and applied power. They both ran very nicely with a full speed range from very slow to way too fast. 

I was a bit surprised that they both have a bit of gear noise (something I always expect with Aristo locos until they get an hour or so running time). I probably would not have noticed if I had the sound systems to put in the locos.

Next I connected 10 Aristo boxcars and a *** caboose to one loco. It pulled them very well - as if it was pulling nothing. With the boxcars attached the gear noise was harder to notice because of the wheel noise.

 Then I connected ten Aristo 53' Evans boxcars to the other along with another *** caboose. The 2-8-0 pulled them but it did not like it. There was a lot of driver slipping. One by one I removed boxcars until I got down to 6 and the train went well enough but the other train was running noticeably faster (they were on the same power supply (straight DC track power). I then removed another 53' Evans boxcar and that made a world of difference. Five Evans boxcars is going to be my max whether it is those cars or cars of similar pulling weight. Since the Evans boxcars have been outside under the old layout for at least a year, the pulling weight may have a lot to do with that and the axles may just need some oil (I did not bother to try it). If someone else wants more pulling power I am sure they could get it by adding some weight to the loco but for my needs I don't need it.

Actually my whole purpose for buying these Connies was to pull little lightweight trains just as the old Connies did in Arkansas. I am perfectly happy with the pulling results.

I did notice that the Connie pulling the heavy load is already running much quieter (probably because the extra weight helped break in the gears). When I sit in the gazebo I don't hear any sound from either loco.

The locos seemed to run very smoothly with no noticeable wobble or anything else but my eyes are not that great anymore and I was not "evaluating" the locos. I just wanted to know if they run to my personal satisfaction and they do.

When I am running the locos straight in front of me I can see the gap under the boiler but the rest of the time I don't notice it at all.

It already has gotten way too hot outside to run them anymore and most days lately it is too hot to run anything at all (for me). I will continue to play with them a bit now and then and eventually put Revolutions and sound systems in them but I am not in any hurry to do that.

Someone mentioned that Aristo has not yet put the instructions up on their website where they can be downloaded so I have scanned them for my own use (so I can read them on my computers without having to go look for the paper copies). If anyone wants or needs a copy, send me an email with your direct return email address and I will email a copy to you.

I will post some photos shortly.

Jerry


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## Jerry McColgan (Feb 8, 2008)

Photos R Us


Oops! The sun made it impossible to see the preview screen on the camera










For me the 40' boxcars look perfect behind the Connie but the 53' Evans boxcars look too modern and too big. To each his own.










I think both Connies look great.










Here is a bit of a closer look.










Sorry but the photos are not great. It was hot outside and so was I.

Jerry


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## bottino (Feb 7, 2008)

Thanks Jerry, they really look good. I think it is significant that they put an engineer in a loco. My Mikado does not have an engineer, so that is interesting that you mentioned it. 
I want mine, but have to wait till I can go up to Star Hobby and pick it up. 

Paul


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## Stan Cedarleaf (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By bottino on 09 Jul 2011 10:30 AM 
{snip} 
I want mine, but have to wait till I can go up to Star Hobby and pick it up. 

Paul 


Are you in the car yet???????


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## vsmith (Jan 2, 2008)

I would think the first bash would be into an 0-8-0 switcher, if this comes with flangless center drivers it could be very successfull as that.


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## Torby (Jan 2, 2008)

Was it a Brazilian degrees?


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## NTCGRR (Jan 2, 2008)

Is there any place to put extra weights other than under the boiler?? Can you weigh it? 

In the boiler should be lots of room.


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

Thanks for the report! 

It ought to be possible to put some more weight, and pull more if you want to. The 2-8-0's that I kitbashed out of mikado drives will pull really well


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## Jerry McColgan (Feb 8, 2008)

Posted By vsmith on 09 Jul 2011 10:40 AM 
I would think the first bash would be into an 0-8-0 switcher, if this comes with flangless center drivers it could be very successfull as that.


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## bottino (Feb 7, 2008)

Stan,
I am waiting for a call, but come Monday morning I will be calling Dan to see what is up. If they are there, I am there.

By the way, will decals work over all those rivets on the tender?

Paul


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## NTCGRR (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Jerry McColgan on 09 Jul 2011 11:19 AM 
Posted By vsmith on 09 Jul 2011 10:40 AM 
I would think the first bash would be into an 0-8-0 switcher, if this comes with flangless center drivers it could be very successfull as that. 


Is this the "dangerous" information Jerry has been telling folks???


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## Stan Cedarleaf (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By bottino on 09 Jul 2011 01:23 PM 
Stan,
I am waiting for a call, but come Monday morning I will be calling Dan to see what is up. If they are there, I am there.

By the way, will decals work over all those rivets on the tender?

Paul 



They sure will, Paul.... Call me and I'll share a secret with you.....


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## Chris France (Jan 3, 2008)

Paul, I called Don at Star today. He said that they had ordered 80 of them and to save on Shipping they were taking a truck up to NJ themselves early this coming week to get them. He said that most likely Weds they would be in. He also said that Dan will be in tomorrow (Sunday) and that I could call back and ask him.


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## Jerry McColgan (Feb 8, 2008)

Posted By Jerry McColgan on 09 Jul 2011 11:19 AM 
Posted By vsmith on 09 Jul 2011 10:40 AM 
I would think the first bash would be into an 0-8-0 switcher, if this comes with flangless center drivers it could be very successfull as that.


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## bottino (Feb 7, 2008)

Thanks Chris. Don told me that they were going up for them when I gave them my deposit. So I wait a couple more days. 
Stan, you ARE the man. I will be in touch.
Paul


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## vsmith (Jan 2, 2008)

3 replies and I still don't see anything. Maybe its on my end.


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## Totalwrecker (Feb 26, 2009)

Invisible ink here too.


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## Jerry McColgan (Feb 8, 2008)

Posted By vsmith on 09 Jul 2011 07:59 PM 

3 replies and I still don't see anything. Maybe its on my end. 


Technical glitch there.

I had been trying to say that the Connie has all flanged drivers. Here are the instruction pages that are related to the track curve capabilities:











ALSO - Note that adding weight may Void the Warranty.[/b]










Jerry


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## Jerry McColgan (Feb 8, 2008)

Posted By Totalwrecker on 10 Jul 2011 01:18 AM 
Invisible ink here too. 

You were supposed to know that if you printed the message and then dipped it in lemon juice the secret message would then appear.

Jeesh! Do I have to explain everything?

Now everyone will know how to read my secret messages.

Thanks a lot.






























Jerry


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## Jerry McColgan (Feb 8, 2008)

STOP THE PRESSES!
 
JERRY DID IT AGAIN - HE GAVE FALSE AND DANGEROUS INFORMATION AND HE OBVIOUSLY IS AN EMPLOYEE, CONTRACTOR OR SHILL (or something yet to be determined) FOR ARISTO-CRAFT (take you pick).








 
I figured something must be wrong with me. Never before have I ever bought a new locomotive, took it out of the box and then decided it was too hot outside to run it.
 
But then a promise is a promise and I did tell Marty I would weigh the Connie. I put it on a scale and it weighs NOTHING. Absolutely nothing! Scales don't lie and I tested the scale on myself (results subject to need-to-know) and the scale works perfectly so as any engineer knows that means the 2-8-0 is WEIGHTLESS!!!
 
OK. I guess there must be a minimum weight and the Connie is less than whatever that happens to be. I guess I will have to find an old analog scale because this digital one does not want to work with an analog loco. Perhaps it would if I put a digital Revolution or decoder in it.








 
Well, while posting the info for vsmith I happened to notice the reference to the front coupler and I figured I might as well put it on even though I've never double headed locos before. After all, how many locos does it take to pull a train around a GARDEN RAILWAY - unless you happen to be Marty and have a layout that spans 3 counties?
 
Well, first ya gotta remove the cow catcher so I did that. Then you put on the knuckle coupler but then I noticed the funny spring and I realized that spring centers the coupler so I put that on. Then I weighed the loco without any luck so now I had a loco with a front coupler. Big deal!
 
Then I remembered I could not pull all those 53' Evans boxcars yesterday and - HEY! I can double head the two Connies - but then those Evans cars were HEAVY and that single Connie had a tough time with them. How good can two Connies be after all?
 
The answer is that two Connies turn a nice new loco into a FANTASTIC new loco (for me anyway) because when I hooked up those Connies they pulled all the Evans cars just like a single Connie was pulling those 40 footers yesterday but MORE IMPORTANT (to me anyway) those two DOUBLE HEADED Connies LOOKED PERFECT as they DOUBLE HEADED around the layout with all of their drivers rotating in synchronized harmony.
 
Best of all (for me) is that it was very common for Connies to pull short trains (as one might run on a garden railway) and it would NOT be unusual for two Connies to be pulling the quantities of cars many of us run on our garden railways. 
 
Now I know what the future of my Connies will be. They will be used to individually pull 10 or so Cotton Belt 40' boxcars and they will also be used to pull up to 20 or more 40' boxcars when I double head them - which will probably be a lot more often than I would have thought. Rather than label the Connies to different railroads I expect that I will be marking both of them as Cotton Belt locos.
 
I would have posted photos but the windows here in the caboose have condensation on them and when I took the camera outside I could not take any photos because it too became covered with condensation.
 
I was pleased to find that when I opened the Train Barn the Connies and everything else was nice and dry inside - no condensation on anything.
 
Photos to come later but in the meantime, my advice is that if your budget can handle it and if you think they will fit and look right on your layout you might want to give serious consideration to buying two of these Connies with the thought of double heading them because IMHO that is when they turn from a nice loco into a fantastic loco while they double head around your layout.
 
After all, who among us has not been transfixed while watching double (and more) headed steam locos chuffing along ahead of long trains or watched videos of steam helper locomotives as they assisted getting trains over the mountains?
 
Now here comes my disclaimer.
 
I have had these locos running for an hour or two. I am NOT doing any sort of evaluation of these locos and I am NOT telling or suggesting to anyone how they should spend their money. I buy and play with toy trains and sometimes they break but most of the time they run and run and run. Time will tell about these Connies - just as with any other new locomotive we buy so it is up to everyone to make their own decisions just as I have made mine.
 
Cheers,
 
Jerry


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## Jerry McColgan (Feb 8, 2008)

These babies are SMOKERS!

If you are getting one (or two) you probably need to be sure that you have some extra smoke fluid.


I took some photos of them pulling 10 of the 53' Evans boxcars but I think they look better here pulling 22 of the 40' single & double door boxcars.










I can't remember but I think that either the single or the double door cars came with ball bearing wheels so I don't know if this is a fair pulling demonstration.










Some one will probably notice the LGB caboose. I like the Aristo Long Steel Caboose for regular trains and the LGB Caboose for long trains 
and the USA Wood Cabooses for trains being pulled by LGB Moguls. No reason other than that I like the way they look.










It is hard to photograph the smoke and here the smoke fluid might have been running low.











OK. The layout is still a mess as is the land around it. I guess my layouts will never make the front page of Garden Railways.









Someone needs to post a video of their Connies double heading with smoke pouring out of them (not me - too much work to figure out how to do it).[/b]

Jerry


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## Jerry McColgan (Feb 8, 2008)

Today I received an email that said in part:

So how do you like those Aristo Consolidations? In the pics I have to admit that they look pretty nice!

My first reaction was - I thought I had explained what I thought about them but then I realized I was saying what I thought now - today - after I bought and paid for them and not what I might be thinking if I had to make the decision today or if I was wanting to run them on a different layout.

So, here is what I said - looking at them from a different perspective:

As for the Connies, once I double headed them I fell in love with them. 

The truth is that I never cared much for the old time locos like the 10 wheelers, Moguls and Consolidations. I only bought LGB Moguls because they worked when nothing else did. I never even looked at a Bachmann Connie seriously (I don't even know what scale it is). I only ordered the Aristo Connies because I wanted a couple of relatively inexpensive (thus Aristo-Craft) small steam locos such as ran on Arkansas railroads. I never even noticed how long it was taking for the Connies to come out because that meant I did not have to come up with the money for them.

Regardless of what some people may think, I never post anything I don't honestly mean. I buy some crap and I just never post anything about it because too often I have found that what I considered to be crap they really liked and enjoyed (like 10 Wheelers and Aristo Classics). It was not that they were crap - they were just inexpensive locos that understandably could not go around my tight curves, steep ramps, and multitude of R1 LGB turnouts while the LGB Moguls (at several times the prices) could.

So far I really like the Connies. When I double headed them I realized that for the first time I now have a couple of steam locos that look right, run well and pull well with the size trains I like to run on my layout.

This is only true and only became possible when I rebuilt and expanded my Caboose Layout to 8' & 10' diameter curves and turnouts along with stainless steel track.

I could not run them on my main layouts because they could never handle the 4' and 5' curves there and it is very doubtful they could handle a steep ramp because of the hump and dip.

I also would be hesitant about running them double headed on brass track because I could not electrically MU them together and I would be concerned about the warranty caution about straining the gears.

You could say that they arrived for me in the perfect moment in time when my layout happens to be perfect for them as well as vice versa.

Regards,

Jerry



Note: The above is a direct quote from my personal email. My use of the word "crap" is nothing more or less than a generic term that represents what I think (Oh! Crap!) when something - anything - does not work as I want or as I intended to use it or that I just plain don't like for any reason whatsoever. There is a distinct difference in my vocabulary between crap - which can apply to the vinegar my wife puts on her French Fries and crappy as applies to something like the overall condition of my layout or the room I happen to be in (OK ANY room I happen to spend a lot of time in).

Jerry


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## vsmith (Jan 2, 2008)

All flanged eh? 8 foot "wider is better" absolute minimum? Well thats a shame they decided to ignore us smaller radius guys, IMHO theres NO real reason something like this couldnt have blind flange center drivers, hundreds real one did, and theres no real reason this couldnt work on track as small as a 5' diameter (bmann connie works). As I said: too late, now too big, for me...Oh Well


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## Stan Cedarleaf (Jan 2, 2008)

They sure look good running together, Jerry...


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## Scottychaos (Jan 2, 2008)

Jerry, 
thanks for the review and the photos!









could I please get you to measure the driver diameter? 
(outside diameter were the drivers touch the rails, not counting the flanges) 
I have a kitbash in mind!  
thanks, 
Scot


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## rmcintir (Apr 24, 2009)

Thanks to everyone posting pictures and videos so far. I've seen actual pictures of a few now: Undecorated, Military, WM, NYC. Anyone have pictures of the others yet? B&O, NH, etc. 

I didn't like the NYC white stripe on the one I saw but could live with it. I would like to see a B&O version. Unfortunately they chose not to make a PRR.  

Sounds like I may need to get an order in soon if I want one. TIA, 

russ


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## NTCGRR (Jan 2, 2008)

Jerry 
they are the wrong scale, I thought we agreed that you are a 1:20th scale man, and you should have 1:20th scale trains ???????


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## Jerry McColgan (Feb 8, 2008)

Posted By NTCGRR on 10 Jul 2011 08:36 PM 
Jerry 
they are the wrong scale, I thought we agreed that you are a 1:20th scale man, and you should have 1:20th scale trains ??????? 
Ummmmmmmmmmmmm,

What scale did you say I am?























You have my phone number. Marilyn is retired and at home these days. How about picking up the phone tomorrow and telling Marilyn that I need to increase the hole I knocked through the brick wall of our house from 1:29 scale to 1:20.3 scale.

Put Carrie on the extension - she will enjoy the conversation and if you can wait until I get back from helping out at the Senior Center I would love to listen in on the extension at this end.









To tell the truth I really LOVED the live steam 1:20.3 K-27 along with the six D&RGW coaches I saw at Diamondhead. I think you should suggest that the hole needs to be big enough for that train don't you?









Heck, I've never used the term before but I'll bet if I could listen in to your conversation with Marilyn I would be LMAO and the sound you would be hearing on your end would be Carrie doing the same. 

Darn, you really are a funny guy. I did not know that.

Jerry

PS I don't remember the guys name but I really liked him and I have not seen him since that time at Diamondhead.


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## Jerry McColgan (Feb 8, 2008)

Posted By rmcintir on 10 Jul 2011 08:30 PM 
Unfortunately they chose not to make a PRR.  

russ 
Hi Russ,

I think I read somewhere that Aristo was planning to come out with a PRR version.

Jerry


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## NTCGRR (Jan 2, 2008)

Bubba has a whole set of brass AMS cars and a K or two, get him to bring them to the open house. I don't think they have left his shelf since he bought them. 
see if he would let you run them?


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## aceinspp (Jan 2, 2008)

Marty is there a reason for your post on this thread. I thought we were talking 2-8-0 Later RJD


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## Jerry McColgan (Feb 8, 2008)

Posted By Scottychaos on 10 Jul 2011 06:51 PM 
Jerry, 
thanks for the review and the photos!









could I please get you to measure the driver diameter? 
(outside diameter were the drivers touch the rails, not counting the flanges) 
I have a kitbash in mind!  
thanks, 
Scot Hi Scot,

Sorry but it took awhile for me to find my dial calipers (it has been a long time since I last used them).

I measured 1.928 but it was hard to get the dial calipers around the drivers and I do not trust my readings but they should be close.

I hope this helps,

Jerry


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## Jerry McColgan (Feb 8, 2008)

Posted By NTCGRR on 11 Jul 2011 05:53 PM 
Bubba has a whole set of brass AMS cars and a K or two, get him to bring them to the open house. I don't think they have left his shelf since he bought them. 
see if he would let you run them? 


Trouble maker!









BTW what do you think he would take for the set?









Jerry


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## Madstang (Jan 4, 2008)

HEY yous two! I can read what yous are say'in!

If I ever decided to sell them I would want what I paid for them as they, like Marty stated have NEVER been of the shelf I placed them on. I don't kinow what they are going for or if you can even still get them.

And no I am not taking them off the shelf, and taking them to Marty's...too mucfh hassle...sorry

The K-36 is a bonified SHELF QUEEN! Has barely 1/2 hour of run time, but I have weathered it to look as if it has been worked hard! Shame my favorite engine, cannot run on my layout because the trackwork is ALMOST perfect, BUT not Accucraft "MUSEUM" quality perfect!

Sorry but I still don't get the point of making a BEAUTIFUL engine that cannot run on MOST peoples layout that buys them!!!! They run great on perfectly flat, like on layout used for live steam. BUMMER!

Carry on boys.

Bubba


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## NTCGRR (Jan 2, 2008)

Hope you can read, I know RJ is tring to currect me again or trap me.
I was repling to Jerry who started this thread and had it go another direction for a minute. 

Thats who WE arethat is talking
I know Bubba let you run his Hudson way back . So I thought maybe, never hurts to ask.


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## Jerry McColgan (Feb 8, 2008)

Posted By Madstang on 12 Jul 2011 05:06 PM 
HEY yous two! I can read what yous are say'in!

And no I am not taking them off the shelf, and taking them to Marty's...too mucfh hassle...sorry

Sorry but I still don't get the point of making a BEAUTIFUL engine that cannot run on MOST peoples layout that buys them!!!! They run great on perfectly flat, like on layout used for live steam. BUMMER!

Carry on boys.

Bubba


Just pulling your chain Bubba,









I already have too many shelf queens and there is no way I could ever run any 1:20.3 anything on my layouts. They are beautiful but just too big.

For the record, I absolutely DO NOT WANT to see your K whatever at Marty's. Running your dang Hudson has already cost me way too much money and so far I think I may have carried that beautiful beast up and down the stairs to my layout two or three times since I got it.

I wish you had not said what you did about your K-36. Now you have me wondering what to expect from my K-4 shelf queen (I think that is what they are called). Maybe that is why the guy sold it to me so cheap???

I guess we need to find someone to pick on who isn't paying attention.









Jerry


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## Jerry McColgan (Feb 8, 2008)

Posted By aceinspp on 11 Jul 2011 07:47 PM 
Marty is there a reason for your post on this thread. I thought we were talking 2-8-0 Later RJD 

Hi RJ,

I've about run out of things to say about the 2-8-0. I am adverse to taking it apart for anything if I can possibly avoid it. Now that I put smoke fluid in them I don't want to even tip them any more than necessary or even unplug the tender as that plug was a tight fit and I don't want to damage anything trying to unplug it.

My plan is to never take the Connies off the track. Just run them and park them and then run them again. Eventually I will probably put Revolutions and sound systems in them but I am hoping Aristo might make some sort of announcement on the new Revolution with sound so I would just have to buy a couple of them, take the tenders apart once and be done with it. I don't know how near or far they are from releasing it.

As hot (100+) as it has been lately I may not run the locos again for quite some time until it gets cooler outside (like in September). With my shade trees dead and gone the cupola now gets too hot to even consider running trains from there. OK. I am a wimp and I admit it. Frankly I don't know how you real life railroaders do it.

I can't run the Connies inside because of my R1 turnouts and curves so I may have to go back to running other stuff inside for now. I don't really do much in the way of evaluations. I just buy stuff, try it and stick it on the layout somewhere and forget about it until I get around to running it again.

If someone else has purchased a Connie and wants to piggy back on this topic they are welcome to do so. Otherwise anyone is free to talk about anything and I have no objection to it. I can't think of anything interesting to add to my comments about the 2-8-0's. If anyone has any questions that I can answer without taking anything apart I will do my best to answer their questions.

Jerry


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## Madstang (Jan 4, 2008)

Are you talking about the Accucraft K-4 Pacific? If so Jim Carter has one and it runs great on his layout or so I remember him saying when he got it.

The drivers are larger then on the K-36,37, and 28s'.

Pick away, I just was paying attention this time!









Bubba


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## aceinspp (Jan 2, 2008)

Well according to Lewis they are testing the loco with additional weights today. So we shall see what we can add and be safe and still be covered by warranty. Sounds like they have a new style that is flat and will fit on top of the one that is in the boiler already. Later RJD


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## Jerry McColgan (Feb 8, 2008)

Posted By Madstang on 13 Jul 2011 04:38 AM 
Are you talking about the Accucraft K-4 Pacific? If so Jim Carter has one and it runs great on his layout or so I remember him saying when he got it.

The drivers are larger then on the K-36,37, and 28s'.

Pick away, I just was paying attention this time!









Bubba




Hi Bubba,

Yes, I got the Accucraft K-4 Pacific last year from the same guy I got the USA Big Boy. I put up a wall length track for the Big Boy above and in front of a computer (which is the only place it gets to run but that is perfect for me because I get to see and hear it up close and personal). The USA Hudson and Accucraft K-4 have not been out of their boxes this year since my focus got directed to other layouts and the locos are so big and heavy to haul up and down the stairs.

For me the big, heavy, metal locos have become shelf queens (like your K-36) but that is OK because I don't have to worry about breaking them and then wondering if and how I could get replacement parts. I just need to try to remember to run them enough to keep the sound system batteries charged (I'm glad I wrote this because the batteries are probably dead now).

Jerry


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## krs (Feb 29, 2008)

Posted By aceinspp on 13 Jul 2011 12:13 PM 
Well according to Lewis they are testing the loco with additional weights today. So we shall see what we can add and be safe and still be covered by warranty. Sounds like they have a new style that is flat and will fit on top of the one that is in the boiler already. Later RJD 
Why?
Are people complaining that this loco doesn't pull enough cars? 


Would be good to add this loco to the pulling power thread on mls if someone can make the measurements.

Knut


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## bdp3wsy (Mar 14, 2008)

Chris, I got mine from STAR HOBBY today. They picked their order up from Aristo and left mine there for me to pick up. They had the B&O waiting for me with my bill. Turn it around to Aristo and picked up my 2 free freight cars at the same time. Saved shipping on the engine and cars. And since I ordered over the phone from STAR in Maryland I didn't have to pay sales tax. I'm putting the savings to an undected 2-8-0 to order before 8-6-11 so I can get two more free cars from Aristo. I only live 20 min from ARISTO so I save allot on shipping. I have even had items that they Drop ship held for pick up. ARISTO is good with this and gives me a chance to poke thru Navin's parts bin. Jake


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## markoles (Jan 2, 2008)

Jerry,

I had missed this topic since I was on vaca last week. WOW, the doubleheaded 2-8-0s do look great. I, too, was impressed with the smoke on the one I saw running at the ECLSTS. I think the smaller stack and the same volume of smoke makes it look like more. Anyway, I completely agree on doubleheading locomotives. I've been doubleheading my 2-8-2 and 2-8-8-2 for a while now. When I eventually get one of the 2-8-0s (holding out hope that ARisto is going to make the New Haven version), I will probably run a triple header. 

The note about the 53' boxcars versus the 40' boxcars is interesting. On our local shortline, they have recently shopped their 2-10-0, #90. They have also started to handle some real freight at their terminal in East Strasburg, and recently got a shipment of 13 freight cars, totalling about 1800 tons. The 2-10-0 can only handle about 1400 tons, so a helper diesel was added. Even in the real world, sometimes helpers have to be added. Here's a video of that train, last week. 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9HuuvS1t4fw

Marty, if you don't like 'Connie" then you should get an extra gearbox and wheel set and extend the boiler to make a 2-10-0 Decapod. Note, this is a modern freight train being moved by a coal fired steam locomotive. Not some historic train for a photo charter... 

We took Luke out for a ride on the 7pm train last night before bedtime and saw #90 in the engine house being fired up. She's been out of service since January getting her 1472 day inspection.


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## Jim Agnew (Jan 2, 2008)

Mark, thanks for posting. As often stated, somewhere there's a prototype for everything.


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## Jerry McColgan (Feb 8, 2008)

Hi Mark,

Great photos and video.

Pennsylvania is probably the best state to live in when it comes to reliving the past steam railroading whether 1:1 or model railroading. I envy your ability to be easily drive to so many train related things - not to mention the numbers of fellow garden railroaders, dealers etc. 

I like the fact that your photos show that just 13 cars required two locos to pull them. 100+ car trains can be impressive but (for me) I tend to lose interest after the first few cars pass and I end up counting the cars without paying much attention to what the actual cars are and might be carrying.

With the train in the video I found myself paying a lot more attention to the individual cars.

With my cars being left outside either (formerly) under the layout or in the Train Shed and Train Barn they may be protected from the sun and rain but I suspect the heat probably gums up the oil in the journals and that probably adds to the pulling resistance. Cars in the indoor layouts tend to pull much more freely - even the big ones.

#90 looks beautiful!

Some guys like to weather their trains which is great for them but I like to pretend that all of my trains just came out of the shop and wash rack. I love to see a train that looks new and I hate to see the graffiti that covers so much of them (to each his own).

UP 844 came through Arkansas not long ago and I was disappointed to see a lot of some sort of white stuff all over the rear end of the loco. I did not bother to take any photos.

I love big, black and shiny steam locos.

Jerry


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## markoles (Jan 2, 2008)

Jerry,

One of the reasons I did not object to moving to Lancaster County in the first place was because of the proximity of this little railroad. 

They have done an excellent job of painting 90 and I doubt I'll ever see it that clean until they paint it again. When I worked for Strasburg in the summer of 99, I gave the running gear a 'bath' with a pressure washer. The grease and grime one the running gear was intense. Even getting the bell shiny took a lot of work, and only remained shiny for one run to Paradise and back. Chris runs the Wm Mason at the B&ORM in Baltimore. The Wm Mason has a lot of brass and Chris said his fireman spent something like two days to shine up all the brass on that locomotive. 

The white stuff on 844 was likely sand from either the track sanders or the flue sand. They use the sand in oil fired locomotives to knock build up off the flues by allowing it to be sucked in to the firebox. The sand on the track is for traction on slippery rail. 

Are you thinking about centering the headlights on undecorated units?


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## Jerry McColgan (Feb 8, 2008)

Hi Mark,

I never noticed that the headlights were not centered. Actually I probably did notice but never gave it a thought.

I do prefer centered headlights but not when it involves any work on my part.









About the only thing I plan to do other than to add sound and Revolutions will be to make up Brother labels for "Cotton Belt" to put on the tenders and come up with some numbers to put on the cabs.

These days I tend to do as little as I can get away with. I don't even have enough energy to cut the weeds with the tractor and bush-hog so I just tell myself it is too hot and forget about doing it.

A few minutes ago the deer were out waiting for their daily corn ration. I noticed it was cool enough that I could have run some trains but instead I put the corn out and came inside to the air conditioning. 

In a few minutes the deer will probably come back and I will split between watching the deer and TV in the cupola. I'm afraid I have joined the over the hill gang.

Jerry


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

All this talk about weights in a consolidation, it seems worth pointing out that into the 1920s, when they were more or less displaced by Mikados, consols were mainline engines. A superheated consol could easily pull 50 loaded cars, especially on an undemanding grade. They were gradually shifted to branchline work and switching by the end of the steam era. They are smaller than a lot of other steam, and they fit my line so well that I converted two Aristo Mikados to consols. Obviously anyone can run them as they please, but it seems worth pointing out that a big superheated consol was absolutely a mainline, long-freight engine into the 1930s


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## Scottychaos (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By lownote on 19 Jul 2011 05:39 PM 
All this talk about weights in a consolidation, it seems worth pointing out that into the 1920s, when they were more or less displaced by Mikados, consols were mainline engines. A superheated consol could easily pull 50 loaded cars, especially on an undemanding grade. They were gradually shifted to branchline work and switching by the end of the steam era. They are smaller than a lot of other steam, and they fit my line so well that I converted two Aristo Mikados to consols. Obviously anyone can run them as they please, but it seems worth pointing out that a big superheated consol was absolutely a mainline, long-freight engine into the 1930s 



I agree with you about the Consolidation being a "mainline" engine, but I think your dates are about 10-15 years "late"..
The Mikado became the "latest and greatest" in common use about 1910 - 1912, 

and really replaced the Consolidation as the primary freight wheel arrangement through the 19-teens..
by 1920 the Consolidation was mostly reduced to branchline status..

sure, im sure there were some Consols on some railroads used as primary mainline power into the 30's, but they would have been the rare exception, not the rule..
The "Glory Days" of the Consolidation as "Mainline" freight power would be roughly 1870 - 1910. 

of course they were *used* long after 1910 as well! but just not as the "latest and greatest"..they were superseded by more modern power about 1910.. 




Scot


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## bottino (Feb 7, 2008)

That;s interesting. Since I have a Mikado I was reading up on them once, and whatever I read said that we were making them for Japan, and after they bombed Pearl Harbor, that ended the deal, so they put them into service here. That would date them in the 40s. That's why they have a Japanese name. Now I am really confused.

Paul


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## bottino (Feb 7, 2008)

I stand corrected. The article below states that the first ones were made for the Northern Pacific in 1904, and they were made up until 1946. So I was wrong. 
http://ctr.trains.com/en/Railroad R...06/Steam locomotive profile 2-8-2 Mikado.aspx
Paul


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## aceinspp (Jan 2, 2008)

Well according to uncle Lewis we can add up to about 2 1/2 pound of extra weight to bring the weight to 6 pounds of total weight not counting the weight of the engine. So this should help. I will be adding some to mine. However AC dose not have the extra weights in stock and will do them on the next run. Well that could be a while even if they have said they have submitted for another run.







Later RJD


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

Wikipedia (which may not be right) says " The 2-8-2 saw great success in the United States, mostly as a freight locomotive. It largely replaced the 2-8-0 "Consolidation" type as the heavy freight locomotive type in the second decade of the 20th century." That would be the teens. But if you read for example _Set Up Running_, the life story of a PRR engine man, he's still running consols into the 30s and in heavy service--I suppose it could be branch line, but it's not 10-12 cars branch line, it's more like 50. 

MY point was simply that Consolidations were not produced to be branch line engines pulling a dozen cars, even though they often ended up that way 
@import url(http://www.mylargescale.com/Provide...ad.ashx?type=style&file=SyntaxHighlighter.css);@import url(/providers/htmleditorproviders/cehtmleditorprovider/dnngeneral.css);


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## Scottychaos (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By bottino on 19 Jul 2011 06:53 PM 
That;s interesting. Since I have a Mikado I was reading up on them once, and whatever I read said that we were making them for Japan, and after they bombed Pearl Harbor, that ended the deal, so they put them into service here. That would date them in the 40s. That's why they have a Japanese name. Now I am really confused.

Paul 




Paul,
sounds like you might be confusing the Mikado story with the story of the "Russian" decopods..
The Mikado 2-8-2 was first developed in the 1880's, but it wasnt in common use until the 19-teens.. 

the name "Mikado" for the locomotives dates from the 1890's, when Baldwin built some locos of the 2-8-2 wheel arrangement for Japan.

By the time of Pearl Harbor, the era of the Mikado locomotive was already over..After Pearl Harbor, a few railroads decided to re-name their remaining 2-8-2's "MacArthurs"..but that name never really stuck. I dont think there were any locos meant for Japan in 1941 that stayed in the US specifically because of the bombing of Pearl Harbor..
and if there were, they were unlikely to be Mikado's anyway!  

and..probably Alco or Baldwin werent even shipping locos to Japan in 1941, considering Japan was an ally of Germany by then..

so that version of the Mikado story just doesn't pan out.. 


Your story of "after they bombed Pearl Harbor, that ended the deal, so they put them into service here." sounds more like the story of the Russian Decopods of WWI. 


Baldwin had a large order of over one thousand 2-10-0's for Russia, most had been delivered when the Russian revolution of 1917 "stranded" the remaining 200 (or so) of them in the US..
these "Russian decopods" were instead delivered to American railroads by the USRA, who controlled American railroads during WWI.
Most went to the Erie, with smaller amounts going to other railroads..Stories abound about the crews not being overly fond of them, calling the locomotives "them damn Bolsheviks" and other names!  

"Russian" Decopod of 1917:









While we are on the topic of Consolidations, Mikados and Decopods..I feel the need to point out that:
the first Mikado was developed by the Lehigh Valley Railroad. 
the first Decopod was developed by the Lehigh Valley Railroad! 
The first Consolidation was developed by..the Lehigh Valley Railroad! who gave the name to the class.. 

Makes me proud be a native of Sayre PA.
(and a descendant of many LV workers! 

Scot


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## markoles (Jan 2, 2008)

Mike,

Interestingly, I was reading on rypn.org about this recent movement by Strasburg's 2-10-0 moving 1800 tons. That train was only 13 cars long. The locomotive is rated for 1400 tons, limited by the railroad's degree of curvature and grade. There were folks pointing out that the locomotive was capable of moving 40-50 freight car trains when it worked for the Great Western in CO. The rebuttal was that on dead flat track, with no curves, the 2-10-0 would be rated for 12,000 tons. Add a .2% grade and that figure is cut in half. So, perhaps yes, some 2-8-0s did haul 50 car freight trains, but the real question should be "What did the B&O E-27-b handle?"

In the world of the New Haven Railroad, the Central New England purchased some 2-8-0s in 1912 for freight service and those ultimately were kept on the NH roster through the end of WWII. These were about the same size as the B&O E-27. The New Haven had a lot of light rail and low clearances so smaller power was required. 

CENTRAL NEW ENGLAND 2-8-0's


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## Dave Meashey (Jan 2, 2008)

The Consolidation is a really nice locomotive. I am no longer buying standard gauge equipment, but I have a wish related to this product.

Back in the early days of large scale, LGB would offer their chassis, complete with cylinders and valve gear, for purchase for scratch building and kitbashing products. As I recall, these products were fairly reasonably priced. Presently neither LGB/Marklin nor any other manufacturer offeres this kind of product.

I would dearly love to be able to purchase two powered eight-coupled chassis with the cylinders and valve gear for a Beyer-Garrett project. Are there enough other modelers with a similar need to make this enticing to the manufacturers?

I really don't have an answer, but this seems like a good thread to "run it up the flagpole."

Best,
David Meashey


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## aceinspp (Jan 2, 2008)

According to Lewis post the loco will only handle 5 cars. So it looks like more weight needs to be added. I'll know by Friday as mine shouh be here. Later RJD


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## Jerry McColgan (Feb 8, 2008)

*Note to all...*

I have pretty much said about all that I anticipate saying about this or any other products, brands or manufacturers. Posts thus far have been courteous and respectful and I appreciate it.

My thanks to everyone who has contributed their thoughts to this topic.

Jerry


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## Jerry McColgan (Feb 8, 2008)

Just for clarification.[/b]

*Elsewhere I have been quoted incorrectly of saying that these 2-8-0's have poor pulling power.* In no way did I say or intend to imply that.

What my experience has been is that the 2-8-0's individually had difficulty pulling all 10 of the 53' Evans boxcars which have a very heavy pull to them. Anything but a large heavy loco or one with traction tires would have a hard time pulling all 10 of these plus the large LGB caboose. I have not bothered to find out what the problem is but these cars came with special journals fitted with plastic wheels and a plastic cap on the ends of the axles. I replaced the wheels with metal ones which did not fit the journals properly so I had to get different metal wheels. These 53' boxcars (and the others I used) have been left outside (covered) for a year where they have been subjected to heat, cold and heavy humidity. It is not a surprise to me that some may be hard to pull - probably due to gummed up lubricant in the journals. 

In order to replace the factory plastic wheels (with he rotating bearing caps) I had to first reverse the brass bushings (due to binding), buy and install replacement Aristo metal wheels, remove and disassemble the trucks, insert the metal wheels and put the assemblies together (twice). Then I had to attempt to reattach the rotating bearing caps. My 1st attempt failed because the bushings started to fall out which is when I discovered I needed different metal wheels and the brass bushings had to once again be removed and reinstalled the way they had been in the first place.

It is no wonder that there is extra friction on these cars as I do not consider my conversion of them to be complete.












I am sitting in a MoPac caboose and I bought those 10 MoPac 53' Evans Boxcars and had a LGB Caboose converted to MoPac so they could all be pulled by a USA MoPac GP-38 that has a Revolution and a Sierra Sound System. That train works perfectly so if the 2-8-0's have any difficulty pulling the Evans boxcars it is unimportant to me.

When I switched the 2-8-0's to Aristo 40' boxcars the pulling problems disappeared. Individually the 2-8-0's easily pulled 10 - 12 of these boxcars and combined they easily pulled all 22 of these boxcars. I made no effort to see if they would pull more and I made no effort to see how they pulled up an incline as the layout is flat and all I am concerned about is what my locos do with my rolling stock on my layout.

The facts are that I don't really know what the pulling power of these 2-8-0's is because I was not trying to find that out. All I was interested in was whether they would pull the 22 Aristo Cotton Belt 40' boxcars that I intend to pull with them. They do so I have no need or desire to do any further testing.

I also mentioned that either the single door or the double door boxcars may (or may not) have come with ball bearing wheel sets from the factory. It was about 95 degrees outside when I set up and ran these locos and trains. Since, IF there are ball bearing wheels on any of the boxcars, that would still have left the other set of boxcars with regular metal wheels and since the locos were pulling everything just fine I did not care enough to pick up the boxcars to see if any of them really do have ball bearing wheels. Either way I know my 2-8-0's can each pull at least 10 - 12 of my 40' boxcars with or without ball bearings. Actually I think I pulled the ball bearing wheels and put them on some other cars but determining that can wait until the fall when it drops about 20 degrees outside.

I leave it to others to post their results with their 2-8-0's. 

If anyone is going to quote me I would appreciate it if they would at least use exact and complete quotes and NOT attribute things to me that I never said or intended to imply. I don't know (or care) what good pulling power for a 1:29 Consolidation would be. To my way of thinking 10 -12 or more 40' boxcars on a relatively level track is pretty good. I would have been happy with half of that. After all, 6 coaches or freight cars + caboose is the most I ever pull with my LGB Moguls anyway.

Jerry


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