# 1/12th scale 3 foot gauge gauge



## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

I'm just curious, does anyone model 1/12th scale 3 foot gauge? I see a number of 1/12th scale standard gauge projects on 4-3/4 inch gauge, and I see the 7/8th scale 2 foot gauge projects, so I was just wondering about 3 foot gauge.


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## aopagary (Jun 30, 2008)

the biggest downside to modeling 1" scale, 3' narrow gauge is that leaves you exactly in between #3 gauge (2.5") and 3/4" scale on 3.5" gauge track; 2 of the 3 or 4 most supported small live steam gauges. the closest choices in common small gauges would be 1:14.4 on 2.5" gauge or 1:10.3 on 3.5" gauge track. 1" scale on 4.75" gauge is quite accurate and is a nice size for traveling (about 1/3 the weight of a 1½" scale locomotive), though i've been discovering that support for this gauge seems to be waning. narrow gauge on 4.75" gauge track would be in 1:6.3 scale to be accurate.

cheers...gary


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

I've been building a few cars in 1/6th scale to go along with the G. I. Joe action figures and Barbie figures, and the actual gauge for prototype 2 foot gauge would be 4 inches. I have given some thought to extending the gauge to 4-3/4 inch gauge to make them compatable with that track gauge. The problem with that is that for the 2 axle cars with the wheels inside the frames, I would have to widen the frames of the cars. I could do that at this point as I only have 1 frame of the ore cars partly assembled and it won't affect the other 2 cars that are in process. Of course, that would make the gauge 40-1/2 inches in 1/6th scale. Better that than trying to build things to 1/6.3 scale, that would really complicate the measuring process. It's bad enough already with 1/6th scale trying to use a standard ruler. 
I'm guessing that if a person was already modelling in 1/12th scale on 4-3/4 inch gauge, laying a third rail to 3 inch gauge or 3.5 inch gauge wouldn't be very difficult. I would think that making the gauge wider on a 2.5 inch gauge live steam engine would be easier than narrowing a 3.5 inch gauge live steam engine, although I could be wrong on that.


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## Allegheny (Jan 2, 2008)

Amber,

If you're looking to do some creative modeling with Barbie dolls and/or GI Joes, you should dig up the DVD of the movie Marwencol - what this guys does with his modeling (absolutely no trains, unfortunately) is almost beyond belief. Anyway, the movie is a documentary about this ne'er-do-well living in the Hudson Valley in upstate NY. He goes out of a bar one night and gets beaten into a coma by some guys even nastier than he is. As part of his recovery/therapy, he starts building things - Marwencol is the name of the ficticious French village he constructs. There is even an elaborate back story to the whole thing (it's set during WW II). When I first saw it, I thought it was fake, but the guy has been written up in the New York Times and other newspapers and journals - he's even had art gallery shows in Manhattan.

So weird that it's fascinating.

Brian


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## aopagary (Jun 30, 2008)

Posted By Amber on 21 Aug 2012 10:00 AM 

I'm guessing that if a person was already modelling in 1/12th scale on 4-3/4 inch gauge, laying a third rail to 3 inch gauge or 3.5 inch gauge wouldn't be very difficult. I would think that making the gauge wider on a 2.5 inch gauge live steam engine would be easier than narrowing a 3.5 inch gauge live steam engine, although I could be wrong on that. 
first off, i screwed up the math a bit... i always seem to stick 30 vs 36 in the calculation for narrow gauge so it turns out that 1:7.6 would be the correct scale for narrow gauge (36") on 4.75" gauge track.

live steam clubs/ tracks that support the smaller gauges will often dual gauge 7½" (7¼") & 4¾" or 4¾" & 3½". LALS and NJLS are two that i can think of off hand (i'm sure there are more). the NJ club has 4¾" & 3½" elevated (or as some refer to it as the high-line). in LA 4¾" & 3½" are on the ground. some who run 3.5" gauge often use a 4.75" riding car with an offset coupler to make things a bit more comfortable. #3 gauge in the US is much less common. the Golden Gate Live Steamers is the only club in the west that i know supports the smaller small gauges (in this forum know as large scale... it's all relative!).

even on standard gauge trains, the wheel gauge to car width is already smaller than most other vehicles. so widening the wheel gauge (as in O gauge models being 6% too wide or over-gauged) is always better looking than narrowing the wheel gauge in relation to scale (eg: 1:29 scale on #1 gauge which is 9% too narrow or under-gauged. these models look very precariously balanced on their axles).


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

I see that my math was way off in figuring the gauge of 4-3/4 inch gauge in 1/6th scale. DOH! The gauge would actually be 28-1/2 inch gauge. That's actually not too bad. 
It's too bad they don't do 5 inch gauge on this side of the big pond, that would work out to 30 inch gauge in 1/6th scale, that would be a good gauge to work with.


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## Eric M. (Jan 3, 2008)

Hi Amber, 

I have dabbled in many scales and gauges that fall in the vicinity of your interests. To date I have built models in 1:12, 1:8 and 1:5 scales (also 1:20.3). While I enjoy modelling in these larger scales I usually adhere to track gauges that have some support out there. For me, one of the major reasons for this is that GGLS is pretty close and they have tracks for 2.5", 3.5", 4.75" and 7.5" gauges. Having access to a club with these tracks is a big incentive for me to work within those parameters. I have honestly given up on worrying about making my models adhere to correct scale proportions for 2' and 3' gauges. I tend to round off to the nearest easy to calculate scale that fits with one of the gauges. Currently my roster of equipment for gauges larger than 45mm includes the following scale/gauge combinations: 

1:12 (1" = 1') scale on 3.5" gauge track. Scales to 42" gauge which was used on street railroads and logging lines in the Pacific NW, also SF cable cars. 

1:12 (1" = 1') scale on 4.75" gauge track. Scales to 57"-- pretty darn close to correct standard gauge. 

1:8 (1.5" = 1') scale on 3.5" gauge track. Scales to 28" gauge. A bit unusual but this was an industrial gauge utilized in some areas. 

1:8 (1.5" = 1') scale on 4.75" gauge track. Scales to 38" gauge. Also unusual but not too far from 36" and parts are available and measurements are easy to calculate. 

1:5 (2.4" = 1') scale on 4.75" gauge track. Scales to 23.75" gauge -- pretty darn close to 24" gauge. 

To me it is worth it to stick to supported gauges. That is one of the reasons that we convinced Rick Kapuaala to build his live steamer in 3.5" gauge instead of 3". (I know you asked about that in the live steam forum.) For the most part I also try to stick to nice round numbered scales. In both 1:12 and 1:8 scale there is a fair amount of commercial parts available and many of the 1:12 scale standard gauge parts work well for 1:8 narrow gauge. Anyways here are some picture of some of my models in the above mentioned scales. As you will see in a couple of the pictures, 12" GI Joe dolls work pretty good with 1:5 scale trains too. 

































































Regards,


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

Very nice cars! What gauges are the 3 rail track?


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## Eric M. (Jan 3, 2008)

Thanks. The dual gauge track is 3.5" and 4.75" gauge.

Regards,


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

"1:5 (2.4" = 1') scale on 4.75" gauge track. Scales to 23.75" gauge -- pretty darn close to 24" gauge." 
That's also very close to 60 cm gauge, common in European industrial use, and used for the trench railways in WW1


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## therbert (Sep 18, 2008)

Amber, as Eric said above, it's easier to stick to the established gauges, especially if you're not going to build your own track. If you're doing it for the pure pleasure of modeling, then of course you can choose any scale/gauge combination you like. At the Houston Area Live Steamers track, we have Gauge 1 (45mm), 4 3/4" and 7 1/2" gauges, the latter two being at ground level, and the Gauge 1 track is elevated. One of the other advantages to sticking with an established scale/gauge combination is the fairly neat (I think) ability to see the relationship of narrow and standard gauge trains built in the same scale, standing on parallel tracks beside one another. For instance, because the 4 3/4" and 7 1/2" gauge tracks run parallel to one another on Phase One of the track at HALS, it is possible to see standard gauge and 3' narrow gauge trains in the same scale (1:8 or 1 1/2" scale) beside one another.

During any given large meet at the track, it's possible to see 3 3/4" scale/2' gauge, 2 1/2" scale/3' gauge and 1 1/2" scale (or 1.6")/standard gauge trains running on the 7 1/2" gauge track, and 1 1/2" scale/3' gauge and 1" scale/standard gauge running on the 4 3/4" gauge track. And we all know about all the different scales that run on Gauge 1 track...


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

If I didn't already have a fair amount of hand laid track built to 4 inch gauge, I might consider changing the gauge to 4-3/4 inch gauge for the 1/6 scale railroad. But then, I don't see myself being able to visit a large club layout to possibly run it on. As far as I know, the closest "ride on" club to me would be the one in the Milwaukee, WI area. That's about a 4 hour drive south of me.


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

Just adding to this thread from a year ago. I finally found a source for larger wheels for my 1/6th scale mine cars, although not much larger. 7/8ths railways has 28 scale inch wheels available right now, they're just over 2 inch diameter, which works out to a 12 inch wheel in 1/6th scale. If it was 1/5th scale, it would be a bit smaller, but still acceptable size. I've been using the largest size 7/8ths scale wheel that I could find previously, about 1-3/4s inch diameter, only about 9 inches in 1/6th scale. 
I'd really like to find wheels that are 2-1/2 inches in diameter, that would be about a 15 inch wheel in 1/6th scale, very close to the wheels used on the early Gilpin Tram cars. I use these wheels on code 332 brass track, so the narrow wheel profile isn't a problem. I'd like to get 1/2 inch or 5/8ths aluminum rail, but I'm not sure where to get it and it's probably expensive. I don't know how that would affect the way the 7/8ths scale profile wheels would work on the larger rail. I wonder if the wheel tread would be a bit too narrow to work well on the larger rail.


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