# Minimum radius for Bachmann C-19 ?



## stevedenver (Jan 6, 2008)

Have searched for this on line and at Bachmann site, without success.

About to pull the trigger but would like to know min radius, and
while were here please, 

How does this loco look with LGB coaches and freight stock please?

Any reason to avoid this gorgeous loco?


----------



## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

Steve:

I do not have the Bachmann version of the C-19, but I do have the Accucraft version. They are both 1:20.3 and in my opinion 1:20.3 engines look large when placed next to 1:22.5/24 cars.

Here is my Accucraft C-19 with LGB coaches.











Here is a picture comparing LGB coaches and Accucraft coaches.










In my opinion the opposite looks OK, LGB Mogul with 1:20.3 coaches.











It is just 1:22.5/24 cars that, to me, look out of place with 1:20.3 engines.

Chuck

PS, I can't help with the radius question. All my curves are 10' diameter and I don't have any problems with my bachmann engines: Connie, and K-27.


----------



## StanleyAmes (Jan 3, 2008)

stevedenver said:


> Have searched for this on line and at Bachmann site, without success.
> 
> About to pull the trigger but would like to know min radius, and
> while were here please,
> ...


The Bachmann C-19 will go around R2 track. It looks a lot better on larger radius curves but then most locomotives do.

The C-19 class of locomotives is a small one. In 1:22.5 it will be a larger locomotive.

Stan


----------



## stevedenver (Jan 6, 2008)

thanks to both of you for your help, I have a good idea now, and R2 , while not my choice, is good to know.

the difference in coaches is indeed dramatic

I love the C19, and need to think it over just a tad
as I am red box, and really don't want to need another basement for F scale stuff, although it is magnificent

but perhaps id be better off with the Climax, the other on my want list.


----------



## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

Steve

While the size difference is quite noticeable with passenger cars, I don't think it is as noticeable with 1:22.5/24 freight cars. The dimensions of those varied quite a bit. I'd think that if you started your freight train with a flat, gon, or a hopper, which are lower to start with, the height difference wouldn't be as noticeable. You could always do a mixed freight with a gon a few box cars and then a coach or two at the end, far enough away so that a direct visual difference would be minimized.

Chuck


----------



## Ted Yarbrough (Jan 2, 2008)

Steve,
The1:20 scale C-19 by Bachmann and the1:22 scale Annie by Bachmann are ALMOST identical in size. Both are small locomotives in 1:1 scale when compared to the K-series locos. I often run 1:20 scale cars with my Annies, but seldom run the 1:22 scale cars with the C-19. It is a personal perspective, and everyone has their own ideas. So, remember, it is your railroad and run what looks good to you.


----------



## Ted Yarbrough (Jan 2, 2008)

Steve,
I run my C-19 on 8 ft diameter track. I think the C-19 is a very well made locomotive. I have two and love them. Reliable operation. Well detailed.


----------



## d_sinsley (Mar 29, 2011)

I am glad you asked. I want two coaches to run behind my scratch built 2-6-0 1:20.3 and indeed those LGB's look way to small and I wouldn't have thought so. I was considering them as I like the looks and the length is rightish for a small narrow gauge coach but they are not near tall enough or wide enough. 

So thanks for asking.


----------



## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

Steve

Smaller engines are pictured in my books pulling and pushing larger cars, I haven't seen the opposite. 


















Its your railroad, run what you like. As I said earlier, I don't have the Bachmann C-19, but I do have the Accucraft. It is a nice looking engine, I think that with freight cars it is doable. 

In 1980 I started out with the Red boxes. As I remember there was less red. But, I added some 1:29 and then bought a Bachmann Connie (1:20.3). That was when I realized my LGB coaches looked small. At that time I thought LGB was 1:22.5 and Delton was 1:24. I didn't notice much difference between LGB and Delton. So I thought a 10% difference from 1:22.5 and 1:20.3 wouldn't be that noticeable. I was wrong. I then measured a some of LGB freight cars and discovered that they were closer to 1:24. That is a 20% difference. That was noticeable. My garage storage space has expanded to include 1:29 and 1:20.3!

Chuck


----------



## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

Pull the trigger. You won't be disappointed. You may find it looks a bit big compared to your LGB passenger cars, but they're diminutive anyway. It will look better with the freight cars. LGB's freight cars scale to around 25' or so in 1:20, which was a common length for narrow gauge freight cars. 

The Climax is also a great loco, and would definitely fit in well with your LGB stuff. 

I own both locos, and neither have given me anything to complain about. The C-19 is arguably the best-running loco I own. 

Here's a video of my C-19 with a short string of freight cars. The hoppers are Bachmann 1:22 and Delton 1:24 hoppers. 






Later,

K


----------



## stevedenver (Jan 6, 2008)

thanks again to all-have been convinced about the loco-good recommendations all
in watching a youtube explanation of the loco, the detailing is mind blowing, a real model, and not one quite as massive as the Ks, (which I also loved but were simply too massive unless I completely changed scales or bought another bunch of rolling stock).

chuck n-what a superb photo-THAT caboose is the LGB prototype -running gear and suspension, bars across end windows, cupola shape, window size....very interesting
do you know if it is narrow gauge?

long ago, I recall seeing the C and S blueprints for the LGB style center cupola bobber, 4065, yet have never seen a photo. I believe these were the blueprints that Disney used for his bobber, and, they may or may not have been genuine, but might have been reproduced from a railroad model magazine of the era. in any event, the photo is wonderful, and being a red box devote' (only because they are so reliable and forgiving of mishap), I am always delighted to see some basis in reality for LGB models.....I know they are out there.........

kevin thanks especially for the thoughts re freight and how to transition and soften the size contrast. now....I need to think which version I like, as I like them all, but am leaning towards the royal gorge as one, and RGS as a possible as well.

I am thinking, we may not see these again, for a long time. I am guessing that the price point, together with the average age of large scalers, is probably a bit dear for many close to or in retirement. Given that these are imho the ideal US ng loco, one I have wanted a very long time (my delton/aristo version had issues on day two and went right back) I am surprised these didn't sell like the LGB mogul. That tells me there IS indeed a larger decline in the garden rr interest.


----------



## Sjoc78 (Jan 25, 2014)

I've been pushing to 1:20.3 but I haven't gotten passenger cars yet. Here is my bumblebee C19 pulling LGB cars. It doesn't look bad, Also note I am running 8ft diameter curves.


----------



## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

Steve

Looking at my book on "Minnesota Logging Railroads" by Frank King, my best guess is that the caboose in question was standard gauge. The few pictures of the Duluth, Virginia and Rainy Lake RR's rolling stock with rails on which I can see space between the rails, looks to be standard gauge. Other places in the book mention that narrow gauge was rarely used in the woods of northern Minnesota.

Chuck

It sure looks a lot like the LGB caboose, good catch!


----------



## stevedenver (Jan 6, 2008)

love the bumblebee video, one of my fav liveries. i too run 8 ft diam.

fwiw, pulled the trigger;flying drg with short tender, ala Colo RR museum
and...sound climax demonstrator logo

after watching both youtube videos by gardentrais, i was excited

might just have to try one with an optional battery ,and may simply buy tsunami for theC19.

im also ecited about the climax...just so short and brutish

i was surprised and disappointed that bmann no longrr includes lubes with the locos. myfirst run shay had these, but of course, iah to later pay for the metal trucks.

appears proper lube is critical for bmann locos.


----------



## toddalin (Jan 4, 2008)

Regardless of the necessary track diameter, will the width make your clearances?

I bought the B'mann Connie and when I tried to push the tender though my railroad, by hand, it would hit on many of my features simply due to its additional width.

I never even bothered to try to run the engine before I sold it because if the tender coudn't make it through, there was little chance the engine would.


----------



## stevedenver (Jan 6, 2008)

shouldn't be a problem-

shay clears everything

if it is , ill fix things

very excited .....very


----------



## toddalin (Jan 4, 2008)

stevedenver said:


> shouldn't be a problem-
> 
> shay clears everything
> 
> ...


Shay clears everything on mine too.


----------



## stevedenver (Jan 6, 2008)

sound climax and C19arrived. i am floored by detail and running characteristics, and...comparative size.

any hints for making the C19's electrical plugs glide more smoothly, as this one will come in and out of the bad weather? touch of graphite powder? they are very snug.

so far, iam very excited and pleased.


----------



## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

Steve

If you are asking about the plugs between the engine and tender, I don't have any easy answers. If they are similar to the plugs on the Bachmann K-27, they are a bitch to separate. I lay my K on its side, on a towel, then with a small bladed screw driver gently pry them apart. My experience with the plugs on my LGB moguls is that pulling on the wires isn't a good long term solution.

I would worry about graphite. It is a conductor and you don't want to create a short between some of the pins.

Chuck

I'm sure you will really enjoy "F". I think it is my favorite scale of the three scales I run; 1:20.3, 1:22.5/24, and 1:29.


----------



## stevedenver (Jan 6, 2008)

thanks
yes you have the same experience as do I, was just trying to figure out how to separate them when outside, on the ground, without pulling on the things

btw chuck, do you know how to adjust volume on the climax, in analog?
cant find a pot anywhere and have adone a brief search-info on soundtrazz says its adjustable, but, im hoping its NOT exclusively by means of DCC programming and has a simple pot somewhere.

I am smitten with the details on these offerings. But, I can tell, they will be very delicate.


----------



## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

Steve

Sorry, my Bachmann Climax does not have sound. Look around for a small toggle switch somewhere on or under the engine. If you find one try holding it in one direction, while there is power to the engine, and see if the volume changes. Holding it in the other direction will reverse the gain or loss of sound.

Chuck

Ps. Originally, I was going to say that my Climax was silent, but then thought the better of it.


----------



## docwatsonva (Jan 2, 2008)

Steve,

You can build one of these things and never have to connect or disconnect your tender again.

Doc


----------



## Jim Agnew (Jan 2, 2008)

Steve, the sound level is controlled by a CV, so I'm assuming it would control the sound level in analog mode. I'm running mine on Digitrax DCC and discovered I needed the programming booster to program mine. Give Soundtrax a call, very helpful. They told me how to eliminate the coal shoveling sound, since I converted mine to an oil burner.


----------



## stevedenver (Jan 6, 2008)

thanks
for the volume info and the cradle too- in poking around the soundtraxx site and the CV addresses, and lack of control on the loco, I came to the same conclusion.

may just need one of those cradles to avoid damage. I cant see but do you work in some sort of rerailer slot at the ends so you can place the cradle and slide it onto the rails?

the C19 is magnificent, but man, its not only big, but like al bmann stuff, delicate.
backing through a turnout and an air hose broke off form the tender, due to sideways (mis)movement of tender truck. luckily, was able to adequately reglue, using Quick Grip ( fwiw a wonderful fabric glue-quick set, strong, pliable, yet can be removed with serious pulling) using the protruding broken butt end and the side molding under the tender-couldn't get the glued in butt end plug of the broken bit out using hemostats!

very impressed with this loco, runs more smoothly than anything I own, other than perhaps the Genesis, ie no motor jerk or pausing, which really makes it appear to be gliding under steam.

This damned thing is making me reassess my entire layout, in terms of radius and grades, and, greater length of ROW, and really careful track work......

otoh, it also makes me more aware of how forgiving and resilient the old red box stuff is. Placing the C19 takes a bit of controlled strength as I reach out with it over the rails. Its hefty indeed (comparatively), major care and attention, including hook up (graphite powder all over the outer white portion does indeed help the plugs a good bit, btw).

Placing an old LGB mogul, and hooking up, easy as pie. one handed. not the C 19.

OTOH, the bmann climax however is pretty easy to handle, not as heavy and diminutive for F scale-like it a lot-at higher speeds it sound more like a gasoline engine , when the exhausts get too fast......sound is rather clever too, as whistles are automatice depending on direction and upon low low voltage a single toot to set brakes, very cool, bell, at a low voltage, like yard speed, it rings, any lower or higher speed and it ceases...standing sounds are, pretty nondescript-overall very nice, and , like my first run shay, the smoke unit leaks fluid onto the running boards and front pilot area. Side cranks rotate, but seem to be less smooth on sharp curves, steady movement but with a tiny hesitation-not so on the straight.

if you like the climax I would recommend it-looks at home on R1 btw and is forgiving of rough track work.


----------



## SD90WLMT (Feb 16, 2010)

Ok.. just fer laughs....

How heavy is this C-19 you have? 

;-)


----------



## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

Steve

Welcome to the 1:20.3 club, at least a member of one. Over the years in having 1:20.3 rolling stock, from several different manufacturers, I have had problems with the brake hoses. Some ride above the ties and switch rails and some don't. If you notice they are bouncing or chattering along, pull it off an cut off about a quarter of an inch and slide it back on. There doesn't seem to be any quality control on the lengths of the hoses.

Chuck


----------



## stevedenver (Jan 6, 2008)

SD90WLMT said:


> Ok.. just fer laughs....
> 
> How heavy is this C-19 you have?
> 
> ;-)


14lbs, and, it has to be handled gingerly, as the details cannot withstand an iron grip, so both hands, underneath.

leaning out with arms loaded, 90 degrees onto a berm with track....its enough to create issues with balance

its helpful to have it as high off the ground as can be, to see and handle the electrical plugs, as they are covered by the footplate, or, one has to get face at track level....


----------



## SD90WLMT (Feb 16, 2010)

Was curious. .. thanks Steve! 
@ 14 #'s, it is much lighter than my dismal @ 19.375#'s..
I know the lift and balance routine.... LOL...

...get a carrier built...!
;-)


----------

