# wood ties



## 3lphill (Feb 22, 2008)

Good Afternoon,

I am finally starting to make some progress. We are going to hand lay 250 Aluminum track (Switchcrafters) on ties made from Port Orford Ceder supported by a ladder roadbed. My questions are what do people like to use to preserve the ties with? And how (or are) are the ties attached to the road bed?

thanks 
Phillip


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## Madman (Jan 5, 2008)

I don't have hand laid track, so I cannot speak from experience. However, I am a carpenter extraordinaries







, so I have many years of experience with wood in the elements. I have come to one conclusion. If the pyramids had been built using wood, we would know nothing about them. All seriousness aside however, I have seen people use cedar, redwood, and treated lumber (which is yellow pine). There are some mahogany variants which are the material of choice for window building and doors. One of them is Ipe', pronounced ee-pay. It's very hard and very heavy. It has natural oils that stand up to the weather well. Cedar and redwood are too soft in my opinion. Treated lumber I stay away from. Just look at a deck built from it that hasn't been maintained. No matter which wood you choose, make sure is will not sit in water. Try to build your roadbed just like the railroads, raise it up above the surrounding terrain, so that the water doesn't have a chance to stay around the ties.


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## SE18 (Feb 21, 2008)

I think you won't need anything if the track is laid in crusher fines atop ladder or battens. I've heard some use used motor oil.


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## placitassteam (Jan 2, 2008)

I used redwood for my bridges which have my only hand spiked rail. Of course the ties are not on the ground. On some I used deck sealer and one bridge is coated with roofing cement thinned with mineral spirits. Both types are standing up OK although the roofing tar seems to be the best. I do have trouble with the spikes backing out of the redwood ties. I have heard that uncoated iron spikes stay in better due to rust.


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## Madman (Jan 5, 2008)

That could be a problem, spikes backing out due to frost or simply the swelling and shrinking of the wood. The rust theory has merit. When I was in college, the professors, who were architects and engineers, felt that rebar should sit on site, before being covered with concrete, just long enough to let the weather wash off the production oils, and give the rebar a slight coating of rust. Not heavy mind you. They just wanted the rebar to be dry. Kind of like your hands when you are working with drywall. Now days, epoxy coated rebar is the norm. It looks shiny to me, thus slippery. Go figure. I've seen old reinforced concrete buildings being demolished. It's incredible how many times the wrecking ball has to hit a reinforced concrete structure before the large chunks of concrete, still hanging by one or two pieces of rebar finally fail and let go.


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## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

to preserve the ties 


General opinion is that redwood will last 'forever' [madman pointed out that 'forever' is a long, long time, so maybe 20 years?] I bought a 20+ year old house with redwood siding in MA that got soaked every time it rained, (no gutters) and it was/is survivng fine. No preservatives needed. 


are the ties attached to the road bed


Not - it needs to move with the temperature. Let them 'float' on/in the ballast, like the real thing. Dig a 4 inch trench, fill with crusher fines (rock dust,) tamp down the ballast really hard, and add track. Spread a little ballast between the ties for looks. 


the spikes backing out of the redwood ties


I used ordinary steel spikes from Micro Engineering, and my track was out for 5 years until I had to pull it up. You could cut/break off the spike heads, but they wouldn't come out - rusted solid and expanded into the ties.


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## Madman (Jan 5, 2008)

Pete,

Your redwood siding had a chance to shed the water after it got wet. It never sat continuously in water. Plus, redwood has the natural oils in it that are required to keep water from penetrating it's cells. However, even redwood standing continuously in water will soften and become less serviceable.


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