# g scale signals



## shay06 (Apr 27, 2009)

Hello all, from australia
On our layout after 15 months work we have a complete circuit. What I would like to pursue now is signals.

Has anyone been down this same road before. I want semaphore signals, plus I want to be able to run more than one loco on a single line and have the trailing loco held back by a signal because the lead signal hasn't been passed plus signals at junctions so whatever gets to the junction first will get right of way while the other is held back until a signal further up the line has been passed for the trailing loco

to continue.
Regards Ian


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## Guest (Apr 27, 2009)

do you want to make that with trackpower? 
if yes, a simple block sytem with magnets and reed contacts to influence your signals and seperated blocks of track will do. 

the junctions are basicly the same, just more blocks to influence.


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## jimtyp (Jan 2, 2008)

Welcome to MLS Ian! 

If I understand your question the answer might be two fold. Signals and controls. For signals I've heard good things about Shilo Signals:  Shilo  

The second question would be controlling the trains to stop for the signals. Do you run DC or DCC? If so I've heard good things about DCC Bitswitch which has offerings for either of those:  Bitswitch


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## shay06 (Apr 27, 2009)

The Bitswitch system looks to me like a really cool idea, thats just what I would like on our layout but for one thing. I want the actual signal to animate to make it look like the signal has stopped the train. Is this achieved by a mechanical means or by a reed switch in the line? 
Thankyou for such a quick response.


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## toddalin (Jan 4, 2008)

I've done what you want to do and documented it on this site (and even make my own target signals, though they don't physically move). Do a search for the Tortoise Bump Accident Sentinental System (Bump A.S.S.).


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## jimtyp (Jan 2, 2008)

Ian, sorry, I didn't notice the "sempahore" signal. I just read "signal". I've seen the Bitswitch working with light signals, changing the signal lights appropriately based on where the train is. I don't know of any semaphore signal that moves automatically, but that sounds like a great idea. The Bitswitch system works off of reed switches in combination with a small controller to change the light signals and to start and stop a train. 



Here is a link to post by Todd showing the schematic for the BUMP ASS:  BUMP ASS


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## Guest (Apr 27, 2009)

australia being a bit far off from most producers, you might try the same thing, i am/was doing. 
(if you are using plain old track power, that is) 
i started out from the LGB epl-system. 
-reed contacts 
-electric motors, for movement of turnouts and mecanical signals 
-additional switches to activate or deactivate blocks of track. 

i opened a LGB reedcontact, took the pieces to the next radio shack and bought two dozen of each electrical thingy that was found inside. 
then i made my own reedcontacts. 
on my last layout i used only original LGB-turnout motors plus some scavenged microswitches. 
for my upcoming layout i am experimenting with the electric motors used for central locking on cars. (they are strong pushers - good for mecanical signals) 

but if you are going to use DCC or other modern stuff, i think you will need something more sofisticated/expensive.


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## shay06 (Apr 27, 2009)

Bingo! Now we are on the same page. Because I am so new to this it takes a bit of time to understand the terminology. I am trying to portray an era but if I cant get the semaphore signals to do what I want I will use the light signals. Does the power for the light signals come from the track? Or through the Bitswitch system? You'll have to be patient because this is an area I've never been in so if I repeat myself you'll know why. I've only seen a video on youtube where semaphore signals were animated but I dont know by what means or did they perform a funtion or were they there purely for cosmetic reasons. Thankyou again. There is a light at the end of the tunnel, dim at the moment but getting brighter.


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## jimtyp (Jan 2, 2008)

I've only seen the bitswitch system in action, I'm not sure of the details on how it works. Fred is the owner of Bitswitch and is very helpful and easy going. I would send him an email. 

But, my understanding is, yes the power for the light signals comes from the track. What Bitswitch provides is the electrons to automatically change the signal lights. It's pretty cool, I've seen the signals change from green to red, and the train stops (gradual stop, not sudden). Looks like magic. And then go from red to green and the train starts up again (gradual start). 

Here is another outfit, but I haven't seen their product in person:  RR-Concepts


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## George Schreyer (Jan 16, 2009)

LGB used to make semaphore signals, at least in a Euro style. 

You get get US style target signals at http://iptrains.com/category.sc?categoryId=2


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## shay06 (Apr 27, 2009)

would I be able to have Fred's email?


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## jimtyp (Jan 2, 2008)

Fred's email is: [email protected] Just let him know what you are wanting. Also let him know if you are running DC or DCC.

You can check out a video of how trains operate with his controllers. The video has one segment called "brake for signals", but it's hard to see the signals. He has a demo layout set up using signals and I've seen it first hand. 

 video


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## shay06 (Apr 27, 2009)

Thankyou for Fred's email address 
We are using a Massoth control so it would be DCC.


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## jimtyp (Jan 2, 2008)

Massoth with DCC should be pretty easy. The key for DCC is whether your DCC motor decoders have "break on signal loss". Massoth (which makes the decoders for LGB) all have that, so you should be good. The break on signal loss is how the trains break and start up again on DCC using Fred's components. And there is a CV you set to determine how slow the breaking is, it can be sudden or very gradual. I won't go into details as Fred can go into all that with you better. 

I realize you may not have this working for quite a while, or you may not end up going that route for some reason, but if/when you do it would be cool to see a video


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## shay06 (Apr 27, 2009)

I'm convinced at what I have seen and learnt so far, this will be the way we will go. I haven't seen anything else better than Freds system. 
But I'm not finished yet, I have a large span to cover with an elevated bridge and thought of an girder bridge. My question is how can I make the span look like a riveted girder bridge?


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## jimtyp (Jan 2, 2008)

You might post that question in the Track, Trestle and Bridges forum. You will get lots of help there.


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## barnmichael (Jan 2, 2008)

The June 09 GR showcases an Irish narrow gauge railroad. He uses semaphore signals. The article says there are lots of construction how-tos, etc. on the GR website. I didn't look it up, but there may be some good signal info for you there.


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## jimtyp (Jan 2, 2008)

Ian, check out the automated semaphores that Noel created: 
 Automated Semaphore


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## Chucks_Trains (Jan 2, 2008)

This manufacturer is supposed to be starting up a large scale division...

Z Stuff


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## bdp3wsy (Mar 14, 2008)

Ian, Chuck is correct they are coming out with a G-scale version. I have been using these for 2 years and the semiphors work perfect even being out over the winter under snow. I cover them with 20oz soda bottles. I have been using the O-scale ones with an added base for height and a spike. I run dcc with track power 18v and one wire between signals and they work perfect even in bright sun light. I have even used the pennsy signals removed from their mast and attached to the Aristo signal bridge. The sensors in the upper frame under the walk facing downward and these are attached to down track signals. Also the dwarf signals in O look great with G-scale and look great in a ladder yard. Jake


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## cephius (Jan 10, 2008)

shay06

Check out this Automatic Semaphore Signal from Marx 


Don't forget that electric signal control was introduced in the 1860s and developed along with the block system. Any railroad that had block control could have electric signals.


Dave


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## coyote97 (Apr 5, 2009)

ööhmmmmm....
....by reading this thread, i remind that i want to have a semaphore, but i have no clue what the US signals mean and how they work.
e.g. the cumbres-pass signal:


can anyone tell me which sign is for what meaning???


and is there a rule how to place it?


(like here in germany where we have rules for everything...filling folders...and therefore exceptions filling racks....) 
 


regards


Frank


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## jimtyp (Jan 2, 2008)

Frank, I don't know semaphores that well, but I believe the answer is not simple. The reason is, at least my understanding, is that different lines used different types of semaphores. 

Wikipedia is good place to research:  Semaphores  

Another good source:  Semaphores  

A good source for American:  Semaphores  

This is a particular signal from the AT&SF AT&SF Semaphore This diagram shows the semaphore in it's 3 possible positions  Semaphore positions 
I don't know what the Cumbres pass signal is for but I read something that implied it was connected to an auto traffic light signal, so the train engineer would know if the auto traffic at a nearby crossing had a green or red light.


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## coyote97 (Apr 5, 2009)

hi Jim,


thank you for your reply. I think i can use socalled "upper quadrant" signals. they have clear positions and seems to be standard in the US.


LOL--and i ever thought WE have difficult rules for signals!!!---LOL




regards


Frank


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## jt2048 (Jan 14, 2009)

I can't help with semaphores but I sure can with searchlight signals (North American prototype). We make G scale signals, dwarf, single and multiple targets as well as mast mounted heads for signal bridge mounting. Our technical reference website is a www.IPTrains.org. You can control our signals with aux contacts on switch machines, bitswitches and we also offer a special Digitrax SE8C compatible version.

We have quite a bit of signals control information on the tech reference web site with a special section for signaling newbies, check it out. 


Best to all ... JT


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## Paradise (Jan 9, 2008)

Havn't gone up there yet but check these out. 

LGB 50960 American semaphore 
LGB 51960 American semaphore 
LGB 51920 European semaphore 
LGB 50300 European manual semaphore 
I think there is a budget manual semaphore made by someone like Model Power too. 

Andrew 

Andrew


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## SteveC (Jan 2, 2008)

Frank

Maybe this will be of some help.

*The railroad signal dictionary: an illustrated vocabulary of terms (1908)*


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## Dan Pierce (Jan 2, 2008)

Train-Li has metal post signals now in their catalog. 

Model Power/LGB had signal lights but did not fare well outdoors due to all the plastic not being robust for outdoor use. 

LGB had American and I believe German sigjnals with moving mechanical arms tied to their EPL drives. LGB part numbers were listed above by Andrew. 

Train-Li has signal lights which can be controlled by switches on control panels, switch contacts on the drives, or DCC decoders.


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## aceinspp (Jan 2, 2008)

Thanks Dan. Will have to check these out. Later RJD


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

I'm not sure if this has been posted, but IP TRains makes some reallly interesting looking signals and signal systems

http://www.iptrains.com/main.sc


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