# Ruby Kit



## ShayCrazy (Dec 27, 2007)

Hi all! Been running my ruby for a bit now! Been great at -30 degrees C. the plumes are huge! I am sure enjoying the smell of steam oil and the challenge of running this little locomotive. I ran in to a little trouble with the assembly with timing the valves but the online guides helped me out huge! The kit overall was excellent, the instructions were very clear and it all went together very well. The only problem I have had is with the small bolts that hold the Cab together I am missing 4 or them. I will have to get in contact with Accucraft for some spares. It would also seem that the roof of the cab was put in the box while the paint was wet so I had to repaint the top but it was an ugly colour anyway. 











I had a few questions about running it though. When I am lighting the fire, I adjust the flame till it is split by the exhaust tube just shy of touching the smoke box door. The only problem with this adjustment is it runs out of steam rather quickly and I have to let it build up again. Can I adjust the flame so it is bigger? Is it going to hurt the smoke box door? Also on the subject of extending running time I was thinking of microwaving the water before filling the boiler. Not to boiling hot but at least too hot to put my finger in for any length of time. I just worry about cracking joints because of thermal shock. 











My third question is rolling stock to pull behind it. I am looking at Ozark miniatures 10' kits. They look so great with a small industrial locomotive like the ruby. My only concern is how they would react to smaller radius tracks I plan on running. Is there a problem running small flats like that? I worry about binding around the corners. 

One other qucik questions are there any folks on here in Saskatchewan Canada? I wont have track laid for some time and I would love to meet some other garden railroaders and perhaps run the ruby when the snow clears.












Thanks for taking the time to answer all my dumb questions.


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## Scottychaos (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By ShayCrazy on 14 Dec 2009 07:27 PM


I had a few questions about running it though. When I am lighting the fire, I adjust the flame till it is split by the exhaust tube just shy of touching the smoke box door. The only problem with this adjustment is it runs out of steam rather quickly and I have to let it build up again. Can I adjust the flame so it is bigger? 









Shay,
that WAY too much flame! 
you dont want the flame bigger, you want it much smaller.
the flame should stay way back in the firebox..thats where it belongs.

if the fire comes out of the actual flue (the round-tubular opening) out into the smokebox area,
by the exaust tube, the flame is much too large. 


this is normal flame technique for all live steamers..a small flame,

it allows a much longer run..
its still plenty of heat!
anything more than a smallish flame is just wasted fuel. 


can you get the flame way back there in the firebox?
if not, you have burner issues..which are solveable!
but first let us know if the flame can stay back there where it belongs..

Scot


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

WHOA... MINUS 30 C???? Stan's Handy Converter says that is -22 F.... Frost bite city! Most people have trouble running a gas fired engine at just Freezing! Even alcohol engines have trouble maintaining steam at just 0 C (+32 F) due to losing heat through the boiler shell! 

I suppose the only way to get any steam at all at -30 C would be to run the burner at flamethrower settings. 

I love "SEEING" an engine running in the "cold" but, WHOA! MINUS 30 C???? shudder!


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## ShayCrazy (Dec 27, 2007)

Yep -22F is about right. We are in severe windchill right now, winds of 20 kts are giving us a wind chill of -42C. I have been running up the locomotive indoors and just taking it outside for a couple of min to run on blocks. I will have to figure out how to get a video on youtube!


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## Scottychaos (Jan 2, 2008)

woah..I didnt even notice the temp reference! 
I was speaking about the flame under "normal" conditions.. 

but still..does the outside temp have _that_ much bearing on the size of the flame needed? 
I wouldnt think so..a "normal" sized flame is still plenty hot.. 
although I have never run below about +10 C!  

Scot


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Scottychaos on 14 Dec 2009 09:41 PM 
woah..I didnt even notice the temp reference! 
I was speaking about the flame under "normal" conditions.. 

but still..does the outside temp have _that_ much bearing on the size of the flame needed? 
I wouldnt think so..a "normal" sized flame is still plenty hot.. 
although I have never run below about +10 C!  

Scot 

You are right, that much flame would add no heat to the water at all, just burn the paint off the smokebox.

Seems to me that the butane fuel would be non-workable at those temps too. You must be using something other than butane or even a butane/propane mix to get it to continue to have gas pressure in the cold. Maybe getting it started in the house is helping, but it would not take long for the gas to lose pressure at those temps in the wind.


I have run my Aster Mikes (alcohol fired) at 32 F (0 C) a couple of times and just ONCE at 0 F (-17.8 C) and had a terrible time maintaining steam pressure no matter how much I tried to increase the fire. Convection heat loss was considerable... especially at 0 F... I could hardly get it to run more than a few feet (light, i.e.: no train) but what the pressure had dropped to below 5 PSI. I had to stop and put the auxilary blower in the stack to get a draft to improve the fire, but that also drew cold air into the mix and that was counterproductive to heating the water. After a few minutes with the aux blower on, I could then move a few more feet and I'd have to do it again. I think I did it twice and then "I" needed to get some heat on me and I packed it all up and went inside!

I am glad I tried to run at 0 F that one time and running at 32 F was a bit better, but I only tried it with no wind at all. I have a hard time believing any "toy" engine would run well in a wind sucking the heat away through convection. I like running when it is around 60 to 70 F (15 to 21 C) when there is a very light rain and very high humidity. Great steam plumes then and not all that uncomfortable for ME!


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## topshed (Jan 20, 2008)

Hi, 

It looks to me as if the only problem you have is the low temperature (that is as long as the burner will run just in the firebox under normal circumstances). If I remember, Ruby has no boiler jacket to insulate her important parts from the elements, so any heat you put into her will get sucked out pretty quickly in cold weather (and boy is that cold!!). You've tried the only option, which is to push as much gas as possible into the burner. That may keep the boiler hot, but it doesn't do the loco much good. If you want Ruby to live to a ripe old age, I suggest you don't run her in winter!


Martin


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## gwscheil (Aug 6, 2008)

Heat loss is murder at low temperatures. Alcohol doesn't vaporize and butane, even propane, have no pressure. My Ida slows noticeably going through one windy corner on a mild day. Cab mounted fuel tanks help some - but only if you can get her lit.

Your other question is easy - I have no problems running any 2 axle car through 2 ft radius curves behind Ida. Ida, Jane, BAGRS, Willi, all turn the same curves. Even my new Accucraft Forneys will do it, but not happily until break-in is finished. Bachmann passengers and most 4-axle 40' cars do fine as well, so the 10' are easy - although tight journals may need some adjustment. All are much happier on my bigger track with 2.5' to 4.5' radius curves. But any fatter curves starts blocking pathways, and runs in the baking sun - not fun in a Missouri summer.


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## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

Can I adjust the flame so it is bigger? Is it going to hurt the smoke box door? 
Yes. There are a gazillion threads in the archives here that pertain to Ruby burners. Here's one I found useful: 
"Solving My Ruby Burner Problems" *http://www.mylargescale.com/Communi...C_ID=43220* 

Also on the subject of extending running time I was thinking of microwaving the water before filling the boiler. Not to boiling hot but at least too hot to put my finger in for any length of time. 
I've run alive steamer in 10F weather (20 below.) 










I take my small soup heater and pre-warmed the water. I don't think you'll have thermal shock problems - I've poured warm water directly on the gas tank. (I have a photo somewhere of the ice that formed due to the gas evaporating and cooling the drops of water! 

There is also a 'Steam Class' article here: 
"SteamClass 2004 - Build A Live Steam Accucraft Ruby" *http://archive.mylargescale.com/art...ch4_01.asp*


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## Jerry Barnes (Jan 2, 2008)

You will have an easier time running it in cold weather if you use the 70/30 butane/propane mix. Burns better in the cold than straight butane.


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

How "warm" is "warm"?

What you want to do is "CONTROL" the temperature of the fuel tank to maintain it warm enough that the liquid fuel will vaporize at a rate just high enough to produce the pressure necessary to provide "gas" to burn in the burner. But, NOT so HOT that the tank bursts! That temperature is in the range of from about 65 degrees F (18 C) to less than 110 F (43 C) give or take a few degrees.

Much less than 65 F (18 C) and the cooling effect of the liquid evaporating will lower the temperature such that the evaporation will cease and there will not be enough gas pressure to feed the burner.

Much higher than that and the pressure MIGHT become too high for the tank... NOTE: the upper limit is proabably around 150 F (65 C) or so, but there is no need to "push the limit of safety" when "room temperature" is perfectly satisfactory AND THE MOST DESIRABLE for operation.

Relative QUANTITY also plays into this... One drop of boiling water dropped on the tank will have little effect, but a gallon of 150 Deg F (65 C) water may impart enough energy to raise the temperature of the fuel (and thus the pressure) to the point of bursting the tank, resulting in a highly flammable gas cloud!









You might notice that as the fuel is used the flame tends to need adjusting to keep it the same size. Most people assume this is because there is less fuel in the tank and thus the pressure has gone down which is then pushing less gas to the burner... but this is not true! The pressure would remain the same if the temperature is kept constant as the fuel is used. But as the fuel is used, its temperature drops and this reduces the rate of evaporation and that is what reduces the pressure, and thus the fuel flow.

IDEALLY, you want to MAINTAIN the temperature of the fuel such that the pressure remains the same throughout the use of the fuel. If you can keep the temperture the same as the fuel is used, the flame in the burner will remain the same and you only need to adjust the fuel valve to increase or decrease the fire to control the amount of steam that is available to run the engine and not be adjusting it due to gas pressure changes.


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## seadawg (Jan 2, 2008)

I remember one cool fall day I was having problems with my burner staying lit. Cleaning the jet didn't help. Maybe the fuel tank is not filling. There must be someting wrong with the fill valve. I take off the fill valve. How did all that water get in there??? OH, it's not water, the fuel's not evaporating!


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Posted By ShayCrazy on 14 Dec 2009 09:26 PM 
Yep -22F is about right. We are in severe windchill right now, winds of 20 kts are giving us a wind chill of -42C. I have been running up the locomotive indoors and just taking it outside for a couple of min to run on blocks. I will have to figure out how to get a video on youtube! 
Shay, 

Where did you purchase your Ruby Kit? 

FYI, I'm in the next door province Alberta. We hit a record low on Monday past -45C at the airport. No wind chill factored in here. 


gg


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## ShayCrazy (Dec 27, 2007)

Seadawg, that is realy funny! I can imagne myself thinking the same thing. I think I will explore the option of a new burner. My Ruby must be an older one with the burner problems. Myne has the square fuel tank so I am assuming it is the older version. I have been running it indoors with an ambient temperature of 18 degrees C. I have been heating up the water with the microwave to near boiling before filling the boiler. This helps it get up to steam quicker. Folowing your advice I have adjusted the flame so it is completly in the flue. I was running it where there was a small flame being forked by the exhaust tube. Now it will run for about 45 seconds or longer when I flip the wheels to push the pistion past top dead center. It seems to run out of steam after a good minuet of running and then I have to close the valve and let it build steam again. To get it running again I need to flip the wheels again to get it to start again. I have read the FAQ about rubys and I will time it again in a few more boiler fills ( this was boiler fill number 4). I figure it should run a little better after things loosen up a bit. 

Thanks for the help. 

Cheers 

Adam


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