# Wood reefer roof walk weathering



## steam5 (Jun 22, 2008)

I’m about to weather a wood reefer I have been building. I’m wondering if someone could help me out with a few questions regarding the roof walks.

- Were roof walks ever painted?
- If they were painted I’m sure it wouldn’t take long before it was warn away from foot traffic?
- The boarded area around the hatch which allowed the workers stand on to drop ice in. Was this painted? Did the paint ware away from foot traffic?

Any tips would be great, I haven’t really found a photo showing exactly what I wanted to see.

Thanks
Alan


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## R.W. Marty (Jan 2, 2008)

It is my understanding that roofwalks were never painted because paint could be slippery and bare wood was not.
That goes for all car roof walkways and working platforms.

Just plain weathered wood is all that should show.
Rick Marty


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Just try SAYING "Wood reefer roof walk weather" three times fast!


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## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

I've heard they were left unpainted, but I've also seen photos that seem to indicate they were painted. At the same time, I've also seen photos of roofs which were completely devoid of any paint due to weather, so who knows whether the walks were painted on those or not. Aesthetically, I like the visual contrast between the painted roof and unpainted roofwalks. 

Later, 

K


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## steam5 (Jun 22, 2008)

K, I have seen pictures showing them painted as well. The confusion! 

I have painted them on my model because I got carried away and attached them before thinking about painting, but I did stain them under the paint. What I am thinking of doing is sanding back the roof walks and it should reveal the stained wood. 

Would like to know if I should try and scrub all the paint back or just some, depending on if the prototype was painted or not. 

Alan


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## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

In June of 08 I started a thread on a Phil's Narrow Gauge 40' reefer kit that I had built that spring. 


40' reefer kit
I used an olympic grey stain for the roof walk.










At the time I painted the car I was told that rules prohibited the painting of the walks. This permitted the crews to observe any deterioration of the wood as well as providing better footing.

Chuck N


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## david bunn (Jan 4, 2008)

Alan 
There is a colour pic on page 389 of vol 12 of the RGS story if you can sneek a look somewhere.This shows RGS #2101, a 26ft wooden reefer, and as far as I can see the whole roof structure is painted in oxide red except for the upper surfaces of the walkways and hatch covers. 
Hope this helps. 
regards 
David


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## FH&PB (Jan 2, 2008)

I, too, had heard that painting roof walks was verboten, but rules can change over time. It probably depends on what era you're modeling. It would be nice to have a date associated with that (assumed) rule change. 

I would bet that, if they painted the walks, they also dumped sand into the paint to make a non-skid surface. We've heard that was done on loco running boards in the 19th century; why wouldn't they do the same on other tread surfaces? (Thus: put a dead matte overcoat on the roof walks don't leave any shine on them.)


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## steam5 (Jun 22, 2008)

Chuck that’s the exact kit I’m doing right now! Yours looks great, well done. 

David, I don’t have that book, but that photo is exactly what I wanted to see! I have a huge PFE book and when I had a flick through that nothing like the photo you described jumped out. 

I’ll try and remove the paint around the hatches and roof walk. If it seems I’m going to stuff things up by doing it I’ll just quit while I’m a head and remember it for next time. We are always learning. 

Alan


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## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

Here's a prototype photo for some guidance. Standard gauge, not narrow gauge, but it shows roofwalks were painted. 

http://www.shorpy.com/node/893?size=_original 

BTW, you owe it to yourself to bop around that web site's collection of railroad photos. Some fascinating stuff from as early as the 1860s! 

Later, 

K


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## Bruce Chandler (Jan 2, 2008)

That's only if you're modeling May 1943 and Chicago & North Western Railroad  

Nice picture


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## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

Yeah, yeah... 

Seriously, there's some interesting details in that photo. Notice the box car near the front? Very clean on the sides; looks almost fresh out of the paint shop except for some soot on the roof. They look to be express cars based on the trucks. Also, I wonder what the white "X" on the doors of the box cars on the adjacent track meant? 

Take a look at the color of the rails on the first and third visible tracks. Kinda looks (on my monitor at least) like a prototype for brass rail.  

Later, 

K


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## steam5 (Jun 22, 2008)

That is a great photo, full of interest and it does look like brass rail. 

I am currently finishing off my reefer today; hopefully get some photos to post tomorrow. 

I used chalks to simulate the roof walks being scuffed of foot traffic.


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## redbeard (Jan 2, 2008)

"BTW, you owe it to yourself to bop around that web site's collection of railroad photos. Some fascinating stuff from as early as the 1860s! 
Later, K" 

Thanks! You are correct there are some great pictures there. Especially a lot of Civil War shots of the U S Military Railroad. Worth trolling around in to find pictures of rolling stock and of buildings. 

Larry


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## Bruce Chandler (Jan 2, 2008)

I guess at some point it became legal to paint the roof walks. Any idea when that was? Or was it really always that way?


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## andrewhamblyn (Oct 27, 2008)

I think the walkways were more like stained or "washed" rather than painted.... 

Andrew


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Bruce Chandler on 04 Oct 2009 07:31 AM 
I guess at some point it became legal to paint the roof walks. Any idea when that was? Or was it really always that way? 

My guess is that it was the other-way-round... at some point it became illegal (by regulation, not "law") to paint them when OSHA decided too many workers had slipped and fallen on slick paint.


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## Dougald (Jan 2, 2008)

I do not know the specifics of the regulations imposed in the USA.

In Canada, roofwalks were unpainted from the beginning for safety reasons but as far as I know, it was not enshrined in the safety regulations. The advent of better braking systems commencing in 1883 with the Westinghouse trials and following a steady implementation of the new airbrakes led to changes routinely in the regulations. By the early years of the 20th century it became quite rare for brakemen to walk the roofs of cars and even rarer to have to use their club to set brakes on cars. AAR regulations changed the brakewheel position to the car ends in 1927 (?? can anybody verify??) but this really only put in place a rule that anointed general practice as mandatory. By this time, almost all cars were steel and roofwalks were always painted. Even wooden Fowler single sheathed cars had painted roofwalks.

Roofwalks were ventually eliminated and brakewheels moved low on the car ends in the 1970s ending completely the era of walking the car roofs.

Regards ... Doug


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## Totalwrecker (Feb 26, 2009)

I've always painted mine.... 

I think you'll find that after the addition of air brakes the brakemen came down off the cars. Retainers were mounted lower on the ends of cars and I think were set before the train started rolling. 
No longer were men riding on top ready to slow a train by turning brake wheels, the engineer now did that with a touch of air. 

John


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## Dougald (Jan 2, 2008)

It should be noted that manually setting the brakes of cars on sidings to prevent them rolling was done and continues to be done today. As long as the brake staffs were mounted to have the brakewheel above the car roof, the brakeman climbed up there to set the brakes. New cars with the brakewheels on the end were required after 1927 (?) but the practice of mounting brakewheels there began earlier.

In looking at old pictures, I would say that painting roofwalks appears to have begun in the early years of the 20th century.

Regards ... Doug


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## rwjenkins (Jan 2, 2008)

I've heard of sand being added to paint to create a nonskid walking surface on ship's decks, I wonder if railroads did the same with painted wooden roof walks.


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## Big65Dude (Jan 2, 2008)

It's my understanding that it was the trainmen's union that insisted that roofwalks be left unpainted because, otherwise, they would be slippery when wet. I suppose whether or not they were painted was a function of just how strong the union was, and how much influence it had on management, at any given railroad.

BTW, here's how I portrayed the roof walk and ice hatches on my (only*) reefer.




























* Yellow is just too hard to weather!


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