# New LGB - Is all made in China now ?



## Merlin83 (Sep 23, 2011)

Sorry if it's a dumb question (it prolly is) - but I guess most if not all of the LGB is now or has been made in China for awhile...and Hungary too.

Not trying to be an LGB snob or elitist...but I wonder if the quality is of the same level ?

Are there other G scale manufactures, that make locos and other rolling stock ? I know of KISS and Train-Line45...but can anyone list others ? More importantly, items that are accessible - that is items in stock and have good ratings ?


Thank You


----------



## alecescolme (Dec 20, 2010)

Take a look at Liliput, similar to Bachmann, but Euro style 
http://www.liliput.de/en/products/liliput/g.html 

Alec


----------



## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

Merlin:

There are several manufacturers of "G" gauge cars and engines. There are a number of different scale that run on our 45mm gauge track. If you are interested in North American trains there is Accucraft (1:20.3, 1:29, and 1:32), Aristo Craft (1:24 and 1:29), Bachmann (1:22.5 and 1:20.3), MTH (1:32), and USAtrains (1:24 and 1:29).

Phil's Narrow Gauge and Hartford products produce kits of Colorado Narrow gauge cars in 1:20.3.

If you are interested in European prototypes, I can't help you very much there, other than the obvious LGB and Piko. 

Chuck


----------



## Doug C (Jan 14, 2008)

FYI; Last (?) year, AristoCraft recently rolled out a "Class66" loco in 1:29 ! http://www.bachmann.co.uk/showvid.php?id=5 And some euro intermodal cars and containers . . . . 


doug c


----------



## Dave Meashey (Jan 2, 2008)

My new LGB 23881 Uintah 2-6-6-2t was just delivered yesterday. The label on its box read "Made in China." I have read that other items are being made in Hungary.

Yours,
David Meashey


----------



## mbendebba (Jan 22, 2011)

Posted By Dave Meashey on 26 Jan 2012 07:07 AM 
My new LGB 23881 Uintah 2-6-6-2t was just delivered yesterday. The label on its box read "Made in China." I have read that other items are being made in Hungary.

Yours,
David Meashey
Dave: That is one of the largest LGB locomotives I have ever handeled, relatively easy to take apart, extremely difficult to handle. I installed in it, for a member of this forum, a Massoth XLS sound decoder. The fellow was quite impressed with the way in runs, and sounds. 
Mohammed
http://www.allaboutlgb.com/


----------



## Treeman (Jan 6, 2008)

Hartland continues to be made in the US. Piko is all from Germany. LGB is coming fro China, Hungary, and Germany. Depends on the item.


----------



## Dave Meashey (Jan 2, 2008)

Mohammed; 

If it is any consolation, I believe the HO version I have (made by Mantua, but standard gauge) is the same way. Both drive wheel sets are free to turn. I think Mantua may have designed their locomotive to take an HO radius as small as 15 inches. Of course, I can get my hand entirely around the HO locomotive. 

I handle the LGB locomotive very carefully right now. As time goes by, I may discover some tricks for holding it more securely. It's a pity that no model train designer has thought to design a locking mechanism for the rear power unit. I realize that it would probably add too much to the production cost, but a simple locking device for the rear power unit would allow folks with wide radius curves to operate prototypically - and folks with tight curves to allow the rear unit to swing. The rear unit could also be locked for easier handling. 

Well, it's fun to dream. 

Best, 
David Meashey


----------



## krs (Feb 29, 2008)

I have a few of those types from LGB, but the European ones - not quite as long and no guiding or trailing wheels 
http://www.gbdb.info/details.php?image_id=133 

I find these locos to be pretty rugged, I don't handle it with kids gloves. 
But I don't carry it a lot out of the box either. 

If you need to carry it a lot and are nervous about it, I would suggest you build (or buy) a simple carrier. 
The ones I have seen are basically a section of track the loco sits on in a case with a handle arranged in such a way that the loco can drive right from the track in the case onto the track of the layout (and back) - you never even have to touch the loco. 

Knut


----------



## Fritz (Jan 11, 2008)

Are there other G scale manufactures, that make locos and other rolling stock ? 

There are: Accucraft or Missouri Works in the US come to mind. Ozark offer a few kits for 45mm and Gn15. 

The UK or Germany are shopping paradises for large scale items made in the countries. Get some local magazines to read the ads or have a look at the foras. Be prepared to import yourself. 

LGB is mainly made in Hungary now. Some still in china, but they plan to bring the production to europe again. They have no production facilities in Germany anymore. 
Piko has 150 employees in Germany, 350 in China. They say, the G-Stuff is assembled in Germany. 

Have Fun 

Fritz / Juergen


----------



## mbendebba (Jan 22, 2011)

Posted By Dave Meashey on 27 Jan 2012 09:17 AM 
Mohammed; 

If it is any consolation, I believe the HO version I have (made by Mantua, but standard gauge) is the same way. Both drive wheel sets are free to turn. I think Mantua may have designed their locomotive to take an HO radius as small as 15 inches. Of course, I can get my hand entirely around the HO locomotive. 

I handle the LGB locomotive very carefully right now. As time goes by, I may discover some tricks for holding it more securely. It's a pity that no model train designer has thought to design a locking mechanism for the rear power unit. I realize that it would probably add too much to the production cost, but a simple locking device for the rear power unit would allow folks with wide radius curves to operate prototypically - and folks with tight curves to allow the rear unit to swing. The rear unit could also be locked for easier handling. 

Well, it's fun to dream. 

Best, 
David Meashey 

Good morning Dave:

I have to be super careful since I am handling someone else's locomotive. LGB crocks and mallets also have drive wheel sets that are free to turn, but they do not seem to cause me as much anxiety everytime as the Uintah did. The Uintah has heavy weights in the pistons, the krocs and euro mallets don't.

I ended up placing it on a slightly backward inclined L shaped foam bed when working on it, and picking from the front and the rear when moving it. 

Regards,

Mohammed


----------



## Dan Pierce (Jan 2, 2008)

In general, LGB American rolling stock is coming from China and has been this way before Marklin. 
Most European was made in Germany, but now is made in Hungry as is the track and switches.


----------



## Axel Tillmann (Jan 10, 2008)

Rumars have it that all LGB is going to Hungary, but I still have to see Americna rolling stock that comes from Hungary. But honestly it doesn't matter. In my opinion Hungary or China - not much of a difference.


----------



## aceinspp (Jan 2, 2008)

Glade to see someone finally breaking away from China. May be a big improvement. Later RJF


----------



## krs (Feb 29, 2008)

Posted By Axel Tillmann on 29 Jan 2012 03:50 PM 
Rumars have it that all LGB is going to Hungary....
That was actually more than a rumour. 
It was an announcement by Marklin and the CEO actually went to China to arrance that.

But it seems it's not that easy to move production out of China since some LGB product is still manufactured there even in 2012.


----------



## Axel Tillmann (Jan 10, 2008)

I only said rumor, becasue that info came from you almost 1 year ago, right around the disaster of the Mogul shipments, and then when the UNITAH arrived (and the Hooker tank car recently or the re-production of the RhB stake car and Postal cars) I was disappointed to see that they all were still made in China. Hence I didn't know if Maerklin was still executing on the move, or abondoned it.

I would be happy they would move out of China all together. It seems that Hungary has better QA and better assembly.

I can imagine that it is not easy. Let's see.


----------



## Chata86 (Dec 5, 2010)

what was the last train made in the german factory? there is a video on youtube that was taken just before it was closed. looks like it may have been the yellow museum trolley? 21390


----------



## Cougar Rock Rail (Jan 2, 2008)

The V200 was also one of the last assembled there I believe.


----------



## dt (Feb 3, 2013)

Talked to Ron Gibson from LGB at the convention this weekend about this topic. Ron says all tooling has been pulled from China and all future product will be made primarily in Hungary and some in Germany. He also said LGB/Marklin was finally purchased by a company that he believes will be a positive for future product development. Nice to see another company pull out of communist China. Now if we could get that exchange rate down the euro made stuff might be able to compete. On a side note I talked to a rep from USA trains who said their American line and the military series cars are made in the USA. The toy tanks and trucks that sit on them are still made in China but the rest is made here. My layout is as China free as humanly possible so its nice to find some more items to choose from.


----------



## Cougar Rock Rail (Jan 2, 2008)

Hi dt (nice RhB avatar btw!), 

Did Ron say anything about the Simba/Dickie changing their N/A distributor (Walthers)? In my mind that's step one towards getting things back in control on this side of the pond. 

Keith


----------



## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

Just a friendly reminder to keep our personal political views from becoming the focus of our posts here. Nothing wrong with a "Buy American" sentiment, but for many of us, the luxury of choosing which trains we purchase based on country of origin doesn't exist. It's important to remember that such expressions--however good-intentioned--may be viewed as expressing something of a superiority complex over those who either have different priorities, or simply no other alternative. 

Later, 

K


----------



## dt (Feb 3, 2013)

Keith, he did mention the Walthers situation. Apparently they are under contract until 2015? With the recent change of ownership they were not sure how that contract would play out or if it was still binding but when that ends there would likely be changes. Im with you on the Walthers deal, the sooner their gone the better.


----------



## Lorna (Jun 10, 2008)

That is good to hear that they got all the molds back. I wonder if LGB will be bringing the Genesis back?


----------



## Cougar Rock Rail (Jan 2, 2008)

Good question on the Genesis. I still think that and the associated coaches were some of their best efforts and value to date. 

Keith


----------



## stevedenver (Jan 6, 2008)

if they do re-issue the Genny, wouldn't it be great if they also corrected the wonky always on red lights! 

there are some great new paint schemes which could well breath life into a second wave of sales 

having taken a gander at the light PC board, which is tight indeed and deciding not to try to splice in a diode to correct the 'always on' reverse light feature, (the board is clearly the same as that designed for the F7 with the always on classification lights near the number boards) 

it would be nice if this were improved/ corrected


----------



## vsmith (Jan 2, 2008)

http://www.dcctrain.com/preorder/images/kat_Nloco_176-6022.jpg



















Heres a few paint schemes they could update them with


What they really should do is redo it as an MP36, which being on numerous commuter lines across the country, far more roadnames to offer.


----------



## San Juan (Jan 3, 2008)

Posted By vsmith on 11 Jul 2013 12:01 PM 





What they really should do is redo it as an MP36, which being on numerous commuter lines across the country, far more roadnames to offer.

An MP36 in G scale? Wow, it took forever to finally get one in HO. Would be cool though in large scale.


----------



## Ltotis (Jan 3, 2008)

I would like to see an F40. When I spoke with people at the old LGB (Pre-Marklin) the reason for not making it was not enough RR's ran it. Me, I say hit where your competition ain't. F40's with commuter rail cars would go well with the Genny's and Amfleets. There was also some talk about the Amfleet molds being made to easily make units with single dors on each side and the old Metroliners. The reason I bring this up is that younger people see Feight (maybe) or Commuter trains more then Amtrak units. 
LAO


----------



## xtcbct (Jul 15, 2008)

I wonder if there are any plans now for the Genesis and Amfleets to resurface. Seems like everyone is talking about them, and it seems new LGB is slowly resurfacing. I wonder how many other modern passenger equipment LGB had planned to make if they hadn't gone under?


----------



## Randy Stone (Jan 2, 2008)

I question the excuse for not making a certain model locomotive just because it wasn't used on enough roads. In HO and a lot of other scales, it's not been a problem as you seen various road names on lots of locomotives that were not correct, but still appealing to a lot of buyers.


----------



## Treeman (Jan 6, 2008)

Walthers has lost exclusive distribution of LGB in North America, as of the end of the year.

Heartland Hobby Wholesale gets a chance.


----------



## Dr Rivet (Jan 5, 2008)

Mike
a] End of 2014?
b] Or do they have 11 more months until the end of 2015? 

Hoping for [a].


----------



## CliffyJ (Apr 29, 2009)

Randy Stone said:


> I question the excuse for not making a certain model locomotive just because it wasn't used on enough roads. In HO and a lot of other scales, it's not been a problem as you seen various road names on lots of locomotives that were not correct, but still appealing to a lot of buyers.


Kinda late for me to chime in on this, but what the heck. Can I say heck?

Anyway, I agree Randy. For example, maybe you recall the HO Virginia & Truckee searchlight car. I think it was made by "Lifelike". Ironic name. Might as well offer a V&T intermodal or rocket launcher, haha! But, I guess folks would still buy 'em, proto or not.


----------



## Treeman (Jan 6, 2008)

They started last month. Talked to them at the CB show.


----------



## krs (Feb 29, 2008)

My understanding is that Heartland Hobby does not have an exclusive agreement, some large LGB retailers can import directly.


----------



## Treeman (Jan 6, 2008)

That may be correct, Walthers is continuing, not exclusive.


----------



## stevedenver (Jan 6, 2008)

I think that given the relatively tiny percentage of large scalers, compared with almost any other scale, and the smaller sales volume and higher prices of each unit, it is simply common sense to sell locos that will have the broadest appeal. FWIW, Randy, they have yet to hit the bulls eye as far as my personal preferences go in such offerings. Piko ran another mogul, etc. 

I must say, albeit only from the sidelines of ignorance, I am delighted to hear that Walthers wont be the exclusive distributor. Having once, long ago, worked at a Walthers local shop here in Denver, seemingly they require close to full retail pricing. 10% discount was typical sale pricing.

Right or wrong, the high price of LGB, back in 1986, dissuaded me from entering G scale initially, until I discovered Trainworld and its large discounting.

Simply, if I am typical, LGB is expensive when heavily discounted, no less at full retail. I have always been happy to pay for it, but, will rarely pay full retail. 

I hope that Marklin gets LGB back in to the hobby and on the shelves in a big way, and, more importantly, that they make spare parts available as well. My recently purchased set of long saxon historical coaches as well as a Saxon Meyer, all made in ??? (not listed on the cars or boxes-hungary, ???) are superb. Paint imho, is more realistic than LGB. And as I have one old LGB version of the 4 axel Saxon coach, I can say, the plastic and weight are about identical, as is the quality.

IMHO, this is essential if one is to 'invest' in more expensive locos. Otherwise, the 'disposable brands' with lower pricing become a bit more attractive.


----------



## krs (Feb 29, 2008)

stevedenver said:


> I hope that Marklin gets LGB back in to the hobby and on the shelves in a big way, and, more importantly, that they make spare parts available as well.


Marklin seems to be listening.
They beefed up their spare parts availability but specifically only parts for LGB products that they have manufactured after 2007 when they took over LGB.
That's understandable.
For LGB items that Marklin has not yet manufactured there are a few places that carry spare parts - Modell-land in Germany, one can get those parts from Train-Li in the US - there is also Warenreich on ebay with a large selection.
And for very common parts that require replacement on a regular basis, sliders, brushes, these types of things, there are a number of third party manufacturers who have picked up the ball.

Knut

BTW - with reference to the thread subject title.....
All regular LGB is now manufactured in Hungary; the molds that were in China have been returned.


----------



## Dan Pierce (Jan 2, 2008)

Dennis the original title/post was about LGB, not other brand names.


----------



## Treeman (Jan 6, 2008)

Piko DCC is made by Massoth, they did most if not all of the electronics for LGB.


----------



## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Not really... it was about LGB, and LGB coming from China and LGB quality.

Not China in general.

Greg


----------



## Dan Pierce (Jan 2, 2008)

Treeman the original MTS (MTS I) system and decoder 55020 were made by LENZ.
The LENZ 55020 decoder was serial only and only CV1-4 were programmable.
The Massoth 55020 had more features, parallel and more CVs that were programmable.


----------



## Treeman (Jan 6, 2008)

What was the time frame for Lenz with LGB?


----------



## Mike Toney (Feb 25, 2009)

I also believe the old LGB was in the final steps to produce a USRA 0-6-0 before the collapse. I would love to see that project finished. Might get me to actualy buy a new production LGB item. Everything I have is pre bankruptcy. I got my start in G with LGB and pretty much everthing I have aside from a few Kalamazoo items is LGB. It was never cheap, I remember the bitching going on when the Moguls first hit the streets and for years afterwards about how expensive it was. But it was about the only game in town at that time other than the toy like 4-4-0 from Kalamazoo. Which also can be made quite realisitic with some detailing and painting. I know my friend would like to see the Amfleets return, he got the Genny before the collapse, but the coaches are hard to find and bidding wars erupt when they do surface on ebay. Mike


----------



## stevedenver (Jan 6, 2008)

I think you're correct about the 0-6-0 and, I recall it having a slope back tender 
I too would love to see that produced

I recall it being referenced in a photo of prototypes shown regarding new locos to be produced.

another loco that was once on the boards, and a prototype produced in brass was a Uintah 0-6-2t -which I don't think survived to production planning. there is a photo in one old catalog with Rolph holding it. That's one I would love to see as well.

I don't know if we will see the re-release of Amtrak locos and coaches-my guess ....not, since they didn't seem to sell well first go round

perhaps with seemingly a greater popularity of standard gauge versus NG in G scale, we might-

All I can say, is that for those of us lucky enough to have them, regardless of their size, or accuracy, they are truly magnificent. Lighted control panel in the cab, blindingly bright LED lights, smooth silent running, etc.
They do seem to 'require' a good deal of space and track length. A short train is about 8-10 feet long!

Even if you love old time steam, narrow gauge, etc. as do I, they are simply commanding by sheer size and 'silverness'. I cannot imagine we will ever see them as affordable as they were when first offered.


----------



## krs (Feb 29, 2008)

That 0-6-0 loco is listed in the database:
http://www.gbdb.info/details.php?image_id=3849

Knut


----------



## Mike Toney (Feb 25, 2009)

That engine if done right and at a good price would help LGB regain thier foothold stateside. So far it appears they have no interest in rekindling the fire of USA mainline prototypes that LGB of America spearheaded at one time. Its a shame IMHO as this is the one brand that I supported the most. 100% of my track on both my indoor and outdoor is LGB, and other that a few odd pieces, all my trains are LGB. I have always loved the bulletproof drives and just a better overall "feel" to the product. Now I havent really put any new production in my hands to compare, I am only speaking of the older German built items or the late Chinese production under German LGB supervision such as the Genesis locomotive my friend owns. I feel that Piko is slowly filling the void that LGB left in the USA. Thier little camelback steamer and its brothers is thier "LGB Mogul" so to speak. Mike


----------



## stevedenver (Jan 6, 2008)

DennisB said:


> They were also talking about the poor quality coming from China and the absence of German quality.


with respect, I have read all the posts twice and saw not a single mention of this.


----------



## krs (Feb 29, 2008)

The LGB Made in China wasn't as bad as people made it out to be.
The packaging was actually better than the LGB products made in Germany.

Ironically, the quality of LGB made in the US ended up being pretty poor - that's why LGB's attempt to manufacture product in the US only lasted for a very short time.

Knut


----------



## Mike Toney (Feb 25, 2009)

While I havent experienced it first hand, I have been told the new production lacks the 'feel' of the German production. Not sure if they have changed plastics used, going away from the expensive Luran S from BASF was was the backbone for Lehmann. I know my friends Amtrak diesel definatly feels different when compared to my old 2018d Mogul. The shop in Zionsville has a new production C&S Mogul beside an older C&S #6 from the Lehmann era and it looks cheaper in my eyes. Long term durablity is still a ? when it comes to the new stuff. Guess time and use will tell. I will continue to spend my $$ on older production items. In the end we should be grateful that Marklin and Simbie Dickie group that owns them are continuing the LGB line, and that suppliers to the old LGB stepped in with spare light bulbs and track skates ect and continue to do so. Mikie


----------



## Garratt (Sep 15, 2012)

I have a pair of hot metal cars 49560 branded as Marklin produced from 2010. No country of manufacture marked.
When I pick them up and run my fingers over them the plastic produces a higher sound tone as if less dense. Even the early ToyTrain range have an entirely different sound/feel. Hard to explain what I mean but I suspect the newer plastic is lighter and more brittle. It was the first thing I notice when I bought them and picked one up, other than that they had metal wheels and look quite nice.

The later wooden Saxonian cars marked 'DR' made in 2008 by Marklin seem much the same as my early ones by LGB made in 2004~2006 except they no longer come with metal wheels.

Andrew


----------



## krs (Feb 29, 2008)

Yes, LGB "China" production never used Luran-S material, that was certainly a change. But many people complained that Luran-S was too shiny and products didn't look realistic, so moving away from Luran-S wasn't necessarily a negative in many people's mind.
When TrainLine came out with their products they made a big deal about using Luran-S in their products but I never saw that being embraced by their customers.

It's also true that over the years the thickness of the plastic was reduced, too much in some cases where the light of a lit passenger car will actually shine through the body. People painted the interior blak to fix that problem.
And talking about painting - the original LGB products were molded in the colour of the finished product and then painted that colour again.
Lately I see more and more items that are molded in one colour, typically grey, and then painted in a different colour - that's fine as long as the paint isn't scratched.

I suppose Marklin like any other manufacturer tries to save cost on one side and provide what they think the customer wants and will pay for on the other.
An example of that is that all LGB cars, except Toy Train items, now come standard with LGB metal wheels which is a very visible change and something customers appreciate.

In the end it all comes down to running a successful business and with the continuously shrinking Large Scale market that ain't easy

Knut


----------



## Mike Toney (Feb 25, 2009)

I agree Knut, the companies still have to make money in that market. I think the Luran S was the best to combat the effects of UV at the time the LGB line was taking mainstream. And it has done well IMHO. Long term outdoor use will be the only good test of current production LGB and how well it holds up both mechanicaly and from UV exposure. Including the metal wheels as standard should have been done many many years ago. I just hope they start to put more effort into recapturing the American market, espicaly with the demise of Aristocraft and little new product being released. I have seen nothing really new from USA, Hartland, Polks ect. While I know we will never get the old LGB back, they are still a major player in Large Scale here in the States if they want to be. Mikie


----------



## krs (Feb 29, 2008)

Mike,
The only Large Scale manufacturer that has intoduced really NEW US type items recently seems to be Piko.
Not to everyones taste but they sell enough to report pretty large sales volume increasesyear over year in the US.
I think for LGB it's a bit of a Chicken and Egg situation - need to demonstrate the sales potential is there or even better, make the sales, before investing in tooling for really new products. 
For European prototypes, LGB has invested quite a bit in recent years, brand new steam locos, many new and substantially modified cars, the 3-car Allegra - all new tooling.
LGB has come out with a specific 2015 US Product catalog and have Ron Gibson back on board - so there is certainly a push in that direction.

Knut


----------



## Mike Toney (Feb 25, 2009)

Getting Mr Gibson back is a good step in the right direction. I dont know that we need to see "new" tooled trains, but some reissues like Amfleet coaches along with other USA rolling stock that hasnt been reissued to any degree for awhile now. Finishing up the USRA 0-6-0 they were in the midst of at the time of shutdown would be fantastic, giving modelers a mainline steamer and one that would run on R1 curves. This leaves no garden railway modeler out, one of the old LGB's rules. Getting away from exclusive Walthers distrubution is another step in the right direction. Piko really has filled during the time LGB was away, the rolling stock is mostly reissues of the old MDC/Roundhouse line of G scale, the 0-6-0 camelback steamer is totaly awsome, but I would like to see proper valve gear on that model for what it costs IMHO. That point aside, I applaud Piko for the wonderfull effort to fill the void. One area I feel the old LGB missed out on was parts and upgrades someone could purchase. Marklin/LGB could offer a upgrade package for all the C&S moguls(or any mogul for that matter), consisting of the Beartrap spark arrestor and the butterfly snow plow. Or take the C&S mogul and do the version that had the air tank on top of the boiler with the bell on top of the tank. That uses old tooling with only a minor tool needed for the boiler top air tank, and if they wanted to, the unique head light those moguls carried. The new LGB has poured funds into new tooling for Euro models, I think in time, espicaly with Ron back in the fold, we will see the same here in the States. For now I have enough old LGB items on my wish list to keep me busy for several years as my budget only allows me to pick up a couple new items each year. Mikie


----------

