# Building DRGW #215 Pagosa Springs Combine



## Steve Stockham (Jan 2, 2008)

This is the newest kit from Rio Grande UK and I was lucky enough to get one of the first runs from Jonathan at Electric Model Works. It is essentially designed to replace the sides of the AMS coach with laser cut wood sides that you put together. This is the third one I have done and it is slightly more complicated than the RGS #259 but not prohibitively so. These kits make a perfect introduction to building your own models. They have step-by-step instuctions with pictures so even the novice can easily construct a very nice model that he or she will be proud to run!

One of the problems with these kits though is that, in order to make them, you need an AMS coach and they have been in short supply recently! I was able to get around this problem by using Colorado & Southern coaches (apparently, these weren't as popular as the D&RGW and RGS versions.) Since I am changing the sides this wouldn't inconvenience me in the least and I was able to procure the very last one that I was able to find. (It is reported that new ones should be arriving at retailers sometime this month so hopefully the drought is over...)

As with the RGS #259, the D&RGW #215 was, for a time, unique. This is the car that LGB modeled their "Drover's Caboose" after! While the LGB model is compressed and as such, looks like a caboose with a baggage door and some passenger space, the actual #215 was a combine with a cupola attached. Take the cupola off and the #215 becomes just another combine (which actually happened.) With it on, however, it becomes a "three-in-one" caboose, baggage/mail car and coach all in one car! Some people have intimated that the car is "butt ugly!" I, however, do not share their less than enthusiastic apraisal! It was for this reason that I put a pre-order in for the kit at the National in Denver last summer!

Well, enough of that. I thought I would share some pics of the bash as it is being constructed. I didn't take any shots of the kit before I started as you can see what they look like if you go to http://sites.google.com/site/riograndemodelsuk/ where they have pics of the prototype being constructed.

Since it's a combine I went ahead and cut off part of the passenger seating. I have applied the red paint for the cushions and still have to apply the gold to the sides:










Due to the arangement of the combine the stack has to be removed and filled in with modeling putty (still drying):










Here's the cupola ready to be fitted to the clerestory roof:










Here's a shot of the new sides. They fit right in place without any mods needed:










I notched the clerestory roof so the cupola could be inserted. 
This was my own idea as the directions call for it to be constructed later:










Here's a shot of the cupola fitted to the clerestory roof. 
I still have lighting to wire up so it's not glue in as yet:










One thing that LGB, HLW and the rest didn't put in their models was this lantern that sits directly
on top of the cupola. It's a dual sighted lantern:










I have constructed and stained the roof walks but they will be one of the last details to go on.
So far, this has been the most enjoyable of the kits to build! More pics when I finish.


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## Jerry Barnes (Jan 2, 2008)

You are becoming the expert on these Steve, nice work!


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## Gary Armitstead (Jan 2, 2008)

Steve, 

I'm interested to see how your AMS roof comes out after removing the C&S lettering and repainting. How will you remove the lettering? You are probably one of the first to get this combine built. I'm following this very closely. Looking great! I'm STILL trying to get a good Pullman Green spray on the sides of my #212 combine. 

It would be great if you could sneak out here to run your train at Fairplex in June!


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## Steve Stockham (Jan 2, 2008)

Gary,
I just use the Floquil Pullman Green in the bottle and a brush to paint over the lettering. The key is to paint the entire board that the lettering is on and then there isn't a real problem with matching colors! The gold decals take care of any slight discrepancies. The real test for me is going to be doing the roof where the old stack used to be! To get it perfectly flush is going to require using flat black and color sanding multiple times! If I have to I will use a spray can to get an even coat. The great thing about this car is that it was designed to be used in a very small train so I can use it as my traveling car.


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## San Juan (Jan 3, 2008)

I like the roof lantern. Nice they included it as part of the conversion kit.


I wonder if they sell the roof lantern as a separate piece? I'll have to check their website. Many of the short caboose fleet on the D&RGW (and second hand D&RGW to the RGS) had the roof lantern. Wouldn't work for me as it is 1:20.3 and a bit too early in time period for our layout. But I bet many others would be interested in at least one.


Are you going to cut out the roof under the cupola? Or leave it as is and not worry about cutting? Cutting out the roof is likely the hardest part of the conversion...that is if this step is done.


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## Gary Armitstead (Jan 2, 2008)

THX Steve. It's cold and rainy out here today in "sunny" SoCal, so I'm doing some painting indoors on my #212 combine. I wasn't going to remove the stack, but now I think after seeing what you're doing, I will do it. David's kits are really a lot of fun and they produce a great model.


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## Steve Stockham (Jan 2, 2008)

Matt,
I thought about cutting out the hole for the cupola but I decided against it. However, it _did_ give me the idea for the notch! The lantern has a hole in the bottom so I am going to run a light up to it that can be independently controlled. I need to figure out if this combine ever sported marker lamps...


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## Gary Armitstead (Jan 2, 2008)

Steve,

The combine I'm modeling doesn't have the lettering on the top board. It's actually on the side of the car just below the windows.

Opps! The photos too big. I can't see where I can delete it and resize. Help moderators!


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## Steve Stockham (Jan 2, 2008)

Okay.... that's gonna look cool! Are you doing it with the roof walk? What lettering do you need to get rid of? Just use a brush and it should work fine. I just painted out my Colorado & Southern letters and it worked great! I notice that #212 has seven windows. Are you going to try and add another?


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## Gary Armitstead (Jan 2, 2008)

In looking in my Colorado Rail Annual No. 25, I don't see ANY photos with the Pagosa Springs combine sporting marker lamps. There are hangers for them, though.


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## Gary Armitstead (Jan 2, 2008)

Steve, 

With the time period I'm modeling, 1947-1950, this car will be "minus" the roofwalk and handrails. David custom-made my sides for me. It is EXACTLY like the photo....seven windows. I need to get rid of the "Colorado & Southern" on the board above the windows. #72 was the only J&S coach Jonathan had at the time.


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## Steve Stockham (Jan 2, 2008)

If you're painting the sides with a Floquil spray can then painting the top board with a brush will make the sides come out even. Use a very good (artists) brush and put a decent amount of paint on on the first coating and do it quickly so that it will flow together and eliminate the brush marks. Are you going to give your car a final semi-clear/ satin coat? After you're done with the roof, tape off and give it a quick spray! Simple and it looks good! By the way, I want to see pics of your #212! C'mon, give!!


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## Gary Armitstead (Jan 2, 2008)

Steve, 

My wife has the camera. I'll try to get some pix this weekend of what I have completed so far. I have too many projects going at the same time is the problem. I need to stick to ONE and get it done! Just finished the wood overlay for three AMS D&RGW flats and try to finish a flat car load for them. Western States double cylinder stationary steam engine.


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## Steve Stockham (Jan 2, 2008)

Hmmm.....an interesting development has occurred! I went to fit the roof walks and I looked at the cupola and realized that there is about a 2mm gap between the walls and the clerestory roof! I kind of gave myself a "Gibb's slap" and remembered that the clearance is for the clerestory facade that I didn't use. Obviously, I was going to have to add some material before I glued it which led me to my next dilemna: how to glue the bloody thing?!! There was just enough space when I finished adding material to use a small strip of white glue that filled in the cracks nicely. A brush and some flat black will complete the look! Since I'm not cutting out the cupola hole I have decided not to light it. I _am _going to go ahead and add marker lamps as the photos do indeed show brackets. Hopefully, if all goes as planned, I should be done sometime next week.


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## Gary Armitstead (Jan 2, 2008)

I'm going to use the clerestory facade. But in my case, it won't cause any problems I'm going to use Tracksides marker lamps....I just need to find some lenses to fit. I'm anxious to see your finished combine.


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## Steve Stockham (Jan 2, 2008)

Here we go! D&RGW Combine #215 is now finished! I opted not to add the marker lamps as there are no pictures of it while sporting them! I chose not to cut out the hole where the cupola straddles the clerestory but I did add a light to go into the lantern that sits on top of the cupola (does anyone know exactly what that lantern was for?) I wired it so it can be independently operated from the cabin lighting. This kit was a step up from the #259 RGS Combine but was not too difficult to construct. The instructions were very explicit and the color pictures were invaluable!
One thing new about doing this kit that truly pleased me was the addition of Ceaderleaf Custom Decals which don't come with the kit but can be ordered from Jonathan at Electric and Steam Modelworks. These decals are the best I have ever used!! They were easy to work with, robust (believe me,_ this_ is a serious consideration!) and they look fantastic!! The car is wired for battery power and I replaced the original AMS wheels with ball bearing wheel sets so the car rolls practically by itself. I am now a firm believer in building your own kits or scratchbuilding your own rolling stock as each time I complete one of these I really have a great sense of satisfaction! I highly recommend these kits for anyone interested in something other than a generic AMS J&S coach!

Here's a few shots of the completed project:



















Here are a couple of shots of the #215 lit up:



















One shot with a flash:


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## San Juan (Jan 3, 2008)

Looks fantastic


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## Gary Armitstead (Jan 2, 2008)

Dang! That's nice!









Am I correct in thinking that you repainted the original ends to match the color of the NEW sides? The lighting REALLY sets off. Did you get the batteries from Jonathan, to fit in the restroom area? You are my inspiration!!


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## Steve Stockham (Jan 2, 2008)

Nope (although it would have been easy enough to do), that's the Floquil Pullman green matching the AMS green! The car doesn't have the batteries in it per se. Jim Carter (pimanjc) showed me a method whereby, using a battery car, you can power an entire train of coaches! I just plugged it into the battery boxcar and flipped the switches, one for the inside and one for the lantern.Of course, your method will allow you to run it anywhere! By the way, thanks for the compliments!


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## up9018 (Jan 4, 2008)

The car looks great Steve, very nice job.


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## docwatsonva (Jan 2, 2008)

Beautiful work Steve. Thanks for the pictures and construction info. I've got a 259 kit and am looking forward to the project. You've inspired me.

Doc


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## R Snyder (May 12, 2009)

Steve, 
It looks like you did a great job. I can hardly wait to see it in person.


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## Richard Smith (Jan 2, 2008)

Great job Steve! That's a real classic.


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## peter bunce (Dec 29, 2007)

Hi, 

Nice work, with a good looking result - thanks for the photos of the assembly as you were building it.


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## chuckger (Jan 2, 2008)

Super job on #215 Steve, very nice

Chuck


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## Stan Cedarleaf (Jan 2, 2008)

Great job, Steve. The little extras you've added to the combine are fabulous. Glad the decals worked so well for you.


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

Wow Steve I agree that came out sweet lookin, nice job.


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## Steve Stockham (Jan 2, 2008)

Thanks for the kind words guys! Stan, thank _you _for coming out with really easy to use decals! Until I tried yours I preferred Dry-Transfers but the ease with which yours went on is converting me!


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## R Snyder (May 12, 2009)

Steve, 
I think you gave me your email address last summer, but I seem to have lost it. If you have mine, could you send me an email?


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## Steve Stockham (Jan 2, 2008)

Richard,
No biggie. It's [email protected]


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## mjwon6 (Apr 21, 2009)

Steve, 
Nice job on the car. I'm building one myself. Hopefully I'll finish it before I die.


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## stevedenver (Jan 6, 2008)

great model






did the 215 ever have tuscan red paint-with white (as opposed to gold ) lettering


ie the earlier DRG paint?


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## Steve Stockham (Jan 2, 2008)

I don't believe so. The #215 was originally #212 and didn't have the cupola ( that was added by the Pagosa Springs area shop.) All pictures of #215 that I have been able to peruse show it with the D&RGW green scheme. There_ is_ one exception: Barry Boggs made a 1:22.5 scale scratch-built model of #215 which makes my little project look like a kindergartener's first attempt! He did his in the Aspen Gold, black accent w/silver roof scheme. I don't know if he did this because all of the rest of his rolling stock was in this scheme and he wanted it to match or if it was historically accurate. Either way, it's a gorgeous model!


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## San Juan (Jan 3, 2008)

Steve,

I'm not an expert on #215 as it never really caught my attention so I've never really done much research on the car.

But an Sn3 manufacturer (P.B.L.) has the car available in the original red paint. I think this is accurate since they strive for accuracy. But again I'm not an expert on the car so I can't be sure.


Here is a link to photos of their model

P.B.L #215 


And a photo:










I can confirm that #215 was not painted in the gold scheme. No info in any of my books ever mention it getting gold paint. But Barry likely painted his this way to match the rest of his "Silverton" painted train.


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## stevedenver (Jan 6, 2008)

many thanks -i see this- 




 i always thought the tuscan scheme had gold lettering-like the RGS Edna --but this white works for me and my re-paint of my car-(the old LGB version-which does look rather pathetic compared to the subject model-but which i still like-i appreciate the comparative size pic-)






in a short research on line-  believe the 'lamp' on the cupola was in fact a housing in which to hang a brakeman's lantern inside-to signal the engine crew -(about what i dont know-possibly to stop i imagine should there be a problem spotted)   


i see your down in bayfield- 
nice place-used to visit there rather frequently 

my inlaws used to live there on 35 acres 

my old friend from high school is the pharmacist there- 

tried to buy the inlaw's place but they sold it before we had the chance to make an offer-that was my idea of a wonderful vacation spot 



gosh i love that part of the state-trains, mexican food, amazing mountains, horses, indian ruins, and not too many people






actually i understand that the 215 was re-numbered to 212 after the cupola was removed


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## San Juan (Jan 3, 2008)

Posted By stevedenver on 24 May 2010 12:19 PM 
many thanks -i see this- 

i see your down in bayfield- 
nice place-used to visit there rather frequently 

my inlaws used to live there on 35 acres 

my old friend from high school is the pharmacist there- 

tried to buy the inlaw's place but they sold it before we had the chance to make an offer-that was my idea of a wonderful vacation spot 



gosh i love that part of the state-trains, mexican food, amazing mountains, horses, indian ruins, and not too many people






actually i understand that the 215 was re-numbered to 212 after the cupola was removed



Our cabin is actually out at Vallectio lake, but Bayfield is our post office so technically we're Bayfield. The "not too many people" has kind of changed in the lasty few years. A lot of recent development in Bayfield (and the overall Durango area). Which means one lane highway 160 is pretty much a minor traffic jam most of the day.



Interesting that 215 was renumbered to 212. Must have missed that in my research over the years. Well that and all of my Rio Grande books are at our place in Vallecito while I'm currently in California for my job so I don't have easy acces to my sources. But this means #215 for sure wore Rio Grande gold, just as #212.


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## Bryan Smith (Jan 2, 2008)

Steve,Question about Drover Caboose with lantern on the roof. How that work? Is that can be a Red Light Markers lantern?


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## stevedenver (Jan 6, 2008)

you know bryan i am not certain- 

from the brief info research i found- 
 perhaps in the earliest days of railroading it was used as a rear facing red light-just like a brakeman grabbing a red lantern or flag to protect the back of a stopped train-and i think this must have been say-the 1880s -maybe also to signal the engineer-the engineer could use his whistle to signal brakeman to get on the top of cars and tighten the brakes as well as release them-but i imagine the brakmen would also need to signal or confirm completion or all is well etc

but later -if i understand things - 
the roof lantern was not used primarily to signal to the rear of the train (red) but rather to signal forward to the engine crew-as to what colors were used for what purpose-i dont know (yet)-pre raido it must have been a way to communicate at night with the engine crew 



 in looking for the info on cupola lanterns i came across info re ATSF actually used wig wags on the cupola-a painted target with 2 lights (red and White) centered in the target facing the engine in order to signal the engineer-probably re brakes pressure- brakes, breaking off of the train, etc 






im sure someone here will give the real story soon 






but ive always been fascinated by pic of really old equipment having these cupola lanterns-they always seem to be pre-1900 or thereabouts


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## Bryan Smith (Jan 2, 2008)

Thank for info Stevedenver...









That is Beautiful work Steve Stockham.


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## Gary Armitstead (Jan 2, 2008)

There is a VERY long and convoluted story connected with the 1st and 2nd #215 AND the 1st and 2nd #212. The story is in the book "Rio Grande Narrow Gauge Varnish", Colorado Rail Annual #25, pages 110 to 116. I'll scan the pages today and post them here. David Gormley of Rio Grande Models UK was the one who told me the story. So I bought the book. Typical of narrow gauge railroading with the number changes.


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## Gary Armitstead (Jan 2, 2008)

I scanned the pages that explain about the 1st and 2nd #212 and the 1st and 2nd #215. Good story.


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## stevedenver (Jan 6, 2008)

gary thanks -fascinating -i learned all about this car-all stuff i never knew






presuming all pre 1940 DRG passenger stock was tuscan red


 so if i read this correctly, the only time the 215 actually was in service with cupola to Pagosa  1928-1934 

  and only had the cupola until 1941-all in some type of red scheme-with perhaps a very short (6 months or so in the green if at all -it appears unclear if the repaint to pullman was at the same time as the cupola was removed but that would seem most likely-the re-build would necessitat paint and it might as well be the new pullman green)  

so
i presume it was built and stayed in the tuscan DRGW scheme - 

    then in 1936 repainted the odd box car red? (depression hard times and a shortage of $$$ as well as of tuscan,  so tuscan mixed with box car red to make do ???) and im guessing too that this is when the white lettering occurred-because again if i understand DRG painting-tuscan had gold lettering-but again depression era -so fright car white lettering ill bet


and then when returned to #212 it was painted green-sans cupola

so then this would mean 
  it was operated in red with cupola  



 and maybe, if at all, less than a year in pullman green, but probably not ever in green=


how odd-i guess every time i saw the rare photo of 215 with cupola, in b and w, i presumed it was green when in fact it must have been the dark tuscan red  =so thats the color ill use for my repaint


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## parkdesigner (Jan 5, 2008)

In a simple format:

Car Built in 1879 as the "Caliente" - Painted RED - Lettering GOLD
Car Rebuilt in 1887 as the "215" - Painted RED - Lettering GOLD
Car POSSIBLY repainted approximately 1918/1919 - Painted GREEN - Lettering GOLD
Car POSSIBLY repainted between 1925 and 1928 - Painted GREEN - Lettering YELLOW
Car Rebuilt in 1928 into the "Pagosa Springs Drovers Caboose" version - with Cupola, Walkways, etc. - Painted GREEN - Lettering YELLOW
Car Repainted in 1936 - Painted RED - Lettering WHITE (Possible theory has been that post-1918 red painted cars were done by the Rio Grande to designate "Civilian Conservation Corps" (CCC) cars - this was *NOT* passenger car red, but another, surplus, red.
Car Rebuilt in 1941 with Cupola and other parts removed. Renumbered "212" - Painted GREEN - Lettering YELLOW.


So, with respect to the "Pagosa Springs" version of the car - 

...from 1928 to 1936 painted *GREEN* with YELLOW lettering.
...from 1936 to 1941 painted *RED *with WHITE lettering. (NOT passenger car red)
...POSSIBLY during a portion of 1941 painted *GREEN *with YELLOW lettering, but doubtful.


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## Steve Stockham (Jan 2, 2008)

Wow! (You learn something new every day here!) Hmmm......well, well, well.....(of course you guys realize there's no way I'm gonna repaint that sucker!) I'm afraid it's just gonna have to stay the way it is!







Good discussion though! Gary, thanks for scanning the book......and we're still waiting for pics of _your_ #212!!


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## Gary Armitstead (Jan 2, 2008)

Steve, 

I hear you on the pics of my #212! I ran into a BIG problem with the kit. When David sent the #212 kit to me last year, he was thinking about #215, YOUR car. As I'm putting the trim on the windows, I discovered I was short quite a few pieces. I e-mailed David and he said he was thinking of the number of windows YOUR car had. This occurred just after the volcano blew in Iceland, so NO flights were coming out of the UK or very rarely. He finally sent some out and these were lost in the postage somewhere. He sent some more out last week and I am patiently waiting now.


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## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

Waiting for windows can be such a pane... 

Later, 

K


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## Steve Stockham (Jan 2, 2008)

(*Groan*) Ooooh.....bad pun alert!!!







I hear you Gary! I ordered a "special" kit to make Baggage Car #126 (single door) and it took about 3 months to get it. Fortunately, I wasn't in any hurry at all. David does great work but as he states on his website, he is a small company and special orders sometimes take a little while (entirely understandable!) Your #212 is definitely a "special order" so David didn't have the luxury of working out the "kinks" on a prototype. I'm not surprised there was a small glitch or two. It's just unfortunate that "Mr. Murphy" decided to show up and screw with you! Do you already have decals for it? Jonathan is now getting them from Stan Cedarleaf and I won't use anything else! I had to make a special order to Stan for my #126 but it took all of three days! Coincidentally, I am typing this just as I have finished the #126! I just wired up the battery connections (the car itself is not lighted but I needed a line to go from the battery boxcar in front to the passenger cars behind.) and have it sitting on my workbench. It came out pretty well! I'm going to send David some pictures of the finished model so who knows? Maybe my little "special order" may become the "experimental prototype" for a Baggage Car!


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## stevedenver (Jan 6, 2008)

ah ha! 
so it went green possibly as early as 1918-thanks park 
-still going to do the tuscan i think 

so when did DRG use green with white lettering?-i thought that was a 40's feature


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## Gary Armitstead (Jan 2, 2008)

Steve, 

David has been great to work with and I have no complaints with either him OR his products. This 212 combine started with talking to David about a combine with "history". So he started with the 215 and changed window configuration and a few other "little" changes. This window trim problem is probably more my bad than anything else. He sent the kit around March of 2009, but I couldn't get started with it immediately because of eye surgeries. Then when I did get going, I discovered that David was working with the Pagosa and its eleven windows, not the 15 window 212. 

I have the decals for 212 from Stan. He is THE BEST. When the decals first arrived from Stan, they were for the later 212, just before the "gold and black stripe". I e-mailed Stan with the pictures of 212 just after the cupola was removed from 215 and renumbered as 212. The D&RGW is not at the roofline, but an older, simple D&RGW on the side of the combine just below the window sill. I had the NEW decals in less than two days AND NO CHARGE. He said just get him some "tea" when we meet up at the BTS in June. That I will do. 

Sounds to me like you're building a complete San Juan Chili Line train. Pictures when you have it completed? Will you have one of the old RPO's? I've thought about having David make one up for me. I need to contact him about one. I don't think he wants to hear from until my window trims and NB's castings arrive!


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## San Juan (Jan 3, 2008)

Posted By stevedenver on 25 May 2010 09:18 AM 

so when did DRG use green with white lettering?-i thought that was a 40's feature 
I've never seen or heard of green with white lettering before. Just green with either gold or yellow lettering. Not saying that it didn't exist, but it is a new one at least to me. 1940s coaches were mostly green with yellow lettering.


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## Steve Stockham (Jan 2, 2008)

Ah! Vindication!! I checked the PBL website and they offer the #215 in Red _and _Pullman Green w/Gold lettering!







Apparently, they feel that there was a time when the #215 sported the green scheme and who am I to dispute them?







(At least that's my story and I'm sticking to it!) Gary, I never meant to imply that you did. I was just commiserating with you. I went with the #126 because the #127 had the roof walk and a particularly unique vent and I didn't feel like going that far again! What I _did_ have to do is learn how to do rivets on styrene ( not hard at all!) which has given me another step toward increasing my modeling skills.


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## Steve Stockham (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Steve Stockham on 25 May 2010 10:21 AM 
Ah! Vindication!! I checked the PBL website and they offer the #215 in Red _and _Pullman Green w/Gold lettering!







Apparently, they feel that there was a time when the #215 sported the green scheme with yellow lettering that they call "Dulux Gold" and who am I to dispute them?







(At least that's my story and I'm sticking to it!) Gary, I never meant to imply that you did. I was just commiserating with you. I went with the #126 because the #127 had the roof walk and a particularly unique vent and I didn't feel like going that far again! What I _did_ have to do is learn how to do rivets on styrene ( not hard at all!) which has given me another step toward increasing my modeling skills.


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## Steve Stockham (Jan 2, 2008)

Oooookay, that's weird! I used the "edit" function to change my post and it came out as a "quote?" (_Very_ weird...)


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## Gary Armitstead (Jan 2, 2008)

When I came back to MLS this morning, I was trying to figure out what you were talking about in that quote. I don't believe I ever mentioned color. Maybe confused with another poster? Anyway, the mailman didn't bring my trim and parts for 212 today. Bummer. I'm anxious to see your 126 baggage car.


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## Steve Stockham (Jan 2, 2008)

Gary,
By my saying that, "I didn't imply that you did," I was referring to your post saying that you didn't have a problem with David or Rio Grande UK etc...(whatever!) Re-reading my post, I can see where it got confusing! I was responding to the whole color thing and then I did an 8-track and shifted to your topic without a pause (oops...) Sorry for the confusion! Well, the pics are posted! I'm going to have to get the whole train out for a picture! I'll say it again, "These kits are great fun!"







Keep the faith Gary! Those parts will get here soon!


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## Gary Armitstead (Jan 2, 2008)

OK, now I understand.


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## Andre Anderson (Jan 3, 2008)

I believe the roof lantern use a red aspect towards the locomotive to tell them that they needed to stop., Now as to red marker lights, the last car on a train always carried red markers as this is what defined the end of the train. With train orders you could not move untill the train that you were supposed to meet had passed. A train was defined as "An engine or more than one engine coupled, with or without cars, displaying a marker and authorized to operate on a main track". Marker lamps were to the rear "A train signal that is used to indicate the end of the train". And classification lamps or flags were used on the locomotive. The class lights or flags would have displayed the following, White, extra train, Green, a second or more following sections of a scheduled train, the last section of a scheduled train would have had it's class lights out, A scheduled train will display no class lights or flags. So if you were in a siding waiting to meet a train, you would first look at the loco to see what class of train this was and what locomotive this was, if this was the train your were supposed to meet you could not proceed until it's markers had passed. This why every passenger car and caboose had brackets on the corners, so the train crew could hang the marker lights on the end. as a caboose it would have had markers facing the rear all of the time. 

Andre


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## stevedenver (Jan 6, 2008)

perhaps the white lettering on pullman green that i was thinking of was the RGS??


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## San Juan (Jan 3, 2008)

Posted By stevedenver on 30 May 2010 11:49 AM 
perhaps the white lettering on pullman green that i was thinking of was the RGS?? 
Yep, RGS did use white lettering on green passenger cars as one of their various lettering/paint schemes.


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