# Accucraft Britannia owners



## SalM (Jan 2, 2008)

Neil and others with the Britannia........ looking down the Stack you can see the blast pipe at the base of the stack and the blower pipe off to the side at about 11 o'clock. The hole in my blast pipe is a loose 1/16th of an inch.
I measured it with an allen wrench and then measured the wrench. It is much larger than the blower nozzle hole.......does yours look like mine or are the 2 holes just a little different in size with the blast pipe being a little larger.
Thanks for looking...Sal


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## David Leech (Dec 9, 2008)

Hi Sal, 
Incidentally, Neil emailed me a copy that he just received from G1MRC with regards to instructions of installing the wicks. 
If you did not get a copy, then I am sure that Neil can forward you a copy if you contact him. 
Just in case it helps solve your mystery. 
All the best, 
David Leech, Delta, Canada


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## nsimpson (Mar 15, 2010)

Hi Sal, 
The orientation of my blower pipe to the blast pipe is at 0230 looking from the front of the engine, which may the same as yours if you were observing from the pressure gauge side. Openings are the same size. As David has mentioned, i have the wick cutting instructions if you do not. 
Cheers, Neil.


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## SalM (Jan 2, 2008)

Thanks for looking.......my blast pipe is many times larger than the blower pipe and that is probably why I cant maintain pressure when running...no draft !!!
As for the wick instructions, if you are going to DH I can make a copy there...if not maybe you can email me a file........Thanks again.......Sal


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## iceclimber (Aug 8, 2010)

That is a bummer. Can you fix it yourself?


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## SalM (Jan 2, 2008)

I think so........remove the blast nozzle....silver solder it closed and re dill to the correct size.............have to remove the smoke deflectors and the front of the smoke box to get access...........


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

I think the draft up the stack needs some velocity to it or it will not create enough vacuum in the smokebox. The exhaust blast alone may not be enough. Try running with the blower open just a bit. If the blower nozzle is very small, on the order of #70 drill, that should give enough draft without consuming a lot of steam. I have to run my scratchbuilds with the blower open just a wee little bit.


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## nsimpson (Mar 15, 2010)

Sal, 
i would not mess with taking your engine apart. My blast pipe is sevveral times larger than the blower pipe as you estimated in your first post - I don't think that is your problem at all and a major hack into your loco could give you more problems than you have. Be patient. 
Neil.


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## iceclimber (Aug 8, 2010)

Yeah, I don't think there would be that type of problem with a gauge 1 model company engine. Then again, I guess some things can get overlooked at the assembly line.


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## nsimpson (Mar 15, 2010)

Sal, 
I just re-read my first earlier post and realize I might have confused you. What I meant was my blast pipe and blower pipe were the same size as yours - the blast pipe being much larger. I did mention that when I read your response and wondered then why you figured you were getting 'no draft'. Sorry for any confusion, but I don't think the 2 pipes are an issue at all. You mentioned in a very early post that you were not using the wick material that came with the loco. Is there a reason? I can send you a copy of the wick cutting info, but will need your email address. I am not going to Diamond head. 
Neil.


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## SalM (Jan 2, 2008)

Neil.....my email [email protected] My engine and your engine blast pipe wise look alike......I was confused....
Wick material choice was just that on my other alcohol engines this works well.....I am able to raise steam on the fan and can raise it further with the blower alone. Pressure drops quickly as I open the regulator. If I open the blower just a bit pressure drops even more to where the engine wont move.
I am taking the engine to DH where a solution my be found..............


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## Kovacjr (Jan 2, 2008)

Sal - Take a 6" long 1/16 brass rod and stick it into the blast pipe. Look at it from the front and side, is it straight up and down? If not you have to tweak it a little to make sure its straight and in the center of the chimney. The blower is usually just to its side.

The nozzle being over 1/16 seems a bit large for the bore size. Being there are others that seem to run fine with the same nozzle Id say there are other factors on yours. 

You say you have no draft when running, does it do the same with the blower at idle or with a fan at idle? Axle pump on or off? Full boiler?

I would check the smokebox and make sure it is completely sealed. Take the door off and make the door was sealed to the smokebox, make sure the smokebox is sealed to the boiler, also where the blast pipe enteres the smokebox.


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## SalM (Jan 2, 2008)

Not home right now ...nozzle seems to be in the center of the stack but will check with a rod later. As for making steam.....everything seems normal... fan then blower until you open the regulator....the engine pulls strong but slowly the pressure decreases to about 30 lbs. Opening the blower to assist ...hurts......the engine runs better not pumping only because of the reduced load not because of increased steam pressure. I can stop the engine, put the fan on and in no time have 50/60 lbs of steam.....start running again and back to 30 lbs in short order...........it seems the blast pipe will not do what the fan or the blower will do....


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## Kovacjr (Jan 2, 2008)

What are you pulling and at what speeds? A light load running slow may not produce enough draft 

Also how far down is the tip of the nozzle? If its too high near the petticoat (if there is one) it will not produce proper draft too.


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## iceclimber (Aug 8, 2010)

So this train doesn't run good unless it is pulling a heavy load? Is that normal?


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## Joel779 (Jan 2, 2008)

With alcohol (or any engine requiring a draft) this is not unexpected. If you are running light and slow, you can crack open the blower. The only problem usually is the water usage goes way up, With a well designed boiler system, the draft created by the blower will 'enhance' the fire to keep up with the steam used. The axle pump on the other hand probably will NOT keep up with the water usage at slow [email protected] url(http://www.mylargescale.com/Providers/HtmlEditorProviders/CEHtmlEditorProvider/Load.ashx?type=style&file=SyntaxHighlighter.css);@import url(/providers/htmleditorproviders/cehtmleditorprovider/dnngeneral.css);


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## highpressure (Jan 2, 2008)

Alcohol fired loco's require a load behind them to get a stronger draft. The more weight behind it the more draft created thus more steam as there is more "PULL" on the fire. I have many Alcohol fired locos and when running light they require a bit of blower to simulate the extra draft created by a load from the cars being pulled. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ga2uUXRNK74


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By iceclimber on 10 Jan 2011 01:46 PM 
So this train doesn't run good unless it is pulling a heavy load? Is that normal? 

It helps, but sometimes you have to run with the blower cracked open. Live steam, especially the alcohol type have their little quircks. You have to learn how your particular engine operates. And learn the track it runs on.


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## SalM (Jan 2, 2008)

If you look at a 4 Jan post on New Years Steamup 2011 you will see a first run of a Britannia on rollers making tons of steam......mine wont do that......
When I open the throttle after a 50/60 lb steam buildup it quickly drops to 30 lbs.......maybe there is a leak after the throttle so not all the steam is going up the stack...I don't think thats the case 
but not sure. The engine pulls like an ox till the pressure retreats to 30 lbs.......my wick configuration is the same as one of another owner I know and he makes tons of steam.......the mystery continues..


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## Shay Gear Head (Jan 3, 2008)

Sal,

Looks like you will be spending some time around the Arkansas Gang gettin her fixed up some. Is Dave Hottman going to be there?


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## afinegan (Jan 2, 2008)

After you run it and the cylinders are heated up. 

1. Stopped the engine and open the blower (sometimes you dont need much, just enough blower to allow the pressure to build)

2. let it build up pressure to blow off
3. crack the throttle a little bit, let the engine crawl and lower the blower until the pressure stabilizes or slightly raises 
4. keep opening the throttle just a little bit and back off the blower slightly until you understand how much blower is required for each speed running (don't run cars at this point, u can do that later). 

If the pressure drops too fast then you need more fire.
To accomplish that:
1. wicks slightly longer - make sure they are installed properly 
2. more alcohol feeding the wicks (do this in small increments, you don't want to have a spill (check the clear alcohol tube feeding the wicks, when your running with the blower it should not be filled to the top, it should look like a small river leading toward the wicks at the bottom of the tube (basically using up its supply of alcohol) 

The alcohol wicks, flues(heat ID) and blower is a finely calculated math problem, you get that wrong and the engine wont work. usually if you cant get the normal stuff to work, take the loco to a local club that runs other alcohol engines (hopefully a scratch builder will be present or someone who knows alcohol fired engines well), they should be able to figure what the loco is lacking and help you fix it or at least diagnose the problem. There is a lot going on to keep a loco in steam!

Ohh, your going to diamondhead, most of the experts are there, they WILL find out your issue! (wish I was going this year...)

Andrew


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## David Leech (Dec 9, 2008)

Posted By afinegan on 11 Jan 2011 12:08 PM 
2. more alcohol feeding the wicks (do this in small increments, you don't want to have a spill (check the clear alcohol tube feeding the wicks, when your running with the blower it should not be filled to the top, it should look like a small river leading toward the wicks at the bottom of the tube (basically using up its supply of alcohol) 


Andrew

Andrew,
Sorry, but I disagree with this option.
The concept of the alcohol burner and the chicken feed is that the level looks after itself.
The clear tube should always be full of alcohol. 
Just open the fuel control a couple of turns and the level in the burner will be correct.
Trying to lessen the flow of fuel will just starve the burner, and it will not operate efficiently. 
Opening it full will also NOT cause any spills as the chicken feed will stop that.
If you do have it overflowing, then somehow air is getting into the system in the alcohol tank. 
At least, that is my view on this subject.
All the best,
David Leech, Delta, Canada


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## SalM (Jan 2, 2008)

The engine and I will be at DH......Dave H. will be there and a resolution will be found. For those following this thread I will post the fix on MLS.....hope it wasn't operator error, on second thought that would be the easiest to fix....TKS everyone.


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## afinegan (Jan 2, 2008)

David you are correct on how the chicken feed works. (makes sense) 

I deducted this info from how my Aster lion works, When its running in top shape, the chicken feed cant keep up with a full supply of alcohol. You can literally see how the fire is doing in my engine by the alcohol level dropping. But I bet larger engines don't do this. 

Andrew


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## Kovacjr (Jan 2, 2008)

I have a feeling that your blast pipe may be too large. I was chatting with a friend with one and his pipe is smaller than 1/16. Which makes sence being that the cylinders are smaller in bore. Too large of a opening you will not get the pressure needed to create enough draft. 

See you this weekend! I'll he there somewhere just dont know where!


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## nsimpson (Mar 15, 2010)

Sal, 
The Britannia you refer to running on rollers on Jan 4th is, I believe, a 'Flying Scotsman'..... 
Neil.


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## David Leech (Dec 9, 2008)

Neil, 
Actually he meant January 2nd, the one with the two lovely little ladies, and it IS a Britannia. 
http://www.mylargescale.com/Community/Forums/tabid/56/aff/11/aft/118678/afv/topic/Default.aspx 
All the best, 
David Leech, Delta, Canada


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