# WIRING QUESTION



## Madman (Jan 5, 2008)

I have one of those inexpensive transmitter/receiver set ups that I hope to put to use on LGB's hot metal car. All of the original wiring for track activation has been removed. I hope to use the transmitter and receiver to change the polarity of the motor so as to dump then reset the bucket. I believe that the wiring diagram I have is correct, but I have doubts. Here is the wiring diagram and a photo of the receiver. The receiver has four latching switches. Each switch has a common terminal and two adjoining terminals. One is normally open while the other is normally closed.










The receiver is powered by twelve volts to the terminals on the upper right. These have nothing to do with the switches. I figure that if I close the first switch, the bucket will dump. Then I would have to open the same switch before closing the second switch to make the bucket raise. Makes sense in my mind, but am I missing something?


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## dbodnar (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Madman on 31 Mar 2011 09:23 PM 
I have one of those inexpensive transmitter/receiver set ups that I hope to put to use on LGB's hot metal car. All of the original wiring for track activation has been removed. I hope to use the transmitter and receiver to change the polarity of the motor so as to dump then reset the bucket. I believe that the wiring diagram I have is correct, but I have doubts. Here is the wiring diagram and a photo of the receiver. The receiver has four latching switches. Each switch has a common terminal and two adjoining terminals. One is normally open while the other is normally closed.










The receiver is powered by twelve volts to the terminals on the upper right. These have nothing to do with the switches. I figure that if I close the first switch, the bucket will dump. Then I would have to open the same switch before closing the second switch to make the bucket raise. Makes sense in my mind, but am I missing something?











Dan - it looks like your wiring diagram has a dead short. Follow the + power wire to the top and it connects directly to the - power. 

I don't know anything about the car you have but if it has a DC motor that does the dumping you need a DPDT relay to reverse polarity and change direction - what you have is a group of four SPDT relays.

You could rewire the board so that two of the relays toggle from the same pushbutton on the remote or you could use one of the existing relays to drive an external DPDT relay. Then you could use a third relay to actually do the action (dumping or returning to normal position)


If you could take a few closeup photos of the board from the top and bottom and from different angles I may be able to tell you how to rewire the board if you would like to go that route. Hopefully the circuitry that activates one relay can handle the current needed to do two.


dave


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## toddalin (Jan 4, 2008)

Lots of ways this can be done with minor modification and depending on how you do the dump/raise. If you need to do a dpdt switch/relay, as Dave suggests, you can just put a jumper wire between the two hot leads on two adjacent relays (say A & B). Then with you toggle either A or B, both relays will always trigger giving you a latching DPDT relay.

Other ways would be to use the N/C on the adjacent relay as a requisite path for electron flow. Then when the second relay fires, it disconnects the first. 

Or, you could use one relay just to run a motor to raise it and a second relay to release a "trip pin" that resets with the raising motor.

It really depend on what you are trying top accomplish using what means.


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## Madman (Jan 5, 2008)

I was messing around with it tonight and came up with the master plan! I think it's basically what you guys are saying.


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## toddalin (Jan 4, 2008)

Posted By Madman on 01 Apr 2011 07:55 PM 
I was messing around with it tonight and came up with the master plan! I think it's basically what you guys are saying. 











Right. This is what I was alluding to, but you need to throw the relays in pairs simultaneously. The two one the left for one direction and the two on the right for the other direction.


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## Madman (Jan 5, 2008)

Yes, you are correct. It works rather well. I do have to press two buttons to cancel power from one pair of before I can press the other two to activate the other pair of switches. They can be pressed one at a time. The only other thing I want to do is put LEDs on the switch contacts so that I know of the switch is closed or not. Since each of the four switches is a double pole I can put the LED on the normally closed side. Sounds like alot of experimenting and work, but I had the dump car sitting around for a few years and the transmitter/receiver only cost me about ten or fifteen bucks.


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## Madman (Jan 5, 2008)

Posted By dbodnar on 01 Apr 2011 04:25 AM 
Posted By Madman on 31 Mar 2011 09:23 PM 
I have one of those inexpensive transmitter/receiver set ups that I hope to put to use on LGB's hot metal car. All of the original wiring for track activation has been removed. I hope to use the transmitter and receiver to change the polarity of the motor so as to dump then reset the bucket. I believe that the wiring diagram I have is correct, but I have doubts. Here is the wiring diagram and a photo of the receiver. The receiver has four latching switches. Each switch has a common terminal and two adjoining terminals. One is normally open while the other is normally closed.










The receiver is powered by twelve volts to the terminals on the upper right. These have nothing to do with the switches. I figure that if I close the first switch, the bucket will dump. Then I would have to open the same switch before closing the second switch to make the bucket raise. Makes sense in my mind, but am I missing something?











Dan - it looks like your wiring diagram has a dead short. Follow the + power wire to the top and it connects directly to the - power. 

I don't know anything about the car you have but if it has a DC motor that does the dumping you need a DPDT relay to reverse polarity and change direction - what you have is a group of four SPDT relays.

You could rewire the board so that two of the relays toggle from the same pushbutton on the remote or you could use one of the existing relays to drive an external DPDT relay. Then you could use a third relay to actually do the action (dumping or returning to normal position)


If you could take a few closeup photos of the board from the top and bottom and from different angles I may be able to tell you how to rewire the board if you would like to go that route. Hopefully the circuitry that activates one relay can handle the current needed to do two.


dave 




As of now I can dump the bucket and bring it upright again. The key fob sized transmitter has four small buttons, A,B,C,D. I must push D and C to dump the bucket, and A and B to raise it. The buttons don't need to be pushed simultaneously. If I cut power to the receiver, then power up again, the buttons seem to loose their memory. Although it is always the same buttons that do each task. It takes some fiddling with the buttons to get them back into sequence. Another oddity is that the four sets of terminals do not coincide with the relay switches just behind them. Your suggestion of making one button move two relays might be worth a look at.


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## Madman (Jan 5, 2008)

Well, I have completed the project. It works rather well. the only glitch is that when I turn the power off to the receiver, then turn it back on again, the sequence of the buttons is alittle off, until I press them in a random pattern and then the correct sequence comes back. Here is a short video of the working model. The small LGB gondola houses the batteries for the receiver. The batteries for the dump motor are under the gray platform to the left of the bucket.


http://youtu.be/3IFG7Cw52nc


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## toddalin (Jan 4, 2008)

Cute. The kids will love it when you dump them some M&Ms.


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## rmcintir (Apr 24, 2009)

Pour me a (small) beer my friend!


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## toddalin (Jan 4, 2008)

Posted By rmcintir on 11 Apr 2011 05:16 PM 
Pour me a (small) beer my friend! 



Tequila shooters!


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