# LGB # 21832 White Pass Mikado



## FLYNAVY53 (Dec 14, 2020)

Hey guys, new to the forum, not new to the hobby. In my uneducated opinion, the LGB/Aster White Pass Mikado is the best looking G scale steam locomotive available, and I'm looking to potentially buy one. That being said, I've read some posts alluding to poor performance, specifically with regard to extremely slow operating speeds. I've also seen a post or two alluding to potential fixes, but havent seen anything specific. I'm not opposed to investing the time and money into making this model run correctly (if there is in fact an issue), I just want to have a good handle on what I'm getting into before making the purchase. I have noticed that the limited number out YouTube videos of this particular model running are generally pretty slow.

I greatly appreciate any and all input!!

Thanks
-Greg


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## Manhart (Dec 27, 2007)

I converted my 21832 with a Maxon Motor. Description in german here: LGB 21832 WP&YR Dampflok Nr.73

I hope you can translate the page with a translator.

Speed and pulling power is now fantastic.

Regards Matthias


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## trainmanfw&sw (Nov 4, 2020)

I myself have only LGB engines, they are it standard production engines, Moguls, Alco diesels, diesel switchers, etc., none are the higher priced production models. Since these engines tend to be rather smooth running from the start, but still some tend to have a slight jump start I have found that running them on DCC, or a system like RailPro RC tend to give them that crawl start which is what we want. Not sure this is the fix you want, but for me a different control system it what I wanted and it works. 

trainman


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## Manhart (Dec 27, 2007)

I made tests step by step including a ZIMO MX69 years ago with this model. The decoder could not solve the problem. The original LGB motor had not enough power and the gear transmission ratio made the loco so slow. LGB answered the question for the slow speed in the past, that it is comparable with the original loco.
The only way to solve it is another motor with more power and a higher turning speed at the same voltage.


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## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

FLYNAVY53 said:


> I'm looking to potentially buy one.


Be aware that they have rubber traction tires, I think (the Hudson does,) which will be rotten by now and will have to be replaced. My pal with the Hudson cut some out of neoprene on his laser cutter!

And the WP&Y Mikado is very similar to the EBT #12 mikado - the latter has 48" drivers and the WP&Y has 44". I agree they are good looking locos. Best of luck


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## Manhart (Dec 27, 2007)

Good hint with the rubber traction tires. I could buy an axle with wheels without the rubber traction tires. The loco is heavy enough to pull a train without the tires.


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## FLYNAVY53 (Dec 14, 2020)

Thanks to everyone for they input....lots to consider. The modifications are probably well beyond my skill level....or at least beyond my current tool inventory.


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## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

Manhart said:


> I could buy an axle with wheels without the rubber traction tires.


Where could you buy that? As a spare part? For a 20-year-old loco?


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## Michael Glavin (Jan 2, 2009)

Axle sets are available from TrainLi USA, currently on backorder. The drive for the Aster/LGB Mikado is the same as the LGB Mikado. Traction tires maybe available, I didn't look, I removed and replaced the traction axles on my Mikado's. The Aster/Mikado is indeed a nice engine and slower than one would anticipate at around 30mph. 

There were issues with the first iteration LGB Mikado drives, the second iteration solved the drive shaft coupling failures. I have repaired a few of theses drives, spares are hard to come by and to update with the latest drive shafts-couplings the motor has to be replaced too.

Michael


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## Manhart (Dec 27, 2007)

Pete Thornton said:


> Where could you buy that? As a spare part? For a 20-year-old loco?


There is a shop Modell-Land-Service in Germany. They had a lot of spare parts from LGB and LGB/Aster and i could by years ago an original axle for the 21832 without the tires. The shop was down for a few years and now it seems, that it comes back, but today the shop has only a structure without content.

As mentioned from Michael: the drive is a LGB Mikado, but the position of the motor was changed for the 21832 with the toothed belt. The following pic shows the original motor from LGB in the 21832:


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## trainmanfw&sw (Nov 4, 2020)

Here is a sister engine I saw for sale on ebay, he does mention having an extra motor included in the deal. LGB 25872 Southern Mikado | eBay I have no idea of the value of these engines, is this in the correct price range.

trainman


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## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

I am very surprised to hear the Aster/LGB mikado has that weird 2-4-4-2 Mikado chassis with the joint in the middle. I thought the Aster/LGB products had their own mechanisms. But the only one I have had my hands on was the NYC Hudson.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

The Aster part was the decorative part, and it added a lot of weight. Nice looking but problematic locos.

Greg


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## OldNoob (Apr 30, 2016)

Pete Thornton said:


> I am very surprised to hear the Aster/LGB mikado has that weird 2-4-4-2 Mikado chassis with the joint in the middle. I thought the Aster/LGB products had their own mechanisms. But the only one I have had my hands on was the NYC Hudson.


I suspect because LGB wanted the engine to be able to handle R3 curves since most of their stuff does. But that is just a guess, i could be completely wrong on that.


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## mjll1958 (Jan 2, 2016)

FLYNAVY53 said:


> Hey guys, new to the forum, not new to the hobby. In my uneducated opinion, the LGB/Aster White Pass Mikado is the best looking G scale steam locomotive available, and I'm looking to potentially buy one. That being said, I've read some posts alluding to poor performance, specifically with regard to extremely slow operating speeds. I've also seen a post or two alluding to potential fixes, but havent seen anything specific. I'm not opposed to investing the time and money into making this model run correctly (if there is in fact an issue), I just want to have a good handle on what I'm getting into before making the purchase. I have noticed that the limited number out YouTube videos of this particular model running are generally pretty slow.
> 
> I greatly appreciate any and all input!!
> 
> ...


The older Mikado had problems with the driveshaft and the metal gears that drives the wheels. Mine was repaired by LGB at least once while under warranty and never ran well until we rebuilt it. LGB completely rebuilt the drive system on the new models which look almost the same. I have an Aster model and a new Mikado and I can't identify major differences except the material in which the aster is built with. The Aster does run slowly and mine was rebuilt using a new LGB drivetrain which fixed the problems, which cost a fortune in both time and money by TrainLI. I now only use it as a display item.


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## Treeman (Jan 6, 2008)

Most LGB will run on R1 curves.


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## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

Treeman said:


> Most LGB will run on R1 curves.


I thought that was the objective of the weird joint in the LGB Mikado frame.


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## Treeman (Jan 6, 2008)

Pete Thornton said:


> I thought that was the objective of the weird joint in the LGB Mikado frame.


Correct, they don't look good doing it. I tell beginners to do 10 foot minimum diameter if they have the room.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Here's an LGB GG-1 on an R1 curve


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## Treeman (Jan 6, 2008)

Like I said.


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## Dan Pierce (Jan 2, 2008)

And the Genisis will run on R1, but it will derail a freight car behind it as the coupler is outside the curve!!.


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## ddrum31 (Aug 30, 2017)

Manhart said:


> Good hint with the rubber traction tires. I could buy an axle with wheels without the rubber traction tires. The loco is heavy enough to pull a train without the tires.


Beautiful engine!

Jason


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## FLYNAVY53 (Dec 14, 2020)

I appreciate all the input. I decided to pass on the LGB White Pass Mikado. It is a beautiful model, but it sounds like it would take a lot of effort to get it to run properly. Ill stick with my Aristo Consolidation for now as that runs quite well.


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## stevedenver (Jan 6, 2008)

FLYNAVY53 said:


> Hey guys, new to the forum, not new to the hobby. In my uneducated opinion, the LGB/Aster White Pass Mikado is the best looking G scale steam locomotive available, and I'm looking to potentially buy one. That being said, I've read some posts alluding to poor performance, specifically with regard to extremely slow operating speeds. I've also seen a post or two alluding to potential fixes, but havent seen anything specific. I'm not opposed to investing the time and money into making this model run correctly (if there is in fact an issue), I just want to have a good handle on what I'm getting into before making the purchase. I have noticed that the limited number out YouTube videos of this particular model running are generally pretty slow.
> 
> I greatly appreciate any and all input!!
> 
> ...


the first release santa fe and Union Pacific mikes , as i recall were the first two, and these had a star shaped universal coupling joint between motor and drive. These slipped. The later versions used a sort of “t” into. “U” universal coupler, which didnt slip.

i have a SR version. I run it with no more than 8-10 cars, often less , very light , unweighted lgb us freight, on the flat. I am diligent about not overloading the drive. It is my experience that if a loco has geared and non geared driver axels the connecting rod bears stress, and can break. I dont know if this is the case with the mike, but it is with the lgb .mallets. 

i too love the wpy mike but they do have a reputation for problems. Aster superstrure parts may be impossible to find. 

fwiw, lgb mikes seem to run anout 1200-1500 on ebay. Fwiw, i always buy for condition and completeness, as any needed parts can not only erase any saving, but become as costly quest. Things like dynamos, headlights, classification lights, etc can be stupidly priced. Handrails too can break their insertion point cups.

i run mine on R3. It will run on R1, but like the gg1 above, it looks absurd. Its a large locomotive. Imho, as lgb goes it is moderately robust. Its smooth, and pretty, despite the slightly too short tender. I added the lgb capacitor as i run analogue. I lighted the class lights as well.


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## Dan Pierce (Jan 2, 2008)

NOTE: The first Mikados had the cardian joint and only 1 small ball bearing on the drive shaft. Newer models had the solid brass knuckle but also had 2 larger ball bearings on the shafts. Motor blocks, shafts and motor were not compatible between these versions, but all the other parts are.


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