# Gluing a real coal load?



## San Juan (Jan 3, 2008)

Back at our place in Colorado, I have some real coal lumps from the D&SNGRR. I've crushed the pieces into "scale" coal and was thinking about changing out my tenders to real coal loads. 

What I'd like to do for most is to cut a 1/8" thick piece of styrene as a base for the coal load. Then pile up the coal on the plastic base and glue it together. Hopefully once the glue cures, the plastic base and coal could be removable as one piece. 

What makes this a little difficult is I'd like to have a large pile...like this photo link 

What could I use to avoid gluing the coal to the sides of my tenders, thus making it possible to lift the load out as one piece? Maybe some masking tape? Maybe glue the coal off site...meaning not in the tender?


I forget the steps involved for gluing HO scale ballast off the top of my head (something about lay out the ballast, spray with alcohol, then spray the diluted glue mix), but presumably the technique for gluing a coal load would be simmilar. 

Any tips out there for gluing a real coal load?


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## todd55whit (Jan 2, 2008)

San Juan 
I am no steam guy however I do remember seeing an article by one of our own, Kevin Strong? I beleive it was in a garden railways magazine. It went through a step by step using real coal to simulate a loader tender. You might want to seek him out here, and maybe he'll read this thread and give you a better idea of where it is.


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## K27_463 (Jan 2, 2008)

Matt: i do what you propose all the time. i have large quantities of Chama coal and Durango coal in my shop. I make a great many real coal loads for Accucraft, Bachmann and other steam locos. Make a piece of styrene to act as a base, in the size you need. Evergreen now offers black plastic sheets- even better. Use hard foam, or even additional layers of styrene to build up where you want the pile to be. Place your crushed coal. Glue. I use water thin super glue but thinned white glue works too. it is just that super glue is really permanent. The glue works into crevices by capillary action . After your first layer or two, lift the load and dump off the excess. Once you have the bottom plastic form made, you can finish the edges of the load outside the loco, so no danger to glue on to your engine. Repeat until satisfied. Takes less than 30 minutes usually to make a really good looking load. It will be VERY solid. 
Stop by sometime and i can show you many. 

jonathan/EMW


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## Totalwrecker (Feb 26, 2009)

Make your load form. lift it out, put in a layer of Saranwrap (enough to drape over sides), replace form add coal and glue. 

As long as there are no undercuts the load should lift out when dry and remove or trim back saranwrap (clingwrap). 

Save a top layer of coal to dust on wet glue, it will keep it's dry color better. 

John


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## Steve Stockham (Jan 2, 2008)

Yeah, I used this method to add a degree of realism. It works really well! Kevin layed out a step-by-step procedure complete with pictures (visual aides! _Yeah baby!!_) It's virtually idiot proof but one caveat: _be really careful that you DON'T dilute your glue too much or it will run forever and take what seems to be an eternity to set up!! _(Don't ask me how I know this...)


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## up9018 (Jan 4, 2008)

Matt, 

If you don't have a copy of the article they are talking about let me know, that magazine is still floating around here somewhere. I'll scan it in and e-mail it too you. 

Chris


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## San Juan (Jan 3, 2008)

Perfect advice, thanks all.

Anyone happen to know what Garden Railways that issue was? I might still have it, but then again I might have thrown it out too









If anyone is willing to share the article with me, my email addy is:

[email protected] 


I can trade you some Santa Fe Hi-Level scale drawings I've scanned. Not sure what good this does for G scale though, unless someone wants to build very large passenger cars









On a side note, I'm going to have to find a new scanner since my new laptop (Vista 64) is not compatible with my very old HP scanner. 




Jonathan, thanks for the tips. By the way, your pillow case crushing method you mentioned while we picked up the K-28 worked great. And I never thought about using foam, but that is a great idea. Saves a lot of coal that way and I can form it in pretty much any shape. Any special glue needed to secure the foam? Hot glue?




About the diluted glue mix for the coal; I have a ready mixed jug of matte medium from Scenic Express that I've used for HO ballast and ground cover. Nice stuff and dries perfectly clear. Might this work for the coal?


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## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

Try August '08. My GRs are scattered all over the place in no particular order, and I can't find it at the moment. It was part 4 of a series that predated my 3-part series on renovating old buildings, which finished up with the Feb '09 issue. 

As others have said, plastic wrap. You may want to get some styrofoam and carve out the shape you want for your coal load, so you don't use quite as much coal or glue in the process. 

Later, 

K


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## Rod Hayward (Jan 2, 2008)

I agree diluted PVA witha drip of washing up liquid to break the surface tension works well. Piled up the coal over a formed shape and dripped the glue on.


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## Bruce Chandler (Jan 2, 2008)

Matt,

I use the Scenic Cement from Woodland Scenics, and I suspect your matte medium product is similar. Like others, I use a styrene base, and glue some foam on top. I used a contact cement that was plastic safe. Then I paint the form black, just in case I can't cover everything. I use an acrylic paint so it won't eat the foam.


I had trouble crushing my coal. It was so hard that when I put it in some cloth, it would cut holes where I hit it.


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## Totalwrecker (Feb 26, 2009)

Matt, 
I don't think the matte medium is as water resistant as the glue. It will do an equal job, but more for an indoor pike than out. I don't know if you run in the rain or high humidity, but they should be considered. Though the matte medium dries clear, it can get milky in color if it absorbs moisture. After it dries it will be clear again. 

John


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## Steve Stockham (Jan 2, 2008)

Ah Bruce! You had the good stuff!! _That's_ the kind of coal that the live steamers are always trying to find!


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## tj-lee (Jan 2, 2008)

Bruce,

> I had trouble crushing my coal. It was so hard that when I put it in some cloth, it would cut holes where I hit it. 

I took the easy way out and used aquarium charcoal. Looks very good, I think, and no hammering required.













Best,
TJ


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## Rod Hayward (Jan 2, 2008)

I cheated and got my coal from the bunker where my local 5 inch live steamers chuck all their slack rubbish after a days steaming. Left overs too small for a 5 inch jobs, but perfect for us.


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## Torby (Jan 2, 2008)

Hmm. Maybe should do that with my Mallet.


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## wigginsn (Jan 9, 2008)

I just did a new bunker load for my Annie last week.

Pretty much as Kevins article (Aug '08) describes, styrene base, 2 paper towel layers soaked in white glue for final form, then coal glued in place with diluted white glue. Using cling wrap kept the mess from sticking to the tender, and its completely removeable.



















I got half a ton of coal last year for our (rarely used) coal range - no supply issues here..









Cheers
Neil


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## Paul Burch (Jan 2, 2008)

I have not made coal loads for tenders but have made about three dozen for coal hoppers. I'll toss in my two cents. If you want to use a white type glue the kind they sell at your local hardware or big box store for gluing concrete works well. Spread some evenly on whatever you are using for a base and then sprinkle on some coal. I then use a spray bottle with alcohol in it to act act as wetting agent to draw the glue up into the coal.


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