# How do you and how will you Power and Control your Trains? Part 2



## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

Jerry:

Here is a stab at your table. It can be modified as new information comes in. If you go the the 10th Anniversary thread in "Public Forum" you will see how the table evolved with time. It is an excel table that can be copied and pasted into most forums. I couldn't paste it into the "Poll Forum" and keep the format. If anybody has a problem with how I listed their information let me know and I'll change the table.


Chuck 


PS This is a tabulation of results of Jerry's question about power sources in the "Poll Booth" forum. 

username DC DCC RC/Battery Live Steam Other toddalin x 



semper vaporo 


x 
Kormsen x 



alecescolme 

x 

carlferg 

x 

chuck n x 
x 

hcampbell 


x 
rivette x 



totalwrecker 

x 

lownote 
x 


penisok 

x 

Del Tappario 

x 

dieseldude x 



eheading 

x 

ddevoto 
x 


KCHahn 
x 


Greg Elmassin 
x 


East Broad Top 

x 

docwatsonva x 



jebuck 

x 

Dave Meashey x 



Fred x 
x 

Bob in Kalamazoo 
x x x 
Rod Fearnly 

x 

tj-lee x 



SLemcke x x 


nkelsey 

x 

markoles x 



jmill24 x 
x x DCS rmcinter x Total 12 6 15 4 1


----------



## Jerry McColgan (Feb 8, 2008)

Hi Chuck,

Thank you for putting your time and effort into creating the table. It is your table so I will leave it to you to decide on the format you prefer.

The only suggestion that comes to mind is that RC and Battery may be two different categories in that Battery would be a source of Power and while Battery Power tends to assume Wireless (RC) as a Control, Radio Control can also be a Control System for Track Power (such as the Revolution, Train Engineer, MTS/DCC and DCS etc.).

In fairness your table only makes reference to Power Sources. Perhaps you intend to produce a separate table for Control Systems.

Regards,

Jerry


----------



## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

Jerry:

I'm not going to start a second table with control systems. Most of the power sources have an assumed control system. DC is a throttle on the transformer or a remote (TE or Bridgewerks), DCC has a remote controller of some type. Battery usually requires a R/C controller (unless you have my 25 year old battery car with a DPDT switch and a rheostat), live steam can be either R/C or manual. At this cut I'm only interested in the power supply and how many use what type(s). It is interesting that some, including myself, use several.

Chuck


----------



## Ray Dunakin (Jan 6, 2008)

Posted By chuck n on 04 May 2011 07:46 PM 
Jerry:

Here is a stab at your table. It can be modified as new information comes in. If you go the the 10th Anniversary thread in "Public Forum" you will see how the table evolved with time. 




-------------

Hmm, I searched the Public Forum for "10th anniversary" and only found a thread about someone's wedding anniversary.


Anyway... I use track power with the AC Revolution control system.


----------



## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

Ray:

The last post on this thread, 10th tour, was on 4-19-11. Here is a link to the thread here on MLS.

10th Anniversary tour 

Chuck 


username DC DCC RC/Battery Live Steam Other toddalin x 



semper vaporo 


x 
Kormsen x 



alecescolme 

x 

carlferg 

x 

chuck n x 
x 

hcampbell 


x 
rivette x 



totalwrecker 

x 

lownote 
x 


penisok 

x 

Del Tappario 

x 

dieseldude x 



eheading 

x 

ddevoto 
x 


KCHahn 
x 


Greg Elmassin 
x 


East Broad Top 

x 

docwatsonva x 



jebuck 

x 

Dave Meashey x 



Fred x 
x 

Bob in Kalamazoo 
x x x 
Rod Fearnly 

x 

tj-lee x 



SLemcke x x 


nkelsey 

x 

markoles x 



jmill24 x 
x x DCS rmcinter 

x 

Ray Dunakin x 



Total 13 6 15 4 1


----------



## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

Stan Cedarleaf just added his power sources over in the Poll Booth.

Steve C. has tried to help me set up a table over in the Pool Booth, but it seems to be easier to place the table here. Please put your answers to Jerry's power questions over in the Poll Booth where they belong. I have no intention of hijacking his thread.


chuck

username DC DCC RC/Battery Live Steam Other toddalin x 



semper vaporo 


x 
Kormsen x 



alecescolme 

x 

carlferg 

x 

chuck n x 
x 

hcampbell 


x 
rivette x 



totalwrecker 

x 

lownote 
x 


penisok 

x 

Del Tappario 

x 

dieseldude x 



eheading 

x 

ddevoto 
x 


KCHahn 
x 


Greg Elmassin 
x 


East Broad Top 

x 

docwatsonva x 



jebuck 

x 

Dave Meashey x 



Fred x 
x 

Bob in Kalamazoo 
x x x 
Rod Fearnly 

x 

tj-lee x 



SLemcke x x 


nkelsey 

x 

markoles x 



jmill24 x 
x x DCS rmcinter 

x 

Ray Dunakin x 



Stan Cedarleaf x 
x 

Total 14 6 16 4 1


----------



## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

Thanks Madman.

username DC DCC RC/Battery Live Steam Other toddalin x 



semper vaporo 


x 
Kormsen x 



alecescolme 

x 

carlferg 

x 

chuck n x 
x 

hcampbell 


x 
rivette x 



totalwrecker 

x 

lownote 
x 


penisok 

x 

Del Tappario 

x 

dieseldude x 



eheading 

x 

ddevoto 
x 


KCHahn 
x 


Greg Elmassin 
x 


East Broad Top 

x 

docwatsonva x 



jebuck 

x 

Dave Meashey x 



Fred x 
x 

Bob in Kalamazoo 
x x x 
Rod Fearnly 

x 

tj-lee x 



SLemcke x x 


nkelsey 

x 

markoles x 



jmill24 x 
x x DCS rmcinter 

x 

Ray Dunakin x 



Stan Cedarleaf x 
x 

Madman x 
x 

Total 15 6 17 4 1


----------



## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

recent answers.

Chuck


username DC DCC RC/Battery Live Steam Other toddalin x 



semper vaporo 


x 
Kormsen x 



alecescolme 

x 

carlferg 

x 

chuck n x 
x 

hcampbell 


x 
rivette x 



totalwrecker 

x 

lownote 
x 


penisok 

x 

Del Tappario 

x 

dieseldude x 



eheading 

x 

ddevoto 
x 


KCHahn 
x 


Greg Elmassin 
x 


East Broad Top 

x 

docwatsonva x 



jebuck 

x 

Dave Meashey x 



Fred x 
x 

Bob in Kalamazoo 
x x x 
Rod Fearnly 

x 

tj-lee x 



SLemcke x x 


nkelsey 

x 

markoles x 



jmill24 x 
x x DCS rmcinter 

x 

Ray Dunakin x 



Stan Cedarleaf x 
x 

Madman x 
x 

noelw x 
x 

Couger Rock Rail 
x 
x 
*Total* *16* *7* *18* *5* *1*


----------



## Randy Stone (Jan 2, 2008)

It would be interesting to know how many of you use Radio Control with power other than Battery.


----------



## Jerry McColgan (Feb 8, 2008)

Reply moved to original topic at:

http://www.mylargescale.com/Communi...spx#215668

Jerry


----------



## stevedenver (Jan 6, 2008)

analog DC 
10 amp bridgewerks or LGB jumbo with tether control 
-manual switches outside 

-keeps it simple and hands on 
live steam too R/c 

lights and motorized stuff-either 12v dc or 16v ac- 

id love DCC 
its just amazing the variety of control 
but retro fitting for me would be very expensive-and it seems the chips get fried from time to time 
may do DCC on a small FRR inside layout eventually


----------



## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

username DC DCC RC/Battery Live Steam Other toddalin x 



semper vaporo 


x 
Kormsen x 



alecescolme 

x 

carlferg 

x 

chuck n x 
x 

hcampbell 


x 
rivette x 



totalwrecker 

x 

lownote 
x 


penisok 

x 

Del Tappario 

x 

dieseldude x 



eheading 

x 

ddevoto 
x 


KCHahn 
x 


Greg Elmassin 
x 


East Broad Top 

x 

docwatsonva x 



jebuck 

x 

Dave Meashey x 



Fred x 
x 

Bob in Kalamazoo 
x x x 
Rod Fearnly 

x 

tj-lee x 



SLemcke x x 


nkelsey 

x 

markoles x 



jmill24 x 
x x DCS rmcinter 

x 

Ray Dunakin x 



Stan Cedarleaf x 
x 

Madman x 
x 

noelw x 
x 

Couger Rock Rail 
x 
x 
SteveDenver x 

x 
Ironton x 

x 
Jerry McColgan x 
x 
DCS *Total* *19* *7* *19* *7* *2*


----------



## TonyWalsham (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By rlvette on 06 May 2011 09:04 AM 
It would be interesting to know how many of you use Radio Control with power other than Battery. 

Randy.

There are a number of variations under that broad banner.
1. Radio Control of the track voltage. Ala Train Engineer. Really on regular DC with R/C. That is, all locos run like DC.
2. Radio Control of individual locos by R/C with the locos using a constant voltage on the tracks. Eg Revolution and my RCS.
3. Radio Control of individual locos using R/C/(sort of)DCC such as QSI/G2 in the loco powered only by constant voltage on the track and controlled by a CVP or NCE TX. 4. Radio Control of track powered DCC via a command station controlling single or multiple locos.

There could also be more such combinations.

Which did you have in mind?


----------



## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

I don't see any difference between 2 and 3 except the manufacturer of the equipment really. Since there is no over the air dcc standard, then this implementation is as proprietary as all the others. 

Also, I guess the answer to "Radio Control with power other than Battery" would involve live steam, and motor/generator systems like Wada. I don't think any spring-driven units are R/C but heck, they might do that over in the UK. 

Greg


----------



## fred j (Jan 12, 2011)

Rite now I'm only using DC, As i feel it works best for me. I've tried DCS and it didnt work out too well but I may try DCC 
in the future as I own a couple of QSI Sounds Boards and I like them. 

Fred


----------



## chuckger (Jan 2, 2008)

Hi Chuck, 
I'm doing battery R/C, will start a layout shortly. 

chuckger


----------



## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

username DC DCC RC/Battery Live Steam Other toddalin 1 



semper vaporo 


1 
Kormsen 1 



alecescolme 

1 

carlferg 

1 

chuck n 1 
1 

hcampbell 


1 
rivette 1 



totalwrecker 

1 

lownote 
1 


penisok 

1 

Del Tappario 

1 

dieseldude 1 



eheading 

1 

ddevoto 
1 


KCHahn 
1 


Greg Elmassin 
1 


East Broad Top 

1 

docwatsonva 1 



jebuck 

1 

Dave Meashey 1 



Fred 1 
1 

Bob in Kalamazoo 
1 1 1 
Rod Fearnly 

1 

tj-lee 1 



SLemcke 1 1 


nkelsey 

1 

markoles 1 



jmill24 1 
1 1 DCS rmcinter 

1 

Ray Dunakin 1 



Stan Cedarleaf 1 
1 

Madman 1 
1 

noelw 1 
1 

Couger Rock Rail 
1 
1 
SteveDenver 1 

1 
Ironton 1 

1 
Jerry McColgan 1 
1 
DCS fred j 1 



chuckger 

1 

post oak and otter lake 1 
1 

Al McEvoy 1 1 


*Total* *22* *8* *21* *7* *2*


----------



## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

Thanks Nick.

username DC DCC RC/Battery Live Steam Other toddalin 1 



semper vaporo 


1 
Kormsen 1 



alecescolme 

1 

carlferg 

1 

chuck n 1 
1 

hcampbell 


1 
rivette 1 



totalwrecker 

1 

lownote 
1 


penisok 

1 

Del Tappario 

1 

dieseldude 1 



eheading 

1 

ddevoto 
1 


KCHahn 
1 


Greg Elmassin 
1 


East Broad Top 

1 

docwatsonva 1 



jebuck 

1 

Dave Meashey 1 



Fred 1 
1 

Bob in Kalamazoo 
1 1 1 
Rod Fearnly 

1 

tj-lee 1 



SLemcke 1 1 


nkelsey 

1 

markoles 1 



jmill24 1 
1 1 DCS rmcinter 

1 

Ray Dunakin 1 



Stan Cedarleaf 1 
1 

Madman 1 
1 

noelw 1 
1 

Couger Rock Rail 
1 
1 
SteveDenver 1 

1 
Ironton 1 

1 
Jerry McColgan 1 
1 
DCS fred j 1 



chuckger 

1 

post oak and otter lake 1 
1 

Al McEvoy 1 1 


Nicholas Savatgy 
1 


*Total* *22* *9* *21* *7* *0*


----------



## GN_Rocky (Jan 6, 2008)

Ok I thought I chimed in, but didn't see myself on the list. 
So you could add me in under track power, Battery (have a little I'm experimenting with), and other. I say other because I will be running all of my receivers thru a large CTC panel I will put in the basement that will control both track power AND signals as well as route selection. As far as I know, nobody has a CTC control for their trains. I plan to be the first with my next layout. So not only will I need the train items, but alot of pvc tubing to run miles of wire along the mainline. Perhaps I should install some of the mini cams at various junctions and feeds them to some small monitors. This should make my new layout quite unique and take trains to the next level









Rocky


----------



## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

Rocky:

I checked both threads (Jerry's over in the poll booth and this one) on this subject and couldn't find your comment on power. 

I'm on a different computer this evening so I'll add you to the master table tomorrow.

Chuck


----------



## GN_Rocky (Jan 6, 2008)

Thanks Chuck !!!









Rocky


----------



## Dan Pierce (Jan 2, 2008)

I run both Analog track power and DCC. Dan Pierce


----------



## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

Thanks Rocky and Dan.

username DC DCC RC/Battery Live Steam Other toddalin 1 



semper vaporo 


1 
Kormsen 1 



alecescolme 

1 

carlferg 

1 

chuck n 1 
1 

hcampbell 


1 
rivette 1 



totalwrecker 

1 

lownote 
1 


penisok 

1 

Del Tappario 

1 

dieseldude 1 



eheading 

1 

ddevoto 
1 


KCHahn 
1 


Greg Elmassin 
1 


East Broad Top 

1 

docwatsonva 1 



jebuck 

1 

Dave Meashey 1 



Fred 1 
1 

Bob in Kalamazoo 
1 1 1 
Rod Fearnly 

1 

tj-lee 1 



SLemcke 1 1 


nkelsey 

1 

markoles 1 



jmill24 1 
1 1 DCS rmcinter 

1 

Ray Dunakin 1 



Stan Cedarleaf 1 
1 

Madman 1 
1 

noelw 1 
1 

Couger Rock Rail 
1 
1 
SteveDenver 1 

1 
Ironton 1 

1 
Jerry McColgan 1 
1 
DCS fred j 1 



chuckger 

1 

post oak and otter lake 1 
1 

Al McEvoy 1 1 


Nicholas Savatgy 
1 


GN_Rocky 1 
1 
CTC Dan Pierce 1 1 


*Total* *24* *10* *22* *7* *3*


----------



## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

Correcting Jerry's data.

username DC DCC RC/Battery Live Steam Other toddalin 1 



semper vaporo 


1 
Kormsen 1 



alecescolme 

1 

carlferg 

1 

chuck n 1 
1 

hcampbell 


1 
rivette 1 



totalwrecker 

1 

lownote 
1 


penisok 

1 

Del Tappario 

1 

dieseldude 1 



eheading 

1 

ddevoto 
1 


KCHahn 
1 


Greg Elmassin 
1 


East Broad Top 

1 

docwatsonva 1 



jebuck 

1 

Dave Meashey 1 



Fred 1 
1 

Bob in Kalamazoo 
1 1 1 
Rod Fearnly 

1 

tj-lee 1 



SLemcke 1 1 


nkelsey 

1 

markoles 1 



jmill24 1 
1 1 DCS rmcinter 

1 

Ray Dunakin 1 



Stan Cedarleaf 1 
1 

Madman 1 
1 

noelw 1 
1 

Couger Rock Rail 
1 
1 
SteveDenver 1 

1 
Ironton 1 

1 
Jerry McColgan 1 1 1 1 DCS fred j 1 



chuckger 

1 

post oak and otter lake 1 
1 

Al McEvoy 1 1 


Nicholas Savatgy 
1 


GN_Rocky 1 
1 
CTC Dan Pierce 1 1 


Total 24 11 22 8 3


----------



## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

Adding Paul.

username DC DCC RC/Battery Live Steam Other toddalin 1 



semper vaporo 


1 
Kormsen 1 



alecescolme 

1 

carlferg 

1 

chuck n 1 
1 

hcampbell 


1 
rivette 1 



 totalwrecker 

1 

lownote 
1 


penisok 

1 

Del Tappario 

1 

dieseldude 1 



eheading 

1 

ddevoto 
1 


KCHahn 
1 


Greg Elmassin 
1 


East Broad Top 

1 

docwatsonva 1 



jebuck 

1 

Dave Meashey 1 



Fred 1 
1 

Bob in Kalamazoo 
1 1 1 
Rod Fearnly 

1 

tj-lee 1 



SLemcke 1 1 


nkelsey 

1 

markoles 1 



jmill24 1 
1 1 DCS rmcinter 

1 

Ray Dunakin 1 



Stan Cedarleaf 1 
1 

Madman 1 
1 

noelw 1 
1 

Couger Rock Rail 
1 
1 
SteveDenver 1 

1 
Ironton 1 

1 
Jerry McColgan 1 1 1 1 DCS fred j 1 



chuckger 

1 

post oak and otter lake 1 
1 

Al McEvoy 1 1 


Nicholas Savatgy 
1 


GN_Rocky 1 
1 
CTC Dan Pierce 1 1 


Paul Burch 

1 

*Total* *24* *11* *23* *8* *3*


----------



## Jerry McColgan (Feb 8, 2008)

Posted By chuck n on 17 May 2011 10:12 AM 
Correcting Jerry's data.


Thanks Chuck,

Jerry


----------



## toddalin (Jan 4, 2008)

Of course it must be recognized that the list only reflects MyLargeScale users and probably has little bearing on the real world where the overwhelming majority would use simple track power as they watch their trains go around the Christmas tree.


----------



## flats (Jun 30, 2008)

Might as well add my track power here, I use dc aristo TE's and battery power 
control by aristo TE's. On the dc side I can run up to 4 engines at once, 2 D9, and 
2 SD45, I have fans on the TE's. 

Ken owner of K&K the road to nowhere


----------



## Mik (Jan 2, 2008)

The AV uses Crest/Aristo 5400s from sets. They work just fine.

A battery loco w/ critter control is still under construction, but it will be set up with a track power option as well.


----------



## Gary Armitstead (Jan 2, 2008)

Battery/RC-Airwire


----------



## TonyWalsham (Jan 2, 2008)

Battery Power (the real RCS) & Other (Track powered on-board real RCS)


----------



## Gravy Train (Mar 6, 2011)

Please put me on the list DC and DCC. Thanks


----------



## Del Tapparo (Jan 4, 2008)

Will the real RCS please stand up? Oh ... He just did. 

(You may not get this one Tony. Used to be a TV game show called "To Tell the Truth". Three people all claiming to be .... something, a plumber or whatever, would tell their stories, and the panel had to guess which one was the real one.)


----------



## TonyWalsham (Jan 2, 2008)

Hi Del. 

We had the same, as in the Australian version, game show here.


----------



## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

Yes i vaguely remember that show, The Family Fued.................







USA always won............


----------



## Robbie Hanson (Jan 4, 2008)

I'm on two Aristo/Crest 10amp power supplies with one first and one second gen train engineers controlling them. My battery engine's running a first gen TE in the tender. 

And I've got an Accucraft Ruby, so throw me in for live steam too.


----------



## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

Today's update. It interesting in that many of us use more than one system.


Chuck 


username DC DCC RC/Battery Live Steam Other toddalin 1 



semper vaporo 


1 
Kormsen 1 



alecescolme 

1 

carlferg 

1 

chuck n 1 
1 

hcampbell 


1 
rivette 1 



totalwrecker 

1 

lownote 
1 


penisok 

1 

Del Tappario 

1 

dieseldude 1 



eheading 

1 

ddevoto 
1 


KCHahn 
1 


Greg Elmassin 
1 


East Broad Top 

1 

docwatsonva 1 



jebuck 

1 

Dave Meashey 1 



Fred 1 
1 

Bob in Kalamazoo 
1 1 1 
Rod Fearnly 

1 

tj-lee 1 



SLemcke 1 1 


nkelsey 

1 

markoles 1 



jmill24 1 
1 1 DCS rmcinter 

1 

Ray Dunakin 1 



Stan Cedarleaf 1 
1 

Madman 1 
1 

noelw 1 
1 

Couger Rock Rail 
1 
1 
SteveDenver 1 

1 
Ironton 1 

1 
Jerry McColgan 1 1 1 1 DCS fred j 1 



chuckger 

1 

post oak and otter lake 1 
1 

Al McEvoy 1 1 


Nicholas Savatgy 
1 


GN_Rocky 1 
1 
CTC Dan Pierce 1 1 


Paul Burch 

1 

Flats 1 
1 

Mik 1 



Gary Armistead 

1 

Tony Walsham 1 
1 

Gravy Train 1 1 


Robbie Hanson 1 
1 1 
*Total* *29* *12* *27* *8* *3*


----------



## Westcott (Feb 17, 2009)

Hi,


I'm battery/RC and steam here.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iMSkT5q4tXc


----------



## TonyWalsham (Jan 2, 2008)

Hey Chuck. 

You misread what I meant. 

I don't run regular DC. 
I use battery R/C and track powered on board R/C. Which I guess should be *other*.


----------



## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

Tony:

I'm keeping it in DC as some of the others in that classification are also using RC for control (Aristo TE). I'm trying to keep the table as simple as possible. If you can give me an abbreviation for your system (that everyone understands (RCN ?)) I'll move it to the other column.


I've changed the heading of that column to reflect that entries there could be RC or not.

To save space in the thread I'm only going to put up the table once a day. Any changes added today won't show up until tomorrows posting. 


Chuck


----------



## Gravy Train (Mar 6, 2011)

Chuck:
Thanks for including me on thePower list. I am fairly new to this web site and it 's nice to be included. I too like some started w/ LGB back in the mid 70's. Love at first ste. (not so much the European style but that's all there was at that time) I put my first train around ourChristmas tree like most people do. Now I put up (3) Christmas tress with (2) large scale trains around each. It's alot of fun. I put thefirst tree and trains up Thanksgivinng weekend. I have mostly large scale in MTH, USA along with some LGB and Lionel. I have radio controll, several different power supplys including Bridgewerks.
Thanks again.


----------



## TonyWalsham (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By chuck n on 18 May 2011 08:18 AM 
Tony:

I'm keeping it in DC as some of the others in that classification are also using RC for control (Aristo TE). I'm trying to keep the table as simple as possible. If you can give me an abbreviation for your system (that everyone understands (RCN ?)) I'll move it to the other column.


I've changed the heading of that column to reflect that entries there could be RC or not.

To save space in the thread I'm only going to put up the table once a day. Any changes added today won't show up until tomorrows posting. 


Chuck 











Hi Chuck.

I don't understand your logic.
My control systems are not like the well known track side mounted TE's that use radio to control the voltage going to the track for regular track powered locos.
Just like the AristoCraft Revolution, I make on board ESC's that can use either a constant voltage going to the track and / or batteries as the power source.

I think Lewis Polk calls his Revolution *RCC*. Radio Command Control. 
In other words RCS is another proprietary form of Command Control like Revolution, DCS or the stuff Lionel makes. So it should be also included under "Other".


----------



## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

OK

I'm going to put you under other as TONY. I'm not trying to make this difficult or complicated. Does the submitter use DC track power with or without some form of RC, DCC is well defined, battery with or with out RC is a well known option, live steam (with or without RC, no one seems to care)? I and most of the members on MLS recognize that within those broad categories there are many subdivisions. I don't have the knowledge or experience to make the various subdivisions everyone might want. This is why Jerry had the smarts to not try it. If you don't like what I'm trying to do I'll take you off the table.

Last spring I was at an operating session where the engines were controlled by your units, they worked very well. But, my impression was that there was a fixed DC voltage on the track and I held a RC unit in my hand to control the direction of the engine and its speed. If that isn't DC with RC please enlighten me.

You are more than welcome to go through the replies in Jerry's and my thread and create a table that more meets your criteria. I will be more than happy to turn this over to you.


Chuck 


PS I applaud Jerry for starting this question. It is something that I have always wondered about. No one ask me to do this, I thought it might be helpful if we had a general idea how we powered our trains. I tried to set up the table in the broadest possible framework. 


On a comment in an earlier post, I would agree that there are probably a lot of people out there who use pure DC around the Christmas tree. This poll was directed to those who are knowledgeable in the hobby. The overall results could be helpful to newcomers. Another possible question would be, "If you changed as a newbie from DC to something else, how long did it take you to make the change, to what and why, or did you start off in a new technology"?


----------



## TonyWalsham (Jan 2, 2008)

OK Chuck. 

Most folks take DC to mean regular locos on powered track with control by either track side mounted manual control transformer controllers or R/C such as the TE. 
Controlling the voltage going to the track, and thus any locos on that track, with an RC hand piece operating a track side receiver is not the same as having a fixed voltage on the track and using that voltage to power and control individual locos with individual R/C's in each loco. 
Any regular DC locos would simply go flat out without any control whatsoever. 

Battery power is self explanatory and is accepted the way you show it. 
The problem comes in with any form of Command Control. That is when the locos are powered by track voltage but controlled individually. 
The control can be by various means such as DCC, DCS, Revolution and RCS. 
The DCC fans insist that any control system that is not "proper" DCC should not be lumped together with DCC. 
That is why Shad created the OTHER forms of control forum. That caters quite nicely for those myriad of users who use constant voltage on the track and control individual locos with a Command System other than DCC. EG. Revolution and RCS. 

If you have been adding the "constant voltage on the track Revolution users" to the DC column the results will be skewed incorrectly towards DC. They really should be added to the other column. 

I commend you on the effort to run this questionnaire but it would be even nicer if the results were accurate.


----------



## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

Gravy Train:

Welcome to MLS. You will find that if you have a question, ask it and you will get several or more answers. In most case they will be all different. A lot of answers depend on the part of the country where you live. Climate does inpact what we do. I learned the hard way when I built my train here in Virginia using techniques that worked in Colorado. Drainage is more important than you might think.

I've been in the hobby since 1979 and I learn new stuff here all the time.

Chuck

PS. The only dumb question is the one that you didn't ask!


----------



## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

I agree that there is a difference, but some responders have said they use TE. No indication as to whether or not it is track side or on board. Therefore I lumped them. 


It's like in biology. Are you a lumper or a splitter when it comes to defining a species? If two birds look alike, and the only difference is the song, are they a different species or not?


Chuck 


I have tried not to get into brand specific categories.


----------



## todd55whit (Jan 2, 2008)

RC Battery, It works great for me. I haven't seen much action from the new RCS site, but I'm stickin with RCS Elite. Probably will be going with the p8 for my up coming loco project.


----------



## TonyWalsham (Jan 2, 2008)

Chuck, 
I can understand you lumping the TE with regular DC column. The vast majority use the TE that way. 
The TE of course can also be used with battery power. 
The TE is rarely, if ever, used on board a loco with a constant voltage on the track as the power source. It is not capable of that without some modification. 
On the other hand, the Revolution can be either track powered and / or battery powered. If track powered, they really should be in the "other" column and called *RCC* if you wish, as it then becomes just another form of (proprietary) Command Control. 

I surely hope you would not be sorting anything out by brand. 
I am certainly not asking you to do that.


----------



## Jerry McColgan (Feb 8, 2008)

Posted By chuck n on 18 May 2011 05:10 PM 
I applaud Jerry for starting this question. It is something that I have always wondered about. No one ask me to do this, I thought it might be helpful if we had a general idea how we powered our trains. I tried to set up the table in the broadest possible framework. 





Hi Chuck,

I think you are doing a great job with your spreadsheet. Radio Control can be a topic all by itself because, as Tony suggested, there are so many different ways it can be operated.

You are welcome to do your spreadsheet any way you wish and perhaps someone might wish to create a separate spreadsheet just on the various types of Radio Control.

I would not know where to start in trying to define all the types of radio control that are available but perhaps someone can and will do it.

Many thanks for your significant effort and achievement so far.

Jerry


----------



## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

DC 




with or without 



username RC DCC RC/Battery Live Steam Other toddalin 1 



semper vaporo 


1 
Kormsen 1 



alecescolme 

1 

carlferg 

1 

chuck n 1 
1 

hcampbell 


1 
rivette 1 



totalwrecker 

1 

lownote 
1 


penisok 

1 

Del Tappario 

1 

dieseldude 1 



eheading 

1 

ddevoto 
1 


KCHahn 
1 


Greg Elmassin 
1 


East Broad Top 

1 

docwatsonva 1 



jebuck 

1 

Dave Meashey 1 



Fred 1 
1 

Bob in Kalamazoo 
1 1 1 
Rod Fearnly 

1 

tj-lee 1 



SLemcke 1 1 


nkelsey 

1 

markoles 1 



jmill24 1 
1 1 DCS rmcinter 

1 

Ray Dunakin 1 



Stan Cedarleaf 1 
1 

Madman 1 
1 

noelw 1 
1 

Couger Rock Rail 
1 
1 
SteveDenver 1 

1 
Ironton 1 

1 
Jerry McColgan 1 1 1 1 DCS fred j 1 



chuckger 

1 

post oak and otter lake 1 
1 

Al McEvoy 1 1 


Nicholas Savatgy 
1 


GN_Rocky 1 
1 
CTC Dan Pierce 1 1 


Paul Burch 

1 

Flats 1 
1 

Mik 1 



Gary Armistead 

1 

Tony Walsham 

1 
DC+RC Gravy Train 1 1 


Robbie Hanson 1 
1 1 
Michael Glavin 1 1 1 1 
Westcott 

1 1 
todd55whit 

1 

Total 29 13 30 11 5


----------



## TonyWalsham (Jan 2, 2008)

Thanks Chuck. 

My congratulations also on a job being well done.


----------



## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

So track power is 3/4 of the total users. Subtract live steam and track power is even more preferred over battery. 

Makes sense. 

Greg


----------



## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

Personally, I find the fact that--to date--more people have responded that they run battery vs. traditional track power to be most curious; something I chalk up to the specific pool of respondents here on the forum who tend to be more long-time hobbyists with specific needs that exceed the limitations of DC track power. I would expect if the pool of respondents included the more casual hobbyist, we'd see traditional track power take a commanding lead over all other forms. But the casual hobbyist tends not to be active in hobby forums, so you'd expect the results to be somewhat skewed towards the more advanced control systems. A more "average" survey pool would be to look at what your local club is operating. Ours (DGRS) is majority traditional track power, probably 5:1 or more over any alternative means of control just based on what I see during Summer railroad tours and what people bring to shows. 

Another way of interpreting the numbers (ain't statistics fun? You can make them say whatever you want!) is to take traditional track power as a baseline from where everyone starts, then look at the results of the survey in terms of a departure from that baseline. If you consider the sampling pool to be predominantly advanced hobbyists (your more typical forum participant), you can get a sense of where the typical advanced hobbyist looks for control. By a 2:1 ratio, they're opting for some form of alternative control, no matter what it is. Of those, battery power is the most popular, by a 2:1 margin over DCC and 3:1 over live steam. 

It will be interesting to repeat this poll in 5 years to see how things have changed as battery and track power advanced control systems merge in terms of functionality and compatibility, battery technology continues to advance, and as stainless steel track continues to make inroads as new hobbyists build their railroads. 

Later, 

K


----------



## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

Kevin, I agree. I'm sure that most of us started out with DC track power. The longer you are in the hobby the more you want to add to your railroad. I have always used analog DC to power my track. Over the years I added a TE as a speed and direction controller. I did this because I'm out in the yard when I'm running and I didn't want to be locked to the power supply and if I was doing some switching, I got tired of running back to the controller after each train movement. An RC unit between the power supply and the track suited me just fine. My next step us was to get a Bridgewerks with a remote. I like it a lot better than the TE. I never could get used to the long delay in the momentum on the TE, even if I have it set for the fastest slow down or speed up.

I now have two engines that are set up for battery and remote operation. I got tired of going out to Dr. Rivet's events and watching everyone else have all the fun running trains. I have an Airwire and NiMH batteries in an Accucraft K-28 and a new Aristo REVO with Li-ion batteries in an Aristo Mallet. I can now run at both the Narrow Gauge and the Standard gauge Steam/spark ups. 


Live steam is fun to watch and on more than one occasion I have thought long and hard about joining the "burned hand brigade", but I've decided it's not for me.

We all grow with this hobby and some form of remote control became necessary, at least for me, to get the maximum benefit.

Chuck


----------



## Jerry McColgan (Feb 8, 2008)

Posted By East Broad Top on 19 May 2011 11:05 AM 
ain't statistics fun? You can make them say whatever you want


K 


Hi Kevin,

I kept the questions simple to avoid guiding the answers toward any specific conclusion. I agree that this is not any sort of scientific survey but it does give us an idea of what appeals to specific MLSers.

It is my opinion that people who are happy with track power are a lot less motivated to get involved in forums like MLS because track power is pretty easy to understand and operate.

In a way the same may be true of dedicated systems. If someone uses everything from the same manufacturer they may have less need for advice beyond what that manufacturer provides.

What I found interesting in Chuck's spreadsheet was that so far there have been 55 responses but those responses totaled 83 power choices. That to me is the beauty of this hobby because there is no reason why any of us have to limit ourselves to a single choice. No system is perfect so why settle for the limitations of what any one system offers - unless your preferences and or your circumstances are such that one system is the only one right for you?

Jerry


----------



## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

so 29 + 13 = 42 track power 
30 battery 

so almost 1.5 times the people use track power over battery.... in this limited poll... for electric locos... can you make this say something else? 

Greg


----------



## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

I just checked the Steamaholics Membership List at the top of the live steam forum. They have 299 members. Shad lists 9222 members at the bottom of the FORUM page under the Community tab at the top of this Page.


That means that a little over 3% of the members of MLS are passionate enough about steam to get an SA number. Since all of the Live Steamers I know are fairly passionate about steam I would imagine that most MLSers into live steam are on that list.

That would suggest, to me, that about 97% of us use electrons in one way or another. Of course some of those live steamers also use electrons, so 97% is probably a minimum.


Another category would be windup. There are several runners out at Dr. Rivet's last Saturday who were running windups on his "O" gauge loop. One made it about 2/3rds of the way around on a single wind, very impressive.


If you go to Scott McDonald's video in my thread on the DM&IR iron ore train in the rolling stock forum, you will see an "O" gauge live steamer leaving my Mallet in the dust (probably better to say in the smoke). 


iron ore train 

Chuck


----------



## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

DC 




with or without 



username RC DCC RC/Battery Live Steam Other toddalin 1 



semper vaporo 


1 
Kormsen 1 



alecescolme 

1 

carlferg 

1 

chuck n 1 
1 

hcampbell 


1 
rivette 1 



totalwrecker 

1 

lownote 
1 


penisok 

1 

Del Tappario 

1 

dieseldude 1 



eheading 

1 

ddevoto 
1 


KCHahn 
1 


Greg Elmassin 
1 


East Broad Top 

1 

docwatsonva 1 



jebuck 

1 

Dave Meashey 1 



Fred 1 
1 

Bob in Kalamazoo 
1 1 1 
Rod Fearnly 

1 

tj-lee 1 



SLemcke 1 1 


nkelsey 

1 

markoles 1 



jmill24 1 
1 1 DCS rmcinter 

1 

Ray Dunakin 1 



Stan Cedarleaf 1 
1 

Madman 1 
1 

noelw 1 
1 

Couger Rock Rail 
1 
1 
SteveDenver 1 

1 
Ironton 1 

1 
Jerry McColgan 1 1 1 1 DCS fred j 1 



chuckger 

1 

post oak and otter lake 1 
1 

Al McEvoy 1 1 


Nicholas Savatgy 
1 


GN_Rocky 1 
1 
CTC Dan Pierce 1 1 


Paul Burch 

1 

Flats 1 
1 

Mik 1 



Gary Armistead 

1 

Tony Walsham 

1 
DC+RC Gravy Train 1 1 


Robbie Hanson 1 
1 1 
Michael Glavin 1 1 1 1 
Westcott 

1 1 
todd55whit 

1 

Trains 

1 

*Total* *29* *13* *31* *11* *4*


----------



## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

Added battery to Nicks entry.

Chuck


DC 




with or without 



username RC DCC RC/Battery Live Steam Other toddalin 1 



semper vaporo 


1 
Kormsen 1 



alecescolme 

1 

carlferg 

1 

chuck n 1 
1 

hcampbell 


1 
rivette 1 



totalwrecker 

1 

lownote 
1 


penisok 

1 

Del Tappario 

1 

dieseldude 1 



eheading 

1 

ddevoto 
1 


KCHahn 
1 


Greg Elmassin 
1 


East Broad Top 

1 

docwatsonva 1 



jebuck 

1 

Dave Meashey 1 



Fred 1 
1 

Bob in Kalamazoo 
1 1 1 
Rod Fearnly 

1 

tj-lee 1 



SLemcke 1 1 


nkelsey 

1 

markoles 1 



jmill24 1 
1 1 DCS rmcinter 

1 

Ray Dunakin 1 



Stan Cedarleaf 1 
1 

Madman 1 
1 

noelw 1 
1 

Couger Rock Rail 
1 
1 
SteveDenver 1 

1 
Ironton 1 

1 
Jerry McColgan 1 1 1 1 DCS fred j 1 



chuckger 

1 

post oak and otter lake 1 
1 

Al McEvoy 1 1 


Nicholas Savatgy 
1 1 

GN_Rocky 1 
1 
CTC Dan Pierce 1 1 


Paul Burch 

1 

Flats 1 
1 

Mik 1 



Gary Armistead 

1 

Tony Walsham 

1 
DC+RC Gravy Train 1 1 


Robbie Hanson 1 
1 1 
Michael Glavin 1 1 1 1 
Westcott 

1 1 
todd55whit 

1 

Trains 

1 

Total 29 13 32 11 4


----------



## Nutz-n-Bolts (Aug 12, 2010)

Posted By chuck n on 19 May 2011 12:45 PM 
Kevin, I agree. I'm sure that most of us started out with DC track power. 



Hi Chuck, just to be contrary I'll ad my 2 cents. While I agree with you statement, I would fall out side of the "most" category. My only loco right now is live steam. Steam is definitely what attracts me to the hobby. I intend to add more to the steam roster but will also include one battery powered engine for young guests. I did start with track power in HO years ago but have never and don't for see using it in my 1:20 world out side. It is interesting to think about the 9000+ members of this site and realize that's just a slice of the large scale hobbyist pie! No matter what part you are, it's a great pie to be a part of.


----------

