# Is QSI dead?



## rreiffer (Jan 14, 2009)

All,

It appears no one has any stock of QSI decoders nor do any appear to be coming to market anymore. The phones and email no longer work and several resellers I have talked to have said consider them gone. Is that true?

Rich


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

There is something in the works, have to wait a bit.

Greg 957


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## ewarhol (Mar 3, 2014)

Greg-

You think everything will work out fine and we'll have Titan decoders in stock again? Still think they're one of the best decoders I've ever used.


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## Martan (Feb 4, 2012)

Really? I don't have a whole lot of experience with different decoders. How do you think they compare to the Soundtraxx or WOW decoders?

QSI didn't seem to like extended packet formats very much. I had to switch to basic to get it to behave. And it was kind of expensive too. Sounds are good though and I did love the plug and play, didn't have to cut a single wire.

I'm about to spring for the WOW in August I think.

I wasn't much of a DCC fan until I figured out how to run them with battery power and wireless but I love them now.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Eric I'm working on getting something back. I do know there are about 200 brand new ones that exist.

I can't talk about it more, but will keep people informed.

Martan, I don't care at all about extended packet formats, I look to features and what they have, and also the sound quality. As far as expensive, ALL the decoders in this class are right at $200 each give or take $10.

I don't like the Wow, I have run into the same firmware bugs in it as their Z scale decoders, won't go into that more here, this is a thread on QSI. 

Greg 947


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## Martan (Feb 4, 2012)

$200 vs $150. Half a C note is well, $50 bucks. Plus they are scarce. I guess I got the last one from RP a few months ago. Good for you if you can scare up some more. As far as extended packets, no I guess you wouldn't care about that. I do however as it impacts my code. But to each his own.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Where can you buy something as good as Zimo, Massoth, ESU, QSI for $150? (please don't answer, the answer is nowhere)

I qualified my statement about quality. We are talking G scale here. 

To each his own? Is there any other person on this forum besides you wanting to use extended packets? Or even know what they are?

Hmm.... if you want to rag on something, please find a thread that is about comparing price, performance, features, etc.

As I mentioned politely already, would like to keep this thread in the vein of the OP, status on QSI. Diverting the discussion on your inventions, extended format DCC commands, or the price of competitive stuff is really not where I want to go (again).

There's plenty of threads, not to mention the ones you started.

Greg 943


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## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

Kelly Dorf (QSI) posted this the other day on the QSI Yahoo user's group in response to an inquiry about updated sound files:

"...With the unexpected demise of QSIS, we have been busy sorting things out, and getting files on a new server. We appreciate your patience."

QSIS is QSI Solutions, which is/was the consumer arm of QSI--the folks handling the decoders sold to hobbyists. I'm not sure I'd have used "unexpected" to describe the demise of QSIS--it's been unresponsive for well more than a year, but it appears that QSI has officially pulled the plug on the business relationship between the two.

Hopefully something new--and stable--can rise from the ashes this time. But to Rich's question, they are currently gone. There are an increasing number of viable alternatives until such time they can regain some traction.

Later,

K


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

So, I know more about the situation than you do Kevin, unless you talked to Josh recently.

Some things are in the works... I know where some are.. and that's all I am saying. 

Don't pester me right now for more details... although I am making a list of people who want them and will pay for them.

I am looking to get 10 myself... 

Greg 936


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## ewarhol (Mar 3, 2014)

Add me to the list Greg. Need two for sure, but with future purchases planned might as well go 10 too.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Got it Eric, sending you an email to make sure I have your email address right.

Greg 935


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## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

Greg, I was merely quoting what was posted very recently by a QSI official on another forum. I make no claims to "insight" at all beyond relaying public information from the company itself. 

I hope someone _can _make QSI's decoders a going concern again. They make a good product. More importantly, though, I hope they're able to rebuild their customer service. That's paramount. Getting the decoders into the hands of the consumer is one thing. Giving the consumer the confidence that if something is to go south that their money doesn't go with it is equally, if not more important. I remain optimistic, but I've stayed away from installing them even when they were available because of a complete lack of customer support. Until I see that aspect rebuilt, I will stay away. $200 is a lot of money to leave uselessly bricked on my workbench shelf. 

Later,

K


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

I'm not objecting to the quote, it's what you added and extrapolated.

"QSIS is QSI Solutions, which is/was the consumer arm of QSI--the folks handling the decoders sold to hobbyists."
INCORRECT

" but it appears that QSI has officially pulled the plug on the business relationship between the two."
NOT REALLY ACCURATE, CLOSE, but I'm pretty sure you don't know anything beyond what you read on the QSI web site.

But to Rich's question, they are currently gone. 
INCORRECT

Greg (I should get 5 countdown points for this one) 934




East Broad Top said:


> Kelly Dorf (QSI) posted this the other day on the QSI Yahoo user's group in response to an inquiry about updated sound files:
> 
> "...With the unexpected demise of QSIS, we have been busy sorting things out, and getting files on a new server. We appreciate your patience."
> 
> ...


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## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

_Greg wrote: " 'QSIS is QSI Solutions, which is/was the consumer arm of QSI--the folks handling the decoders sold to hobbyists.' 
INCORRECT"_

My description of the relationship between QSI and QSIS is taken from QSIS's web site home page: 
"*Who we are.* QSI Solutions is the consumer products affiliate of QS Industries (QSI) of Beaverton, Oregon."
If I can't take _their _word for who they are, whose should I take?

_Greg wrote: " __'but it appears that QSI has officially pulled the plug on the business relationship between the two.' 
__NOT REALLY ACCURATE, CLOSE, but I'm pretty sure you don't know anything beyond what you read on the QSI web site."

_QSI used the phrase "unexpected demise." I would believe them to have an accurate understanding of the business relationship between themselves and their affiliate, and I think "pulled the plug" is an an accurate euphemism for "unexpected demise." What was, isn't anymore. I made no implication that a similar relationship couldn't be built in the future. Quite the opposite; I stated that I hoped it would. That you seem to be privy to "inside info" with QSI doesn't surprise me, given your history championing their decoders and working with QSI on various aspects of their development. 

_Greg wrote: " 'But to Rich's question, they are currently gone.' 
INCORRECT"_

I've currently got 5 QSI decoders in operation. If any one of them was to die and I couldn't reprogram it myself, where would I send it for repair? I'm glad you've found a stash of existing decoders. Is there a plan in place for reliable QSI customer support to go with them, or are they "new old stock" decoders found in a warehouse? A container full of Aristo locos showing up on the dock doesn't mean Aristo is back in business. Again, I'll wait and see. It may be a semantic argument, but until I see QSI offering new products off the production line with reliable customer service to back them up, they're "gone" in my opinion. 

Later,

K


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## rdamurphy (Jan 3, 2008)

At a recent trainshow, I talked to the SoundTraxx rep, he said they were expecting the Tsunami's to come in 4 Amp versions soon, suitable for G gauge/Fn3.

All of my decoders currently are QSI... Still kicking myself that I didn't buy the leftovers when Caboose closed at 70% off....

Robert


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## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

Kelly Dorf (QSI) just posted this on the QSI forum in response to a question about the future of the large scale version of the Titan:

_"QSI is not planning on reproducing the large scale decoder you refer to. _[Large scale Titan] 
_HOWEVER, we do have in stock what we call FX-DO, which is what we furnish to O scale DC and DCC manufacturers. This unit will power just about all of the current large gauge engines. It has all the latest features and full lighting capability."_


He invited anyone interested in pursuing their OEM version to contact him offline.


Not exactly a rosy picture for fans of QSI's large scale decoders. If enough folks contact him, perhaps he'll revisit? Can't say. Glad I've found alternatives. I just installed my last QSI board a few weeks ago. (Gonna miss the stereo mapping of sounds.) 



Later,


K


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Unless Josh sells them the rights, QSI cannot sell the Titan. QSIS is Josh's company, QSI is a different company.

I doubt that QSIS will sell the rights to QSI. 

So, definitely QSI is not planning in reproducing the Titan, because they CANNOT at the present time, they don't have the rights.

There's a fine edge on this explanation, and yes there are some people pursuing manufacturing the Titan.

Greg - 796


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## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

Thanks for clarifying the legal issues, Greg. Sounds like a ruddy mess, if you ask me. Good luck to the guys hoping to re-introduce the large scale Titan. I would hope they're going to be able to fully back these boards with regard to service and repair, as it sounds from what you're saying that QSI is pretty much washing their hands of the whole thing because they don't own the rights. 

That also still leaves the question of repair/service of _existing _decoders. If QSI doesn't own the rights to the large scale Titan, they can't really back them up with regard to service. Not very reassuring to those of us who have QSI boards installed. 

Yep, a ruddy mess indeed.

Later,

K


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## bobvandno2 (Nov 4, 2009)

*Greg count me in*

Greg, I want 15 decoders plus if you can work the magic 15 G Wire receivers. Any thing I can do to help give a shout.


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## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

If the G-wire receivers aren't available, you can use the Airiwire Convertr-60, which is rated at 6 amps continuous in conjunction with the Titan (or any DCC decoder). If you don't need 6 amps, the Tam Valley Depot DRS-1 Hi-Power receiver is rated at 3 amps continuous, and is a bit cheaper ($72 from Litchfield Station currently). 

There's no performance difference between running the Titan with the Convertr or TVD receiver versus running it with the G-wire. I've got the Titan set up with both kinds of receivers. The only configuration difference is that with the Convertr/TVD receiver, you do not have to reset CV56.1 to accept Airwire control. Note that the TVD receiver only works on Airwire's channel 16, so you cannot use the G-wire transmitter in conjunction with it. You must use an Airwire transmitter. 

Later,

K


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Yes a mess at the moment. There is apparently stock of the Titans and the gwire boards with the 2nd revision of the "new" wireless IC (the first one was problematic).

I'm looking to buy the existing stock in one fell swoop if possible. I'm talking to the principals.

Greg - 794


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## bobvandno2 (Nov 4, 2009)

*any news*

Greg, Any news on Titan decoders. Still want to buy.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

I've not gotten word back from Josh yet, he seems to be interested in selling, and I'm interested in buying. I know he took a vacation.

I am working on it. I KNOW there is indeed a stock of assembled and tested decoders in existence as well as the GWire receivers.

Greg - 746


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## bobvandno2 (Nov 4, 2009)

*any news*

Greg, Are the TCS WOW a viable replacement for the Titans ? One other thing I'd like to join your site as a member, how would I do that? If you here any thing I'm hoping I can buy from you.

Bob V.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Hoo boy, I have a greatly different opinion about this decoder from Kevin Strong, and he always comes back at me whenever I post my opinion.

So, I'll defer the details to my site. I will say that I am disappointed in the operation and quality of the firmware, and unfortunately, it also incorporates other bugs that have caused me to replace all my TCS decoders in Z scale.

The problems I have found may not be significant to many, but once a decoder climbs over $150, I expect it to operate like a Zimo, ESU, Massoth, or QSI, which are all around $190 in the open market. So spending $160 and having issues is not worth it to me, I'll spend the extra $30 and be happy.

Here's my review and extended hands on experience:
https://elmassian.com/index.php?opt...ticle&id=440:tcs-decoders&catid=55&Itemid=504

Regards, 

Greg - 745


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## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

Since Greg gave me such a stellar lead-in, I'll say "yes, without hesitation." No disrespect to Greg. He has his criteria for what makes a good decoder. I have mine. Greg had some technical issues with his TCS decoder early on in his experience with it. First impressions are lasting impressions. He asked for help with these issues on the TCS users' group, but declined my assistance offered there.

My experience with these decoders has apparently been much better than Greg's. They're not without their quirks, but the ends justify the means. I've got 4 in use (both steam and diesel, in multiple current capacities, on locos of multiple scales). More to be used in the future, most assuredly. Greg posted his thoughts on his web site. My review was published in Garden Railways a few months back, and is also available on their web site. (You do need to subscribe to view the online reviews.) 

Sound quality is top drawer. I've got QSI and TCS decoders playing through identical speakers in similar installations, and both sound great. TCS has the advantage of having all their sounds loaded onto the decoder, so there's no need to load individual sound files onto the decoder externally. (The older "Q2" files on the QSI decoders allow you to choose various sounds on the board itself, but the sound quality of the recordings is less than the newer "Q3" files which must be selected and loaded individually.)

Motor control is great, though I do occasionally get some stuttering at speed step 2 and 3 (out of 28) with LGB motors. I don't get this in my On30 locos, so I'm led to believe it's motor-specific. There's no PID adjustment on the TCS board as there is the QSI to try to mitigate this, but I rarely crawl at such low speeds, so it's not something I really notice when running. The momentum and braking algorithms seem to push through this. Greg doesn't seem to like the 5-step progressive braking feature, but I find it very intuitive. 

The "Prototype Operation" mode is fantastic, but takes some trial and error to get set up properly. The manual is vague. I had to e-mail TCS for clarification, and once they explained things to me, it made more sense. The steam is different from the diesel, but both sound fantastic once calibrated. You can really hear your locos dig into a grade or just start coasting quietly downhill. I purposefully designed my On30 layout with 3% grades to take advantage of this feature on the latest generation of decoders (of all manufacturers). My grades outdoors aren't quite as steep, but the effect still manifests itself often enough to keep things from sounding monotonous. 

Bottom line, _in my opinion_, the new boards from TCS and Soundtraxx are every bit worthy alternatives to the QSI. If you're used to the QSI and want to stick with it for the sake of going with what you know, you're not losing anything by doing so. There are nuanced differences between _all _decoders, but at this current moment in time, the decoders from QSI, Soundtraxx, Zimo, TCS, and ESU are all pretty equal with regard to quality and control. Hopefully QSI will continue to be made available, but we'll see. ESU is the only one I don't currently use, but that's just because I haven't had reason to buy it with the other manufacturers' products. With any new decoder--regardless of how long you've been doing DCC--there's a learning curve. It's new hardware and software, and a new way of doing things that's going to be different from what you've been used to with your "tried-and-true." 

Later,

K


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Kevin just stop it.

You offered assistance with trivial items and things that were already understood.

"He asked for help with these issues on the TCS users' group, but declined my assistance offered there." THIS IS UNCALLED FOR AND YOU HAVE BEEN DOING THES JABS FOR A LONG TIME. Of course you put them in the "guise" of helping when you know you do it to push my buttons.

You have not seen what I have, and also you've never done a custom speed table on a TCS decoder, admit it. There's a ton of time spent with this decoder and the more I look, the more I find flaws exactly like those in the Z scale decoders.

Say whatever you want about a product but stop lying about me. You twist things and act like you are trying to help... leave off the personal stuff and stick to things that can be proven. Aren't personal remarks against the rules any more? 

This is conduct unbecoming to a member let alone a moderator. 

Greg

p.s. the sound is not top drawer, reference my site about the dynamo sound and blowoff... it might be an 8 on a 10 but not a 10... it's up to you if it is good enough, but not as good as the best.


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## Fred Mills (Nov 24, 2008)

OH BOY...almost like something from LSC...two "EX perts" having a cat fight over a small bit of lint...go at it Kitties, and make it a good fight to make it worth while for everyone watching...nice that you are doing it out in the open so everyone can watch...comic relief, for us while LSC is shut down...I'll bet the multitude of "MODERATORS" here on MLS are farting themselves into corners, trying to decide what to do with you both...bets are on...!!!


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## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

*sigh*

I really, REALLY cannot understand why you think I'm out to insult you every time I write something in response to your posts. I've tried, but keep coming up empty. My attempts to help you with your TCS decoder were genuine, born out of the respect for the patient assistance you gave me when I was just trying to grasp how the QSI decoders worked many years ago, back when we actually seemed to get along. (Yes, folks, there was a time when...) For whatever reason, you've got a mental block to viewing it as such. You seem to insist I do it to "push your buttons." I cannot control your interpretation. Suffice to say nothing could be further from the truth. I see your responses to folks where you offer suggestions to help them out of a genuine desire to solve their problems. Why you can't see that's where I'm coming from, I cannot fathom. 

Custom speed tables? No, I don't use them, and I have stated as much when the topic has come up--most recently on LSC, right before Bob pulled the plug. Sorry if you missed that reference. He shut things down within an hour or two after I posted in that particular thread. (Rather unfortunate timing.) Your review states there's an issue with them--I don't dispute that. Since I don't use 'em, it doesn't affect me. My comments above presume that the reader had gone to your web site and read your review, thus would know about your observations on custom speed tables. No point for me to bring it up. I concentrated on those areas where our opinions differ, to give the reader as broad a spectrum of views as possible. (After all, you did kind of invite my thoughts by stating we had differing opinions. I figured you'd expect me to clarify where and how with a set-up like that.) 

As for "lying" about you, I made the same offer of assistance in response to your thread you started here as I did on the TCS users' group. Your thread, your title describing the specific problem you were having, followed by my suggestions for a remedy and an invitation for you to call me to compare notes since I recently had success doing exactly what you were unsuccessful doing. Readers (if they care--and I pity them if their lives are so devoid of entertainment that they might) can go back to that thread and read the words for themselves.

Now, if you'll excuse me, and not meaning to begrudge Fr. Fred his entertainment absent LSC, I'm off to the workshop for a spell. 

Later,

K


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