# Gregs website and questions on "Bashing"



## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

As a newbie, I am doing my fair share of homework: 

Greg, your site is a godsend. thank you for sharing your knowledge. What manufacturer of track is now my biggest question... need to do homework. 

Now, I hear comments on "bashing" or kit-bashing" and have a vague understand of the concept. From a layperson perspective I visualize taking a $600 "Mallet" and bashing up a $30 "car". 

Are all these parts interchangeable once the "crushed" parts are glued back togther? 

What fun... strange trains? Frankenstein?

gg


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

*RE: Gregs website and questions on "Bashing"*

Hmm.... 

Track power or battery power is first question. 

Will there be people or animals walking on the track on occasion, or very rare? 

Those 2 questions will help narrow the choice down. 

Regards, Greg 

p.s. Did you read my track page and the beginners faq on this? 

FAQ:*http://www.elmassian.com/trains-mainmenu-27/beginners-faqs-mainmenu-49/track-choice-mainmenu-50*

More detailed: *[url]http://www.elmassian.com/trains-mainmenu-27/track-mainmenu-93/track-aamp-rail-material-mainmenu-94*[/url]
*http://www.elmassian.com/trains-mainmenu-27/track-mainmenu-93/track-aamp-rail-material-mainmenu-94* 
comments/corrections/criticism appreciated....


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## altterrain (Jan 2, 2008)

*RE: Gregs website and questions on "Bashing"*

Yes, kitbashing is much fun though I have hear it used for everything from a simple repaint to full blown Frankencritters. 

Some of my bashed stuff - a Dunkirk geared steamer from Bachmann gondola, Big Hauler cab and shay trucks with a bashed bobber caboose, a boxcab diesel from an Aristo track cleaning car and some 7/8's scale critters from a Bachmann 45 tonner diesel with scratch parts and a diecast construction tractor- 





































-Brian


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

I'm a a total newb at this stuff but I've managed a couple kitbashes--this is the most elaborate

http://www.mylargescale.com/1stclass/lownote/b-06.jpg
picture exceeds 640 pixels wide - changed to a link - Jim Francis, Moderator

Here's the prototype











it started as bachmann "Annie" and ended up as a PRR B6 switcher. I bought a barely used annie on Ebay--like this










and then used parts from whatever I had. It's pretty crude but it was a lot of fun


It started as a chassis and a PVC pipe










I've done lots of less elabrate things, just blundering my way along. I don't think there's a loco on our railroad that hasn't been repainted or sawed up or had varous parts added to it.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

*RE: Gregs website and questions on "Bashing"*

GG said: 

" What manufacturer of track is now my biggest question... need to do homework. " 

anyone have opinions? 

Greg


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Brian, "Bloody" good. Lots to look forward to I say.. Here we can let the mind work to the fullest... Understand the basics first. After all this is indeed a hobby where fun is very personal and per your layouts Gents can beautify a garden. 

Greg, I will study your site further and thanks for the links. 

Short term: 

Do a basic design layout. Min 8' diameters with a #6 simple switch (Vs the original double) between the inner and outer track given my space. 

Figure out the ERA and style if not a mix as I use existing assets. Migration to ERA 2 type equipment. 

Focus on RELIABLE track suppliers as I want "plug'n play" from a track supplier. Aristo is iffy at this time. I have an array of Code 332 LGB brass track (EU)on hand however suspect that I will need to go SS outside flex Code 250 (US). I have no room for poor quality here. ( I will go DCC direct power ) 

When it comes to track and installation, cost is not an issue. Do it once... simple as that. 

Figure out how to lay this track in a region or zone 3 (North Alberta "oilsands country") where the frost line can go to 7 feet. (tempted to just "free-float" with basic 2" PVC pipe "pegging" into the ground with a foam fill . This, in turn allows for annual y-axis adustment as required. The prime mission for the pegs is to preserve x / z axis movement within reason and allows for secure ballasting. 50/50 mortar and stone dust with annual repairs based on the amount of heave. 

Based on above predrill peg holes (12") with 6 " of gravel then the prefilled foam peg that is driven in by 6" then back filled with stone dust. (stone dust repels water and is very dense when you work with it. I have a driveway in E Canada filled with it.. Works beautiful ) 


Regards, 

gg

PS: can I meld the code 250 and 332 together on the sidings and switching yards or in areas of low speed...? (trying to save a few bucks)


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Lownote... now I understand.. 

No need to destroy a $600 "mallet"

thanks

gg


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

*RE: Gregs website and questions on "Bashing"*

GG, I would definitely stay with stainless. The Aristo used to be the standout value, half the price of the competition. If I was to start over, with the erratic quality control on the plastic ties, UV protection missing, and some parts of the turnouts also missing UV and the poor frog geometry and all the tweaks needed on the WR, I would go code 250 stainless from the other guys. 

Stay with split jaw stainless clamps. 

Yes, there are transition clamps for 250 to 332... you could use 332 in a switchyard, and just ballast it more to hide the height of the rails... 

I don't have any problem with people or animals stepping on the 250, the only caution is if you have lots of wild animals, deer will dent code 250 faster than 332, but in stainless it's nothing like brass. 

If you are going reliable, take a look at my air motors to move switches, no electrical out in the elements, and easy way to run from DCC. 

Regards, Greg


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Excellent and thanks

Being based out of California I note that you stayed away from "frost issues" !!! 








gg


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

*RE: Gregs website and questions on "Bashing"*

Very nice climate to do trains in, winter is just 30 degrees cooler than summer and there is less daylight... no frost heave, and not enough rain to try to fix the ballast with anything more than gravity. Pretty ideal place. The desert has too much expansion. 

Of course it costs about twice as much to live here, a good month is when the gas and electric is under $600 and I don't have air conditioning... 

such is life... 

Greg


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## Ted Doskaris (Oct 7, 2008)

Gee Greg,

A bad month for me is about $150, and I have AC - though only need to run it about 2 weeks out of the year.
Of course, I don't have a nice multi storey manor house!









-Ted


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## altterrain (Jan 2, 2008)

*RE: Gregs website and questions on "Bashing"*

Gee Greg, 

A bad month for me is about $150, and I have AC - though only need to run it about 2 weeks out of the year. 
Of course, I don't have a nice multi storey manor house! 

-Ted


Greg must be running those trains 24/7! 

-Brian


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## Guest (Jan 8, 2009)

*RE: Gregs website and questions on "Bashing"*

What manufacturer of track is now my biggest question... anyone have opinions?


my personal experience is, that the railjoiners of LGB-track are good enough, not to need to be replaced with railclamps. 
that might save some money.


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

What manufacturer of track?

I've got Aristo brass and stainless, LGB brass, AML and USA Trains brass on my layout. To be honest, I have mixed Euro and American ties too. I'm not a stickler.

LGB is the most "robust." The ties are very durable but they look the least American. The joiners are surprisingly good as Kormsen said. If you use anti-corrosion paste when you join them they last a long time


Aristo track has somewhat flimsier ties and it's a different color. The joiners have those little screws--I think they work pretty well, I have some in use with no clamps still after a year outside in heat and snow


Aml track is like LGB but the joiners are less reliable and require clamps from the start 


I don't think there's a huge difference.


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## aceinspp (Jan 2, 2008)

I think I would still use the clamps as eventually you will start having electrical problems. Of course size of layout can be a determining factor also. Later RJD


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

Yes, I think sooner or later you will probably want clamps everywhere. The bigger your track pieces, the less clamps you need and the better off you are--two 8 foot sections=two clamps. 16 1 foot sections =32 clamps. A railbender will pay for itself that way!


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

*RE: Gregs website and questions on "Bashing"*

I started with stock Aristo joiners, then replaced all the ones around switches, and then swapped them out. I was able to easily change out the stock slide on ones for Split Jaw without lifting any track. Besided electrical continuity, in the case of Aristo, the SJ clamps also aligned the rails better. 

Regards, Greg


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## Engineercub (Oct 18, 2008)

I have to agree, Greg. Your website is incredibly helpful to beginners. It sure helped me with MANY questions that I had. I, for one, would like to say thank you for putting all the time into your site that you have. Between you and Ray, your two sites explained most of the questions I had starting out (which I still am) and gave me real good insight to make my choices on things. As to track suggestions, I personally went with code 332 Aristo Stainless Steel and Split Jaw railclamps. I honestly haven't heard any complaints from anyone about this setup, but have heard numerous complaints about brass track and slider joints. Mostly pertaining to having to clean it all of the time and sliders not being as conductive as rail clamps. The longer someone has been in the hobby and the more things they have tried makes them a perfect candidate for taking advice from. And thanks once again for all the help. ^^

-Will


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## flats (Jun 30, 2008)

*RE: Gregs website and questions on "Bashing"*

I have got to put my 2 cents here about brass track. Now I run trains at least once a week, 
but there have been times I went 3 weeks because of cold and wet weather. Even after this 
amout of time all I had to do was run the track cleaner in front of the engines to clean the track. 
I think that most G scalers have the trouble with their brass track by not running the trains 
on them as much as I do for I donot have trouble with my brass track at all in engine stalling 
or slowing down. Now a derailment is a different story. 

Ken owner of K&K the road to nowhere


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## Steeeeve (Sep 10, 2008)

*RE: Gregs website and questions on "Bashing"*

Does Aristo-craft still make Code 332 SS Flex track? I see some 8' SS flex track at St Aubin but it doesn't indicate whether it is 332 or 250. The new aristocraft catalog seems to indicate that all the flex track is now 250. Is this true?


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

*RE: Gregs website and questions on "Bashing"*

One thing I have found is that 2 different people may have completely different experiences with how often they need to clean brass track. I made a loop of USAT, LGB and Aristo brass, and basically had to clean it (a lot) every time I used it. 

I even bought an LGB track cleaning loco (with the spinning eraser wheels) to clean the oxide from the rails. 

The next guy may need only a quick cleaning every few days on his brass rail. 

So, it depends. My experience was valid. So is Ken's. 

But, one thing I know, the only person I ever heard complain about SS was a person that apparently got mildew cleaner on his rails and got black goop (SS can react to certain chlorine solutions). 

So, my negative experience with brass track convinced me to go SS. No regrets. 

Aristo used to sell brass 332 rail and tie strips (to make your flex track), and I believe SS. 

Now it seems he will offer "built up" flex track (no screws) in code 250 according to the catalog, and code 332. 

If you read the Aristo forum, Lewis addressed this today. To make it more confusing, there is European tie spacing and the "economy" brass too... Way too many flavors and part numbers. 

Regards, Greg


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## altterrain (Jan 2, 2008)

*RE: Gregs website and questions on "Bashing"*

All Aristo track currently available is code 332. Code 250 is "in development" as the say. I don't know about the 8 foot rail. Most folks buy the 5 foot straights and turn it into flex track. Sunset Valley offers code 250 SS - http://www.svrronline.com/TrackandRail.html. 

-Brian


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

I'd love to mix up my existing LGB track with "SS Flex" which I will need to buy due to my efforts to stuff a lot into little space... 

See the attached link. 

http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=2359087&l=bc870&id=623662743 
And I am really concerned re my switches: I used a 36" switch (Aristo-SS-US) coming off the main line and then a shorter 18" on the secondary line. Here the train travels "in reverse" over the switch. Is this possible without hassle? Is there a better solution? Have I created a short circuit?

PS: This draft is engineered for CFO approval. Secret plans afoot to "blow it out" along the side during construction as I will "accidently" order extra flex track.... 

gg


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## altterrain (Jan 2, 2008)

*RE: Gregs website and questions on "Bashing"*


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Brian, how in heck did you get that pic loaded up?

I tried







(no breaks) and nothing worked









gg


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

New test something happen when I posted last:


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## altterrain (Jan 2, 2008)

*RE: Gregs website and questions on "Bashing"*

I went to your link and then right clicked on the image and hit "copy image location". I then pasted it here in between the image tags - [img*]---[/img*] without the * 

-Brian


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)




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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Think I will stick with the good ole fashioned "link" business.


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

*RE: Gregs website and questions on "Bashing"*


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

*RE: Gregs website and questions on "Bashing"*

[imghttp://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=2359087&l=bc870&id=623662743*]


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

*RE: Gregs website and questions on "Bashing"*

I will be dead by the time I find the secret


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## altterrain (Jan 2, 2008)

*RE: Gregs website and questions on "Bashing"*

[img*]http://photos-h.ak.fbcdn.net/photos-ak-sf2p/v647/141/115/623662743/n623662743_2359087_3912.jpg[/img*] 

just take out the 2 *


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## NTCGRR (Jan 2, 2008)

*RE: Gregs website and questions on "Bashing"*

right click over someones photos and then hit property it shows the url and site location .


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

*RE: Gregs website and questions on "Bashing"*


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

AND HE SCORES !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

thx and now for..... 

gg


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## Dick Friedman (Aug 19, 2008)

*RE: Gregs website and questions on "Bashing"*

I didn't like the huge rail of 332, so I went with 250. I didn't like yellow rail, so I went with aluminum. I run track power, and have my power pack linked to the rail in two places around a 120 foot loop, so everything conducts well. I used brass Hillman clamps, which at first provided spotty service. I remove the electrolysis, inserted aluminum foil inside the clamps, and they now are very reliable. I do have to clean the rail, but that's a useful walk to pickup fruit, leaves, and branches along the route.


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## Ted Doskaris (Oct 7, 2008)

Posted By flats on 01/08/2009 12:22 PM
I have got to put my 2 cents here about brass track. Now I run trains at least once a week, 
but there have been times I went 3 weeks because of cold and wet weather. Even after this 
amout of time all I had to do was run the track cleaner in front of the engines to clean the track. 
I think that most G scalers have the trouble with their brass track by not running the trains 
on them as much as I do for I donot have trouble with my brass track at all in engine stalling 
or slowing down. Now a derailment is a different story. 

Ken owner of K&K the road to nowhere 


Ken,

What brand locomotives do you run on your layout? (If it includes USAT products, do you retain the loco slider shoes?)


Thanks for your input,

-Ted


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## vsmith (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By GG on 01/06/2009 7:57 PM


Now, I hear comments on "bashing" or kit-bashing" and have a vague understand of the concept. From a layperson perspective I visualize taking a $600 "Mallet" and bashing up a $30 "car". 




I do beleive he's got it!


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