# Could they?



## John Galt Line (Dec 12, 2012)

OK, I know this question is a bit out of left field and is sure to shake-up the rivet counters and cause great gnashing of teeth amongst prototype purists... Here it goes: Let's say hypothetically a European or some other such foreign locomotive were to fall in to the hands of a US railway what would prevent them from using it?
For example a German BR218 materializes on a class III rail road; could they use it? Or did they just get a really big lawn ornament... If on the other hand they could use it in regular service. What would they have to add to and/or remove from the locomotive to do so? Obvious would be couplers and a bell. Would they have union issues since the locomotive is double ended?
Thank you for your responses in advance.


----------



## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

If the gauge is the same and the couplers match, no reason why not. If it's electric, you'd have to make sure the power is compatible. I don't know if there are sublte differences in terms of flange profile between US and other railroads, though I'd expect there not to be anything significant, or at least nothing that couldn't be changed by a quick visit to the wheel lathe.

I don't think the double-ended thing would make any kind of difference. Most locos with double-ended controls have some kind of key mechansim which make it so you can only run it from one end at a time. 

Later,

K


----------



## Scottychaos (Jan 2, 2008)

Probably some minor differences in MU technology and connections (if a diesel)..It would probably require some modifications to make it compatible with US locomotives, but probably nothing major. 

Scot


----------



## DKRickman (Mar 25, 2008)

It depends on a lot of factors..

Gauge is one, obviously. Assuming that's the same, it might be difficult to add American style couplers. If the draft gear is not at the same height and of at least similar dimensions, it might not be possible to put US style couplers on the engine.

Due to different loading gauges, the engine might not fit. In general, European loading gauges are tighter than in the US, but Russian equipment can be even larger than ours.

If the wheel tread profile is different than the AAR standard, it could be a very expensive proposition to replace the wheels. I don't know if there is a global standard profile or not.

I don't know of any reason why union rules would apply. In fact, many class 3 railroads are non-union anyway.

If the locomotive is to be operated over public grade crossings in excess of 20 MPH, it will have to have ditch lights. It will also have to have a horn and bell, if not already so equipped. While not really important from a modeling point of view, it will have to have FRA approved safety glass in all the windows, which could get quite expensive.

I don't see any reason why it couldn't be done, but it wouldn't be as easy as swapping the couplers and repainting.


----------



## mdwildcat04 (Mar 11, 2013)

http://www.railroadpix.com/rrphotos/detail/739.html

Like this?


----------



## John Galt Line (Dec 12, 2012)

Thank you all for your answers. 
I asked because after running European prototype for the longest time I am looking to come over from the dark-side and move to more North American local/ equipment. I'll still keep most of the OBB/ DB stuff, but since I have couple of 218s that have a fair share if scrapes and scratches and a bit beat-up ( derailed, and rolled like a log down an embankment, only thing stopped it was the box hedge) and ; thus need some touch-up or repainting. I thought why not pain them up in the new RR colours. I asked about the union stuff because I was usually told the reason that US railways didn't have double cabs was due too union rules to do with needing two crews or some other labour related issues like that... 
About the ditch lights, would the regular 3 light Deutsche Bahn arrangement work or do the light need to be exactly such and such height from the rail head and distance apart? 
Thanks,


----------



## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

About 35 years ago,LGB only had European engines when they started their North American rolling stock. 

I used those engines to pull my Colorado Narrow Gauge cars. I didn't think a thing about it. I never liked their Americanized Stainz with tender. Then came the mogul. 

It is your train pull what you want. 

Chuck


----------



## John Galt Line (Dec 12, 2012)

mdwildcat04,
sort-of but more like in Estonia where they have what looks to be ex Wisconsin Central GE C36 on the roster... Only I was looking to do the reverse. Second hand Euro motive power here... you know it just happened to fall from the sky like manna and ended up in Texas...


----------



## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

It is YOUR railroad, so you use the equipment you want to run. I know people that play the "What if?" scenario... They may be modeling the New York Central, but playing the "What if they had purchased the AT&SF and took over their routes" they run what might have existed if that had happened.

Some of us run total "fantasy" Railroads, with dragons for engineers, hauling space rockets and flying saucers on flat cars.

My backyard got flooded pretty badly once, but since my track was all elevated and I could stand on some rocks and flagstones to keep my feet dry, I ran anyway and told people it was the "Anchorage, Honolulu and Tokyo RR". I think one neighbor lady believed that to be a real RR!


So pretending that you are modeling a U.S. railroad that has European locos is just another aspect to the hobby. Make up a story as to why this U.S. RR has European locos and some people will believe you are running a model of a real RR!

Have fun with it.


----------



## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

Have you seen Amtrak's latest locos? 

http://www.wired.com/autopia/2013/05/new-amtrak-locomotives/

No reason not to think others are equally interchangeable.

Later,

K


----------



## John Galt Line (Dec 12, 2012)

Semper Vaporo said:


> It is YOUR railroad, so you use the equipment you want to run. I know people that play the "What if?" scenario... They may be modeling the New York Central, but playing the "What if they had purchased the AT&SF and took over their routes" they run what might have existed if that had happened.
> 
> Some of us run total "fantasy" Railroads, with dragons for engineers, hauling space rockets and flying saucers on flat cars.
> 
> ...



Semper,
I know, I whole heartedly subscribe to the “It's my railway and I'll run it how I want, and if you don't like it then go home.” I just asked because some how some way somebody's going to ask and not be satisfied with above answer... at which point I would like to have a smart intelligent answer for them as to how and why I could run European locos etc....
Heck might even make up a story that the Germans actually succeeded in forming a colony in Texas http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adelsverein and managed to break off in during “War of Northern Aggression” that would make WW1 and WW2 kinda interesting though.... 
Prost,


----------



## Beddhist (Dec 17, 2013)

John Galt Line said:


> mdwildcat04,
> sort-of but more like in Estonia where they have what looks to be ex Wisconsin Central GE C36 on the roster...


Estonia is probably not a good example here. According to Wikipedia it uses a mix of 1520mm and 1524mm gauge, so the US locos must have been re-gauged. Also, they seem to use knuckle couplers, not buffers and chain like W Europe.

I can't imagine the ICE having been modified too much, so that would indicate that Euro rolling stock is largely compatible. I don't see the couplers as an issue: years back automatic centre couplers were trialled and adapters were used. I saw a picture in a rail magazine.

Cheers,
Peter.


----------



## Tom Parkins (Jan 2, 2008)

Biggest difference is meeting US crash standards which are much more stringent. Most off the shelf European equipment does not meet US standards.


----------



## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

> a European or some other such foreign locomotive were to fall in to the hands of a US railway


Aren't we forgetting the Chinese QJs operating in Iowa ?


----------



## BigRedOne (Dec 13, 2012)

I think there's a Chinese steam locomotive somewhere in the US, I seem to remember seeing a YouTube of it.

For sure many US-manufactured locomotives were exported, and I think a lot of transit equipment is made by global companies like Siemens and Bombardier.


----------



## Larry Green (Jan 2, 2008)

While I don't have specifics at hand--

There are two China-built 2-8-2s currently running here;

One or more British engines have run in North America;

WWII engines built here for service in Europe--many were returned and operated here;

In reverse, the Reading once sent a steam locomotive to Italy to promote the use of 
Reading Co anthracite coal; the gauge and wheel configuration was apparently OK, but they did not get a contract to sell coal.

I'm sure there are other examples, so go ahead and run what you like! I am currently running a model of an engine built in the USA for service in France during WWI, and supposedly repatriated to the US.

Larry

Larry


----------



## Randy Stone (Jan 2, 2008)

The Iowa Interstate Railroad purchased one or two Chinese steam engines that they are running here in the states.

http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=450539&nseq=69


----------



## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Then there is the Boone & Scenic Valley RR in Boone, Iowa running the 1st of the FOUR that I know of that were purchase from China. This 2-8-2 was built in China specifically for the Boone RR. It is claimed to be the last steam locomotive in the world built by a company that was in the business of building steamers commercially for RR's (excluding amusement parks and one-off historical replicas).

The two 2-8-2's purchased by the Iowa Interstate and another 2-8-2 purchased by R.J. Corman (RR wreck cleanup company) were bought from RR's in China that have converted to Dismals.


----------



## SD90WLMT (Feb 16, 2010)

And remember that old adage...

...." You can't please everyone all the time".....

So make up your quick response.have a go at it...but have Fun with your trains!!!!!!!!!!

And don't you build the laser car kits?
You came from Estonia...cool!
I had a long ago cousin come to US ....from Estonia....
Where do you live in TX? ...if I may ask...

Dirk


----------



## SD90WLMT (Feb 16, 2010)

Just in case no one figured it out..

I was fooled by ..one letter...
The Galline
The Galtline
Alan & John


So no, not the same person...but I may remember them both now!!

;-)
..Dirk


----------



## BigRedOne (Dec 13, 2012)

It seems there must be several Chinese steamers ... the picture posted by Pete shows a 2-10-2 (I think), while some posts are making reference to 2-8-2's.


----------



## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

BigRedOne said:


> It seems there must be several Chinese steamers ... the picture posted by Pete shows a 2-10-2 (I think), while some posts are making reference to 2-8-2's.


OOPS... sorry, the latter 3 engines are 2-10-2's (not 2-8-2's). My bad!


----------



## John Galt Line (Dec 12, 2012)

SD90WLMT said:


> And remember that old adage...
> 
> ...." You can't please everyone all the time".....
> 
> ...


Dirk,

I live up in Kerrville, my mom's family ( fathers side) has been in the Kerr, Gillespie, and Llano county are since the mid 1840s. When ever I meet people form this part of Texas; whose family go back to the 19th century, I joking tell them we're probably related.... then we start listing the various local families we're part of to see if we're Kin folk to each other...
I had to go back and check the post with the Estonian Loco to make sure I didn't infer I was from there. To the best of my knowledge my ancestors were not Estonian. sorry for the ambiguity of the post. 
I tried to build one way way back when I dabbled in HO scale. I learned by trying the few Campbell kits I got for Christmas 96'; I haven't the patience for them... maybe now that I'm older and a little less in a hurry to get tings done, I'll give them another shot...

Shane,


----------



## Scottychaos (Jan 2, 2008)

I caught this interesting import back in the 80's..as far as I know, she was the only one of her kind to make the trip to the USA:

http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=71192&nseq=0

Scot


----------



## John Galt Line (Dec 12, 2012)

Ceaușescu must have laughed all the way to the bank when we bought that...


----------



## Scottychaos (Jan 2, 2008)

John Galt Line said:


> Ceaușescu must have laughed all the way to the bank when we bought that...


heh! yeah..although we only bought the one! 
years ago I heard some things about its history, but I dont remember them now..so I just googled for info and found..my own thread from 10 years ago! 

http://www.railroad.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=1891

Looks like it came to the US in the early 70's, and tested on the Southern and the Santa Fe, before ending up on the Washington Terminal.

but one thing is still unknown..*why* was it brought to the US for testing?
who thought it was a good idea to bring over a locomotive from Romania of all places? just because it was cheaper than US-built locomotives I presume? (thats probably why.."cost" is usually the only reason things like this are done..)

Sounds like no one thought too much of it though..the experiment was not repeated..

by a fluke of fate, I happened to be the one who (probably) photographed it last..I just happened to be a teenage railfan in Sayre, PA, where it spent its last days. I also have a few photos of it in a semi-scrapped state.

Scot


----------



## John Galt Line (Dec 12, 2012)

*The company that made it...*



Scottychaos said:


> heh! yeah..although we only bought the one!
> years ago I heard some things about its history, but I dont remember them now..so I just googled for info and found..my own thread from 10 years ago!
> 
> http://www.railroad.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=1891
> ...


FAUR SA is still around... been around for about 90 years, still makes small switching locos and according to their web page, some sort of part used to make Airbus A380 wings...

"Romanian industrial manufacturer Faur Bucuresti (FAU.RO) has delivered technical devices to French aircraft company Latecoere, to be used in the assembly lines of the A380 airplane, The Groupe Latecoere specializes in the design and technical maintenance of various high-precision aeronautics components, utilized in the assembly of Airbus aircraft wings."

and it looks like the still make the loco type in you photo too... and at 400,000RON it's a steal. that works out to around $122K a unit if i got the exchange right...

Locomotiva LDH 450 CP pentru vanzare


----------



## SD90WLMT (Feb 16, 2010)

OK, I see your near San Anton... our twins live there for the moment, talking of moving, again??

Not to worry about family stuff... :-}

Dirk


----------

