# A speaker setup in USATF3 that I like



## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

I have 10 USAT F3 locos, and really wanted to install a nice sound system, but moreover wanted a way to do all of them without a lot of extra work, but get really good sound.

I've put the details of my speaker install here: *http://www.elmassian.com...trong>**

I'll share some of the pictures and notes here:

When I pulled one apart, while I knew there was a speaker grill in the fuel tank I was surprised to see a speaker mount in the shell, in some grills on top behind the cab:










So, I started thinking I could do a 2 speaker install, and get some bass even though I could not use large speakers. The added benefit is that with a top-firing speaker, you get better high frequencies, and I can direct the horn and bell to the top speaker, rather than have them come from underneath the loco.

I found a nice 2" high performance speaker for this location:









In the fuel tank, there is a cutout, but the depth was very limiting, and I was concerned that I could not get a high performance speaker in this location:









I found a very compact speaker, that after some simple modification JUST fits into the fuel tank:









Again, be sure to check my site for the details and a step by step.

By the way, they sound great! Lots of volume, no distortion, and if you've never done a 2 speaker install, the extra "size" of the sound is impressive.

http://www.elmassian.com/trains/mot...cc-install

Greg*


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## paintjockey (Jan 3, 2008)

Do you like the sound quality? I did an install for a fellow that wanted the speaker in the grill (aristo style) and fuel tank and I really didn't care for it. I thought it was too overpowering kinda in your face like. Not knocking it mind you, just my observation. 
But, I always thought it would be cool if you could get the smaller speaker to play the horn bell and cab chatter then get the larger speaker to play the engine noise. It would be easy with 2 phoenix sound units but not worth the cost. 

Terry


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## paintjockey (Jan 3, 2008)

Oh, I have also "carved out" the floor of the USA F units to get a larger battery in. But, in that install I installed airwire so I removed the original boards. 

Terry


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Since both speakers are small (2" and 2.5") the sound is not overpowering, but remember I use QSI units, so there's a lot of variation in the sound, starting up it gets loud especially if you have added weight to the train (momentum) and are giving it a lot of throttle. After it hits cruising it quiets down, so it's not monotonous nor overpowering. 

Since the titan has 2 separate amps, and 2 separate channels, each sound has a fader to either or both channels, so I'll be doing exactly what you said, the horn and bell will come primarily from the "roof" speaker. 

Right now I'm very pleased and will do the remaining 9 F3's like this. 

Greg


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## grsman (Apr 24, 2012)

Greg
Would you tell me where you get your speakers?
Tom


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## Dick413 (Jan 7, 2008)

Tom I don't know where Greg gets his speakers from I'm shire he will tell us, but I have the same one's and get them from http://www.train-li-usa.com/store/s...3_159.html
Greg in the top speaker the open grills won't they let sound back in to the back side of the speaker? 
thanks dick


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## SD90WLMT (Feb 16, 2010)

So Greg, will there be any issues for the QSI - to run 2 A/C oval speakers, top fired....???? one channel with existing channel power... 

Still desire to use a 20 watt mini-amp to power 4 lower 2.5 in. speakers like in your tank...from the second channel of the QSI.. 

D


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

My E8's have two Aristo 2 x 3 ovals in them.... absolutely no problem... plenty of power since there are 2 separate amps. 

Yeah, a good amp would be great, just hard to find one with low distortion running from speaker outputs. 

Greg 

p.s. Dick, I'll experiment this weekend with closing up those top grills and see if it makes an audible difference, right now the sound is great and no distortion at full volume, an important thing to me.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

The Visaton speakers FRS5-8 and FRS7-8 were purchased from "Parts Express":

*http://www.parts-express...trong>**

http://www.parts-express...trong>

(Sorry Axel!)











Greg
*


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## Dick413 (Jan 7, 2008)

Greg 
All I got from parts express was " The page you requested is not a functioning page on the Parts Express website!!" 

Dick


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## Dick413 (Jan 7, 2008)

Found it 
http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?partnumber=292-536

http://www.parts-express.com/pe/sho...er=292-530

need to copy and paste the last one thanks Greg


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## SD90WLMT (Feb 16, 2010)

So - if I got this, right... 

the QSI can handle a single A/C oval on top - on 1 channel, 
and a single larger speaker on the lower end, - on 1 channel.. 

But,.. if 2 - 8 ohm speakers are on the lower end they should be 4 ohm each, 

So the ? is this, where are the matching 4 ohm speakers like the great Visitron units we are currently getting and using now? 

Really would like to have 2 - 2 1/2 in. speakers for increased air movement on the lower end of a loco..... 

:- } 

Dirk


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## Dick413 (Jan 7, 2008)

Thanks for fixing the link Greg, home page showed you had done it. 
Dick


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Dirk, I'd like to keep this thread on the F3.... I used an 8 ohm speaker on each of the 2 outputs on the QSI. If you want to run more than one speaker on one of the QSI outputs, then just make the impedence 8 ohms, like two 4 ohm in series 

Back to the topic, the speakers are very inexpensive from Parts Express. I ordered the balance for an ABBA set. 

I'm going to work on the lighting next, but all will be leds except perhaps the number boards. 

Greg


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## SD90WLMT (Feb 16, 2010)

as I mentioned- I understand the ''speaker addition'' for ohms usage. 

.... just have not seen many nice speakers in 4 ohm range to buy that might fit our uses in locos... 

but your Dayton site upon further digging does also have 4 ohm small units, they just cost more than 8 ohm ones do, just for reference... 

Dirk - THX


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## SD90WLMT (Feb 16, 2010)

Greg - have you tried using a ''cross-over filter'' on the fuel tank speaker yet? 

something in the 2500hz range... 

D


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

No, I hate losing power in a crossover in low power systems. 

The high frequencies are naturally damped in the fuel tank. 

I want all the bass I can get so no way would I not let the smaller speaker participate. 

I'd lose a lot of bass with a crossover I believe. 

Greg


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## SD90WLMT (Feb 16, 2010)

Then I presume the key is your happiness, and no distortion from the upper speaker.... 

If the upper highs get lost running around in the fuel tank. well ok... 

D


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

The highs are not running around in the fuel tank, they are being beamed at the ballast, and being more directional, they go pretty much straight down and get absorbed. 

They need a direct path to your ear, like the speaker on top. Also, since the top speaker is smaller, there's a bit more high end in that speaker. All of the speaker selection is by design. 

Greg


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## Totalwrecker (Feb 26, 2009)

I got a bunch of 4 ohm speakers from add on pc sound systems, the little satelite ones. 

John


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