# Track and roadbed



## jjwtrainman (Mar 11, 2011)

Okay well I am back again finally after not having access to the internet for so long. In my absence some things happened that changed my plan for a garden railroad, As some may remember, but it was a while ago, I was planning a very small garden railroad for the side yard of my house. Well, I moved again, but more possibilities opened up. Also I am going to be in that spot for a few years, so it is time for a more permanent railroad. I have a larger area that I picked out in a overgrown garden for the railroad. It is about 14 X 16 feet in a hexagonal shape with a very small pond in the middle, the pond is only about 3 X 4 feet and is one of those pre-formed ponds. my locomotives are all 0-4-0's and I have only two axle LGB cars so here is are the questions:

1. Should I use PIKO track? 
2. Should I use 6' diameter curves? I am told that that is what I should do, but my trains are quite short. Also, I don't believe in the largest curve possible theory, if I did that, I would have a circle.
3. Would R1 switches look stupid on that layout, or would nobody notice? 
4. What kind of method should I use for roadbed, and what materials? The ground is quite loose, but I am building up the height of the railroad with a combination of gravel and dirt.

Please tell me if you need more info.


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## John J (Dec 29, 2007)

How Big a area do you have to build on ? That is the most important piece of information we need to know to help you. 



The type of rolling stock including Engines determines What curves you can use. It also determines what switches you can use.


Some rolling stock will only run on 10 FT curve. 

The manufacture usually indicates minimum curve diameter that their rolling stock will work on. 

All my road bed is Concrete. 



The rule of thumb is " Use as big a curve as your area will allow. All mine are 20 FT curves except for one. ( It just has not been converted yet) 

If possible get a rail bender That will allow you to create your own custom curves. It will also allow you to buy all kinds of track bargains because you can adjust any store bought curve to anything you want.

The only track brands I have are Aristo and LGB. Don't know about Piko. 

Someone will be along to give you more information




JJ


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## jjwtrainman (Mar 11, 2011)

As stated above, it is 14X 16 in area, and I only run the two axle type cars once put out by LGB.


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## Totalwrecker (Feb 26, 2009)

First get your area built up and compacted... 

I would use a variety of curves, but first do you want a point to point RR or an oval to let them go round and round? Or my favorite 2 return loops with a run inbetween. 

Battery or track powered? (reverse loops can cause electrical headaches) 

With your equipment I see a country RR with a few industries and small towns, not a main line pike like JJ's, so 4'd, 6'd and 8'd curves can be used. If you like the way R1 switches look then use them, it matters not what others think! 
I'd start with gravel as your roadbed, it is so much easier to move track about when there is no structure under it. What pleases the mind's eye can be less appealing than the ground's eye... 

I gather from your re-intro that you are renting your house, so I wouldn't do concrete nor a ladder type that has to be removed when you move on, it becomes real work removing pipes and stakes pounded into the ground or ribbons of concrete that has to go in a trash bin.... 

Track? Well with your smaller equipment, I think you might could oughter use code .250 rail (I couldn't bring myself to say 'should') but I'm not sure you can get sectional track in that code, so you would be looking at bending and cutting the rails to fit ... is this something you want to do? 

A look a English garden railways might be a good source of inspiration to develop a track plan. Helping you solve your track laying is where we shine, telling you what to plan, not so much. 

Happy Rails 
John


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## wchasr (Jan 2, 2008)

JJW, 
I worried about these things too when I was starting. So much so that until this year I've not had a layout to run on. I've been colelcting large scale traisn since the early 1990's. Because I wanted to run some large more mainline trains I choose a minimum of 8 foot diameter. For your chosen trains R! or approximately 4 foot diameter curves and R1 switches should be fine. If you are building up your roadbed anyway you could do what I did and do the PVC trimboard (or Trex or your locally avaialble materials) ladder roadbed. I placed the ladder and pounded the stakes home adn set the track on it free floating earlier this year. I then ballasted around it and over it. Almost a foot high. It has settled over the last few months but I'll let the winter take it's toll and re-ballast in the spring. I did NOT tamp or compact the soil in any fashion even worse I rototilled the area as it was part garden adn part front yard when I started and I needed to add some topsoil to replace the sod I took out. I'm sure that some of my settling is because teh tilled soil underneath the weedblack is compacting. 
There are those who have gotten trains running relatively quickly by doing the ladder roadbed. MANY will say that placing your track on a solid base of some sort is important. I felt that for now the ladder was relatively easy to change if I wanted or needed to and knowing that the soil was disturbed felt it was the best option for me. Yes it is some work to pull it out BUT no more so than removing the berm you created with the fill and gravel. 
sketch up on pencil and paper your area. There used to be templates avaiable of the standard LGB sections that would give youa good diea of what's possible. Piko's track is similar enough you could use that as a guide. Conversly there are any number of resources on teh computer that will allow you to dream your layout up in cyberspace. Some are cheap and some are not and some have a steep learning curve and others are not so bad. None as cheap as simply measuring and sketching your area out and dreaming with a pencil in your hand. 
In the end it is your decision on track and roadbed and methods. You make your choices based on your abilities and budget. I could haul my own gravel from an asphalt plant locally so I choose to raise my ladder slightly and ballast around it. if I'd had to pay to haul that in I might have chosen differently. 

Biggest thing is to figure out how to share photos with us as you progress. Enjoy it! 

Chas


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## jjwtrainman (Mar 11, 2011)

Sorry for my hasty reply earlier, I had to get going early this morning. Any ways, here is everything I know I want on the railroad: 

Track powered trains, but I am in the process of converting them to battery as soon as I master that enough that I won't ruin my locomotives.
1 loop of track, so it would be a round about kind of layout.
Also, I would include a three track yard at the most for storage mostly. 
I would have to use R1 switches for now, but later I would plan on R2 or R3 ( based on LGB's track system)
I have a little Stainz locomotive and a porter, all rolling stock is two axle cars. I know that they can easily negotiate 4 ft curves, but they still look way too tight for anything but an industrial railroad, and even that's a stretch.


So for track, I need to have roadbed that can support track powered trains well. The track needs to be built well too, and I've so far heard good things about PIKO track, I just wanted an opinion from here. anything else I need to add?
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## KGierman (Jan 21, 2008)

Consider using the R3 switches from Train-Li-USA. They are equivalent to what would be an R2 switch in LGB if such a thing existed. They have a brass point that can be powered, if necessary. With LGB R3 switches I have problems with small locomotives stalling in the switch. Not so with the Train-Li-USA switches. So far, I have replaced 3 LGB R3's with the equivalent R4's from Train-Li-USA on my mainline and plan to replace the remaining switches as finances permit. 


Keith


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## adelmo (Jan 2, 2008)

I use the Piko 4' straight section outdoors with track power and would recommend. You should be able to find it for $5.00 ft which is one of the best prices for brass track available. No experience with the Piko switches.


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## jjwtrainman (Mar 11, 2011)

OK, switches are not the problem for now, and after a lot of research, I think that I will go with PIKO track. 6ft diameter curves I think will work fine for the layout too, I know we are supposed to use "the larges curve possible", but if I did that in my space I would just have a large circle, so 6 ft sounds about right to me. Also, yes, you are correct that I am in a rental house, but I will be there for a while. I doubt my land lord wants to play trains after I'm gone so no I don't want to use concrete roadbed. So that still leaves two questions here:

1. What should I do for roadbed? I don't really care how good it looks, but it has to work. And if it helps, I am in the northern plains with a dry climate. because of the soil in our area, the frost depth only goes down to about 18" and the frost heave is reflectively light compared to surrounding areas. 

2. is it a good idea to update to larger switches later given the fact that I have small wheel base locomotives? Someone already said they didn't have a problem with Train-Li switches, but anybody have any experiences with PIKO please share. I know the track just came out a couple years ago, but somebody must know. 

By the way thanks for sharing, it has helped me figure some things out, I just need some info on roadbed, as it is my weak point. And I need some sort of feedback or information on PIKO's switches. 
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## adelmo (Jan 2, 2008)

Check this UK G forum about Piko switches, http://www.gscalecentral.co.uk/f/m165785.aspx 

Cheers, Alan


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## jjwtrainman (Mar 11, 2011)

thanks adelmo!

I'll definatly have to find out more about the switches by PIKO, but I think that the rest of the track system is fine... maybe







. I'll have to do more research about the track. So then, anyone got any suggestions for a good roadbed system that won't frustrate my land lord when the rent is up? This means no concrete, no mixing concrete with crushed rock, and no post laying. But there are many other options I believe, so anybody got a good idea on what is best for my situation.

Also, as a review for what has already been said, the railway is located in western South Dakota, on dry soil in a dry area with only minor rain showers. The only problem is that when it rains, it pours! So the roadbed needs to be very stable, and has to hold the track in place securely.

thanks for any replies so far! 
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## kormsen (Oct 27, 2009)

have a look here, what i do, to use R1 curves, without having sharp S-curves: http://kormsen.info/tracks/


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