# The Cliffside Mine at night!



## Ray Dunakin (Jan 6, 2008)

When I built the Cliffside Mine, I used 16v "grain of rice" bulbs for interior and exterior lighting. But until now they haven't been connected to a power supply. Recently I finally got the low voltage wiring installed for the upper level of the layout, so that I run power to the lights. Eventually I'll be using a Malibu transformer/timer, but for now I just hooked it up to my old Buddy L power pack, set to a little less than half power. 


Last night I shot some time exposures, and I think they turned out pretty good...


This is the Cliffside Mine, located high on Grandt Cliff:












This is the scratch-built hoist inside the hoist house:












Here's a view looking towards the mine from the 15" gauge tram tracks:










You can see these (and a few other shots) in a higher resolution on my website:


http://www.raydunakin.com/Site/IRR-Night.html


Enjoy!


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## studeclunker (Mar 15, 2009)

EXCELLENT!


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## toddalin (Jan 4, 2008)

Very cool.


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## Bills (Feb 20, 2008)

Nice work Ray. Did you use LED or incandesent lamps?


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## Ray Dunakin (Jan 6, 2008)

Those are all 16v "grain of rice" incandescent bulbs.


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## sbaxters4 (Jan 2, 2008)

Very well Done Ray!!! Thanks for sharing! Great inspiration!


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## Mike O (Jan 2, 2008)

That is sweet. Very nice photography. Thanks for posting. 

Mike


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## Torby (Jan 2, 2008)

Fantastic!


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## Don Gage (Jan 4, 2008)

Very nice effect Ray, 
I really like the available light shots of the mine. 
Thanks for sharing, 
Don


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## Nohandles (Jan 2, 2009)

Wow what a cool building and excellent photography too. Thanks for sharing with us. Doug


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## Les (Feb 11, 2008)

Thank you for posting the excellent pixes. Dumb question: is this outdoors? Can I come back in a few months and bug you on the details of the winch?









Les


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## jimtyp (Jan 2, 2008)

Great photos Ray! Did you make the rocks? They look extremely real in these photos.


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## dltrains (Jan 2, 2008)

Ray,
Looks like it turned out really nice,just enough light to show it off

Dave


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## Ray Dunakin (Jan 6, 2008)

Thanks guys! 

Les: Yes, it's an outdoor layout. I'll be happy to answer any questions about the hoist. I'll have to look around and see if I have any pics showing construction of the hoist. 

Jim: The rocks are are real, and there are a lot of them!


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## Biblegrove RR (Jan 4, 2008)

Ray, you sure seem to have perfected the use of that new camera! Simply beautiful....thanks


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## Mike O (Jan 2, 2008)

Ray, 

Any chance of a daylight shot from a bit further away so we can see the context? 

Mike


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## Les (Feb 11, 2008)

Ray,

Hold off a bit on the pixes, I find myself in the middle of a filing crises. I've been stuffing misc-received data into one folder, and it's a mess trying to find what want. Today, I got the lumber for the first section of my layout so will begin tomorrow. The first section is 8' long and will serve to get me started on a whole lot of fronts at once.

I would like to second the request for a longer, daylight shot for context. For instance, the mine entry ('Adit'?) is located the way I thought one would be, but all the pictures show hoist houses over undefined structures.

Les


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## Ray Dunakin (Jan 6, 2008)

Ok, here are a few daytime shots of the Cliffside Mine: 

As you can see here, the mine has both an inclined shaft, and a horizontal adit (tunnel). The shaft is located between the ore bin and the hoist house. The shaft goes down at a 45 degree angle, towards the hoist house. 









The adit is on a lower level and really only exists to provide enough room for the tram to push or pull a short train of ore cars during loading. (I still have to extend the chute from the ore bin, to reach the tram tracks.) 











Here's a couple of farther away shots so you can see where the mine is in relation to the railroad:


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## Les (Feb 11, 2008)

Ray,

Okay, I understand better now. Thanks for taking time to post the pixes. Can you point me at a link where the hoisting of the ore is explained? All I ever see on these lifts are small mine cars (usually two) or buckets. The buckets I get: they dump into a bin. The little mine cars (hand pushed), those I don't get: Do they ride a 'cage' of some sort to the top and then get pushed to the bin, or...? The emphasis of the pictures I've found are on the hoisting frame and/or house, with a couple of small trams partway up the frame, and nothing much else.

For my own mine ( a lead mine) I had first thought to use adits to allow trams to be pushed over a waiting ore car and dumped. Then I got the notion of using pneumatic engines to go inside and get a string of them, a notion I'm still taken with put am unsure how to implement in a reasonably prototypical way. In the far distant future I want to do a mine shaft that is cut out on one side to show a 'typical' shaft & tramway, workers, etc. It will be below table level. Thought it might be something a little different. 

Les

BTW, FWIW, I got enough lumber today to start my first 3' x 8' module. Going to start putting it up over the weekend, when the weather is going to be bad. Finally, after two years.


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## Ray Dunakin (Jan 6, 2008)

Les, I'm no expert but here's what I've figured out from studying old mines and what little I've found on the web and in print...


The methods vary depending on the type of shaft, the era, and the size of the mine. 


A vertical shaft can use buckets to lift out the ore, but you'd only see this on very small, primitive mines. 


Another method is to have a platform on the lift (also called a "cage") which is fitted with a short section of track. A single ore car is pushed by hand onto the lift from whatever level of the mine is being worked. The hoist lifts it to the surface, and then a worker pushes the ore car onto a track to be dumped, either into the ore bin or the waste pile. This is a simple method used on smaller and/or older mines, but it's not very efficient. 


On a larger and/or more modern mine with a vertical shaft, the workers would dump the ore into a special ore car attached to the hoist cable, called a skip. The skip is pulled to the surface and dumps (usually) automatically. 


A mine with an inclined shaft would generally use a skip designed for use at an angle rather than vertically. As near as I can tell these also dump automatically. 


Exactly how the vertical and inclined skips dump isn't real clear to me, but it usually involves an extension of the rails that flips the skip over. 


I've also seen some inclined skips with wider wheels on the back end, and narrower wheels on the front end. Apparently these allow the front end to drop down between the rails, which are wider at the dumping point.


That's what I decided to use for the inclined shaft of the Cliffside Mine:


















The rails are wood fitted with styrene "angle iron". 


You can see a good example of a vertical shaft headframe and skip here:
http://www.raydunakin.com/Site/Death_Valley_Mine_CA.html
This is the "Death Valley Mine" near Cima, CA. It's a small mine of relatively recent vintage, with a homemade, steel headframe. It's remarkably intact, with the skip still in place. There was a large tube nearby made of steel drums welded together, which was apparently used as a chute. 


The "Great Western Mine" in Gold Point, NV has an inclined shaft with a fairly large wooden headframe combined with a steel hopper:
http://www.raydunakin.com/Site/Gold_Point_NV.html


You can see the steel headframe of the "Orleans Mine" there too, and it also has an inclined shaft.


There's a smaller wooden headframe and inclined shaft at the "Noonday Mine" in the Mojave desert:
http://www.raydunakin.com/Site/Noonday_Mines_CA.html


The "Nivloc Mine" in NV has a vertical shaft and large steel headframe. If you look near the top of the headframe you can see the remains of the mechanism for dumping the skip. But there are also signs of some old 18" gauge tracks on the ground which seem to indicate that this mine originally brought up the ore cars on a lift.
http://www.raydunakin.com/Site/Nivloc_Mine_NV.html


Hope this helps!


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## Engineercub (Oct 18, 2008)

Ray that is just gorgeous. You have alot of talent mister. Thanks for sharing. 

-Will


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## denray (Jan 5, 2008)

Ray
I have looked at your site on a couple occasions before and have always enjoyed your techniques you have used. I am also a mountain man, I do concrete, Wow the Rocks you have handled brings back memories of my youth being raised on a farm. I have picked up more rocks than what you have, But when emptied off the wagons, mine turned into rock piles, yours turned into an awesome form of ART. You are a real skilled artist, you have taken what most people consider to be nuisance and make a Rembrant.
I really appreciate your artwork more than I do a Rembrants Painting, not to offend any rembrant fans.
Keep up the GREAT Work
Dennis


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## Stan Cedarleaf (Jan 2, 2008)

Ray... That mine is fabulous. Looks just like the rocks on I-8 just before you drop into the Imperial Valley....

Fantastic....


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## placitassteam (Jan 2, 2008)

Wow! That rock work is really something. Is it all mortared in place and if so what is the base? Thanks


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## Ray Dunakin (Jan 6, 2008)

Yes, the rocks are all mortared together. The hill is composed of old sea bed and is very hard, almost like sandstone. In fact I had to use a chisel on some areas! I cut "steps" into the hill, so that the rocks are supported by this hard sediment. The steps are also sloped back into the hill a little, so that the weight of the rocks leans into the hill rather than away from it. 

Most of the mortar is put in behind the rocks, and any excess that squeezes out between the rocks is hosed off with a light spray. This minimizes the appearance of the mortar. In addition, the mortar is tinted to help it blend in with the rocks.


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## placitassteam (Jan 2, 2008)

Thanks Ray. Sounds like your land is similar to ours, we have clay and rock that in places becomes concrete.


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## silverstatespecialties (Jan 2, 2008)

WOW, Ray, you are the MASTER! Very nice!


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## Randy Stone (Jan 2, 2008)

Simply Fantastic Ray 

Thank you for sharing your layout with all of us. 

Randy


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## Seans_World (Aug 14, 2009)

That is an amazing layout, I really enjoyed your videos also. Thank you for sharing. Hopefully someday I will have mine set up something in that realm.


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## joe rusz (Jan 3, 2008)

Perfecto, Ray. Nice effect.


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## Gary Woolard (Jan 2, 2008)

Where can I find the videos?
thx in advance,,,


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## aceinspp (Jan 2, 2008)

As usual great job. You never cease to amaze me. Later RJD


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## Ray Dunakin (Jan 6, 2008)

My YouTube "channel" is here: 

http://www.youtube.com/user/raydunakin 

I have videos of my layout, and also some cool video of 2-8-0 #93 running in Ely, NV. 

My "In-ko-pah RR Freight Ride" video shows the entire layout, as seen by a "cameraman" riding a flat car.


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## ThinkerT (Jan 2, 2008)

http://www.youtube.com/user/raydunakin


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## Gary Woolard (Jan 2, 2008)

Thanks, Ray & ThinkerT. I took the freight train ride, Ray, and then spent WAY[/i] too much time checking out the RR on your site this evening








Some terrific ideas, implemented with a lot of care! Next time you have an open house for the S.D. club, let us know -- it's worth the drive down from L.A.!


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## Gary Woolard (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Gary Woolard on 27 Aug 2009 12:14 AM 
Thanks, Ray & ThinkerT. I took the freight train ride, Ray, and then spent WAY[/i] too much time checking out the RR on your site this evening







Some terrific ideas, implemented with a lot of care! Next time you have an open house for the S.D. club, let us know -- it's worth the drive down from L.A.!


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## Ray Dunakin (Jan 6, 2008)

Thanks! Yes, I'll let you know next time we have an open house. Also, we're always happy to have visitors, so if you'd to come down before then just let me know and we'll work out a day and time.


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