# 3d printed mogul



## peter_m (Aug 10, 2014)

Hi, some of may still know me from this tread:
http://forums.mylargescale.com/15-model-making/39058-3d-printing-1-22-5-scale-locomotive.html

Like I said there, it was a bit of a test to see if it was possible to completely print a model train, and that there was more to come. Well I have been a bit busy in the meantime as soon after the build log was finished I became a father !
Our son's name is Jip and he's doing very good.

So not to much free time at the moment, and of course priority's have changed but things are already settling a bit by now. 

After I had (as far as I'm concerned) successfully finished my saxon loc I wanted to build something that would actually be usable on the railroad. With usable I mean durable, smooth running and more detailed looking. I read the articles in the masterclass section and decided that I would build a 2-6-0, wherever possible based on the one build in 2001. 

I learned quite a lot from building my first loc and maybe even more from your comments. One of the suggestions was to look for an existing powerblock from one of the manufacturers. I did and I found an LGB "Dicke priced very reasonable. I already own a Dicke which also made it less painful to dismantle it 

Besides the powerblock I'll try to do some other things different as well. I want to use ABS in stead of PLA as a print material as much as possible. I find ABS easier to sand than PLA so I hope it gives nicer results. It also has a higher melting temperature which could be important when running in hot sun. For the cab I want to use the Woodfill material that I also used in my previous project to make the coal container. I'm not sure that I can create all the details that I would like, so if this fails I might go for a more modern look with a steel (printed in ABS) cab.
Next to the wood filament there is another new material that I want to try. It is called Bronzefill and as the name suggests it has real bronze mixed into it. When you sand and polish this after printing it just looks, feels and weighs like real bronze. With these materials I want to create one of the earlier moguls that has a bit of a weathered look. (I hope that the bronze gives the illusion of weathered brass).

The drawings are almost finished by now. Since I use the LGB powerblock the wheelbase is a bit off but I think it still looks quite nice. I want it be able to run on as narrow curves as possible so the first ans last drive axle will use the original (modified) LGB wheels. The second axle will use (bronze) printed wheels without flange. All the smaller wheels will be printed in bronze as well. I use brushes on the first and last drive axle and the sliding contact. I hope this results in smooth operation otherwise I might use real metal wheels with powerpickup on the tender. (no the printed bronze doesn't conduct electricity )

I didn't bother drawing all the plumbing on the loc as it takes a lot of time, this won't be printed anyway, just made of copper and brass wire.


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## Treeman (Jan 6, 2008)

The drawings look great. What is the price range of your printer?


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## peter_m (Aug 10, 2014)

I'm using an Ultimaker 1 printer which is now available from about $1250 for a kit.
You probably want to pay about $250 more for a heated bed, so you can print with more materials and in higher quality.


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## David Fletcher (Jan 2, 2008)

Very very nice, I look forward to seeing it all printed up and working.
Keep it up,
David.


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## peter_m (Aug 10, 2014)

Thanks for the compliment David!
And also for the great articles, I've read it with great interest and it realy helps when you know "what" you are making. Especially when it comes to the details. 

Sunday (well actually Saturday night because I was awake anyway) I started printing the first part, ie the main chassis. This is the part that holds the driveblock and the three drive axles. In front of this, the chassis will be extended up to the pilot mount. The print must fit within a square of 210x210mm so I couldn't print the whole chassis in once. The extension will be screwed to the main part behind the first drive axle so the connection will be barely visible. 
In the morning the first part was finished. Very excited I snapped it from the buildplate, and as soon it came it cracked. It turned out that the ABS was very brittle and several layers just came loose from each other. I started searching and came to the conclusion that I probably have a bad batch or bad supplier of ABS... 
I guess that I'm back to the PLA plastic but that means that it is a bit harder to sand nice and smooth. Nothing to do about at this time, but I might have an alternative for the future. I have another material that should have material properties similar to ABS and is easier to print but I haven't tested it yet.

Back to the chassis. At first I struggled a bit with the printer setup but eventualy I got it running nicely and 8 hours later, short after midnight the part was finished. (couldn't resist a quick peek at 3AM )
It needs some sanding but I think it will come out nice when I'm finished. The next day I printed the chassis extension which took about 6 hours.
Today I printed the back coupling and the cab support beam. The support beam will be glued to the back of the chassis and a small nut for the coupling is to be inserted in a slot that will be sandwiched between these two parts. Therefore I want the coupling already mounted to the support beam. 

Well that's all for now. Next thing is to assemble these parts, spray on some plastic primer and filler and start sanding


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

It looks like that came out pretty well!


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## peter_m (Aug 10, 2014)

Finally, an update!

The build is progressing nicely but writing it all down as well as taking pictures takes a lot of time, so my apologies for that. I was quite satisfied with the printed chassis although it needed a lot of cleanup. It was printed with a layerheight of 0,16mm which was sort of my default setting. I sprayed several layers of filler and did a lot of sanding. After a coat of satin black I think it looks quite nice. 

Next I printed the cylinders with bronze filament. The shiny parts needed to be polished using copper polish. The other parts were painted black. Also the middle flangeless driver was printed in bronzefil. I printed new counterweights to modify the existing LGB wheels.

Next was the drivegear. This wasn’t so hard. After painting it I could start assembling the chassis. 

When I was satisfied with the chassis so far I started printing the cab. In my first post I said I wanted to try a wooden cab so I started printing with filament containing wood particles. It would be about 10 hours of printing but after 2 hours I already saw that the result was a bit disappointing. The corners weren’t nice and sharp and after about 5 hours of printing the nozzle clogged and I had to start over again. At this point I decided that I would first try a black painted cab. This way I could just use ordinary filament instead of the woodfil. When the build is finished I can always print a wooden cab if I want to. So I loaded the printer with PLA filament and again started the 10 hour job. The result was a lot better but I still had a feeling it could do better. So I changed the layerheight to 0.06mm (about the size of a human hair) and the speed to 30mm/sec. It now took more than 25 hours of printing but now the result was really nice! It needed just a bit of cleanup but other than that I think I can spray a layer of filler and hardly need sanding at all.
Quite addicted by this high resolution I also printed the boiler which also came out nice.

I’ll try to make better pictures in the future but for now you will have to do with these:


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## d_sinsley (Mar 29, 2011)

Peter,
Really quite amazing what your producing. The cab is very sharp indeed but so are the cylinders and steam chests. Are your side rods and cross heads printed? I guess a better question would be at this point is what isn't printed?

Makes me excited to see my wheels when we get that far.

I can see when I start my next loco build I will have some serious expenditure in materials and shipping from Holland for detail parts ;-)
Devon


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## CliffyJ (Apr 29, 2009)

Tremendous work, Peter. As a veteran 3d modeler, my hat's off to you.


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## peter_m (Aug 10, 2014)

Thank you very much for the compliments guys.

Devon, almost everything you see is printed 
Indeed the side rods and crossheads are printed. The only parts not printed are the valverod, the steamcock, the oilcup on the cylinders and as mentioned the 1st and 3rd axle drivewheels.
Just let me know which parts you want and we'll try to find a solution


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## d_sinsley (Mar 29, 2011)

peter_m said:


> Thank you very much for the compliments guys.
> 
> Devon, almost everything you see is printed
> Indeed the side rods and crossheads are printed. The only parts not printed are the valverod, the steamcock, the oilcup on the cylinders and as mentioned the 1st and 3rd axle drivewheels.
> Just let me know which parts you want and we'll try to find a solution


Your rapidly becoming my new best friend Peter. . . well the second loco is down the road a bit. I am sticking to my guns on the first one being as much scratch built as I can. But the second one I plan on going all out with fancy detail parts. Kind of the polar extremes in build philosophy. But when I do I will start with the fancy wheels and just make a list lol. 

really I am impressed at the technologies ability an the operators ability to design and manipulate the machinery to produce that stuff. In fact you have significantly changed my opinion of the value of 3d printing technology. Your ability is truly cool.


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## peter_m (Aug 10, 2014)

Yes I know what you mean, on my previous project I also wanted to see how much I could produce myself. I ended up with a completely printed gearbox, just because it was possible


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## peter_m (Aug 10, 2014)

Last weeks I worked on some of the smaller parts. Parts of the domes, the rail stanchions, the bell and the boilerbands were all printed in bronze. Now that they are polished I think it gives a weathered brass look. The only thing not printed are the safety valves on the steamdome.


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## d_sinsley (Mar 29, 2011)

Basically you and I building the same locomotive with two very radically different techniques. Fun to seem them come together.

Very nice Peter.


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## peter_m (Aug 10, 2014)

In the last weeks i did a lot of detailing. Especially the plumbing was very time consuming but I'm happy with the result. Although I still have to work less sloppy, I think there is definitely progression in my work. Also did the tender in the meanwhile. There will be some more wood on top, and it needs some plumbing. The main part of the tender took more than 48 hours to print. I now realize that I didn't have pictures on my camera but there might be some on my phone. At this point the tender is coupled too close to the engine. It looks good but it can't turn tight corners. I found out that I gonna need wider curves as I only have R1 curves which it can't take. The pilot truck should steer only a bit more to make the turn. Maybe if I use wheels with a smaller flange it could just work. But then again for my future garden layout I want wider curves anyhow. It just would be fun if I could already make a test run. Also detailed the interior but I found it hard to make decent pics. 

Next is a bit of detailing on the tender, put on decals and last weathering, which I think will be a bit scary ...


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## Dwight Ennis (Jan 2, 2008)

This is very cool! What software are you using to (a) draw the 3D parts and (b) drive the printer?


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## CliffyJ (Apr 29, 2009)

Just beautiful, Peter. You're making us all drool!


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## peter_m (Aug 10, 2014)

Wow, thank you for the compliments!
Dwight; I use Creo parametric (former pro/engineer) for the modelling as I can use this at work. Then I load the drawings in Cura to prepare it for the printing. This basicly slices the part into small layers with a given thickness and writes this to a file with allong with all the other needed parameters needed for printing, such as temperature and speed. You can save this to a sd-card and let the printer work as "stand alone". So if your computer crashes, the printer just keeps running.


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## Gary Armitstead (Jan 2, 2008)

peter_m said:


> Wow, thank you for the compliments!
> Dwight; I use Creo parametric (former pro/engineer) for the modelling as I can use this at work. Then I load the drawings in Cura to prepare it for the printing. This basicly slices the part into small layers with a given thickness and writes this to a file with allong with all the other needed parameters needed for printing, such as temperature and speed. You can save this to a sd-card and let the printer work as "stand alone". So if your computer crashes, the printer just keeps running.


Peter,

I have a question regarding the software you are using to build your parts. I use MasterCam as my drawing/cad program. I can do my drawings in 3D geometry, parametric surfaces or in "solids". I can also convert these to STL for stereo lithography (3D printing). Do you know if Cura can be converted to and/or from DXF or IGES? Thanks. Beautiful model!!


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## peter_m (Aug 10, 2014)

Gary, Cura can read stl files so if mastercam can convert to this format it should be no problem. Does this answer your question?


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## peter_m (Aug 10, 2014)

By the way cura is supplied with my printer but is free to use for anyone. As far as I know it works with printers from other manufacturers as well. It is realy easy to use but has a bit less options than software that isn't free.


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## d_sinsley (Mar 29, 2011)

Most excellent work my friend. That is turning out to be a classy lady. It is fun to see our projects progress basically at the same pace with very different methods of construction. Yours is very high tech and mine is very low tech. We are at about the same place. 

Keep up the good work.


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## Sjoc78 (Jan 25, 2014)

This is really impressive. If you didn't mention that it was 3-D no one would know it just looks like a professionally/skillfully built model. I'm currently looking to get a 3-D printer so I definitely enjoy seeing your work.


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## peter_m (Aug 10, 2014)

Devon, it would be cool to see them next to each other, but this will be hard to arrange 

Sjoc, that sounds great! which manufacturer/model are you looking at?


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## d_sinsley (Mar 29, 2011)

Sjoc78 said:


> This is really impressive. If you didn't mention that it was 3-D no one would know it just looks like a professionally/skillfully built model. I'm currently looking to get a 3-D printer so I definitely enjoy seeing your work.


Don't let Peter fool you. He is and this is a skillfully built model (Edit: Actually I don't know if Peter is a skillfully built model or not). Maybe not in the traditional sense but this guy can make it happen. He has shown me other work and is working up some wheels for me and he is skilled. I send him a picture and a few dimensions and he spits out drivers. Pretty talented work, maybe not traditional, but skillful nonetheless. I used to kinda be a critic of 3d printing but not anymore. full respect.


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## d_sinsley (Mar 29, 2011)

peter_m said:


> Devon, it would be cool to see them next to each other, but this will be hard to arrange
> 
> Sjoc, that sounds great! which manufacturer/model are you looking at?


When we are each done we will take some shots and post them together to show two very different ways of achieving very much the same loco. Hows that sound.


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## peter_m (Aug 10, 2014)

sounds great to me!


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## peter_m (Aug 10, 2014)

My loc is finished. I did some light weathering using dry-brushing and a light coat of sand on the lower side. I'm quite happy with the result although there are a few spots that could have been better. 
Maybe I'll try making some figures and otherwise I just see if I run into some on a meeting. 
For now I hope that summer will come in soon so that I can finally start laying track. I don't even got R2 turns yet so I still can't make a full test run with this loc 

Then next i want to make a few logging disconnects to place behind this loc and some other things for around the railroud, but to be honest what I really want is starting a new locomotive build because this is simply what I enjoy the most 

Only thing is that I just can't decide which loc to build first. The most difficult part for me is finding good drawings. Just taking the plane and fly to the US only to measure a loc is a bit too expensive.. 

Enjoy the pics and feel free to comment


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## peter_m (Aug 10, 2014)

and some more


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## CliffyJ (Apr 29, 2009)

Just wow. Great job Peter, your work is inspiring.


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## peter_m (Aug 10, 2014)

Thanks Clif!


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## Randy Stone (Jan 2, 2008)

Peter, did you paint the black or dye it?


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## peter_m (Aug 10, 2014)

Randy, sorry; English is not my first language. What exactly is dye?
I painted most large parts using my airbrush and the smaller just with a pencil


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## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

Wow! That turned out great! You'll have to post pics of it running outside! 

Later,

K


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## CliffyJ (Apr 29, 2009)

Just curious Peter, how many cad-modeling hours do you think you have into this model? And were you working from drawings, photos, or both? 

Pretty amazed...
Cliff


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## peter_m (Aug 10, 2014)

Thanks Kevin! When the weather here becomes nicer I'll definitely take some running pics outside.
ps. Any sign of the samples yet?

Clif; Phfew thats a dificult question, if I have to make a guess I'dd say around 50 hours or so. Anyhow it was over a time span of 2 months but there were days that I couldn't do any modelling or only half an hour. Most of the time went into research and stuff like that rather than the modelling itself but I guess you are familiar with that yourself. Next time I'll try to record my drawing and printing hours.

For the reference I used David Fletchers masterclass so a big thanks goes out to him. For the rest I gathered as many as possible pics from the net for all the details.


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## peter_m (Aug 10, 2014)

Found some pics of the build on my phone


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## CliffyJ (Apr 29, 2009)

Only 50 hours? Now I AM impressed!


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## peter_m (Aug 10, 2014)

Haha, but beside that I am modelling 5 days a week at work. The parts are all quite simple shapes. Only the pilot was a bit challeging


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## d_sinsley (Mar 29, 2011)

Very fine locomotive. I love it.


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## peter_m (Aug 10, 2014)

Thanks Devon!


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## roybikerdude (Jun 10, 2014)

Looks like a great build. Did not see the stl files and was wondering if they could be shared.


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## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

roybikerdude said:


> Looks like a great build. Did not see the stl files and was wondering if they could be shared.


That thread is dated 2014/2015. I would send a private message to the original poster ("OP")


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