# Ozark Castings Melting Point?



## Dwight Ennis (Jan 2, 2008)

Does anyone know at what temperature the white metal used by Ozark will begin to deform/melt?

Thanks!


----------



## Pete Chimney (Jan 12, 2008)

Dwight 

I believe Ozark Miniatures uses what is known as pot metal for their castings. Here is the link to wikipedia with some info. 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pot_metal


----------



## Curmudgeon (Jan 11, 2008)

I don't think so. 
All the stuff I have in bags is soft. 
Pot Metal is brittle. 
Maybe mine is just old technology stuff. 
If I recall, it melted sooner than solder. 

If they went with pot metal, great!


----------



## Jerry Barnes (Jan 2, 2008)

Some melted on my shay's smokebox is all I can say.


----------



## livesteam5629 (Jan 2, 2008)

Larry Heggert won't tell you. Proprietary information. You could call the folks at Ozark and ask them.You cannot use it near a heat source like live steam. I know it is fairly low since I have remelted some broken parts and spures to make some of my own castings. It isn't pewter, but in that neighborhood. 
N


----------



## steamlogger (Jan 2, 2008)

I know it melts when too close to heating element in an oven at 350 degrees. I have a water hatch that I was powder coating and now it is a flush hatch


----------



## toddalin (Jan 4, 2008)

I tried to solder one of the link couplers that had opened up and it melted to a blob at the soldering iron's touch.


----------



## rkapuaala (Jan 3, 2008)

Hummm, guess I won't be adding those leave springs I got from them to my Ruby since they're really close to that steam pipe.


----------



## Dwight Ennis (Jan 2, 2008)

I'm asking the question because I'm going to need to bake some paint, and I don't want the coupler pocket to melt. I found this table[/b][/b] which lists several alloys, the lowest of which melts at 140*C. I need to bake the paint at 175*F.


----------



## Mike Reilley (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Dwight Ennis on 12/17/2008 8:05 AM
I'm asking the question because I'm going to need to bake some paint, and I don't want the coupler pocket to melt. I found this table[/b][/b] which lists several alloys, the lowest of which melts at 140*C. I need to bake the paint at 175*F. 


Well...I can't imagine any metal melting at 175*F...or even getting soft. ****, if you cook meat at that temperature, you'll need a LOT of BBQ sauce...and a lot of time...cause ribs are the only thing I know that respond to such low heat. 

Why don't you test one Ozark coupler pocket in your oven if you're still concerned..or boil one. I gotta believe that the metal on a live steam loco gets up to that 175*F temperature range anywhere around the boiler...and much higher around the firebox and smokebox. If you have one of those IR thermometer [e.g. http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=93984 ] why don't you measure the temperature on the various parts of the engine the next time you run it.


----------



## Charles M (Jan 2, 2008)

Guys, 

Try this website for information on metals and their melting points. 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wood's_metal 

There is a metal called Wood's metal that melts at 158 degree F . It is also known as Cerrobend and has been used for casting parts for O Scale and HO Scale model train use for years. You could melt this product in boiling water and yes it has been done. I have some on hand now for project . 

Charles M SA # 74


----------



## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Cerrobend is great for filling tubing to bend it without collapsing the tubing and then melt the Cerrobend out and have nice bent tubes.


----------



## Mike Reilley (Jan 2, 2008)

Well...damn, there is a metal that melts at that low of a temperature. Interesting material....


----------



## Jack - Freshwater Models (Feb 17, 2008)

I would have thought it was some sort of tin/lead alloy since they are the cheapest???? Most Bismuth alloys like cerro are expensive!!! Generally speaking most tin/lead alloys have a melting point of about 475 deg F. I cast in lead free Britannia (92 tin -7.5 antimony-.5 copper) which can be soldered with low melt solder like "TIX". 

BTW, monikers like "Pot Metal" and "Pewter" are pretty general. 

Jack


----------



## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

Richard, so long as the steam pipe doesn't actually touch the casting, you'll be fine. I've got an Ozark number plate on the smokebox of one of my steamers. It's a pot boiler, so the smokebox doesn't get near as hot as on a butane-fired loco, but it's held up nicely. Roundhouse uses a fair amount of some kind of white metal castings on their steamers. I've also used plastic and other things that many would say you shouldn't use with live steam. (Heck, look at Aristo's steamers!) So long as they're not in contact with the major heat sources (boiler, smokebox, cylinders) you should be fine. 

Later, 

K


----------



## John McGuyer (Jan 2, 2008)

There is no specific answer as the metal used by Ozark is not the same for all the products. Some parts require a more brittle alloy that can take more heat. 

John


----------



## Dwight Ennis (Jan 2, 2008)

Was talking to Bob Hartford tonight. The stuff he used didn't start to deform until at least 400*F and melted much higher - somewhere in the neighborhood of 475*F +. Just an FYI for everyone.


----------



## Bob Starr (Jan 2, 2008)

It always has appeared to be some form of pewter to me. Pewter melts in the range of 450-550 degrees. Pewter is primarily tin and is lead free.


----------



## Jack - Freshwater Models (Feb 17, 2008)

"American" pewter is lead free but many pewters have a few percent lead to aid in flow in teh casting process. 

J


----------



## Dwight Ennis (Jan 2, 2008)

Bob said his metal contained lead. He didn't remember the name of it off the top of his head, but it wasn't pewter.


----------



## Jack - Freshwater Models (Feb 17, 2008)

Dwight, 

A small amount of lead is common and is pewter though he probably refered to it by a propriatary name. I have been told lead is now supposed to be banned from consumer products in California and EU countries which is why I use unleaded "Britania metal". I wish I could use lead containing pewter because it is much easier to cast. 

I have used heat lamps to "bake" paint on my castings without problems. More likely to burn paint than to melt the casting! Good luck with your project!!! 

Jack


----------



## Paul Burch (Jan 2, 2008)

Dwight,
If you can contact Mike Gorsich,he might know. We both had conversations with Dave at Ozark about his new caboose trucks. Mike is a machinist and gets very detailed about his modifications. He quoted me a melting temp that came right from Dave but of course I didn't pay attentoion.


----------



## ozmin (Feb 16, 2008)

Dave from Ozark Miniatures

Dont get much of a chance to log in. As far as the metal we use is concerned it is a fine pewter. Pewter soften significantly at around 375 to 400 degress . Becomes truly melted at 500+ doesent really cast until 600+


As far as soldering. Most irons ar too hot and the solder used requires too much heat. There is a solder I sed to sell that can solder with the small heat of a match. I have a new metal that we are using for the guys in 1, 1.5 and 3in scales It is extremly brittle and very unforgiving. But can be soldered easier although the melting temp is only 100 more degress.


----------



## OldNoob (Apr 30, 2016)

Apologies in advance for resurrecting an old thread. But i had to share something.
Recently I was soldering at "medium" setting (im guessing between 400 and 600 degrees) on my iron and soldering on one of Ozark's Harp switches.. The metal just "Went away" it literally melted onto my soldering iron. I had to turn the heat down to the very lowest setting and even then,, had to be quick about it. the melting point of the harp switches i received was only slightly above that of the solder i was using. Maybe i got a bad one? I actually had to replace, rebuild and shape the melted, missing material using solder.


----------



## Dan Pierce (Jan 2, 2008)

I would try to test some of the flashing I removed thus saving the part.


----------

