# Regner Lumberjack: too much gear backlash?



## Skeeterweazel (Feb 11, 2014)

Guys, having some issues w/ building my kit. Please see video. The small gear is driven by the motor. Large gear is connected to shaft that front wheels are on. Shafts for both gears run through the frame and there is no way to adjust the back lash.
I would figure that possibly a little extra lash would be designed into the kit in case some dirt got in there so wouldn't bind, but this seems too much to me. Gear life will be diminished.

Please chime in, especially those w/ Lumberjacks. If this is the way it is i can live w/ it for now. Have article where someone installed bearings for shafts to ride on. May do that down the road. Can "fix" lash then.

Thx.

Marty


----------



## Nick Jr (Jan 2, 2008)

Marty, that's quite a bit more lash than mine has, and I've had it for over 5 years. Almost looks like the shaft is riding a bit back from where it should be. Maybe the factory drilled holes in the frame are off a bit.


----------



## Garratt (Sep 15, 2012)

The gear teeth are only meshing on the tips. Something is not right there. They will prematurely wear if not set-up correctly. 
You don't seem to be having much luck with this Regner kit Skeeterweazel. 

Andrew


----------



## snowshoe (Jan 2, 2008)

I had the same issue with mine. I ended up putting washers underneath the motor plate where the screws secure it. This brought the gears closer together.


----------



## Garratt (Sep 15, 2012)

Are these the gears Skeeterweazel?
I can't see how you can do anything to improve the situation without going to considerable effort of reworking Regner's engineering. First a faulty boiler that was not tested now this... 










Andrew


----------



## Skeeterweazel (Feb 11, 2014)

snowshoe said:


> I had the same issue with mine. I ended up putting washers underneath the motor plate where the screws secure it. This brought the gears closer together.


 these are the other 2 gears. The gear on the motor meshes with the little gear in vid.


----------



## Skeeterweazel (Feb 11, 2014)

If backlash is bad, are the gears small, or distance between shafts is too great? I'd bet shaft distance.
Here are my dimension for comparison, if anyone is in a place to send theirs to me:
small gear: .511"
large gear 1.020"
distance between inside of shafts, not centerline distance: .592.
Thx.


----------



## Garratt (Sep 15, 2012)

I would imagine the shaft holes are bored out of specification with a worn jig.
There is a specific way to measure gears too Skeeterweazel. Don't ask me though.
When you add the shaft diameter of 4mm, the centers work out to be very close to .75". 
You may be best measuring in metric though as it was made in Europe.

Andrew


----------



## HMeinhold (Jan 2, 2008)

Skeeterweazel said:


> If backlash is bad, are the gears small, or distance between shafts is too great? I'd bet shaft distance.
> Here are my dimension for comparison, if anyone is in a place to send theirs to me:
> small gear: .511"
> large gear 1.020"
> ...


If you give me the number of teeth for both gears and the diameter of the shaft(s), I can give you the correct distance between shafts. The diameters you measured are from top to top of the teeth?
Regards


----------



## Garratt (Sep 15, 2012)

Henner

25 and 50 teeth, 4mm gear shaft. Not sure about the axle though.
http://www.regner-dampftechnik.de/service/pdf/Lumber Jack_ENGL Lieferung.pdf

Andrew


----------



## HMeinhold (Jan 2, 2008)

Garratt said:


> Henner
> 
> 25 and 50 teeth, 4mm gear shaft. Not sure about the axle though.
> http://www.regner-dampftechnik.de/service/pdf/Lumber%20Jack_ENGL%20Lieferung.pdf
> ...


Assuming the module (used in the metric world instead of pitch diameter) is 0.5, then the distance center to center for the axles should be (25+50)/2*module = 18.75mm (0.738") or if the shafts are 4mm then the distance between shafts should be 14.75mm = 0.581".
Oh, I forgot: It does not hurt to increase the axle distance by 1..2 thousands over the theoretical value to prevent binding.
Regards


----------



## Skeeterweazel (Feb 11, 2014)

I think worse case will be if Regner doesn't have a solution for the gear issue i'll buy some bearings and move the shaft holes so i get better gear mesh. What do you think?
http://www.amazon.com/Model-MF74-2RS-Precision-Bearing-4x7x2-5mm/dp/B00ESG3SLK


----------



## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

Skeeterweazel said:


> I think worse case will be if Regner doesn't have a solution for the gear issue i'll buy some bearings and move the shaft holes so i get better gear mesh. What do you think?
> http://www.amazon.com/Model-MF74-2RS-Precision-Bearing-4x7x2-5mm/dp/B00ESG3SLK


Note that you can get ball bearings in many, many different sizes from the r/c car parts shops. I use them on Accucraft coach trucks.

But Regner should be taking care of it. Patience !


----------



## Skeeterweazel (Feb 11, 2014)

Patience? Easy for you to say. I bet you have some trains you can run. I have bupkis! I'm trying though. What else can i do?

Can't believe in this age of email that it's taking so long to get word from Regner.

edit: sorry Pete. Wasn't lashing out at you directly. I'm just a little snippy.


----------



## snowshoe (Jan 2, 2008)

I hate to say it but Regner is awful at answering their emails. You probably will never here back. I have to say 99% of every dealer/company I had sent emails to I never got a response. You might have to call.


----------



## Kovacjr (Jan 2, 2008)

Well I have your original requested wheel with a order that arrived today but the other stuff was requested well after this order was shipped. Yes patience in a company that usually comes through with requests and issues but does not "speak" as many Americans are used to. 

As to emails to Regner many just email in English and as they don't really speak much English they most likely don't understand the email. I send everything in German.


----------



## Skeeterweazel (Feb 11, 2014)

Thx Jason. That's good news. I'm just frustrated and need to howl at the moon a little. Appreciate your efforts w/ this.


----------



## Skeeterweazel (Feb 11, 2014)

I think you're in the ballpark. If i put gears together, no space between, i get .574. 

Really thinking about opening holes up for bearings. In the process of figuring out how much to move intermediate shaft.
Is there a downside to running bearings vs. shafts directly on frame?
Thx.




HMeinhold said:


> Assuming the module (used in the metric world instead of pitch diameter) is 0.5, then the distance center to center for the axles should be (25+50)/2*module = 18.75mm (0.738") or if the shafts are 4mm then the distance between shafts should be 14.75mm = 0.581".
> Oh, I forgot: It does not hurt to increase the axle distance by 1..2 thousands over the theoretical value to prevent binding.
> Regards


----------



## Nick Jr (Jan 2, 2008)

Skeeter, I see no down side to using bearings, as long as your holes are correctly placed. Biggest plus is you have control over what you are doing instead of depending on someone else. Go for it. nick jr


----------



## Kovacjr (Jan 2, 2008)

Skeeterweazel said:


> I think you're in the ballpark. If i put gears together, no space between, i get .574.
> 
> Really thinking about opening holes up for bearings. In the process of figuring out how much to move intermediate shaft.
> Is there a downside to running bearings vs. shafts directly on frame?
> Thx.


 
I'm in the thought to wait and see as the gears that Regner supplied in the past didn't have this problem. They use a stock gear and modify and if the supplier changed or they got a bad gear batch then with the proper ones you are going to have trouble replacing in the future with any wear. You are welcome to also try and call them, their number is on the website and your manual for the Lumberjack.

As to changing to bearings, its not a bad idea BUT to use a drill bit it wont happen trying to move the hole. You will need to do it on a mill and use a endmill for the hole. I have even looked through my gear supply of spares and they are different as they are for I think the Willi intermediate shaft.


----------



## Skeeterweazel (Feb 11, 2014)

Decided to install bearings, mostly because axles are worn from riding on frames. But did move the idler axle so have .738 centerline spread. New gears fit bettter than originals, but moving axle will make them even better.
Think it will be good.
Marty.


----------



## Nick Jr (Jan 2, 2008)

Marty, very very nice. should run better than new.


----------



## snowshoe (Jan 2, 2008)

Nice Marty. I did the same to mine when I first built it. It will help a lot.


----------

