# Tanks for the memories



## Mik (Jan 2, 2008)

It's no great secret that I don't post over here much anymore. The program threading problems often make it too hard to find my own posts again, let alone locate what anyone else is CURRENTLY doing. No great loss I guess, since there doesn't seem to be any big push to get it fixed. For myself, it's been suggested I try to minimize unnecessary "stress" since I tend to get worked up over things that annoy me... so, the path of least resistance is to look in about once a week to see if the powers that be have corrected the problem.

Anyway, I'm going to give the board "another chance" and post this summary build log. I'm also going to cram a LOT of basic tricks and techniques into a single post, so it might end up looking long and windy. But, please remember, if left out something that puzzles you and I don't respond, it's because i couldn't find the thread again to even SEE the question.Thanks for understanding.

For a build challenge elsewhere, I decided to take a basic wooden flatcar/gon "kit" and build it into a historically based tank car.









The prototype car was built by the Harrisburg Car Co around 1870-ish. How do we know this? Adnah Neyhart didn't get interested in oil until 1864 - and Grandin & Neyhart was one of those smaller companies ruthlessly sucked up by the Standard Oil Trust in 1875 - the same year Mr Neyhart died... but in between Adnah Neyhart managed gain to control of nearly 1/4 of the oil shipments coming out of the Pennsylvania fields (as of 1871). This builder's photo is one of perhaps two dozen pre-Pennsy takeover Allegheny Valley RR photos that I've found

The plans for the kit showed a 6 sill arrangement. I deviated from the standard practice for a couple (to my mind) good reasons: 1. Models, especially mine, have to go around much sharper curves than the prototype cars ever faced so the trucks have to be able to swing over further, and 2. The full length U shaped center sill will transfer the loads of the targa trucks with no stress on any glue joints. Since MY AV is narrow gauge, and the prototype car standard gauge there will be quite a few "compromises" and "liberties" taken on this model









The top side of the U sill was milled into a semi V by hand with a milling cutter in a Dremel knock off, creating a cradle for the tank - with plenty of surface area for glue to bond to. Since the tank sits recessed, the floor was planked with the long side boards from the gondola kit. A couple other period Harrisbug Car builder's photos I have access to show that this walkway board orientation on tank cars is correct.









The underside crosspieces were then added - with smaller crossbits inserted to fill the space between these and the walkway planks where the two extra sills are missing. This was mostly to keep the wood from warping the first time it gets damp









The tank itself is constructed mostly from inexpensive plastic plumbing bits gotten at the local hardware store.









The dome part was made to fit the tube by milling reliefs with the same Dremel cutter used on the sills - final shaping is fast and easy if you wrap the barrel tube with 60 grit sandpaper. I use this method to seat domes on boilers, too. 









I then rough shaped the upper part of the dome by sanding it into a convex curve









Then I drilled the first couple dozen of hundreds of "rivet" holes and inserted HO track nails to simulate the rivets. I glued them in place by dabbing the shaft with Welder brand contact cement.









More sanding, more holes and some plastic tube.









Add a little paint, and we have a dome!









A quick and easy way to get a straight, squarely perpendicular layout line on any cylinder is to wrap it with a sheet of paper. The paper should be big enough to wrap around at least 1-1/2 times (and preferably stiffer than newsprint, I just used it here for contrast)... if the paper is lying flat on the tube surface, and the leading edges line up perfectly, you'll ALWAYS get a square line. 









A tried and true way to get equal rivet spacing is to use a sewing pounce wheel... I don't have one, so I marked them out freehand. and it shows.... however it isn't QUITE as obvious after paint and weathering. AFTER i was mostly done, a gent from England suggesting using a steel screw type hose clamp (or a spaced pair) around the tube as a drill guide as well. The larger brass colored "rivets" are hardware store escutcheon pins. about 1/4 the cost of the track nails









The ends are thin plywood discs from the craft store sanded convex. The red/white paint scheme is an approximation based on an educated guess by my rail historian buddy in Cali. early B&W films weren't particularly sensitive to many colors, the base could have been yellow or even light green. The darker color could also have been navy or brown .









In cases like this where there is no truck mounting stub, (or where it's been broken off on a factory car), a bit of 1/4" vinyl aquarium tubing stuck on a fat wood screw is a low tech, cheap as chips substitute for a shoulder screw. This little trick works with every brand of large scale truck I've tried.









I don't know why the prototype car was fitted with what appears to be swing action trucks, but I simulated them by milling off the coil spring detail on a pair of archbars from my scrapbox, and gluing on two bits of 1/8" square styrene. Once they're painted and they'll look fine, and few people will notice anyway.









I had a small dilemma. The prototype 1870 car had only manual brakes. My outdoor pike is set in 1962. When I do road trips we set it in 1925-6. The real car was likely scrapped before this, BUT I still want to run it anyway. While I COULD have chosen to just ignore everything, my compromise of sorts was to fit the car with early style air brakes.I found these 1898 Westinghouse patent drawings http://www.google.com/patents?id=bn...=gbs_selected_pages&cad=1#v=onepage&q&f=false , and based those for my car on them. 









I also decided that my car should have the later low slung, narrow gauge stance to match the rest of my rolling stock, rather than that high mounted, "ping pong" look of the earlier prototype. Those two middle sills I left out allow it to negotiate r-1 curves with a bit to spare.









One of the things I like to do is try out new/different ways of doing stuff. Either it will work, or be a spectacular "Hey, y'all watch this!" type failure. I read someplace last year about an interesting, and cheap wood staining technique. Since the car had all that nice white wood, it was the perfect opportunity to try it out. The first step is a basic natural stain - a teabag worth of tea leaves let steep overnight in about 1/2oz of rubbing alcohol. - This results in a nice tannin rich liquid that you just slop on and let soak in. Don't worry about any stray bits of teal leaf, they'll just brush off when it's dry.... If the color is too light, just recoat when dry until you get a hue you like. This is what the deck looked like after 2 coats, a warm maple or fruitwood color. 









This was coat #4... I let this one set about 5 minutes before I brushed away the leaf bits with a paper towel - because I wanted the wood surface to still be "wet" for the next step...









After wiping off the excess tea stuff away, I then wiped on a VERY diluted (about 20:1 with water?) black acrylic paint wash (with the same paper towel) and then buffed it away.... after it dried I had this really nice faux walnut/old wood (but not rotten) look. Best I can 'splain it is the wood being damp with alcohol keeps too much of the black from soaking in initially, but then the alcohol absorbs the water and pulls the paint into the grain...... 









I'd say that experiment was a moderate success. Another puzzle I'd been working on turned out to have a real simple solution. You'll notice that the brake staff on the prototype has a cool looking support bracket. I was digging through my detail part sorter for stirrups, when I realized I could just cut away part of an Ozark Miniatures boxcar brake staff mount and it's be "close enough for gubmint work" The lacy plastic D&RG style brakewheel really helps with the period look, too. 










Since I wanted to model the lettering just as much as the car. I splurged $7 on a set of 3/8" "no need to trim" waterslide alphabet decals from a company called Virnex.... Up side is, yes there isn't excess clear film to trim. Down side #1 there is a fairly steep learning curve. I think out of all the letters on both sides, I got 3 on without tearing. Down side #2 they don't have much surface area to hold them down, so the the water gets under and the previous letter tries to float away when you apply the next. My personal review is they're pretty good for a one-off car like this, but I'd really hate to letter a fleet with them. The tank straps are copper wire from a short bit of stranded entry cable that a friend was tossing out. Till I straightened it, then tried to rebend it, the stuff was getting pretty work hardened.









From the beginning of the build, I really, really wanted to do this, luckily we had a brief thaw:









Since the car would have been over 50 years old in 1925 I simply couldn't leave that brand new car shine stay, though..... it would have to look rode hard and put up wet - something like this one

















I didn't take pix of the intermediate steps, so those who are curious will have to settle for a talk through. 

On the tank:


Step#1 was to paint on a really nasty oil spill


Step#2 was to make that spill, and the paint look "old" via my usual 3 step overspray process. See: http://www.the-ashpit.com/mik/weathering.html


Step #3 Then I gave it a wash of black.


Step #4 Next was to paint yet MORE "spillage", much of it right over the "old" spill areas, but with differant runoff tracks.


Step #5 I drew in small "rivulets" with an extra fine Sharpie


Step #6 Was add some fresh "rust" areas, mostly along seams and rivets.





On the frame:


Step #1 was to use the same black wash I used on the tank on both sides near the center of the car where spillage would have been likey to have soaked into the planks.


Step #2 was subjecting it to the same overspray when I painted the tank.


Step#3 Adding "tarry" blobs and "moss", mostly along the joints, via paints. --Oh, and I found a set of plastic stirrups in a box, so they got added, too.





The trucks got "old grease" creep around the journals, and some lighter brown "dry rust" highlights to bring out the details. They got some tar blobs and moss as well.



















Just to show the actual size of the car, here it is with my Kalamazoo car that I relettered for Wolf's Head.... While you might THINK I screwed up on the scale, it's actually pretty indicative of real world tank car evolution between 1870 and the mid-1880s









There you have it! After all that research, work and documentation, did I win? Nope. I didn't even get a single vote.... But I DID get a nice new car for my pike for under $20!


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## Dave Meashey (Jan 2, 2008)

Well Mik;

The car would have gotten my vote for sure, but I am not on the _fora_ much myself these days. I also like the way you used General George Patton's theme song for the title of this thread.









Best, David Meashey


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## Totalwrecker (Feb 26, 2009)

Hey Mik, 
Thanks for posting, looks good. 
Dem other guys just had better junk drawers. 

Sorry the site issues weigh so heavily. 
My Topics works for me tho' it takes time to scroll... 

We all would like it fixed, but we don't know how to fix Shad's home life. 

Anyway thanks again. 

John


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## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

Sorry to loose you. The car for Shad was a great project. Thanks for starting it. I really enjoyed following its progress. We are all having problems with the site, but I am working throught them. Chuck


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## Dean Whipple (Jan 2, 2008)

Great looking model, thanks for sharing....and the how to......


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## docwatsonva (Jan 2, 2008)

I think you've done a mighty fine job Mik. Your project shows what can be done on a shoestring budget, which is what most people seem to have today. I tend to spend way too much time on a project constantly seeking some sort of perfection, but that's the way I am. It seems to take me forever to finish something but I like building much more than running trains.

Your techniques achieve results much faster and put wheels-on-rails quickly. I thought your car deserved more attention too. Hang in there. I know things have been a little messy and discouraging here but I keep looking on the bright side. This is supposed to be fun, isn't it? I also don't do much posting here anymore but I thought I'd give it one more try with my combine project. I'm a devoted narrow guage guy and fear that type of modeling is quickly loosing ground to more modern stuff. We'll see.


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## Mik (Jan 2, 2008)

Well, managed to find the thread again... midway down the SECOND page!  
To start with, thanks for all the kind comments! My priority on this car really wasn't actually so much to "win" but more to present the build process as a teaching primer for newbies. On that level, i think it succeeded, maybe. 

Meanwhile, this year's 'over there' challenge featured a LOT of great models. And what I found really interesting was the high quality of work coming from so many 1st time entrants -- but another thing I noticed was that so many of the prolific posters, and entrants from previous challenges, chose to sit this one out. Kind of like the long time folks here and the traveling boxcar -- What THAT says about the state of the hobby and forums, I'm not sure. Maybe it's just a 'changing of the guard" thing? 

Anyway, here are the missing pics.. 

"Swing action" trucks 









Low NG stance


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## Mike Reilley (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Mik on 17 Feb 2013 01:41 PM 
Well, managed to find the thread again... midway down the SECOND page!  ....




Allen...no need to search all the forums for your thread...or any one you post on. Just click "My Topics" up on the top left of any page...between to "Unanswered, Not Read" and "Active Topics". That takes you to page which has all the threads you posted on...from newest to oldest. 

And...keep posting your builds. The tip on the screw for trucks was new for me. Thanks.


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## Paulus (May 31, 2008)

Mik, I always liked your work and your inventivity. I find it most inspirational. So I'm glad you posted this project over here and hope you keep on posting!!


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## Naptowneng (Jun 14, 2010)

Mik 
Nice build and explaination as usual from you. And timely for me. I have been doing bashes of various gons and flats for work cars, but have not yet done a car body from scratch, and your project is a good example of one for me to try. I will also try to do better in posting my projects as well. 

Regards 

Jerry


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## Mik (Jan 2, 2008)

Thanks mikey, for the tip on how to find MY threads... now how do I separate out everybody elses from the mess? Say those within the last 5 days? 
If you want a website community to continue to grow and prosper, you shouldn't have folks needing to figure out work-arounds, NOR take months to fix a problem. If Shad's home life pressures prevent him from doing it, then what has there been to stop him from "deputizing' a trusted someone else to work on it? It's a software problem. It can be fixed from anywhere in the world. 

I've asked the guy who drew up the basic car if I can use his original pdf file plans as a teaching tool as well. We'll see what he says


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## bnsfconductor (Jan 3, 2008)

Posted By Mik on 17 Feb 2013 04:18 PM 
now how do I separate out everybody elses from the mess? Say those within the last 5 days? 


I always use "Forum Active Topics" when I check MLS. It should show every thread that has been posted on since your last visit. So if it's 5 days or 5 minutes it doesn't really matter. I've never used any other method to read the forums. It's kind of like the unread messages on that other site.

Craig


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## tmejia (Jan 2, 2008)

Mik,
I too like your build and explanation. I've pdf'd it for future reference.
And I like others have mentioned - always use "Forum Active Topics" when I check MLS.It just seems to work for me.


Tommy








Rio Gracie


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## Ray Dunakin (Jan 6, 2008)

Nice job, Mik! 

I never enter any of the "build challenges" or contests, because I'm usually too busy building something else, or the project's requirements don't suit my interests/needs, or both.


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## Mike Reilley (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Mik on 17 Feb 2013 04:18 PM 
Thanks mikey, for the tip on how to find MY threads... now how do I separate out everybody elses from the mess? Say those within the last 5 days? 


Well, I've not found a way to "separate out everyone elses's from the mess and get of list of just my threads...but on the left of that "My Topics" page is the thread owner's name under the thread title. Mik will be easy to find. And as for the date...the date of the last post is on the right. So...ya just got to intuit it...


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## SteveC (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Mik on 17 Feb 2013 04:18 PM 
Thanks mikey, for the tip on how to find MY threads... now how do I separate out everybody elses from the mess? {snip...}[/i] Why don't you...
[*] Click your *User ID* link, in the upper-right of any MLS page (located just to the left of the _Logout_ link).
[*] Then after your *User Profile* page displays.
[*] Click the *Posts* tab.
[*] After the page is refreshed and the *Posts* tab displays, you'll see the last 10 topics you posted to in the sort order; Most Recent (top) to Oldest (bottom).

[/list][*] Then at the bottom of the page just below the last listing you'll see a link labeled View all of Mik's Posts[/b].
[*] If you click the link and after the page is refreshed, you'll see a *Search* page displayed, with the 15 most recent topics that you've posted a reply to listed. In the sort order; Most Recent (top) to Oldest (bottom).

Note-1: The number of postings listed on the page is dependent on the setting you have configured in the *Items Per Page:* setting (i.e. 15 being the default) found on the *Forum Preferences* tab on the *My Settings* page. Don't forget to use the *Save* button if you make changes to your settings.

Note-2: Just so you're forewarned, attempting to go to page 2 or greater does not work.
[/list][/list][/list]


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## Mike Reilley (Jan 2, 2008)

Steve...If I understand you, what you described is exactly what "My Topics" returns in one click...all the threads you posted on....newest to oldest.


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## SteveC (Jan 2, 2008)

Mike, yes sir you are basically correct, however, there are many differences in the information that is displayed (e.g. displays the first couple of sentences of what you posted as content in the reply) and if you click on the topic Title/Subject link it takes you directly to that particular reply which you posted (i.e. not just to the top of the first page of that topic).


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## joe rusz (Jan 3, 2008)

Mik, great job. You should be proud. As for many other issues, I feel your pain, including the frustration you feel when after all of your hard work you post all the pictures of your stuff and get little or no response (hello, anybody out there?). Other than that, I'm annoyed that you stole the headline I was gonna use for an article I was scheming to do for GR. Now I gotta put my thinking cap back on--if I can remember where I put it.


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## Robert (Jan 2, 2008)

Please, no sarcasm is in anyway intended Mik, but why the washes of tea to stain the wood rather than stain. I really like the results you achieved and I am lining up some scraps to start experimenting, but would it have been easier to use wood stain? Does the tea afford better control or colour? 

Here’s hoping I can come anywhere near as nice an affect as you achieved.


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## Totalwrecker (Feb 26, 2009)

Robert, 
When used in that manner Tea is a stain. 
A Stain is merely pigment in a carrier, you can buy chemical stains that simulate real ones or... 

On my 'canvas' water hoses I used coffee. After turning it dark it contues to yellow. Chemicals may not know how to do that! Or the man mixing them. 

When I decided to use coffee, I had a head start, I knew the color, seems that's an easy stain to find on the belly of my white T-shirts! 
I imagine tea cups and coffee mugs led to knowledge of their content's staining abilities! 

See ya down the line, 

John


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## Mik (Jan 2, 2008)

Robert, to answer your question. 1. I read about it someplace and wanted to try it. 2. I had tea bags and rubbing alcohol here, and I was on a budget. 3. buying a cup of stain to use maybe 3 brushfuls, then having the rest sit around and dry out always seems kind of wasteful. 4. commercial stains stink too much to use in a closed up house. 

Besides, it worked beautifully. So much so that I intend to revisit it on other projects.


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## Robert (Jan 2, 2008)

Thanks for taking the time to respond Mik. Keep up the great and inspiring work.


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## Mik (Jan 2, 2008)

Part Duex: The dromedary 
I had some bits left over that I bought for the challenge, and decided not to use... specifically about $8 worth of abs fittings. And besides, everybody needs another tank car, right?.... especially if you live in or model oil country. 
I also like "different", and what's more different than a twin dome "boiler" gasoline tank car? 









What's a few hundred more holes to drill between friends anyway? Besides the car will make a great canvas to try to paint and letter the old Standard Oil Trust logo on. 









Pieces parts 2" Lasco pipe fittings, a couple 1" caps, and an Aristo frame 









The center section was easy 









The end caps got cut back, they'll also be given a few passes over the sander once the glue sets hard 









assembled tank. less 1" cap domes (ends still need sanded to a shallower convex) 









Aristo frame with approx 4" removed - leaving the car at 27' in 1/24 - It will play well with my Kalamazoo stock, a longer car would look ungainly on my r-2 curves, and I've never been much of for slavishly following the rigid "prototype" blargle anyway 









Now the real work begins. I've bid on a leatherworkers pounce wheel, 1/8" pitch... If I can get it at my price, great! If not, I'll do it freehand again.


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## dieseldude (Apr 21, 2009)

Mik- that's pretty cool!!!! 


-Kevin.


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