# Foam for streets?



## riderdan (Jan 2, 2014)

I'm still puzzling over getting my streetcar track embedded in the street of my "town" and have come up with a possible solution. My idea is to make the street from insulation foam, painted both sides with black exterior latex (of which I have a whole gallon from another project). I thought that if I undercut the edge of the foam it could sit over the outside of the ties, and then I'd fill the section between the rails with styrene, like so:








I don't need to be able to step on the street, since I have access to the "town" from stepping stones nearby. There's a concrete pad under most of the town that would support the foam, so there shouldn't be any danger of settling.

I know people have used foam vertically for building wall, but has anyone used foam horizontally like this? Any thoughts on durability etc? Drawbacks or advantages I haven't considered?


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## DennisB (Jan 2, 2008)

I use 2" and 1 1/2" exterior foam as a base for my buildings. Check my web site for more info. Warning, your base coat must be interior latex, and use several coats and give both coats time to dry well. Then you can use exterior paint on it. To add more strength to the foam before you paint it, add a liberal coat of craft glue. This gives it more strength. Regards, Dennis.


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## MikeMcL (Apr 25, 2013)

I will be putting a trolley line in my town when I return to Florida in October. Interesting idea you have. I use foam insulation sheets for tunnel portals and retaining walls and they've held up nicely for a couple years so far. I don't see why horizontal would be a problem, except for dents from squirrels or falling braches, etc. . Worth a try. 

Dennis said interior paint first, not exterior paint. As long as it's LATEX exterior, it worked for me. You want to make sure the foam is covered in latex with no pin holes before applying a solvent based clear coat for added UV protection.

I was thinking of cobblestones carved into PVC foam board for around the track. I've used this for sidewalks and you can carve lines in it with a screwdriver. Here is the material, http://amzn.com/B00XHY56QE Might be a solution in between the rails instead of the sytrene in your drawing. PVC foam is much stronger than Styrofoam.

This is a photo of a diner I made with the PVC foam board sidewalks.


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## vsmith (Jan 2, 2008)

Interesting idea, I'm indoors but I have to consider being able to step onto the paving to access storage areas above the layout so I was planning to use a mix, some layered MDF, some basswood planking, and some bathroom stone tiles set in masonry adhesive.


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## CliffyJ (Apr 29, 2009)

RD, you might also want to investigate, for the upper surface, black closed-cell 1/4" foam sheet (e.g., polyethylene), placed on the ties (between rails) and on 3/8" construction foam (outboard). Not perfect in thickness, but close. From what I've seen and used, it has a nice textured surface. I suppose the challenge would be (as always!) the selection of a lasting adhesive.


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## riderdan (Jan 2, 2014)

Cliffy,

How does it stand up in the sun? I've seen both 1/4 and 1/2 inch, closed-cell foam in a charcoal color, but I thought it needed to be painted to hold up under outdoor use (my understanding is that most forms of polyethylene foam are not UV stable). If it has to be painted, then the cheaper foam board insulation might still a better bet.

If it *doesn't* have to be painted, then it would definitely be a good solution, since it's already the right color, and it would be possible to step on it if needed.

D


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## CliffyJ (Apr 29, 2009)

Hmm, I don't know.... and I suppose it will vary with the formulation of rubber.


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## riderdan (Jan 2, 2014)

Thanks to Cliffy, I have a piece of foam down for a test










If this holds up, I will raise the town "base" on some insulation foam for rigidity and flatness and then cut through both layers to lay the trolley in the street. I do appreciate how this long piece has no seams--something that turned my off from some street-building methods. With the weather here, anything laying flat that's made from individual "parts" tends to warp and separate.

Many thanks to Cliff, who sent the foam along for just the cost of shipping. I'll post again in a month or so when I see how it's holding up under the late summer sun.


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## Dick Friedman (Aug 19, 2008)

I've used the very dense insulating foam board (not Styrofoam) as bases for buildings to keep the wood from damp dirt. After one dry winter and one very hot summer and fall, the bases seem remarkably straight and dry. I attached the buildings to the bases with Liquid Nails for Projects. Everything seems to be working out.


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## riderdan (Jan 2, 2014)

Dick Friedman said:


> I've used the very dense insulating foam board (not Styrofoam) as bases for buildings to keep the wood from damp dirt. After one dry winter and one very hot summer and fall, the bases seem remarkably straight and dry. I attached the buildings to the bases with Liquid Nails for Projects. Everything seems to be working out.


Thanks Dick. That's good info--Sacramento has about the same summer weather as here (I used to live in the Bay Area and have been to Sacto in the summer) so that's very informative. My main concern is heat, as I've had some styrene and even some acrylic warp from heat outdoors.


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## CliffyJ (Apr 29, 2009)

Best of luck Dan, I'm sure curious as to how it behaves.


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## Mike Flea (Apr 8, 2014)

I've been using the pink insulation board, and it's very durable out in the weather, as long as it's properly treated. I had a thread started last year, "Modeling in Foamboard", where I made a mountain on my outdoor layout. I covered it with a product I picked up from Menards called Flexcoat. It's a foamboard coating made specifically for use outside. It applies just like mortar, and looks like mortar, but when it dries it's flexible, so it expands and contracts, and out here in Chicagoland where the temp constantly changes, it's working out well. It appears to take paint and scenery well on a test piece I made, but I also apply a satin clear sealant over the top.


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## riderdan (Jan 2, 2014)

Here's an update on the foam Cliffy provided (Thanks again, BTW)

It's been out about a month now, and seems to be holding up well in the sun. Some buildings are sitting on it and there's no noticeable difference between the building-shaded spots and the foam that's fully exposed to the sun. The foam has two sides--for want of a better description, I'll call it an "open" side and a "closed" side--and I put it down with the less porous, closed side up. It looks pretty good on the closed side, very "asphalt-like" So on that front, the foam seems to be a winner.

Unfortunately, I didn't account for the Kansas wind.  After two years, you'd think I'd have learned...

To keep the wind from picking it up and scattering the buildings, I had to put down some serious weight on the corners--think large landscaping blocks in the 10-15# range. You can see them in the image I posted earlier in this thread. Even then, the wind catches at it and can sometimes make ripples in the foam, although I've stretched it pretty tight. Since the winds here are regularly in the 20s, and often gust into the 40s, I'm thinking that this method of holding it down might not work over the longer term. 

I'm tempted to try to glue the foam down with construction adhesive, but unless it is very firmly held right to the edges, I suspect that the wind will eventually have its way with it.

Anyone have any advice on an adhesive that would stick to both foam and concrete?


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## CliffyJ (Apr 29, 2009)

Thanks for the update RD. Glad to here it held up under UV, but wow, I sure didn't think of wind either. 

I've used a construction adhesive to hold chunks of 'crete together, but haven't tried foam. I'd have thought the adhesive would seep up into the foam cells, and get a good grab just because of increased surface area. 

Maybe it's worth a test with a small rubber strip that you've worked the (masonry?) construction adhesive into, and done the same with the concrete, and let them set a bit prior to joining. Kinda like contact cement application. Speaking of which, actual contact cement might work... But I haven't tried it, so can't claim it will.


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## Mike Flea (Apr 8, 2014)

Try Locktite PL300 Foamboard construction adhesive. I got mine from the local Home Depot, and it's waterproof.


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## riderdan (Jan 2, 2014)

I've made some additional progress on this...

My final plan was to build a "base" to glue the foam to and then put that out where the town will go as a combination street/trolley track base. I'm using foam insulation in two 1/2" layers as the base. This is kind of like the picture in the first post of this thread, but with an extra layer to make a solid base.

The first layer is a full 8x4 sheet of foam which I will cut down as needed. The second layer has been cut out to provide a place for the track (including ties) to set down into. On top of this, I put down the foam I got from Cliffy, and cut it to just the width of the outside of the rails. The piece that came out from between the rails I cut down to leave about 1/4" on each side for the trolley wheel flanges. 

The pics below give an idea of how it will look--it's been glued up and I'm waiting for the side that's weighted down to dry so I can finish it up. The gaps you can see are where the foam isn't laying flat--they should go away when everything is glued down.





Since the "middle" layer is as wide as the track (including ties) I expect any debris that gets into the gaps will fall down into the open space out of the way of the trolley wheels. I'll cut/drill a number of holes to let any accumulated water out. I'll just have to wait and see what happens with the little bit of snow and ice we get here...

The dirty spots are where some buildings were sitting on it while it was out for a test. It didn't seem to fade, it just got a bit dirty  I may (or may not, depending on the effort involved) put an additional piece of gray-painted foam down on each side of the street to represent sidewalks... we'll see.

I still haven't completely figured out how I'm going to handle the wind issue. I expect that with 30 pounds of buildings and track on it, it will be less of a problem. I will probably bend two pieces of pencil rod and drive them down into the corners on the windward side just so the wind can't get under and catch it.


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## Sjoc78 (Jan 25, 2014)

riderdan, that looks great!


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## CliffyJ (Apr 29, 2009)

That looks really cool RD!


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## riderdan (Jan 2, 2014)

Sjoc78 said:


> riderdan, that looks great!





CliffyJ said:


> That looks really cool RD!


Thanks guys. As I mentioned before, I was really hoping for something that didn't have seams and that would lay flat. The other option I thought about was how I made some of my other roads: a concrete base with black outdoor grout as the "asphalt"--but I couldn't figure out a practical way to get the trolley tracks embedded in that.

The real test will be having it outdoors this winter and seeing how it handles freezing cycles. And I guess I'm still not certain about the wind. But I'm hoping for the best.


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## CliffyJ (Apr 29, 2009)

For wind, as you decide where structures will be located, assuming you bring them in for the winter (?), perhaps screwing down the foam here and there might be a backup plan. For example, with batten strips under a structure, or fender washers, secured with Tapcon or other masonry screw.

For strips on the ties, what kind of adhesive were you using there? Or maybe you were bringing that in for the winter as well?


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## riderdan (Jan 2, 2014)

CliffyJ said:


> For wind, as you decide where structures will be located, assuming you bring them in for the winter (?), perhaps screwing down the foam here and there might be a backup plan. For example, with batten strips under a structure, or fender washers, secured with Tapcon or other masonry screw.


Last winter I left the structures out. My experience has been that the sun is harder on them than the limited amount of snow that we get. And I'm hoping to get some running time in during the winter--I have a homemade plow that I want to test out 

But using masonry fasteners to hold things down might still be a good idea. I know that they call Chicago the Windy City, but Kansas is so flat that we really have a lot of very windy days. On the inward edge, the foam may protrude past the concrete, so that's why I was thinking stakes.



CliffyJ said:


> For strips on the ties, what kind of adhesive were you using there? Or maybe you were bringing that in for the winter as well?


I am using Locktite PL landscape adhesive. It's supposedly waterproof and seems to have a good grip on the foam.


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## CliffyJ (Apr 29, 2009)

Understood, sounds like a good plan. It will be very interesting to see your model in the spring! 

BTW, another really good adhesive is Gorilla Glue, based on some testing I did (with great input from others here) between insulation foam and styrene. Again, I've no idea if it will work for your situation, but if the PL gives way, I'd keep GG as a backup product to try out (note that the surface needs to be wetted for best adhesion, I believe). 

FWIW, here's the results on my testing: http://forums.mylargescale.com/14-buildings/32793-foam-styrene-adhesive-pull-test-3.html#post561786


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## riderdan (Jan 2, 2014)

Thanks Cliffy. I will keep the Gorilla Glue in mind.

I've gotten everything glued down, just waiting for the adhesive to set. I have a couple more holes to cut so that I can run the wires between buildings for the lights. I also need to trim off some of the extra insulating foam, which currently sticks out past the edges of the black foam in places. Then I'll paint the edges and it will be ready to put out on the layout.

I've been running some tests with the tram--it's a Bachmann closed streetcar. I have an Azatrax point-to-point module to control the trolley (it's DC, not DCC) and am fiddling with the stop times at the ends of the track and the acceleration/deceleration rates to ensure it doesn't overrun the end of the track. I added some LGB pickup skates to it to improve connectivity... so far, so good. I'm a little ambivalent about the reed switches I have on the track to detect the tram (with magnets on the chassis). I may order a set of pulsed-IR detectors and see if they're more reliable than the reed switches.

I'll post some more pictures once it's outside.


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## MikeMcL (Apr 25, 2013)

I started on my trolley tracks today.iam using 6mm (1/4") pvc foam board as a spacer, then a veneer of brick road Christmas village accessory from department 56. This will run down the middle of my rolled roofing main street down town.


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## riderdan (Jan 2, 2014)

MikeMcL said:


> I started on my trolley tracks today.iam using 6mm (1/4") pvc foam board as a spacer, then a veneer of brick road Christmas village accessory from department 56. This will run down the middle of my rolled roofing main street down town.


Mike--will this be indoors? I really like the look of the brick, but don't think it would stand up outside.
Be sure to post more pictures as you make progress.

I have everything glued together, but am waiting for a day with less wind to take the giant sheet of foam out to the layout. It was gusting to 50 here the other day, and I had pictures in my head of me holding the foam and sailing off to Missouri like a giant kite


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## MikeMcL (Apr 25, 2013)

riderdan said:


> Mike--will this be indoors? I really like the look of the brick, but don't think it would stand up outside.
> Be sure to post more pictures as you make progress.
> 
> I have everything glued together, but am waiting for a day with less wind to take the giant sheet of foam out to the layout. It was gusting to 50 here the other day, and I had pictures in my head of me holding the foam and sailing off to Missouri like a giant kite


This is going outside. The brick veneer is sort of like a thin rubber mat. I've been told by another modeler that it will hold up outside, he had used it for some walkways. I may spray it with Krylon clear to protect from UV. The PVC foam board is OK outside, and all is glued together with Goop, which has worked well for me outside.

Yes, more pictures to follow, but I have about 10 more feet to do, and then I need to incorporate it down the center of the asphalt shingle (rolled roofing) road.


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## riderdan (Jan 2, 2014)

Mike,

I liked it how you did it so much I went looking for the bricks. According to posts on Amazon, apparently Dept 56 has changed from the rubber to a textured cloth--which I'm pretty sure won't hold up outside. Bummer.


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## Jerry Barnes (Jan 2, 2008)

You could try those u-shaped landscape spikes to hold it down. I think you can find the rolled brick in Menards at their Lemax figure display, another brand.


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## riderdan (Jan 2, 2014)

Jerry Barnes said:


> You could try those u-shaped landscape spikes to hold it down.


That's a good thought, Jerry. 

The wind here is wicked--two or three days a month it gusts to 30-40mph. I've finally got tired of the wind breaking off the spout from my water tower and had to chain it up. Anything that's not fastened down is likely to fly off... and I'm thinking a 4x8 sheet of insulation with six or eight buildings on it could wreak havoc on the rest of the layout, not to mention the loss of the buildings attached to it.

I may combine adhesive and stakes. Luckily the layout is next to the fence on one side and end, and next to the house on the other end, so really only the south side is vulnerable.


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## MikeMcL (Apr 25, 2013)

I had some of the brick that was black vinyl backing when I started. Found a couple other sources, but as you say, they changed the formula, and use some kind of cloth backing. Finally I received an 18 x 36 inch mat by Lemax that was the same black vinyl backing to finish the trolley line.

http://amzn.com/B000VWCFPU

The trolley has been running through town since last Thursday, and I think it came out pretty good.



















The trolley line is running, but I'm still finishing up the rolled roofing roads.


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## riderdan (Jan 2, 2014)

Mike, that looks great.

I hope mine looks half as good when it's done


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## MikeMcL (Apr 25, 2013)

Thanks! I'm sure yours will be fine too.

Now my next task, besides finishing up the asphalt streets, is to automate the trolley barn doors to close when the trolley hits that end, spring loaded to open when the polarity changes to go the other way (using Aristocraft timed reversing unit). I just bought some 1/8" brass rod that should do the trick.


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## Cougar Rock Rail (Jan 2, 2008)

Hi guys,

In case you haven't already seen these, Bertram Heyn makes some really interesting track accessories, including the infill sections. Maybe there is something that will help:

http://www.modell-werkstatt.de/gleissystem/gleiszubehoer/index.htm

It's in German of course...fire up the Google translator!

Keith


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## riderdan (Jan 2, 2014)

Thanks Keith. I have one of his wye switches and the stuff he sells seems to be of very good quality. I'll keep those in mind if my foam centers don't work out


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## riderdan (Jan 2, 2014)

*More progress*

I've got the foam down outside now and have some additional info about it. Of course, it's early days yet, so we'll have to see how it holds up...



The good:

The foam has no seams, which means it looks like a road.
The trolley track looks pretty good
The rigid foam insulation sheet underneath means it's flat and level
It hides the lighting wires where they run between buildings 
The town area is clearly defined

The bad/unknown:

It's one big sheet, so if it has a problem, the whole thing will have to come up
I'm still not sure about how it will do in the high wind
I don't know if the "tight" fit between the bottoms of the buildings and the houses will mean water gets trapped inside.

There's still a good bit to do on this. I need to put some additional wiring in for a couple cars I have added working headlights to. I also need to build up the dirt around it and add plants along the edges to hide the sharp transition between foam-covered and not-foam-covered areas. At the front, I need to make a transition to the road that comes across the track so I can put my crossing gates back in. In addition, there's some wiring to do to make the trolley track auto-reverser run--those are the yellow and red wires you can see on the front left.

But I'm pretty happy with how it looks so far


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## CliffyJ (Apr 29, 2009)

Sure looks good RD! But yeah, lotsa technical / material issues you're engaging, so please keep posting!

Sounds like you're securing your buildings onto the foam? If so, yes, the foam will create a seal. The degree to which you allow for drainage will probably relate to the integrity of the seams in your buildings...

Which probably won't be perfect. So, do you have ideas for draining the buildings?

CJ


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## riderdan (Jan 2, 2014)

CliffyJ said:


> Sure looks good RD! But yeah, lotsa technical / material issues you're engaging, so please keep posting!
> 
> Sounds like you're securing your buildings onto the foam? If so, yes, the foam will create a seal. The degree to which you allow for drainage will probably relate to the integrity of the seams in your buildings...
> 
> ...


Thanks Cliffy,

I'm not planning on gluing the buildings down. They seem to do OK just sitting on the level surface. I like being able to take them off individually and fix them if needed. 

The tops and corners are well sealed. When they were down on concrete, there were good-sized gaps around the perimeters of the buildings, since the concrete was uneven. While this meant some water its way worked under the buildings in heavy rains, it also dried out quickly. However, since it's glued to the insulation panels, the foam is very flat--which means no/little gap at the bottom edges. Since it is foam, I'm wondering if water that gets under may take longer to dry out... without those "air gaps."

Once good thing is that there's a hole through the foam under each building where the wire for the lights comes up. So I'm hoping that will alleviate any drainage problems. Also, none of them are tightly sealed (the bottoms are open), so just the normal effect of them "breathing" during the day when they're warmed by sunlight should help.


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## CliffyJ (Apr 29, 2009)

Oh, OK, the buildings are sitting there, not screwed or weighted down onto the foam and forcing a seal. Got it.

Either way, I guess when the weather comes, and the water and ice do what they do, you'll be breaking ground on this new method! It may be that you find that small holes, notches, shims, or other adjustments take care of things.

This is probably a dumb idea, but you could wait for a sub-freezing night, go out and dump a bucket of ice cubes and cold water on a building, and check the results in the morning.


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## MikeMcL (Apr 25, 2013)

It looks pretty good Dan! As far as the building bases, I have a suggestion for a base/sidewalk for your downtown. I used 6mm (~0.250") expanded PVC foam board. This is a rigid material, and the sidewalk seams and curbs (lines) can be easily carved using a flat blade screwdriver following a straight edge ruler. The photo below may not show the sidewalk and curb lines too well, but they look better in person.










The PVC foam can be found on Amazon in various sizes and thickness, http://amzn.com/B00K2QKPNY

In my case, I used free coroplast (election sign corrugated plastic) as a sub-base, and cut the PVC material in sidewalk sized strips to surround the building and glued them to the sub-base. On the inside of the building, I glued scrap strips of coroplast extending a little less than 1/4" below the walls. So the walls sit on the PVC sidewalks, and the 1/4" strips locate and lock in the building to the surrounding PVC sidewalk, but the building can still be removed. A little more effort, but uses less of the costly PVC foam board than one big piece under the building.


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## riderdan (Jan 2, 2014)

MikeMcL said:


> It looks pretty good Dan! As far as the building bases, I have a suggestion for a base/sidewalk for your downtown. I used 6mm (~0.250") expanded PVC foam board. This is a rigid material, and the sidewalk seams and curbs (lines) can be easily carved using a flat blade screwdriver following a straight edge ruler. The photo below may not show the sidewalk and curb lines too well, but they look better in person.
> 
> The PVC foam can be found on Amazon in various sizes and thickness, http://amzn.com/B00K2QKPNY
> 
> In my case, I used free coroplast (election sign corrugated plastic) as a sub-base, and cut the PVC material in sidewalk sized strips to surround the building and glued them to the sub-base. On the inside of the building, I glued scrap strips of coroplast extending a little less than 1/4" below the walls. So the walls sit on the PVC sidewalks, and the 1/4" strips locate and lock in the building to the surrounding PVC sidewalk, but the building can still be removed. A little more effort, but uses less of the costly PVC foam board than one big piece under the building.


Thanks Mike.

I have some 6mm Sintra that I used as bases for a couple of buildings, but it warped pretty badly between the sun and snow. Somewhere I have a picture of one corner of a station platform that's bent up from the plane of the material about 1/2" 

I've mostly switched to acrylic, since I haven't had any issues with that getting warped. But it's a little pricey for making sidewalks.


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## MikeMcL (Apr 25, 2013)

riderdan said:


> Thanks Mike.
> 
> I have some 6mm Sintra that I used as bases for a couple of buildings, but it warped pretty badly between the sun and snow. Somewhere I have a picture of one corner of a station platform that's bent up from the plane of the material about 1/2"
> 
> I've mostly switched to acrylic, since I haven't had any issues with that getting warped. But it's a little pricey for making sidewalks.


Good to know. I hope that in my case, since the pieces of PVC are not large (inch or so by a foot or so), and the fact that I'm under a canopy of live oak so sun is limited, that they'll be OK. If we get snow here, that would be something, LOL!


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## riderdan (Jan 2, 2014)

An unfortunate update 

Well, my original idea of foam for the roads in town didn’t work out too well…



The arrows (click for a larger version) show the problem.

I suspect that the problem arose from the expansion differential between the black closed-cell foam that forms the street and the styrofoam insulation that backs it. Apparently the black foam expands and contracts too much in the sunlight for it to stay glued to the insulating foam backing. So where it has come unglued from the backing, I’m getting “bubbles” during the daytime, as the expansion of the foam forces it up in places where it’s not glued down. 

These have appeared in the last couple of weeks and two have gotten significantly bigger in that time. Probably since the weather here has been in the mid 80s a couple of times this week, once the glue lets go, the expansion "bubble" pulls up the edges a bit each time it forms. When the hottest part of summer arrives, it will likely be get worse. The aesthetics wouldn't be so much of an issue, but in a section I didn't photograph, the bubble is lifting a building at a crazy angle.

I really liked the look of this, and the ability to “embed” the streetcar line in the street. But if it won’t stay glued down, it’s not much use.

I’ll probably go back to my original idea, which was to cover the concrete in the town with Henry’s asphalt roofing tar or similar, to get the seamless look I was hoping for. I’m not sure how I’ll handle the streetcar line…

Back to the drawing board!


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## Jerry Barnes (Jan 2, 2008)

How about that roof stuff they put along the valleys. Black with a peel off backing to stick it down.


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## riderdan (Jan 2, 2014)

Jerry Barnes said:


> How about that roof stuff they put along the valleys. Black with a peel off backing to stick it down.


That might work, Jerry. I was also thinking about outdoor grout. I have some concrete-base roads where I covered the surface with black outdoor grout, and those are holding up well.

But I can't figure out a way to embed the streetcar tracks in either of those cases...


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## placitassteam (Jan 2, 2008)

I would advise against using asphalt roofing tar. It gets soft and sticky in hot weather. I used it to glue roofing on my Dolores station and part of the roof just slid off when it got hot.


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## CliffyJ (Apr 29, 2009)

Bummer, Dan! 


I guess I'm wondering if there was a chemical failure in the glue bond, vs. a mechanical one due to tearing.

Is there a simple way to test for relative expansion, e.g., two strips of each material, secured at one end, free at the other, and weighted down a little? The end creepage difference (or lack thereof) might be instructive.

Cliff


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## riderdan (Jan 2, 2014)

CliffyJ said:


> Bummer, Dan!
> 
> 
> I guess I'm wondering if there was a chemical failure in the glue bond, vs. a mechanical one due to tearing.
> ...


Good point Cliff. I have a moderately long section of each, so I should test it out. I really still like how it looks--it's stood up to the sun pretty well. 

It's possible I could peel off the foam and re-glue it with something else. I used a pretty thick coat of outdoor construction adhesive, spread on evenly with a floor adhesive trowel, but from a corner I attempted to peel up (when I first noted the failure) I think I could get it off.



placitassteam said:


> I would advise against using asphalt roofing tar. It gets soft and sticky in hot weather. I used it to glue roofing on my Dolores station and part of the roof just slid off when it got hot.


Another good point. I need to find something thin and spreadable if I decide to go that way. I was thinking since it's on a flat surface it wouldn't matter too much--but I wasn't thinking about how gooey it can get on hot days.


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## Chris Scott (Jan 2, 2008)

This is flange wheel rail profile for paved right of way. Tramway track is used on tramways or light rail operations. Grooved rails (or girder rails) are used to provide a protective flangeway in the track work in city streets or road/track crossings.









The technique I've seen used for modeling this is to combine two rails one on its side with the foot against the foot of the other rail. The head of the rail on its side is covered by the road material. This gives a form for the pavement material between the rails. It's a bit labor intensive as it requires hand laying the two rails. I do not remember how the rail on it's side deals with rail spikes but it seems to me the rail could be notch filed to clear the rail spike. I don't see why you could not notch the rial for plastic tie track, maybe cut some of the molded spike heads off where there are two on the same tie. 

I've seen this technique in model railroad magazine repeatedly as the topic comes up regularly. You might search mags like Model Railroader. Or ask the question or search their forums.


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