# Anybody into machining?



## ohioriverrailway (Jan 2, 2008)

I'm looking for someone who can make small NS rollers (actually, maybe pulleys is a better term) that can be used as trolley wheels for current collection. Any takers? Will pay cash!! Only need about 6 or 8.


----------



## cephius (Jan 10, 2008)

Rick, Check out eMachineShop.com 

http://www.emachineshop.com


----------



## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By cephius on 06/17/2008 10:14 AM
Rick, Check out eMachineShop.com 
http://www.emachineshop.com




I had tried their software some time ago and could not get it to work on "MY" PC. Since I was not really all that interested in it, I just gave up. Your posting reminded me of it and I tried it again. First it wanted to download an update and I let it. Then it wanted to run a diagnostic because of some sort of incompatibility it found with my Video driver. I started the test and it passed the 1st step (of 3) but failed misserably at the second one. Killed the program completely! Even generated a message to send to Microsoft to tell them about it! 

When that all completed, the program came back and logged into their website to a troubleshooting section which had a few irrelavent comments, but for the problem I had it recommended getting the latest drivers for my display (which is a common recommendation, but I know I already have the latest) and it also recommended turning off Hardware Acceleration if new drivers didn't help. Well, I don't want to do that so I told it to run the program anyway. 

It came up and said there was a hardware problem and I should either turn off Hardware Acceleration or reload the program in a mode that does not use Hardware Acceleration. 

I tried that, assumming that the program would be slow and maybe frustrating to use because of that... maybe in trying to view a 3D object and rotate it around it might be slow or jerky. 

I am now quite intrigued by just how fast it might be if there was no hardware imcompatibility on my PC. WOW, nice program! I called up a couple of the examples and loaded some of the predefined parts (a gear). Operation is quick and smooth. 

I have not played with it beyond that, at this point, but it seems to be a good program ahd should not be too difficult to learn. I think, for my purposes, that I like Google's "SketchUp" a bit better as far as a method to make a quick and dirty design of an object, but for machining parts this is probably a better interface... and obviously, to order parts from this company you probably have to supply the design using their program. 

I don't know what the prices are like for onesy/twosy parts like us home hobbiests would want, but it appears to be a method to get some specific part that would be difficult to impossible for the average guy to do by themselves.


----------



## cephius (Jan 10, 2008)

I used it to draw the very large drivers for a 1:20.3 Sandard gauge model of the Empire Express 4-4-0 #999. I selected different materials to get the best price. The price per unit goes down as you order more units. I figured if I went forward with this project I would build three models. That's 12 driver wheels. Best price, $70.00 per wheel. Scratch building aint cheep ! !


----------



## tony23 (Jan 2, 2008)

I don't understand what you need put a link to a picture to help me and also some sizes


----------



## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By tony23 on 06/17/2008 1:42 PM 
I don't understand what you need put a link to a picture to help me and also some sizes " border=0>" border=0>" border=0>

Start here: 
http://www.mylargescale.com/Community/Forums/tabid/56/forumid/4/postid/24569/view/topic/Default.aspx- 
well that went nutz... trying again. 

Can't get rid of the dash... trying again!


----------



## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Semper Vaporo on 06/17/2008 2:24 PM
Posted By tony23 on 06/17/2008 1:42 PM 
I don't understand what you need put a link to a picture to help me and also some sizes " border=0>" border=0>

Start here: 

http://www.mylargescale.com/Community/Forums/tabid/56/forumid/4/postid/24569/view/topic/Default.aspx


----------



## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

(fumble fingers!!!!)


----------



## ohioriverrailway (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Semper Vaporo on 06/17/2008 2:25 PM
Posted By Semper Vaporo on 06/17/2008 2:24 PM 
Posted By tony23 on 06/17/2008 1:42 PM 
I don't understand what you need put a link to a picture to help me and also some sizes " border=0>" border=0>" border=0>

Start here: 
http://www.mylargescale.com/Community/Forums/tabid/56/forumid/4/postid/24569/view/topic/Default.aspx





Are you trying to tell us something???


----------



## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By ohioriverrailway on 06/19/2008 1:21 PM
Posted By Semper Vaporo on 06/17/2008 2:25 PM 
Posted By Semper Vaporo on 06/17/2008 2:24 PM 
Posted By tony23 on 06/17/2008 1:42 PM 
I don't understand what you need put a link to a picture to help me and also some sizes " border=0>" border=0>" border=0>" border=0>

Start here: 
http://www.mylargescale.com/Community/Forums/tabid/56/forumid/4/postid/24569/view/topic/Default.aspx

Are you trying to tell us something???




Actually, two things.. 

One, there is help already available on the site that tells you how to post images and such. 

Two, I had a pickle of a time posting the link to the place that tells us how to post images and such! /DesktopModules/NTForums/themes/mls/emoticons/blush.gif


----------



## ohioriverrailway (Jan 2, 2008)

Can be difficult posting links. Wouldn't have been much of a picture to post, just think of a pulley that's 1/4 dia, 5/64 wide. Really too small for my digital to handle. Think I found a fellow in Massachusetts who has a lathe and experience. 

How'd you make out in the floods? Looked a bit at the Mason City papers as I'm interested in how Iowa Traction fared. Was no specific mention, so I guess they're OK, altho IC&E is/was out of service on either side of the town.


----------



## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By ohioriverrailway on 06/20/2008 7:21 AM
Can be difficult posting links. Wouldn't have been much of a picture to post, just think of a pulley that's 1/4 dia, 5/64 wide. Really too small for my digital to handle. Think I found a fellow in Massachusetts who has a lathe and experience. 
How'd you make out in the floods? Looked a bit at the Mason City papers as I'm interested in how Iowa Traction fared. Was no specific mention, so I guess they're OK, altho IC&E is/was out of service on either side of the town.




I have a mill and a lathe and considered volunteering to make a part for someone someday, but of all the items I have made with them I have NEVER been able to make two alike! When you specified that you wanted 6 or 8 I assumed you wanted them to be alike and I knew that meant, "not me". I can chuck up a hunk of metal and turn it to some diameter. Then chuck up another hunk and without changing anything on the lathe at all, turn the piece to a different diameter... such that it is easily detectable to the eye that the two pieces are not the same. Chuck up another piece and get yet another diameter. Frustrating to say the least. I hope you have found someone that can do you some good. If you need only one and don't give a hoot about accuracy, I'm yer man! 

As for the floods here in Cedar Rapids... at most I, personally, have been severely inconvenienced. 

Had to forego flushing the toilet using city water for a couple of days, no bathing or washing clothes or dishs for less that a week, then was limited to water usage only on odd numbered days (my address is an odd number) and no watering the lawn or washing the car. 

Had a couple of short (2 hours or less) power outages and lost internet access several times for a few hours total. 

Cedar Rapids is split into East and West parts by the Red Cedar River and both sides have basically the same stores, so even the loss of all the downtown bridges was not all that difficult. Cedar Rapids' streets are so convoluted that you cannot hardly go anywhere without going someplace else first, so it is just ever so slightly easier for me to use the west side stores than the east side where I live, but with the bridges out of service I had to use the stores on my side of the river. 


I already had 10-gallons water in jugs in the basement for emergency use in case of storm, etc. I rotate the contents when I do laundry (pour the jugs into the washing machine and refill them from the tap) so the water is relatively fresh. But I quickly discovered that 10-gal. is just not hardly enough to use for toilet flushing for very long. SO... since I have to have two dehumidifiers in my basement running 24/7/365 (floods or not) just to keep my tools from rusting and the walls from turning black with mildew, I redirected their output to gallon jugs and got about 2 to 3 gallons of water per day. That amounts to about 1 flush! I am considering making this setup a bit more convenient and less labor intensive (golly, I have to go down there twice a day to change jugs! Oh the pain!) and continue the process just to save on the water bill! (Besides, I hear that dehumidifier water is good for my steam locomotives!) 


The VAST majority of Cedar Rapids (and Marion, Hiawatha, and environs) was affected the same as me... minor inconvenience. BUT... nearly 2000 homes had water up to the second floor and will have to be bulldozed and rebuilt (it is somewhat doubtful at this time that many owners will be able to afford to rebuild). The residents have lost EVERYTHING in the way of material possessions... furnature, appliances, clothing, books, photos, mementos, toys, keepsakes, TVs, radios, computers... EVERYTHING but the clothes on their backs. Most have put on a brave face and are glad to have survived with their lives and their families, but are overwhelmed by the task at hand. 

There has been some confusion and difficulty with people being allowed back to their homes and businesses as and after the water has gone down. Some were allowed back in without ID checking and others were held at bay at gun point! Looting is almost nil, with only one person having been arrested for it. There are reports of some unscrupulous "contractors" trying to bilk people, but officials and the media are really working hard at getting out the word to ask for license and permits from anyone purporting to be a repair contractor and to not give them any money "up-front". There is a "grass roots" push to give work only to local contractors, and the city and county officials have endorsed it, but I fear "restraint of trade" lawsuits because of that. 

FEMA, the National Guard and other disaster organizations are here in force and are helping but anything of this scale is bound to be fraught with difficulties, regardless of the exercises and practice the groups have performed or the politics of the leaders or past performance in previous disasters. 

It will be interesting to see what is done about the loss of the downtown business area and the homes on the west side and southeast areas. Large, old and historic neighborhoods were utterly destroyed and I cannot figure out what can, or should, be done about that. We may end up with a 400 city block "500-year-flood park". 


As far as Garden Railroads, I know of none that were affected to any great extent. The one I know about are not in the flooded areas. The big RRs (the real ones) took some pretty big hits. CRANDIC's two bridges collapsed, one is of no consequence as it went nowhere and it was wanted to get rid of it anyway. The other will need replaced so Penford and other businesses can get rail service. I think the U.P. bridge on the north side and the Iowa Northern a way upstreak are okay. The mainline U.P. bridge is also okay but the track that parallels the river on the east side is under major repair. I went to watch trains last night and watched a half dozen MOW cars change crews at Beverly Yards and head east again. Then two trains of HUGE boulders followed after them. The cars had rocks from 6 or 8 inches in diameter to several FEET in diameter, I am sure they are "fill" material for the east side tracks between CR and Bertram. I know they are running mainline trains in the area but the speed limit is like 10MPH from just west of the river to Bertram a few miles east. I don't think that Beverly Yards were damaged too bad by Prairie Creek, but I noticed that the road that crosses at the east end had some of the dirt at the edges washed out right at the tracks, so water must have been over the tracks there and probably over all of Beverly Yards since it is somewhat bowl shaped and the east end is higher than the middle (the west end is a bit higher).


----------



## Chucks_Trains (Jan 2, 2008)

Semper Vaporo, Did the Milwaukee Road ribbed caboose survive or is it gone?? 

Machining drivers without the aid of a CNC would be a tough one..well for me that is../DesktopModules/NTForums/themes/mls/emoticons/sad.gif 
The rail contact area is tapered and so is the flange. I've often thought about truing up some of my locomotives drivers by chucking them in my mini-lathe & then grinding them round but dealing with the double taper might make that near impossible. 

North West Short Line might make those Lionel replacements. 
BBT might also make them..


----------



## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

That poor little caboose is in pretty sad shape... but that has nothing to do with the flood! It is still in use as a rear platform for what is called the "Worley Warehouse Job". Usually 2 refrigerator cars taken to the Worley Warehouse and 2 brought back in a shove move that needs a platform for the conductor to stand on for the 3 mile shove. I took a photo of it just a couple of hours ago nestled on a storage track... see below. That is the way it has alwas looked since I have known about it. I just heard on the scanner that the Worley Warehouse Job is on its way back, so I assume it is in use right now.


----------



## arfy (Jan 2, 2008)

Rick 

I have some small pulleys Size- 9.6 mm high/ 4.7 mm wide If the size is okay, E-Mail me your address and I will send 

them to you 

Bob Arfmann


----------



## ohioriverrailway (Jan 2, 2008)

Bob, 
Those would be just a tad too large. But thanks for the offer.


----------



## Les (Feb 11, 2008)

The angle formed between the flange and the tread can be done a couple of different ways: grind a toolbit to the included angle and do them both at once, (more uniformity but greater chance of chatter) or set a standard-ground bit to first one angle, then re-set to turn or true-up the second angle. DON'T leave a sharp point on the tool bit, you want a very tiny radius. Be very careful about chuck speed, you absolutely don't want chatter! /DesktopModules/NTForums/themes/mls/emoticons/crazy.gif 

A little late to the thread, but I hope this helps. Oh, if you're not overly skilled, take the time to make a check gauge out of something like brass or mild steel. 

Les (Old retired tool 'n die maker).


----------



## Les (Feb 11, 2008)

Posted By Semper Vaporo on 06/20/2008 12:17 PM
Posted By ohioriverrailway on 06/20/2008 7:21 AM 
I have a mill and a lathe and considered volunteering to make a part for someone someday, but of all the items I have made with them I have NEVER been able to make two alike! When you specified that you wanted 6 or 8 I assumed you wanted them to be alike and I knew that meant, "not me". I can chuck up a hunk of metal and turn it to some diameter. Then chuck up another hunk and without changing anything on the lathe at all, turn the piece to a different diameter... such that it is easily detectable to the eye that the two pieces are not the same. Chuck up another piece and get yet another diameter. Frustrating to say the least. 




Are your machines set up properly? Are they old and worn or relatively new and tight? If these two things are 'go', then, it's ah ... likely operator error. You s/b able to get as good a repeatibility as your machines' tolerances. 

The pulleys would be simple: turn a suitable piece of stock long enough to provide as many pieces as you need, down to within .001 or .002" oversize of the finish size. Mike it along its length to make sure it's okay. If your lathe is set up properly, it will be. Now, decide how wide each pulley needs to be. Lay off, with a parting tool bit, where you will 'part' each off from the stock. Leave a few thousandths slack between. Then decide where the centers of your pulley will go (like obviously, halfway between your parting marks. Or, lay out the pulley throats first, starting at one end and then make your parting marks.) Either way works. Grind a bit to the required included angle. Put a tiny radius on that bit. Now feed it into the stock and form each pulley to the correct depth. Now you have a bar that looks like it has lots of V grooves on it, with very shallow square grooves between that are much thinner. (This is the cutoff/parting tool marks, or this is where you put 'em in. You left room, right?) 

You're almost home free. Now take a piece of fine crocus cloth and clean up that extra .001 you left, it'll be all shiny, after. Clean up the end one closest to the tailstock. PRECISELY position your parting bit/cutoff bit to the inside of what will be the end pulley when it falls off. Give it perhaps a thousandth or so. Part it off. Mike it. Is it correct? Oh, a tad over, say a thousandth or so? Lay it flat on the crocus cloth and polish it down if you need to. Doubt the tolerance matters that much. It'll remove the tooling marks, which is what you want. Do the next, and so on. That's one way of getting uniform parts: you cut 'em all off the machined stock on one setup. 

If the gentleman wants small hubs, he should have specified that, so you could put them in before parting. It's pretty simple to leave extra if you're not 100% sure and resign yourself to a bit of filing/polishing. Alternatively, you could make oversized pulleys (width) and then chuck each one and turn a hub, but you tend to lose accuracy just to save some extra metal. If hubs are wanted, more stock will be wasted because the pulley blanks will be spaced further apart to leave room for the lathe tool. (NOT the parting tool). 

There are several ways of doing that job. Just remember, every time you have to tear down and set up your workpiece, you tend to lose accuracy. 

The last thing I can think of is, inexperienced folks tend to use a dial caliper for everything. That's fine for most work, but when you want to get down close, go with a micrometer. 

I just bought a new 7 x 10 lathe after mulling it over for a few years. My Atlas was worn pretty badly. I intend to invest in long-reach dial indicators, and mount them on the machine so I can read precisely how far the carriage gets moved in either plane. Those dials on mine strike me as pretty cheesy. 

Late to the thread, but I hope this helps. 

Les


----------

