# Next Accucraft Standard Gauge Loco??



## RP3 (Jan 5, 2008)

Another thread has covered the recent Aster Challenger proposal, but I've been surprised at the lack of any information on Accucraft's standard gauge plans. I had thought that Jerry Hyde was supposed to debut a new possibly Eastern prototype (PRR M1 or T1??) at Diamondhead, but he was apparently a no-show -- either at DH or CF. 

If anybody can share, I'd like to know what's on tap. As everybody has a favorite, I have mine and still hope against hope that either Aster or Accucraft will bring out the Southern Ps4. So let the dreaming continue.

Ross Schlabach


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## Charles (Jan 2, 2008)

Ross 
That dream of yours is shared by many, well atleast in our home. 
If the did the PRR T1 that would be difficult in terms of practicality given the frame and wheel base requiring very large radius. 
I would go for a M1a 
cb


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## Anthony Duarte (Dec 27, 2007)

Well, in the newsletter that's been sitting around since last spring, Accucraft mentioned that they were considering a UP Challenger (seems doubtful now that Aster's taken their potential customers), a Santa Fe 5000 Class, and an SP M-6 Mogul. I personally have no interest in those locos... but if i had to pick a standard gauge engine (being a NG nut), I'd probably want either a Southern PS4 or a UP 4-8-4. 

Just my ¢2, 
- Anthony


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## scottemcdonald (Jan 11, 2008)

I'm going to need a 1:20.3 Standard Gauge (yes F scale) Southern Pacific Mikado X3203 so I can have the Standard Gauge and Narrow Gauge interchange that was at Owenyo, CA to go along with my SPng 4-6-0 Slim Princess. 










Heck, I'd even go for the Little Giant diesel NG engine if I can't get the Mike in Standard Gauge 1:20.3


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## JoelB (Jan 3, 2008)

How about a New York Central Niagara, if you're thinking about 4-8-4's...


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## John Allman (Jan 2, 2008)

Well, in the newsletter that's been sitting around since last spring, Accucraft mentioned that they were considering a UP Challenger (seems doubtful now that Aster's taken their potential customers), 

Well, what do I know? Not much I suppose. But Aster is considering a Challenger, not yet confirming that one will be built. IF enough people are willing to commit to purchasing one, THEN Aster will probably (but not definitely) produce it. 

So let's not put the cart before the horse. 

As to Accucraft, I too have wondered. An easy explaination could be that Jerry was not feeling well, and did not attend for that reason. Perhaps someone who knows him will let us know what is up. 

John


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## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

New York Central Niagara, if you're thinking about 4-8-4's... 
I would have thought UP 8444 was a better candidate (commercially speaking) as they already considered the UP Challenger. At least you can still see it. 

I'd even go for the Little Giant diesel NG engine 
Scot, 
RYM just did it in On3, and I keep pointing out to Rich that, as he already has the plans, there are a few SP Fn3 fans who would like to see one. Lots of pics on his page (and there's a pic of 'Little Giant' on the CCC RR in Mexico where it ended up in some mag I read recently - NG&SLG?) 
http://www.richyodermodels.com/rym_owens_bd.htm


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## jfrank (Jan 2, 2008)

Being a Southern Pacific fan and modeler, I hope Accucraft sticks to it's SP agenda. Three cylinder 4-10-2's, Pacific P8's and P9's, Consolidation C9's, etc. If they want to stray from the SP then look at Santa Fe and UP. Best option for a small but powerful engine would be the C9.


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## Chris Scott (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Anthony Duarte on 29 Jan 2010 06:55 AM 
Well, in the newsletter that's been sitting around since last spring, _*Accucraft mentioned that they were considering a UP Challenger (seems doubtful now that Aster's taken their potential customers)*_, a Santa Fe 5000 Class, and an SP M-6 Mogul. I personally have no interest in those locos... but if i had to pick a standard gauge engine (being a NG nut), I'd probably want either a Southern PS4 or a UP 4-8-4. 

Just my ¢2, 
- Anthony 

Anthony:
Really ? Maybe there are some questions that (above highlighted) raises: 

Could it be that Aster might just as easily stimulate demand for an Accucraft Challenger and Accucraft capitalizes on unsatisfied demand (unable/unwilling to buy an Aster*; Thou$ands less (i.e., $12-14k vs. ~$6-8K); A very popular and nostalgic locomotive (US and Japan); Gas fired (not alcohol or coal); They just do not want an Aster, etc.? Accucraft could also do an alcohol version as well gas, yet another ripple. And demand is often stimulated by seeing/experiencing the Challenger; call it the seeing is believing drool factor. 

Isn't a Challenger less complicated than a Cab Forward or a NGG-16 Garratt where both engines are articulated, one forward one behind the cab? On a Challenger both engines are forward of the cab; on a Challenger isn't only the front engine articulated the rear engine fixed? If a Challenger is less complicated wouldn't this potentially lower an Accucraft Challenger's price (i.e. between the Cab Forward $8K versus the NGG-16 Garratt's $5K)?

Has not Accucraft shown they can do a Limited Edition Live Steam production run of 50, 60 or 75; production dependant on pre-sales w/deposits. As-well-as an ability to do a later run as small as 25 if there's demand; e.g., Cab Forward.

If the above are true, isn't it possible the downside could be for Aster should they consider a second run of Challengers at sometime they may not find sufficient demand if Accucraft does a Challenger?

Just questions.


Notes: * As hard as that is to believe nevertheless the possibility has to be considered.


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## Anthony Duarte (Dec 27, 2007)

Posted By Chris Scott on 29 Jan 2010 09:11 AM 
Posted By Anthony Duarte on 29 Jan 2010 06:55 AM 
Well, in the newsletter that's been sitting around since last spring, _*Accucraft mentioned that they were considering a UP Challenger (seems doubtful now that Aster's taken their potential customers)*_, a Santa Fe 5000 Class, and an SP M-6 Mogul. I personally have no interest in those locos... but if i had to pick a standard gauge engine (being a NG nut), I'd probably want either a Southern PS4 or a UP 4-8-4. 

Just my ¢2, 
- Anthony 

Anthony:
Really ? Maybe there are some questions that (above highlighted) raises: 

Could it be that Aster might just as easily stimulate demand for an Accucraft Challenger and Accucraft capitalizes on unsatisfied demand (unable/unwilling to buy an Aster*; Thou$ands less (i.e., $12-14k vs. ~$6-8K); A very popular and nostalgic locomotive (US and Japan); Gas fired (not alcohol or coal); They just do not want an Aster, etc.? Accucraft could also do an alcohol version as well gas, yet another ripple. And demand is often stimulated by seeing/experiencing the Challenger; call it the seeing is believing drool factor. 

Isn't a Challenger less complicated than a Cab Forward or a NGG-16 Garratt where both engines are articulated, one forward one behind the cab? On a Challenger both engines are forward of the cab; on a Challenger isn't only the front engine articulated the rear engine fixed? If a Challenger is less complicated wouldn't this potentially lower an Accucraft Challenger's price (i.e. between the Cab Forward $8K versus the NGG-16 Garratt's $5K)?

Has not Accucraft shown they can do a Limited Edition Live Steam production run of 50, 60 or 75; production dependant on pre-sales w/deposits. As-well-as an ability to do a later run as small as 25 if there's demand; e.g., Cab Forward.

If the above are true, isn't it possible the downside could be for Aster should they consider a second run of Challengers at sometime they may not find sufficient demand if Accucraft does a Challenger?

Just questions.


Notes: * As hard as that is to believe nevertheless the possibility has to be considered.

Points well taken.
I supposed I could be wrong, especially considering that i'm in one of the groups you mentioned that is unable to buy a large Aster locomotive, and if Accucraft DID go through with a challenger that was, say, in the 5-6k range, I would certainly consider saving my pennies.


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## Charles (Jan 2, 2008)

Anthony
Challenger would probably be in the range of 8K as with the Cab Forwards.


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## JEFF RUNGE (Jan 2, 2008)

There is an article in todays New York Times, addressing Obama's ambitious plan to double exports in the next 5 years. The FIRST thing mentioned to accomplish this is "China would have to allow their currency to appreciate 40%" so if that agenda moves forward it could be BYE BYE cheap Accucrafts Would you pay 11K -12k for that same Cab Forward ?? But if his accomplishments to date, are any indicator of his (Obama's) accomplishments to come...... well you get the picture. Show me the jobs!!


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## nickco201 (Jul 1, 2008)

I think a Southern Ps-4 would be great....I think it would be very popular among eastern RR fans and many others. Already enough western stuff.


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## Chris Scott (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By JEFF RUNGE on 29 Jan 2010 11:11 AM 
There is an article in todays New York Times, addressing Obama's ambitious plan to double exports in the next 5 years. The FIRST thing mentioned to accomplish this is "China would have to allow their currency to appreciate 40%" so if that agenda moves forward it could be BYE BYE cheap Accucrafts Would you pay 11K -12k for that same Cab Forward ?? But if his accomplishments to date, are any indicator of his (Obama's) accomplishments to come...... well you get the picture. Show me the jobs!! 


A digression, with apologies to the MLS community, but it's relevant. And everyone is going to find this soooo fascinating.



Jeff:
The NYT's author's other notable recent accomplishment are interviews with Michael Obama and French First Lady Carla Bruni. Also the author does not source the data which means...

With respect to doubling exports: 
"America's exports currently total about $1.57 trillion, using annualized numbers from the third quarter of 2009, according to the US Department of Commerce. It would require growth of about 14 percent a year to double that amount. That's a bit faster than the inflation-adjusted pace seen before the recession, when a weakening dollar helped spur export growth." *** 

The dollar has been weakening from it's peak in 2008 when demand for dollars surged as the world sought safety. As the world economies continue to strengthen the dollar will continue to weaken as dollar demand subsides. Admittedly, a doubling of exports in 5 years (and 2 million jobs) is aggressive, but it's something to get excited about. Who would accept a president saying he wants a 10-20% increase in exports over 5 years? 

If China did allow their currency to appreciate by 40% in 5 years the disruption to the world economy and the internal politics of China would be a catastrophe. If you think Accucraft's sales would dry up, imagine the demand ramifications, around the world, if the prices of all China's export products go up 40%. 

"One item that stood out as different [in his speech] was the acknowledgement that we are on our way to export-led growth, if we are to have growth at all," commented Andrew Samwick, a Dartmouth College economist, in an online analysis of Obama's remarks to the nation. "I don't think [2 million jobs] a reasonable projection, but it does signal a different way of talking about what's important in economic policy." ***

"Many experts say the world economy needs some post-recession retooling, with the US importing less and exporting more, while China and other Asian nations transition toward growth fueled by their domestic consumers." ***

China has been focused on rapidly growing their internal consumer consumption for as long as 10 years. China's leaders are well aware they must let their currency value rise, slowly; economic growth fueled by exports alone is unsustainable over the long run. But don't expect China to let their currency appreciate in the current economic climate that would be counterproductive for both sides.

Just think, maybe Boeing, with a backlog of 851 787 Dreamliners, the largest backlog for any commercial passenger airliner ever, and customers requesting 2 more models for short haul, they alone could generate $1 trillion in export revenue. Deliveries start at the end of this year. Do your part for the economy, buy a Dreamliner!


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## JEFF RUNGE (Jan 2, 2008)

While Boeing may create some good paying jobs, they will ALL be filled by people who have worked in the industry before and are currently unemployed or under employed. As for products from China getting too expensive, when that happens someone else will fill the void. Wish I could avoid buying products made by Chinese companies or manufactured in China, but it's hard to do today....


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## jfrank (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By JEFF RUNGE on 29 Jan 2010 04:34 PM 
While Boeing may create some good paying jobs, they will ALL be filled by people who have worked in the industry before and are currently unemployed or under employed. As for products from China getting too expensive, when that happens someone else will fill the void. Wish I could avoid buying products made by Chinese companies or manufactured in China, but it's hard to do today.... 

LOL Jeff. Who pray tell will replace them. I think we have exhausted the supply of cheap skilled labor with the Chinese. Certainly not anything in Africa or South America or Mexico. Russia??? Eastern Europe? Naw. The Japanese and Koreans are already pricing themselves out of markets. So who is left????????? Time to bring it all back here. The reality is with the decline of the Dollar no one in the US will be able to afford anything. But, hey, Ive got mine so I don't care.


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## Chris Scott (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By JEFF RUNGE on 29 Jan 2010 04:34 PM 
While Boeing may create some good paying jobs, they will ALL be filled by people who have worked in the industry before and are currently unemployed or under employed. As for products from China getting too expensive, when that happens someone else will fill the void. Wish I could avoid buying products made by Chinese companies or manufactured in China, but it's hard to do today.... 
Forget trains, buy a Dreamliner. It's a bigger bang for the buck, plus if it's yours you get to fly it. Or lease it and live off the revenue. Life is good!


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## CapeCodSteam (Jan 2, 2008)

So, let me see if I get this right. Are you guys trying to tell me that Accucraft's next Standard Gauge is going to be an airplane commissioned by Boing?


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## zubi (May 14, 2009)

Oh, then, how about a cute pre-WW2 double decker for Accucraft Narrow Gauge?? Zubi


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## JEFF RUNGE (Jan 2, 2008)

Chris, no point to be made, just an interesting perspective on what was said in Obama's speech, and the article I sited.


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## JEFF RUNGE (Jan 2, 2008)

Kent, yes and it will run better backwards then forward......


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## DavidQueener (Jan 10, 2009)

Gentlemen, 
This may be a bit pre-mature as an annoucement, but I have been commissioned by Mr. Gary Bartlow and Mr. Doug Hemmeter to build for them the chassis for three UP Challengers in F scale standard gauge. These will be two rail electric / battery powered locos, not live steam. Doug is doing most of the assembly work on these 6 foot long monsters, but if you want to get an additional one, or components for building your own, Doug and Gary are the men to talk to. 
Cheers! 
Dave Queener 
www.CumberlandModelEngineering.com


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## aankus (Jan 5, 2008)

Ahhhhhh Yes, 
lets blame the new guy for the economic disaster left to him by good ole' gwb...... 
Hank Paulson in his new book reveals that he "warned gwb of the upcoming collapse back in 2004" 
Did he do anything about it ???? Guess not..... 

Enough of this political crap, lets stick to the topic, live steam or echt damf !!! 

BTW, the 'almighty buck' is gaining steam, rising precipitously against the Euro. 
Rumors are that the default of Greece et al.(Portugal, Spain) is eminint...possibly precipitating the collapse 
of the EU.....howz dat for political fodder ????? LGB may be a 'god buy' again....Oh yeah, it went 'belly up' did'nt it ?.....


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## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

removed


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## Dave -- Use Coal (Feb 19, 2008)

I always get curious when something is removed from a thread. I always figure that is the good stuff.

It is amazing how threads drift from the original subject to something that appears unrelated. In this case we drift from what engines will be available (or that we would like to see available) to the health of the euro. Very interesting.


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## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

I always get curious when something is removed from a thread. 
Dave, 

Nothing so exciting. I was making a dummy post to get the 'quoted text' html for another thread. Sorry - I should have used the testing forum!


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