# Methylated Spirits



## steamboatmodel (Jan 2, 2008)

What do the Alcohol steamers in Canada use?

I have run model steam engines for a number of years now, but generally use butane/propane mix, Esbit or Sterno. I was given an old engine and boiler that uses Methylated Spirits. After pressure testing the boiler I went to the local hardware store to buy some Methylated Spirits or denatured alcohol. The clerk looked at me strange and said you by alcohol at the liquor store. When I explained what I wanted it for he told me that I couldn't do that it was against the law. He then refused to sell me the pieces of copper tube I had been going to buy. Well so much for supporting the small guy, I then went to Canadian Tire and asked them, they didn't have any ether and there reaction on explanation was "thats Cool, and could they see it". They suggested either methyl hydrate or Coleman fuel (Naphtha/white gas). 
Regards,
Gerald.


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## tacfoley (Jan 3, 2008)

Well, Sir, I hafta admit that I wouldn't be going to an Aster dealer to buy tyre chains, so why would Crappy Tire know anything about running live-steam trains? Seems very odd to me, that's all.









I'm sure that Messrs D M-K, D. Pantage or A. Wright will put you in touch with the correct teminology and possible sources of the ordinary alcohol we use in our locomotives.








Asking in a hardware store for alcohol AND copper pipe is a sure-fire way of getting a free holiday in Kingston HoC for a while, during which time they'll doubtless find out what you REALLY wanted it for, if not a home-brew still for 'shine.









Best

tac
www.ovgrs.org


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## Dave -- Use Coal (Feb 19, 2008)

Here in the south, United States, we go to home depot in the paint department and get SLX which is for paint thinner and cleaning brushes. It works great but does have a smell to it. For sure you do not want to drink it. There is also a brand called ACE but I have never seen a place to purchase it. They do use it at the Diamondhead Steamup.


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## Dan Pantages (Jan 2, 2008)

Methyl hydrate is what you use. In Canada it is the law that the contents have to be on the container and if you buy methyl hydrate from Canadian Tire it is 99.9% pure and says so. I regularly take several 4 liter jugs (1.056US gallons) down to the Summer Steam up as it is more pure than what you buy in most places in the States. (Let’s not get off on some tangent here and come up with all kinds of places you can get more pure stuff) Fellow steamers who wait for my shipment to get in call it “Canadian Hooch”, the name given to it by Richard Finlayson. 

On an aside, one time I bought 10 jugs and the fellow asked why I needed that much. I told him what it was for and that I was going to take it down to the States. He suggested that they would stop me at the border. I phoned the US Border patrol and told them my plan. The conversation went sort of like this. "I am going to San Francisco next week and plan on taking 10 gallons of methyl hydrate with me. Why? To run my model steam engines. You can buy it in the states. Yes but it's not as pure. (Long pause) Wrong answer! I'm sorry, I don't understand. That stuff is used in making drugs and "pure" is important. You don't understand this stuff is used as a fuel for live steam engines, would I phone you if I was transporting it for illegal purposes?" He hung up and I still bring Canadian Hooch down to American steam-ups. Also it’s about $9.00 Canadian a jug.


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Dave -- Use Coal on 16 Oct 2009 10:23 AM 
Here in the south, United States, we go to home depot in the paint department and get SLX which is for paint thinner and cleaning brushes. It works great but does have a smell to it. For sure you do not want to drink it. There is also a brand called ACE but I have never seen a place to purchase it. They do use it at the Diamondhead Steamup.


I much prefer the S-L-X brand of denatured alcohol over the stuff sold by True Value hardware stores. (I can't remember the full name of the company that makes the brand I don't like, but it something like "Sunny ... chemicals")

All alcohols stink as far as I am concerned and S-L-X does have an odor to it, but it is not as 'bad' as the "Sunny" stuff... especially the fumes from burning.

I am quite allergic to many perfumes and other odoriferants ("pot-pouri" [flower and weed leaves in a bag or bowl], room deodorant sprays and candles [like "Glade"] and perfumes and body lotions [especially "Sea-Breeze"]. These "odors" give me immediate violent pain in the nasal cavities and headaches... one time a pot-pouri display in a store put me on the floor in a semi-conscious state).

An accidental good whiff of the fumes of burning the Sunny brand alcohol set me down for a good while, where as the S-L-X brand has not. I do not know what the differences are in these two products except what I read on the Southern Steam Trains website at:

http://www.southernsteamtrains.com/notes/alcohol%20fuel.htm

If you cannot find denatured alcohol on the shelf, ask the clerk for "denatured alcohol for cutting shellac"... surely in Canada they sell shellac and have alcohol for thinning it.


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## Tenn Steam (Jan 3, 2008)

Try a boating supply. In the states West Marine for example. Some small boats use alcohol stoves. ACE may be a house brand of Ace Hardware.
Bob


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## Spule 4 (Jan 2, 2008)

Ace "brand" is packaged for Ace by WM Barr. So Kleen Strip brand should be the same.


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## zephyra (Jan 2, 2008)

S-L-X is also manufactured by WM Barr. You can find the details of any US originated brew on http://www.msds.com/. The formatting is a bit strange after cut/paste but the summary is: Ethanol 45-50%; Methanol 45-50%; Methyl isobutyl ketone 4%. Kleen Strip and Ace brand are identical.

MSDS lists a 'green' denatured alcohol from WM BArr which is primarily ethanol with up to 4% methyl isobutyl ketone but I've never seen it in the stores. 

Another manufacturer is Sunnyside which sells brands such as Allpro - these are very nasty in my experience: Ethanol 60%; Ethyl Acetate 25%; Solvent Naptha trace; Methyle Isobutyl Ketone 3%; Methanol 12%

Robert


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## steamboatmodel (Jan 2, 2008)

Thanks Guys, 
The Methyl hydrate works great $7.99 a 4L jug. 
The local hardware is one that I had used for a number of years. It has switched ownership lately due to health issues of the original owner, the new owners and staff have no idea what they are doing. I used to buy all my Sterno and Esbit tablets from them plus small copper pipe cut offs, They now only sell 8' lengths of pipe and the Sterno and Esbit they tossed out it was over six months old. They will order more if you want to buy the minimum order amount, but don't want to carry anything in stock. That's why I had ended up at Can Tire, It was the only other place within walking distance. 
Regards, 
Gerald. 
PS I thought I had replied before to this but I can't see my reply.


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## thumper (Jan 31, 2009)

This is a note to Dan, and it's not meant to be a lecture, but don't screw with the U.S. Homeland Security group [formerly U.S. Customs]. From knowlege of the law and personal experience watching their operations at one of the largest border crossings between Canada and the U.S., they have more authority at the border than anyone in the Justice Department and can, if they so chose, confiscate everything in your possession if they think you are doing something illegal. Think of talking about a bomb in an airport - it's just dumb to do so. More often than not, they are a pretty good group of people and would love to see the locomotives you have with you and then send you on your way. However, if you get a guy who has a mean streak, he alone can make your life more miserable than you ever thought possible. They have a tough job; they take it very seriously and it isn't the time to be a "smart a__"! By the way, we wait for our Canadian friends to stop a the Canadian Tire store on their way over for a steamup to pick up some methyl hydrate - the cost being about 50% of an inferior product sold by our local hardware stores. 

Regards, 
Will Lindley


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## Dan Pantages (Jan 2, 2008)

The original question of this post was “What do the Alcohol steamers in Canada use?” I tried to answer that in my post, with a bit of humor; your border guards see it just as that. In 15 years of crossing the border with live steam engines and fuel we have always been treated in a professional and friendly manor. Let’s not hijack the thread, this seems to happen all too often on this form board.


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