# What happens if the post office goes away.?



## John J (Dec 29, 2007)

Listening to talk radio today the talked about how the Post office is loosing money. Maybe they should shut it down. 


What if they just closed it? No Mail at all. 

What would take it's place?

How would Letters, Bills , Documents Magazines Get Delivered?

What about sending stuff to each other? Rolling stock? Buildings. Boxed Stuff? Supplies? 

Would you use UPS to deliver Letters , Bills, Correspondence, Tax Bills, Voting Information? 


Fed- X to do the same ? 

I am not interested in the fact that the Internet will take up the slack.....Pretend that is not a option.

JJ


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## Polaris1 (Jan 22, 2010)

The way I hear it is that the Post Office is only losing money IF they try to make up all Pension Plan dollars over 1 years time..... 

They can always raise Postal Stamp rates IF required too........ 

Shutting down rural Post Office locations is not a GOOD Starter option...... 

Dennis M from GBay, WI


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## bicyclexc (Mar 31, 2010)

So what if it loses money. So long as it is written in the constitution the funding should be guaranteed as a public service. Want to save the money? Amend the constitution first. 

IMO it would be a very bad move to eliminate the post office, but as most problems in America, there is no silver bullet to make everyone happy :/


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## Mike Reilley (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By John J on 30 May 2012 03:58 PM 
Listening to talk radio today the talked about how the Post office is loosing money. Maybe they should shut it down. 


What if they just closed it? No Mail at all. 

What would take it's place?

How would Letters, Bills , Documents Magazines Get Delivered?

What about sending stuff to each other? Rolling stock? Buildings. Boxed Stuff? Supplies? 

Would you use UPS to deliver Letters , Bills, Correspondence, Tax Bills, Voting Information? 


Fed- X to do the same ? 

I am not interested in the fact that the Internet will take up the slack.....Pretend that is not a option.

JJ 




JJ...the USPS is a government owned, non-profit corporation...that is NOT allowed to operate as a corporation by our wonderful Congress. Interestingly, the reason the USPS replaced the Post Office Department was specifically to run it "commercially" and NOT as a government agency...but Congress has forgotten that. Loss of the USPS would further the US's move toward third world country status. The fight going on about reducing mail services so that the USPS is profitable needs to be won by the USPS...not Congress. 


Somehow, the number of manned post offices needs to be reduced and replaced with mail service kiosks/desks at supermarkets...like many banks did in the last 20 years. Congress won't allow that.


Some how the number of days that mail is delivered has to be managed based on the mail load. Today is is not. Congress won't allow that. They want mail delivered 6 days a week...period. I get junk mail daily...and it's a money maker for the USPS...but I don't get it all 6 days of the week...usually just four or five. For me, if they cut my mail delivery back to 5 days a week, I'd be fine with that, especially if the 2 days off were not next to one another...then again, it we didn't get mail on the weekend, the postmen would have more regular job schedules and more family time.


The solution space needs to be negotiated...but frankly, I don't think until the Congress allows the USPS "corporation" to behave like a corporation will this ever be over.


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## Bob Pero (Jan 13, 2008)

I do all my banking and bill paying on line. UPS has been carrying a lot of the mail under contract. I do not see why we could not cut the delivery days down like you suggested.


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## TonyWalsham (Jan 2, 2008)

Lucky you in the USA getting deliveries six days of the week. We don't. Just five days has to do.
Maybe the USPS should do what the Australian Government owned PO does. 
Whilst E mail has pretty well killed off regular personal letters they realised this a fair while ago and expanded their other services. 
Apart from regular mail service the PO is a one stop shop for all sorts of things. Especially as a payment agency for accounts such as Gas, Electricity, Government bills, Telephone accounts etc. 
Our PO is also highly profitable efficiently handling packages, even though we have Fed Ex, UPS, DHL and lots of other couriers. They make lots and lots of profits handling packages from overseas. 
In the UK the PO also handles banking services and hopefully will do so here soon as well.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

I can't pretend that the Internet is not an option, not only is it, but it's one of the reasons that mail delivery has dropped off. 

So your question is how would we cope? Yes we would use FedEx and UPS and DHL to send things that had to be sent, of course. 

I really don't get the question, I think you gave the answer in the first post. 

Greg


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## Randy Stone (Jan 2, 2008)

Here in Florida, the post office doesn't open until 8:30 or 9am. 

If you go during your lunch break, let's say 11:30am to 2pm, the busiest times of the day, they have the least people at the counter helping customers due to lunch breaks. 

Then, they close at 5pm. 

So if you work an 8 to 5 job, you're relagated to visiting the post office on Saturday. 

So, my suggestions are as follows. 

Stop delivery of mail on Thursdays. This is typically the slowest business day of the week. 

Two days a week, open at 7am. 

Two days a week, stay open until 8pm. 

I've heard suggestions of closing on Saturday. This would be assinine. 

Be open for business 9am to 6pm on Saturdays. 

Hire part time workers to help through the lunch time. The counter should have a full staff from 11:30 to 2pm. 

Also, the priority boxes loaded to 70 lbs are a great value. 

But, they need a larger box with the same 70 lb weight restriction. 

Another idea, would be allowing customer to open accounts where they could ship from home, and get billed for the costs. It could be paid through Paypal or a credit card on file. 

This is the 21st century. Most everyone has a computer and the need to take stuff to the post office is so 20th century. 

Got a slip that you have mail or a package at the post office and you need to come there to pick it up. WHY? This should be automated.


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## Mike Reilley (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By rlvette on 30 May 2012 09:38 PM 


Another idea, would be allowing customer to open accounts where they could ship from home, and get billed for the costs. It could be paid through Paypal or a credit card on file. 


That's available now via their web site. I use it all the time. I print the sticker for the box and tape it on, click the box for pickup, put the box out front, and the mailman picks it up on his normal rounds.


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## W3NZL (Jan 2, 2008)

The very thought of having to deal with, or depend on UPS or FED EX on a daily basis is a sobering thought...
Makes me kind of glad to be an old guy... hehe
Paul R...


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## JackM (Jul 29, 2008)

Dennis has it right. For whatever political purpose, a number of years ago Congress ordered the USPS to be able to completely fund its pension requirements by 2015. Not one other department of the Federal government is required to do so. Thus, it would seem, the private carriers would benefit from a new market for their services. 

The fact that mail service is in the Constitution doesn't seem to be important. 

JackM


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

Historically, the post office was never understood as a profit-making entity. It was understood as something vital to the operations of both government and the economy, and thus a profit-enabling tool. But not a profit making entity. The idea that it should make a profit is an artifact of the privatization wave that started in the 1980s. 

Initially, to defray costs to taxpayers, the post service set rates according to the actual costs of delivery. So delivering mail within Philadelphia was really cheap, because distances were small and natural barriers were slight. Delivery to a rural area, on the other hand, was extremely expensive--distances were much much greater and the barriers to delivery--poor roads, but also flooded rivers, mud, snow etc--were much greater. There was a movement throughout the 19th century for "rural free delivery," making all letters deliverable with the same stamp, so that in effect city dwellers were subsidizing the mail delivery of rural customers. The argument for rural free delivery was partly the traditional one--that the mail was vital for government and business, and everyone should have the same access to it.


In 1902, "rural free delivery" was established, so that the same 1c stamp would deliver a letter three blocks in manhattan and 300 miles by sled dog in Alaska. The post office's revenues have declined as the volume of 1st class mail has declined. Email replaced many letters; fed ex and UPS took over much of the package delivery, and the post office is left with much less profitable business class "junk" mail.


IMHO it would be an excellent idea to provide everyone in the US with free wireless internet service--or rather, to treat wireless interent as a public good, much as we treated the mail, and on the same grounds. Our taxes would go to fund a subsidized system of universally available wireless internet. Effectively, users in urban areas would be subsidizing users in rural areas. That service could do most of what the postal service does. Of course, there are still many peopel who don't have computers, and they'd still need some mail delivery. And unless the Constitution is amended, the US is still required to provide a mail service.


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## todd55whit (Jan 2, 2008)

I absolutely don't want to amend the constitution to save the post office! Never! However I think a lot can be done to better manage employee benifits. I am a public employee and a lot has changed in my benifits. I have had to expended more for what I get. Why can't they? 
I understand the costs of retires can not be and should not be fooled with. I think if the politics and the leashes could be taken out of the equation it might be able to perform better. Get rid of Saturday delivery. Personally all my Saturday mail is Junk advertisements. I really don't think we need it. Think about it, what can you do with the mail on Saturday anyway? If you get bills I don't think you can run out and pay them on the weekend anyway. I think as a whole we can wait until Monday for mail. I don't want to lose this service because there are some out there that can and won't use a computer.


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## CJGRR (Jan 2, 2008)

I'm sure I'll get flamed for this, but i don't use the postal service for anything, so quite honestly, I'd rather my tax dollars don't fund it. If I need to get ahold of some one, I'll call them. If i need to order something, I'll have it shipped by UPS. If I have to pay a bill, I'll do the payment over the phone. I aint paying .50 cents to send a check to a bill...etc 

In short, it's time for it to die


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## Trains (Jan 2, 2008)

They can't shut it down! I pay all my bills by mail. Don't do anything over the net to many people out there smarter then the people
who say it's safe. Maybe if the big shots that are making more money then they need to, for sitting on their A-- and not doing anything
would take a cut in pay. They could keep it going. I'm sure there is a lot of wasted money, just like the rest of the goverment.

My 3 cents.

Don


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## astrayelmgod (Jan 2, 2008)

" Not one other department of the Federal government is required to do so." 

Not only that, but no private company does that, either. It is exclusively a requirement by Congress on the USPS. The USPS would be doing fine without that $5 billion a year drain.


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

I do like the USPS and think it needs to remain in "business". I think they do a mighty fine job. I have had WAY LESS problems with the USPS than any of the other package delivery services.

I would not mind paying more for postage to mail bills and and other 1st class letters, but I expect the junk mail advertisers to pay the same amount that I do. Drop the different classes and charge what it costs. I am sure that the cost for me would go up due to the total loss of cheap junk mail, but that would be worth it to me. Most of what I receive during the week goes straight from the mailbox to the recycling bin and that is irresponsible use of the Earth's natural resources!

I am retired and although sometimes the mail delivery is the highlight of the day (







) I would not mind delivery just once per week (it could become a real party on that day!!!







)! The city only collects trash once per week, so why shouldn't the USPS deliver on the same schedule... Maybe just the day before trashday and then I would not need to store the junk mail for more than just overnight! But utility and other bills would have to start giving me at least 30 days to respond instead of the present 2 weeks or less for some of them (I have seen some bills where the date on the bill is the 1st and the due date is the 20th, but the postmark is the 10th and I actually received it on the 14th)!


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## Randy Stone (Jan 2, 2008)

I pay most of my bills using the internet. 
But the local county water department wants $2.00 extra to pay my water bill online. 
I'm not paying $2.00 when a check, envelope and stamp cost far less. 

I still prefer to ship USPS and believe the post office is still a needed goverenment business.


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## Mike Reilley (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By JackM on 31 May 2012 06:10 AM 
Dennis has it right. For whatever political purpose, a number of years ago Congress ordered the USPS to be able to completely fund its pension requirements by 2015. Not one other department of the Federal government is required to do so. Thus, it would seem, the private carriers would benefit from a new market for their services. 

The fact that mail service is in the Constitution doesn't seem to be important. 

JackM 
Without becoming argumentative, the requirement to fund it's pension, that is, to generate enough revenue to fund the pension program, is something that corporations are SUPPOSED to do. Not all do as we've learned lately...which has led to several bailouts for the US Government. Somehow, the USPS needs to figure out how to be revenue neutral by reducing expenses and increasing income. Congress needs to act more like a board of directors RESPONSIBLE for ensuring the USPS can be revenue neutral...FIRST AND FOREMOST....and meet it's constitutional demand.


Regarding "not one other department of the Federal government is required to" fund it's retirement program...that is incorrect. First the USPS is NOW NOT a department...it's a Federally owned corporation...like the TVA, the Bonniville Dam Authority, Department of Energy laboratories, etc. I worked for 35 years as a Navy civil servant. All three of the Navy labs I worked for were financially managed under a program called the Navy Industrial Finance (NIF) system. Under NIF, the rates we had to charge for our labors included the full retirement costs of the employees (as well as cover all salary, fringe benefit, overhead and G&A expenses)...money that was sent to the Treasury from the NIF to pay future retirement costs. In effect, the Navy labs and shipyards are government owned non-profit corporations...and are run like corporations. Year after year, the shipyards lost money, but under NIF the labs had to generate extra revenue to pay for the losses at the shipyards. We literally competed against private industry for R&D work...and hired private industry to augment our scientists and engineers when needed. To draw a commercial analogy, the NIF created a holding company for all the labs and shipyards and they had to generate revenues to pay ALL expenses. Our customers were the Department of the Navy and other DOD agencies. The same holds true for most of the Department of Energy labs and power generation facilities...the rates they charge must defray ALL costs. This is why the Congress is requiring the USPS to fund it's pension. It's the way Federally owned corporations are supposed to operate...and the USPS was shirking it's responsibility...and are still crying about it.


I should also add that under NIF, layoffs were possible and did occur...every year I worked. Further, facility space was "rented" and given up based on business volume. The Navy real estate and buildings used by NIF activities are all "owned" by a Navy Regional Command (NRC)...who was our landlord. The NRC charges for all landlord services and depreciation of the buildings...generating funds to defray maintenance and operations costs for the land and structures...JUST LIKE landlords do for all floorspace rentals by their tenants...and just like private industry budgets for/charges for their own buildings and facility expenses. There's no free lunch. I just wish MORE of the US government agencies worked on a variation of the NIF accounting system...maybe we'd see less featherbedding.


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## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

As for once a week service, that is what we get every winter when we go out to Arizona for 2-3 months. The USPS has a forwarding service, about $15 a week. Once a week they box up* all *of our mail and ship it out by Priority Mail. It goes out on Wednesday and we get 1 or 2 boxes on Friday. It is actually very nice to get the mail once a week. Of course we get local mail there six day a week, but most of our mail comes once a week.

It is a great service. Regular forwarding doesn't include magazines. This includes everything, including Garden Railway.

Chuck


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## Gary Armitstead (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Mike Reilley on 31 May 2012 02:26 PM 
Posted By JackM on 31 May 2012 06:10 AM 
Dennis has it right. For whatever political purpose, a number of years ago Congress ordered the USPS to be able to completely fund its pension requirements by 2015. Not one other department of the Federal government is required to do so. Thus, it would seem, the private carriers would benefit from a new market for their services. 

The fact that mail service is in the Constitution doesn't seem to be important. 

JackM 
Without becoming argumentative, the requirement to fund it's pension, that is, to generate enough revenue to fund the pension program, is something that corporations are SUPPOSED to do. Not all do as we've learned lately...which has led to several bailouts for the US Government. Somehow, the USPS needs to figure out how to be revenue neutral by reducing expenses and increasing income. Congress needs to act more like a board of directors RESPONSIBLE for ensuring the USPS can be revenue neutral...FIRST AND FOREMOST....and meet it's constitutional demand.


Regarding "not one other department of the Federal government is required to" fund it's retirement program...that is incorrect. First the USPS is NOW NOT a department...it's a Federally owned corporation...like the TVA, the Bonniville Dam Authority, Department of Energy laboratories, etc. I worked for 35 years as a Navy civil servant. All three of the Navy labs I worked for were financially managed under a program called the Navy Industrial Finance (NIF) system. Under NIF, the rates we had to charge for our labors included the full retirement costs of the employees (as well as cover all salary, fringe benefit, overhead and G&A expenses)...money that was sent to the Treasury from the NIF to pay future retirement costs. In effect, the Navy labs and shipyards are government owned non-profit corporations...and are run like corporations. Year after year, the shipyards lost money, but under NIF the labs had to generate extra revenue to pay for the losses at the shipyards. We literally competed against private industry for R&D work...and hired private industry to augment our scientists and engineers when needed. To draw a commercial analogy, the NIF created a holding company for all the labs and shipyards and they had to generate revenues to pay ALL expenses. Our customers were the Department of the Navy and other DOD agencies. The same holds true for most of the Department of Energy labs and power generation facilities...the rates they charge must defray ALL costs. This is why the Congress is requiring the USPS to fund it's pension. It's the way Federally owned corporations are supposed to operate...and the USPS was shirking it's responsibility...and are still crying about it.


I should also add that under NIF, layoffs were possible and did occur...every year I worked. Further, facility space was "rented" and given up based on business volume. The Navy real estate and buildings used by NIF activities are all "owned" by a Navy Regional Command (NRC)...who was our landlord. The NRC charges for all landlord services and depreciation of the buildings...generating funds to defray maintenance and operations costs for the land and structures...JUST LIKE landlords do for all floorspace rentals by their tenants...and just like private industry budgets for/charges for their own buildings and facility expenses. There's no free lunch. I just wish MORE of the US government agencies worked on a variation of the NIF accounting system...maybe we'd see less featherbedding.



This is just a little sidenote here pertaining to what Mikey said. Here on my street in Burbank, our street is 1088 feet long. We're a couple of houses from the intersection at the top of the sloping street. It drops 90 feet to the next intersection down from us. So that's what....a 9% grade? Our postal lady(middle fifties) weighs all of 85 pounds dripping wet and two weeks ago, there were two young supervisors (in their thirties)following her around in their cars. We talked to one of them and he ACTUALLY told us they were trying to see how our delivery person could do the route more efficiently and save the PO more money! I told them,"Are you serious?!" Our lady parks her little van at the end of the street (topmost end) and makes her rounds going down one side and backup the opposite side. These two "idiots" said it looked to them that our mailperson should start in the middle of the block! WHAT!!!??? I then said, "Why don't we just fire you two morons, save a ton of money and let the lady do her job (like she has been doing for the past thirty years). That's the PO mentality we're dealing with here.







BTW, the lady that started our route about a year ago, replaced a drug addicted young man who NEVER deivered our mail correctly or anytime before 9:00 at night. Our neighborhood complained for over five years before someone in the main office finally ousted his butt. More gubment efficiency at work.


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Just an odd note to add to the subject... 

For about the 7th or 8th time in the last year or so, the US Mail was delivered TWICE in my neighborhood in one day. I have video surveillance cameras around my house and have at least 7 or 8 times noted the mailman deliver the mail at around noon (give or take an hour or two) and then a second (different) mailman delivered mail again some time between 3 and 6 PM. It just happened again today... a man the first time about noon, and a woman the second time about 5 PM. 

I also have video of one mailman delivering at my house, going on to the neighbor's house and then returning to my house to put more mail in the box. And that has happened at least 3 times in the last few months. One time the same mailman came to my house 3 times within about 20 minutes.


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## SD90WLMT (Feb 16, 2010)

I'm really even more curious now... 

Which do you think is more important to worry about - or not discuss here. Things that will happen in the future.. 

--- if the post office will survive? 

OR 

--- if the dollar bill as a currency will survive? 

Which will impact your life more?


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

The dollar bill is in WAY better shape than the post office. And I'm not just blowing smoke--I just published this:

http://www.amazon.com/Face-Value-En...9384/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1338509891&sr=8-1


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## kleinbahn (Sep 21, 2010)

Well, if it goes private like the Dutch parcel service did, a box that was $5 to send from NL to the US will become $30 overnight!


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## ThinkerT (Jan 2, 2008)

I am employed by a postal contractor. I deliver mail six days a week, that is driving down a rural road and sticking it in actual mailboxes. My workday starts a bit before 7:30 am and I am usually done for the day about 1:00 pm, give or take a few minutes. 

I work with regular postal employees. For them, anymore, ten to twelve hour days are the norm, be they clerks (in the post office) or city carriers (delivering mail within the city). A couple of the ones I've worked with have pretty much collapsed from exhaustion and overwork (we get one back in the next few days, and another is medically restricted to 'light duty'). 

As was pointed out earlier, the big reason for the bind the postal service is in is the insane payment levels for its pension plan. (My personal view - and that is all it is - is that this money is being stolen by the people who mandated it in the first place). Just bringing these payments down to a sane level level would be enough to solve most of its immediate problems. 

Other problems stem from utterly incompetent upper level and executive management (sometimes I think they are trained to make the worst possible decision each and every time) and micromanaging by Congress. 

There are some issues with local post office management; basically the system is set up so that local management gets bonuses for keeping costs down, which means working people longer hours and skimping on supplies and maintainence. 

A likely fix involves increasing the number of 'contract post offices' operating in malls and small buildings, where none of the employees are directly employed by the postal service. Much, much cheaper (because those people make only 1/3rd to 1/2 as much).


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## Madman (Jan 5, 2008)

I haven't read all of the replies, however I should hate to think of our country without the post office.


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## ThinkerT (Jan 2, 2008)

For about the 7th or 8th time in the last year or so, the US Mail was delivered TWICE in my neighborhood in one day. I have video surveillance cameras around my house and have at least 7 or 8 times noted the mailman deliver the mail at around noon (give or take an hour or two) and then a second (different) mailman delivered mail again some time between 3 and 6 PM. It just happened again today... a man the first time about noon, and a woman the second time about 5 PM. 

I also have video of one mailman delivering at my house, going on to the neighbor's house and then returning to my house to put more mail in the box. And that has happened at least 3 times in the last few months. One time the same mailman came to my house 3 times within about 20 minutes 

When they get shorthanded, routes get divided up in strange ways, and all to often not all of them are familiar with the 'quirks'. 

As of late, some of the regular postal employees where I'm at are so overworked it is 7pm or later before they finish. Most of the delays are caused by trying to deliver actual packages or items requiring a signature, with nobody home to accept said package or sign.


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## bwplasticman (Apr 27, 2012)

One can only hope. About 6% of my outgoing packages are handled by the USPS, but the USPS is responsible for 100% of my shipping problems including non delivery, damaged merchandise, lost merchandise from packages and delays. While insurance covers some of the cost involved, other packages cannot be insured and no amount of insurance can make up for the hassle of dealing with the USPS on any topic let alone claims. While I recognize that no USPS would cause some problems. Remember, every man, woman and child in the US is on the hook for $50.00/each just to bail the USPS out of their current financial problems and there is no end in sight.

Bruce
Colorado Model Structures


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## bwplasticman (Apr 27, 2012)

One can only hope. About 6% of my outgoing packages are handled by the USPS, but the USPS is responsible for 100% of my shipping problems including non delivery, damaged merchandise, lost merchandise from packages and delays. While insurance covers some of the cost involved, other packages cannot be insured and no amount of insurance can make up for the hassle of dealing with the USPS on any topic let alone claims. Remember, every man, woman and child in the US is on the hook for $50.00/each just to bail the USPS out of their current financial problems and there is no end in sight.

Bruce
Colorado Model Structures

Sorry, hit the submit button b4 I meant to.


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## Madman (Jan 5, 2008)

I sell alittle on Ebay. I ship 99% of my sold items, which are mostly trains, via USPS. I have only had one experience with a package I shipped to California, where the item arrived in pieces. It was not a train but a ceramic Lennox ferris wheel. And I blame the damage on my inadequate packaging.


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## Del Tapparo (Jan 4, 2008)

Virtually every order I have ever shipped in the last 13 years, has been handled by the USPS. I have never yet had a problem, either within the US or overseas. My biggest complaint is the horrendous customer service, or lack thereof at the main post office. I used to cuss it daily, having to stand in line for a minimum of 20 minutes every time. I finally got smart and started using Click'n Ship on-online, then I only had to wait in line for overseas orders that required customs forms.

Then I really got smart, and discovered my local CPU (Contract Postal Unit). Never a wait over 1 or 2 minutes, people that actually know what customer service means, and it is within blocks of my house! The only time I go the the main post office now, is sometimes on a weekend, when I just want to drop of a Priority Mail package in the box they have in the lobby (outside of the locked doors). And guess what? 2 out of 3 times, the damn drop box is locked ! What idiots!


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## bwplasticman (Apr 27, 2012)

Glad you guys have had better luck than I. In the past year alone, I have had one package completely lost, one took 46 days to Germany, one with the contents completely lost and replaced with someone else's merchandise, one where the contents were completely missing, and two where the package was opened and some of the contents removed. The first three were international flat rate where no insurance was available, the fourth was covered but took more than 60 days to be adjusted. The claims on the last two were denied as the packages were delivered. 

Bruce 
Colorado Model Structures


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## Madman (Jan 5, 2008)

Posted By bwplasticman on 14 Jun 2012 10:28 PM 
Glad you guys have had better luck than I. In the past year alone, I have had one package completely lost, one took 46 days to Germany, one with the contents completely lost and replaced with someone else's merchandise, one where the contents were completely missing, and two where the package was opened and some of the contents removed. The first three were international flat rate where no insurance was available, the fourth was covered but took more than 60 days to be adjusted. The claims on the last two were denied as the packages were delivered. 

Bruce 
Colorado Model Structures

Man, if it wasn't for bad luck, you'd have no luck at all


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## krs (Feb 29, 2008)

Posted By ThinkerT on 08 Jun 2012 09:48 PM 

A likely fix involves increasing the number of 'contract post offices' operating in malls and small buildings, where none of the employees are directly employed by the postal service. Much, much cheaper (because those people make only 1/3rd to 1/2 as much).


--------------

That seems to be the approach taken in Canada.

The post officed has contracts with a number of drugstore chains, so in each of those drugstores there is a section set aside for postal services, employees are drugstore employees trained to handle all mail and parcels and other postal services and hours are the same as the drugstore hours or close to it.
That includes the postal counter open on Saturdays and Sundays as well.

Business at each of these outlets is booming, they typically have two or thee people serving customers and there is still a short line up, but it moves fast.
The Canadian post office actually makes money as far as I know.

Mail delivery is only Monday to Friday, but it has been like that for years.


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## Mike Reilley (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Del Tapparo on 14 Jun 2012 08:21 PM 
I finally got smart and started using Click'n Ship on-online, then I only had to wait in line for overseas orders that required customs forms.


Yeah....I really agree. Click'n Ship is by far the most convenient way to ship stuff. I just go to USPS link after weighing my boxed up package, go through the selection process...and make sure you select the correct mail options...there's quite a price difference...then enter the address you're shipping to and print a shipping label with the postage on it. I trim that...tape it to the box...and set it on top of my mailbox before the mailman arrives...and off it goes.

For more valuable stuff, I take the box to the post office...but there's no line waiting. I just go in and place the box on their counter/into a bin and leave. My post office has the shipping bins in the lobby, so I can deposit the box even when they're closed. If's it's got a USPS label/postage on it already, there's no need to wait. In and out...

You must get an account with the USPS before you do this...but once you do, it remembers your past shipping addresses and your credit information (the postage is charged to your credit card)...so shipping stuff to the same address is easy as you just select a recipient from the address list.

Oh...and Click'n Ship is LESS expensive than going to the post office...by around 10% or more.


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## bwplasticman (Apr 27, 2012)

Tell me abut it. Fedex has had only problem with my stuff in 7 years and almost 1500 parcels.

Bruce
Colorado Model Structures


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## ThinkerT (Jan 2, 2008)

Glad you guys have had better luck than I. In the past year alone, I have had one package completely lost, one took 46 days to Germany, one with the contents completely lost and replaced with someone else's merchandise, 

Hmm...I do know that the postal service is downright paranoid about international parcels. I had one go missing on my route a couple years ago, got chewed out about it, but it rurned out I never saw it. It got stopped before making it to me. 


one where the contents were completely missing, and two where the package was opened and some of the contents removed. The first three were international flat rate where no insurance was available, the fourth was covered but took more than 60 days to be adjusted. The claims on the last two were denied as the packages were delivered. 

Not accusing, but I have seen where stuff fell out of parcels that were too flimsey for their contents. More than once, I've picked up such parcels during sorting only to have them come completely apart on me. I try to find everything, tape it up, and slap a 'damaged in transit' tag on it. Lots of others have rips or holes in the boxes. 

Mostly, though, I find myself wondering if the processing/sorting center might be at the root of your USPS problems. The staffs at the post offices proper tend to be way to overworked to tamper with anything even if they were so inclined, but it might be a different story where the mail is sorted after it leaves there. 

I do have have to put up with 'issues' now and again from where the mail is sorted before it gets to me. Perhaps there are severe staff problems at the sorting facility your parcels would go to after it leaves the post office.


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Just to add to the silly story content here...

Many years ago I ordered TWO books about computers from a seller, on approval. I got them and decided to keep one and send the other back.

I turned the original shipping box inside out to get a clean surface on which to put labels, put the one book in it, with some crumpled paper stuffed in to take the place of the other book that I was keeping. I put a return address label on it of my home address and put the supplied "Return Merchandise" label (marked to show which book was being returned) on the outside of the box.

Unfortunately, I ran out of tape at home and could not finish sealing the box, so I took it to a postal substation that was run by a small apparel store not far from where I lived. I had to stand in a long line (the place was very popular for mailing packages!) and while in line I looked at the rack where tape and labeling material was, but could only find one 500-ft roll of tape at a price I just could not afford. So when I got to the desk I asked if they had a smaller roll of tape I could buy. The lady very kindly said she would take care of sealing the package for me and I would not need to buy any tape at all! She weighed the box and I paid the postage and she set the package aside to finish serving other customers, saying she would do it up properly, later. So I left, quite pleased with the excellent and caring service!

The NEXT DAY (not two weeks later or even two days later), AT WORK (not at home), I was bored so I went to the department mailbox to see if I had gotten anything. There, in the bin, was a package addressed to me with a PRINTED label listing me, my company and the mail stop to deliver it to. And next to that label was MY home return-address label. Hmmmm... To complicate matters, the top flaps of the box were bent badly over top of a small object that was thicker than the box... The flaps had been force bent over it and lots of tape had been applied to seal the box. The box was so covered with tape that I did not recognise it.

When I opened the box, inside was the book I was returning to the book seller along with ANOTHER BOOK that I have no idea where it came from! My crumpled stuffing paper was not there.

I have no idea how anyone would have known my WORK address (including the mail stop in my building) to apply it to the package... I did not have any of that information on or in the box.

That evening, I took the package back to the postal substation and the same lady was working there. I explained my confusion over how I got it back and how it got to where I work! I was also concerned about where the extra book had come from. It was a college course book on business correspondence practices. I ventured a guess that maybe some employee had brought their school books to work there at the substation and it had accidentally been put in my box and gotten mailed. I was hopeful it could be returned to the person that owned it.

The lady went ballistic! They do not seal packages for customers and they do not type labels for customers! Nor do their employees bring books to work with them. She said I must have done it!

I again said I'd like to return this errant book to the rightful owner and she said I could just mail it with the other one back to the book seller, but I would need to get a bigger box as they post office would not accept a package as bent up as this one!

I was so stunned by her reaction, that I took the box back home, straightened out the flaps a bit, put the one book I was returning back in, removed the type written label that someone had added over the Return Merchandise label (glad I had put clear tape over that label!), put more crumpled paper in the box, sealed up the box again (I had stopped at a drugstore to get packing tape) and took it to the main Post Office and mailed it.

I still have that "extra" book and it has been useful a couple of times when I needed information about business writing (and how to address a congressman once!).

I still wonder where the extra book came from, but I will never understand how they got my work address to send it to, or how it got there in less than 15 hours!

I am glad I sent a separate letter to pay for the book I kept!


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## Jscola30 (Jun 13, 2012)

I've for the most part have had excellent experiences with the USPS. Can't say the same for private carriers. They seem to take longer. I had to order some church music (I am an organist, allota organists seem to be railfans too) and the publisher used only Fedex, I called it Fedlocal. 99% of what I get through the USPS I get either on time or early. I do most bill paying on line or in person, but all model trains, cds, dvds, etc are through the mail and I prefer using the USPS as they are much cheaper.


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## W3NZL (Jan 2, 2008)

I've recently had a couple of new experiences in the shipping world, new to me anyway... The last couple of things I've 
ordered online I opted for the "free shipping", said to take 7-10 business days, called UPS sure-post... Apparently UPS 
hauls the parcel overland, dumps it at Ur area central PO, who turns it over to Ur local PO, and they deliver it with Ur 
regular mail.... The best part is that it only took 3 days in one instance, an only 2 in the most recent one, and on top 
of that it was FREE !!! What a deal...
Paul R...


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## rdamurphy (Jan 3, 2008)

As a former truck driver, I spent a Christmas season as a driver on a mail contract. We did several routes, I did Denver, Pendleton (Oregon), Pittsburg, Philly, Denver, and also Denver, Omaha, Chicago, Denver.  Both were team runs. We were on a set schedule for departures and arrivals and were expected to be on time - not early - for both. I can't tell you how many times our 53 foot trailer was completely empty or had only a couple of mail carts or even a bag or two on it. 

NO ONE, not a single individual, at the US Postal Service has any inkling WHATSOEVER of the definition of word 'Efficiency." When we hit our departure time, they closed and sealed the door, even if there was mail on the dock, if it wasn't "ready" to go. We made an entire round trip to Chicago the week before Christmas with all three legs of the trip with a 53 foot trailer completely empty. I was a substitute driver, so I ran different schedules. And it never changed. 

BTW, you'd be amazed at how many times mail would be loaded in those airplane containers - and then shipped by truck, container and all. And then the airplane containers shipped back by truck empty. They paid the airlines for the space on a certain number of flights, even if they didn't send a single box...

We got paid the same if the trailer was full (NEVER happened) or if it had one letter on it. Or just a post office seal on the back door of the empty trailer. 

They could easily cut down on the number of carriers and trucks save an awful lot of money and still move the mail. 

Oh, the best part? One 200 pound cart of mail, five Postal "workers" arguing over who was going to unload it... 

Robert


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## Scottychaos (Jan 2, 2008)

spam..reported.


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## Dave Meashey (Jan 2, 2008)

Scot;

Darn! THAT is the only kind of Spam I get these days. I wish my wife would go out of town for a short visit, so I could fix myself some REAL Spam. YUMMmmmmmmmm!

Thanks for catching it,
David Meashey


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