# Choosing my ballast size



## ewarhol (Mar 3, 2014)

So I went to the local rock quarry and picked up samples of ballast (G Scale ballast). I'll be using Aristo/USA track and trains. I've attached a photo with the different size ballast 1/4", 3/8", 1/2". 

Leaning towards the 3/8". Curious what thoughts are and what size others have used?


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## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

If it were me, I'd use the smallest. I use crusher fines with a spectrum of sizes between dust and about a quarter of an inch. 

I have never seen it sized like you found at the quarry, except in larger sizes.

Chuck


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## toddalin (Jan 4, 2008)

I use #5 granite crusher fines as used in the roofing industry (A-1 Grit Products). The size and look is good, but the material is ferrous so is magnetic (and rusts a bit) and continually adheres to the engine reed switch magnets.

You may also want to consider magnetism in your thinking. 

http://a1grit.mediabeef.com/uploads/files/642291624306111894-productscatalog.pdf


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## ewarhol (Mar 3, 2014)

After I posted I was sitting back and looking at it again. The quarry had smaller more dust like rock, but that was wayyyyy to small. I'm beginning to like the 1/4" more. Ballast along the real rails looks proportionately smaller. I think the 3/8" and larger would start to look like boulders.


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## jimtyp (Jan 2, 2008)

Eric, I like the 1/4", I think that scales most prototypical, but just my preference. The upside of the larger stuff is that it will stay in place better, the larger the less movement.

if you have access to any nearby railroads, you could pick up a few rocks from their ballast and then translate that to scale size.

Can you post a pic with your track and some of each?

-Jim


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## Vinny D (Jan 25, 2013)

Like anything *it depends*
Here in Rhode Island where we get cold snowy winters and heavy rains in the spring I get best results using 3/8" crushed blue stone.
Yes, the smaller sizes look better.. but they don't last. They easily get washed away and just seem to disappear!
If you are in a dry area with not much climate and weather change season to season you can probably get away with using 1/4" size, but for me it just never lasts.
Looks great for about a week or so after I try using it as a finish ballast, but one good rain storm later it's pretty much washed out and I am left with the 3/8" stone that stays in place all year round.
So I would suggest trying out a small section and seeing what works best for you.


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## JerryB (Jan 2, 2008)

Eric:

You only mention "G scale" without providing any specific scale information. Not really important, but I would think you would want something that is somewhat "to scale."

Consider that 3/8" is equivalent to ~12" in 1:32, ~11" in 1:29, and ~8 ½" in 1:22.5. IMO, this is really large for ballast.

1/4" is equivalent to ~8" in 1:32, ~7 ¼" in 1:29, and ~7 ½" in 1:22.5. Still definitely on the large side.

My 1:20 scale RR uses a very coarse, sharp edged sand for ballast, but I don't remember the actual grade. This material has been down for years & years. I do replace some during regular maintenance, but the track & its structure are very solid.

The above suggestion to check a local prototype RR to see what they use is good.


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## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

Jerry, that is why I like crusher fines. The largest pieces are usually less than 1/4".

When I lived in Lakewood, Colorado, I used to go up in the Front Range and shovel it into the back of my SUV From the borrow pit by the road. The local granite at one place weathered down to a coarse sand. I could walk along the road and pick the size I wanted.

Chuck


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## ewarhol (Mar 3, 2014)

Thank you everyone for your input. Great ideas and scale measurements. I attached a picture that shows a piece of USA track, caboose, and the ballast samples.

Some replies mentioned that the smaller rock washes away. Just brain storming and idea, but if you were to put larger ballast down first (say 3/8") then the smaller rock (1/4" or smaller on top), would the smaller rock stay put better or still wash away?

I live in central MN, so we have lots of snow, wind, heavy spring and fall rains, and so on. Thank goodness no snakes like mentioned in a different thread


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

I use a mix where the max size just fits between the ties... bigger than 1/4 about 3/8 max.

Looks large if I have my rivet counter hat on, but stays in place better.

Remember an 1/8" prototype raindrop is almost 4" in 1:29 so rain can wash out prototype scaled ballast.

Greg


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## Dan Pierce (Jan 2, 2008)

12 years ago I used 1/4 inch gravel and mixed it 4 parts 1/4 inch and 1 part stone dust.
I dug a trench 6 inches wide and 4 inches deep.
I then inserted weed block fabric (not for the weeds, but for the ballast to keep it from mixing with the dirt).

Then I added my mix, leveled it and placed track on top.

Here it is 12 years later in Eastern Massachusetts and I have not had to reballast.

Works for me through rain, ice, snow, deep frost, etc.


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## Joe Johnson (Jan 2, 2008)

A couple of years ago I had a truck deliver a couple of yards of crushed granite from a local quarry and I built my self a screen from 1/4" screen and I sift it as I needed it. The bigger rocks just went into the path around the layout. 

I used chicken grit when I started but I don't recommend it because of a lack of fines. The fines help lock the track in place.


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## PatrickK (May 16, 2014)

I had a bunch of rock dust delivered to my house. The stuff is finer that the stuff you're considering, but I think it looks perfect for 1:29/1:32 railroads. The fine material sticks pretty good after sprinkling with water. Like most things in a garden railroad, ballast must be kept up. I keep a supply on hand for general repairs. Go with the smaller stuff for the realism.


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## Ironton (Jan 2, 2008)

Turkey grit number 2 looks really nice. Do not know what size it is though.


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## ukcollegestudent (Jun 5, 2014)

my g-scale train blows off the tracks when it is super windy- would a ballast help? I mean just fill the cars with rocks? would that help? any suggestions would be appreciated. if they are heavier and derail would it cause more damage? I have already had one engine stop working (i think it overheated) and I was afraid more weight would do the same to the other one.


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## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

A little more information would help. What scale, cars, locomotives, etc? Do you have metal wheels? How strong are the winds? I have been in this hobby for over 30 years and never had a train derailed by wind. More clarification will help.

Chuck

Ballast holds the track in place. Weight will hold the train on the track.


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

ukcollegestudent said:


> my g-scale train blows off the tracks when it is super windy- would a ballast help? I mean just fill the cars with rocks? would that help? any suggestions would be appreciated. if they are heavier and derail would it cause more damage? I have already had one engine stop working (i think it overheated) and I was afraid more weight would do the same to the other one.


You are talking a different kind of ballast... One, (the subject of this thread) are the rocks/gravel/stone that supports and stabilizes the track. The other (what you are referring to) is weight added to a vehicle to lower its center of gravity and make it more stable and less apt to fall over or to rock (not stone, but as as in get tipsy and no I don't mean "drunk", though that is the past tense of what someone does with alcohol to get drunk/tipsy and tend-to-fall-over... never mind).

BUT, to answer your question, yes, additional weight to cars will stabilize them and make them less apt to be blown around by wind, but, you are right in that the additional weight produces more load on the locomotive and the operator might apply more power and that may overheat the motors and burn them out.

I, personally, have never had a car blow off the rails, but then, I am a "fair weather Railroader" and don't play trains in rough weather (though as a Live Steam enthusiast I do run when it is raining -- uh -- lightly!).

To ballast my track I use granite chicken grit that is listed as "Medium Grit" that seems to range in size from 1/8 to 3/16 in size. The "Large" variety was about 3/16 to 1/4 inch in size and looked bad, and the "Small" was 1/16 to 1/8 and was just too small to look right.

I do load my train down to increase the drag so my locomotive will CHUFF louder, but I don't have to worry about overheating an electric motor or circuitry.


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## mgilger (Feb 22, 2008)

I would use the 1/2 as a base, then lay the rail and finish up by putting the 1/4 down. You did not indicate if you were laying this on the ground and if you were using grown cloth or not. 

In my case I used #8 limestone on ground cloth in a shallow trench. The #8 seems to be equivalent to your 1/2 inch as the base. After getting a good firm base I laid the track. Then using #9 limestone, equivalent to your 1/4 inch, I went around and lifted my rail up maybe 1/2 inch by hand while laying the #9 stone, giving it a nice crown on top of the base. Over time you will find you need to top off the 1/4 inch stuff as it's going to want to slip down into the larger stuff, but that's OK. It's just like working on a real RR and having to re ballast occasionally. 

Here's a picture of some track I just laid a few weeks ago. 










Regards,
Mark 
*http://mmg-garden-rr.webs.com/*


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## Trains (Jan 2, 2008)

I started with small chicken grit, kept washing away.
Went to screened pea gravel about 1/4" works good for me.









Don


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## ewarhol (Mar 3, 2014)

Chuck and SV-

1:29 is the scale I'm modeling. I'll be building the track on a spline roadbed made out of green treated 2x4's. This will be a temporary layout. My wife and I own a few acres we hope to build on in a few years. I'm taking the time now to learn with a small layout before building a larger garden layout.


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## White Deer RR (May 15, 2009)

I'm just using bags of paver base from a big box store. It's more like 5/8th max, but I'm in the Pacific Northwest, and it lasts longer. I would wager the color of this stuff must vary by region, but the stuff here is a nice light gray that I like.

I do have to pick some of the bigger rocks from the middle of the tracks by hand, but it all settles pretty well with some rain and some traffic. Nobody has ever walked back there and commented on my grossly out of scale ballast. ;-)

This is just for top dressing, and also having a small setup it's more convenient than trying to deal with a half pickup load of quarter minus. When I first got into this hobby I did buy a pickup load of quarter minus, and I put it down, so it must be out there in the back yard somewhere...

Obviously at some point bags become cost-prohibitive, but I don't have a place to store gravel, so I can keep a bag on hand for when I need it.


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## backyardRR (Aug 14, 2012)

It's nice to see someone else using paver base for roadbed/ballast. I did it 
because I couldn't find a nearby stone dealer who would deliver the smaller
quantities of crushed rock that I needed. When tamped down it sets up 
nice and firm and handled the past winter freeze without issue. 
Yes, it can be more expensive in the long run. 
I use Lowes paver base step 1 for the 3" roadbed. It is gray in color compared to HD, which is brownish, but the color could vary by region.
I didn't know what to do about the top dressing of ballast until recently when I bought some of Lowe's paver base step 2 for another project. It turned out to also be gray with scale appearing material that also has the plus of having rough edges to hold it in place. A section of track I tried it on
has held up well after several heavy rains. The stuff seems to stay in place.


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