# V-Dump Ore Cars



## Del Tapparo (Jan 4, 2008)

Rant ... I ordered a string of 6 Bachmann V-dump ore cars to go behind my LGB Diesel switcher. I have seen the ads for these things forever, and thought I knew exactly what I was ordering. Yes, they are labeled 1:20.3 scale ... but I still pictured them as being rather small. I was shocked when I opened the box. These things are 6 1/4" wide! A quick and very short run out on the layout proved that they won't even fit through my tunnel portals and they look way to big behind the LGB switcher. (They do look OK behind a Shay.) 

While I will concede that this is my fault, I think it would never had happened if the manufacturer could have just provided the slightest bit of information, i.e. specifications, for the product, like dimensions? While scale of 1:20.3 is a clue that this might me something larger than something in 1:22.5 scale, it doesn't tell me how big it is unless they provide the dimensions of the prototype. The near total lack of specifications for large scale products just continues to urk me!/DesktopModules/NTForums/themes/mls/emoticons/angry.gif" border=0>" /DesktopModules/NTForums/themes/mls/emoticons/angry.gif" border=0>"\ 
This is the type of thing that can really burn you ordering on the web, compared to your local hobby shop. See it, touch it, feel it.


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## Dennis Paulson (Jan 2, 2008)

Me too 
I cut about 1/2 or so off of the opening end to reduce the overhang , from hitting everything ...............and they were still some big cars . 
Traded them off .


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## altterrain (Jan 2, 2008)

Those suckers are huge. I use them for 7/8's (1:13.7 scale) and they're even a bit big for them. 

These figures are nearly 5 inches tall! 



















-Brian


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## Larry Green (Jan 2, 2008)

Del, 
If you had a PDF file for them, you could tweak the dimensions to get exactly what you want! 
About the only thing those cars look right behind is the 1:20.3 45 tonner--it may be scale, but it dwarfs everything else on the RR. Had to get one, anyway 

Larry


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## pdk (Jan 2, 2008)

Further to Brian... 

Yeah, even us 7/8ers were shocked. Luckily we had early warning from one of our brethren. 

I've seen hundreds of skip photos and never seen any prototype that large (bet I will now). No idea why they made them so gargantuan.


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## altterrain (Jan 2, 2008)

Pete, 

One of the 7/8's guys posted this page recently - http://www.rail.lu/wagonmines.html which had a few similar prototypes (one third the way down the page) like this one - 











-Brian


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## DKRickman (Mar 25, 2008)

Posted By Del Tapparo on 09/08/2008 7:24 PM
Rant ... Yes, they are labeled 1:20.3 scale .... These things are 6 1/4" wide!


A quick touch of the caulculator reveals that they scale out to 10' 6 7/8" 

That's as wide as, or wider than, modern standard gauge rolling stock! 
Was there really a 3' gauge v-dump that was over 10' wide? Or was this a fictictious creation of Bachmann, labelled 1:20.3 to make people think it's suitable for a scale railroad?


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## vsmith (Jan 2, 2008)

I seriously thought they were 7/8scale also when I first saw them, bought a mess of HLW ore cars instead.../DesktopModules/NTForums/themes/mls/emoticons/whistling.gif


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## Guest (Sep 10, 2008)

Posted By vsmith on 09/10/2008 12:03 PM
I seriously thought they were 7/8scale also when I first saw them, bought a mess of HLW ore cars instead.../DesktopModules/NTForums/themes/mls/emoticons/whistling.gif" border=0>




that would be my vote!


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## CCSII (Jan 3, 2008)

What's an "HLW?"


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## Guest (Sep 10, 2008)

http://h-l-w.com/ 
Hartland Locomotive Works...Made in USA to 1/24 (or thereabouts).....their stuff is tuff!!!! Great for little kid hands!


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## davidarf (Jan 2, 2008)

I was also very surprised at the size of these cars, but the chassis is so good I decided to cut mine down and now I am very pleased with them running with my Accucraft C16.


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## Dougald (Jan 2, 2008)

I was unable to locate a pic on short notice but ... 

I believe these cars are quite prototypical for modern (post 1970) open pit quarrying operations. I have also not checked my references for South American or Chinese ng but I doubt that such wide cars were used in regular mainline service. To give a sense of what we are looking at, consider the size of the dump trucks used in offroad open pit mining. 

B'mann hasw a penchant for producing unusual stuff especially in the industrial field. Since most large scale modelers are not very familiar with industrial equipment (beyond logging locos) it would help if they would publish some dims with their ads. At least they published the scale which is more than most advertisers publish. 

As an aside, most folks are very conditioned by the use of 1:22.5 or smaller scale combined with the choice of puny prototypes and often models shortened from the prototype. These same people are amazed at the size of a K-27 even though it is a small loco by sg practices and only the next step in modernizing had American ng survived in a viable commercial form. F scale is big ... 

Regards ... Doug


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## altterrain (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By davidarf on 09/11/2008 1:49 AM
I was also very surprised at the size of these cars, but the chassis is so good I decided to cut mine down and now I am very pleased with them running with my Accucraft C16. 





David, 

How did you cut them down? 

-Brian


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## davidarf (Jan 2, 2008)

Brian 

I cut about 5/16 inch off the top of each side with a razor saw and then glued 1/8 inch plastic angle to the outside of the cut edge to form a new lip. The tipper buckets were then sprayed with matt grey paint and touched up with spots of rust colour paint. 

I have a rake of 9 of the hoppers and so sawing them all by hand was a bit tedious, but once done I was pleased with the outcome and they now fit all my tunnel entrances. They ride the track really well - I think due to the very nice heavy metal chassis.


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## Dave Meashey (Jan 2, 2008)

I bought one of these cars in Fall of 2006. As others have posted, I was astonished at how large it was. I added the larger diameter wheels to mine and mounted the Kadee 830 coupler boxes to the top of the frame. This way it looks appropriate with the 7/8ths inch scale whimsical locomotive I use to pull it. 

I may eventually get another car to modify in the same way. The cars really seem to fit with 7/8ths inch scale equipment best. 

Yours, 
David Meashey


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## Del Tapparo (Jan 4, 2008)

Thanks for the tip David. I am in the process of cutting one down now. Looks like it will work out fine. 

And as an added benefit, my rotary tool, a Black and Decker "Wizard" bit the dust, so I went out and bought a real Dremel tool. I started out using a razor saw, but I think the Dremel with a cutoff disk is going to be easier. Just hack it off then clean it up with a file.


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## pdk (Jan 2, 2008)

All sounds logical, Doug. But like flying saucers and bigfoot. I'll believe it when I see some photos. 

 

Posted By Dougald on 09/11/2008 5:45 AM
I was unable to locate a pic on short notice but ... 
I believe these cars are quite prototypical for modern (post 1970) open pit quarrying operations. I have also not checked my references for South American or Chinese ng but I doubt that such wide cars were used in regular mainline service. To give a sense of what we are looking at, consider the size of the dump trucks used in offroad open pit mining. 
... Doug


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By pdk on 09/14/2008 7:59 AM
All sounds logical, Doug. But like flying saucers and bigfoot. I'll believe it when I see some photos. 
" border=0> 






Do you believe photos? 










That is me "IN" the cab of my Aster Mike!


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## Del Tapparo (Jan 4, 2008)

V-Dump Article Here is an update on my V-Dump ore cars. I wrote an article for the club newsletter describing how I cut them down to a reasonable size.


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## williep99 (Sep 19, 2008)

Altterrain,

I wanted to note your kitbashed dozer hauling the ore carts was well done.

Thanks, Bill


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## altterrain (Jan 2, 2008)

Thanks Bill. There's a thread on it somewhere in the Model Making forum or on my blog - http://www.grblogs.com/index.php/2008/08/02/rail-tractor-enterprise?blog=25. There's a minute long video of it in action on youtube (be sure to see it in high qualiity) - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OucW7TD6Ujw. -Brian


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## Bill4373 (Jan 3, 2008)

following Del's "V Dump" article, I cut my four cars down with my micro table saw. Smooth cuts. Now to glue on the strips, bash and paint them.


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## franck combe (Oct 26, 2008)

does anyone can indicate me the exact dimension of v dump cars ?


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## Del Tapparo (Jan 4, 2008)

The metal frame is 9 3/8" long (12 1/2" coupler to coupler) and 3 1/2" wide. The ore bucket is 6 1/8" wide, 5" long, and 2 7/8" deep. Entire car is about 4 7/8" tall from the rail.


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## Madman (Jan 5, 2008)

Posted By calenelson on 09/10/2008 12:39 PM
http://h-l-w.com/ 
Hartland Locomotive Works...Made in USA to 1/24 (or thereabouts).....their stuff is tuff!!!! Great for little kid hands! 












*Are you able to get Hartland stuff, especially the mini series cars? If so, where?*


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## franck combe (Oct 26, 2008)

thank for the detailed dimensions.

If I compared the v dump cars with the real german ones, it seems that he could comply with just with the biggest one v dumps but this model is very rare in Germany (for 7/8 scale)


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## Guest (Oct 29, 2008)

Posted By Del Tapparo on 09/26/2008 2:35 PM
V-Dump Article Here is an update on my V-Dump ore cars. I wrote an article for the club newsletter describing how I cut them down to a reasonable size.


*Del,
Thank you for that! Great write up to. Looks like I need to be in your club!
Toad
*


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## Trains West (Oct 4, 2008)

the cut down cars look good and look a lot like these prototype


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## Guest (Oct 30, 2008)

*Looks like the engine is slippn off the track abit.......







*
*Thanks for photos, where are they from?*
*Toad*


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## Trains West (Oct 4, 2008)

Henry Virginia.......


there is still track under there it is just hard to see


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## Bill4373 (Jan 3, 2008)

I followed Del's instruction sheet but cut mine down with a microsaw, cleaned the edges with an knife and file. The bucket now measures 4 1/4". I finished one of them, (hope the photo comes through). I used a heated carriage bolt to damage the inside. I'm not happy with it so I'm thinking about what else I can use.


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## samevans (Jan 3, 2008)

These are patterned after the On30 cars but it looks like someone's math went a little awry. Note also that the On30 ones are braked which is why the frame is asymmetrical (one end is longer), but the brake standard is not fitted to the 1:20.3 versions. In fact UK practice was to marshall so many standard (symmetrical) skips to one braked skip, if US practice is the same I am surprised that B'man chose tp model the braked version.

One solution is to purchase skip kits from Binnie Engineering in the UK . These are models of Hudson Rugga I cubic yard (27 cu ft) skips and are available in 45mm gauge. They are available in 45mm ga and are suitable for SMALL locos such as the B'mann Porters and the Davenport. The coupling heights will be lower than the standard 1:20.3 but then this would be the case on the prototype. The coupling would probably have been some form of link & pin. See


http://trains.laurells.net/kits/binnie.html

http://trains.laurells.net/kits/Pict3134m.jpeg


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## snowshoe (Jan 2, 2008)

Madman:



Wholesale trains seem to have the best prices when it comes to Hartland. Here is the link. http://www.wholesaletrains.com/GProducts2.asp?Scale=G&SPECIAL=0
I have bought a few of the Hartland flat cars with the Logs as well as others from the Mini series. Great little cars and very cheap, under 15 bucks. You just have to add metal wheels and change the hook and loop couplers. I also just ordered the flat cars for 14 and change. You cant beat that price especially when everyone else wants 30 or more bucks. Im becominh a hudge hartland fan.


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## dms1 (May 27, 2010)

Does anyone have a copy of the PDF file mentioned above? The link does not work for me.

Also, does anyone have a picture with a Bachmann V-Dump and Hartland V-Dump car side by side they could share?

Thanks


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## Naptowneng (Jun 14, 2010)

http://www.h-l-w.com/Products/Mining_set.html


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## dms1 (May 27, 2010)

I know where to see the HLW cars, I am asking if anyone has a photo of the HLW and Bachmann V-Dump cars side by side in the same picture.

Also looking for Dels PDF file.


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## vsmith (Jan 2, 2008)

dms1 said:


> I know where to see the HLW cars, I am asking if anyone has a photo of the HLW and Bachmann V-Dump cars side by side in the same picture.
> 
> Also looking for Dels PDF file.


I am out on the road today. If I can remember I'll take a pic when I am back. I have both. And yes, the Bmann cars are really huge...


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## Garratt (Sep 15, 2012)

I put the larger Bachmann metal wheels on my Bachmann V dumps and use them for 7/8ths. I may eventually put on some spoked ones. The left over little Bachmann metal wheels went on my LGB and Hartland V dumps. 
Interestingly, The V buckets swap with Hartland and LGB perfectly.

Andrew


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## vsmith (Jan 2, 2008)

Thanks Andrew.

BTW has anyone ever converted a Bmann v-dump to link pin couplers? I'm going to use LGBs but was wondering if anyone had done this already. The v-dumps seam to have a different mount.


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## CliffyJ (Apr 29, 2009)

Hartland Locomotive Works. Here's one of their ore cars:

http://h-l-w.com/Products/Miniseries/Mine-Ore-web.jpg


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## Garratt (Sep 15, 2012)

Vic I saw a simple conversion on the web which had perspex blocks bolted in place of the coupler box with a small 3 link chain which was attached to the other car with a shortened pop rivet dropped through a hole. I can't remember the exact detail. The only loose part was the pop rivet but easily replaced. I can't find the article now. 
You could get scale link n' pin fittings inside the existing coupler boxes but you would have to devise a way of springing them so they center. 
I am in the process of distressing my Bachmann V dumps and fitting putting link and pins for 7/8ths.
I have opted for the skeletal LGB V dumps and Bachmann wooden side dumps for my regular Large scale stuff. The Bachmann V dumps are just too ginormous.

This guy from Sri Lanka on eBay has 12 plastic link n' pin pockets for $6.50 including shipping.
Just have to attach them somehow. He also has plastic journals etc.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/G-Scale-Pla...019702?pt=Model_RR_Trains&hash=item23274a0cb6

Andrew


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## dms1 (May 27, 2010)

Garratt, Thanks for posting those pictures, that is exactly what I was looking for. 

I bought some of those link and pin coupler's from the guy in Sri Lanka, I haven't used them yet but the quality of the product looks good and I plan on using them. On the other hand I also bought the journals and I'm not sure I like them (I decided not to use them except maybe for decorations\clutter) and am trying to buy some journals from Hartford instead. The journals from Sri Lanka, the springs are decoration only and they are only 1/8" thick, not 1/4 inch thick like Ozark or Hartford journals.


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

I've bought both the sprung and un-sprung journals from Hartford Products and I've used them both for different cars. They're both good quality. I even drilled out the bolt holes in a couple of the journals, drilling through the square nuts that are cast on, so that I could attach them with pins or miniature screws instead of gluing them on. It's easier to get the wheels off the car if you need to if the journals are removable.


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