# Ruby kit bashing issues.



## StevenJ (Apr 24, 2009)

I have a problem. I'm adding running boards to my Ruby and had to repaint my firebox door twice. So far, I've been using duplicolor manifold paint. It just doesn't do the job though. The paint on the fire box door, everytime after I paint it, just keeps boiling up no matter what I do. I've tried lower flames, whatever. It doesn't happen immediately though and I do give the paint three or four days to cure minimum. What happens is, the paint will be fine for a minute or two after start up on the firebox door. Then as the heat builds and it reaches 40 psi, the paint starts to boil on the front of the smoke box door. I used high heat engine paint. Is dupilcolor a bad brand for this? What kind of paint should I be using?


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## Nick Jr (Jan 2, 2008)

Steve, I have has success with Duplicolor. I noticed on my cans it says to let it cure for 7 days. Different paint maybe?? Nick Jr


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## Chris Scott (Jan 2, 2008)

Maybe insulate the firebox inside, door and surrounding. Fiber blanket with brass back plate. Other option would be to call Cliff at Accucraft - he who knows all things.


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## therbert (Sep 18, 2008)

Rather than using engine paint, try using header paint. An engine block never gets beyond about 250ºF, but headers get much hotter -- being exposed to the direct heat of the exhaust flames, just like the heat coming out of the flue on your boiler. I think it might work better, and I think you get it in an aluminized formula, too, which should be very close to the factory color of the smokebox on the Ruby.

Tom


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## dwegmull (Jan 2, 2008)

Hi Steven, 
Are painting on the bare brass or over the factory paint? Stripping everything down to bare brass and using an appropriate primer before paint might help...


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## Bill4373 (Jan 3, 2008)

when "mom" isn't around, sit it in the dishwasher (cover gas burner). after the final rinse, take it out (don't touch it with bare hands) and let it air dry. 

If you want a black engine, use high temperature grill (charcoal/gas) paint. I used Krylon BBQ & Stove Paint, from Wally's. 

For color, I have used Dupli-Color Engine Enamel (good up to 500 degrees) 

No problem with either.


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## StevenJ (Apr 24, 2009)

Bill, I own my own place number one. Number two is that I do not own a dishwasher. I am letting it bathe in paint thinner. Thanks for the suggestions guys! To give some background, what happened originally is that the factory paint had all burned off. Then I repainted it and that paint burned off. Then I repainted again again, without clear coat, and it still burned off. The paint is duplicolor engine enamel for 500 degrees. Now the first time I painted it I did give it a week to cure but I used the clear coat. That clear coat is also duplicolor engine enamel for 500 degrees.

* UPDATE! I just repainted it again, for the last time with duplicolor, and will give it until next friday before I fire it up again. I'll let you guys know if it worked.


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## rbednarik (Jan 2, 2008)

Steve,

Having done quite a few smokeboxes over the years, I ill offer one word of advice. Make sure that the brass has a Key, that is, go out and get a scotch-brite pad and rough up as many areas as you can once all the paint is stripped off. A good alternative is to use a wire bristle brush. 

Primer is probably not a good idea for suck a high heat area, as most metal etching primers *will not* withstand over 300*F. With a well prepared surface, the engine block enamels will not lift once cured properly. To cure properly, place the part in the oven a few hours at a low temperature (180-200*F), this works well if you have a portable toaster oven, to reduce the fumes in the house. Be sure to prop the door open a crack to allow the fumes to escape. 



Although, if one fires up their engine after the paint has dried to the touch, you can handle the door with kid gloves throughout the run, the paint will fully cure on it's own after two runs. Just make sure not to toch the paint after it has gotten hot, as it will not have cured yet! Once it has cooled, the paint will be hard-shelled. This is why auto body shops (good ones anyway) use heating enclaves to cure the paint on the body of a resprayed vehicle. 

For example I have had my coal fired (formerly gas fired) ruby smokebox coated with cast coat iron engine block paint for quite a few years now and it is as strong as can be. No primer, just a good keying. Also, for that matter, the coal fired boiler (bare copper, no wrapper) was keyed, wiped and sprayed with a coating of regular rustoleum semi-gloss enamel black, no primer as well and is holding steadfast and looks as good as day one.


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## AzRob (Sep 14, 2009)

Hey Steven, I'm planning on doing running boards on my Ruby when I get it up and running. Do you have any pictures?


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## StevenJ (Apr 24, 2009)

I can take some pictures later. I glued them with jbweld it keeps breaking off with enough pressure. I may need to either screw them on some how or solder. rbednarik, I will try that with the toaster oven. Neat idea, thanks.


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## Bill4373 (Jan 3, 2008)

Tag Gorton, in his book, Live Steam Workshop suggests between 50-60 degrees C (125-135 F). This is a great book.


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## Bill4373 (Jan 3, 2008)

Posted By Bill4373 on 09 Oct 2009 11:43 AM 
Tag Gorton, in his book, Live Steam Workshop,suggests between 50-60 degrees C (125-135 F). This is a great book.


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## rbednarik (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Bill4373 on 09 Oct 2009 11:44 AM 
Posted By Bill4373 on 09 Oct 2009 11:43 AM 
Tag Gorton, in his book, Live Steam Workshop,suggests between 50-60 degrees C (125-135 F). This is a great book. 

Different temperatures for different paints. With duplicolor one is well within heat tolerance range for curing of the paint. Although with celluose or lacquer based thinners, the temperatures are probably less. Best to follow the manufactures instructions and curing times.


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## Eric M. (Jan 3, 2008)

I gotta say I disagree with the assumption that the problem lies with the paint.  I have painted 8 different live steam engines-- both gauge one and ride on.  Duplicolor engine paint has alway proven more than adequate to withstand the punishment that a smokebox dishes out. I have experienced the phenomenon you describe where the paint blisters or "boils" and the couple times it has happened it was because of inadequate surface prep.  I find that the paint is not boiling but the oils or moisture that get trapped under the paint boil causing the blistering.
 
The smokebox door on the ruby is a nice piece.. It is not a casting but rather a built up piece with separate dogs, bolts, rivets and hinge details that are all soldered on.   I have de soldered one so I know.  There are a lot of little crevices where moisture and oil can hide.  I would suggest stripping all the paint as David suggested.  You need to release all the contaminants that may be trapped under your layers of paint. At the very least your smoke box door needs to take a long bath in a strong solvent like acetone or lacquer thinner to degrease it. and then wash it with simple green and hot water and allow it to dry for days--preferably in a sunny spot so you are sure that the moisture has evaporated.  Prime it with engine primer and repaint with the Duplicolor engine enamel.
 
Regards,


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## mfslater (Feb 10, 2008)

Hi Listmates 

I'm looking for a spare set of Ruby wheels (all 4). 

Any offers?


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