# Help With SD70MAC and Dask-9



## krogerssolar (Jan 8, 2009)

Hi can anyone help me with this question? i would like to get a USA Train's SD70MAC has anyone put and SD70MAc and a Aristo Dash9 together and run them on battery power via a TE bat car.

Thanks Kevin


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## Stan Cedarleaf (Jan 2, 2008)

Kevin.......... First question would be ... Which TE are you going to use?

Then....... Yes, you can run them together but you will need to be able to have them run on the same speed curve. I don't know which locomotive runs faster.

If I were doing it, I would power both locomotives with the same battery source, put an AristoCraft REVOLUTION receiver in each locomotive (plug and play in the Dash ), set the speed curves and MU them together.

I'd probably run the Dash 9 behind the SD70 and power the SD70 with the front MU plugs on the Dash 9. There would be some additional wiring necessary inside the SD70, but it sure could be done.... 

I would recommend battery voltage at +/- 18 volts. The REVOLUTION is rated from 12-24 and doesn't like more than 24. Running those two large locomotives, I would highly recommend 5-8 amp hour batteries or more.

I'm running a matched [/b]set of FABBA's on one 14.8 Li-ion battery source using one REVOLUTION receiver to control them all. They're all wired together as one unit.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

If you do not want to add independent remote control (decoder each loco), you can add some diodes in series with the track pickup (or power input) on the faster loco... a very coarse way of speed equalization, but under load locos pretty much equalize out... running light is where most people test this and it's the worst case. 

We do not know if he meant the new TE or the old TE or the Trackside TE or the 75 MHz TE or what. 

Regards, Greg


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## krogerssolar (Jan 8, 2009)

Thanks Guys for the info What i would be Running or i should am running now is one Dash9 with a Track side TE put in a boxcar using a Lion Aristo 21.0 volt DC 2 amp Batt Ive been looking at the SD70 but im unsure how well the gearing and the speed difference are between the dash and the 70. 


also what might be the best loco the mu togther with dash-9's 


Thanks Kevin


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

First, please answer what model of TE you have.... I was trying to get you to come up with it with my last post. 

If you are going to run both from a battery car as you say, you would be better off to put a second battery in parallel. You won't get much run time with one on both locos... unless you are pulling very short trains. 

Don't worry about trying to select a loco to match speeds, even identical locos can run at different speeds... try the diode trick I gave you, cheap, easy to do and easy to reverse out. 

Regards, Greg


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## Stan Cedarleaf (Jan 2, 2008)

Kevin, as Greg posted, you will need to do some work with diodes or other controls to allow the SD70 and Dash 9 to run at the same speed. 

I might suggest you get another Dash 9 and run it with your TE. Also you might want to parallel 2 batteries to increase the run time, Two Dash 9's are going to draw the 2000 mAh 21.5 volt battery quite quickly and shorten your run time.

They will MU together using the trackside TE to power them both. It would be a very easy hookup and you would not need to take the locomotive apart as you would with the SD70.

That would be my choice.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

As Ed Headington mentioned in another post, he converted a USAT loco to battery without opening it up. 

It can be done easily as well as the diodes.... 

There are easy ways to accomplish what you want, and putting these 2 different locos together looks very cool. 

Regards, Greg


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## blueregal (Jan 3, 2008)

Greg and Stan i read above about paralleling batteries, i was told safer to series em is that true or not? Note you say they wiill last longer????? I have them wired in a series and then hooked to a bik-10 kit with charging jack. Just curious about the difference between parallel and series??? Regal


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## Jim Agnew (Jan 2, 2008)

Whatever you mu with the Dash 9, you will probably need to jumper the polyfuses in the Dash 9 to prevent nuisance trips.


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## Stan Cedarleaf (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By blueregal on 28 Aug 2009 10:53 PM 
Greg and Stan i read above about paralleling batteries, i was told safer to series em is that true or not? Note you say they wiill last longer????? I have them wired in a series and then hooked to a bik-10 kit with charging jack. Just curious about the difference between parallel and series??? Reg Regal... It depends on what voltage battery you are using. Let's say you're putting two 7.2 volt 2700 mAh packs in series to make 14.4 volts. That works out just fine for most conditions. You are doubling the voltage but the amperage remains at 2700 mAh. If you would wire them parallel, the voltage would remain at 7.2 but the mAh would increase to 5400.

When you put batteries in parallel, you increase the amp hour rating.... ie: putting two 2000 mAh batteries in parallel with increase them to 4000. Not increase the voltage.

When you wire them in series, the voltage will increase by double ie: wiring two 21.5 volt 2000 mAh batteries in series will increase the voltage to 43.0 volts but the amp hour rating remains at 2000. 

Hope this helps. It may sound a bit redundant.

Most of our trains will get real warm at 43 volts and most all the R/C controllers will burn out at that voltage. 

I ran 12 volt gel cel batteries in series to make 24 volts for some of my heavier locomotives. However, now that the Li-ions are getting much better, I've been running just 14.8 volt 4400 mAh packs with great success.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Neither series nor parallel is inherently safer. 

You need precautions whenever using batteries period, and what types of precaution depends on a lot of things, definitely another long-winded thread in itself. 

Back to our friend's problem, and remembering this is the beginners forum, 

Given the battery used and the load expected, I would parallel 2 of the same battery, with one diode on the plus side of each one to isolate each from the other. 

The power will still flow to the motor or whatever electronics are used. 

Regards, Greg


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## Stan Cedarleaf (Jan 2, 2008)

Kevin...... To support Greg's post, here's a very simple drawing comparing parallel and serial....


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## NTCGRR (Jan 2, 2008)

IF, you have lots of locos, I depower some (remove gear) and then mix manufactures. Two D-9s pull as much as anyone wants, so i depower my USATs. 
Here the 40-2 is the depowered unit and the D-9s are running off the battery car 









Here is two depowered units. 








Just a thought. 
I have one Mac 70 depowered in my BNSF lash up.


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## Dan Pierce (Jan 2, 2008)

If you demotor a loco, then you can make it the battery car!!!


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## NTCGRR (Jan 2, 2008)

Dan 
Depower means I simply remove the worm gear in the motor blocks so the wheels roll free. and turn off the motor switch. If I want to re install the gear its no problem. 
My battery cars usually goes with what ever unit train a lash up in pulling.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Marty, in USAT, the worm gear is an integral part of the axle, it holds the two axles halves together. You must remove and replace the entire axle if I am not mistaken. 

Also, I would guess that you make sure the internal wipers for the axle must be removed, since it would now be a single metal axle on both sides, and you would get a short between these pickup wires and the connectionto the pickups at the end of the axles. I guess you could also just unplug all wires from the end of the motor block. 

Is this what you do? and if so, what/whose axles did you use? 

Regards, Greg


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## SteveC (Jan 2, 2008)

If you're running at Marty's, you're running battery or live steam, or you're not running.


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## NTCGRR (Jan 2, 2008)

I guess if they wanted more info than the basic I figured they would ask. I did not want to push the thought if they wanted all powered units. 
And yes the worm gear is on the motor,either way you need to pull it. 
Those of us who came from HO scale and ran many dumby units have no problem with depowering a 1:29th unit.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Ahh, gotcha MArty... have never pulled the worm off the motor shaft, do you have a special puller? Is it real difficult? Just wondering. 

Sounds like the easiest method though. 

Regards, Greg


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