# Annie & Clarabel have a meltdown



## JackM (Jul 29, 2008)

A warning lest this happen to you.

I expect my 2-yr old granddaughter will be visiting this weekend, so I put Thomas, Annie and Clarabel in the "Crystal Train Yard" to surprise her. They've been sitting there only four days. Thomas is okay, but this wasn't the surprise I expected.












My Buffalo Creek box cars - and all my other rolling stock - have sat in the yard for two years (basement in winter) with absolutely no problem, so it never entered my mind. Admittedly, it's 90 degrees today; relatively uncommon for Upstate New York. 

This was a three-car set (Thomas, Annie and Clarabel) that I got for a bit over $100 at Hobby Lobby last fall. Thomas is okay; he must be made of sturdier plastic; the bodies of the cars are fine, just the tops are warped. Guess we'll leave the tops off and find a few little people to enjoy the ride.

JackM


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## benshell (Oct 1, 2008)

Wow, I'm sorry to see what happened to them. I'm glad to know about this though. I'll have to be careful to avoid keeping Annie and Clarabel around too much heat!


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## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

Try turning them over and see if they will flatten out. It may not work, but it might be worth a try.

Chuck


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## NTCGRR (Jan 2, 2008)

Thats my thought turn them over on a flat board. 
I would use paint to cut down on UV rays, this may be a warning to you of things to come.


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## JPCaputo (Jul 26, 2009)

You may add a vent or 2 at the peak of the roof. That way there will be a flow of air to keep the temp down.


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## Jethro J. (Apr 4, 2012)

Jack,

What you can do is grab a cookie sheet and line it with Alum foil. Lay the roof on it. Pre heat your oven to 350 and place 
the cookie sheet with roofs in it till the roofs staighten out, about 5 minutes or so.

Jethro


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

I would assume it has never gotten 90 in your basement! Also, if you had a thermometer, you would have found that the air trapped inside was significantly higher than 90. 

The clear plexi allows the ir waves to penetrate, and they heat the contents and the air is trapped. As an added benefit, as Marty alluded to, plexi allows the UV waves to penetrate also, which will definitely fade the paint. 

Quite a difference from a cool basement not in the sun. I'd avoid storing anything when it is sunny unless it's really cold. Since you already built this, why not get some of that heat reflective tinting material applied to the inside, the stuff they put on house windows to reflect light, heat and UV? 

Greg


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## JackM (Jul 29, 2008)

Rather than take up a big bunch of bandwidth by reprinting stuff from last July, here's the link to the original thread regarding my "Crystal Rail Yard": 

http://www.mylargescale.com/Community/Forums/tabid/56/aff/9/aft/121327/afv/topic/Default.aspx#235982 

Scroll down to find the answers to your doubts. I answer all questions further down. 

Or, here's one para graph that pretty well sums it up: 

I used the width of the hinge part of the hinges (don't know how else to describe it) to make sure I mounted all three hinges at the same height, and took advantage of the same part of the hasps, so there's a 1/2 inch gap between the top of the side panels and the curved roof. This gives it plenty of ventilation. On one of the mid 90s days we had last week I used my (HF) Infrared Thermometer to measure temp of ballast, rolling stock, etc. I shot the beam thru the space between side and roof. I couldn't find more than a five degree differrence between anything inside or out of the shed. I've never seen and moisture collect on the inside of the Lexan, etc. I guess that space is much like the vents in the roof of your house. Very pleased with that. And I doubt the moles, voles or chipmonks would be able to climb up the smooth surface and squeeze inside. 

And, as I said at the top of this thread, all my other rolling stock is in permanent storage here, except in winter, and there is NO evidence of fading or any other maladies; nb. the Buffalo Creek box cars next to the Thomas train. Also, my custom-painted motive power similarly show NO fading. It's only the cheapo Annie & Clarabel roofs that have a problem. 

So before I leave for work today I'll put the two roofs on the patio table, upsidedown (the roofs, not the table), with a brick on each. Another 90+ degree day today, so that should rectify the problem. PITA, tho. 

Thanks for your thoughts. 

JackM


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## krs (Feb 29, 2008)

Sorry JackM

I had to laugh when I saw the picture:










The expression of Annie's face (eyes) is so appropriate..."Oh my God, look what happened to my roof!"

Why not go back to Bachmann to get a replacement, I would consider this a product defect.
These trains are made to run outside and should be able to handle a bit of heat.
Since your other rolling stock was stored under the same conditions and is fine, seems pretty obvious that the material used for the roof of the Annie was inappropriate.

Knut


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## JackM (Jul 29, 2008)

Knut - 

Pretty much the same expression that I had. 

Warranty replacement is next on my list of possibilities after I looked more seriously at the underside of the roof. Re-flattening it in the sunshine or oven seems improbable. 

Unbelieveably, there is a spine running down the length of the roof presumably, one would think, to prevent the curve it now has. A brick won't work. Maybe piling on stones on either side of the spine. Better if I can just mail them back to Bachman for replacement. Of course, USPS charges extra for packages that aren't FLAT!!!!! 

JackM


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## krs (Feb 29, 2008)

JackM, 

Would you even have to go to the expense to mail back the defective roof(s)?

I would expect that a call to customer support, then maybe email them a few pictures, should get you free replacements in the mail. 

Knut


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## toddalin (Jan 4, 2008)

These are a fantasy. Make "lemonade." Maybe even cut off the vertical supports to accentuate the curvature and make it look like it belongs.

Obviously Annie and Clarabelle were fed up with the "Troublesome Trucks" and "blew their lids." You now have a "one off" unlike anyone elses. Run with it!

If it really bothers you, get a couple replacements that you can put on.


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

My opinion is that the roofs did not "melt and sag" but rather the heat caused an outgassing from the upper surface and that caused it to shrink which is why the ends of the roof are raised. If they had melted and sagged, the center would be depressed, but the ends would not have moved upwards. 

Turning them over with a weight on them may not do much. If you turn them over so the bottom surface does the same outgassing in the sun's heat might straighten them out, but they will have shrunk instead of just straightened and may not fit too well then.


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## DKRickman (Mar 25, 2008)

It doesn't look as though those roofs should be to hard to make from scratch, if you're so inclined. Wood, styrene, even cardstock (properly varnished, of course) should be easy enough to form to that simple curve. Cut the ventilator details off and glue them to the new roofs.


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## Dave Meashey (Jan 2, 2008)

Obviously I have forgotten most of my high school physics (50 year class reunion in 2013), but something concerning the behavior of those roofs doesn't sit right with me. I would have expected them to bow up in the center from the heat. The flat plates to hold them inside the carbodies can clearly be seen in the photo. Excessive heat = expansion = retainer plates press against carbody ends = roofs bow in the middle. Ain't working that way. We have been given information in the past that the PRC manufacturers like to re-use plastics, sometimes grinding up and blending dissimilar types of plastic. Could the sway-back result be caused by dissimilar materials fighting each other during expansion? THAT would definitely be deficient QC.

Just my $0.02,
David Meashey


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## ChrisS (Apr 5, 2012)

i dont know about the oven at 350*, but maybe really hot water..... and let them slightly soften. thats what i use to straighten warped resin castings...


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## JackM (Jul 29, 2008)

I have emailed Bachman so maybe they'll make good on the roofs. 

Looking at them more carefully, I noticed that most of each roof is as it should be, straight. It's only the ends - maybe an inch or two - that warped up. Rather than bricks, ovens, etc., if Bachman won't supply two replacements, under warranty or otherwise, I'll get out the trusty ol' heat gun and make like those glassmakers down at the Corning Glass Works. Heat & pound, heat & pound, dip in water. Oh wait - that was a blacksmith. 

JackM


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## K27_463 (Jan 2, 2008)

All injection molded plastic has internal stresses that are a result of the molding and cooling process. how a molded part will behave when heat is applied is completely unpredictable. These roofs warped under a heat effect from the sun on the plex car barn roof. The instructions previously offered to use 350 degrees on a cookie sheet are completely wrong. This will result in a complete blob of distorted plastic. It is possible to return these roofs to the original shape, with a muiti step process and using clamps, weights,metal straight edges, and wooden forms to correct each bend or curve one at a time. 125 or 150 degrees for just a few minutes is more like it. Ask me how I know this. It will still be subject to failure overall because as heat is applied, new fail points are likely to appear as the existing warps are removed.. Since the shape is so simple, likely easier to make new ones.


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## toddalin (Jan 4, 2008)

Is there an internal "spine" that may have expanded at a differential rate than the plastic outsides causing the outward curve?


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## Del Tapparo (Jan 4, 2008)

Posted By JackM on 21 Jun 2012 03:09 PM 
I have emailed Bachman so maybe they'll make good on the roofs. 


E-Mail ? Ha ! Good luck on even getting a reply to your e-mail, much less getting replacement roofs. (Just speaking from my experience, and a friends most recent experience.)


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## Dan Pierce (Jan 2, 2008)

I was able to straighten a dirty roof by LGB by placing it in the dishwasher to clean it (great for crevices getting clean) and after the start of the drying cycle, I removed the roof and hand bent it back to the original shape. When it cooled it held the sape. 

Now what will happen in the outdoors on a hot day, I will have to wait and see. Maybe I should have glued it in place!! 

Side note... LGB has screws at the middle and ends of their long cars to hold the roof in place. Maybe they knew something about possible warping????


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## JackM (Jul 29, 2008)

For those better versed in high school physics than I, here's the underside. Speculate all you like. 












JackM


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## reeveha (Jan 2, 2008)

I haven't found Bachmann very responsive when e-mailed. You may get a response in 2-3 months. 

Call them and find out if you can just email pictures of the tops instead of returning them.


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## Gary Armitstead (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By JackM on 22 Jun 2012 05:35 AM 
For those better versed in high school physics than I, here's the underside. Speculate all you like. 












JackM
Jack,

My suggestion would be to go over to the Bachmann site and post your situation with pictures. "The Bachmann" might get you some resolve. You're way off the mark over here. You need a DIRECT contact with Bachmann. AND YES, they are terrible about answering e-mails IMOH.


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## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

and I might add having spare parts. I have found that sometimes they do, but most often don't. Either call them, or post on the Bachmann large scale forum on their site.

Bachmann large scale forum 

Chuck


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