# The NS Track Seems to Have Solved the Problems of Stainless Steel



## toddalin (Jan 4, 2008)

As I noted in a prior thread (that I would have posted to, but the search function doesn't work as it should), Dave Bodner was having a problem with trains starting on a section of stainless steel track at the children's hospital.  He changed that 3' section out for nickel silver.  Since the change over,

"The good news is that we have had no reports of problems since I replaced the one 3' section of isolated stainless track with the LGB nickle silver track over a week ago. 

No news is good news, I guess!"  
So there it is!  Draw you own conclusions.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Actually that is not nickel silver track, but brass track plated with nickel, big difference. Nickel silver does oxidize, pure nickel does not. 

Interesting the difference between stainless and Nickel. I hope you keep us informed, and it might just be because it is new, that the stainless somehow pitted, and the nickel plating may follow suit in the future. 

Regards, Greg


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## toddalin (Jan 4, 2008)

Posted By Greg Elmassian on 30 Jul 2009 12:29 PM 
Actually that is not nickel silver track, but brass track plated with nickel, big difference. Nickel silver does oxidize, pure nickel does not. 

Interesting the difference between stainless and Nickel. I hope you keep us informed, and it might just be because it is new, that the stainless somehow pitted, and the nickel plating may follow suit in the future. 

Regards, Greg 





No, the NS is the old track from the old layout before the change over to SS that is new and has been "well polished."


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

My mistake, I forgot they used to have NS track. Well, it's probably great quality metal. 

I would be interested to see if it does not "collect" the dry carbon "dust" as I find on my stainless. It does not seem to hamper my operation. 

I forgot what the loco was (interested in the driver tire composition), do you remember? 

Regards, Greg


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## toddalin (Jan 4, 2008)

Posted By Greg Elmassian on 30 Jul 2009 12:57 PM 
My mistake, I forgot they used to have NS track. Well, it's probably great quality metal. 

I would be interested to see if it does not "collect" the dry carbon "dust" as I find on my stainless. It does not seem to hamper my operation. 

I forgot what the loco was (interested in the driver tire composition), do you remember? 

Regards, Greg 

I believe it is an LGB Staintz.


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## SE18 (Feb 21, 2008)

I have used nickle silver outside in the past, code 148 from BK or BKS? can't recall the initials. It oxidized like crazy, despite reading in an old garden RR book that NS is the best rail to use. 

OTOH, I have some 3-rail NS from MTH RealTrax (approx. code 250) that I've used outside that has had minimal oxidation. 

I am guessing that NS can have many grades and composite ratios.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

I have had the same varied experience with NS, my first experience was in the 60's on HO, it was marginally better than brass. 

There's all grades of NS, just like the differences in grades of brass, and also that of stainless steel. I have had experience with 3 kinds of brass, and 2 kinds of stainless, and now one type of nickel plated brass in G scale. 

Regards, Greg


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## Totalwrecker (Feb 26, 2009)

According to Wikipedia, the NS Oxide IS conductive.... 

So unless there are conditions for oil to attract dirt to the railhead you shouldn't need to clean it s often.... 

not counting; bird poop, leaves, my gandy dancers' peanut mounds..... still too skitterish to ride a moving gon so far.... lol 

John


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## SE18 (Feb 21, 2008)

that may be true in the lab but not outside. i think you might be on to something, however, about dirt, it may be some sort of interaction between the oxidation and dirt, where dirt and oxy molecules combine. I had trouble with the 148 code and train operation and to confirm, I tested the track with ohm meter.

The whole experience soured me to track power and I went r/c battery. Sometimes, when bad things happen, some good comes out of it. No track cleaning worries anymore.


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## Totalwrecker (Feb 26, 2009)

SE, 
Been playing with trains since I can remember... well over 50 years.... I remember the push to NS when I was in HO.... for me it was always cosmetic... it looked more realistic. That's why I get to experience chinese unquality in Stainless! To my eye (and in my opinion) brass looks toylike. Was as a teenager when I joined a large HO club with a layout at a hobby shop in Long Beach Ca, gleaming and weathered NS rail was the only thing allowed. 

My thoughts on dirt is more of a physical obstacle than molecular.... I had an issue with black ants; their bodies would crush just fine, but were thick enough to lift the wheels. Taking on a double breasted army of 'em would stop my trains. 

Awhile back we had a thread on cleaning track, I followed one suggestion and tried some snake oil...er.. smoke oil... hated the wheel slip... the next day the wind blew in grit, the loco wobbled! 

John


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Good point SE18... 

The only thing that really counts is outside in the elements, and it varies across the country. 

Regards, Greg


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## tacfoley (Jan 3, 2008)

All I know is that my B-i-L and I have had 00/H0 PECO N/S track outdoors here in UK since around 1959, althought it was partly replaced in 1979. Same stuff though.

tac
www.ovgrs.org


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Same name, but no guarantee it's the same alloy, quality, or manufacturing process.... 

Regards, Greg


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## toddalin (Jan 4, 2008)

The primary problem that we face on the T&LBRR is that in the evening the resistance between the rails drops way down such that this becomes a factor in running trains and they can start to buck. Because our track sits in damp ballast (with a high iron content) and natural vegetation that gets watered twice daily (with a high mineral content) the resistance between the rails can get quite low and become a current draw of itself. The other day I measured just 500 ohms between the rails at 2:06 pm, 156 ohms at 5:06, 140 ohms at 7:00 and the readings got weird around 8:00 pm after running trains.


I wonder if track that doesn't corrode, or has a conductive oxide could be even worse because it has a greater contact area to the soil that is conductive.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

I have a similar problem, watering like you do. I just run more amps ha ha ha! 

I'll have to measure my rail to rail, but 140 ohms is pretty low... do earthworms pop out of the soil around your place? 

Regards, Greg


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## toddalin (Jan 4, 2008)

Posted By Greg Elmassian on 01 Aug 2009 07:14 PM 
I have a similar problem, watering like you do. I just run more amps ha ha ha! 

I'll have to measure my rail to rail, but 140 ohms is pretty low... do earthworms pop out of the soil around your place? 

Regards, Greg Gets a lot lower than 140 ohms.







You have to realize that this is inclusive of about the full 600 feet of track. Like I said, things get weird after the sun goes down and I was getting readings so low that the "continuity" buzzer would come on.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

I only have about 450, but a fair amount is elevated, and the switchyard is on hardibacker.... does the resistance go up after you hose the rails down? plain water seems to be fine, but dust/dirt seems to have the conductive elements in it. 

Regards, Greg


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