# Need sound system help.



## kml928 (Aug 23, 2009)

Hi,
I plan on buying a USA Trains Pennsylvania F3 AB engine set (or maybe just A unit) and I want to figure out in advance what sound system to get.

I have read alot about DCC but would like to stay away from it for now bc it seems very complicated.

But I do want a sound system like the QSI that I can get a QSI train commader unit with that can manually control the bell / horn and lots of other functions using a DC transformer/controller.

It says the loco needs to be QARC ready, I do not even know what this means or how to find this out in advance before I buy the loco set I mentioned above.

Basically what I want is not to spend alot to start (the QSI sound system and controller are within my budget). I want the train to have automatic prime mover sounds that increase and decrease along with the throttle from the controller but I would like something similar to this QSI controller where you can manually sound the bell / horn and other fuctions with buttons and not magnets under the track like some sets where the sounds are automatically played at a predetermined time / spot.

If the USA Trains locos are not available to use the QSI system what else is out there that is similar without going to DCC which I dont know much about and seems alot more involved?

I will be running these on a small indoor wall layout.


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## eheading (Jan 5, 2008)

A lot of us are using the new Aristo Revolution Train Engineer for control, coupled with the Phoenix soundboard. With a USA engine, you'll have to do some wiring, but it is VERY straight forward. Those of us who use this combination all seem to be very pleased with the results. I'm sure others will share with you what you have to do to use the QSI system.

Ed


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## N1CW (Jan 3, 2008)

*HI kml928*

*







*

*As Ed pointed out, you will have to do some electrical work for now..short answer.*

*Since you have not bought the USA engine yet,*
*I would sugguest you look at Aristo's FA-1 in Pennsy colors.*
*It already has the Plug-n-Play socket for the QSI board.*
*It will NOT require electrical work and handles 4' curves *
*since you will have a small inside layout.*


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

One advantage of the QSI is that if you switch to DCC at some point, the decoder will work under DCC. DCC isn't complicated, once you work with it a bit. But it's expensive. The upfront initial costs have kept me away from it. I'm currently using QSI in 5 locos, controlling them by Airwire using a constant 21 volts DC on the rails. So I'm using DCC, but sending control signals over the air rather than over the rails.


Installing QSI in a USAT loco will involve some wiring work, although QSI has been developing a plug and play board for USAT locos and it's supposed to be released this Fall sometime. I've been waiting at least nine months. When will it actually be released? Who knows? In the meantime, the Aristo is not a bad choice--the QSI Aristo boards just drop right into the socket. Could not be easier. You just hook up the speaker and you're done




The Quantum engineer gives you a really remarkable degree of control over sound and it's cheap. It's a good option for DC and much better than track magnets!


Also "QARC ready" just refers to having a QSI decoder--installing the QSI decoder will allow it to work with the Quantum engineer


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## kml928 (Aug 23, 2009)

Thanks for the replies guys, I am dead set on the F3 PRR Brunswick unit, it's my fav of all time so I am definaltely going with that. 

I would be willing to look into the Aristo controller using the Phoenix sound system. If you guys could post some more info or direct me with some links for more info that would be great. The main thing is I just want to manually control the bells / horn myself when needed but have the engine revs and running sound be automatic. 

If I have to go DCC for that I guess I will but with DCC can I run an ABA set all at the same time if each unit is powered? I was told DCc only controls one loco at a time and I plan to get the matching USA Trains AB set eventually to run it as ABA even though I will just run the sound only in the lead A unit. 

Sorry if I am making this difficult to understand I am very new to this.


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## kml928 (Aug 23, 2009)

Wow so they are planning a plug and play board? That would be great bc I really want to start off staying with DC and trying something like their quantum engineer controller with the sound system. 

I wouldn't mind waiting a few months if they are releasing that board by end of 09 sometime. 

For their current units what exactly is involved in the wiring?


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## eheading (Jan 5, 2008)

Actually, either the DCC or the Aristo Revolution will allow you to run multiple engines together, all powered. Regarding the Aristo and Phoenix systems, you can go to the Aristocraft website, and on the left side, select manuals, and you can bring up the Revolution manual. It has wiring diagrams that show you how to connect the Revolution to any engine, even if it doesn't have a plug-n-play socket.

Ed


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

I was new to this a couple years ago--took me forever to figure it out!

On DC you can more than one loco at a time by dividing the track into "blocks" which are electrically isolated from each other. You switch the power to various blocks on and off, and in that way stop one engine and allow another to run. It works but it's a pain--tons of wiring. It's cheap to do and you can run locos straight out of the box


An alternative is to remotely control each engine. You do this by putting a decoder in each loco. The decoder either gets signals over the air, or over the rails. 



Lots of people like to run their engines on batteries. Put a decoder in the engine, install batteries, and then control the loco with a wireless remote. You never need to clean the track!



You can also run wireless remote powered by the track. The engine gets DC power from the rails, and command signals from the wireless. This is what I do. It's easy and relatively cheap



DCC sends command signals over the rails, as a series of digital pulses. It has a number of advantages but high initial cost. It's really sophisticated and lets you control just about every aspect of the way the loco runs. It's possible to send the DCC signals over the air--this is also what I do.


The new Aristo Revolution system is relatively inexpensive and pretty sophisticated. It works especially well with batteries but requires some additional equipment to run well with track power or to add sound



Sound

QSI has sound and motor control integrated in one card. The sounds are excellent and they respond really nicely to the load the loco is under. The Phoenix card is sound only--you wire it to the decoder. Phoenix sounds are really excellent as well, probably the best all around.

I did a lot of research and concluded that it was cheaper to buy a single QSI card, with sound, than it was to buy a Revolution decoder and a Phoenix soundboard. In the long run, if you end up running more than 5-6 locos, DCC is probably cheaper. But it's depends on a bunch of other variables


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

Posted By kml928 on 24 Aug 2009 06:23 AM 
Wow so they are planning a plug and play board? That would be great bc I really want to start off staying with DC and trying something like their quantum engineer controller with the sound system. 

I wouldn't mind waiting a few months if they are releasing that board by end of 09 sometime. 

For their current units what exactly is involved in the wiring? 

Greg Elmassian has a little info on the QSI plug and play board on his site:

Greg's page--lots of info here 

Greg is a regular poster here and will sign in eventually


Basically you need to bring all the track power leads to two wires and all the motor leads to two wires. When I converted a USAT 44 tonner I ended up 
ripping out all the USAT boards and wiring the decoder directly. I took all the track power wires, tied them together into two wires (right and left rail) and then took all the motor control wires and tied them into two wires (positive and negative). The QSI board comes with screw terminals--you wire the track power leads into two terminals, the motor lead into two other terminals, and the lighting leads into two more. It's not rocket science, but it's not exactly fun either. I've been holding off buying some USAT locos, waiting for the QSI plug and play board. You can email QSI and ask them when it will be ready--bugging them can't hurt!


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## Torby (Jan 2, 2008)

We have a pair of those F3s at the botanic in B&O blue. You'll like them! I think Dave put Phoenix in them. If you can follow a wire and instructions, installing any sound in them will be easy. Our Aristo F1s are old work horses. They keep going and going.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Remember that the Quantum Engineer (the remote control for all the sounds in DC mode) has an advertised rating of 2.5 amps, and will run 3-3.5 amps.... Two locos might be pushing it, one USAT loco will be fine. 

If you use a QSI now, get the connectors from all electronics, and there will be no cutting or soldering. route the track pickups wires into the QSI, and the output to the motors to the motors and the original board. 

That will run the lights and motors from the QSI. If you buy the $1.50 connectors from All electonics, then you can unplug your QSI and return the loco to stock wiring in about 30 seconds. 

(All the wires from the pickups and motors have quick disconnect "JST style" connectors. 

Regards, Greg


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## eheading (Jan 5, 2008)

Greg has good advice (as usual). His advice concerning Allelectronics connectors applies to whichever system you select to go with.

Ed


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## kml928 (Aug 23, 2009)

Posted By Greg Elmassian on 24 Aug 2009 10:19 AM 
Remember that the Quantum Engineer (the remote control for all the sounds in DC mode) has an advertised rating of 2.5 amps, and will run 3-3.5 amps.... Two locos might be pushing it, one USAT loco will be fine. 

If you use a QSI now, get the connectors from all electronics, and there will be no cutting or soldering. route the track pickups wires into the QSI, and the output to the motors to the motors and the original board. 

That will run the lights and motors from the QSI. If you buy the $1.50 connectors from All electonics, then you can unplug your QSI and return the loco to stock wiring in about 30 seconds. 

(All the wires from the pickups and motors have quick disconnect "JST style" connectors. 

Regards, Greg 

Ok, I do have a question regarding the amps, I plan on running the ABA setup, but only one of the locos (the lead F3) with sound. Now, if I only am using the Quantum Engineer to run the sound via DC in that single lead loco, can I still run the ABA lashup off the main transformer with no problems as long as the transformer to control the train movement is powerful enough to handle the 3 locos? 


I definately am only going to run the sound from one unit for now, mainly bc of the cost. 

Keith


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Why thank you Ed! 

If you search my site for connectors, you will find this page: 

http://www.elmassian.com/trains-mai...nics-mainmenu-225/misc-electronics/connectors 

and the connectors on the top are the ones you need. I like the idea of not "cutting into" the wiring if I can... 

If you get stuck, I can help a bit... it's actually not all that difficult, but if you have never done it, a few words and pictures can help you a lot. 

Regards, Greg


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## TonyWalsham (Jan 2, 2008)

Keith. 

The answer is *NO* to powering an ABA lash up. 

The Quantum Engineer claims to handle a total of 2.5 amps continuous. 
Period. 
That total includes *all* the locos that will be powered on the track. Plus lighted cars etc.


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

The more locos you run, the more power, the more current is drawn from the power supply and throttle. "Amperage" is the term used to describe the amount of current being drawn. USAT locos tend to draw a lot of current, a lot of amperage. Lights in locos and in passenger cars draw more amps (although if the lights are LEDs they draw very little). Pulling long trains draws more amps, and pulling up steep grades draws more amps. Sound draws some amps too. 

I really don't know if the Quantum Engineer is capable of running what you want. Tony says no, Greg seems to say yes: I suspect it would depend on what else you are running. It's common to use a 10 amp power supply, but it's also been my observation that people on this forum are aiming for perfection and tend towards overkill. I'm guessing it would be fine with an A unit and an unpowered B unit, but three F3's would be too much, and two would be pushing it. But Greg and Tony know more than I do


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## kml928 (Aug 23, 2009)

Posted By TonyWalsham on 24 Aug 2009 04:52 PM 
Keith. 

The answer is *NO* to powering an ABA lash up. 

The Quantum Engineer claims to handle a total of 2.5 amps continuous. 
Period. 
That total includes *all* the locos that will be powered on the track. Plus lighted cars etc. 

I'm really confused now, if the Quantum Engineer is only to control the sound effects to a sound system, wouldnt the power to run the actual locos still come from whatever power pack/controller you are hooking it to that controls the actual movement of the locos?

I thought since only one A unit will have a sound system installed the Quantum Engineer is just used as an add on to your existing power pack to run/trigger the sounds through the wires / rails to that sound system in the loco.


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## TonyWalsham (Jan 2, 2008)

The Quantum Engineer has to carry the *total* current being used by whatever is on the track. Not just the power being used by the sound loco. It was designed for H0. Not Large Scale. 

Another thing you need to realise.
As the QSI sound bleeds off the first 5 - 6 volts to allow an idle voltage for the sound, the non QSI equipped A & B units will always want to start sooner than the QSI equipped A unit does. The only way around that is to equip all units with a QSI sound.


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## aceinspp (Jan 2, 2008)

Actually just bite the bullet and do the DCC . Lownote has now spent about as much as for paying for a good DCC system. In the long run you are money ahead. Later RJD


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## kml928 (Aug 23, 2009)

Ok, well I think I understand now. 

I dont need a handheld wireless unit, I am only setting up a single room wall layout, very simple, at the most it may run through portals through a few rooms but thats it. 

Is there a tabletop wired power pack/controller that will allow push button activation of the bells / horns? Just something similar to the Quantum that would work with the setup I want to run? I dont care how many wires, ect, I just dont want to have to place track magnets to sound the bells and horn at predetermined points which would get very annoying.


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## kml928 (Aug 23, 2009)

With the Aristo Train Engineer (CRE-55470) does that come with everything you need? If not, what else will I need to set it up? And do you have to intall something inside each loco using this unit if I would run the ABA set?


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Posted By kml928 on 24 Aug 2009 06:17 AM 
Thanks for the replies guys, I am dead set on the F3 PRR Brunswick unit, it's my fav of all time so I am definaltely going with that. 

I would be willing to look into the Aristo controller using the Phoenix sound system. If you guys could post some more info or direct me with some links for more info that would be great. The main thing is I just want to manually control the bells / horn myself when needed but have the engine revs and running sound be automatic. 

If I have to go DCC for that I guess I will but with DCC can I run an ABA set all at the same time if each unit is powered? I was told DCc only controls one loco at a time and I plan to get the matching USA Trains AB set eventually to run it as ABA even though I will just run the sound only in the lead A unit. 

Sorry if I am making this difficult to understand I am very new to this. 

OK, looks like confusion.

DCC is the best system to run multiple locomotives period. Works better, more features, etc. To control multiple locos as one unit, whether they are at the front, back, in the middle or all 3 places, is called consisting. No system does this as well as DCC... This is one of the many distinguishing features of DCC.

Anyone telling you that DCC only controls one loco at a time is uninformed or is trying to put it down. Maybe you are meaning to say that people say you need a decoder in each locomotive. That is normally true. Trying to share a single decoder between 2 locos is not normally done, and cannot be done with the output power of the QSI, definitely not 3 locos.


You got a lot of good advice already, one comment that the QSI will have a higher starting voltage than non-QSI locos. This is true on DC track power.

If I understand your requirements now, you want to pay the least, you are happy just running the bell and whistle, you want to run on DC.

You will have 1 to 3 USAT units.

If you had one USAT unit, then a QSI, and the Quantum Engineer will be great, and low cost, and easy to install.

Two locos will complicate your life unless you put a QSI in each (the QE will handle the load if you do not have a huge train or grades).

You could also just pull the motors from the B and or the second A unit, make them dummies, then a single QSI and the QE will still be optimal.

When you want to run ABA and sound, and remote control of sound, you have to forget sounds in all the locos.

If you want this, then you could run the Aristo TE wireless, and a Phoenix in the first loco, and TE receivers in the B and the trailing A unit...

This I think might be the lowest cost.




Hope this helps a bit... you really have to decide where you are going, and buy the RIGHT system for the future, making the wrong decision now just wastes a lot of money.

Regards, Greg


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

Posted By kml928 on 24 Aug 2009 07:06 PM 
With the Aristo Train Engineer (CRE-55470) does that come with everything you need? If not, what else will I need to set it up? And do you have to intall something inside each loco using this unit if I would run the ABA set? 


This was the original "trackside" train engineer. You get a wireless transmitter which talks to a receiver. The receiver sits by the trackside and controls voltage to the track in response to the throttle buttons on the transmitter. The big advantage was you could walk around without being tethered to a throttle. It would not let you trigger a sound board, I don't believe. Aristo made or maybe still makes makes accessory receiver (CRE-55474 and CRE-55475) which I guess you could put in a loco and maybe trigger sounds. Someone else here may have done it. The accessory receiver needs 5-18 volts to operate, you could get that from the track. I'm not sure that the current models of Phoenix wil work with those accessory switches.


Greg figured out how to get the trackside TE to trigger sounds in a QSI board--there was a thread about it a while back. It did not seem all that complicated but I didn't really study it. Under DC power, the QSI board plays sounds in response to very fast polarity changes. See here:


QSI with Trackside 

You could do it that way, and all you would need would be the trackside TE and the accessory switch and a QSi card


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

You asked a simple question and got a boat load of info you didnt want so the simple thing to do to run dc is to put a Phoenix card in one loco and run a 27 mhz TE to control them simple







do not buy the revo way to much overkill for what your lookin to do. and for one lttle loop DCC or any other remote system might be to much for as well. if down the road you want more control you can always upgrade to what ever system will work best for you....by the way run your trains and have fun, read this forum and you will learn a lot in time








PS I have just about every sound system out there, QSI MTH Phoenix,Sierra and im just as happy for now to run them under DC as under command control........


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

OOOOOOOOOO and most importantly the USA f-3 is the best running and Quality built 2 axle loco out there, great choice







you wont be sorry....


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## kml928 (Aug 23, 2009)

Ok, heres a link to the Aristo TE 27mhz receiver and transmitter: 

http://www.wholesaletrains.com/Detail.asp?ID=5493 

Is that the one I can use? 

Do I need another power pack / controller with this or is this all you need to run a simple setup? 

The thing is, USA Trains sells the F3 AB unit as a powered A & B unit, and then a 3rd A unit would automatically be powered. I am not concerned with having all 3 locos pulling the train with motors running, I am not going to be running long trains indoors. I just want to make sure the lead A unit has sound, and ALL 3 units have working lights and smoke. I do not care if the B and tailing A unit are made dummies, just that they light and smoke. 

I would be very interested in the item I mentioned above that I think you were referring to (D.C. Train Engineer Receiver and Transmitter Set, Crest - Aristo Craft Trains, CRE55470 ). With this unit you can control the movement of the train as well as sound the bells / horns anytime you want using the buttons? 

I'm sorry if I got anyone confused, I think I might have confused myself more here lol but I appreciate all the feedback.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Yes, I built 2 custom units for Nick to trigger the bell and whistle using a Trackside TE and a QSI... they work pretty darn well, but again you complicate things when you run multiple locos still, the QSI loco still wants about 7 volts before it takes off, the others will be on their way. 

If the other 2 locos are dummies they can still have smoke and lights. 

I have Nick's set up so we had bell on/off, horn button, and I think a short horn, all controlled from the TE wireless transmitter. 

I'm not really in the business to make these, just something I thought I could do easily and Nick twisted my arm! 

Regards, Greg


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## kml928 (Aug 23, 2009)

Ok, I think I will end up going with the Aristo DC TE setup, the way it sounds I just need a power pack with that correct? Is 10 amps enough bc thats the ones I came across when looking. And the TE just gets wired in between the power pack and the tracks correct? The sounds system doesnt matter to me as long as it has authentic EMD 567 prime mover sounds for the F unit and I would prefer the Leslie S5 horn (At least I think the one I demod was the Leslie S5). I have a guy who can sell me the A unit with a Sierra Soundtraxx unit built in, is that a sound unit that can be controlled with the Aristo TE DC setup mentioned in the previous post? 

Is making a powered unit a dummy as simple as disconnecting the wiring? Or do you have to remove the wheels/trucks with the gears and modify all that stuff too? If it involves pulling some wires I will do it, if I have to completely modify the loco then I will probobly leave them powered.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Umm... you have to have a custom circuit to trigger the QSI from the trackside TE... I built a couple, but as I said I'm not in the business... 

I'm afraid we are confusing you... 

Here is the simplest solution without a remote control: 

Transformer with speed control and a reversing switch, not a TE... reversing switch can trigger bell and whistle... QSI in lead engine, and either remove motors from the other units or replace wheels with ordinary freight car wheels, but some rewiring is needed. 

Reverse the direction switch while running, train will not reverse but whistle will blow... Flick the reversing switch back and forth in about 1/2 second, bell goes on. 

Cheapest and simplest. 

Regards, Greg


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## TonyWalsham (Jan 2, 2008)

Aaah!!!!!! The simplicity of standardised electronics.


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## kml928 (Aug 23, 2009)

Posted By Greg Elmassian on 24 Aug 2009 08:31 PM 
Umm... you have to have a custom circuit to trigger the QSI from the trackside TE... I built a couple, but as I said I'm not in the business... 

I'm afraid we are confusing you... 

Here is the simplest solution without a remote control: 

Transformer with speed control and a reversing switch, not a TE... reversing switch can trigger bell and whistle... QSI in lead engine, and either remove motors from the other units or replace wheels with ordinary freight car wheels, but some rewiring is needed. 

Reverse the direction switch while running, train will not reverse but whistle will blow... Flick the reversing switch back and forth in about 1/2 second, bell goes on. 

Cheapest and simplest. 

Regards, Greg 

What about the Sierra Sountraxx system? Would it have to work the same way with the TE controller? I doubt I am going with the QSI system, I will likely be going with the Sierra Soundtraxx.


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## TonyWalsham (Jan 2, 2008)

If you use the TE trackside you will need a separate on board R/C receiver matched to the TE to control the sound triggers. Either that or you have to use magnets in the track and reed switches in the locos.


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

Amazing how complicated this all is, isn't it? All you want to do is run three locos indoors and go toot toot! 


At least that's how it starts. We began with some LGB starter sets running outside at Christmas. Three little 0-4-0s and a DC power pack. I was astonished at how expensive it was. As I got into it, and began "improving," I got more accustomed to the costs, but I still balk at the idea of spending the around $700 it would cost to go to DCC. I've spent much more than that on single pieces of musical gear, but musical gear eventually pays for itself if you're getting gigs. I can't see charging admission to look at the trains. So I completely sympathize with the desire to keep it cheap. At the same time, I've spent enough so that I can see DCC would have been cheaper.


If you get into this for the long haul, DCC is probably the way you want to go. Have you looked at George Schreyer's page?

http://www.girr.org/girr/tips/tips.html 

A really great resource, if a little dated. DCC is the best if you want to consist locos; in the long run it's the cheapest if you stick with track power. We haven't even gotten into the track vs battery power debate. That's another whole can of worms


The Sierra soundcard--as Tony said, you will need an accessory switch to trigger the sounds. You might try looking for the 75 mhz TE.* You put a receiver in each loco and run the locos via a transmitter that looks just like the black transmitter for the trackside, only it's gray. I have the 75 mhz running in 3 locos, and it's simple and reliable and runs on track power. 4 year olds can manage it. It's been discontinued, but you can probably find it here and there as people shift over to the new Revolution TE. You would need the 75 mhz accessory switch to trigger the sounds; it's a little hard to find, but they are out there. I have that system running a Phoenix board in a USAT 44 tonner. It does what you want.



*Aristo has made three main versions of the TE system.: the trackside, 27 mhz black TX system, the gray tx 75 mhz onboard system, and the new "revolution" system


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

The problem here is that you need a pretty complete understanding to do this yourself. 

You can have it cheap, full functioned, or easy to implement. 

In most of the world, you get to pick 2 of the 3 above... .in this case, maybe only one! 

If you want it easy, it will be more expensive. 

If you want more functions it will be more expensive or complicated. 

If you want it cheap, you have to give up remote control or do a lot of work. 

There's been a lot of options presented. 

I do not think you have the expertise to do the complicated stuff yourself right now.

That either means paying for installation/design or buying a system that takes virtually no modification. 

Easy: QSI in all the locos... run DCC... I could have you running over the phone on a DCC system with sound in less time that it takes to remove the shells of the locos to plug the decoders in (Aristo locos) 
The USAT would be just a little more time, but can make a "plug in" installation. 

But this will cost you more money initially... as the number of locos (that can run at the same time) approaches 6 total, track powered DCC is cheaper than anything else. (6 sets of batteries and at least 3 chargers offsets the DCC system) 

I can make reasonable cases for other systems too... given different requirements or your priorities of cost, "easy", functions

Here's the bottom line: How much money will you spend and how much effort to get "into" and learn the electronic side?

So the answers: 

unlimited money and do not learn electronics 
limited money and learn electronics 
unlimited money and learn electronics 

all have different recommendations from me... if you are asking to "just do this one thing" and not look into future expansion. 

(limited money and do not learn electronics gives you NO solution by the way in my opinion, you WILL have to learn about some stuff) 

I mean "learn electronics" to be "understand how to trace voltage with a meter, follow wires, etc.", not to design the space shuttle. 

As a final recommendation, since the Sierra is discontinued, I would not use it unless you have it already and money is very tight... 

I think at this point, you need to sit back and look at your priorities, then you can use your priorities to decide which route to take, right now, you have tons of options... since none have been eliminated as too expensive, too difficult, etc. 

Regards, Greg


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## Jerryj (Jul 29, 2008)

I to just run two Eng s and have QSI and NCE G wire in them and run DC track or battery and it is not hard to do.I think it is better then AC Revo. With QSI and NCE G wire you have more option for the future. 
Jerry


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## George Schreyer (Jan 16, 2009)

What hasn't been mentioned that to get a sound system to run on DC when the engine is NOT running, you need some form of on board battery for the sound system. The Sierra was good for this but it's gone. The only options now are the Phoenix PB9 (which has it's own little battery) and a Dallee which can use a 9V battery. 

The other sound systems, QSI, P5, and all the other DCC type decoders that have sound will run on DC, but not until the track voltage exceeds about 6 volts. 

Many of the systems can take advantage of an on-board traction battery to keep the sound system alive when the engine is standing, at that point, you're most of the way to battery/RC. 

The DCC type system, which are most of them now, run from the DCC signal on the track which is there all the time. Many of them have small holdover capacitors to allow the systems to continue to operate over short track power outages.

If you are looking at the easiest way to get good sound, especially on an indoor layout, then I'd consider DCC using a QSI sound decoder. It's more expensive to start up, but less expensive incrementally. It is a hands down winner from a control accuracy and flexibility standpoint. 


However, I recall that you wanted to use a USAT F3. The QSI decoder may have difficulties with that loco, QSI will be coming out with a sort of a plug and play board for USAT locos .... real soon now.....


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## aceinspp (Jan 2, 2008)

Going with DCC and QSI right out of the box will save you money in the long run. You also will be a very happy camper when the smoke clears. Late RJD


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## kml928 (Aug 23, 2009)

Ok then I guess where I am at is I need to know what is involved if I install the sound or wiring myself on these, I have done simple wiring before as long as theres full instructions included with all these kits I should be able to do it. Will I need a soldering gun? 

I think I am going to buy the A unit awhile and go from there.


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## kml928 (Aug 23, 2009)

I dont think my earlier post went through, but I got a response from USA Trains direct and they say the Quantum Engineer would work, but also mentions a booster. Can someone shed some light on this, is the booster necessary bc of what was mentioned before about the amps? 

"Keith, 



We have the Pennsy AB sets in stock for $474.95. You would have to specify the Tuscan or the green. There is a company close to us who specialize in the QSI installations. I suggest you call them, ask for Gary P****** 1-888-339-8724. If he installs the QSI system in your locomotive you could run DCC. A second option would be to buy a Quantum engineer controller which would give you push button control for $35.95, since it is high amperage for G scale you would also need the booster boy for $129.95 so for about $166.00 plus Gary’s’ price you would get push button QSI operation and DCC. 



USA TRAINS 

P.O. Box 100 

Malden, MA 02148 

781-322-608"


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## kml928 (Aug 23, 2009)

Heres a link to the booster, which along with the Quantum Engineer is what I wanted to go with, so this should work with the ABA setup using the booster correct? 

http://www.qsisolutions.com/products/q-engineer-booster.html


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

We have been promised the booster for some time. I was not aware that it was finally available... check with Tony's Trains to see if it is REALLY available... (this is why I did not mention it)... 

By the way that means you need a decoder in each loco (as mentioned before) or make the other locos dummies (in which case you do not need the booster). 

2 locos with QSI will most likely work with light loads without the booster.. 

Regards, Greg


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## kml928 (Aug 23, 2009)

Are about 10 - 15 older era boxcars considered a light load for G scale? Would just the one powered A unit be ok with dummy AB engines and 10 - 15 boxcars?


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## kml928 (Aug 23, 2009)

The booster is listed on the Tony's Trains site, thats actually one of the places I had found it. 

http://www.tonystrains.com/products/qsi_solutions_main.htm


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## kml928 (Aug 23, 2009)

Posted By Nicholas Savatgy on 24 Aug 2009 07:38 PM 
You asked a simple question and got a boat load of info you didnt want so the simple thing to do to run dc is to put a Phoenix card in one loco and run a 27 mhz TE to control them simple







do not buy the revo way to much overkill for what your lookin to do. and for one lttle loop DCC or any other remote system might be to much for as well. if down the road you want more control you can always upgrade to what ever system will work best for you....by the way run your trains and have fun, read this forum and you will learn a lot in time








PS I have just about every sound system out there, QSI MTH Phoenix,Sierra and im just as happy for now to run them under DC as under command control........


What is involved with this setup quoted above? A Phoenix card in the lead A unit and a 27mhz TE to control just that one or all ABA units? Would I still need to dummy the other AB units to do it this way? And what else is needed other than the phoenix sound card and 27mhz controller? 

Again, the lineup will be ABA, only sound in lead A, other ABs would prefer to be powered but will make dummies if easier, only concerned that lights and smoke work on all 3. 10-15 boxcar load for now. 60-80 foot length single track indoor wall layout running through mulpile rooms.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

I know the booster is listed on Tony's trains... I happen to know Tony pretty darn well and I know he owns QSI solutions... 

To what I said: check to see if it is available... you don't know me, so just take my word on it... 

Greg


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## kml928 (Aug 23, 2009)

BTW, what are some online places people can recommend as far as good pricing / service and alot of products for the G scale trains and equiptment?


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

I responded to your private message give me a







and please at least use your 1st name so i and others know what to call you


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