# WARNING - Model Master Paint (Testors) and BMS (AMS) Plastic



## parkdesigner (Jan 5, 2008)

So I am beyond depressed.... honest-to-god pissed-off angry... for months I have been working on a project... what it was supposed to be is not important... the point is this... Model Masters Paint is CRAP... horrible dangerous stuff... it destroys models...

I've been heavily kit bashing a BMS (AMS in England) Baguley Drewry diesel engine. 

I've been doing a bunch of kit bashing the last year, and every time I had leftovers, they went in the scrap bin... parts from NORSCOT 1:18 and 1:16 dozers and tractors.... parts from 2 Bachmann 45 Tonners... parts from 1:20 Japanese and German trucks and construction equipment that I have never seen before, and doubt I will ever see again (one-off ebay purchases...) ALL of these parts, I've been setting aside for a very special project... 

And so, this week I finally went to the LHS and picked up $40 worth of plasti-struct and evergreen styrene bits and set to work on the Baguley, detailing it out...

Last night, I finished the effort... all of those parts... all of those rare and exotic 1:20 scaled items... finally glued on to the engine... there was some frame augmentation with styrene, and a new hood fabricated as well... and I'll tell you - it looked GOOD... (I never even got a photo of the damn thing) and so, today I stopped again at the LHS - went through all the offerings of paint - 5 or 6 brands - and settled, though it was painful, on one of the more expensive options - the Model Masters 3 oz Spray Paint from Testors... 

so I get home this afternoon - and carefully I began to give the whole build it's paint - pass by pass...

Now - to be CLEAR - I've got a WALL of trains I've painted, some have gone on to be weathered by others - but a large majority in the last 5 years were done by me... and I KNOW how to get the look I want (fit and finish) from a rattle can... and yet... as I applied a second coat... the paint was NOT applying to the BMS plastic, in the CORNERS only... window sills, vents, all were just fine... but the cab corners, and the hood electrical boxes (scratched from styrene) WOULD NOT paint... after going online and checking the Testors instructions to be sure, and within the allotted time - I went to give the corners another pass and BLAM the paint pooled.... EVERYWHERE... on parts of the engine that were just fine... now a goopy, sloppy mess...


Sure - frustrating and difficult... but nothing some stripper (acetone) wouldn't get me back to square one... at worst - I might have to reglue the project...

So into the bath the whole thing went - afterall... the detail in the grates and grills and sills were half the point of the project - anyone can "screw and glue" and slop paint on a car - this was my first true "finescale" effort, using photo-etched parts, and the afore mentioned host of one-of-a-kind detail parts...


And then... Tragedy... 

I don't know what was in the plastic - I don't know what the **** Accucraft did - but as all the styrene stripped perfectly clean.... (and didn't unglue - so perfect!)... the Baguley Drewry shell MELTED!!! You read that right... the BMS plastic became gelatinous.... deforming and melting away!!! What's worse - the now gooey black plastic jello - attached itself to ALL the detail parts... I now have a tub of irreplaceable, correctly scaled 1:20 parts from the last 40 years from around the globe - and it all looks like melted crap - as each piece is entombed in what was the BG engine shell... 

So where does this leave me? 

I have 2 dozen or so parts, encased in CRAPPY poor quality whatzit plastic from a melted Accucraft engine... 

I have NO engine... gone - pufft... just this deformed, sloppy mess.... looks like somebody put a GI Joe toy in the over and melted it.....

I have a box of various additional details... all sized and built to fit the now vanished heavily modified BMS diesel shell... 

(And before you say it - YES - I've used the same paint, and the same paint remover on SCORES of AMS cars.... and for that matter even Accucraft Brass items... I've NEVER seen anything like this...)

My only options are, A) Buy ANOTHER Baguley Drewry Diesel, (Another $300) and buy at the very least, another Bachmann 45 Tonner (What? $100), another Norscot Cat D2 (~$65) and another Norscot Oliver Dozer (~$80).... so - $545 or so, plus shipping to find all the parts I need for a second go.... or B) start over with another company's shell, and scrap all the custom fitted stuff now built... or C) give up...


No good options there.... and why? Either Testors made a SH*T batch of paint (for the record a different color of the same brand of paint, from the same LHS did NOT damage a small section of the shell I was working with) or Accucraft decided to save a few F&#$*'g pennies on their BMS line by using lessor quality plastic in the Baguley Drewry... 

Great.... just great.... thanks a bunch BMS... 


So you guy's have been warned.... I'm just sitting here in a daze.... this time tonight, I had planned to be uploading pics to MLS of what I seriously thought would be my best model ever... I was already starting to research what contests I could enter it in to (Something I've never done before - and those of you who have seen my models should understand what that says about the quality of this now aborted project....)

So close.... so damn close... and to have it all *literally *melt in my hands....

I don't need to tell you - I have the glass of scotch close at hand...

...close to a $1000 in parts and purchases, out the window... *poof*... 

ugh....



Sorry guys - had to rant... hope this saves someone else from the nightmare I am currently in...


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## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

Ouch! I feel your pain. As for the detail parts, all may not be lost. Let the parts bathe in the acetone or MEK or other plastic solvent (assuming they're metal). Once it softens, you can probably free it up with a wire toothbrush. Alternatively, you can melt the plastic off with a torch or in your gas grill or something like that. Do it on a windy day when your neighbor with the obnoxious barking dog is downwind.  Careful with white metal parts, though--they may melt also. If you can heat the plastic up enough to soften it, the white metal will probably still be in good condition. 

Later, 

K


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## Steve Stockham (Jan 2, 2008)

Oh..........wow. Uhhh........(I'm speechless!) That's got to be _the_ worst horror story regarding scratchbuilding that I have ever heard!! Kevin's got some good advice but if you're not already on the second bottle then you're a better man than I Gunga Din! (_Melted in your hands??!! Yikes!!)_


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## Greg Stevens (Jan 3, 2008)

I can't believe you used acetone to try to remove paint off of plastic. That stuff contains MEK I believe and that will melt the enamel off of your teeth. Acetone should never, NEVER be used on plastic. It melts it in a heartbeat. You should have used brake fluid which will attack the paint, but not, in most cases, the plastic. A better bet for a fast removal would have been Scale Coat paint remover. It is plastic compatable. 

As for paint, I would not use Testors either. Floquil or Scale Coat is my preference for all things RR related. Or one of the kinds of rattle can paint found at the hardware store. Rustoleum, etc. Also, always paint on an undercoat to be sure.

If you have used acetone successfully in the past, I can only say that you were VERY lucky not to loose your plastic models. Sorry about your loss.


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## Spule 4 (Jan 2, 2008)

OUCH! Not sure what to even suggest..... 

A friend had a batch of Model Masters "bead" up like that recently on a project I sent to him, but not spraycan (this was airbrushed). After removal (wipe down with acetone and some light abrasive blasting) I got a good coat on the model. Amazingly, another coat of Model Masters (airbushed, but I thin mine down with xylene) went on fine. 

Not sure what styrene/plastic AMS makes their stuff out of. I have one model from them (a single shorty US outline four wheel flatcar split from their sets of two the sell) and it has a differnent "feel" to it than other plastics. I do know it does not like the sun however, the car has a very obvious "bow" to it....


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## Paulus (May 31, 2008)

This is a serious case of Murphy's Law; 
_"If there is a possibilety of several things going wrong, the one that will cause the most damage will be the one to go wrong. Corollarly; if there is a worse time for something to go wrong, it will happen than". _

It really is a serious problem and I too can feel your pain! 
I have a little experience with Testers Model Master, not enough to know the paint good. But I'm with Greg about the use of aceton (or any thinner) on plastic; don't ever! 
I used MrMuscle oven cleaner in several occassions succesfully (mostly with 1:35 very detailed military models). No loss of details or weakening or melting plastic. Certainly for as far as it is styreen (used in most plastic kits). 
Just put the items in a plastic bag, soaked in MrMuscle and let it stay 24 hours. After this you can softly brush of the remaining parts of paint with a toothbrush. 
Also, whenever you are not certain how it will react; use it on a little piece of the plastic (or other material) you want to strip paint of as a test... 
On the other hand, in this case it is all talking afterwards... Again; I feel your pain. 
Don't drop the model; I hope you try to restore it as much as you can... That will be a sort of victory! 

Good luck, 

Paul


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## Ralph Berg (Jun 2, 2009)

I've had the "beading" paint problem with both Bachmann and Buddy L plastic. The roofs of boxcars seem to be the most problematic. I don't know if they are using something for UV that is causing the problems or what. 
I've solved the problem I've had by using Rustoleum Plastic Primer. After priming, I wait a couple days before doing a top coat. 
The Rustoleum primer will pull off with the masking tape if taped too soon. 
Ralph


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## Steve Stockham (Jan 2, 2008)

I have had a few hours to ruminate on this situation. I would say that staying away from Testors would be the first _obvious_ conclusion. I have found that Floquil works very well with AMS plastic! As to acetone as a paint remover, it does wonders for brass but it _does _eat away at plastic! The trick with acetone is that it evaporates _extremely_ quickly. Plastic takes a few _more _seconds to soften than acetone does to evaporate _if all you do is swipe a paper towel soaked with acetone over a spot!_ The new paint hasn't had time to cure and will immediately come off but you _must let the acetone evaporate and the plastic harden up again!_ It's a quicker process than some of the more recommended methods (for good reasons!) but it definitely has it's pitfalls as you unfortunately have found out! By the way, acetone seems to soften up LGB plastic fastest of all the manufacturers and using it to remove lettering is _extremely_ risky!


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## parkdesigner (Jan 5, 2008)

Thanks for the support guys.... the morning after and the pain is still there - can't bare to even look at the work bench right now... 

Kevin - good thoughts, but alas, most of the more "detailed" parts were themselves plastic... it's all gone I'm afraid... as the liquid BMS engine coated everything... I'm sure if I did go in with any solvent, it's only degrade the detail parts too... 

Greg, I've been doing this for a decade or so now - and even in the professional model shops I've worked in, and at times hired, there has always been acetone on hand, and in use... It's NEVER been a problem before... this was either A) reaction to the Testor's or B) reaction to the BMS plastic (again, as the AMS plastic has been fine again and again...) 

Ralph, Garrett, Steve - agreed.... Testors will NEVER be in my house again.... the really horrible part of this is that I almost always just use Hardware Store standard rattle cans... big fan of OSH's own brand... it was for this model I specifically decided to pony up the extra money to get a "perfect" color match... I spent a good half hour comparing all the various model spray paint brands at the LHS... and then even after that - almost bought the basic Testors and decided at the last second to pay extra for the "Model Master" brand... man - did I get ripped! 


After the rest of the bottle last night, I gathered up the parts that were still salvageable... at the moment, I'm thinking of giving it a second go... problem is most of the remaining items are worthless as I'd be starting over with a different shell/cab.... 

we shall see...


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## Dwight Ennis (Jan 2, 2008)

I specifically decided to pony up the extra money to get a "perfect" color match... How hard is it to match MOW Gray?


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## parkdesigner (Jan 5, 2008)

Not hard at all Dwight!! Hence the OSH rattle cans....

This time though, there was Blue, Yellow, and Green...









The Blue and Green went on just fine... (both Model Master/Testors as well) - it was the final coat of yellow that brought forth doom









(Oh - and go ahead, let your mind try to work those colors into my little D&RGW world!!







)


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## Dwight Ennis (Jan 2, 2008)

(Oh - and go ahead, let your mind try to work those colors into my little D&RGW world!!)I donno Josh... somehow I just can't see it. hehehe


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## SlateCreek (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By parkdesigner on 17 Oct 2009 07:42 PM 


(Oh - and go ahead, let your mind try to work those colors into my little D&RGW world!!







)


So, um.... let's see... you're adopting the "What -If" philosophy, whereby Burlington Northern and Santa Fe got together and parcelled up the D&RGW instead of the UP .... thereby giving you a need to combine green locomotives with blue and yellow ones ..... and instead of painting the Daylight black with a maroon stripe, we're going to see a K-28 in Warbonnet instead of Bumble Bee, right?

(Ok, I'm gonna duck now.... I doubt even the scotch will fix the knot that'll leave in his spine!)

Matthew (OV)


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## Greg Stevens (Jan 3, 2008)

I can see one problem with your painting agenda right away. If you used blue and green then yellow on top of those, then you would have major problems covering with the yellow. When I was painting models professionally, the lightest color always went on first. Then it was masked over and the darker colors were put on. If stripes were the order of the day, they were always put on last, using decal stripes. Easier for me to work with and no bleed under from the darker colors. I really feel for you in this delema.


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## parkdesigner (Jan 5, 2008)

Greg - correct - lightest first... the blue and green went on other parts of the shell...(the shell was run through a bandsaw several times) the yellow was the first, and only, color to go on the pieces being painted. 

Dwight - it's ok, I'd never fault someone for being hard pressed to see past MOW grey!! 

Matt - you're dead to me.


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## Dwight Ennis (Jan 2, 2008)

Dwight - it's ok, I'd never fault someone for being hard pressed to see past MOW grey!! 
Only in your case Josh... only in your case. However, on the bright side, at least you got the gauge right, so there IS hope. hehehe


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