# Econami by Soundtraxx -- Anyone Using in large Scale



## John King (Mar 18, 2014)

Are any of you using the Soundtraxx ECONami decoder in your large scale locomotives or trolleys? Are you liking it?

With way too many moving items on-hand I'm thinking of it as a less expensive way to go DCC-sound for some of my 'smaller' things like Bachmann trollies.

John in Maryland


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## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

The feedback on the Soundtraxx Yahoo group seems to be pretty favorable on the new decoders. I'm looking to install one in an upcoming project based on what I've read there and heard on YouTube (though coming from iPhone video of an HO-scale loco is hardly indicative of real life). I saw both the 1-amp and 4-amp versions hanging on the rack at my local hobby shop the other day. (Along with the TCSWow! decoders, which are also available in low- and high-current forms.) 

My only gripe with the Econami is that it lacks a cam-triggered chuff, so you must trust the BEMF-controlled chuff to keep things close enough to exactly in quarter. Some guys on the Yahoo group say it's great, others say they can get it close but not perfect. That's been my experience with other BEMF-driven chuffs over the years as well; I think much depends on the specific motor/locomotive. For the loco I'll be doing (an LGB Porter), there's no room for magnet/reed switch on the small drivers, so I'll be at the mercy of the BEMF anyway.

Sorry for a lack of 1st-hand experience. I've got the older Tsunami decoders in my two galloping geese, and they work very well. 

Later,

K


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## Dan Pierce (Jan 2, 2008)

Check out the Zimo sound files and the MX645 HO decoder can be used in many LGB single motor engines. I did install one in a goose, another in a LGB rail truck.
For non sound there is the MX621 and it fits in the barrel of the 2001 gustav hand car and it will drive lights, even led ditch lights!!.


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## dccforme (Jul 29, 2015)

I use them and love them! Great bang for your buck!


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## Dan Pierce (Jan 2, 2008)

Make sure for largescale you only use the 400 version as this is the only one rated for over 24 volts (10-26), others are 22 volts (10-22) max. Even the LGB MTS I system of old had 24 volts.


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## nscaler711 (Dec 4, 2015)

What if I am using a MRC Prodigy Advance for this? Can I get away with using the Eco-100 instead? 
I doubt I'll have more than two locos running at the same time, anytime soon anyways. That and $65 sounds better than $120 anyways lol.


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## dccforme (Jul 29, 2015)

What will happen is you will short out and possibly ruin the decoder which would lead you having to buy another. You can get them for $120 online free shipping. Are you set on econami? I know a few other decoders.


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## nscaler711 (Dec 4, 2015)

I don't see how I will short out the decoder, Max Voltage from the MRC is 16v... I have ran up to 6 DCC Sound HO locomotives on that system and never ran into many problems, and I figure the operating range of a couple G scale S/E locos using HO decoders would be around 4 HO locos running. Besides a Short in electronic devices usually consists of leads +/- being crossed. So even running a smoke unit shouldn't short it out.

that and I am cheap.... And atleast in G I can pretty much make a mini subwoofer since there is so much space


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## dccforme (Jul 29, 2015)

nscaler711 said:


> I don't see how I will short out the decoder, Max Voltage from the MRC is 16v... I have ran up to 6 DCC Sound HO locomotives on that system and never ran into many problems, and I figure the operating range of a couple G scale S/E locos using HO decoders would be around 4 HO locos running. Besides a Short in electronic devices usually consists of leads +/- being crossed. So even running a smoke unit shouldn't short it out.
> 
> that and I am cheap.... And atleast in G I can pretty much make a mini subwoofer since there is so much space


You can try. I know usa models and aristo diesels with 2 trucks usually suck alot of power. I say experiment.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

of course it won't short out.... there is no short circuit.

of course running 24 volt motors in G scale from a 16v DCC system will not work well at all. They will be sloooow.

You need track voltage AT LEAST 20v... remember that in G scale you can lose a couple of volts through the tracks, and up to 2 volts in the decoder so 16v system might only get 12v to the motor... NG...

Greg


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## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

Greg Elmassian said:


> ...of course running 24 volt motors in G scale from a 16v DCC system will not work well at all. They will be sloooow.


That all depends on what locomotives you're running and how they're geared. If you're running modern mainline diesels at a scale 80mph, then 16 volts will likely be inadequate. If you're running standard gauge at more branchline speeds (30 - 50 mph) or narrow gauge (10 - 30 mph) then a 16 volt system should be plenty. I use a Prodigy Advance2 system on my indoor shelf railroad, and even at that "low" of a voltage, I'm still limiting my top speed to around 60 - 70% of what's available. That gives me a top end speed at full throttle of around 30 - 40 mph on most locos. My wireless DCC stuff runs with either 14.8 volt and even now 11.1 volts on my latest projects. 

Most folks who do track-powered DCC in large scale gravitate towards 24 volts because--hey--why not. That way you know you've got the voltage there if you need it. But you can most certainly use lower-voltage systems without any problems; just don't expect to break any land speed records. 

Later,

K


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## nscaler711 (Dec 4, 2015)

East Broad Top said:


> That all depends on what locomotives you're running and how they're geared. If you're running modern mainline diesels at a scale 80mph, then 16 volts will likely be inadequate. If you're running standard gauge at more branchline speeds (30 - 50 mph) or narrow gauge (10 - 30 mph) then a 16 volt system should be plenty. I use a Prodigy Advance2 system on my indoor shelf railroad, and even at that "low" of a voltage, I'm still limiting my top speed to around 60 - 70% of what's available. That gives me a top end speed at full throttle of around 30 - 40 mph on most locos. My wireless DCC stuff runs with either 14.8 volt and even now 11.1 volts on my latest projects.
> 
> Most folks who do track-powered DCC in large scale gravitate towards 24 volts because--hey--why not. That way you know you've got the voltage there if you need it. But you can most certainly use lower-voltage systems without any problems; just don't expect to break any land speed records.
> 
> ...


Sweet, all I needed to know, I have a small... Small loop like 4' curves and four 12" straights along both sides, haven't measured but I'm guessing 4' x 8 space....  
So I don't have to break any speed records lol. If I want to do that, I'll break out a few Katos in N 
Only locos I have atm, is a Aristocraft FA-1, and *cough* Bmann Thomas *cough* *ducks* 

But I am looking around for a USA T SF GP38 cheaply... So that and the FA are the ones I'll ever run till I actually have a yard to run them.....


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## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

I just picked up the 4-amp version of the Econami, and also a 1.2 amp (2-amp peak) TCS WowSound decoder. (Thanks, early Santa!!!) I will be playing with them over the winter, though I've got to clean my workshop first. 

Later,

K


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

No, people who know DCC don't run 24v because of "hey why not", an aristo E8 will only run 62 smph at 20v on the rails... so 16v would be a joke.

Not everyone runs 20 smph like you have commented about your running many times.

Kevin, if you want to enter a comment like you did, it would be more helpful if you did it from experience, or at least say "hey I have limited experience with standard gauge locos so I have never tried 16v". Your comment of "hey why not" could be construed as insulting to people with experience and hard facts, and it is misleading to newcomers or people who are looking for recommendations.


Greg


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## nscaler711 (Dec 4, 2015)

Greg, Chill out, I have a bmann controller that has a max output of 18v with 1amp max, so if my loco stalls it shuts down. The FA-1 runs way too fast on 18v for my space constraints, so 16v will be plenty for me and anyone else that doesn't need a bullet train lol
(did I mention I have been modeling for over 15 years? I have some knowledge of what's going on.) 
A 24v DCC system is great for operating more than say 4 sound equipped locos at 30yrds away or more...


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Do you have an Aristo E8? Have you measured voltage vs. speed?

Voltage has nothing to do with the number of locos.

Current is needed for more locos.

Sounds like you are not as experienced in this area either.

Read the posts again, it's a recommendation of too low a voltage in G scale on DCC that I am taking exception to.

You clearly are not running DCC in your post, no one runs DCC outdoors on G scale with 1 amp.

Greg


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## nscaler711 (Dec 4, 2015)

No one said anything about a Aristo E8... 
And yes I know how how it works, more current equals more locos...
And I do run DCC in N, HO. 
Also nobody said "outdoors" either.... So maybe you should re-read the posts... 
It was about a brand of decoder....


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## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

Greg, when I write "Hey, why not," I'm referring to the notion that most folks, when purchasing power supplies for their DCC boosters, will purchase supplies which will allow the booster to run at its maximum capacity, not just the minimum they need for prototypical speeds of their trains. They may not need it, but since the booster can handle it, and it doesn't cost anything extra, they use it. (I'm quite fond of recommending the 24-volt Mean Well power supply that you use on your system, actually. It's cheap and reliable.) I can't think of anyone I know in large scale using high-end DCC systems who isn't putting at least 20 volts to the track regardless of the kinds of trains they're running. 

That doesn't render the lower-voltage systems inadequate, _if you don't need the extra voltage to reach prototypical speeds_. I stipulated as much in my post. If you want to discount a system on the wholesale level because it doesn't meet your specific needs, that's your thing. I prefer to take things on a case-by-case basis, weighing the needs of the modeler with the capacities of the specific system. In this specific case, there's no reason the lower-voltage system wouldn't work. If _you _were asking the question, the answer would be different because your needs are different.

Later,

K


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## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

Back to John's original question...

I got a chance to sit down and install the Econami in my B'mann K-27 last night. Installation was simple, and I ended up installing a 2nd 2.5" speaker in the smokebox, wiring two 6-ohm speakers in series for a total of 12 ohms. I've still got some tweaking to do of the sounds, but my early impressions are quite favorable.

Motor control is very smooth. I'd heard folks in the small scales say the motor control was an improvement on this one over the older Tsunamis, and while I never had reason to argue with my older Tsunamis, this one is very smooth. 

The BEMF chuff appears to stay consistent throughout the speed range, which is one thing that really concerned me at the outset. I've not been a fan of BEMF chuff in the past, and Soundtraxx taking away the cam-triggered chuff option on this decoder worried me a bit. While still "not a believer," I've got it as close to properly quartered as I can get it, and it appears to stay that way. I want to try this loco on a higher-voltage system to see if it shifts depending on track voltage. 

Later,

K


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