# Regner Lumber Jack problem



## tacfoley (Jan 3, 2008)

My pal Broos came over this afternoon to fire up his just-built Regner Lumber Jack for the first time [I have a load of gas-cans, and he don't].

After going through the usual pre-fire-up drill we lit her up via the stack and watched as the flame began to cook the smokebox door. We could NOT get it to go back out of the firebox. We tried futzing around with the gas setting - all to no avail. I DID notice, though, that the gas was coming out at a very low rate, even whe nthe valve was fully opened. 

We are either doing something so fundamentally wrong that I can't see what it is, or there is a problem with the burner assembly.

Comments please.

TIA

tac
www.ovgrs.org
Supporter of the Cape Meares Lighthouse Restoration Fund


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## Scottychaos (Jan 2, 2008)

First thing to try in a situation like that: 
remove the jet, and spray butane/gas *backwards* through the jet.. 
(by pressing the jet down on the gas can valve) 
if something is clogged inside the jet, this will often dislodge it and blast it out.. 
this is a common cause of burner problems..and it especially makes sense with a never-run locomotive, 
"manufacturing dirt" is a possibility.. 

50% of the time this will fix the problem! 
give that a go and see if it works.. 

Scot


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## tacfoley (Jan 3, 2008)

Posted By Scottychaos on 23 Sep 2010 12:30 PM 
First thing to try in a situation like that: 
remove the jet, and spray butane/gas *backwards* through the jet.. 
(by pressing the jet down on the gas can valve) 
if something is clogged inside the jet, this will often dislodge it and blast it out.. 
this is a common cause of burner problems..and it especially makes sense with a never-run locomotive, 
"manufacturing dirt" is a possibility.. 

50% of the time this will fix the problem! 
give that a go and see if it works.. 

Scot 
Thanks, Scot - that was my thought too, at the time. Can't do anything now as it's nearly 10 pm here, and Broos has long gone. We are going over to main131's track tomorrow for a steam-up, and we'll take it with us there.

Thanks again.

Best

tac
www.ovgrs.org
Supporter of the Cape Meares Lighthouse Restoration Fund


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## Eric M. (Jan 3, 2008)

I was going to suggest that too. I have encountered clogged jets a few times on "fresh from the factory" Regners. Maybe contaminants inside the tank when they are shipped.

Regards,


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## Nick Jr (Jan 2, 2008)

Don't be too dissapointed in the first few runs of the lumber Jack. As the instructions say the cylinders need to wear onto the delivery block. The more I run mine the better it gets. Nick Jr


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## steamtom1 (Jan 2, 2008)

As I have posted on this site, often times after you have cleared the jet, there is still some crap floating around in the tank. With the jet removed, I fill the tank, and then purge it to the atmosphere. It is a waste of a good tank of butane, but it often carries with it any of that crap that will continue to plug the jet. Well worth it!


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## tacfoley (Jan 3, 2008)

Thanks to all for the suggestions. Much appreciated, especially the last from Tom. 

Best 

tac 
www.ovgrs.org 
Supporter of the Cape Meares Lighthouse restoration Fund


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## Cougar Rock Rail (Jan 2, 2008)

Tac, if you've got a smokebox fire just give a quick blow down the stack...that usually does the trick and sends it back where it belongs! 

Keith


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Cup your hands slightly and clap them together directly over the stack being sure to bring your hands together at the top just slightly before at the bottom. The resulting shock wave will pop the flame back most of the time unless there is not enough air being entrained in the gas stream at the venturi right at the nozzle.

If there is dirt in the nozzle or if it is aimed off toward the side it won't pick up enough air and so the gas won't burn until it gets to the smokebox where there is more air available. Even seating the nozzle fully can cause a problem if it does not result in it being aimed right. (This is a problem in the dual burner setups that have the rigid pipe to hold the 2 nozzles in the burners... One will be aimed well and the other gets skewed such as to not entrain the needed air and there will be a problem keeping that burner working.)


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## tacfoley (Jan 3, 2008)

All the usual remedies - clapping hands, using a flat object over the stack to 'pop' the flame back - fail to do the job. I suspect that there is not enough air being entrained - as SV notes, to enable the flame to burn in the tube. I'm told this evening that there is hardly any noise of gas release - even with the gas valve wide open. 

He's going to try everything, starting with blowing the jet block out. 

tac 
www.ovgrs.org 
Supporter of the Cape Meares Lighthouse Restoration Fund


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## thumper (Jan 31, 2009)

I too have a Lumberjack and it had problems with dirt in the line. On the Lumberjack, the fuel tank is easy to remove. You will probably have to remove it to get the jet out. Try the following: 

Remove the tank, and 
Remove the fuel valve on the top of the tank. 
Remove the fuel line and jet from the burner. 
Reconnect the fuel line with the jet in tact to the fuel tank. then 
Turn the whole mechanism so that the opening of the tank faces down. 
Now, as Tom says, take a full fuel can and place the nozzle over the orifice [hole] taking care not to damage the hole and blow fuel through the jet for a few seconds. This should take care of cleaning both the jet and the fuel tank. If you have an air compressor, that's o.k. too, but the pressure may be less. With an air compressor you can do the tank separately. 

Also, per Regner's local rep, find a piece of brass shim stock and make a small band, much like a cigar band, to fit over the burner. By sliding the band over the air input to the burner, you can adjust the air/fuel mixture so that you can get the flame to pop back to the burner immediately upon lighting the burner. 

MOST IMPORTANTLY, DON'T KEEP THE FLAME LIT ONCE YOU LEARN THAT THE FLAME IS OUT IN THE SMOKE BOX AS YOU WILL DESTROY THE TEMPER OF THE SPRINGS HOLDING THE CYLINDERS IN PLACE. IF YOU LOSE THE SPRING TENSION, THE ONLY SOLUTION IS TO REPLACE THE SPRINGS AS THE LOCOMOTIVE WILL NOT OPERATE. 

Good Luck, 

Will


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## Two Blocked (Feb 22, 2008)

When you are done cleaning this and that, please consider that butane will only burn in an environment that contains sufficient air (oxygen) to support combustion. If it burns in the smokebox (generally the default position) and will not snap back through the flue to the burner, then be assured that there is not enough air being entrained in the fuel (gas) flow through the burner's mixing body. In my reading of your notes I'm supposing that you tried to fire up very soon after you filled the fuel tank. If so, that may be the error. In filling the fuel tank with liquid gas, some of the liquid flashes to gas through the tank vents contained in the fuel tank fill valve (Ronson, Accucraft, Aster, Regner, et al), and in doing so lowers the temperature of the fuel tank and its contents. As the fuel tank chills, the vapor pressure in the tank falls and there is less energy (velocity) available to pass through the gas jet and into the mixing body. This reduced pressure/velocity combination will not entrain (draw in) sufficient air in the mixing chamber to support combustion on the poker burner, but it will travel forward to the smoke box where it will mix with sufficient air and perform many nasty tricks; annealing the cylinder springs is one of them. I strongly suggest that once the fuel tank is filled, to allow it to come back to room temperature before trying to fire up. This will give the best pressure/velocity through the jet, and allow the best conditions for a proper start sequence. One more thing. Please make sure that there are no fuel leaks in the supply piping/tubing between the fuel tank and the gas jet. This includes using some form of sealant on the gas jet threads (apply only to the male threads; skipping the first engagement thread) to insure fuel system integrity. I recommend Loctite brand High Temperature Sealant in the tiny white tube. I purchase it in the auto supply retail store. Even the tiniest fuel leak, if sucked in with air through the air holes in the mixing body, will disturb the fuel/air mixture to the point where the flame will never pop back to the poker burner. An ambient temperature, or warmer, fuel tank and a no leak fuel supply, will guarantee repeated success.


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## gwscheil (Aug 6, 2008)

The best way to plug the jet is to fill the tank beyond the feed valve and open the valve. This forces liquid butane through the system - not vapor. It will probably remain liquid until it reaches the jet. Then the sudden expansion cooling flashes the butane to vapor, but liquid butane is an excellent solvent. Any oil or grease dissolved will then deposit in the jet - instant plug. Try to remember to vent excess liquid after filling the tank through the filler valve, never the control valve. If it spits liquid, keep venting.


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## hcampbell (Jan 2, 2008)

While Mr. T. Blocked theory sounds logical, it doesn't seem apply to my Regner Shay. Unless I severely restrict the air intake, the flame pops back so enthusiastically it goes out. 
That's one of the things I like about live steam, locomotives are individuals. 

Harvey C. 
SA1838


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## Chris B (Oct 18, 2009)

I recently had a phone call from a local enthusiast who had built a Lumberjack and had spent two days trying to light it. He had already got through one set of springs and to say he was unhappy would be an understatement! He brought it over and when I put a finger over one air hole on the burner, it lit and popped back instantly. I made an air control ring from a strip of brass and now with that covering half the holes, it works every time. 

Cheers
Chris


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## thumper (Jan 31, 2009)

Hopefully, by now, you've solved the burner problem. 

When you service the Lumber Jack, make sure you don't over-fill the boiler. Once full, you have to remove about 50 ml of water so the steam out line is clear of the water. Most other locos require removal of only 30 ml. Otherwise you will get water in the cylinders and you will have difficulty with smooth operation until the water level drops. Also, consider breaking it in on rollers for about an hour [5 min. forward, 5 min. backward, etc. till your hour is up]. You will find that the locomotive will run much smoother after the short break in period. 

Finally, consider replacing the Regner fuel filler valve with the Ronson type as it will make it easier to refuel. If you keep the Regner valve, slip a piece of silicone tubing over the end of the adapter that screws onto the fuel can. Make sure your cut is clean and that the tubing extends about 3/16 from the end of the adapter. That way, when you place it over the filler valve and press down to fill the fuel tank, the silicone tubing will form a seal at the base of the filler valve and gas will be prevented from escaping during the fueling process. 

Enjoy. 

Will


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