# Roundhouse SRRL scale



## aopagary (Jun 30, 2008)

i tried looking around for this information and after viewing the Roundhouse website, i'm even more unsure. not trying to start any sort of scale discussion here, but could anyone tell me the size of the Roundhouse SRRL #24 model? my confusion comes in where Roundhouse says it can be run on either 32mm or 45mm track with a conversion kit. am i correct in thinking that if it is indeed 1:19 scale, to be modeled for 2 foot gauge it should be gauged to 32mm?

looks like a nice locomotive.
thanks...gary


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## clifforddward (Jan 2, 2008)

You are correct...as built this RH model is scaled to model 2ft gauge on 32mm track....the conversion kit is offered for use on 45mm gauge track purely for marketing purposes, and to offer the ability for folks with only 45mm track to have access to the engine. One must remember that in the UK where this RH engine is built 32mm gauge track is still the most common. The popularity of 45mm gauge track in the UK is just now taking hold, and I don't really know if it is really growing by leaps and bounds or just seems that way by more comments in the press and onlie forums.

If built for 45mm to represent 2ft gauge the model would be built in 7/8" scale, 1:13.7

Unfortunately little in the way of rolling stock for Maine prototype has been offered in 1:19 scale....therefore scratchbuilding correct rolling stock for this engine is the rule of the day.

But it is a nice RH model, and looks good running

Best Regards,
Cliff


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## Steve S. (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By aopagary on 21 Nov 2012 06:19 AM
i tried looking around for this information and after viewing the Roundhouse website, i'm even more unsure. not trying to start any sort of scale discussion here, but could anyone tell me the size of the Roundhouse SRRL #24 model? my confusion comes in where Roundhouse says it can be run on either 32mm or 45mm track with a conversion kit. am i correct in thinking that if it is indeed 1:19 scale, to be modeled for 2 foot gauge it should be gauged to 32mm?

looks like a nice locomotive.
thanks...gary





I called Roundhouse once to ask that very question. Was told by a nice lady that the engine was not made to any scale just freelance. When they talk about 32mm or 45mm they are saying that the drivers can be moved in a little on their axle's to accommodate either size of track. I have seen all types and scales of rolling stock being pulled behind these engines. In my opinion, LGB size stuff looks a little big behind one, smaller then that seems about right. However, the LGB cars do not look bad and that is what most people pull because LGB offered SR & RL cars back in the day.


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## Scottychaos (Jan 2, 2008)

You have two options: 

A: Just consider it 1/20.3 scale, (3-foot gauge on 45mm track).. 
thats "close enough" in terms of scale, and gets you into the realm where products actually exist.. 
rolling stock, figures, structures, etc.. 
If you actually wanted to build a garden railroad in a scale to match the locomotive, 1/20.3 would be the thing to look at, 
not 1/19 scale.. 

but..if you go that route, with 45mm track and 1/20.3 scale rolling stock, 
you are still going to have rolling stock "matching" issues..because: 
yes, it looks quite small compared to other rolling stock..but thats because it IS very small!  
its supposed to be.. 
the prototype locomotive was 2-foot gauge, and it hauled 2-foot gauge rolling stock.. 
even though it technically "matches" 1/20.3 scale (very close anyway) all other 1/20.3 scale locos and rolling stock 
are models of 3-foot gauge prototypes, not 2-foot gauge prototypes..so they are in fact "too big" for the SR&RL 2-foot gauge locomotive. 

Imagine a prototype railroad where a Maine 2-foot line runs alongside a 3-foot gauge line, (which didnt happen in reality, but just pretend) 
you have your SR&RL 2-footer locomotive sitting on its 2-foot gauge track, with some 2-foot gauge rolling stock attached, 
and alongside you have 3-foot gauge locomotive, and some 3-foot gauge boxcars sitting on the 3-foot gauge track track. 
In "real life" 1:1 scale, the 3-foot gauge loco and boxcars are physically larger than the 2-foot gauge loco and cars.. 
Now, lift up the 2-foot gauge loco with a crane, re-gauge the drivers outward and sit it on the 3-foot gauge track, and hook it up 
to the 3-foot gauge boxcars, and away it goes..That is essentially what you would be doing, in model form, if you wanted to run this 
loco on 45mm track with 1/20.3 scale rolling stock..its doable! but it looks a little weird.. 

there is really nothing that can be done about that, unless you want to:

B: scratch-build 2-foot gauge rolling stock,in 1/19 scale, to run on 32mm track..that would get you there!  
and could make for a very nice Maine 2-footer railroad..
but there isnt much in the way of 1/19 scale 32mm rolling stock out there..except for perhaps British prototypes, which wouldn't 
prototypically match the locomotive..So, its going to be a "compromise loco" unless you want to get into scratch-building 
1/29 scale Maine rolling stock.. 

Scot


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## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

even though it technically "matches" 1/20.3 scale (very close anyway) all other 1/20.3 scale locos and rolling stock are models of 3-foot gauge prototypes, not 2-foot gauge prototypes..so they are in fact "too big" for the SR&RL 2-foot gauge locomotive. 
There was a gentleman at the IE&W Fall Steamup with a complete SR&RL train in 1:13.7. I think he had an Argyle Forney and some scratchbuilt cars. It towered over our 1:20.3 stuff. 
(I don't have a photo and I couldn't find one on the thread - maybe someone took a pic?)


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## aopagary (Jun 30, 2008)

Posted By clifforddward on 21 Nov 2012 06:54 AM 
You are correct...as built this RH model is scaled to model 2ft gauge on 32mm track....the conversion kit is offered for use on 45mm gauge track purely for marketing purposes, ...
this is the answer i was looking for. it's good to know that it's designed for 32mm track and the conversion is to move the wheels out to 45mm and not the other way around. with the size described by most as small next to 1:20.3 scale, agree, that would be correct as i've seen some 2' gauge equipment and it generally very compact. i'm guessing that straddling 24" gauge rails had something to do with that.

maybe one last question, ...at 32mm are the wheel flanges (and gauge) robust enough to run on tinplate track? that would be a plus seeing as electrically poor O gauge track is very easy to come by.

well, for scratchbuilding, at least trucks might not be a big problem.
thanks for the input...gary


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## Dr Rivet (Jan 5, 2008)

Pete 

Steve King's 1:13.7 [7/8n2] Forney was made by Rishon Locomotive Works [Paul Travaskis] in Australia. It is one of about a half dozen produced. The Argyle Loco Works [Gordon Watson, also Australia] Forney is either 1:22 or 1:19, a MUCH SMALLER loco that compliments the RH #24.


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## llynrice (Jan 2, 2008)

My friend, Larry Green, has an SRRL #24 which he has modified to be a 1:20.3 light prairie type. If you are comfortable with detailing, the loco offers possibilities. And Larrys' still "runs like a Roundhouse."


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## Kovacjr (Jan 2, 2008)

Gary 

Here is the cars that I mentioned in my PM 

http://www.nemodel.com/shop/agora.cgi?cart_id=93473.10126*x62HI3&p_id=2250&xm=on&ppinc=search2 

My friend has a set of them that someone made, set on 45mm trucks but the cars are scaled for the #24. His 24 is also gauged for 45mm. When they are on 32mm track they do look much more correct. 

Also there are only 3 reservations open for the May 2013 batch. It is the only batch for 2013. Uness you are in search of a used one. There are early non sprung chassis versions that usally fetch a lower price, the newer sprung chassis ones typically are a higher dollar.


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## Daryl.E (Nov 13, 2012)

Gary, a friend of mine has the #24 and he and our crew run on his out door layout ,it is all mamod track( 20 years old) with no problems. My loco is the fowler from RH as well.


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## zubi (May 14, 2009)

Gary, Roundhouse SR&RL #24 is about 1:21 scale. You can order it with 32mm and 45mm wheelsets. NorthEast Narrow Gauge car kits go well with it. Best, Zubi


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

The Maine Narrow gauge stuff is SMALL. I am 6'2 and I can stand next to a coach on the ground and look right into the windows. I have to duck passing between coaches or stepping aboard. I can stand in the middle of the car and touch windows on both sides at the same time!









I model Maine Narrow gauge stuff and have a Roundhouse SR&RL 24 which is a fine running engine! I agree with the scale being close to 1:20.3. the higher quality models in 1:20.3 are generally 3 foot gauge stuff, however the cheap stuff from Bachman and the like are pretty good size wise for these engines. LGB and Bachman's passenger cars are about the right height and with for Maine Narrow gauge though the prototypes tended to be longer in proportion and lower to the ground. 









On the Left is a Bachman coach on the right a small scatch bilt coach which is about the right size and scale, based on Ted Stinson drawings from Garden Railways Magazine. 

Ted Stinson ran the NE narrow gauge company, he is old and not feeling well and the products are basically no longer available as far as I can tell. I placed an order for a coach last spring and it was not filled (nor was I charged)


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## HampshireCountyNarrowGage (Apr 4, 2012)

How would it stand up against an Accucraft 4-4-0? I like the idea of converting it to a small 3 ft 2-6-2. 

Chester Louis SA #64 
Hampshire County Narrow Gauge


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

It is an inside frame engine and thus perhaps not quite prototypical of American small 3 foot gauge engines but is very much similar size to the accucraft 4-4-0 and 2-6-0s. 

Larry Greene's engine looks great as a 3 foot gauge engine!


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## Dr Rivet (Jan 5, 2008)

Eric 

#24 is an OUTSIDE FRAME locomotive. Otherwise the drivers on the RH version would not be able to be regauged easily between 45 and 32mm. Admittedly one needs a different set of trucks for the tender and different pilot and trailing axles.


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## Garratt (Sep 15, 2012)

Eric, have you tried putting the smaller Bachmann 24mm wheels on the coach to get it to sit lower? 
I think the prototype wheels are 20" so they would scale to about 25mm in 1:20.3. 
The prototype SR&RL trucks are different being a shorter wheelbase too but it would be an easy mod sitting lower for that squat narrow gauge look. 

Andrew


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

Jim-- you are of course correct...I mis"spoke" 

Andrew-- my scratch built coach does use the smaller wheels from Bachman as do most of my freight cars. the Bachman coaches are little used and totally unmodified.


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## StevenJ (Apr 24, 2009)

You could pretend it is 2 1/2 foot or 30 inch gauge. That's what I do with my RH Liberty Bell 2-6-2. I own an Accucraft 4-4-0 and it looks kind of short next to it and small but not too bad. 

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n206/StevenJ61/Homelayout/layout07.mp4 

Not the best quality but here is video of my RH Liberty Bell 2-6-2 double heading with my Accucraft 4-4-0.


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## HampshireCountyNarrowGage (Apr 4, 2012)

Steven - Is there something missing from the address? It takes you to a page saying top category. I'd like to see your 2-6-2 with your 4-4-0. 

Llyn - Isn't Larry a member here on MLS? Think you could get him to give up some details on it? 

Chester Louis SA #64 
Hampshire County Narrow Gauge


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## Scottychaos (Jan 2, 2008)

Unfortunately you cant just paste a link directly into a message as-is..the forum "breaks" it..
you have to hit the "insert hyperlink" button, past the link into the URL field, and then,
(the most important step) you have to give it a *different name* in the "title" field..
then the link will work:

Link to StevenJ's video, from a post above 

Scot


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## StevenJ (Apr 24, 2009)

Ok okay that should be it just in case Scott's link doesn't work also thanks my bad.


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## Larry Green (Jan 2, 2008)

Hi Chester, yes, I am here. A description of my conversion of SR24 to a true 3-foot engine was posted here on the live steam forum when it was completed, but I can't remember the date. You can try the archives. The photo of it unpainted pretty well describes the changes and additions--numerous Trackside Details and Precision Scale castings, as well as scratch-built parts. 
Regardless of whatever scale RH may have used, the model's dimensions checked out in 1:20.3 when compared to drawings I have of prototype 3-foot small 2-6-2s and similar engines, except for the height. The cab was correctly sized, but sat too low. I made a new stepped deck, raising the cab a scale 9 inches. An extension was fitted to the stack, and coal boards added to the tender to complete the effect. 
While dwarfed by a K-28, as it should be, my Belden Falls #12 represents the small plantation (Godchaux Sugar, Argent Cypress) and industrial engines that used to be numerous, including more than a few that had outside frames (Catskill & Tannersville #2). 
I am awaiting delivery of a new RH Alco-Cooke 2-6-2. The tiny prototypes were built here in Patterson, NJ to 60cm (2 ft.) gauge for the British War Dept. during WWI. While the surviving Alcos now owned by museum lines retain their original gauge, five similarly-sized Hunslet 4-6-0s were regauged to 3 foot and remained in service well into the 19402. So, there is a prototype for most anything, dimensions included. I haven't decided yet how much conversion work I will do to this one. 

Larry


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## llynrice (Jan 2, 2008)

Here is the original thread about the mods to Larry's light prairie: http://www.mylargescale.com/Community/Forums/tabid/56/aff/11/aft/85756/afv/topic/Default.aspx#102703


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