# steam oil



## cjsrch (May 29, 2010)

I was trying to read a thread on steam oil in the archive at http://www.mylargescale.com/Communi...C_ID=29566
how ever everything in there seems to only have the opening post

so on that note can anyone tell me about the Lucas Heavy Duty Oil Stabilizer as well as how to view the archive.


BTW this is for a ruby kit that i am waiting for  Wanted to do live steam for ever. used to dream of owning a live steam


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## Kovacjr (Jan 2, 2008)

If you need Steam oil I would use the Green Velvet 460. Which is designed for steam cylinders not a internal combustion engine. I have been using both these oils for a few years now and will continue to for many to come. 

http://www.steamenginelube.com/cylinderoil.htm 

It is the 1st oil in the list. 

And for a bearing/bushing oil for all the external lubrication needs 

http://www.steamenginelube.com/engineoil.htm 

The 1st one in the list.


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By cjsrch on 29 May 2010 06:46 PM 
I was trying to read a thread on steam oil in the archive at http://www.mylargescale.com/Communi...C_ID=29566
how ever everything in there seems to only have the opening post

so on that note can anyone tell me about the Lucas Heavy Duty Oil Stabilizer as well as how to view the archive.


BTW this is for a ruby kit that i am waiting for  Wanted to do live steam for ever. used to dream of owning a live steam




Lucas Oil does not emulsify with water, which is a primary requirement for steam cylinder oil. Yes, there are lots of folk that use it and say they do not see any problems with their locomotives after using it, but I seriously wonder if they are risking damage in the long run.

All those threads you can only see the lead post were eaten in an accident to the database, (I am not sure if it was an attack on the site or just some other gremlin) but the gist of most of the responses are what you have read here. Use Steam Cylinder Oil if you want to be assured that your engine will not wear out prematurely. Green Velvet is supposed to be prettygood stuff, but you can get Steam Cylinder Oil from your local Heating Oil dealer in most cities. But you have to buy it in what for us small scale Live Steamers is a humongus quantity... 5-Gal bucket for somewhere around $30... That is what I paid about 9 years ago (price has probably gone up, just like gasoline has). That is enough for several life times of regular running of steam in the garden.


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## cjsrch (May 29, 2010)

Ok but it sounds like it would work atleast for a few runs. 
I want to get a large amount of the correct stuff and was supposed to get some with my order but it looks like they did not send it. 

from what i read mobil 600w is supposed to be a good one to use. just having trouble tracking it down localy


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

See: 

http://www.southernsteamtrains.com/misc/steam-oil-hwade.htm


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

I tried the Lucas for a while and was disappointed. It seems "gummy" and made the engines drag. It's only positive feature is that it ia avaliable at any auto parts store. Stay with the Green Velvet or any ISO 460 gear oil.


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Please, not 'any gear oil', Gear Oil and Steam Cylinder Oil are NOT the same thing. Steam Cylinder Oil has tallow in it which enables it to emulsify in water (steam). The "460" number is the weight of the oil and is a measure of its viscosity, but not an indicator of it intended use. Use only Genuine "Steam Cylinder Oil".


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## Dan Pantages (Jan 2, 2008)

I have never understood the debate on steam oil. It comes up several times a year and it’s always “well I use this, it’s not bad and it’s cheap”. We pay thousands of dollars for our steam engines not to mention what else we spend on the hobby so why try and save a few dollars a year on stuff that’s “not bad but it’s cheap”? If you are really trying to save money then go out and buy a 5 gallon pail of proper steam oil for about $45, keep a gallon and sell the other 4 gallons for $12 each, or split it with 4 other friends and each pay $10 for a gallon, a gallon will last you for ages. 

ISO VG 320/460 SUS 142 at 212 F 

STEAM CYLINDER OIL thermally stable oil designed to reduce the buildup of harmful deposits caused by the high operating temperatures of steam cylinders. This chemically stable oil protects against rust and corrosion, provide good film strength, excellent lubricity and resistance to oxidation and foam. It is excellent for all types of stationary engines and locomotives, from O-gauge to 7.1/2". 

Everyone debates what kind of water to use and then try and save a few pennies on oil. Well you can clean out the damage, build up, from “bad” water but when the wrong oil is used the damage is significant and you can’t just clean it up with a little white vinegar.


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## Larry Green (Jan 2, 2008)

Dan, I agree with you 100% 

Larry


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## Dave -- Use Coal (Feb 19, 2008)

This is a topic that I comment on whenever it comes up.

I suggest you read the information on Roundhouse - Engineering on the topic of steam oil. I suggest the use of Roundhouse steam oil or Green Velvet. Both have formulations developed for small scale live steam locoomotives.


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## cjsrch (May 29, 2010)

IT isnt a price issue. its more of a "i cant find it localy and need to order some but only have 1 week off and i want to run the train a few times "issue 
Do you really think using sub par oil is going to cause damage after only severl short runs? most of them being on compressed air bench runs?


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## Kovacjr (Jan 2, 2008)

The lubricator will not work as designed on compressed air. The lubricator is designed to allow oil into the steam line from the steam condensating in the lubricator there fore pushing the oil up and into the pipe. If you order the green velvet you would have it in just a few days as I did.


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## k5pat (Jan 18, 2008)

cjsrch,
If you tell us where you live perhaps one of us lives near you and can get you some of the right stuff until you receive yours. Also it would be nice to know your name. CJSRCH does not flow off the lips nicely.







If you want to run-in the chassis on air you can squirt some light weight oil into the steam line to the cylinders. That will suffice to lubricate the pistons during run-in. However, I agree with everyone else, when running on steam use real steam oil and you will avoid costly maintenance in the future.


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## steamboatmodel (Jan 2, 2008)

If you run on steam use real steam oil. 
If you run on air use air tool lub oil. 
Regards, 
Gerald.


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## afinegan (Jan 2, 2008)

Hey cjsrch,

I have and use the green velvet steam oil, I can give you some if you want, my bottle has lasted me almost 2 years lol, I know you live near me








Its best to use the right stuff and not take chances, it has to be carried to the cylinders in the steam and wont run right without it (also risk prematurely wearing down metal parts)


I also have an air compressor and have timed my coal fired ruby and my butane ruby if you would like timing help (and a nice layout in the back for testing )

Send me a PM (or email), if your interested (Ill figure out some time on the weekend to do this)


Andrew


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## Chris Scott (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Dan Pantages on 31 May 2010 12:59 AM 
I have never understood the debate on steam oil. It comes up several times a year and it’s always “well I use this, it’s not bad and it’s cheap”. We pay thousands of dollars for our steam engines not to mention what else we spend on the hobby so why try and save a few dollars a year on stuff that’s “not bad but it’s cheap”? If you are really trying to save money then go out and buy a 5 gallon pail of proper steam oil for about $45, keep a gallon and sell the other 4 gallons for $12 each, or split it with 4 other friends and each pay $10 for a gallon, a gallon will last you for ages. 

*ISO VG 320/460 SUS 142 at 212 F *

STEAM CYLINDER OIL thermally stable oil designed to reduce the buildup of harmful deposits caused by the high operating temperatures of steam cylinders. This chemically stable oil protects against rust and corrosion, provide good film strength, excellent lubricity and resistance to oxidation and foam. It is excellent for all types of stationary engines and locomotives, from O-gauge to 7.1/2". 

Everyone debates what kind of water to use and then try and save a few pennies on oil. Well you can clean out the damage, build up, from “bad” water but when the wrong oil is used the damage is significant and you can’t just clean it up with a little white vinegar. 





Dan:
Couple question arose in my small brain about the steam oil spec you posted: 

What does the temp part (SUS 142 at 212 F) of it mean? 

Who is the manufacturer of that particular spec'd steam oil?


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## k5pat (Jan 18, 2008)

Chris,
Look here for info on SUS. 


Also HERE is a handy viscosity chart for the technically minded.


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## Dan Pantages (Jan 2, 2008)

The ISO: International Organization for Standardization issued a regulation known as "ISO 3448 Liquid Industrial Lubricants" that classifies lubricants on the basis of their kinematic viscosity value at 40°C (expressed in mm2/sec). 
Different numbers mark different ISO VG (VG=Viscosity Grade) levels coming close to its viscosity interval value. 

The 460 = Medium Viscosity at 40°C in mm2/sec 

Saybolt, Saybolt Universal Seconds, SUS, or SSU - The most common viscosity measurement prior to the international acceptance of centistokes, SUS measurements are now obsolete. To convert measurements from SUS at 100F to an approximate value in cSt at 40C (ISO viscosity grade), divide the SUS value by 5. 

Centistoke (cSt) - Unit of measure for Kinematic Viscosity. 

It’s not a brand, it’s a specification. I use Texaco because they are right beside our 7 ½” park and a sponsor of the British Columbia Society of Model Engineers.


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