# Indoor 13 ft x 16 ft shelf in 'G', can it be done?



## Bill in NH (Mar 22, 2010)

Thanks in advance for your replies. Changed subject line to read 13 ft x 16 ft from 13 x 16. Sorry about that!
Bill in New Hampshire


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## Bill in NH (Mar 22, 2010)

*RE: Indoor 13 x 16 shelf in 'G', can it be done?*








MM?? I had typed in a long note to go with the above, but it vanished except for my 'Thanks for the reply' line. In short, can I fit a 'G' shelf layout (wall on 3 sides with one duck under) in this 16 x 13 space and maybe run 4-4-0s without making it toy like? Or should I drop back to 3-rail scale for this area? In 3-rail my plans were for my biggest loop with 42" radius. I've never built in 'G' before so know little of the track radius available or what looks good. Any links to 'G' plans or layout ideads would be helpfull. I did not wish to limit myself to running only very small 0-4-0s or small mine type switchers.
Thanks again,Bill


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## Torby (Jan 2, 2008)

*RE: Indoor 13 x 16 shelf in 'G', can it be done?*

13 by 16 what? Millimeters? No way.


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## Bill in NH (Mar 22, 2010)

*RE: Indoor 13 x 16 shelf in 'G', can it be done?*

Sorry, That would be 16 ft. x 13 ft. 
Bill


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## Torby (Jan 2, 2008)

*RE: Indoor 13 x 16 shelf in 'G', can it be done?*

Sounds cool.


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## Peter Osborne (Jan 5, 2008)

Yes. I'm assuming 13 inches by 16 feet? You would be limited to a point to point line with perhaps a spring switch to send the train back on an alternate track. A trolley/traction line could be fun if you set it up with an automatic reversing unit like the Little Critter control. That way you could have an intermediate stop. 

More info, better answers. 

Peter.


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## cape cod Todd (Jan 3, 2008)

I would think you could fit alot of action into a 13' x 16' area. I have alot of action setup around the Christmas tree that includes 2 joined loops and 2 sidings and it all fits into a spot maybe 5' x 8' It uses the LGB R1 curves which are only a 4' diameter. Using this size really limits what you can run before it starts to look strange overhanging the rails. But with such a big area you could use nice 10' curves and really set up a nice layout where you could run many different sorts and lengths of train wihtout making it look to toy like. You could add some elevation, make some hills and tunnels etc.. I see a continous loop maybe a dog bone type with a switching yard and a couple of sidings. Trains always had a purpose to either deliver freight or people so you need a start and finish, Think about what you would like to run and plan for it. 
I think you have plenty of room to play.


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## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

Bill, 

My first foray into G scale [aaghh - did i actually write that? Guess its OK as I started with a 1:22.5 Big Hauler.] Oh yes, my first layout was in a loft that measured 12 x 16 plus a corner storage room. 

One side was a wide shelf (24"?) with three tracks and the other was just a 6" shelf on brackets. Under the window was my workbench and a bookshelf, so the track curved over the bench and through the side of the bookshelf, then over my son's slot car track (which was on a table) using a couple of Lionel bridges, to meet the shelf on the other side of the room. 

I ran the track through the corner storage room by carefully cutting out tunnel mouths in the plasterboard/drywall. (I got so good at the cutting I could put them back with spackling and you'd never know they'd been cut out!) The curved track in the storage was on an old folding table - I intended to put extra tracks in there but never got round to it. 

The side wall of the storage was cut and a lifting bridge on a hinge got the track back to the wide side shelf. I think I can find a couple of pics - this is all pre-digital camera! Here's the bridge, with wooden sticks for planking.










This is a view of the wide shelf: (whiskey containers = grain hoppers?)










Radius was about 4' minimum. I ran an Aristo Pacific and 2 heayweights with no problems. It was a fun operation.


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## Bill in NH (Mar 22, 2010)

Cape Cod Todd & Pete, 
Thanks for your replies and pics. What I have available is a basement area 13ft x 16ft with walls on both 16ft sides and wall on one 13ft side. The other side will be across a open area with a 'duckunder' or removable bridge through part of it. My first plans were to have both 16ft side shelfs be 3 ft deep and the back 13 ft wall the shelf/table coud be 4ft , maybe 5 ft ( a stretch), to give a 13 ft x 4/5 ft table. So I could run a , say Bachmamn (sp) 4-4-0 or 4-6-0 on 10 ft radius/ or was that 10 ft dia? What size radius( or is dia. used in 'G' Gague track?) are available and what is the most widely used track/switches? Aristo Craft? I know LGB is, I guess, the best quaility, but I hear their track LGB can get quite $$$$. My original goal was to build a garden railroad. Seeing I thought I'd like to run live steam, I bought 2 live steam 4-4-0s and the Aristo live steam 2-8-2 Mike a few years back. I've never steamed any of them. Now knowing I'll never get to that garden railroad it's getting time to let them go ( though I HATE to. The 4-4-0s are like small works of art!). Back to the planning board tonite sketching out track plans with a 10ft dia/radius to see what will fit. 
Yes, I do need to figure out just how 'G' track sectional track is measured. Is a 10 ft cruve in 'G' mean 10ft dia. or 10 ft radius? and what would the normal track spacing be between paralell running tracks center to center? and!! if I used, I'd say #4 turnouts, how much space(ft) would be required to complete the 2 switch installation? 
Sorry for all the basic questions. 
Bill


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## Bill in NH (Mar 22, 2010)

OH PETE! You ran a Aristo Craft 4-6-2 on 4ft min radius?


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## stanman (Jan 4, 2008)

Consider an overhead layout. Mine is 18 ft x 13 ft with room for lots of action. A couple feet less would work too.

The photo points toward the 13 ft dimension.


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## SoCalStu (Dec 27, 2007)

This room is 12' wide using 8'di. curves on the end and on the right. On the left are R1 curves and switches and normally restricted to the smaller engines.


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## ThinkerT (Jan 2, 2008)

With that kind of space, 10 foot diameter curves might take more of a 'bite' out of the corners than you'd care for. 

8 foot diamter curves (R3) should work just fine. 

Your classic track plan options for a space like that, though, are a tad limited - at least with 8 foot diamer curves. Basically, they come down to: 

1) A folded dogbone, although the space here is so tight it will be more of a squashed oval. On the plus side, you get to avoid having a duck under or removable section to enter the layout; on the not so good side, you are looking at some serious 'reach' issues. 

2) A oval or double tracked oval - a popular idea, if a bit boring. Thing with this, though, is you don't get a lot of mainline run here; your locomotive engineer can be waving at the people in the one town before the brakeman in the caboose has said goodbye to his wife in the other. 

Given this, you might want to think about an 'inside folded figure eight' type deal - the mainline makes two loops around the room, with a crossover dropped in to make this work. This gets you double the mainline run a classic oval would in much the same space. You probably have enough space to where, with 8 foot diameter curves, and a 2 foot squeeze at the one point, you could stick the inner loop on a large peninsula coming out from one of the 'long walls', with the remainder on two to three foot wide shelves, except for your liftout section.


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## SoCalStu (Dec 27, 2007)

Why don't my pics show? I tried it at 640 and 320 wide from Photobucket. Nadda!


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## Dan Pierce (Jan 2, 2008)

Train-Li has 6 foot diameter R2 curves and we found the Aristo SD45 and Pacific will run through the R2 switch with passenger cars without derailing. 
Aristo does spec these at 8 foot needed. Sure there is overhang, I am just pointing out it can work.


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## Jim Schulz (Aug 10, 2009)

Bill in NH, when you're ready to let those live steam 4-4-0s go, let me know. I'd be interested.


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## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

You ran a Aristo Craft 4-6-2 on 4ft min radius? 
And why not? It look great on the straight bits! 
The end curves had straights in them, (see bridge photo) and I recall the room was 12' wide. So they had to be 5' radius or less. 

I'd like to run live steam 
It's possible to run indoors. There's a fire danger that can easily be minimized by good ventilation (install a bathroom fan or other type in a window and run it.) The room will get humid - run the fan! And butane in the air needs to be removed when you're filling the tank, so get as big a fan as will fit. 

normal track spacing be between paralell running tracks 
On tight curves or if you plan double track and Aristo heavyweights, you need more space. Trains are about 5" wide, so figure at least 6" spacing on the straights and more if you can.


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## Tom Leaton (Apr 26, 2008)

Bill, 

With 4 foot Radius curved track, you can run a Delton 2-8-0. a Big Hauler 4-6-0, or any LGB loco. Our Bachmann spectrum 2-6-0 old timer slows on the curves slightly but runs fine. The Big Hauler and LGB items seemingly run on anything made.


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## Totalwrecker (Feb 26, 2009)

Posted By SoCalStu on 04 Apr 2010 04:15 PM 
Why don't my pics show? I tried it at 640 and 320 wide from Photobucket. Nadda!

Try posting the link not the pic, I don't think regular members can post pics.
Before I upgraded I had to use photobucket that way...
I found I got better responses when I could post the pic in the thread and also decided that I would support the site.
I'll be renewing in a couple of weeks...

John


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## vsmith (Jan 2, 2008)

Given your limitations of space and desire to use wide radius curves you could do something as simple as the left, or a bit more like the plan on the right, or some variation, but not much else IMO. those wide radius curves are going to eat up most of your available space but it can be done. all turnouts are 8' diameter and you still have some reverse S conditions at the turnouts but then there isnt much space to work with. I could plan quite a complex layout in this space for myself, but then I'm a bigger advocate of R1s for indoor use. Good luck with this.


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