# Fueling Discussion



## CapeCodSteam (Jan 2, 2008)

I have heard the term "Aster Snob" tossed around here from day one. 
And over the past few weeks it came together for me. 
Some spirit runners do it because their fuel source is renewable, as opposed to the cans of fossil fuel. 
And what about the cans? 
We buy them by the case, they never completely empty and then there is the waste cans to be disposed of, or better yet recycled
And then you have the damn adapters, paid extra out of pocket
Made by fellow steamers in their basement shops to offset the expense of their hobby
Micro economy at work

Which brings me back to the term "Aster Snob"
Aster has been mainly fired, which is great for the cold climates
The Acc Hudson offered one with meths 
I would like to see them create more


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## Bruce (Jan 3, 2008)

Totally agree with you. I want to try my hands to an alki engine but the cheapest one I can think of is the new Aster Baldwin at 2800 to 3000 dollars. 
Would love to see Accucraft build one of the smaller engines like the new forney or the AML engines in alki versions. But than after you add the axle pump, sight glass and a new boiler design, 
the price will sky rocket. 

Bruce


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## CapeCodSteam (Jan 2, 2008)

I'm kinda groovin' on the idea of a drunk S-12. 
Ponder that idea Ryan
I might have to rename it Robot Chicken


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## rbednarik (Jan 2, 2008)

Kent, 

Pondering away. Already looking at how best it would be to fit a burner under there.


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## CapeCodSteam (Jan 2, 2008)

Meth fired S-12?


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## ConrailRay (Jan 2, 2008)

I just happened to get an S-12 as well, and was considering altering it to alcohol. my last few experiences with butane haven't been so good  

The S-12 I got had some custom work done to it - something with the burner, larger tender hand pump, and a new gas tank built and put into the tender with a quick disconnect filler and new gas valve. 
Maybe I can trade the tender as to not waste the work!! 

-Ray


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## HMeinhold (Jan 2, 2008)

I converted all of my alcohol fired locos to Butane. The reason: some severe fires caused by derailments here in dry California. 
Regards


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## CapeCodSteam (Jan 2, 2008)

What color Ray?


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## ConrailRay (Jan 2, 2008)

Hi Kent, 

black #1251 (non raised letters) 

-Ray


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## Shay Gear Head (Jan 3, 2008)

Just to keep the record straight the Accucraft Forney's do include a sight glass.


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## lotsasteam (Jan 3, 2008)

http://ygingras.net/b/2007/6/a-better-soda-can-stove

Just the thing aster snobs need! of course a little bit modified it would fit any loco!

Manfred Diel


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## seadawg (Jan 2, 2008)

I don't know anything about snobs, but it seems more about narrow vs standard gauge. (The only two Asters I own are narrow gauge butane fired.) Why should only the standard gauge guys be allowed to imbibe???

I'm working on a project to change that stereotype. The burner pictured below is destined to be placed between the frames of my Accucraft C-16 Bumblebee. I have given thought about posting some progress reports on this website, but I'd probably be trying to extinguish flames of a different type. (oooh, they never used that livery in day to day service or oooh, you might kill somebody with that cobbled together hack job of ticking time bomb style boiler). I'm leaning more towards posting the progress, 'cause I have a fairly thick skin after spending 20 years in Uncle Sam's canoe club (I'll probably get flamed for calling the U.S. Navy a canoe club!







)

Anyhow, who want's to see an Accucraft C-16 alcohol conversion???? Here's the burner (notice, it's on fire, stand back from the flame) :









Oh, by the way, yes those are .44 Mag cases....


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## CapeCodSteam (Jan 2, 2008)

Dave, 

I'd love to see progress, post away


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## David Leech (Dec 9, 2008)

So Dave, 
Are you building a new boiler, or modifying the existing one by making it into a type 'C', or WHAT. 
I doubt that it will work as a pot boiler, will it? 
All the best, 
David Leech, Delta, Canada


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## Cougar Rock Rail (Jan 2, 2008)

I'm with Henner on this one. I've seen way too many meths fires to want to be anywhere near the stuff. While I understand the proported enviro benefits and that some boiler configurations lend themselves to meths...sure isn't for me. In fact the very first Aster I ever saw run (or attempt to run) went up in a ball of flames and almost burnt the building down. 

Keith


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## seadawg (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By David Leech on 04 Feb 2010 11:28 AM 
So Dave, 
Are you building a new boiler, or modifying the existing one by making it into a type 'C', or WHAT. 
I doubt that it will work as a pot boiler, will it? 
All the best, 
David Leech, Delta, Canada 

With the valve gear / eccentrics there's not much room for a proper pot boiler burner, and one of my reasons for attempting this conversion was the added complexity of the blower / blast pipe. My ultimate goal is coal but the C-16 would have an extremely small grate area if I attempted to build a true wet walled firebox. So to answer your question, I'm building a JvR "C" type boiler from scratch.


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## David Leech (Dec 9, 2008)

Dave, 
I am really not familiar with this loco, other than watching them run past, so I might be way off here. 
There is a guy in the UK who has converted his Aster gas burning K4 and NYC Hudson into alcohol, just by fitting the 'C' type 'end' to the existing boiler. 
Don't know how he does it, but it does apparently work 
Then all you have to do is to add the 'blower' bits! 
It might save you building a whole new boiler. 
I have a Hudson boiler waiting for me to experiment with, one day when I find time. 
All the best, 
David Leech, Delta, Canada


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## Spule 4 (Jan 2, 2008)

Hmm, alcohol fires vs gas fire/explosion. Dealing both with gases and flammable liquids for work, I know which one I would rather be around.


Also, alcohol can be fired in the cold, fuel can be found anywhere, no adaptors/fillers/right mix to find.


And finally....
If you have a sight glass, a way to add water to the loco (pump, goodall, etc.) with an alcohol loco one can keep it under fire or operation for hours. Or at least I have.

And as far as Std/narrow gauge, here is a "retro" option, I was just talking about drooling over this loco 25 years ago:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Live-Steam-Ro...2eaad8cfbd


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## Steve S. (Jan 2, 2008)

You guys have this "*ASTER SNOB* " thing all wrong. It has nothing to do with meths vs. gas............ or SG vs. NG. It is much simpler then that. A "*ASTER SNOB"* is somebody that thinks that the only engine worth owning is an *ASTER*. And if he does own other engines along with his *ASTERS*, he will always tell you that his *ASTERS* are by far the best. Also remember that there are different degrees of "*ASTER SNOBS "* out there just like there are many different engines out there. You may finally morph off to the point that you find yourself scratching the word *ASTER* onto the sides of your other brands of engines with a sharp nail. How do I know so much about this..................??


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## jfrank (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Steve S. on 04 Feb 2010 03:13 PM 
You guys have this "*ASTER SNOB* " thing all wrong. It has nothing to do with meths vs. gas............ or SG vs. NG. It is much simpler then that. A "*ASTER SNOB"* is somebody that thinks that the only engine worth owning is an *ASTER*. And, if he does own other engines along with his *ASTERS*, he will always tell you that his *ASTERS* are by far the best. Also remember that there are different degrees of "*ASTER SNOBS "* out there just like there are many different engines out there. You may finally morf off to the point that you find yourself scrathing the word *ASTER* onto the sides of your other brands of engines with a sharp nail. How do I know so much about this..................??










Steve forgot to tell you that as an Aster Snob you have to know the secret handshake to be able to stand in the 'Aster Corner' at Diamondhead and be recognized.


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## Steve S. (Jan 2, 2008)

John, the "*Secret handshake[/i]*_ "_ is only trusted to those *Aster* owners that own the most highly sought after prized *Aster* articulated engines or *Aster* engines that have individual, real, (not a casting) leaf springs.


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## rbednarik (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By seadawg on 04 Feb 2010 10:20 AM 
I don't know anything about snobs, but it seems more about narrow vs standard gauge. (The only two Asters I own are narrow gauge butane fired.) Why should only the standard gauge guys be allowed to imbibe???

I'm working on a project to change that stereotype. The burner pictured below is destined to be placed between the frames of my Accucraft C-16 Bumblebee. I have given thought about posting some progress reports on this website, but I'd probably be trying to extinguish flames of a different type. (oooh, they never used that livery in day to day service or oooh, you might kill somebody with that cobbled together hack job of ticking time bomb style boiler). I'm leaning more towards posting the progress, 'cause I have a fairly thick skin after spending 20 years in Uncle Sam's canoe club (I'll probably get flamed for calling the U.S. Navy a canoe club!







)

Anyhow, who want's to see an Accucraft C-16 alcohol conversion???? Here's the burner (notice, it's on fire, stand back from the flame) :









Oh, by the way, yes those are .44 Mag cases....


Dave,

Yes please! Looking forward to seeing the finished product. That should be one powerful engine. You've got to ask yourself one question on that burner: "Do I feel lucky?"..."Well, do ya?"


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## Steve S. (Jan 2, 2008)

Ryan.......................... Ah yes, Dirty Harry, one of my all time favorites.


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## Spule 4 (Jan 2, 2008)

Yes, please post more pix of such projects.


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## tacfoley (Jan 3, 2008)

Posted By Steve S. on 04 Feb 2010 03:55 PM 
John, the "*Secret handshake[/i]*_ "_ is only trusted to those *Aster* owners that own the most highly sought after prized *Aster* articulated engines or *Aster* engines that have individual, real, (not a casting) leaf springs.

Ah, right. In THAT case, I, too, am an Aster Snob. Both of mine have real working leaf springs.

tac
www.ovgrs.org


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## seadawg (Jan 2, 2008)

Ok, so it looks like I got four votes for sharing the progress of the Alky conversion, so I'll probably do something along the lines of Larry "Redbeard" Newman's coverage of his Ruby-Heisler build. 

On a different note, I have a Regner engine that has individually built up leaf springs. Does that make me a Regner Snob??


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## Steve Shyvers (Jan 2, 2008)

Five votes. I converted a Roundhouse Billy to alcohol firing a couple of years ago. I used the stock boiler and added a firebox to the back end to make a "C-type" boiler. I used two 1/2" dia. wicks, and I added baffling to the single flue to slow down exhaust gas flow. Most of the hard work was in the smokebox to make it air tight and to figure out the blast pipe arrangement. 

Steve


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## seadawg (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Steve Shyvers on 05 Feb 2010 07:51 AM 
Five votes. I converted a Roundhouse Billy to alcohol firing a couple of years ago. I used the stock boiler and added a firebox to the back end to make a "C-type" boiler. I used two 1/2" dia. wicks, and I added baffling to the single flue to slow down exhaust gas flow. Most of the hard work was in the smokebox to make it air tight and to figure out the blast pipe arrangement. 

Steve 


Steve, your articles were my inspiration to get off my butt. And it is looking like the blast pipe will be somewhat difficult because of "converting" what is already there for exhaust connections. (3MM threaded outlet and I want a .080" orifice @ 36mm below my lower stack openeing.)

But I'm getting ahead of myself! Also one of my goals is to not do anything that is not reversable should I fail. The chicken feed fuel tank will require me to cut a hole in the bottom of the tender, so that's not happening until if and when the boiler works well. (I plan on making a simple tender with the proper sump size from a plastic Hartland flatcar.) 


Anyhow, I better save some information for my own thread.


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## Spule 4 (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Steve Shyvers on 05 Feb 2010 07:51 AM 
Five votes. I converted a Roundhouse Billy to alcohol firing a couple of years ago. I used the stock boiler and added a firebox to the back end to make a "C-type" boiler. I used two 1/2" dia. wicks, and I added baffling to the single flue to slow down exhaust gas flow. Most of the hard work was in the smokebox to make it air tight and to figure out the blast pipe arrangement. 

Steve 


Pictures please. By C-typ, I assume something like this?

http://www.southernsteamtrains.com/...rtypes.htm

Thanks!


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## Charles M (Jan 2, 2008)

I retro-fitted my Roundhouse " Old Coloninal " with a Roundhouse butane tank and stick burner of my own design so it is still a pot boiler. The reason for this was running alcohol the fumes gave me a roaring headache. I did make the conversion so the original tank and burner could be put right back in , requiring only 2 small screws to be removed to replace the tank. 

Charles M SA #74


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## Steve S. (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By seadawg on 05 Feb 2010 06:55 AM 


On a different note, I have a Regner engine that has individually built up leaf springs. Does that make me a Regner Snob??





*You bet it does! But I bet you don't have a secret handshake. *


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## CapeCodSteam (Jan 2, 2008)

Handshake, Shandhake... Brittany and I have secret tire tracks. A very exclusive club.


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## Britstrains (Feb 24, 2008)

HaHa you got it Kent!!


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## Steve S. (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By CapeCodSteam on 05 Feb 2010 09:52 PM 
Handshake, Shandhake... Brittany and I have secret tire tracks. A very exclusive club. 






That sounds much better then a *Secret Handshake*. Heck, and I thought that us *ASTER SNOBS* were cool. We got nothing on you.


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## CapeCodSteam (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Steve S. on 06 Feb 2010 07:10 PM 
Posted By CapeCodSteam on 05 Feb 2010 09:52 PM 
Handshake, Shandhake... Brittany and I have secret tire tracks. A very exclusive club. 






That sounds much better then a *Secret Handshake*. Heck, and I thought that us *ASTER SNOBS* were cool. We got nothing on you.









Steam Wheelies. Dwight is going to set up a thread for SW numbers, Brittany is SW #1 and I can be #2.







Not to thread jack, it is the perfect view. I love playing pool in a chair, I can see all the angles, and track side view for trains isn't so bad.


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## seadawg (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Steve S. on 05 Feb 2010 09:30 PM 
Posted By seadawg on 05 Feb 2010 06:55 AM 


On a different note, I have a Regner engine that has individually built up leaf springs. Does that make me a Regner Snob??





*You bet it does! But I bet you don't have a secret handshake. *




Nope, got our own language - Deutsch!







(Just kidding, I speak way more Japanese than German.)


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