# What's good/bad about HLW logger



## HaBi Farm (Aug 28, 2011)

I'm still trying to decide on a new loco to equip with a good sound system, probably Phoenix with Airwire & battery powered. I 'm starting to lean towards the HLW logging engine. It would be completely different from any other locos I have and would easily pull whatever I'd want to put behind it. The HLW logger looks pretty small so I'm assuming that some or most of the install would need to go in a trailing car. I also saw that it uses hook & loop so would need to be modified to connect to the 1st car in the consist. 

My second choice would be a Bachmann Annie. The Bachmanns have had a history of cracked gears and derailing front trucks, but it appears that these are no longer concerns with the new Annie. Are there concerns that have come up with the HLW logger? 

Any other good choices out there? I like the looks of the Bachmann C-19 2-8-0 but it would be an additional $500. Also, most of my layout is 10' curves or bigger but a side loop has 6 1/2' curves (diameter).


the other Rodney


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## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

That is a very personal question. It is all about what YOU like. As far as I know they are all reliable. 

Chuck

Your question is sort of like, I want to get married. Should I marry a blonde, brunette, or a redhead?


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## Treeman (Jan 6, 2008)

You are correct about the HLW, it has very little room for much of anything. It is a very good puller.


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## Dave Meashey (Jan 2, 2008)

Rodney;

The HLW logger was not that hard to mount Kadees to. I think that most of the available space is used for weights, so a trailing car for sound and control options is probably a must.










Enjoy whichever locomotive you choose.

Best,
David Meashey


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## mickey (Jan 28, 2009)

Blonde.


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## Dan Pierce (Jan 2, 2008)

The Bachmann Annie is not a strong puller. The HLW Big John is a very strong puller.
However the Annie has lots of room in the tender for electronics and speaker and has a chuff sensor in the engine with a wire already going to the tender for this.


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## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

What cars are you pulling, LGB, Bachmann big haulers and similar sized cars from other manufacturers (1:22.5/24), or Accucraft (NG) and Bachmann Spectrum (both1:20.3)?

The three engines you mentioned may represent three different scales. The HLW engine is 1:24 (?). The Annie is 1:22.5 and the 2-8-0 is 1:20.3. I'm not sure about the scale of the HLW loco, but I think it is 1:24.

In my opinion the 1:20.3 engines, even the Connie which is a smaller sized engine, appear large relative to 1:22.5/24 rolling stock. If you are pulling lower logging cars, flats, etc. it may not be as noticeable. But with higher cars like passenger, box, reefer, etc., the size difference is noticeable.

Chuck


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## Stan Cedarleaf (Jan 2, 2008)

Rodney, I've been using the HLW Big John with radio control for years. (I have 3) 

All the electronics and sound are in a follow box car with a simple 2 wire connecting cord to the engine. Very simple and easy to do. Control system is the CREST REVOLUTION and I've used a number of different sound systems.

The HLW Big John is an excellent puller. I've tested it with 30 cars without a problem. I like a train of 10-15 cars with a caboose for my layout.


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## HaBi Farm (Aug 28, 2011)

I had wondered how the scale of the HLW logger loco would compare to the the cars I have - an assortment of flatbeds (usually log loads), gondolas (also log load), and Bachmann Big Hauler. Definitely not a unit train look. And if I put the taller cars at the end of the consist the height difference would be less noticeable. I see in Dave's picture that the caboose must be quite a bit taller than the loco. But I'm representing a poor line that has to use what it can get.

Any mechanical weaknesses or common breakdowns to be aware of? How does it stay on the rails if the track and switches are less than perfect?

For a trailing car with the install inside, I'd want to use a log load. Any tips on how to disguise/hollow out the load to give the space needed for the install?

the other Rodney


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## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

Rodney

Logging railroads often had to move equipment and supplies around. I don't think that a trailing box car would look out of place. You could also use a high sided gondola and put everything low along the bottom and cover it with logs.

A combine could also be used. They were common on many backwoods railroads to move supplies, miners, loggers etc. Hartland has a nice looking one.

Chuck


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## HaBi Farm (Aug 28, 2011)

I'm still concerned that the HLW logger loco will seem a little too small for the rolling stock I already have. I've looked at several websites and can't find the dimensions for HLW locos or cars. If I knew HLW dimensions (width, height, length) then I could measure what I have to see if they'd be in the same ballpark.

Can anyone point me to a website with HLW dimensions? Or measure what they've got and post it here?

the other Rodney


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## CliffyJ (Apr 29, 2009)

Another car option might be a short flat car with a skidded camp building on it, in the style of something like...

http://www.ozarkminiatures.com/scripts/prodList.asp?idCategory=1263


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## CliffyJ (Apr 29, 2009)

Rodney, here's some quick (approximate) dimensions.

length = 14"
height (top of stack) = 7 1/4" from railhead
height (top of cab) = 6 1/8" from railhead
width = 4 1/2"

It's probably 1:24. 

Cliff


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## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

At 14" it is just 1/2" shorter than an LGB narrow gauge box car, also 1:24. My Bachmann Climax (1:20.3) is about 16" long. An Accucraft 1:20.3 box car is about 18" long. They go well together, and I think the HLW logger would look fine with any 1:24 rolling stock. Especially if you are running a backwoods logging/mining RR.

Chuck

PS As long as your engine can pull the train it can never be too small. Here is a picture from a book on MINNESOTA LOGGING RAILROADS by Frank King.


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## CliffyJ (Apr 29, 2009)

Nice pic Chuck. With that a loco that small, it's even an opportunity for that Bachmann "industrial mogul."


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## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

Cliff

I have several pictures of small engines with large cars, but I haven't seen any of the reverse, large engines and small cars. That is probably why I can't pull a 1:22.5/24 train behind a 1:20.3 engine. It just doesn't look reasonable to me.

Chuck


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## docwatsonva (Jan 2, 2008)

I have been involved with the construction of a garden RR at the Western North Carolina Arboretum. Most of the track and equipment was donated and had to be utilized. We needed to find a reasonably priced dependable engine. We selected an HLW Paul Bunyan. Because of the limited construction time allowed for the RR, we felt that battery R/C was the best operational solution.

The show (Winter LIghts Festival) for which the RR was built ended last Sunday. The PB was run 7 days a week, 4 hours per night for about 6 weeks. That totalled over 170 hours of trouble free operation. Who could ask for more.

The PB is a small engine so we decided to install all the electronics and battery in a trailing car which turned out to be a Bachmann gondola. Wiring modifications to the PB to allow control from a trailing car was a piece of cake. We installed a 6000mAh battery, a G Scale Graphics RailBoss system, and a Phoenix sound system. It fit with room to spare.











One of the project volunteers, Scott Williams, also an MLS member, did the install and created a very nice styrene faux cargo box to conseal it. Photo below.












Here's the setup with the PB.











Doc


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## HaBi Farm (Aug 28, 2011)

3 big thank yous to doc, chuck, and cliff. That was a great observation that it was common to have small locos pulling big cars, but not the other way round. Doc - what is the length of the Bachmann gondola that you used? It looks about the same as the Paul Bunyan, or about 14"?

Most of my current rolling stock is Bachmann Big Hauler style, so probably closer to 1:20.3 than 1:24. But not as big as the Bachmann Spectrum cars.

the other Rodney


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## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

Most if not all of the Bachmann Big Hauler cars are very close to 1:24. Measure the length. If they are close to 14.5" and they are 1:24 are based on 30' narrow gauge cars. If it is closer to 18" long it is 1:20.3.

Chuck


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## docwatsonva (Jan 2, 2008)

The majority of the rolling stock used in this project is the older style Bachmann Big Hauler as is the gondola. I don't have the measurement of the gon's length since it's stored at the Arboretum. I assume Chuck is correct in his assumptions.

The layout was designed to represent the time period around 1900 when logging was quite prevalent in the Western North Carolina region. The Paul Bunyan fit the bill. Part of the equipment donations included a Bachmann Shay and Climax. We purchased the PB because we were not sure either of these engines could handle the operation demands. At some point we intend to use the other engines on an occasional basis.

Doc


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## HaBi Farm (Aug 28, 2011)

Not counting the trucks/couplers, the bodies of the 2 flatbeds I have are both 15". The bodies of the 2 gondolas are 14" and 17". Should be close enough for the 10' rule? I haven't really noticed the differences when they're all together behind a Bachmann Big Hauler. Maybe that's the secret - keep all of the rolling stock similar and the loco will blend in unless it's really out of scale.

Doc, in your last close up pic it looks like the Paul Bunyan is just a little shorter and narrower than the gondola, but not by much. Thanks again for letting me SEE the install and the cargo box.

Being able to buy MADE in USA is nice, too.

the other Rodney


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## Vinny D (Jan 25, 2013)

If the link works, this is my (re-painted) HLW Big John hauling (2) Bachmann Spectrum tank cars and a Aristo box car. All different scales but looks good enough for me!


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