# Help with minimum curve diameter for Bachmann G-scale #91605



## pepelpue1 (Nov 17, 2013)

Hi, I am looking into purchasing a Bachmann G-scale steam locomotive that could handle about 4' diameter curve. It would be circling the Christmas tree and since there is not much room in the living room it would be restricted to no larger than 4' diameter track curve. I would appreciate if someone could give me pointers as to the relationship of the wheel number, wheel setup, etc to the curve diameter. Thank you for your help, Al.


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## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

The Bachmann 4-6-0 (aka "Annie") is what comes in most Bachmann starter sets, and will fit around a 4' diameter (2' radius) curve. Others to look at, the 0-4-0 "Porter" and 2-4-2 "Lynn," and on the upper end of the price spectrum, the Bachmann Forney. 

If it were my Christmas garden, I'd opt for the 2-4-2 "Lynn" and maybe two passenger cars. As much as I like the 4-6-0, I think that from an aesthetic standpoint, it's too big for the space you'll be running it. That and two passenger cars in tow, and you're nearly halfway around the 4' diameter circle. The "Lynn" is a neat-looking locomotive, and--in green--fits the Christmas theme. It's also a lot shorter than the 4-6-0, so it and a few passenger cars will look a lot less like it's chasing its own tail. 

Another option might be the Bachmann "Davenport" diesel, but that's more of an industrial locomotive. Unless your Christmas garden is Santa's workshop and you're moving raw materials from the storehouse to the elves' workshop, I don't see it being very festive. Having said that, I can definitely see it with a Christmas wreath on the front of it and an elf hanging out of the cab. A string of shorty gondolas (Maybe from Hartland?) filled with miniature presents or bags full of toys might be a fun little train! 

Hmmm, Mine's red already.... 

Later, 

K


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## pepelpue1 (Nov 17, 2013)

Thank you very much for the information. My other issue, beside the curve diameter, is the pulling power of the locomotive. I am planning to use the locomotive to serve the kids and the guest, their food plates. I am looking in to several Aristo-craft flat carts, with metal wheel(looks better), for carrying the food plates. So, I need a steam locomotive that could haul flat carts with porcelain plates on them. The locomotive will haul about three flat carts, with a porcelain plate on each. I plan to do this all day on thanksgiving and Christmas day. If the locomotive can handle hauling these carts, can it also handle 12-13 hours of non-stop operation of serving the plates? thanks, Al.


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## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

4' diameter curves are hard on all but the shortest engines (those with two driving axles). The tight curves put a lot of stress on the wheels and gears of larger engines. While the 4-6-0 will navigate the tight curves it will last longer on larger curves. Chuck


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## Totalwrecker (Feb 26, 2009)

Porcelain plates w/ Thanksgiving size servings Vs. Plastic gears. 
Minimum radius is a device to sell trains, it is not a recomended practice. 
you roll your dice and takes your chances. 

I can't advise, no experience. 

Best of luck, 

John


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## pepelpue1 (Nov 17, 2013)

Thanks for the information. Are most locomotives made with plastic gear? How about LGB G-scale steam locomotives? what would be the minimum curve diameter that would not put a burden on the locomotive? Is there any site that explains the curve diameter in relation to the locomotive setup? Thanks, Al.


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## BigRedOne (Dec 13, 2012)

You really can't equate a specific locomotive architecture to minimum curve. 

Some manufacturers seek to make all of their models fit any radius they sell, and they will compromise scale fidelity and detail accuracy to do so. (Think about the LGB Sumpter Valley articulated, with it's disconnected steam pipes and huge gaps to accommodate the swinging engines.) This seems to be the norm in the toy market and indoor electric market. 

Others maintain scale realism and prototype operation, and will sacrifice turning radius to do so. Seems more common in the live steam models to do this - where operation is likely outdoors with less space constraint. 

Just like the real railway, shallower curves and grades are preferred. For R1 (four foot diameter), I'd also stick to the small 0-4-0 locomotives, and shorter wagons. If you can squeeze in R2, I think you'll be happier with the appearance and operation. 

Personally, I'd be more concerned about spilling your food, than the locomotive wearing out; heck, in the context of the overall holiday effort and expense, replacing a gear isn't a big deal anyway. I bought LGB, but I like the European narrow gauge prototype to begin with. 

LGB's flat car set 45690 might be a good choice for you: two cars for $117, and they have removable stakes which perhaps could be selectively installed to brace your plates so they don't slide and then tip the wagons over. Low side gons might work, but I'd favor the four-axle cars to carry a load, and get the center of gravity of the load as low as possible, especially if it may not be centered.


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## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

Most engines have plastic gears. My engines on 10' diameter curves leave a minor residue of fine grained brass on the track. The steel wheels grind the edge of the brass rails. Several times a year I run on a layout with curves, greater than 40' diameter, I don't see any abrasion there. Do not run trains with tight curves on a light colored carpet, or you will leave black dust noticeable on the carpet when you remove the track. LGB 0-4-0 engines, like the Stanz, are very robust. They are great pullers. Better than some larger engines. As for pulling plates for Thanksgiving, I'd work on this project for next year. None of us can tell you how many loaded plates you can pull on a layout we haven't seen. My personal opinion is to go with an LGB engine, (made in Germany). They are the gold standard. Ball-bearing wheels on the flat cars will increase the number of cars you can pull. Find a local garden railway group and start some experiments. By next year at this time you will be ready for this neat project.

Chuck


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## pepelpue1 (Nov 17, 2013)

I like to thank you guys for all your information. I gained lot of useful information. I will check more into LGB steam locomotives and will try R2 track to start off with, and if I have to, move to R3 track. Thank you, Al.


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## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

One last comment, maybe. We tell all beginners, USE THE LARGEST CURVES THAT WILL FIT INTO THE AVAILABLE SPACE. In the long run it makes life simpler. Chuck


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## SD90WLMT (Feb 16, 2010)

And.... 

If you find you only have room under the tree for the smallest of curves... 
Just use it to enjoy your Christmas festivities....for now..knowing it fits under the tree! 

If and when you get to move outside, besure to save the tree curves just for the tree!! 
Then....be sure to use much larger curves for a lasting and enjoyable layout.... 


Have fun..stop with the turkey food stuff.. 

YA ALL are makin me hungry,..... ;-) 

Dirk


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## BigRedOne (Dec 13, 2012)

R3 (at least in the LGB assortment) is eight foot diameter - a lot larger increase than R1 to R2. Though, if you can run R3 you're well positioned for future growth in your equipment roster and superior appearance and operation. 

When planning a railway in the family area of the house, you can go around the perimeter of a room(s). Instead of cramming a small railway in the middle of a room, running it behind and around much of the furniture will give longer runs, shallower turns, and a nice effect of looking like tunnels as the train come in and out of view. Looks better than a small circle if someone places a video camera on the train, too. You will have a larger expense for track, though. 

LGB's Stainz and the stake flat car set are both shown in my photograph. I'd be comfortable with dry snacks on salad plates, but I wouldn't haul dinner plates with food which could make a mess or ruin the meal / experience. A lot of weight, above the CG, with centrifugal force due to sharp and abrupt curve, on the instability of carpet, with people not paying attention, is asking for a mess. Personally I'd not run plates which overhang the "loading gauge" (normal width / height of a train), or where the plate itself is not centered by weight on the wagon. 

I have two LGB Stainz, and have run trains long enough that they probably approximately the load you plan. They're nice locomotives, and appear to be a good value when purchased in a starter set. I imagine the "Wangarooge" starter set is a good choice too. 

Dark mess on carpet under track joints is a problem, but seems to be due to the gap between adjoining rails. If you have light carpet, make sure the tracks butt together tightly (not easy with G gauge manufacturing tolerances.) 

LGB's four axle wagons run better than the two axle wagons, and the longer they are the more pronounced this is. 

Look into a restaurant supply company to get some skinny rectangular serving plates. This way you can have plates which can be lifted off a wagon, yet don't overhang the loading gauge or risk toppling the wagon from uneven side-to-side loading. 

Keep in mind that guests are likely to derail your wagons removing a plate, and this adds to the risk of a larger derailment of your train, with increased rick of spillage. 

But, despite us naysayers, have fun! That's what big trains are for.


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## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

The latest versions of the Bachmann locomotives do have brass gears, so in that regard the worry of plastic gears is mitigated to a point. Having said that, heavy Thanksgiving plates--especially a train full of them--is going to put something of a strain on the system. Two or three at a time (provided portions are light) shouldn't present an issue for the time you're talking about. Realistically, even with plastic gears, you're probably going to be quite alright. But weight and drag should be kept to a practical minimum. 

LGB locos are certainly worth a look (as are other manufacturers) if you're looking for potential variety. 

For serving plates, though, I would echo those comments towards easing the diameter of the curve as much as possible. The tighter the curve, the more drag you'll encounter going around the curve, and if the drag is too much and the curves too tight, the train may derail on the curve. I'm sure that will delight the dogs to no end, but the cranberry sauce will stain the carpet something nasty. 

Later, 

K


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## Dan Pierce (Jan 2, 2008)

LGB R2 is around 4 foot 8 inch for the diameter. 
Train-Li had 6 foot diameter (their R3 track). 

You could get a rail bender and custom bend to any diameter using flex track and 8 foot sections/rails to keep connections to a minimum.


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## pepelpue1 (Nov 17, 2013)

Thank you very much guys. After reading all your comments, I will run my track around the living room, instead of the Christmas tree. The only issue with that is getting around the potential disaster area of walkway to the corridor.


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## SD90WLMT (Feb 16, 2010)

Rail road crossing ....ahead.... 

Have fun... 

HAPPY THANKSGIVING....why did the dinner land on the floor Honey? ...she asks with a frown! 

Dirk


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