# Raised bed for the railroad



## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

Well, I guess I have to start this topic all over again...
This is the last picture that I took of the process, it was erased along with the rest of the thread, so I thought I'd post it again for reference. 



I've gotten a bit more done since this picture, I'll have to take a couple pictures tomorrow. Today was cool and rainy so nothing got done outside. 
As to the discussion of what kind of top fill to use on the raised bed, the opinion seemed to be pretty much against using pea gravel because it's usually rounded off and doesn't lock together the way the sharp edged gravel does. Just to clarify, this layer of top fill will be used under the ties, not as ballast. It seems too big to look like ballast in 1/20th scale. Someone had mentioned using chicken grit from the feed store, the stone kind, not the oyster shell, for ballast. I have a small bag of that to experiment with. It looks to be pretty close to a nice scale size for ballast. For the raised bed top fill, the best thing I could find is the pea gravel that Quickcrete sells for mixing with their readycrete product. It seems to be all broken and sharp edged, and it's the same size as pea gravel. I have a bag of that that I was going to use as aquarium gravel, but I found out the tank leaks, so I'll try the gravel on the raised bed. I should get the rounded pea gravel for the aquarium anyway, once I get the tank re-sealed. I'll be glad when it's warm enough to get the fish back out into the pond without the temperature shock they'd get right now. I don't want to lose my big fish.

Anyway, I had several lengths of my 4 inch gauge track out in the raised bed to see what that looks like. That's pretty tempting.  It's code 332 brass that I'm using for 2 foot gauge mine tram rail for 1/6th scale. I'll have to get a picture or 2 of that also. I got the rail well used off of e bay in 12 inch lengths. It's a pain to use with the big ties that short, I need to solder a couple pieces together to make 2 foot sections. I'm sure I could just solder a rail joiner to both rails and it would be done. Most of the rail pieces don't have the hole drilled in the end for the track joiners, or I could just do it that way.
I wonder where I could get 3 inch wheels for small 1/6th scale freight cars. They would be 18 inch diameter in that scale. The crew could use a 20 foot flatcar for hauling ties and rail to the end of the line.


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

Another thing, I have no idea what size the screws are for the track joiners for this code 332 brass track, but I know I don't have any with the right thread. I assume that they're metric. What I did was to re-thread the holes with a 2-56 tap. I do have short screws for 2-56 to hold the rail joiners on the rail. It seems that the metric holes are just enough smaller than the 2-56 that they can be re-threaded fairly easily. If I get ambitious, I might try drilling the holes in the other track pieces so that I can thread them also, for the rail joiner screws.


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## ralphbrades (Jan 3, 2008)

Miss Amber, 

Well consulting my tables gives me Imperial UNC 2-56 as a number 51 drill size. This equates as 1.702mm -so I assume the original hole was tapped to coarse M1.5 (?) This is fairly uncommon -even in a metric country! If all else fails then continue to re-tap to UNC or re-tap them to coarse M2. 

regards 

ralph


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## DocJ (Apr 3, 2012)

If you have Aristo track the tap is 2 mm. When I tap other supplier track for the Aristo joiners I have had a bad experience breaking taps -- the small bit is very fragile and to succeed you need to have a vise to lock the track down and some sort of rig to keep the tap exactly perpendicular at all times. A hand held tap holder doesn't seem to do it. A drill press rotating at a VERY slow speed is ideal.

What I'ld like to know is how the factory taps all those track ends. 

I like the joiners as they come from Aristo because they come with socket head screws which are easy to work (once you get the bit in the screw head). I put a piece of paper under the track ends that I am joining to catch the inevitable dropped screw. Some track came with a Philips head type joining screw which had the same 2mm tap but which were not as easy to use.

The new Bachmann brass track has joiners in the same concept as Aristo but the whole is in a different location in the track web. Be aware of this when joining Bachmann track to other brands, particularly Aristo. I have a case of new Bachmann but I haven't checked the Bachmann tap size. 


Why have you chosen NOT to use rail clamps, or at least some clamps around the switches and where you feed power? The switches often need maintenance and it's easier to remove when there are clamps at all three rail ends; and power feed connectors go easier on clamp screws than on the screws that hold track to ties -- the Aristo style (or Bachmann style) clamp screws can't be used effectiovely to hook up power


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

I haven't gotten anywhere near doing switches yet, in fact, I don't own any at this time.  
I will try the idea of clamps for the switches when I get to that point, I can see the advantage of being able to remove the switch for maintenance. I'm not concerned about conductivity, my engines will all be battery powered, (all 2 of them). I bought a bag of Bachmann rail joiners to use on this code 332 rail that I have, and you're right, the holes don't line up perfectly. The hole in the joiner is slightly lower than the hole in the rail. I didn't have too much trouble getting the screw to go into the hole in the track so that worked out anyway. 
The code 332 rail is just for the 1/6th scale mine tram, I'm using code 215 Llagas Creek track, I have 6 lengths of that, and code 250 rail and my own ties for the F scale track. I'm going to need to buy a lot more rail, if I mail order it, I'll get code 215 aluminum, the nearest large scale train shop (100 miles away) doesn't carry code 215, that's why I have some code 250 rail, from them.


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## jake3404 (Dec 3, 2010)

Its a good start amber. Looking a little closer at your picture I think you got too big of rail. That must be Code 3000 or something like that in the background.


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

Actually, it's code 2625 rail.  It's 20 pound mine rail that I picked up last fall From a place up in the Copper Country of Michigan's upper peninsula. I have a rail size chart that I copied from the internet that gives the measurements of the rail and what weight the rail of a given size is. That's how I figured out what the rail is. It was quite the adventure getting those rails home!


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

The axle on the trailer is not as far back as it should be, so we could only do about 45mph before the trailer would start to fishtail. 150 miles at 45mph...in the dark...I must be insane...


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

The weather was nice today, so I got more done on the raised bed, among other things. 

 

 

As you can see, the yard has a pretty good drop from the front yard toward the back. I started with 1 board half in the ground, and now I'm 3 boards down to get into the ground, roughly an 18 inch drop in 32 feet. That's a pretty steep grade for a G scale engine. I'd have to have a Shay to haul cars up a grade like that.  
My poor garden is still waiting for my attention, I tilled it but I can't plant it until the end of May due to possible frosts. I also have 2 other garden plots in the back yard to deal with. That doesn't leave much room for the railroad to expand.


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

The work continues on the raised bed. I haven't gotten too much done this week, too many other things going on, but I did get a bit more done. 
The track crew of the Poor Rock Mining Company decided to lay a new spur track, they need anothe location to dump the tailings. They sent the crew out with a wagon load of track supplies. 

 

 

The track crew is using a half finished side dump ore car to move the ties and rails to the end of the track. They have 1 rail ready to be spiked, and they're getting another rail ready to set on the ties.


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

Now I just have to decide if I'm going to run this size track, 1/6th scale 2 foot gauge, or G scale track....


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## SD90WLMT (Feb 16, 2010)

Amber, is that you giving directions from the buck board? 

Dirk 
DMS Ry.


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

Yes, just waiting for them to unload the ties, gotta get back for another load!


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## ralphbrades (Jan 3, 2008)

Looking at your figurines and the track work I would suggest that you opt for a 1/6th scale 2 foot gauge railway (=4 inches). It is a "bit tight" at the bottom of the garden to put in a large curve so as you intend to construct a Meyer type loco -this will not be a problem. Both K1 (the first Garrat) and J1 (the biggest Hagans built) could take 60 foot radius curves on the Tasmanian tramway. If you are making your own wheels then I would suggest you follow the profile used by The Gauge '3' Society rather than the one used by G1MRA -or you could use a "colonial profile" wheel which would enable you to take rather uneven track and tight curves... 

regards 

ralph


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

Ralph, the wheels on the mine tram car are the biggest 1/13 scale wheels that I could get from Sierra Valley Enterprises, they're made by Gary Watkins. They're 1-3/4 inch wheels, which scales out to 10-1/2 inches. The wheel profile seems to be a good one for the code 332 rail in the picture. I'd like to find larger wheels with the same profile, especially if I'm going to build an engine for the mine tram. I was thinking about building a copy of one of the battery powered mine tram engines. A steam engine for this mine tram would probably just be an O-4-0 side tank engine. I could build an electric version if I could find the proper wheels, and they didn't cost too much. I would make my own if I had the equipment to do that. Some of the smaller 0-4-0s didn't have spoke drivers, from the pictures I've seen, some of them had solid drivers, or holes in them. If I build a Meyer type engine, it will be in a smaller scale than this. It would be quite interesting to have a Meyer engine in this scale, but I couldn't afford to buy the parts to build it. 
By "colonial profile", I assume you mean larger flanges?


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## ralphbrades (Jan 3, 2008)

Miss Amber 

"Colonial Profile" is designed to be an AXE that chops through things that strew the tracks -this is the profile of the wheels that the Class 15A Garrats that took me to school had on them. It was also used in the NER for the same reason... 

viz: http://www.cabbagepatchrailway.co.uk/neree1pic70.jpg 

As to wheels -do you have what I would call a "Pillar drill"? http://www.axminster.co.uk/axminster-axminster-wd16b-pillar-drill-prod725428/ 

Before I got rich retired (and bought a lathe) I had to make my own wheels.... It should be possible for you to grind and fabricate a "compass cutter" to sit in the chuck of the -or even to use a hole saw(!) and then cut through 1cm sheets of acrylic. You now slice thin rings from steel pipe. You back this onto a 3mm piece of steel plate cut into a disc and braze the two together. The disc of acrylic then sits inside the slice of tube. You file the flanges to a nice edge. The "spokes" are the applied to the acrylic disc -or you can chew away at the acrylic.... What you see here is a slice of steel before the backing plate (AKA flange) is brazed to it. 

viz: http://www.cabbagepatchrailway.co.uk/metrovickpic32.jpg 

If you think this all sounds rather bizarre Rhodesia Railways used to produce wooden disc wheels for wagons using this process of steel rim and welded on flange during the period of "sanctions" -the royal coaches during the Edwardian Period used to have "Maunsell Wheels" with discs of Mahogany and Teak... 

Hope this gives you what you require(!) 

regards 

ralph


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## spincaster (Mar 10, 2012)

And then there were wheels with paper centers...............


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## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

I wondered where this thread went ;-) 

I'd like to find larger wheels with the same profile, especially if I'm going to build an engine for the mine tram. 
There are wheels available in the size you want from Little Engines and the other 'grand scale' train suppliers. The UK also has little mining railways and someone may be modelling them in a large scale. 

Here you go: 3.38" wheels (86mm) from Railcraft, in Australia. They are polyurethane, which may be a problem?











Also check out the Kozo Hiraoka castings: http://www.friendsmodels.com/produc...ivers.html 

Though I do think the idea of making your own might be viable!


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

Ralph, I do have a "pillar" drill, a bench top model. The chuck on it is not perfect, it has a bit of runout to it. After reading what you were talking about with making wheels, I think I could probably cut wheel disks without too much problem with the drill. I've been known to "turn" things on the drill in thew past using a file and a rest, with the object chucked into the drill chuck, so I could probably file down the wheel tread to a usable profile. I'll have to try it when I find some suitable steel to work with. I think I could cut the wheel disks out of the steel with a large hole saw made for cutting metal. I have some smaller ones and the arbors already, so I just have to buy the proper sized saw for the arbor. I priced them, they're not cheap. 
Pete, I'll have to check out the Kozo Hiraoka castings, see what they look like.


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

I have a couple more pictures to post of the progress with the raised bed. 

 

 

Here's a picture of the 4 inch gauge track after I dumped some pea gravel "ballast" around it. This pea gravel is sold by Readicrete as a filler for their ready mix concrete, and seems to have a lot of sharp edges in it. It's probably about half sharp and half rounded edges. I already had the bag of it, I was planning on using it for aquarium gravel, but the tank leaks, so I decided to try it on the track.


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

It rained most of the weekend, so it will be interesting to see how that red sand-clay mixture settled into the raised bed. I don't think I'll have any washout of the pea gravel that I put around the track, it basically has no where to go, the raised bed edges will hold it in place. As can be seen in the picture above, the raised bed is just barely wide enough for the 4 inch gauge track. The ties are 10 inches long, 5 scale feet. I cut them to be approximately 6" X 8" X 5 ft. 
I'm going to put some of my G scale track out there to see what it looks like once the weather clears up.


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

I finally got the raised bed done and filled with the sand clay mixture. Now I need to top fill it with the pea gravel for the sub road bed. 

 

 

I was going to build the raised bed all the way to the end of the picket fence, but I decided to stop with one fence section open. It seems like a good place to build an ore bin and trestle. Gotta have a place to dump the ore, you know.  
I need to get more brass rail for the track, I only have enough rail for about 7-8 more feet of track. I suppose I could use code 332 aluminum rail also, up on the raised bed it won't be getting stepped on by anything heavier than a cat.


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

Now I'll be pondering what I could use to cover up the raised bed boards to make it look more like a rock ledge or a fill.


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## jimtyp (Jan 2, 2008)

Great pics! Please keep them coming.


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## ralphbrades (Jan 3, 2008)

Miss Amber, 

I do not know where you live in the US -but judging by the fact you have sand and clay to play with I would imagine that your bedrock is pretty far below ground (unlike mine). Here garden railway builders use a mix normally referred to as "Hypertufa" for making "rocks" with. This is a blende of concrete and peat, honestly! This mess, plus a hole to pour it into, makes simple very lightweight "rocks" that are easily colonised with small plants. Mosses and Lichens can be made to grow very well by painting the rocks with live yoghourt. Decide what sort of ore mine you want and tint the Hypertufa accordingly with paint. 

As a guide for ores: 

Iron is black and red with tan stripes. 
Tin is yellow and blue, (it is normally found with Chromium). 
Copper is either green/blue or actually Copper coloured. 
Lead ores are very pretty yellow and white with veins of metallic Lead and can have sparkles of Flourites. They can be stained very garishly with (green) Thorium and (brilliant yellow) Uranium oxides (I have some in my garden wall) 
Gold is found in Quartz deposits. 

Trestle plans may be found here: http://www.cabbagepatchrailway.co.uk/trestle.html 

The strangest thing that has been "mined" is a friend of ours whose railway transports Tapioca which is mined at the bottom of the garden and transported by rail to the kitchen.... 

regards 

ralph


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

I live up between Lake Superior and Lake Michigan, it's all either bedrock or swamps up here, and a lot of the swamps seem to be on top of the hills. 
I think the area where the house was built, about 1898, was swamp that they filled in with this sand and clay mixture that's under the topsoil. This town is here because of several iron mines that were started in the 1870s. There's a large copper mining area about 150 miles north west of where I live. 
I'm not sure what my mine will be digging for, either copper, or gold. 
As for the hypertufa, I might have to try that, that would be an interesting experiment. 
I've been thinking about building some scale cribbing to disguise the boards that the raised bed is built with. I think that if I build them with about an inch or so gap from the boards, I should be able to fill the gap with gravel to make it look like a typical cribbed fill for the roadbed. I don't know if it will work or not, but I'm going to try a section of that to see how it looks.


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## aceinspp (Jan 2, 2008)

After reading this thread just curious as to why one would want to drill and tap rails for rail joints when you will be running battery. Just make sure the rail jointers fit snug. Also one could use rail clamps as much easier. Later RJD


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

Well, I wanted to make sure that the track joiners stayed on the rail on one end, the other end will just be a slip fit. I didn't have any of the 2mm screws, that's the only reason that I drilled and tapped for 2-56. As to rail clamps, they're expensive, and not necessary for this purpose. Like you mentioned, I don't need the conductivity, I just need the rails to be connected to each other.


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## SD90WLMT (Feb 16, 2010)

Amber, here is "cribbing" on my main line! It might give you motivation to go ahead with your idea for the planter box side walls. I built most of it on the bench, and completed the balance "on site", to fit it correctly between the rocks and get the right height needed.. 

 

As an idea for you adding, some gnarly rocks in piles against the wood sides, they will break up the line and give a purpose for the cribbing in between them also, plus the rocks can be above the side planks to - again - help break up the horizontal line of the very long planter you have there. Random rocks in various size groups will work really well here.!!! not all the rocks need be above the planks tho - just here and there... 

Hope this helps!! go for it! Get out the horse and buckboard again and move some boulders in place!! You've got the man power! 1/6th manpower that is...:~} 

Dirk 
DMS Ry.


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## SD90WLMT (Feb 16, 2010)

OK, I was in a hurry then. 

I forgot to mention 2 items... 

I added "Dead-men" as this cribbing was built, layered into the fill dirt that I added from behind...this helps prevent it from moving or falling away from the track above. 

The crib was built on a slight incline as it was built upwards, or in a very steeep stair arrangement! This also helps to stabilize it as a structure. 

Dirk 
DMS Ry.


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

That looks really good in the picture! I have limited space between the garden fence and the raised bed to work with, so I can't put too many rocks out from the raised bed and still be able to walk through the space. I might be able to do something with rocks as long as i can keep the pile close to the raised bed. The cribbing looks really good between the rocks. I've seen a few pictures where they've used cribbing to build up the roadbed for a bridge approach, or to get across a gully, that kind of thing. Also, a lot of cribbing was used around mines for roadbeds, ore bins, etc.


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## SD90WLMT (Feb 16, 2010)

I was not sure how much room you might have to work with and still walk down the path..? 

I have one other cribbing located at the end of a Wye tail, but it is much taller and of the closed beam design - so no rocks show thru on it. looks cool in the rocks tho! 

Dirk 
DMS Ry.


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

I got another bag of gravel down on the raised bed yesterday, it'll take 1 or 2 more bags to finish covering the top of the raised bed. That should make a pretty good sub roadbed to set the track onto. I got a couple more pictures of the raised bed yesterday. I would have done more with setting up the pictures but it was sprinkling and I didn't want to melt.  
For a bit of perspective. 

 

Here's the Bachmann 0-4-0 with a Bachmann gondola and 2 of my 3 log cars. As you can see, the log cars still need to be detailed.


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