# The Hale & Norcross



## CliffyJ (Apr 29, 2009)

This is a continuation of a (newbie) modeling project for a large mining complex, The Hale & Norcross (in Virginia City, NV, ca 1880). 

The thread started with with a discussion on (foam) wall and sheathing materials:

http://forums.mylargescale.com/14-buildings/24771-structure-sub-wall-materials-5.html

Here's the foam model:









Lately, it's been window and door casting:

http://forums.mylargescale.com/14-buildings/28255-window-door-resin-casting.html

Thanks again for all the help on those endeavors. Here's the stack of castings.









The next step is applying siding, and I'd like to share what I learned recently on this. I'm going with styrene, for durability, and was able to get a 4'x8' sheet of .04 stock from a local plastics house for pretty cheap ($21). 

For testing purposes, I cut an 18" wide x 4' piece, and went to it with a drill-mounted wire brush...









...followed by some light sanding. The wire brush tends to lift the material up.









The first method of painting didn't work. I spray-painted multiple layers (black, brown, working to lighter rust color), with the vague notion that sanding would reveal some good "grain". I varied each coat somewhat, and avoided strict uniformity. But all the sanding did was exposed the kicked-up groove edges, which turn white. So, I just wiped on and off diluted India ink, and that made the grooves appear. 









For a 'production run' of this stuff, I'll just use a main color, with slight variation from one or two similar colors. In this case, the objective was a sort of "barn red" using rust and clay colors. For more weathering, I'd blend a bit of tan or brown. All the sprays I used were Krylon or Rustoleum, for plastic.

Next came strip cutting. I made a strip cutter based on one used for small stripwood (saw it on Youtube). But that didn't work. What did was laying a piece of angle down as a guide, scoring the sheet with a knife, and snapping it off. The edge is slightly rough, which works for me.









Here's how the strips look when placed together semi-randomly:









I needed to darken the edges, so I drew each strip slowly between a couple of blocks, while holding a jumbo Sharpie on the edge. 









Well, that's it for this test. Next step is to apply the strips on the foam building....

===>Cliffy


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## Naptowneng (Jun 14, 2010)

That looks good Cliff, a great alternative to cedar. What plastics supplier??

Jerry


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## CliffyJ (Apr 29, 2009)

Thanks Jerry. It's Piedmont Plastics, in Elkridge:

http://piedmontplastics.com/contact-us.aspx?bid=RO

They have a big warehouse of all manner of plastic stock, you'd enjoy it. Acrylic, Sintra, styrene, whatever. In big sheets.

For folks not near Baltimore, they have 40 locations in the US. Though I'm sure there are other suppliers that are just as good.


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## Naptowneng (Jun 14, 2010)

Thanks Cliff I have been looking for a local plastics place, I see they have Sintra, one option for building materials in the garden

Spectacular day!

Jerry


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## CliffyJ (Apr 29, 2009)

Though there are slightly cheaper online sellers, the cutting & shipping charges can kill you! So yes, it's nice to have a local wholesaler -- that sells retail also. 

BTW, that 4'x8' sheet cost me $21. The equivalent through Evergreen or some other small-piece supplier would have been prohibitive... ditto Sintra. 

And yes, such a gorgeous day!


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## SD90WLMT (Feb 16, 2010)

Just keeping ya on your toes Cliffy..

...why not try a few knots....

Looks awesome ..!

D


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## Totalwrecker (Feb 26, 2009)

Yeah! They wouldn't be for naught!


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## CliffyJ (Apr 29, 2009)

Sure, knots are good. Maybe a rolling pin and some chain, or a hammer on a wad of chicken wire, or something like that, would produce a random "distressing" of various holes.


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## Totalwrecker (Feb 26, 2009)

Take a dowel and slice across the end with a separating disc. Shove bits wire into the slot, chuck it in your drill and give it a spin.


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## CliffyJ (Apr 29, 2009)

Here's the three candidate adhesives I'm considering. I've not tried the PowerGrab before, though it is recommended. The other two did well in some samples last year (on various materials). 

Just a few notes on application. The PowerGrab goes on like mashed potatoes or spackle. Didn't really want to spread onto the foam out of the tube, and comes out in lumps. The HD Construction Adhesive feels more like a caulk, and goes on easily. In my earlier tests, it seemed to do as well as the PL3X, at least subjectively tugging at sample bits. The PL3X looks and acts like melted plastic, and is what I used to bond foam-to-foam. 

I'd like to try some pull-testing (hence the number of strips). More later...

===>Cliff

[Edit: So as not to derail this thread, I dealt with this testing in a different one: http://forums.mylargescale.com/14-buildings/32793-foam-styrene-adhesive-pull-test.html ]


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## CliffyJ (Apr 29, 2009)

Totalwrecker said:


> Take a dowel and slice across the end with a separating disc. Shove bits wire into the slot, chuck it in your drill and give it a spin.


Hi John. Would that produce a different effect than the wire brush in the drill?


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## Totalwrecker (Feb 26, 2009)

CliffyJ said:


> Hi John. Would that produce a different effect than the wire brush in the drill?


They make wire brushes???? 
Yeah half the wires will fall out..... the other half bend. 
Not as uniform and you just want to suggest the knot more than make one...


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## CliffyJ (Apr 29, 2009)

Well, lack of uniformity is good here! So I'll bear that idea in mind when I get to the main run of this stuff. 

Thanks John --

===>Cliffy


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## CliffyJ (Apr 29, 2009)

It's been a long time since I've worked on this project, but this weekend I finally poured the foundation.

Here's the form, made a few weekends ago:










Here it is as of yesterday morning, with another form for its neighboring mine. 










Completed the pours today.










===>Cliffy


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## Totalwrecker (Feb 26, 2009)

Looks real good there buddy.
I git the feelin' that you don't like our kibitzin! A lot done there....


John


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## denray (Jan 5, 2008)

Cliff
Now you are a man after my own heart, now that is the way to make structure bases.
that technique sure prevents alot of future problems.
Dennis


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## SD90WLMT (Feb 16, 2010)

Yea...poor 'Ol Cliffy will have to go on the road....giving shops and lectures on his building technics..

I think your past the "Novice Stage"... Cliff...

You need to consider presenting your work in a spot other than the Beginners dept!!!
Your have Graduated....way beyond Beginners here...
I'll give you My Vote here!!

And...thanks fer joining in the Fun of Garden Railroad Layout Construction!!

;-)
;-)
;-)

!!!! !!!! !!!! !!!!


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## SD90WLMT (Feb 16, 2010)

You've got lots of firm ..yet gentle tapping ahead....to pop your forms free...

Not to wait too long buddy!


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## CliffyJ (Apr 29, 2009)

Ha ha! No John, I sure appreciate all the ideas, it's just that I'm sorta embarrassed over how long ago I started this mine project, and how long it's probably gonna take! 

Glad you like the forms Dennis, they were fun to put together. And thanks Dirk, and I might get to the form removal tomorrow afternoon, not quite sure. The things are screwed together, hopefully with most of the screw heads accessible. 

Thanks guys, I'll take more pics later.
Cliff


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## Totalwrecker (Feb 26, 2009)

We have time limits? 
*Oh No!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Just like badges we don't need no limits!
*I have a building stuck in mid-pour, ran into not wanting to drape several extenshun cords during lightening fueled storms. A buddy suggested some water additive and now I can't hand mix.... dang kibitzers! lol
Was only 103 today, mebbe I'll get out tomorrow.
Keep your forms wet...
John


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## CliffyJ (Apr 29, 2009)

Hey John, well, I'm glad it's not any big thing to drop a thread and pick it up when I get back to that project. I suspect I'm gonna be doing that a lot... And yeah, how did that additive go? 

Anyway, your mention of keeping my forms wet was a little alarming last night, 'cause they'd all dried out. And I wasn't feeling inclined to hosing them down in the dark. Or getting off the couch even, by that time. But I got off work a little early and remove them. And I was relieved that they came away quite easily. 










It ain't Warren Buffet's front stoop, but it'll do. Here's the pads with the south mountain.










The hole in the flatter (Savage) pad is a pit for, maybe, a future drop-in (as in portable) model of the interior works. But, that'll be a thread I'll have to pick up a few years from now I think.

===>Cliffy


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## Totalwrecker (Feb 26, 2009)

It's a hobby, not a job. We get to it when we can.
Beating lung cancer didn't give me new lungs, combined with an average summer heat of 97, I just didn't have any energy...
To use the additive it's added to the water and then LESS water is used to mix the batch. I bought a mud mixer attachment to chuck in my drill to mix the cement ... then the monsoons provided a geezer excuse.... and ponder time. Nearest outlet is 70' away. Been wet.
Next pour; walls are formed and some dodads for detail are ready to be glued to form. Need to add some rebar (scale) and find some gumption.
Your pours look great, Atta Boy!
John


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## CliffyJ (Apr 29, 2009)

Thanks John! 

Yeah, you've been having quite the weather, I hope everything's ok, and nothing got washed away... right?


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## CliffyJ (Apr 29, 2009)

Scale rebar?


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## SD90WLMT (Feb 16, 2010)

Hey...that looks darn great....Wow!! Zer....

Scale rebar..John uses little nails...a head this way..a point thata way!!

Pretty creative form application to....got my mind pondering....how to make decent bridge abutments....they have an exposed narrow edge...with plenty of bulk down in the dirt...

Drop by n ponder with me Cliff....ha!! Bring John!!
We'll have a cement convention!

Looks great...Dirk


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## Totalwrecker (Feb 26, 2009)

Little 6" rain gutter nails, most gutters are 4" gives 2" in wood.
Way back when I was planning on an On3 outdoor line, I bought a box of them to lay out my railroad. I could push 2-3" into the crap we call dirt, sand and silt, then tie a yellow string and see where my thoughts were going. 
The first monsoon not only showed me dirt flowing over the trex ladder, but big drops splashing grit upwards and everywhere ... then I looked at the scale flanges on my new pride and joy; a brass RGS 455 and decided I needed to pursue another track, from code 70 to 332.
Concrete is stronger than cement, cement is part of concrete, it fills the gaps between the stronger aggregates. So I need to reinforce my cement pours to cover my clumsy ways.... All hardware cloth did was hold the broken parts to the mesh, the nails when overlapped allow cracks with out shattering. 
After the mines played out and the brass in love with his train, we tried the excursion/tourist trains, but even that is like the tides....
Buildings show cracks, paint? faded, shingles? Only the medical kind left in town....
There's a rumor about getting the old car towed away which would open a way to elevate the rest of the railway. So much easier than battling Tom and Jerry!
Uh oh it's in print ....
gotta go
John


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## CliffyJ (Apr 29, 2009)

Thanks Dirk!
And John, sounds like you might have a big expansion in mind? Or at least a big elevation? Elevate and expand, I say!


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## Totalwrecker (Feb 26, 2009)

If I had cast my roadbed in concrete my remodel would be out of the question...
Department Live and Learn; For me, ground level ain't all it's cracked up to be...

Evo; Oval, oval and reverse loop, revese loop and another elevated reverse loop, this last change is to elevate first reverse loop somewhere else. TBD. After my old de-wired car gets hauled out, that is.
John

Cooler weather acomin'! May have another shift in the ol' Final Frontier .....
I'm curious about hiding detail in a pit, just a midnite snack fer my critters!

John


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## CliffyJ (Apr 29, 2009)

If you elevate it enough, you could run tracks through the car windows, and use the car as a concrete mountain support. Just let the air out of the tires first.

See, I just saved you a bunch of trouble!


Those pit details would be very portable --- like, remove the critters, put the assembly in for the camera shot or maybe a meet-up, and get it back indoors right after.


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## Totalwrecker (Feb 26, 2009)

Ha! Been ponderin', used the electric level to see. Sat in my favorite spot where I can look down the mine/barn leads on trestles, cribs and bridges, or where the mainline curves back through the settlement. A glance down the junction lead or farther over to the new depot... Dang, I like this look. 
I guess I'll redo it righter....
But thanks fer the concerns
John


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## SD90WLMT (Feb 16, 2010)

So what's the latest news from the mining district thar Cliffy??

....assayed any fresh ore lately!?

D


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## CliffyJ (Apr 29, 2009)

Dirk, it's mainly been a cleanup weekend, getting ready for the fall. After I got the track put together again and cleaned the main line, I was able to get a train running. So that was a big milestone.

Jerry B. (naptowneng) came by yesterday, and we had a good mini-meet. Jerry's a great GRR-er with a lot of experience, so it was wonderful having him over. It was the first time I've ever had a fellow G-gauger visit. Thanks Jerry!

Today, I did various repairs and cleaned more track. Here's a vid of the new mountain and locos running thru it.






===>Cliffy


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## SD90WLMT (Feb 16, 2010)

Ahh, there's nothing like having another train Nut drop by to chat and visit with!!

Really cool after all that hard work...wish I could drop in!!

Great place to end the year....break time!

Dirk


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## CliffyJ (Apr 29, 2009)

Thanks Dirk, wish you could drop by my digs, or I could drop by yours. 

But yeah, another season coming to a close. Fall season is so beautiful and melancholy. I love it. 

Cliff


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## Ray Dunakin (Jan 6, 2008)

Cliff, the layout looks great! I like that mountain, and your roadbed and mill foundations look real nice.


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## CliffyJ (Apr 29, 2009)

Thanks a heap Ray, I appreciate it!


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