# What if the Elk River #1 had been narrow gauge?



## Mik (Jan 2, 2008)

I've had Wm Harris' 1-1/2" scale plans for the "Falk" for about a year. I doubt I'll ever build one that size, BUT I also had a junk battery loco, and a c-16 cab lying around. So.....

Real Falk:









My progress after blowing $3 on plastic pipe and about 45 minutes of butchery










It's not going to be a scale model, (An old Kalamazoo 0-4-0 would be a better start for that), just an exercise to see if I can make it look presentable without spending much money. Since all 4 wheels have traction tires and the motor is only 6v, I'm going battery power with a small rheostat in the cab or bunker for speed control.


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## Rich Schiffman (Jan 2, 2008)

Mik,

The Falk and Bear are available from MoLoCo in Narrow Gauge and standard gauge in 1/20.3 scale. Check out their web site.

www.moloco.biz


Have fun, they're great little locos. 

Rich S


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## Eric M. (Jan 3, 2008)

Hi Mik,

I will keep an eye on your progress. I have a 7.5" gauge Falk. It's a work in progress-- the chassis runs on air though.




















Regards,


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## Mik (Jan 2, 2008)

Thank you, Rich. Yes, I know I could buy them, with only two small problems -- I model in 1:24, and I won't spend that kind of money on ANY loco. (call me cheap or just plain old broke)


This project is just to see whether I can capture the spirit of the locomotive with stuff I already have in my junk box. 



Stuff I have and will use: The carcass of a battery operated 2-6-2 of unknown manufacture, A Delton c-16 cab (I still need to shorten it by about 1/4), Most of an Ozark winch kit, An Ozark reverse lever kit, A pair of Aristo cylinder lubricator turnings, Ozark pop valve and whistle, a cylinder from a junked B'mann 0-4-0, A firebox section from the same junk 0-4-0, and some bits from the old General plastic kit. Also, I found an Ozark smokestack last night that I'll probably replace the wood one with -- the rest I'll scratchbuild.


Now a big question for you battery gurus: What would be the best balance between cost and operation for a battery pack? (about the size of 4 AAs to fit in the boiler) Note: I'm probably limited to stuff from Radio Scrap or evilBay.


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## Ray Dunakin (Jan 6, 2008)

Good idea, Mik! I'm looking forward to your progress. 

Eric, that 7.5" Falk is awesome! Will it be live steam?


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## Mik (Jan 2, 2008)

some progress..... 

different stack, not "correct", but I think I like it better than the other one 









smokebox door details, 









base coat of paint, and showing the cylinder mount and crosshead guide mount for the gypsy winch. 









Test fit with the shortened cab, the proportions are a lot closer now 









That's as far as I've gotten. I'm going to work on the chassis for a bit next


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## Mik (Jan 2, 2008)

Bit more done, I really don't like the siderods, but they'll do until I figure out something else.


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## trainbuffjr (Jan 11, 2008)

Looking good so far Mik! I even have some of those parts lying around on my workbench. Keep us posted.


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## Mik (Jan 2, 2008)

today's progress... 
I couldn't find the spare cylinder, so I made a wood one. Also, I REALLY wish I'd had a bigger gear 









Piping started The white thing on the side of the firebox is a half-finished Penberthy injiector


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## Les (Feb 11, 2008)

MiK

Thanks for taking the time to post the pixes. I want to build one of those eventually, but there's just too much about it I don't understand, starting with 'Falk'. A manufacturer?

Your modelling philosophy and mine are near the same.

I really like what you've got going. Are you working from plans (loosely)? That is, to know what's needed and where it's supposed to go?

Very encouraging, neat project you've got going there.

Les


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## Mik (Jan 2, 2008)

The original locomotive was built by Marshutz & Cantrell National Iron Works of San Francisco in 1884 for The Elk River Mill and Lumber Co. It is a 10 ton 0-4-0 loco with an idependent gypsy winch. It was named "Falk" because the president of the Elk River company at that time was Noah Falk. 

I'm not sure why, but the online pics I've found all seem to be small and/or fuzzy. I'm working from a booklet published by Live steam Magazine ($15), and I think the NGSLG also has line drawings for $5 or so. 

This is a pic of Missouri Locomotive Co. gauge 1 version mentioned above -- Much nicer than mine, but then I won't have anywhere near $775 invested when I'm done either.


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## Les (Feb 11, 2008)

Thanks for the nice pic. It now lives inside my folder.

Someday....

Les


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## R.W. Marty (Jan 2, 2008)

Les,
For plans of the Falk and the Bear Harbor go here

http://www.timberheritage.org/store.htm

Check in the store. 5$ for 3/4 inch plans of both loco's,
although higher donations are accepted









Will be fireing and engineering on one or the other 
of those two on the 28th.
Later
Rick Marty


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## Rich Schiffman (Jan 2, 2008)

Mik,

Your model is really taking shape. I do have many files on the Falk. If you would like me to send a CD of these send me an address to the email in the signature block. I am always happy to share these.


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## Les (Feb 11, 2008)

Rick,

Many, many thanks for the addr. I never suspected plans would be out there at such a reasonable price.

Les


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## Mik (Jan 2, 2008)

Some more progress, nothing like wasting a whole day off, lol. 

Did I mention that I REALLY hated the side rods from the battery toy? I was looking for something else when I found a pair of Delton c-16 rods in a box.... 2 hours of butchery later they fit pretty good. I made them a bit sloppy because if this thing is anywhere near correctly quartered I'll be very much surprised. 









The cable guides for the winch. They look about right, but are glued down tight (non functional) because I'm too lazy to make working hinges. I'll probably glue the gypsy engine together too. Yes I know the original did not have a buffer beam, I had it here and it helps hide some mistakes. 









Backhead detail, the johnson bar on this side is for the manual brakes (1884, no air!) The more I study this thing, the more it resembles a portable farm engine mounted on a loco chassis instead of wheels (only real difference is the winch pinion in place of a flywheel) 









Engineer's side. The smaller lever close to the firebox is the throttle lever (the valve itself is at the end of the long pipe off the dome, clear up by the cylinder - condensate must have been a problem when this thing sat any length of time), it should be longer, but it is what I had here. Also, you can see the platform for the tank/bunker... good old coffee stirrers to the rescue again! 









AND, here is the water tank/fuel bunker. I put making this off as long as I could, not because I didn't know HOW to make it...because I was hoping I'd figure out an easier way. It's .030" x 2" sheet brass, with jewelry wire for the top bead, and some tiny plastic I-beam for the belt strip. There should be a bazillion rivets in 3 horizontal rows plus several vertical ones, but I'm NOT adding them. 









Now, some observations for guys considering this build -- stuff I would like to have done differently if I'd had the $$$.... 1. start with either a Kalamazoo 0-4-0 or the Lehmann Porter... it will save you a lot of farting around re-engineering stuff. 2. get a 1-1/2"-2" gear for the winch. The 1" gear I had is simply too small. 3. if you want to motorize the winch, a friction drive on the crank disc with the motor hidden in the boiler would probably be the easiest and least obvious. 4 measure twice and cut once. I had to patch the cab because I misjudged the location of the winch cylinder -- on that note, mount the engine lower than I did, if you can. I had to block part of the front cab window because the valve rod is 1/4" too high


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## Les (Feb 11, 2008)

Well, I like it real well. It does look like a steam traction engine, doesn't it? I happened to've liked the old green rods okay, but it's your build. The new ones look good too.

Keep it up, I'm enjoying watching it come together.

Les


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## Mik (Jan 2, 2008)

Patience is a virtue.. unfortunately it isn't one of mine... I just had to mock it up again... Yes, I know the cab and bunker are on a little drunk. I need to mill a couple reliefs in the floor, drill some holes, and screw them down -- then they'll sit straight(er)


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## Les (Feb 11, 2008)

Hey, a nice pic for the rank amateur like me: shows that not all is perfect at any given moment.

Remember, I've never scratchbuilt (or built) a single thing as a model since the 50s. What I'm seeing is giving me the push to get started, and 'get er done' _then _look at the results. (If I can bear to.) Sure, the thing's a tad off level here 'n there _at the moment._ A few screws like you said, some putty 'n paint, you'll have a neat-looker for sure. But for encouragement value, and demonstration purposes, it's great for me to see. I'm really glad you posted the pic, and I'm waiting for more. I'm taking lots of mental notes.

Les


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## vsmith (Jan 2, 2008)




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## Ray Dunakin (Jan 6, 2008)

Very nice work Mik, and an informative construction log!


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## Mik (Jan 2, 2008)

Les, best thing is to jump in and do it. If you're lacking confidence, or your skills are rusty, then start with a smaller project that you won't cry if you make a mistake on.... 

See the woodshed in this pic? It was my first real "scratchbuild". A Sunday afternoon (at work, between customers.... shhhhh! Don't tell, nothing like getting paid to do train stuff, lol) , a few dowels, 3 leftover plastic window frames, a plastic roof, and a bunch of coffee stirrers Kim lifted from the local coffee bar. Total cash outlay about $3. If I had mangled it I'd have simply salvaged the plastic, tossed the rest and started over. The saw rig was next, and it was actually easier (less boring anyway) than cutting up all those twigs for the woodpile 









Another thing is I use either Welder (which I prefer) or E-6000 to glue just about everything. It stays flexible for a good while, so if I really mangle something I can usually (gently) pry it apart and scrape the glue off to try again, even the next day.


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## Les (Feb 11, 2008)

You must be a mind-reader. While I was outside catching up on yard work, I kept thinking, "A trackside building out of coffee stirrers ought to get you started." I saw the woodshed before, and I could use several, since at least some of my engines will be woodburners.

Thanks


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Mik on 03/16/2009 2:18 PM
Les, best thing is to jump in and do it. If you're lacking confidence, or your skills are rusty, then start with a smaller project that you won't cry if you make a mistake on.... 

...snip... 

.


There is NO project small enough that I DO not cry about WHEN I make a mistake on it...









The major problem with ALL my projects is that I can afford just enough raw material to make ONE of each of the piece parts of the whole such that if I ruin just ONE of them, then the whole project is down the tubes until or unless I can replace that one piece of raw material.


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## Mik (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Semper Vaporo on 03/16/2009 3:39 PM

There is NO project small enough that I DO not cry about WHEN I make a mistake on it...









The major problem with ALL my projects is that I can afford just enough raw material to make ONE of each of the piece parts of the whole such that if I ruin just ONE of them, then the whole project is down the tubes until or unless I can replace that one piece of raw material.



That's part of the beauty of coffee stirrers. If you convince your caffeine addict buddies to help you by liberating an extra half dozen or so for you every time they buy a cup of coffee, you'll soon have a drawerful of the things. If you MUST actually buy them, then $2 will usually get you a big fist full... They scale out to between about 5 and 7 inches wide, and you can cut them with sprue nippers.

My material problem is usually opposite... they only sell stuff I need 2" of in 2 foot lengths ...Unless it's a detail casting, then I realize I need it about 20 minutes after I get the email that my order has been shipped... Or it's brass strip, then NOBODY local carries it anymore. (even brass rod is getting harder to find)


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## Mik (Jan 2, 2008)

coming together at last!... 

Remember how I said that if you don't like how something turns out to not be afraid to rip it out and do it over? Well, one of the most (to my mind) distinctive features of the Falk is that honking HUGE crank disc on the gypsy winch engine. The smaller gear I had made me initially go with a 1" disc. It just didn't look right, but I didn't have a larger gear to allow a bigger disc to clear the winding shaft either. What to do? What to do? Then I realized that while I didn't have a big gear, I had a couple more medium sized ones.. so why not make the space I needed with an intermediate gear? While I was at it I fabricated a new winch frame as well... The way I figure it, all I'm really out is half an hour and a few cents worth of basswood. I think the result is much cleaner. 









And the crank disc? a 1-1/2" turned wood disc from Michael's looks just about "right" 









While I was fixing things that annoyed me I also lengthened the throttle lever by 1/2", using some leftover white metal from another one that I cut up for the c-16 project, plus a thin plastic strip glued behind to strengthen it. Once it is painted it should look fine. 









The backhead looks rather empty compared to larger and more modern locos. All that is there is the firedoor, blower valve, oil can tray, water column, pressure gauge and two trycocks. But I don't believe in adding stuff that has no other purpose than making it look busy. (in a word, "Justify!") I did glue a 1/4" washer (3c) to the end of the homemade wood cylinder to look like a cast cylinder head, it should also have 6 nut castings, but I'm not certain how visible it will be with the cab roof and bunker on. 









Next I need to build the rear buffer and coupler mount, then mount the bunker. I'm still waiting for suggestions on a rechargeable battery pack (4.5 or 6volt) The guys at Radio Scrap are almost totally useless if the application isn't in their books 

Edit: for Les, and other beginners, I hope it's readable


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## Les (Feb 11, 2008)

That looks fine to me. I'm still trying to think of how to make bolt & studs for cylinders. I don't want to buy any. The winch looks good, is it intended to operate? Not only is Radio Snack useless for tech help, my local one wouldn't let me use the bathroom.

Les


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## Mik (Jan 2, 2008)

Les, since the gears are white metal (VERY soft) I glued everything tight rather than risk bending the gears or stripping the teeth. If I had used nylon or brass gears I probably would have made it able to turn. Ozark's nut bolt washer castings are fairly cheap... if you need enough other stuff to justify an order, or your LHS stocks them... otherwise??? square nut could probably make from basswood with wire for the bolt, but I don't know how many I'd have the patience to sit and make (about 5?)


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## Les (Feb 11, 2008)

Mik,

Hey, somehow I missed the very last pic w. the labels. I dunno how I did that. I sure do appreciate that, though. So, the reverser lever looks like that. I never knew that. I didn't know why site glasses are tilted on some engines but not others until I mentally traced the possible location for the crownsheet. Didn't know two trycocks were permissible. Big time thanks to you for all that extra trouble!

Les


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## Mik (Jan 2, 2008)

There are only two trycocks because I ran short of picture nails.... LOL! Just wait till you see how I'm going to jerry rig the battery so I can charge it and the speed control pot


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## Mik (Jan 2, 2008)

I didn't have a whole lot of time today, but I still got a lot done.

Wiring, the toy loco originally used 4 C batteries- no room for anything like that here. Best I could fit was a rechargable 9v. Here is my wonderful wiring. The throttle pot only seemed to turn tho motor on or off, so I actually ended up removing it. It seems like it will just sort of just trundle along on the 9v, but run time and pulling power remain to be seen. Who knows? Track power via skates may eventually be in it's future.










A face only a mother could love... I found a filthy piece of surveyor's string at work the other day. A couple hooks and it's a dandy winch rope... and already 'weathered', too. 










Side view, showing the bunker installed. I think I've managed to capture the proportions and "feel" of the original critter fairly well, even with all the liberties and compromises I made. The bits of tube in the corners of the bunker are the water fills. This is their proper location, but I think they are actually a little short. Rear footboards and coupler will have to wait until tomorrow. Front cab windows, engineer and wood load will wait until I decide how heavily I'm going to weather it.


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## Les (Feb 11, 2008)

Okay, now I know where those things carried the water. Been wondering about that. Few ever bother to mention such small but critical items. Hey, lookin' good, like it's been around the woods awhile.

Les


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## Mik (Jan 2, 2008)

All done but the whistle chain and firewood load. Still thinking about track powering it, though 









On Kimmee's shelf with my scratchbuilt log cars. Happy accident that it just fits -


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## Les (Feb 11, 2008)

It's a good lookin' ol' engine, like it's been around the woods awhile. How much trouble would it be to get a shot of one of those log cars? (Unloaded.)

Going to get the wood for my first part of the train board tomorrow.

My '94 S-10 started hackin' and coughin' a couple of weeks ago when the weather was nasty. Figured 'Hm, spark plugs, about has to be, it stutters under load." Called the friendly dealer. He said, "Oh yeah, $200 to change the plugs--(all 4 of them--)+ $100 to do the diagnostics." I said, "It's the plugs. I'm sure of it. 75K mi & 16 years?" He said, "Diagnostics gets done either way, to be sure. Might not be the spark plugs." I had a set of plugs I picked up at a garage sale, brand new, for 75 cents about ten years ago. They fit that pickup, is why. So I spent half a day doing what I used to do in an hour, and lo, runs great. Going to take the savings to the lumber yard, I yam.









Les


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## Mik (Jan 2, 2008)

Les, thread on those is here http://www.mylargescale.com/Community/Forums/tabid/56/forumid/8/postid/79234/view/topic/Default.aspx


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## wchasr (Jan 2, 2008)

Mik, 
Really nice! I went o my local general supply store that supplies the local restaurants and such and they ahd to special order the wooden stirrers but for less than $10 I got 4 boxes I believe? Huge boxes. I'll never need to "appropriate" them now. They had plastic ins tock but wasn't what I was looking for at the time. I may go back and get some though. I drive by the place every day. 

Chas


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## Les (Feb 11, 2008)

Mic,

What a great pleasure to run the morning mail and find that link. I remember it now. Also, the cars you built are included, so I saved the link into my 'projects' folder. Thank you, I owe you one.

Looking at those spring-loaded coupler pockets, I have to assume there're at least two types of pocket: one with springs, and one w/o. Is that a good assumption?

Thanks again for your efforts in posting, the link, 'n stuff.

Les


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## Les (Feb 11, 2008)

Chas,

I can't find a restaurant supply house, but to to go Wallyworld or Michaels, you get charged an arm and a leg for those dumb things. I'm looking, St.L. has got to have one, someplace.

Les


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## c nelson (Dec 18, 2008)

I bought some 6v NiCad packs from local RS a while back for $0.27 each (included charger)..yes I said $0.27 each! Nice deal! 

23-351 

they are not showing on web, but a call to store may deliver some? 

cale 

Nice Job btw!


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## Mik (Jan 2, 2008)

Here's today's pic with wood load, whistle and bell cords, and... a buddy. Why doesn't any backwoods lokey EVER look "finished" without a dog? Yeah, OK, I know it needs a spark arrestor yet.... fires are bad news when you're in the woods surrounded by burnable stuff. 









It's been suggested that two 9volts in parallel might have enough amperage to run this thing (just one is a bust). Since it has 4 traction tires, track powering it may be a problem. I'll think on this some more, finding accessible space for the 2nd 9v will be a challenge.


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## Terl (Jan 2, 2008)

NIce lookin loci. Looks very much like the Falk, and your method of scratchbuilding with what is on hand very much appeals to me. Looks good with your log cars. How does is pull? 

Terl


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## Mik (Jan 2, 2008)

FINALLY got time to wire in the second 9v, add the spark arrestor and fix the slight bind in the siderods. Maiden run was with 3 LGB 4 wheel cars, she just ambled right along. Added another one and it slowed down some, but still went. With 5 cars she threatened to stall (4 traction tires and a pound of BBs means she isn't likely to slip. I'll have to see if the run times improve tho. It was slowing down and getting a bit uneven after about 10 minutes.


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## jnic (Jan 2, 2008)

I like it. Maybe I missed something but what did you use for a motor block ??



john


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## Mik (Jan 2, 2008)

I had the remains of this really crappy battery operated 2-6-2 that my ex wife bought as a surprise for me back when she still cared. (I was surprised, alright, surprised enough to ask her what the he## I was supposed to do with the piece of junk -- and it only took 6 years to figure out a use, too) As I said in earlier posts, a Kalamazoo or HLW 0-4-0, or LGB Porter or even a 2017 would probably have been easier and definitely a performance improvement.


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## Les (Feb 11, 2008)

Maybe a pic, pulling the cars?


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