# Staver Spring Steamup



## David Leech (Dec 9, 2008)

The Staver Spring Steamup was held from Thursday April 26th until Sunday April 29th in Portland, Oregon.
I think that all who attended enjoyed themselves.
Here is a video that I made of the event.
All the best,
David Leech, Delta, Canada


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## SalM (Jan 2, 2008)

David............great video.............talk about catching all the action...well done


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## Tom Bowdler (Jan 3, 2008)

Thanks David,
Excellent video!


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## Two Blocked (Feb 22, 2008)

Hi David,
This Staver post that you have presented is an outstanding example of everything that is perfect about a small scale live steam video. You have expertly presented a fine piece of work. One example is the exciting blend of 'man' and machine set in such a lovely live steam setting. No one could confuse this event with a 'sparkly' gathering; not with all those happy faces and body language in nonstop action. No watching paint dry here!
KO-5


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## StackTalk (May 16, 2014)

Thanks from me as well, David.

Good to note that the fire brigade responded so effectively 

A little bit of everything . . . adds up to a lot of fun.


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## dougiel (Jun 3, 2008)

Many thanks David. Always look forward to seeing the action from Staver. No outside this year ?.

I can see why those from the left of the pond do not like alcohol fired loco's.

DougieL


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## David Leech (Dec 9, 2008)

dougiel said:


> Many thanks David. Always look forward to seeing the action from Staver. No outside this year ?.
> 
> I can see why those from the left of the pond do not like alcohol fired loco's.
> 
> DougieL


There was a short run outside, but the weather wasn't very warm, and at times VERY wet, and there was also an incident with the outside loop.
Strange as it may seem, but both the fires were from Butane!
Regards,
David


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## Dave Meashey (Jan 2, 2008)

David;

Thank you for the video. I especially enjoyed seeing the "Sandwich Flyer" with auto-coaches on both ends of the locomotive.

I think that I may have been operating on Tom Harris' Lakeside Lines HO empire (in Wythville, VA) about the same time you folks were boiling water. Lakeside Lines may not be as exciting as live steam, but since the train lengths frequently exceed 70 cars, an engineer does have to pay close attention to getting his train over the railroad.









Best Wishes,
David Meashey


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## Chris Scott (Jan 2, 2008)

David;
What Kevin wrote, me too.


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## GaugeOneLines (Feb 23, 2008)

Thanks David for an (as usual) excellent quality video. As a longtime runner (58 years) of Gauge 1 live steam, I find it worrying that people are trying to put out what is obviously a gas fire, with water! As the 'voice' says, "Smother it". As a hobby, we really do need a "handbook" for how to run live steam be it gas or alcohol, because you come across an awful lot of home taught runners who are somewhat incompetent because they haven't had an experienced runner to teach them the safe and proper way to do it.


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## du-bousquetaire (Feb 14, 2011)

Thanks for sharing with us this fine video David, you guys seem to be having a great time at mr Stavers, All the best, Simon


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## weaverc (Jan 2, 2008)

GaugeOneLines said:


> As a hobby, we really do need a "handbook" for how to run live steam be it gas or alcohol, because you come across an awful lot of home taught runners who are somewhat incompetent because they haven't had an experienced runner to teach them the safe and proper way to do it.


A handbook is available for new (and experienced) steamers titled "Starting in Steam, An Introduction to Live Steam Model Railroading." It is available either in soft cover hard copy or digital download from _Steam in the Garden_ magazine 
http://www.steamup.com/ 

Overall, the live steam hobby is well covered in this inexpensive publication. I recommend it for all newbies.

Chapter 2 is about safety and track fires are mentioned, although no distinction is made between alcohol and gas fires.


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## David Leech (Dec 9, 2008)

I think that nothing beats experience.
As David said, it would really be best if everyone new to live steam had a mentor to explain and teach them all the whats and hows.
Of course, there are some who live too distant from others for this to happen.
There are some that think that they know it all and do not need help.
But I do think that at somewhere like Stavers, if all those with little experience could be paired up with someone with more knowledge about not only how to run live steam, but also how to run on a track that is new to the runner.
Also a limit to the number of runners on the track at one time might be a good idea.
I think that it takes a lot of running to feel really comfortable about live steam.
I find that reading a book does not always give you the practical knowledge that experience does.
Regards,
David


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## GaugeOneLines (Feb 23, 2008)

David Leech said:


> I think that nothing beats experience.
> As David said, it would really be best if everyone new to live steam had a mentor to explain and teach them all the whats and hows.
> Of course, there are some who live too distant from others for this to happen.
> There are some that think that they know it all and do not need help.
> ...



All I can add to that David is AMEN!


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## weaverc (Jan 2, 2008)

I agree that nothing beats experience. I have 42 years of it since the purchase of an Aster Old Faithful in 1976 and there is still a lot that I do not know, especially when it comes to alcohol or coal firing. It was not my intention in my post below to imply that "a book' is THE way to go. It was merely in response to the post stating that we need one -- and one exists.

I have mentored many newbies over the years and find that passing on first hand knowledge with discussions, demonstrations and on-site advice along with their own newly gained experiences is the best way for new steamers to learn the hobby. But, when helping someone, it is important to remember that none of us who mentor are perfect nor experienced in every aspect of steaming. It takes learning from many over time to really become proficient. With all that said, the book "Starting in Steam" might contain something that even the most experienced steamer can learn.

I have observed at many steamups that when a newbie appears, there are always several experienced steamers who offer advice and help and that's the way it should be. I've not been to Staver's, but am sure it occurs there also.


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## Tom Bowdler (Jan 3, 2008)

Whether they know it or not,
David, David and Carl have been influential in my live steam journey of over 20 years. I still make mistakes and gain experience and attempt to pass that on to less experienced folks than I am. Sometimes they just don't want to listen.
I will keep enjoying, running, listening, reading and making mistakes and getting better. Some day I'll get to Stavers.
We all should aspire to do the same,
Tom


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## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

GaugeOneLines said:


> Thanks David for an (as usual) excellent quality video. As a longtime runner (58 years) of Gauge 1 live steam, I find it worrying that people are trying to put out what is obviously a gas fire, with water! As the 'voice' says, "Smother it". As a hobby, we really do need a "handbook" for how to run live steam be it gas or alcohol, because you come across an awful lot of home taught runners who are somewhat incompetent because they haven't had an experienced runner to teach them the safe and proper way to do it.











https://www.steamup.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=207


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## David Leech (Dec 9, 2008)

Just in case anyone is wondering, two people have demanded that I remove this video from YouTube as they feel that some shots are inappropriate and disrespectful.
So that I do not face any legal actions I have removed the movie and will no longer take any more movies of such events as do not wish to put up with the bullying and hassle that has occurred from this time.
All the best,
David


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## Chris Scott (Jan 2, 2008)

David Leech said:


> Just in case anyone is wondering, two people have demanded that I remove this video from YouTube as they feel that some shots are inappropriate and disrespectful.
> So that I do not face any legal actions I have removed the movie and will no longer take any more movies of such events as do not wish to put up with the bullying and hassle that has occurred from this time.
> All the best,
> David



David;
Post the video somewhere else other than YouTube like here on MLS or another site. You could probably post it to Staver's web site. Or you're about to receive a large number of volunteers or alternatives to post the video. 

You do not need youtube, obviously. 

I think your videos are among the best if not the best of our scale MRR. Please please do not go quietly into the night.


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## StackTalk (May 16, 2014)

David Leech said:


> Just in case anyone is wondering, two people have demanded that I remove this video from YouTube as they feel that some shots are inappropriate and disrespectful.
> So that I do not face any legal actions I have removed the movie and will no longer take any more movies of such events as do not wish to put up with the bullying and hassle that has occurred from this time.
> All the best,
> David


If you do not mind sharing, David, what was the issue?


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## David Leech (Dec 9, 2008)

It doesn't matter where I share it as two parents have asked me to remove from any chance of being viewed it as their children are either shown having a crash, a fire, or that their name tag can be read, so they feel that it is disrespectful and inappropriate.
So I feel the best way is just to get out of the whole thing so that I can continue to enjoy the hobby.
I guess I could go through the process of a re-edit to make sure that I remove any scenes with said people, which I may do if I ever find the time, but it does seem easier just to remove it completely.
Thanks for your interest.
Regards,
David


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## Chris Scott (Jan 2, 2008)

Words fail.


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## StackTalk (May 16, 2014)

Thank you, David,

Parents are protective of children by nature, and some are overprotective which I suppose is their right. I did not perceive any disrespect in the video.

Correctly. or perhaps not, I detected a tone of discouragement, perhaps disappointment in your post.

Those who have commented here have admired your production, and have meant to compliment and encourage you.

It it obvious that it takes a lot of effort to produce such a fine well edited video and for those of us who may not get to Stavers. your work will be missed.

It's pretty common to see images of old white men at a steam-up, and so it's refreshing when one sees participant diversity, including women and children enjoying themselves.

Having said all of the above, I can understand why some parents just don't want their children being videographed with the videos subsequently made available on the Net. Perhaps it may be a matter of either asking permission of parents at the time when one is taking videos? It's also possible you've been unlucky this time and that the matter may not come up again?

I'm guessing it would be a lot easier to edit out children from a video during the initial production than it would be to have to go back in and do it later?

Just my two cents.

~ Joe


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## seadawg (Jan 2, 2008)

Sorry to hear this David. Shaking my head.


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## Ding Dong (Sep 27, 2010)

I very much enjoy your videos David, you have done a great job capturing the event and the personalities.
The simple solution is to ban the children........oh what a world in which we live.


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## du-bousquetaire (Feb 14, 2011)

Yes David it is a shame that our world is turning to that. 

A few years a go when I was teaching young stage hands one of our colleagues had solved the problem since we often made videos of the activities we produced at the school to ask all the new students to sign a letter of photo rights, this was in order to promote the school. That's when I discovered this stupid problem. But how can you do that at steam ups?

Your wonderful videos will be missed by those of us who cannot attend. And its such a bad direction the world is taking, its like all these railroad operators, who now discourage steam trains excursions on the section of line under their juridiction. Just to be sure they don't have to deal with any hastle.


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## David Leech (Dec 9, 2008)

I spent the morning re-editing the movie to remove all of the 'young people' and the disrespectful and inappropriate shots and have placed it back on YouTube.
There are still a couple of young people in the background but I am hopeful that that is acceptable.
Regards,
David


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## Dwight Ennis (Jan 2, 2008)

I would think that if the parents don't want their kids to be filmed, it's on them to not take their kids where they know filming will be taking place. If they aren't aware that filming is taking place, it's on them to leave with their kids as soon as they see filming happening. Yes, it's sad that parents feel the need to take such precautions in today's world, but it's also on them to prevent it from happening in the first place, not inconveniencing other people after the fact.

Just one more example of our "I'm offended and it's your fault" culture. mho.

Still, it serves as a warning to the rest of us to pre-edit our videos beforehand. Thanks David.


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## Alan in Adirondacks (Jan 2, 2008)

And a question from out of left field:

How can we attract younger people to our hobby if all they see is older people in the videos? I can understand a parent's caution. That said, I agree with Dwight, that the onus is on the parent to address the matter during the meet.

I thought having young people there was exhilarating! And how else can they learn meet etiquette without running?

Best regards,

Alan


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## TonyW (Jul 5, 2009)

A link to the original version of the video was sent to all members of the North West Wales Area 16mm Group here in the UK with particular reference to the two fires and how they were dealt with. Fires such as these on our locos are fortunately rare and it was interesting to see how the two on the video were dealt with and whether anything could be learnt or improved. Unfortunately this useful video was removed before most of the group members got to see it.


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## dougiel (Jun 3, 2008)

Having mistaken both fires for alcohol rather than gas I went back for another look.

First one was interesting as it appears the gas was in the ballast and was "flushed" out by the liquid being poured into the ballast. As I used ballast on my 16mm line it was a warning about gassing up on this material.

Second one I realised I had seen similar before. A tender loco with a large gas tank in an enclosed water bath. The water bath was empty of water but after gassing up was full of gas. Owner lit a gas lighter next to it and the gas in the tender took light. Did not last for long but scary.

Pity the first version had to be removed. I suppose thats life these days.

DougieL


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## du-bousquetaire (Feb 14, 2011)

I think we should all thank David for doing the re-editing, it is the right thing to do because of what Alan speaks about, we all have to take the matter of bringing in young people to the hobby very seriously. Perhaps a solution would be to have a sign at the entrance stating that videos will be made and that people who do not wish to be filmed restrain from showing up. And that no claim can be allowed. This reminds me of the rules for GTG at members homes set up by the G1MRA, which specify that parents are responsible for their children, their behaviour and what they do.
Jusqt a suggestion...


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## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

David Leech said:


> I spent the morning re-editing the movie to remove all of the 'young people' and the disrespectful and inappropriate shots and have placed it back on YouTube.
> There are still a couple of young people in the background but I am hopeful that that is acceptable.
> Regards,
> David


Thank you. It was/is a great video.


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## afinegan (Jan 2, 2008)

Just put a sign on the door (done in legalese), "Upon entering this facility, you agree to allow yourself to be used in any video production, that is taken on this private property" or something like that. Then, from then on don't worry about it.

I am pretty sure this can be done, if your in a public place, they cant do anything about it anyway. We are entering a real idiotcracy of sorts, people are REALLY getting stupid these days.

I will continue sharing all my live steam stuff with the younger crowd like many of those around me do, this is how you spread the hobby (now if I can find time to make it to the track these days, is another issue)

- afinegan

(btw, I really need to make the trek out to one of the staver meets, it looks like a lot of fun!)


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## du-bousquetaire (Feb 14, 2011)

I would too from France!


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