# Making coal fired ruby boiler



## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

I have started building a boiler for my model of the SD Warren paper mill locomotive. I purchased a Ruby kit last month and have the chassis running on air. this is a sketch of my plan.



















a Ruby is pretty small in 7/8" scale but the SD Warren engine is pretty small too!










I purchased a 10 foot length of 2" copper pipe yesterday at Lowes. If you need a piece, let me know, I have more than I need. 

I started by cutting a length of pipe and slitting it lengthwise with my saber saw. I heated the peice with two propane tourches going full tilt to anneal the copper. I quenched it in my pickling solution and scrubbed it with a scotch bright pad to clean it. With it annealed, I could flatten the copper by hand. once it was basically flat I used a rubber mallet to finish the job. This photo shows the layout for cutting and drilling the boiler.










I center punched for all my drilled holes


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

I used my band saw to cut out the shape. 










I used brass escutcheon pins to make "simulated" rivet detail on the smoke box.










I used a 1/8" ball end mill to make a divot in the end of a punch. this punch was used with a hammer to form the heads. I drove the rivets through holes drilled in the smoke box area. then I clipped them off flush (ish) with the back side. when I used my punch to form the rivet head the cut off end of the rivet flared a bit which holds it in place permanently. 










I turned a hardwood dowel to form the boiler around. I machined it to be the same diameter as the inside of the finished boiler. with the copper annealed again, it was possible to bend it around the dowel by hand. once i got it bent most of the way around, I used my rubber mallet to form the copper the rest of the way.










With the boiler shell shaped, I used copper wire to hold a piece of copper over the seam while i silver soldered it in place to reinforce the joint.


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

The front of the firebox is sealed off using a peice of copper formed to close the space between the sides of the firebox and the boiler cylinder.










I started by sawing out a piece of copper.










I also sawed out a block of Oak to make a former, the curve was measured to be bigger than the radius of the boiler so that the metal when shaped would fit the boiler shell more or less correctly I used a small pall peen hammer to shape the copper.










It took quite a bit of work with my hammer, the vise and former and some files to make the throat plate. the hard part was getting the part to fit the outside of the boiler shell and the inside of the firebox shell.



















Maybe I'll silver solder it tomorrow.


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## Nutz-n-Bolts (Aug 12, 2010)

Exciting! I love Boiler builds. I'm interested in how the soldering of the throat plate goes. I has to be tricky at the top where it goes from in the fire box to out under the boiler. Seems like it would be easy to get a pin hole there. Is this your own boiler design?


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

The throat plate was hard to make and the joints are not yet as tight as I would like. As you say, it will take some careful work silver soldering it. I was thinking if the boiler was made so that the firebox outer shell was a separate piece overlapping the boiler shell, making the throat piece would be easier because the transition from inside the firebox to outside the boiler would be smoother and less distance. that is how I might do my next one. 

I did design this boiler based on Larry Herget's post in 2005. I'll see if i can find the link.


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## se38005 (Oct 18, 2010)

Why did you use tube, when the first thing you did was to cut and flatten it ? You would save yourself some work by starting from a piece of copper plate. Was it easier to get a tube ? 
Nice work with the rivets.


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Nice work Eric. Copper is wonderful stuff to work with. Looking forward to seeing your boiler in action.

vr Bob


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

I used pipe then flattened it because that is the easiest way to get copper of suitable thickness. I just went down to Lowes and there it was...flat stuff must be ordered specially and is more expensive because it is a special order and because it must be shipped. even inefficient use of this stuff will yield more boilers than I can make in a bunch of years work for $111 plus tax. It was not difficult to flatten it out. 

here is a sample of this afternoon's work:









I made a wooden former on my lathe and sawed out a copper disk to become the front tube sheet of the boiler. the wood form has to be smaller than the boiler inside diameter so that when the copper is bent around it the outside of the flange will be about the right size. I try to do this scientifically but always end up having to file it a bit.









I again heated the disk to anneal it to make it easier to work with.








I used my little Ball Peen Hammer to form a flange around the disk using my wooden former.








it took several passes with the hammer.








I drilled holes for five 5/16" OD tubes. I felt smaller tubes would not allow enough air flow. I hope these will work. I had to file the circumference of the front tube sheet so it would fit properly. I always wish it were tighter but this should work fine... It will just use more $ilver $older.


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

I made the rear tube sheet more or less the same way as the front. This time I sawed out a block of hardwood to the shape of the inside of the flange. I marked out the position of the holes before forming the flange but didn't drill until the flange was complete. the forming operation would distort the holes. 
I then measured and cut five boiler tubes.








I applied flux to the tube sheet joints. It is a white paste. I added some water to the paste to make it runnier so I could brush it into the joints all around the tubes. I then heated the work a bit to dry the flux. With the flux dried, I could place little bits of silver solder into the spaces between the tubes. 











Sorry that this isn't a sharper photo. it is hard to hold the torch and the camera. but you can see the flux isn't really visible anymore and the solder has melted around the boiler tubes. The flux melts clear and runs like water when the work is at about the right temperature.









This is how things stand tonight. the firebox sides/top sheet is bent around a former to match the rear tube sheet. it is also flanged to fit the backhead plate. this whole assembly will be worked into the boiler and silver soldered there once I have made the backhead and silver soldered the firebox together. I will also have to make a mudring to seal up the bottom of the boiler around firebox area.


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

What are you using for pickle bath to clean up after soldering? For years I used battery acid, but switched to citric acid.


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

This is a pickling solution I purchased. it is not highly acidic. I'll have to check the can. If i can still read it I'll let you know


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## David Leech (Dec 9, 2008)

Posted By xo18thfa on 12 Feb 2012 08:18 PM 
What are you using for pickle bath to clean up after soldering? For years I used battery acid, but switched to citric acid. 
Hi Bob,
Just curious, in what form is your citric acid, and how well does it perform.
I bought some citric acid 'powder' to test, and have been trying all kinds of amounts, but really not sure that it does anything.
Maybe, it's not what it is supposed to be! 
My brother uses battery acid, and watched him immerse a small piece of brass after silver soldering, and it was instant!
I know the citric acid is safer and milder, but does it do as good a job?
Also, after use, do you re-use, or discard?
All the best,
David Leech, Delta, Canada


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By David Leech on 13 Feb 2012 08:28 AM 
Posted By xo18thfa on 12 Feb 2012 08:18 PM 
What are you using for pickle bath to clean up after soldering? For years I used battery acid, but switched to citric acid. 
Hi Bob,
Just curious, in what form is your citric acid, and how well does it perform.
I bought some citric acid 'powder' to test, and have been trying all kinds of amounts, but really not sure that it does anything.
Maybe, it's not what it is supposed to be! 
My brother uses battery acid, and watched him immerse a small piece of brass after silver soldering, and it was instant!
I know the citric acid is safer and milder, but does it do as good a job?
Also, after use, do you re-use, or discard?
All the best,
David Leech, Delta, Canada


Hi David. This is a course granular powder I got from McMaster Carr. "Technical Grade" is on the container. I understand health food stores carry it too. Use a 1 gallon plastic water jug to mix it. Fill about 3/4 full, add acid powder, shake vigorously. Add acid powder and shake until no more dissolves and it starts settling to the bottom. Have to really shake hard to fully saturate.

Citric acid works great. Very quick and clean. Mild to the hands. Clean up with soapy water. Does not eat up steel like battery acid does. Reuse it. The mix turns green but still works.


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## Steve Shyvers (Jan 2, 2008)

Hi David, 

I have a pickling bath made from diluted sulfuric acid (same as battery acid) that I bought in the plumbing supply section of the local hardware store a number of years ago. I've used the same bath for several years, and it's gotten a bit weaker over time. However if the workpiece is still hot after silver soldering then the acid is still quite aggressive! Note that this is not a recommended procedure for safety reasons since the acid will spatter if the part is too hot. 

Does your brother dilute the battery acid that he uses? I know that battery acid, when in the battery, needs to have a specific concentration, but don't know what this is in terms of concentation percentage. When I diluted the "plumbing" sulfuric acid to make the pickling bath I don't remember trying to achieve any specific concentration. I just poured some into a plastic container full of distilled water. (Safety: Aways add the acid to the water. Never the other way around!) 

I also have a gallon jug of grocery-store white vinegar (5% acetic acid solution) that I have used as a pickle on occasion. It is not aggressive at all, and the part usually needs a long soak in it. I pour the quantity needed into a glass dish and immerse the part. Then I discard the vinegar after use, reasoning that it has probably lost much of its acidity. 

Steve


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

The Stuff I am using is "SPAREX #2" which is (was?) sold as a pickling solution for copper and brass, their #1 is for steel and iron according to the can.








It contains Sodium Bisulfate rather than a more caustic acid. a peice of copper left in overnight is only cleaned not dissolved. It does not burn my hands if some splashes on me or if I have to reach into the plastic pail I use to clean my boiler parts. It can be mixed in different concentrations and a mixed batch lasts a long time. the batch I am using now was used to make several other boilers last year and it still is quite effective cleaning my parts. I have kept it in a plastic juice container with a tight cap.


Amazon sells it : http://www.amazon.com/Sparex-Number-Pickling-Compound-Ounce/dp/B0058ED064


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## snowshoe (Jan 2, 2008)

Eric nice work so far. I wish I could do stuff like that. Maybe one day. Looking forward to seeing more.


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

"Sparex" I had that once years ago. Sulfur Springs Steam Models used to sell it. That's a good pickle too.


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## highpressure (Jan 2, 2008)

*H'mmmmm, looks familiar' Keep up the good work '*


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## David Leech (Dec 9, 2008)

Hi Bob, Steve and Eric, 
Many thanks for the information about choices of pickling solutions. 
More information to store away for when I next need it ... as long as I don't lose it!!! 
All the best, 
David Leech, Delta, Canada


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By highpressure on 14 Feb 2012 01:29 PM 


*H'mmmmm, looks familiar' Keep up the good work '*

Come to think of it, Power Model Supply sold Sparex. There's a blast from the past.


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

I probably got that can from Power Model, DeSoto MO unless I got it from a welding shop. I guess they had a fire some years back put them out of business.


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

I worked on the backhead today. 

I started with a piece of copper cut out to shape and marked the firebox door.
















I drilled two large holes in the firebox door then filed it out to shape. I also formed the flange around the outside edge using a wooden form and my little ball peen hammer.








this photo shows the firebox inside sheet and how it fits against the backhead. Full scale practice is to have a double layer of iron between the fire and the fireman with water between ( a wet back firebox) this has only one piece of copper between the fire and the fireman ( a dry back firebox. 









this is how the internal parts of the boiler will fit together.








again a little blurry but here is silver soldering the backhead to the firebox shell. This operation was done using two propane torches. one was almost enough, the second made the silver solder flow nicely. any bigger parts will require the use of the Oxy-acetylene torch.








here the firebox and backhead are in the pickling solution.








here is a dry fit of the boiler onto the chassis. the firebox fits into the frame behind the drivers and rests on the smokebox saddle behind the "Odo" who is 7/8" scale.


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## Dwight Ennis (Jan 2, 2008)

Nice work Eric! Looks great so far! 

BTW, I started using Sparex when I started building #21. I still use it. Good stuff. I keep mine in an old crock pot.


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

Nice work! I like the way the flues are done. What did you use for the flue pipes?


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

That's nice work Eric. Flanging copper is enjoyable work and not that hard to do. Have to anneal frequently, that all really.


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## Nutz-n-Bolts (Aug 12, 2010)

The new boiler has very nice lines. I'm looking forward to seeing you do those stay bolts. I believe I see the holes in the boiler. Will they be that small in diameter?


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

Randy-- I am looking forward to the sty bolts too...It may be a bit tricky to get the inside soldered properly...we will see. 

Amber-- the flues are flexible copper tubing 5/16" outer diameter. I just straightened the roll as best as i was able then called it good enough! I did bend one of the tubes away from the others after they were soldered because it looked too close. 

Bob-- Henner said that non flanged copper parts work as well as flanged ones do in the finished boiler and plenty strong. flanging is fun but not really too precise when I do it. perhaps I'll try making a boiler without flanging to see how it goes...I have plenty of copper now!


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## HMeinhold (Jan 2, 2008)

Eric,
the old English masters recommended making the flanged parts slightly over-sized, gripping them from the inside with the 3 jaw and skimming them to a good fit. Another trick is to make 3 dimples at 120deg with a center punch from the outside of the boiler shell to keep the tube sheet from sliding down during soldering.

Regards


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## steveciambrone (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By HMeinhold on 17 Feb 2012 08:48 AM 
Eric,
the old English masters recommended making the flanged parts slightly over-sized, gripping them from the inside with the 3 jaw and skimming them to a good fit. Another trick is to make 3 dimples at 120deg with a center punch from the outside of the boiler shell to keep the tube sheet from sliding down during soldering.

Regards

I found when flanging it is hard to get an absolute 90 degrees, So I took the endplate over to the disk sander and took a little material off until I got a proper fit.

Steve


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

I have done both tricks with varying success. I turned down the front tube sheet while still on the wood form with a piece of brass with a center-drilled hole pushed against it with the tailstock's live center to hold it in place. 

I sanded the firebox inner sheet by hand on a piece of sandpaper glued to a piece of flat plywood. not as quick as a disk sander but not hard either.


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Don't get me wrong. Flat plates work just fine. The best perfuming boiler I ever built was the G1MRA "Project 0-6-0". That boiler requires flat plates. Can't build that one flanged even if you wanted too.

OK, the next question. How are you going to do the stays in the fire box?


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

The stays are not next but I plan to insert peices of copper wire and silver solder them in place...we'll see if i can. I have done similar with different shaped boilers but the fire box of this is tighter than previous projects. 

by the way, I'll probably learn more from this project and thread than I'll teach!


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

I was just wondering about getting inside a small firebox to silver solder stays. I've not tried it. I've had trouble soldering front tube sheets in when the smokebox is part of the main barrel. My torch blows out easily if the flame is restricted in anyway.


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

Eric, thanks for the info about the flues, now I know that I can use the soft copper small diameter pipe for the flues. I wasn't sure about that.


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## Steve Shyvers (Jan 2, 2008)

Bob, 

Soldering inside a small firebox was the most difficult part of making my coal-fired boiler because, as you say, the burner flame gets snuffed out in the enclosed area. If the flue diameter is large one strategy could be to position the boiler so that the flues pointed at some angle so that they either helped to get rid of combustion gases or to bring fresh air in. This would not be convenient for working inside a smokebox that was an integral part of a boiler. Nor would it work if you were trying to solder the flues themselves. On my coal-fired boiler I fitted and soldered the stays before the dry back head was attached. This meant that the firebox wasn't so enclosed for that step, but that changed when I had to solder the inside solder joint to attach the dry back head. 

Steve


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Steve: I'm going to have to figure it out. Have a project in mind later this spring.


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## HMeinhold (Jan 2, 2008)

I have a Sievert swirl burner head which is recommended for soldering within a firebox. So far it has lived up to the expectations.
Regards


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

Hey Henner, that sounds like just the ticket, do you have a photo or a link to a supplier?


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## HMeinhold (Jan 2, 2008)

Eric,
I use the Sievert #3525 cyclone burner, see e.g.

http://www.bestmaterials.com/detail.aspx?ID=16964 

I thought it was recommended by Kozo, but I did not find the reference in his books. I must have found it in Model Engineer.
Oups, looks as if my link does not work... Search for "Sievert 3525" on the WEB site of bestmaterials.

Regards


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

So, how do you attach the valves and other parts to the boiler shell? I've been trying to figure that out, but haven't come up with anything yet. I also haven't found much written about in the on-line information I've found. I've read that you either use copper or bronze bushings, but not brass. What would you use for the bushings?


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Amber on 22 Feb 2012 10:49 PM 
So, how do you attach the valves and other parts to the boiler shell? I've been trying to figure that out, but haven't come up with anything yet. I also haven't found much written about in the on-line information I've found. I've read that you either use copper or bronze bushings, but not brass. What would you use for the bushings? 
Bronze is the material to use for bushings. Copper is way to difficult to machine into a bushing. Ordinary bearing bronze, Alloy 932 (also called SAE 660) works just fine. Leaded Phosphor Bronze, Alloy 544 also works. There are other exotic alloys, but 932 or 544 will do. 

Just drill a hole in the barrel or endplate and solder the bushing in. That's it. Just make sure you get good penetration of the solder and a good fillet. Inspection, inspection, inspection.

PM Research sells very nice bronze bushings ready to solder in. Their bushings come with 2 styles of thread. They are either 40 threads per inch straight, or Model Tapered Pipe (or MTP). 40 thread per inch straight is often called "Model Engineer" or ME. Determine which thread you need for the accessories you plan to use.


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

Thanks for the info! I wonder if the flanged bronze bushings that are sold at the hardware stores would work. The smallest one has a 1/4 inch bore, possibly a bit on the large side for the small boilers?


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Hardware stores around don't sell important stuff like bronze boiler bushings, so don't know. The threads have to match the safeties, water gauges, pressure gauges, clacks and all that stuff. Otherwise you'll end up buying a bunch of taps and dies to make everything work. 

I would suggest getting any of Kozo Hiraoka's books on his 3.5" gauge loco's. There are five of them. The Climax is my favorite, followed by the Heisler. He goes into great detail on boiler making. Very well illustrated and explained. Kozo is the master of silver soldered brass fabrications. He shows techniques you can build anything.


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

I wouldn't mind buying a tap and die for a specific size as long as the safeties and valves, etc are available in that size. I was looking at the stuff on the PM Research website, they seem to have most of the stuff that would be needed for the boiler plumbing, and he seems to offer it in different threading choices. As long as I decide which thread to use for the various fittings, I should be able to get the stuff from him. It seems to be a good website. Most of the other sites that I've found through Google search seem to be based in the UK, and that probably would increase shipping costs.


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

making boiler bushings:








this photo shows drilling a 1/2" brass rod to make a bushing to accept the accucraft safety and boiler fill cap or Goodall valve. these fittings are tall to allow for the saddle tank. the domes will sit atop the saddle tank so I made the fitting tall enough that they could be attatched according to Ruby practice.

Bronze is better for these bushings but brass works too in small boilers especially if care is taken in silver soldering and the boiler sees somewhat limited service. 









I used a M10x1 tap for threading the bushing. I just hold the tap in my tailstock chuck and turn the main chuck. There are special tools that fit in the chuck for tapping but this works fine. 









I turned down the end to fit into the hole drilled in the boiler so it is a snug fit. 


I may do the turret in the cab differently with a flat surface and 4 threaded holes so the throttle, blower and gauges can run off the same fitting. I feel if i make the steam passage into the turret larger the waterglass will not siphon water into the steam line.


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

to seal off the bottom of the firebox, we need a plate called a "Mudring" cut to fit both the inner and outer shells. I started by making a plywood pattern by the cut and fit method.








I used plywood because I have a lot of it laying around the shop so mistakes are cheap! I got the fit pretty close, but kept in mind where improvements could be made.








I traced the outline onto a peice of 1/8" copper from my scrap bin...cheapskates like me don't throw anything out
















I then sawed out the mudring on my bandsaw. I spent some time truing up the shape with a file to get nice snug fits all around. 









there were some small gaps less than a 32nd of an inch which should fill with silver solder just fine. a few judicious taps with my trusty hammer help too.


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

Just for fun here is a photo of some of the scrap and reject peices from this project. it certainly pays to measure twice and cut once. follow your plans and make sure to put the right numbers into the calculator when you calculate the size of metal needed for a 1 3/4" dia boiler, I made a nice 1 1/2" shell then had to purchase more pipe as I was out of scrap to work with!









All part of the fun and learning!!!


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## HMeinhold (Jan 2, 2008)

Eric,
you are a brave soul showing your scrap bin. A couple of years ago we built a boiler suitable for coal firing. It was around our boiler #15, so we thought we were experts and could afford some shortcuts. Boy, did we get clobbered. Every single shortcut haunted us. We thought, we could get away holding everything together with rivets/screws, as already melted silver solder has a higher melting point than fresh material. Of course during some difficult to make joints the whole lot got hotter than anticipated and everything sagged. We also thought, we could get away with some larger gaps by soldering the rest and then hammering the gaps close after the first round. This did not work very well either. Since then we have become very humble and stick to everything the old masters tell us to do. We finally got the boiler done but it is now referred to as the "silver mine" and David, the owner, refuses to have any pictures of our "masterpiece" leak to the public







. But with the lessons learned we will definitely make another attempt when the need for coal firing comes up again.

Regards


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## Dwight Ennis (Jan 2, 2008)

it certainly pays to measure twice and cut once.Or as my old metal shop teacher used to say, "Measure with a micrometer, mark with chalk, and cut with an ax."









I'm sure all of us have made our share of scrap (I know I sure have). Like you said, it you aren't making scrap - you aren't learning anything.


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Dwight Ennis on 24 Feb 2012 02:12 PM 
it certainly pays to measure twice and cut once.Or as my old metal shop teacher used to say, "Measure with a micrometer, mark with chalk, and cut with an ax."









I'm sure all of us have made our share of scrap (I know I sure have). Like you said, it you aren't making scrap - you aren't learning anything.










No one ever quotes the 2nd half of that old adage:

"Measure twice, cut once, buy another board."

And I had a manager once that believed the "measure twice" bit meant, the first of the "twice" was to measure where the part is to fit, and the second of the "twice" was to measure the stock to mark where to cut. His point was to not waste time retaking measurements that you should have gotten right the first time. If you have to measure twice where the place where the part is to fit, then you should measure twice on the stock to be cut, and thus the adage would be "Measure four times, cut once." Do it right the first time and you don't have to waste time doing it again.


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## daveb (Jan 2, 2008)

Eric, I just junked my first boiler build because I couldn't seal the leaks. I am building a Kozo shay and following Kozo's methods which are pretty good. The execution left a lot to be desired. I did learn a few lessons. First keep your tolerances to .003 to.007. The best expression I heard, "keep them to a tight rattle". My biggest mistake was not putting a bevel on the boiler(firebox) side of the stay bolts and nuts. Without this bevel the solder did not penetrate the joint and I could not get them to stop leaking. Same with the Mud-ring. Get it to fit close and then bevel on both the boiler side and the firebox side of the edges. The other major problem was I did not use enough solder on the first heating. Kozo calls for smaller aamonts of solder than I will use on my second attempt. I made the same mistakes Henner made but I finally gave up because the boiler was a mess and I'm sure was weakened by the poor joints. That was a lot of bronze and copper down the tube. I'm now working on a new boiler and hopefully will put the lessons I've learned to good use. 

Istill need to get up and see your RR. 

Dave Barker


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## HMeinhold (Jan 2, 2008)

Dave,
as a last resort you can use gap filling solder (McMaster carries it). That's how we finally saved our boiler. We also learned the need for beveling the hard way. This is one of the very few tips the old masters did not publish (Did they want to keep at least one secret?).

Regards


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## daveb (Jan 2, 2008)

Henner, I wish I had learned of that sooner. That might have been what was needed to save the boiler but now I'm afraid that the boiler has been weakened beyond the point I would trust it. It also looks like s_ _ _. I'd be embarassed to have it hydro tested by a bunch of pros. Anyway I have learned a lot, I have most of the fittings done for the new boiler, I have the copper, and a lot more confidence in what I'm doing. Hopefully it will be done by this spring. thanks for the info on the filler solder. 

Dave Barker


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

Good point on beveling and I have to some extent... I should remove my as yet unsoldered stay bolts and do give the holes some bevel if I can! I think I'll just twirl a little center drill in the holes with my fingers. 

I soldered the mudring to the inside shell of the firebox today with little problem...could be the silver solder I have is the gap filling kind because it does that just fine! I will not be (too) embarrassed by silver solder all over the place if the thing holds pressure! this is all for fun any how and not to win awards at the machinist convention!


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

Well, yesterday was the big day. I soldered up the boiler. 

Before I did, I removed the stays and used a centerdrill to chamfer the edges of the stay's holes. I just twiddled the drill with my fingers, any more than that and I would have ruined the boiler because the drill will catch and drill through. 










I spent some time peening a head on one end of each stay before re-installing them. 









I guess I didnt show drilling the stay bolt holes in the firebox. I assembled the inner part and boiler shell and positioned them as I wanted them to be. Starting with the crown sheet stays at the top of the boiler, I drilled through the holes in the boiler shell down into the crown sheet of the firebox. I just drilled enough to mark the place of each bolt. then I removed the inner part and centerpunched the holes as marked with the drill. then I reassembled it and drilled through the crownsheet using the boiler shell holes as a guide to get the angle right. My stays are 12gauge copper house wire so I used a suitable drill bit (number 46 drill- 0.081") to get a sliding fit. I felt that if the fit was too tight, the silver solder would not flow into the joint.










I got some new firebrick at the Wiscasset hardware store in their wood stove department. This is the work area I set up for the silver soldering job. I had a stainless steep wire that I could use to push around the melted solder (lower left) I used quite a bit of silver solder wire, more than what is shown circling the boiler.


I used my oxyacetylene torch to do the heating. I started by heating the entire boiler by waving the torch around it a bit. when I felt I was close I concentrated on heating the brass fittings on top, then the stays and fitting on the side then the backhead. with pliers, I stood the boiler on end to get the front tube sheet, then I turned the boiler upside down and did the mudring and throat plate. I shot the torch through the firebox door to heat the inside to solder the stay bolts, which worked pretty well if not neatly. the flame would melt the silver solder as I presented it to the ends of the stays making a few puddles in random places.


When I got every thin as well as i could, i dropped the boiler in the pickle solution for half an hour to clean it well.

I found a couple spots that needed attention so I re- fluxed them and reheated the area and added a bit of solder. 


As my hands were busy, I didn't get many shots of the work in progress-Sorry about that.


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

here is a shot of the side of the firebox showing the ends of the stay rods. the nearer three have been clipped with wire cutters just above the fillet of silver solder.








this is the first test pressurizing. I put a Goodall valve in one fitting and a plug in the rest. I filled the boiler with water then pumped to see what would happen. I found a leak by a stay bolt on the inside of the firebox...one of those tough to get spots...Who'd a guessed? I again cleaned the area as best i could with a wire brush and pickling solution, then applied flux and re-heated. with a little poking with my stainless wire, the silver solder that was there filled the pinhole just fine.









After pickling and polishing the boiler again, I found a pressure gauge which I threaded to 1/4" - 40 NS ( ME in the UK) which matched the turret hole's thread. I made a little spacer then screwed the pressure gauge on tightly. I filled the boiler and again pumped with the Goodall valve until I got about 120psi ( when I hit 100 on the gauge I kept going a bit) the boiler didn't show any sign of the pressure. after I stopped pumping the pressure did very slowly drop, I suspect the Goodall valve is weeping slightly or perhaps one of the O-rings on a plug. in any case the pressure stayed up for almost 24 hours now...it reads 25psi right now. I think that is good enough! I think the boiler is safe and leak free (or as close as doesn't matter)


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## Steve Shyvers (Jan 2, 2008)

Congratulations! Nice work. Thank you for documenting this. I've been in the garage a lot of this weekend fabricating parts for a type "B" boiler. Had hoped to do some silver soldering but have run out of time for today. 

Steve


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

I hear these names; type "C" and now type "B" can you elaborate? I think I know about a "C" boiler but perhaps you can describe it as well? These types are written about somewhere that I have not read yet.


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

here is a photo of the inside of the firebox showing the stay bolts and lots of silver solder!


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Phippsburg Eric on 26 Feb 2012 03:24 PM 
I hear these names; type "C" and now type "B" can you elaborate? I think I know about a "C" boiler but perhaps you can describe it as well? These types are written about somewhere that I have not read yet. 
Type B and Type C refer to designs by the late J. T. Van Riemsdijk of the G1MRA group. This is the Type B:










And a type C 











Both are intended for alcohol fuel. A lot of work in the firebox on these as they must be air tight. Especially on the Type C where the fire has to make a tight turn.

Very nice work on your boiler. Lucked out -- only one leak. What pressure are you planning to run at?


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

Thanks for the Info on boiler "types" I had seen both types but was unaware of the name "type B" 

I actually had several leaks the first time through but got them before I pressure tested when I found the last. I plan to be able to operate at 60 psi, though I am not sure the Ruby chassis is good for it, perhaps 40 is more realistic.


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Phippsburg Eric on 26 Feb 2012 07:05 PM 
Thanks for the Info on boiler "types" I had seen both types but was unaware of the name "type B" 

I actually had several leaks the first time through but got them before I pressure tested when I found the last. I plan to be able to operate at 60 psi, though I am not sure the Ruby chassis is good for it, perhaps 40 is more realistic. 
It should take 60 OK. Use to watch Dave Hottman run his at 90.


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

Bob, if the firebox is air tight where does the alcohol get it's combustion air from? 
Eric, what kind of pump did you use to pressurize the boiler?


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## David Leech (Dec 9, 2008)

Amber, 
They are open to the air where the actual burner is, the air being drawn in from underneath and around the burner. 
All the best, 
David Leech, Delta, Canada


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

I used the plastic squirt bottle to pump water through the Goodall valve. It did 120psi pretty easily, I would hesitate to go any higher though; it started to take some effort. 

Amber is correct, the bottom of the firebox is open so that air is drawn up through the grate under the coal fire and hot gasses are drawn through the boiler tubes and ejected up the stack by the blower and engine exhaust. if there were air leaks in the smokebox or fire box, the draft caused by the blower and exhaust will be wasted as air will sneak in where it doesn't have to pass through the fire and boiler. on a coal or spirit fired boiler, the size of the opening under the fire may also need to be limited to get the most heat from the fire.


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Amber on 26 Feb 2012 09:55 PM 
Bob, if the firebox is air tight where does the alcohol get it's combustion air from? 
Eric, what kind of pump did you use to pressurize the boiler? 
It's open on the bottom. The firebox has to have a tight seal around the boiler barrel. It's draft leaks to avoid, not air leaks. The smokebox has to be close fitting too. Can't have draft leaks up there either.


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## steamboatmodel (Jan 2, 2008)

One observation about the pressure gauge, the needle should only reach to 2/3 of the max pressure. If you want to pressure to 120 psig your gauge should have a max reading of 180 or a 200 psig gauge. You should never pressurize a gauge too the point where it exceeds it max pressure or worse pins the needle, any gauge so treated should be removed from service untill it can be inspected and recalibrated. 
Regards, 
Gerald.


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

You are certainly correct about the gauge...this is one I had sitting around I am sure it is not properly calibrated. I think if there were lasting damage to it it would not return to the zero point which this did. I will not be using this for anything more than this type of one shot service where precision is not required and little danger is involved. 

I stopped at the industrial supply on Friday but they were out of stock of all gauges of this type (as they were other things I was looking for) I guess the economy takes its toll on such things.


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## rkapuaala (Jan 3, 2008)

Very cool Eric, very cool


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

I made the smokestack for my SD Warren engine. The stack proper is just a piece of 1/2" K&S brass tubing. I turned the cap on my lathe. I drilled 1/2" diameter about 1/4" deep followed by a 15/32" hole. that way the cap will hide the end of the tubing and will not slip down its length. I actually ground a radius ended tool for my lathe using a "blank" piece of tool steel. it would not have been easy to get the smooth radius on the underside of the cap with the little rim at the bottom with out the custom tool. for the top section one of my standard round end lathe tools worked fine. I polished the product with steel wool before parting it of the brass stock rod.

The base as trickier. i started by bending a piece of brass plate to match the curve of the smoke box top. then i filed a similar curve into the end of a piece of brass rod and silver soldered the brass plate on to it. I chucked the rod with the plate on the end in my lathe and drilled it 1/2" to fit the smoke stack tube. I used my radius round end lathe tool to start the fillet at the base. I left a bead at the top when I parted the base off the rod. I used a round file to blend the fillet around the base plate. I did a little clean up of the edges of the base, again just by eye with a file. This would have been a casting so I did not feel a polished surface was warranted so I just left the file marks. 












I drilled holes in each corner of the base then used these holes as guides to drill into the smokebox top, which I threaded for 1-72 screws. this secures the smoke stack quite well and is actually easier to install and remove than the stock stack was. At this point I have not fixed the length of the tube, i am not sure quite how much should extend up or how much should extend into the smokebox...I'll work that out in time.


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

I made an exhaust blast pipe using a piece of 1/4" bronze rod. I started by opening up the threaded hole in the stock valve block and threading it 6-32 which is a bit larger than the stock hole was. I machined the end of the rod with a 6-32 male thread which screws into the valve block. then I drilled a long hole into the rod using the lathe. the 1/16" hole reached up almost an inch. then I added a smaller drilled hole for the nozzle end of the blast pipe I used a number drill with a 0.05" diameter which is about 1/10th the cylinder diameter as reccomended by a Steam in the Garden article. I turned down the outside of the blast pipe so i could bend it to align with the smokestack.


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

I made a smoke box saddle from a piece of copper. It is drilled to fit around the 1/4" section of the blast pipe snugly and bolted to the smokebox to seal the bottom the opening there. it also will be what holds the front end of the boiler onto the engine.









this is what the inside of the smoke box looks like at this point. the stack tube is not yet fixed so I can slide it up or down to improve the draft. I may have to change the blast pipe so that it is shorter overall to allow access to the top center flue for cleaning which may mean I have to lower the smoke stack tube.


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Looking great Eric. Fine work all around.


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## bille1906 (May 2, 2009)

Eric 
A couple of things we have found on our non-coal boilers we have made are. 
In the Bay Area we have at lease two metal yards that carry new and recycled metal. I am sure they are pretty much all over. I have been able to fill my needs for flat copper stock fom the recycle bin which is charged by the pound (now at a high of $10 per pound) with a $2 cutting charge. I usually use 1/16" for small boiler end plates and 3/32 on the 3" ones. I don't think I have ever paid more than $20 for a job (just a little info for future jobs) 
Copper electrical wire can be used for the stays but you can get bronze braizing rod from a welding supply house. if you countersink the holes, the solder will flow better and you can grind them flush without woring about ruining the fillet 
Henner taught me about the three dimple trick which works well but on our last job, the plate rotated a little as it tends to float when the flux melts so on the naxt one, I will try drilling a 0.040 hole througe the tube and end plate and driving an 0.040 copper rivet through to lock it in place. The silver solder should flow around and seal this off. 
Your work so far is great


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

When I lived down south in "civilization" i frequented scrap metal dealers, there was a good one in Stamford Connecticut which set aside interesting pieces that could be used in a home machine shop or a sculptor's shop. their copper was soon crushed and sold, but occasionally I could find some good stuff. 

Here in Maine, I have not found the place, though I'm sure one exists down near Portland or one of the other old industrial towns, though there is probably little new stuff of interest beyond stolen (i mean salvaged) copper plumbing. Maine industry has largely left for "greener pastures".


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## Steve Shyvers (Jan 2, 2008)

Eric, 

Is the firebox door positioned so that you can use it to insert a brush into the middle flue? Then the height of the blast pipe would not depend on cleaning accessibility, and you could tailor the blask pipe height to optimize steaming. My coal-fired RH Billy boiler has 7 flues, and all can be brushed out via the firebox door. The long-handled flue brushes that I use have sufficient flexibility to do this. 

Steve


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

Steve-- the firebox door is low to reach the top center flue as a straight shot. But I am not sure the door is big enough yet either, I may have to open it up a bit.

On to other adventures...









I have started work on the saddle tank. this is to be a working water tank supplying feedwater to the boiler. I used some copper roofing scrap I had scrounged at the previously mentioned Connecticut scrap dealer. I used some steel wool to polish it then embossed rivets in it (I am getting a degree in rivet making







)









I bent the copper around some rod clamped to the work bench.









I silver soldered the tank so that I could just stick the end caps on without forming a flange. The inside of the tank which fits against the boiler is a separate piece of copper. I used 1/2" copper pipe to connect the inner and outer shell to provide a water tight hole for the boiler fill and safety valve ferules.


I cut the excess copper off with metal shears and a "nibbler" which takes little bites of metal off each time you squeeze the handle. Finally I filed the joint smooth. 










I traced the profile of the front of the tank onto a peice of copper, then drew a line of rivets with a sharpy marker then followed the line with my rivet embosser. 










I drilled some holes just outside the profile line so that I could insert some pins to locate the plate properly when silver soldering it on.









here is what I have at this point this morning. the forward hole is the tank's fill hatch. I have yet to make brackets to bolt the tank in place on the boiler.


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

That thing is really looking nice!


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## rkapuaala (Jan 3, 2008)

Eric, I like the way you made your water tank. I'm going to use that method on my next one, probably Olomana. I think a working water tank would be a nice feature on her.


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## bille1906 (May 2, 2009)

Eric 
Very nice 
Are you going to have an axle pump to pump the water from the saddle tank into the boiler


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

Thanks Richard! I think you will like having the extra water on your big engine! 

Bill-- I am thinking an old fashioned crosshead pump...we will see....


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## bille1906 (May 2, 2009)

Where is the crosshead


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

Well...the ruby doesn't really have one but the spot is where the piston rod hits the main rod to the rear driver. I intend to connect to that pin a long rod to a pump under the cab...It has yet to be designed and built so we will see what happens...


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## Dwight Ennis (Jan 2, 2008)

Looks great Eric! Nice work!


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

It has been a while since i had a chance to do much on the SD Warren engine.

Last week I added fittings for a water glass:








I added a second fitting down by the bottom of the firebox ( i had planned to use the first ( to the left ) but will use that only as a bushing for the feed water check valve ) then I added a piece of copper tubing bent about as sharply as I could and some machined brass parts for the upper fitting. I made the top fiitting for the glass but the bottom one is purchased...I had it in my box of parts for years! the white gunk is thread sealant.

Richard's photos of his engine show how the boiler can be attached to the frame of the engine at the firebox...looked like an easy way to attach mine too! it is just a brass angle plate screwed into the rear cross piece on the Ruby's frame through the new Deck plate. I deeply scribed lines into the brass plate to look like planking.










I used the stock throttle and turret fitting from my kit. I made a 1/4-40 to 10-32 reducer bushing which threads into the boiler bushing. then I made a 10-32 hollow bolt to attach the turret and banjo fitting for the pressure gauge. I saved the fitting on the banjo for the blower valve...yet to be installed (or made)











I used "blacken It" to darken the smoke box. I liked the antique look I have seen on other engines here on the forum, I am not sure mine looks quite as good though. Perhaps with some toasted steam oil and some coal soot it will come into its own


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## Dwight Ennis (Jan 2, 2008)

I intend to connect to that pin a long rod to a pump under the cab...As there is no actual crosshead or guide to provide support, I'd think about the additional lateral stresses applied to the piston rod, and try and keep the pump rod and its motion as parallel to the piston rod as possible. Just a thought.


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## rkapuaala (Jan 3, 2008)

Amazing work Eric.


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Did you move the throttle/pressure gauge manifold a bit forward? Good idea. Gets clutter out of the cab. Also a good idea to put an extra bush in and cap it. Never know the next thing you might want to try.


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

It looks like it's coming along really well. 
I'm just curious, would it be a problem to install the throttle needle valve body inside the upper boiler shell with the shaft sticking out the backhead, and route the steam line out the front flue plate and down to the cylinders? I suppose that there could be an internal space problem with a boiler that small, but other than that, could it be done that way?


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

Amber-- 

certainly one could install the throttle valve inside the boiler, the problem becomes access and how to assemble and maintain it. My Aster Climax did it by having a bushing at the front and backhead that a long thin tube and throttle valve fit into, with an additional bit of tubing reaching up into the steam dome as with full scale practice. 

Dwight-- 
My plan is a straight shot between the "crosshead" and the pump which should not put undue strain on the crosshead area, though your point is well taken.


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Amber on 22 Mar 2012 11:42 PM 
It looks like it's coming along really well. 
I'm just curious, would it be a problem to install the throttle needle valve body inside the upper boiler shell with the shaft sticking out the backhead, and route the steam line out the front flue plate and down to the cylinders? I suppose that there could be an internal space problem with a boiler that small, but other than that, could it be done that way? 
Absolutely you can. LBSC and the boys in the UK did that for decades. Here's the set up you are talking about.


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

Interesting setup. I assume one of those valves is the throttle and the other is the stack blower? Is there a sight glass on this engine?


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

Eric, are your sight glass fittings basically just compression fittings? I saw today that PM Research has silicone tubing that's apparently used for the gaskets for the sight glass, and they carry 1/4 inch glass tubing pieces, so I was wondering if I could use a pair of compression fittings for the water glass ends and use silicone tubing sections for the compression rings.


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## rkapuaala (Jan 3, 2008)

Bob, thats a sweet little door you have on the burner.


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

I stopped by the Boothbay Railway Village to see the sights...here is one of the two SD Warren engines...the other is being restored. this engine is the real thing but is only cosmetically "restored" I think the stack is not original, and I couldnt see the back of the boiler...Did I hear that there was an attempt to motorize it with a gas engine? any how there were still some interesting details to see:









Its just a little beasty!

Amber-- my watergauge uses regular O-rings to seal the around the glass. they are compressed by a nut as a compression fitting would. I would think that a piece of silicone tubing would do the trick too!


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By rkapuaala on 24 Mar 2012 12:40 PM 
Bob, thats a sweet little door you have on the burner. 
Thanks Rick.


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Amber on 23 Mar 2012 10:03 PM 
Interesting setup. I assume one of those valves is the throttle and the other is the stack blower? Is there a sight glass on this engine? 
Yes, throttle in the middle and blower on the right. Here's the water glass after all was done.










The pressure gauge is a standard industrial gauge made by Ashcroft. The are about $9 from McMaster Carr. 0-60 PSI is the lowest range. The only downside is that the case is plastic. If the fire gets away you will definitely torch it. Chingford's gauge is going on 5 years now and still works great. Folks sometime take the guts out and make a nice brass casing.


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

I found some more photos of the SD Warren PaperCompany engines. The coupler rig is pretty basic on this beasty. looks like just a curved buffer block and a chain. is there something under the buffer that the chain attaches to? 

here is a shot of the cars









all pretty simple. Has anyone seen this rig before? Do you have any more info on how it works?


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## Dave Meashey (Jan 2, 2008)

Eric; 

Looks a lot like the coupling methods used for the 60cm and smaller gauge "feldbahn" industrial railways in Germany. Some of those railways attach one of the chain links to a heavy spike behind the buffer. 

There may be a hook on the chain under the pilot beam of the Warren Paper Company locomotive. Can't tell for sure. There appears to be a stout metal bar under the buffers on the pulpwood cars. My guess is that the chain was extended from the locomotive and hooked to the bar on the pulpwood car. I'll bet there was plenty of slack action on those trains. Probably made for a real "Rattler." 

Just my guess, 
David Meashey


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

On the engine, it looks like there's a piece of bar stock that comes out from under the wood beam and has a hole in it that the first chain loop goes through. That bar is probably attached to the frame with a pin or something, it looks like it will swivel back and fourth, and that bar that goes across underneath it probably is there to hold up the bar that the chain is attached to. It's hard to tell if there's a hook on the chain or just 3 links. 
It looks like the cab corner has been abused a few times.


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

Well, I did a little work this morning
Smoke box front and domes.

first the smoke box fronT:









I started by putting a peice of brass plate on my mill and drilling holes for the bolts then milling out the back side.










I sawed the part out using my band saw. this brass cuts fine with wood cutting tools...this saw is running fast for cutting wood and the blade is intended for wood.










I machined the front on my lathe to give it the right shape.


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## rkapuaala (Jan 3, 2008)

Eric, the front looks great. Did you consider forming it from sheet brass? That's how I made mine so I'm kind of partial to that technique


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## rkapuaala (Jan 3, 2008)

Here is a shot of mine.


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

Richard--

I certainly could have, but I have a bunch of 1/4" brass plate which machines beautifully and with the CNC mill it is pretty easy to do this way. It looks like your smokebox door opens, I will make this whole front like the Ruby's do to facilitate cleaning









I machined the dome from solid brass rod. I first drilled and bored it out 5/8" diameter to fit over the 1/2" (nominal) copper pipe which sticks out of the saddle tank.









here I have the dome on the mandrel I made to fit the 5/8" hole. this made it so that I could machine the dome without damaging it with the lathe chuck jaws. I made it more or less the same size as the Ruby Kit dome but added the fancy lid for the sand.









Here is the engine with this morning's work added. so far these are not attached just put in place. I think I will leave the domes just a push fit so that I can remove them to access the Goodall valve under the sand dome and the safety under the steam dome.


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

Those domes are really nice!


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## Dwight Ennis (Jan 2, 2008)

Looks great Eric! Nice job!


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## rkapuaala (Jan 3, 2008)

Yes, those domes are great! Well so is the rest of it


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Smokebox fronts are a lot of work. Yours looks sweet.


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

I spend a couple hours in the shop this evening. the first project was a number plate for the old girl. I sawed and filed a peice of brass plate (probably 0.050" thick or so) into a Numeral "2" I just kinda went at it after sketching it onto the brass with a sharpy marker.










I heated the number plate and melted on a little bit of silver solder (remember this thing will get HOT!) Then I re-cleaned the plate and fluxed it, set the number in place then heated the works until the solder flowed. I used a stainless steel wire to keep the number centered as best as i could by eye. after a little cleaning, this is how it looks. it is 3/4" in diameter (which scales as 10 1/4")











Here it is installed on the smokebox front. I threaded the back side so I could screw it on with a 2-56 screw.

I added the hand rail too. it is just some bar stock (which I had to saw from the same plate as the number) bent to shape, drilled and screwed in place. I turned the ball ends on the lathe and drilled them to fit the 3/32 rod.

I still have to make the hinges. I need the whole front to hinge so the hinges will not be quite prototypical...any suggestions?


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## rkapuaala (Jan 3, 2008)

Sweet. I like the sketch of your lamp Eric,,, where are you getting the lamp cover? Also the sketch seems to suggest that there is glass coveing the lamp cover and reflector? I was under the impression that the lens was not necessary or used?


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

I havnt started on the lamp yet. You inspired me to give it due diligence so I drew it as detailed as I could. I have some 2"x2" x 1mm? glass slides which might do for a lens. It hadn't occurred to me that the lens might not be necesarily prototypical. I think one of the photos of "your" plantation engines seems to show that a lens was fitted. I do not know If I will be able to make or install a glass lamp chimney. I may try "blowing" one from glass tubing. I'll only try once or twice, as I do not have that much tubing.


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## llynrice (Jan 2, 2008)

Hi Eric,

One source Larry Green and I have used for headlamp glass is watch crystals which come in many sizes. The company I have dealt with can be found at: http://www.gssupplies.com/mineral_glass.html


Llyn


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

Cool! thanks Llyn that looks like it might be just the ticket...I wasnt sure i could cut a circle out of the old slide glass I have.


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## SteveC (Jan 2, 2008)

Eric

To cut a disk out of the glass you could try.








[*] Drill press.
[*] Flat work surface.
[*] Copper/brass tubing of desired inside diameter for O.D. size of disk (or close & finish with grindstone).
[*] Circular clay dam.
[*] Grinding compound slurry.
[*] Light downward pressure.
[*] Time.
[/list]


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

That number plate is really something! The number is pretty small, must have been "fun" to cut that out!


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## rkapuaala (Jan 3, 2008)

Eric, I used a fuse body for mine,,, I heated it and pulled on it with a pair of plyers but the end started closing up and I had to cut it off with a dremel. I never thought of heating it up and blowing it.... I'll have to give that one a try.


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

Amber-- 

I actually rough out the shape of the number with my band saw...very delicately while it is still attached to the larger piece. I cut the sides and a slot in from the left and right to rough out a "2" then go at it with needle files. if they are pretty new and sharp they make short work of the job. there is not much metal to remove. finally I cut the number free of the larger piece and file the cut smooth. 

Steve-- I will have to try that, sounds easy enough and I have all the stuff...If i fail, I can try again or get a watch chrystal. 

Richard-- 
I have tried "blowing glass" once or twice with no real success..but what the heck its fun to try, I would think it should be relatively straight forward, especially if all I need to do is stretch a tube to make it thinner. I am not sure I could do it with a fuse body because it is pretty short, but it might work out fine.


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

Over the weekend, I made a coal grate for the engine.

I have a piece of stainless steel sheet (plate?) which is about 0.050" thick. I used my hack saw to cut strips about 1/4" wide, then cut the strips to the length of the firebox and drilled matching holes. Two of the bars have feet to hold the grate above the ash pan.


I used a piece of 1/16" stainless rod to hold them together spaced apart using 2-56 nuts. I peened over the ends of the rods to keep the works together.








It looks a bit rough but I think it should work!


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## David BaileyK27 (Jan 2, 2008)

Eric, looking at your Grate the Bars are too close together, they need at least 1/8" space between , my Ruby grates only had 6 1/8" Bars and 7 1/8" spaces, 
David Bailey DJB Model Engineering Ltd


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

David-- 

That is easily enough changed, I could just file off the peened ends of the rod, double up on the nuts or make spacers from 1/8" stailness tubing which would probably be better but not easier. I would have some extra parts for a replacement grate should it ever be needed.


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## Steve Shyvers (Jan 2, 2008)

Eric, 

I made the grate for my loco using 1/4" x 1/8" 303 stainless bar spaced at 1/8" intervals. The bars are "strung" on 1/8" diameter SS rod and silver-soldered in place. I was chided for not using 304 stainless (higher resistance to corrosion) and for using silver solder for something that was almost in the fire. Well, the 303 has held up fine (loco isn't in continuous duty). To back up the silver-solder joints I drilled holes in the bars (on the bottom side) almost to the 1/8" rod and then used a punch in the holes to try to peen the bars to the rods. Don't know if that had any effect, but the silver solder appears to have stayed where it needs to be. If it softens at all when the loco is fired it's not causing a problem because the grate is supported from below by two pins that run across the ashpan. 

Steve


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Cutting stainless sheet with a hacksaw!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Let me buy you a beer.


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

With a new blade is wasn't too bad and I wasn't going for high precision...but I didnt use 1/8" stock either--wink wink!


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

I wonder, would a metal cutting blade in the band saw cut 1/8th inch stainless without too much hassle?


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

If you can slow the blade down a lot it will cut stainless fine with a metal cutting blade. My saw is a wood cutter and the blade is really moving, it will burn out very quickly going so fast. If I set up a different set of drive pulleys, I should be able to cut steel and stainless. 

My saw will cut brass, copper and aluminum just fine as it is though.


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Amber on 26 Apr 2012 09:59 AM 
I wonder, would a metal cutting blade in the band saw cut 1/8th inch stainless without too much hassle? 



Really slow with a lot of oil. Stainless steel "work hardens". Does not take much heat to quickly create a hard spot. If stainless work hardens it won't cut.


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Phippsburg Eric on 26 Apr 2012 09:45 AM 
With a new blade is wasn't too bad and I wasn't going for high precision...but I didnt use 1/8" stock either--wink wink! 
I'm still buying you a beer.


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

Here is a shot looking up at the firebox. I reassembled the grate using two nuts as spacers. the space comes out to just about 1/8". I am holding the as pan which is hinged at the front and (for now at least) friction fit at the rear. I will probably make a way to pin it.










I made a fire door last weekend. I think it looks pretty good. Unfortunately, I broke my (last) 1-72 tap so could not finish the installation.







Any hints on getting a broken stub of tool steel out of a partially threaded hole in copper? I cheated an made a new hinge bracket with a larger hole pattern, I will just drill another hole and hope I do not break another tap


















I made extension brackets to hold the front buffer beam. I drilled two holes to catch the first two screws in the frame--the screw holding the stock buffer backing spreader, and the forward cylinder assembly screw. 


I used long 2-56 hex head bolts with washers in countersunk holes to bolt the wood to the metal brackets.










Here is the current "beauty shot" with my two 7/8" scale guys. she is a really small engine in full scale but will be a pretty big Ruby!


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## rkapuaala (Jan 3, 2008)

Sweet fire door Eric. I like the mount you are using for the front beam. I wish I had thought of that. Can't wait to see it with the cab on.


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## rwjenkins (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Phippsburg Eric on 26 Apr 2012 06:30 PM 
Any hints on getting a broken stub of tool steel out of a partially threaded hole in copper? 

Soaking it in an alum solution will do it, the steel will corrode and disintegrate and the copper will be left unharmed. Been there, done that! Takes a while though.


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## HMeinhold (Jan 2, 2008)

I had success with citric acid. It dissolved the broken tap. It took about 12h.
Regards


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

Would my Silver solder Pickling solution do the trick, do you think? that would be "Sparex". 

I like the idea of dissolving it...nothing could be better. though the piece of tap (#1-72) is stuck in the firebox.


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## HMeinhold (Jan 2, 2008)

Eric.
drop some steel into the Sparex and check if it dissolves. With citric acid you see small bubbles form. I don't know what the reaction byproducts of Sparex are. Good luck.
Regards


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

Eric, I have a question for you, I couldn't send a private message, so I figured the best way is to ask it here on your thread. Can you tell me what the flange to flange measurement is for 2 foot gauge wheels, the real ones. Not the back to back measurement, the measurement across the sides facing the rail. The reason I'm asking is that there's a V dump mine car at the local museum that measures 23-1/4 inches across the flange faces, and I was wondering if that's typical of 2 foot gauge equipment. I figured that you would be the best person to ask this question.


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

The track is gauged 24" between the inside of the rail heads. I think on curves, we are happy to have the gauge a bit loose...say 24 1/4" 

I haven't put a ruler against a wheel, and it is hard to say what exactly is the place to measure but I would bet that 23 3/4" is about right for flange to flange measurements


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

When I measured the face to face length across the wheels, I basically hooked the tape measure across 1 flange and eyeballed the measurement to where the flange met the wheel tread, that was about the best I could do with that. Maybe they had a bit of extra slop on the wheel gauge for the mine cars to keep them on the probably rough mine track, probably between 15 and 30 pound rail. I think 30 pound rail would have been heavy for the mines 80-100 years ago, more like 15-20 pound rail.


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## rkapuaala (Jan 3, 2008)

OR&L ran on 15 pound in some areas. I don't think it got much bigger and they shipped a lot of freight. They did have lighter engines though.


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

15 pound rail must be some pretty small stuff. The pieces of rail I have in my yard are 2-5/8ths inches high and the same wide on the base, and according to the rail size guide that I downloaded, these are 20 pound rail. I got the rail from a guy who had a bunch of it that was salvaged from a copper mine. If the OR&L was using 15 pound rail, that must have been a lot of light equipment being used. I wonder if they had any 15 ton cars. The D&RG started with 30 pound rail and 10 to 20 ton capacity cars, I believe.


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## rkapuaala (Jan 3, 2008)

They used SOME 15 pound rail. I have family up in Nanakuli. There's some rail left up there that is partially buried in the sand as you walk to the beach. I don't know how high it is, but the top of the rail is around about 2.5 inches. There is some twisted rail still up by this old concrete abutment and it is also fairly small. The largest engines OR&L ran was a converted K 28. The average loco's were 060 and 280s and small 4-4-0s. I'm not sure the Mikado's went all the way up to Waianae, though I have seen images of the 2 8 0 up that far. Some of the rail around Waipahu is larger. I'm not sure why.


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

I think I should have asked this question on the track ballasting thread, it would make more sense there. Maybe the moderators could move it to there? 
Rick, maybe you could get yourself a chunk of that rail to have for reference? That could be interesting. I wonder if they would let somebody salvage the rail from the sand at the beach.


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## SteveC (Jan 2, 2008)

Amber

We can move whole topics, but we can't move individual replies.


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## rkapuaala (Jan 3, 2008)

No, that's not possible. They have plans of punching the rail through to Waianae. As I said they used different weights for different areas anyway, so what I pull up from the ground in Nanakuli isn't necessarily what they have laid around the rest of the island. I doubt they ran those Mikados on that tiny rail up there in Waianae, but I'm not expert.


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

Probably why they had the little "teakettles".  
Sorry about hijacking your thread, Eric! Did you get the engine fired up with coal yet?


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

This is a cropped end of one of the rails we laid on the WW&F. I think it is 50 or even 60 pound rail which is bigger than the 35# that was used on the line back in the day. Some of the used rail we have been using is actually older than the original line! I think the Big (for two foot gauge lines) Sandy River and Rangely Lakes railway used some 50 or 60# rail on its main line but the rest was lighter stuff.


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

I got my New 1-72 taps in the mail yesterday so I was back in the saddle so to speak...










I finished screwing on my firebox door. It works pretty well and fits fairly tightly. I used a 1/16" drill as a tap drill which is bigger than the "proper" tap drill to try to avoid breaking the new tap. It seems to hold fine. I also made a new bracket to hold the firebox to the rear frame and cab deck. the old one had the vertical bolts too close to the boiler so I couldnt get a wrench on them.











I had to re-shape the rod between the Johnson bar and reverse valve. It is some kind of tough steel and didn't want to bend. I did manage to get a right angle bend into it before it broke. I added a brass "link" to represent the link to the Stephenson valve gear.

I silver soldered the link and some reinforcement at the bend. 
I also added an extension to the handle to make it easier and more to scale. I filed down the existing handle and slid a piece of tubing onto it. a brass knob finishes it off.











I squeezed in the lubricator and hooked up the steam line to the throttle and engine under the boiler. I heated the line going up to the throttle to anneal it making it easier to bend into shape.


I have an electric fan on order. I still need to make a steam blower and valve before i can fire her up. I also have to make the feed pump ( you can see the RED check valve on its extended fitting and the water drain fitting on the saddle tank.)


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## Nutz-n-Bolts (Aug 12, 2010)

Great progress. I think you have laid things out quite nicely. (controls, piping and valves) There is always a lot of time in the details. Building coal fired breads even more of those time consuming details, but in the end this is going to be quite a looker and coal fired to boot! Keep up the good work. Looks Awesome!


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## Steve Shyvers (Jan 2, 2008)

Eric, 

Please tell us where you got the clack valve? It looks very much like one I bought years ago from Sulphur Springs that came from Fyne Forte Fittings on the Isle of Wight. 

Steve


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

Steve-- 

I cannot recall for sure where i got my checkvalve, I ordered it probably almost 20 years ago probably from Power Model Supply. I think Coles has the same valve now or one close enough as doesnt matter. It has a 1/4-32 UNEF thread.


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## Steve Shyvers (Jan 2, 2008)

Eric, 

Thank you. I need to check the thread dia on mine, it's 3/16" or 1/4", but it has ME threads and came with only a 1/8" dia ball. The clack's really tiny. I have since rebored the ball seat, put in a 5/32" ball, and fitted a stop on the screw-in cap to restrict the ball rise to about 1/32" inch. 

Steve


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## Dan Pantages (Jan 2, 2008)

Steve, I have friends who live on the Isle of Wight, if you have any information on Fyne Forte Fittings, I'm sure they would be glad to track them down.


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## Steve Shyvers (Jan 2, 2008)

Dan, 

Thank you, but I believe that Fyne Forte Fittings ceased trading a while back. Somewhere I read that it had been operated out of a boatyard. I still have one of the clack package labels, and it shows the address as "Clarence Boatyard, East Cowes, Isle of Wight", complete with postal code, telephone, fax and VAT numbers, although it also shows "Freshwater, Isle of Wight" which is a village at far western end of the I.O.W. and some distance from Cowes. A Google search just now makes me think that "Clarence Boatyard" might specify a location and not the name of a specific firm. If Fyne Forte Fittings were still trading then I'm sure the name would have already come up in this forum or in the G1MRA forum. 

By the way I did confirm that the thread size on the clack is 3/16-40 ME. 

Steve


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

As you know with coal or alcohol-- You need a fan to get up steam.

I thought I had asked my dealer to order me one but he didn't get around to it and rather than wait and spend $100+, I set up my CNC and a disk of aluminum.











here it is milled out ready for some hand work and assembly. The disk of aluminum was bigger than I needed so I had something to grip with the hold down clamps. Of course you have to remember to really tighten them down...I got off to a rough start.











I put the fan back onto the lathe to cut it free of the excess material and to clean up the rim. because the metal moved between when I drilled the hole for the shaft and when the milling was completed, I had to re- bore the hole oversize and bush it to get it properly centered (or at least close enough.)













I mounted the a 12 volt (radioshack) motor to the top plate then pressed the fan onto the shaft. I used brass tubes as spacers to hold the bottom plate close to the fan. I bolted a piece of tubing into the bottom plate that fits into the smokestack. 6volts of battery and a switch make it ready for use.


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

I finally finished enough stuff to fire up the SD Warren engine. This past week I worked on the blower valve and plumbing. I machined the valve from brass stock much as I did for my butane tank heater last winter. I used 1/16" ID copper tubing to plumb in the blower. Inside the smokebox, the pipe is hook shaped so it shoots up the stack. I pinched the end to make a smaller hole. smaller yet might use less steam.









here i am building up steam using my new blower fan. I had some charcoal...I had burned some brush and put out the fire with lots of charcoal left. I soaked it in lamp oil and lit that...it didnt work real well, perhaps the charcoal was still wet. I then tried wood pellets which worked better. I tried adding coal but couldnt get it to light, so just burned more pellets. they seemed to work OK. they didn't last real long but did have enough heat for a short run of about 100 feet to my mid line station where I fed in more. I also used water pretty fast, I think the blower uses a lot of steam. 











here we are in front of the Winnegance station. I just put some more pellets in the firebox, they are a bit smokey until they are burning well. I learned a bit about firing her and was pleased that she ran as well as she did!


I am off to Mass for a steamup tomorrow, and will bring her along with some pellets and coal, perhaps I'll try again and get some pointers.


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Great job!! First runs can be frustrating, it's a learning curve. The blower nozzle has to be very small to work best. #70 drill (0.028") is it. You want velocity up the stack. It does not take much steam to get the draft needed. A petticoat (upside down funnel) on the bottom of the stack helps too.


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## Steve Shyvers (Jan 2, 2008)

Good work! Really fun to get a fire going in a boiler you built yourself, isn't it? For blower nozzles I've used stainless capillary tube (estimated 0.027" ID) silver soldered in the end of 1/16" copper tubing. Capillary tubing was salvaged from an un-used Luer nozzle. Others have suggested pinching annealed copper tubing around a sewing needle, and then removing the needle. 

Steve


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

It is good fun! Ive been kinda busy lately with other stuff so I am excited to make her go! 

I like the sewing needle idea...I'll give that a try, otherwise, I can silver solder in a orifice of some sort...yet to be determined.


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## Dwight Ennis (Jan 2, 2008)

Great job Eric!!







Always fun to see her move for the first time!


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## rkapuaala (Jan 3, 2008)

Great job Eric, I can't wait to see her with a cab!


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## alecescolme (Dec 20, 2010)

Wow! 
I have been enjoying watching this build 

Alec


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

Some updates: 

First: I dropped a busted center drill into some of my Sparex pickling solution...it disolved pretty well leaving a little pile of rust behind at the bottom of my plastic container. that seems like a good way to get busted taps or drills out of a brass or copper part...never thought of that. 

second: I have played with coal some more and had pretty good luck running the SD warren engine. I have done a complete circuit of my track about 350 feet i guess in one shot twice now. 

One time burning soft coal...excess from the WW&F railway museum. they have a pile of "dust" which is too small for them, they were happy for me to take away some for an experiment. I stoked it twice during the loop. it lit fairly easily but sort of stuck together when it was burning. it didnt seem to stick to anything when I finished and dropped the fire though. 

I havnt had as good luck with the Pennsylvania anthracite from my freind's coal stove, i didn't crush it small enough I guess. I really couldnt get it to light without putting out the wood pellet fire 

I had fine success with wood pellets, though I had to stoke pretty often. they are also easy to start by soaking them in lamp oil or paint thinner (i ran out of lamp oil...only had a little in the bottle) I get about 75 to 100 feet between stokings with my little boiler using wood pellets about 4 times for the loop.


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

You're going to need a stoker for that engine.  Turn the stoker by remote control with a small motor.


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

I have done some work on the little SD Warren engine. The first thing I did is make a feed water pump to pump water from the saddle tank into the boiler.









here is the basic pump. it uses3/32" stainless rod (K&S) as the plunger. I made a Teflon gland where the rod enters the pump body at left. two check valves are in the vertical portion of the pump. the lower is where water enters from the saddle tank, the upper is where it heads to the boiler










The pump is actually a "cross head" pump. you can see the plunger attaches directly to the cross head. You can also see the plumbing from the saddle tank to the pump and up to the check valve. I made a new check valve...that red one I had in my parts bin was too big.










the next project was to make a cab. I made this one on a plywood shell.










I used walnut for trim and paneling. the roof is plywood bent over sawn roof beams. Sorry about the photo quality, it was kinda dark when I took this shot this evening.










here is the rear view.


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Nice looking pump Eric. Do you have a drawing??


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

I just kinda went at it with that pump...sorry no drawing.


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## bille1906 (May 2, 2009)

Did you make the teflon gland by wrapping teflon tape around the rod?


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

The gland was actually machined from rod. the barrel of the pump is 1/8" so that I could install a larger plunger if needed. the gland seems to seal just fine


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## rkapuaala (Jan 3, 2008)

Sweet cab Eric


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

How did you make your check valves?


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

I took my little SD Warren Engine over to Don's place in in East Boothbay, here is a video of her run.

I was burning wood pellets. I started the fire with wood pellets soaked in lamp oil. The starter fan is an unmodified Accucraft fan. I can see how a more powerful suction might be nice on a larger engine.


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Really sweet Eric!! What kind of pressure were you getting. At 1:48 there is a side view of what looks like a water pump. What's driving the pump?? How did the pump work out. "Wood pellets" Is that the pellets folks use for home heating?

Great job. Looked like she was running strong

Bob


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

The safety is set at 60 psi and does pop off. 

the waterpump is driven from the crosshead directly. the connecting rod becomes the pump plunger and is 3/32" in diameter. it seems to keep up reasonably with out stalling the engine. 

The wood pellets are for home heating ... they are Hardwood from my local hardware store. they seem to work well enough but do not last long. I have to stoke quite frequently. I do not currently have coal which works really well. I Have soft coal from the WW&F railway museum and some Pennsylvania anthracite from a freind's home heating stove. I can use the soft coal but it gets kinda gooey when it burns, the anthracte doesnt seem to light. perhaps more experimentation is in order.


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Some of the custom fireplace companies in town say they carry those wood pellets. But I don't know. Who needs heat in Las Vegas. I'd like to try them.


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

Around the north country, they are sold to use in "pellet stoves" which are automatic stoking devices with a little firebox about the size of a coffee cup. they supply a steady trickle of pellets and forced air to keep the fire more or less constant. My dad has one and uses about a bag a day when it is cold out. The pellets have less heat energy than coal but certainly enough to get the job done if stoked frequently. they are also cheap...$5 per bag when purchased singly at the hardware store. cheaper still if purchased by the ton as people who heat with the stuff do! 

They probably sell them for chateaus in the mountains even in the "desert southwest"


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## cocobear1313 (Apr 27, 2012)

Hi, I read your thread and have followed your buying example except I bought my 2" pipe at Menards. I was inspired by your thread here.


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

I ran the little engine today...had her in steam for a couple of hours. I did try to get too far between stokings one time and lost pressure...had to resort to the fan. As long as I keep the saddle tank full she seems to keep the boiler full just using the cross head pump. I have had good luck using wood pellets, still havn't managed the cross over to hard coal...but what the heck I can get wood pellets at the hardware store and I have a nearly full bag! 

Cocobear-- I hope you keep us informed of your progress! I know I had great fun and learned a lot by sharing photos etc.


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## Nutz-n-Bolts (Aug 12, 2010)

Hi Eric, She runs very nice. Seems to steam just fine. Do you have a bypass valve for you water pump or is it always going to pump water (or air if the saddle is empty) in to the boiler? That smoke sure looks good coming out of the stack!


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

I have a bypass pipe feeding into the rear of the saddle tank but haven't set up a by pass valve yet...doesn't seem to need it. I guesstimated the diameter to pump about the right amount based on the expansion of the water into steam and it seems to be a pretty good balance. I did have to pump in a little extra water after a complete loop of the line a couple of times but a couple of times I didn't need to. I have a fitting for the squirt bottle.


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

Just curious, have you tried adding a bit of hard coal to the fire once you have the wood pellets going? Once the fire is hot, maybe the coal will burn better.


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

Hey Amber-- 

I have gotten the soft coal going that way well enough. it seems to get sticky when I get a coal fire going though, perhaps if I introduce the hard coal then, i might have better luck. 

I guess I hadn't answered your question about check valves. I use a 1/8" stainless steel ball bearing as the basis. the ball rests in a cup slightly larger than it is with a hole drilled in the bottom. this hole is the in-feed side of the valve and the ball settles into it to seal it against water flowing back. above the ball is threaded the cap of the valve. the out flow can either be through this cap or through the side of the cup as shown below. 

I made the parts on my lathe. one of the tricks for a good seal is to drill the "cup" then square out the bottom of it after drilling the in-feed hole. this makes a nice sharp edge for the ball to seal against. I ground an old drill bit with a square rather than pointed tip.


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## rkapuaala (Jan 3, 2008)

Wow, nice video. Love how much smoke comes out of her!


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

I made some little cars for the SD Warren engine to pull. 

They are very simple...I started with two strips of plywood, marked out about 1/2" across the top edge as a main carrying beam, marked out two holes for journal bearings, sawed away the excess, added brass tubing for bearings, two wheel sets a deck and end beams. 

It was not quite as easy as that, but just about. I had three cars ready to run in two hours. I added some details this morning to spruce them up a bit, I'll paint them and weather them a bit too.










The coupler is simplicity it self!


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

I started work on the headlight for the SD Warren engine today.

I wanted to see if I could make it with real glass parts. I dont have much experiance working with glass. My Mom gave me some slide glass (actually two inch square stuff used to keep photographic slides flat) I had read that you can cut a circular part using abrasive powder and a rotating drum made from soft metal.









I sliver soldered a piece of copper pipe to a bit of brass with a shank so I could mount it in a drill press. I clamped the glass on the drill press between to pieces of PVC plate (one with a hole drilled to fit my "glass drill") I used some plastic clay to seal around the hole in the plastic so that I could flood the area with water. I brushed water and the dust which had accumulated under my bench grinder into the hole, turned on the drill and applied light pressure. I worked the drill up and down so that the slurry of water and abrasive dust would keep the cutting area flooded. My little drill press runs fast and spits out the water so I had to keep adding to the slurry. In about 5 minutes I was through and had a pretty good lens!










I also tried to make a lamp chimney for the oil lamp. I started with a piece of glass tubing like I have used for water glasses. I heated up one end of the foot long piece until it melted closed using my propane torch. with the end sealed, I heated a section near the end, carefully rotating the tube so it was heated evenly all around, then i gently blew into the end until it started to balloon out slightly. It was surprisingly easy to do, though it took two tries to get it the right shape. 

I used a triangular file to file a groove around the glass where I wanted to cut it and just snapped it off.


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## llynrice (Jan 2, 2008)

Your method for creating a circular piece of glass worked well. There is another source which Larry Green and I have used on various projects -- watch crystals. They come in a very wide array of diameters both domed and flat. I bought mine from GS Supplies. http://www.gssupplies.com/mineral_glass.html


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## cocobear1313 (Apr 27, 2012)

Eric, this is a most imformative thread! Very nice stuff. 

Dave


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## rkapuaala (Jan 3, 2008)

Fantastic job Eric, I'm gona have to give both those a try. BTW where did you get your glass tube?


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

Gee, Richard-- 

I don't recall where I got the glass tubing, I have had it in my bin since I built my tug in 1994 at least. I might have gotten it from the Chemistry lab at my old workplace. I am sure it could be purchased though and probably not that expensive. 

I have started the metal work for the headlight...photos to follow...


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## Nutz-n-Bolts (Aug 12, 2010)

Eric, it just keeps getting better. Great glass work. The cars look excellent too. Can't wait to see the lights go on. Are you going to try and burn oil in it, or electrify it? 

Richard, I know PM Research will give you several extra with a purchase of a sight glass kit. Not sure if they sell just glass. They are quite a nice source for fittings.


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## cocobear1313 (Apr 27, 2012)

I agree with Nutz-N-Bolts about PM research!


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

You can buy just the replacement glass tubes for the water glass. I bought a set of 3 of them when I was working on my boiler project.


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

Unfortunately for this project the glass tubes offered for water glasses tend to be way to short to work. It has to be heated red hot at one end then blown by mouth at the other...you want several inches at least. I would try a glass blower's supply or a chemist lab supply house.

I continued the head light this morning.








This is the top chimney of the lamp roughly cut out from copper.









I folded it into shape than filed it smooth.









Several parts were silver soldered together. the basic drum is just a section of 1" copper pipe. I used silver solder so that it wouldn't all come apart as I added parts.









I machined the reflector from aluminum to give a nice shiny look. some people think a little duller metal would be better, but this looks good to me.

I made a brass piece to be the bottom part of the lamp.










I machined a brass bezel to hold the glass lens in place and give the head lamp a good finished look.










I think it looks pretty good! I have to add foot boards, a bell, whistle and hand rails on the cab and I think I can say good enough! I could keep adding stuff until the cows come home.


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## Rail Planet (Jan 22, 2012)

Sweet!


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## rkapuaala (Jan 3, 2008)

Very sweet Eric,,,, yep,,, I do not want to blow on redhot glass


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## Nutz-n-Bolts (Aug 12, 2010)

That light turned out so nicely. I love all the detail. Can't wait to see more photos once you add the last few bits. Oh and of course maybe one more video of the whole train running. GREAT WORK!


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Really nice how it came out, makes the loco! 

Greg


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

I added a bell and hand grabs on the cab. 









I also painted and weathered the pulp cars a bit.










I guess I haven't painted the journals yet ... probably should ... and soon too!


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Great job Eric!! there are lots of nice tips and "takeaways" in this write-up. Thanks for putting all together.

vr Bob


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## snowshoe (Jan 2, 2008)

Eric that looks great. I really like the way it came out. Love the pulp cars. I might have to steel that idea. 

I also love the style of your figures. Too bad you dont have molds for them


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## kno3 (Aug 25, 2008)

That's a really great loco. Congratulations.


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

Eric, where's the wick for the headlight lamp?  
Really great work there!


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

Thanks for the kind words! I have had great fun with this project...there are only a few more details required...I dont know if I'll get as far as a lamp wick though. I have learned a lot form all the experiments i did and the suggestions you have given me! I'll post a photo when I am "finished"


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

I added the boiler stays and the foot boards over the weekend. I think she is just about "done"! I am sure I can come up with some more details and improvements though. 
Oh! and I did get some ceramic tile of the type to make a ceramic butane burner...might have to try that too!


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## Dwight Ennis (Jan 2, 2008)

She looks terrific Eric!! GREAT job!!









I watched your video and it looks like she runs great too!


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## Amber (Jul 29, 2011)

That engine really turned out great! 
What kind of ceramic tile would you use for a gas burner? My experiments with building a propane burner for my boiler weren't very successful, maybe that would be a bit better.


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

The ceramic tile is quite light weight because it is perforated with a million little holes running from front to back. I purchased it from a fellow in the UK who lists his products on the 7/8th scale forum. He shipped me the tile which is about 6"x8" x 1/2" thick. I hope to be able to make several burners from it. like this one from Stuart Turner


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## HMeinhold (Jan 2, 2008)

Eric,
the tiles are also available here in the US. My friend David got them for a good price some time ago. I'll ask him for the link. One trick with these ceramic burners is to put some posts (like 1/4" diameter rods) in the path of the incoming gas jet to swirl the mixture around. Bill is currently converting his Quadruplex to ceramic burners. I guess he will report about his experience.
Regards


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## HMeinhold (Jan 2, 2008)

http://www.mrheater.com/productdetails_extended.aspx?catid=41&id=144&prodid= Eric,
here is the link:
http://www.mrheater.com/productdeta...mp;prodid= 
Regards


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

Thanks Henner! What I purchased looks about the same except that on the product you show there is a non-perforated edge which mine lacks. 

I'll experiment with it in the near future and report back. I was wondering about getting even distribution of gas mixture to the ceramic, I had similar ideas to the 1/4" rods you write of.


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## bille1906 (May 2, 2009)

Eric
Here is the progress so far as mentioned by Henner

I first made a trial box to test the burner. After several combinations I found that .010 jet worked the best. here a half tube gives me an idea of how it would work in a fire box.










Here is my firebox.It is very shallow as there is no room to go between the frame rails in the articulated engine








The outer box fits inside the fire box and the inside one holds the burner it is sealed air tight with RTV








There needs to be a space with no holes on the ends as you can see on the sides so from the bottom of the burner, I sealed off two rows of holes with the RTV








Here is my burner next to a store bought one. You can see the smaller ridges and holes. The other one is about 50% higher than mine
One thing I did was to cut the material on the back side from 1/2" to 3/8" thick on the band saw and to squeze the jet holder to an oval with a hieght of 1/4". The air gap under the burner is also reduced from 1/2" to 1/4"
I wouldn't recomend doing this unless you are cramped as I was, because I think it makes the gas dispursement more dificult.
You will also notice that the jet holder assy is only half the length








I started with just the brass rods but the heat was mostly at the rear of the burner so I added this diverter. Thr rear rod is actually for mounting and not gas disbursment








The diverter worked too well and most of the heat moved to the front as you can see below. I cut about 1/4" off each end of the diverter and it did the trick








Here is a view of the burner in the boiler. I had to turn the gas up a bit to get it glowing but then I was able to turn it down real low and still keep it glowing. It seems to heat things up real fast and is very quiet







.


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

That is really cool Bill! I will have to try it myself. I have some Ruby jets, which I would guess would give about the right amount of fuel, so I will start with them. Did you size the burner to fill the firebox?


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## bille1906 (May 2, 2009)

Yes Eric, except that these were already this width and that is why I didn't have to block the holes on the side. 
I'm hoping I have enough burner surface to drive four cylinders but I think I will be ok as the boiler heating surface is more than double what it was with the two poker burners and 3/4 ID flues. 
Ruby jets vary in size but they are around .010. By the way, the burner with the big holes worked better with a .0135 jet


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## HMeinhold (Jan 2, 2008)

How about splitting this thread with a new title: Ceramic burners? The moderators can probably do it.
Regards


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## SteveC (Jan 2, 2008)

Sorry Henner, no can do.


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## bille1906 (May 2, 2009)

Henner 
I was thinking of starting a new thread after I get back from vacation and have a chance to test the boilers out in action. 
I have learned a lot about boilers from you and others as well as this thread and would be happy to plagiarize all of your knowledge.


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## Charles (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By bille1906 on 29 Aug 2012 06:04 PM 
Yes Eric, except that these were already this width and that is why I didn't have to block the holes on the side. 
I'm hoping I have enough burner surface to drive four cylinders but I think I will be ok as the boiler heating surface is more than double what it was with the two poker burners and 3/4 ID flues. 
Ruby jets vary in size but they are around .010. By the way, the burner with the big holes worked better with a .0135 jet Bill
Definitely on the right track with the utilization of ceramic burners. We are offering a conversion using such a setup with the boilers we are doing. Our first one forth coming will be fitted onto the AC-9 (with option to coal fire). We will be comparing notes with you. A separate thread on this will be worth the time to allow all of us to reference it easily.
Thanks for sharing


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## bille1906 (May 2, 2009)

Will do 
I have some photos of the original boiler de-construction and revamp. The front boiler is very similar to the AC in design and probably presents the same challenges. I am on vacation for three weeks and will pick up when I return. One advantage of redoing the existing boilers is almost all of the bushings and mounts remain the same.


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

Jason Kovak sent me some Welsh coal this fall and I have given it a try. at first I didnt have that great luck with it. I couldn't keep up steam...it would get up enough steam for a short run then when I stoked it i couldnt get enough pressure to continue the run. 

Jay suggested I look to the smokebox geometry. If you imagine a cone centered on the blast pipe extending up into the smoke stack, that cone should be 6 units tall and one in diameter at the top of the stack. My stack was thinner...perhaps 8:1 or more. I made a replacement stack that is fatter. 










The stack is screwed onto the smokebox using the same screw holes and is interchangeable. I did have to open up the main hole to fit the larger diameter pipe.










The Larger stack seems to look fine! I think the stack on the prototype was fatter than my first stack.

The engine runs well with the new stack. it is quieter and seems to breathe easier. Burning alcohol, you can hear the fire roar with each beat of the engine which you couldn't really before. The blower and chuff seem quieter but perhaps more effective.
I converted the firebox back to burning coal and fired her up again. Se seemed to do better. steam pressure came up pretty quickly and really took off when I opened the blower...unlike before. I started with lamp oil soaked charcoal and added in some coal. once pressure was up, I got a good start to the run. I stoked it after a couple minutes. I found adding a scoop of charcoal helped keep up steam as I immediately got a hot fire and more draft. I continued adding coal and a scoop of charcoal and was able to get a good extended run.


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## snowshoe (Jan 2, 2008)

Eric love the way that engine looks. Something about that boiler color that I really like. Makes it rustic looking and really fits into your layout with that backwoods feel with all the pines etc.......


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

Thanks Shawn-- 

The smokebox is copper which had been chemically "blackened" then fed a constant supply of soot and steam oil. yesterday I found some graphite powder, mixed it with linseed oil and brushed it on....looks like a well used engine now! has a little texture to go with the dark metallic gray but hasn't lost that rusty color either. The stack got good an hot coal firing and burned off all the oily stuff so I had to add some back.


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## Mike Toney (Feb 25, 2009)

Beautifull work!!!! I so wish I could find someone that does this kind of work near me. I would love to build/learn how to build an engine like you have. I would order a ruby kit tonight if I knew how to build the boiler. Doubt I even have the tools necessary to do it alone. You really should start building a few to resell. A affordable coal fired boiler for the ruby is despiratly needed, or I should say on that is produced stateside if it can be done at a cost that is much lower that DJB does them for the Edrig/Ragleth. To bad Accucraft doesnt just do a coal fired ruby in RTR and Kit format, it would be a Huge boost to the coal fired end of our hobby. The entry cost to coal firing keeps many away IMHO, I know as I am one of them. Great work!!!!!! Mike and Michele T


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

Thanks Mike and Michele! 

I am not really yet ready to produce for sale. that is a whole 'nother step from building one moderately successful boiler. building this type of boiler isn't really hard, though it does require a bit of shop infrastructure. a Lathe, Drill press, band saw and powerful torch of some sort are needed. often local adult ed classes can be utilized to get the skills and sometimes access to equipment. if you can buy, borrow visit or otherwise get your work to the needed tools, you could proably get it done if you have the confidence to give it a try your first one or two might not be perfect but you will learn!


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

I did two little projects before Christmas on my SD Warren engine. the first was a ceramic burner. I made a little copper box with a venturi tube matching the original Ruby burner tube. It is silver soldered to take some heat. I used the original jet.










The ceramic was easy to cut. I used a hacksaw to cut it and sand paper to perfect the size. I just bent the top edges of the copper box to hold the ceramic in place.










here it is on test. i used the original Ruby tank and control valve. it seemed to work fine!










I made some brackets to hold two pins to secure the burner up under the firebox. I added some "wings" to the front and rear of the burner to catch those two pins and fill the little bit of space at the front and rear of the burner. I apologize that I do not have a good photo of it installed.










In service it seemed to work very well...once I got the junk out of the gas line and jet







It can run the engine at a good speed with a moderate train and the safety popping at 60psi!


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

After some thought and advice from experts (thank you Charles, Jayson Kovak and David Bailey!) I built a new grate which gave me about 1/4"-3/8" deeper fire. this seemed to be the trick! I was able to fire effectively on Welsh coal! I was able to maintain a fire for fairly long periods of time. 

the grate is made up of stainless rods held 1/4" apart by holes drilled in a peice of stainless which makes up the ash pan. it is simplicity itself. The ash pan is secured right up under the bottom of the firebox by the same two pins. Remove one and the ash pan hinges down for cleaning. remove both to install the butane or alcohol burners.










here is the old grate and ash pan---










with this old one the grate fits up into the firebox taking up space for coal and fire!


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## Kovacjr (Jan 2, 2008)

Now that's a deep firebox. Looks good, nice and simple. Wonder how the wire will hold up to the coal bed? Might want to put a bridge wire across the middle to keep them from sagging over time?


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

I suppose it depends on how much I use it, but I can replace them easlily enough or use 3/32 wire which should be plenty strong enough.


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