# Beautiful New Train-Li Switches at ECLSTS



## BodsRailRoad (Jul 26, 2008)

I almost forgot to post about these.

Axel of Train-Li had several brand new Beautiful switches at the show. There were several new Curved switches ranging from R3/R2 all the way up to R10/R12's !! There was a very nice WYE switch, with what I think were R7 turnouts. Lastly the was an absolutely gorgeous 3 way switch, am not sure on the turnouts on it but looked to be also R7ish.

These switches were works of art. They are hand made, not production line stuff, and the quality and detail have to been seen to be appreciated. The ties are all individually attached to each rail, no strips, and the frogs and pivot points looked perfect. I believe there is about a 3 week lead time on the switches from time of order, and from what I saw they are available in brass and Nickle plated brass (didn't see any Stainless but there may be) These are the best looking switches I have seen. 

I forgot to take pictures of the but hopefully Axel will post some as well as some more detailed info as far as prices and what not.

Ron


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## Spule 4 (Jan 2, 2008)

These are the Thiel units if memory serves? I think Axel said he would be handling these. 

http://www.thiel-gleis.de/ 

If so, from pictures, they look superb.


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

These switchs were awsome i ordered 2 of the R10 curved ones nice..............


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## Mike Reilley (Jan 2, 2008)

OK...what's R10, R12, etc?


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## Spule 4 (Jan 2, 2008)

Radius of turn, whereas most points are #.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Actually the R numbers are arbitrary coming from LGB. 

Train-Li advertises a R7 turnout, but LGB never had a specification for that number. It would be more helpful if the frog number was expressed. 

If the R number really meant degrees directly, it would be nice. 

I notice on the Theil site, the curved turnouts are expressed in true radius, both "routes"... but I don't think you can determine the frog angle by looking at the difference in degrees between the two... 

The "largest" curved switch has radii of 200 and 300 cm, that's 6.56 and 9.84 feet (radius), that's nice and broad! 

I hear they are only in brass (so far). 

Greg


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## Mike Reilley (Jan 2, 2008)

OK...lots of NON information. Is an R10/R12 turn out one with a 10' inner radius...and a 12' outer radius? Or...is it diameter? Or is this a stupid continuation of the stupid LGB R1/R2/R3 nomenclature? Or is this just something completely new? 

How can you use such a turnout without understanding what the heck is being sold? Why would anyone buy one? Now...the whole idea that I could buy a curved turnout is new to me...so someone needs to explain the nomenclature IMHO.


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## Hagen (Jan 10, 2008)

Posted By Mike Reilley on 26 Sep 2010 11:14 PM 
OK...lots of NON information. Is an R10/R12 turn out one with a 10' inner radius...and a 12' outer radius? Or...is it diameter? Or is this a stupid continuation of the stupid LGB R1/R2/R3 nomenclature? Or is this just something completely new? 

How can you use such a turnout without understanding what the heck is being sold? Why would anyone buy one? Now...the whole idea that I could buy a curved turnout is new to me...so someone needs to explain the nomenclature IMHO. 
I've never been a fan of the "R" designation. Give me the radius or diameter so I can work it out. And for a # switch give me the degree.
I can't see how the frog number would help anything for a curved switch. 

As for curved switches, it's nothing new. But Thiel isn't exactly cheap by any standard so I am going with these from Switchcrafters If I am going curved.

Switchcrafters switches are reasonable and great quality. And made in the US


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## aceinspp (Jan 2, 2008)

I never did like the R designation either. Never could figure out what was meant by R. Later RJD


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## BodsRailRoad (Jul 26, 2008)

Posted By Greg Elmassian on 26 Sep 2010 10:46 PM 
I hear they are only in brass (so far). 

Greg 

Greg I think they are available in both brass and Nickle plated as they had several of them in Nickle plated including the WYE, the 3 position switch, and a curved one as well. Ron


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## BodsRailRoad (Jul 26, 2008)

Posted By Hagen on 27 Sep 2010 12:50 AM 
As for curved switches, it's nothing new. But Thiel isn't exactly cheap by any standard so I am going with these from Switchcrafters If I am going curved.
Switchcrafters switches are reasonable and great quality. And made in the US 


Well if it was a Switchcrafters booth, then yes it wouldn't be anything new, but it was a Train-Li booth and it was new for them. Btw those switches you linked are very nice but only available in Nickle in code 215/250 and not in code 332 which is what the Train-Li switches are in, so it's not really the same at all









Ron


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## Hagen (Jan 10, 2008)

Posted By BodsRailRoad on 27 Sep 2010 01:56 PM 
Posted By Hagen on 27 Sep 2010 12:50 AM 
As for curved switches, it's nothing new. But Thiel isn't exactly cheap by any standard so I am going with these from Switchcrafters If I am going curved.
Switchcrafters switches are reasonable and great quality. And made in the US 


Well if it was a Switchcrafters booth, then yes it wouldn't be anything new, but it was a Train-Li booth and it was new for them. Btw those switches you linked are very nice but only available in Nickle in code 215/250 and not in code 332 which is what the Train-Li switches are in, so it's not really the same at all









Ron

Sorry Ron, I linked to the ones I would buy








So in case you did not find his 332 offerings You should probably buy these, He has them in aluminum code 332 as well.

Or if it was to say that he did not have Nickel silver code 332. Thiel does not have Nickel silver either (as you know), they have nickel plated brass. From what I hear very much better than LGB's attempt at the same though.


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## BodsRailRoad (Jul 26, 2008)

No need to hijack this thread (which seems to happen an awful lot here for some reason).

This post was about Axel's new switches, of Train-Li USA and a sponsor of this forum, which he had available at the ECLSTS and not some other manufacturers switches.
And yes I know Axel's switches are nickle plated brass if you reread my first post it states that, and yes those other switches are not available in 332 in nickle of any kind.

Ron


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## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

Not only are the "R" numbers completely arbitrary, they vary from manufacturer to manufacturer. They serve no purpose whatsoever, as you've got to know what each "value" is for each specific manufacturer. You essentially have "R3" switches with three different radii depending on who's making them! Stupid, stupid, stupid way of doing business, if you ask me. List the switches by radius (or diameter) and be done with it. 

Later, 

K


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## Spule 4 (Jan 2, 2008)

Kevin- 

True, based off of the European way of doing some of this, and the assumption of one brand. 

And Ron, no hijack, I remembered this from my in box (September 18) from Axel: 

New Line of ProLine-Custom switches 
We are carrying now the specialty switches (curved, Y, 3-way, large R10 straights and other products) that are *made by Thiel in Germany.* 

And Mike, sorry my quick answer of yes to the R=curve and not # points was "non information", but it seems as if the replies and even yours continue to support this? 

I don't get it, I really don't....


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## BodsRailRoad (Jul 26, 2008)

Sorry Garrett but I disagree.
The post was about the new switches Axel had at the ECLSTS (regardless of who makes them for him, they are still being sold in the US by him as Train-Li Pro line switches), and not about some other manufacturer who makes cheaper curved switches than Axel, which is what I was talking about when I said hijacking the thread.

I do agree though the whole "R" thing can get confusing though, I wish it was the diameter or Radius of the switches curve.

Ron


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## aceinspp (Jan 2, 2008)

Yep I'd agree with Kevin Stupid indeed. Later RJD


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## Mike Reilley (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Spule 4 on 27 Sep 2010 03:40 PM 
....And Mike, sorry my quick answer of yes to the R=curve and not # points was "non information", but it seems as if the replies and even yours continue to support this? 

I don't get it, I really don't.... 

I didn't mean to slight you either. Been in the hobby for 10 years. I know what R1, R2, R3 mean...and I know different manufacturers have slightly different radius curves for their versions...BUT...R7, R10, R12, etc. were completely new to me, and as I said, were meaningless terms as far as I knew. So, given that, why would any manufacturer or distributor use those terms? That was my point.


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## Spule 4 (Jan 2, 2008)

Ah, bit of a misunderstanding I see. Glad I took the rest of the afternoon to run some trains and cut down some trees (unrelated) and not muck up other threads....mia culpa. 

Yes, the R thing is annoying if you are "outside" the box of being married to one brand. Having modelled European trains in many scales/gagues for nearly 30 years has taught me this: many of the European makers assume you are "in bed" with them and not looking across the fence. 

For example, another line of readymade track for another scale I model (H0e, 750/760mm trains in H0 on N/9mm track) has one manufacturer that sells switches in degrees of curve, and another actually uses frog numbers. Oy! 

The premise is "why would an LGB modeller worry if Piko or TrainLine 45's R2 matches LGB R2....." And then there is not a fixed difference between the R1, 2, 3....as Mike points out.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Some of this is because LGB made their switches curved, so frog # would actually be misleading, since the turnout curved through the entire diverging path. 

MOST prototype (yes I said most, not all) turnouts are made like the USAT and Aristo #6, where once you hit the frog, the rails are straight on the diverging route. Then frog # (where it is basically another way to express angle) makes the most sense. 

So LGB making turnouts that "fit within" a curve makes sense... but the R7, R10, R12 is completely meaningless, it implies a broader curve, but the Train-Li R7 has about a number 5 to 5.5 frog, depending on who measured it... R7 of course sounds superior to #6, but it's a "sharper" turn.. 

Regards, Greg


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## Scottychaos (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By BodsRailRoad on 27 Sep 2010 04:22 PM 
Sorry Garrett but I disagree.
The post was about the new switches Axel had at the ECLSTS (regardless of who makes them for him, they are still being sold in the US by him as Train-Li Pro line switches), and not about some other manufacturer who makes cheaper curved switches than Axel, which is what I was talking about when I said hijacking the thread.


Ron




Thanks Ron,
your post has helped me make up my mind to go with Switchcrafters..

Scot


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## Hagen (Jan 10, 2008)

When I meant nothing new, I meant nothing new.
Thiel has made superb track products for years, they are, I am told, far superior to most other brands. That is what you pay for obviously. 
And as Axel now imports them, all the better for him and you. But you made it sound like it's the only option, a previously unheard of world turning event... 

And it is not.


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

Posted By Hagen on 28 Sep 2010 12:40 AM 
When I meant nothing new, I meant nothing new.
Thiel has made superb track products for years, they are, I am told, far superior to most other brands. That is what you pay for obviously. 
And as Axel now imports them, all the better for him and you. But you made it sound like it's the only option, a previously unheard of world turning event... 

And it is not.


Ron posted that Train Li was carrying some new nice looking switchs. WHAT PART OF THAT DIDNT YOU UNDERSTAND ??????????????????? You guys took it off in another direction not Ron.


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## Scottychaos (Jan 2, 2008)

I wasnt aware we had a new forum rule in place..that it is forbidden to mention other manufacturers in threads. 
I must have missed the memo. 
Whoever sets these kinds of rules, please let us know next time.


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

Posted By Scottychaos on 28 Sep 2010 10:19 AM 
I wasnt aware we had a new forum rule in place..that it is forbidden to mention other manufacturers in threads. 
I must have missed the memo. 
Whoever sets these kinds of rules, please let us know next time.







http://gold.mylargescale.com/scotty...lleyes.gif" /> 

Scot


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## Hagen (Jan 10, 2008)

Posted By Nicholas Savatgy on 28 Sep 2010 09:38 AM 
Ron posted that Train Li was carrying some new nice looking switchs. WHAT PART OF THAT DIDNT YOU UNDERSTAND ??????????????????? You guys took it off in another direction not Ron.










Now ain't that cute.
Please feel free to use your freedom of speech, as I will use mine. 

And I understood just fine.


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## Steve Stockham (Jan 2, 2008)

(*Sigh) Okay, the gist of this thread seems to have been that Axel and Train-Li have some kick-ass switches that are Code 332....that's cool! Some others supplied more details and that's cool too! Still others brought up the fact that there is a competitor out there that is making a comparable product so now we have something to compare it to. What's wrong with that? The way I see it, we all win with more manufacturers making the products we want! Geez guys! How about we lighten up a bit? Everyone's entitled to their opinion so let's try and be a_ bit_ more civil to each other? Please? I'm actually interested in both product lines and if a third manufacturer is brought up and discussed I'll be interested in that too! Having them all in one thread makes it easier for me to locate them. Thanks for listening.


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## Totalwrecker (Feb 26, 2009)

The over all problem with the track system is that it was based on a toylike representation. Sectional track. When you get to the end and beginning of a circle it had better match!. To make circles and straights meet switches were made like that, a curve track laid over a straight. The geometry works. Easy Peasy won out over scale..... WR (wide radius) is pretty accurate as a description. 
Then something happened ... Fine Scalers joined the fray... flex track and numbered switches vs. sectional, not so fine scale.... can be mixed, depending on the style of layout. 

Metrics and US.... Feet? Don't believe, a close aproximation to centermeters, just sounds better to US. 

John


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## John J (Dec 29, 2007)

I do not like R numbers or Frog numbers. I like the I like the diamater numbers because it relates to what I am doing. 

I got no where with the link. Any one got Pictures of this switch?


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## John J (Dec 29, 2007)

Posted By Hagen on 28 Sep 2010 10:29 AM 
Posted By Nicholas Savatgy on 28 Sep 2010 09:38 AM 
Ron posted that Train Li was carrying some new nice looking switchs. WHAT PART OF THAT DIDNT YOU UNDERSTAND ??????????????????? You guys took it off in another direction not Ron.










Now ain't that cute.
Please feel free to use your freedom of speech, as I will use mine. 

And I understood just fine.


I don't find this overly amusing either 

JJ


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## Hagen (Jan 10, 2008)

Posted By John J on 29 Sep 2010 07:20 AM 
I do not like R numbers or Frog numbers. I like the I like the diamater numbers because it relates to what I am doing. 

I got no where with the link. Any one got Pictures of this switch? 
Pictures of the new switches from Train-Li can be found here at the manufacturers website

http://www.thiel-gleis.de/html/start.html
Under "bilder" and "Weichen" (and the other links as well)

Looks like Axel has not yet put them on his website.


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)




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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

Posted By Greg Elmassian on 26 Sep 2010 10:46 PM 
Actually the R numbers are arbitrary coming from LGB. 

Train-Li advertises a R7 turnout, but LGB never had a specification for that number. It would be more helpful if the frog number was expressed. 

If the R number really meant degrees directly, it would be nice. 

I notice on the Theil site, the curved turnouts are expressed in true radius, both "routes"... but I don't think you can determine the frog angle by looking at the difference in degrees between the two... 

The "largest" curved switch has radii of 200 and 300 cm, that's 6.56 and 9.84 feet (radius), that's nice and broad! 

I hear they are only in brass (so far). 

Greg 

I just ordered a set from Axle of the 10/7 curve switchs in nickel silver plated and i was told that they were 10ft radius curves with 7ft radius turnout ? Nice switchs. cant wait.


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

Posted By John J on 29 Sep 2010 07:22 AM 
Posted By Hagen on 28 Sep 2010 10:29 AM 
Posted By Nicholas Savatgy on 28 Sep 2010 09:38 AM 
Ron posted that Train Li was carrying some new nice looking switchs. WHAT PART OF THAT DIDNT YOU UNDERSTAND ??????????????????? You guys took it off in another direction not Ron.










Now ain't that cute.
Please feel free to use your freedom of speech, as I will use mine. 

And I understood just fine.


I don't find this overly amusing either 











JJ


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Posted By Nicholas Savatgy on 29 Sep 2010 05:06 PM 
Posted By Greg Elmassian on 26 Sep 2010 10:46 PM 
Actually the R numbers are arbitrary coming from LGB. 

Train-Li advertises a R7 turnout, but LGB never had a specification for that number. It would be more helpful if the frog number was expressed. 

If the R number really meant degrees directly, it would be nice. 

I notice on the Theil site, the curved turnouts are expressed in true radius, both "routes"... but I don't think you can determine the frog angle by looking at the difference in degrees between the two... 

The "largest" curved switch has radii of 200 and 300 cm, that's 6.56 and 9.84 feet[/b] (radius), that's nice and broad! 

I hear they are only in brass (so far). 

Greg 

I just ordered a set from Axle of the 10/7 curve switchs in nickel silver plated and i was told that they were 10ft radius curves with 7ft radius turnout ? Nice switchs. cant wait. 


*Yeah, I said 6.56 and 9.84 feet... I guess you could stretch 9.84 feet to 10 feet.. but 6-1/2 feet to 7? nope, that's not accurate... unfortunately, that's like calling a #5 frog a #6 or #7... not accurate. *

Greg


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