# Class A Climax in 7.5" gauge, Progress and Updates.



## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

After about 30 years of waiting, moving, practicing, getting the shop set up, gauge 1 projects and other things, I finally got started on a 7.5” gauge ride on live steamer. It is the “Clishay” design developed by Bob Maynard. Clishay appeared in a construction series in “Live Steam” magazine from November 1977 to August 1979. Here is one of Bob’s original builder’s photos that is in “Live Steam”, December 1977.










Bob’s design is a combination of a “Class A” Climax and a very early Shay. It has 2 powered trucks, vertical boiler and an open column marine style motor. Unlike the original Climax, Bob’s design uses a chain drive mechanism with a gearbox transmission rather then the complex offset bevel gearing. The engine is made completely from barstock and easily obtained parts. There appears to be no complicated machine or fabrication steps. 

I plan to follow Bob’s design with one major exception, the boiler. The original boiler is a copper core made from 4” pipe with 32 water legs around the perimeter. I have the parts for that boiler, but would rather do a regular vertical firetube boiler from an 8” steel pipe. That boiler is more then I want to try, so I will visit Jesse Banning here in Las Vegas next week and see if he will take that on for me. 

Another deviation is in the cab and water tank layout. In “Live Steam”, June 1979, Leland Cobb proposed an alternative like the #149 Climax, “Gold Bug”. Here’s a photo of the #149 “Gold Bug” and Leland’s drawing. This is the look I plan to do.



















The frame is the first part. It is a 1-1/4” angle iron perimeter with 1/4" x 2” spreaders. It is an easy job, straight cuts and weld together.










It came out flat, and square. Good start. The “Gold Bug” version requires stake pockets along the frame side. These are lengths of 3/4" thin wall square tubes for the pockets and bent up framing nails for the “U” bolts. Everything is welded from the back. They turned out good.

Next time start on the trucks.


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## HMeinhold (Jan 2, 2008)

Hi Bob,
this is a big surprise and a very interesting project. I will follow it closely, as one of my next projects (after the Guinness and the restoration of my 4 3/4" Heisler) will be an A-Climax. However I will try to go with the real skew bevel gears. Good luck and a lot of fun with this exciting loco!
Regards


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## Shay Gear Head (Jan 3, 2008)

Bob,
It's not clear how the power is transfered to the wheels?


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## highpressure (Jan 2, 2008)

*Bruce'
-Ran Bob's Cli-Shay many (25) years ago at the Cinder Snifters track. The sprocket you see in the top photo just in front of the boiler lower edge, drives a lay shaft with a sprocket on the locos center line that drives chains out to the truck sprockets which are on centerline. The chain bend/slop lets it go around curves. Has a coal fired Porcupine boiler inside of the outer boiler shell. It ran very nicely and would pull an ungodly load.*


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Hi Henner: 7.5" gauge has been a dream for many decades. Most of the guys in our local Gauge 1 club run 7.5 and 4.75 too. Two of the guys build their own. I feel comfortable taking on this project. Another goal is Bill Harris' Mi-Cal Shay in 2.5" scale. Like yours only 1.5 times. Check out Doug Edward's website. He sells correct Climax gears and other truck parts. I've seen his Willamette parts, they are gorgeous.

http://www.precisionlocomotivecastings.com/ 



By the way Henner, I switched over to citric acid for cleaning silver soldered parts. It's much better then the battery acid







.

Hi Bruce: Yes, the picture does not show much of the drive parts. A set of 6 roller chain sprockets feed from the center countershaft in the photo. More on that in the next weeks.


Hi Larry: Every comment I've seen on the CliShay are very favorable. Yours is encouraging too.


Right now awaiting a materials order, then real work can get going.


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## Shay Gear Head (Jan 3, 2008)

I've never understood why this thing is called a "Cli-Shay" anyway. It's not like a Shay and not like a Climax.
The closest thing to reality that I can see is that it looks "similar" to Shay's prototype locomotive and it was chain drive to boot.
I guess it's kind of like Regner calling their latest "creation" a Willamette.


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## highpressure (Jan 2, 2008)

Bruce' Bob naming it a Cli-Shay is kind of like you calling an Exhaust Condenser a "SPITANATOR". Also, Bob did a step by step construction article in LIVE STEAM MAGAZINE many years back.[/b]


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## rkapuaala (Jan 3, 2008)

sahweat


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

Looks like a neat project...lots of fun! 

By the way...When checking th Precision Locomotive castings catalog and noting the comment about Regner's Willamette... were the Real Willamette engines Shays, knock offs or licensed or what was going on? I thought Shays were built by Lima but then I am not any Shay scholar.


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## CapeCodSteam (Jan 2, 2008)

Good for you Bill! Glad you were able to move on to bigger, not nessecerily better things. I can't wait to see how she turns out and a first hand report of her maiden run.


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## HMeinhold (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Phippsburg Eric on 24 Jul 2011 04:21 PM 
Looks like a neat project...lots of fun! 

By the way...When checking th Precision Locomotive castings catalog and noting the comment about Regner's Willamette... were the Real Willamette engines Shays, knock offs or licensed or what was going on? I thought Shays were built by Lima but then I am not any Shay scholar. Eric,
Willamette in Portland (manufacturer of logging equipment) repaired many Shays wrecked by the loggers in the area. So they learned about the weaknesses of the design. After the original patents expired, they designed a "Shay" with lots of improvements. Unfortunately they did not sell huge numbers, as the depression was about to start. The Mt. Rainier Scenic Railroad, Mineral, WA runs a restored one. 

Bob,
is there any danger your loco could become a mantle queen and if yes is your mantle big and sturdy enough







(I think, now I get finally expelled from this forum...)
Regards


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

Thnaks for the Willamette story!

Being a Mainer, I know Portland well and their former Locomotive building factory "the Portland Company." Aparently Portland Oregon, continued the tradition!


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By HMeinhold on 25 Jul 2011 08:41 PM 
Posted By Phippsburg Eric on 24 Jul 2011 04:21 PM 
Looks like a neat project...lots of fun! 

By the way...When checking th Precision Locomotive castings catalog and noting the comment about Regner's Willamette... were the Real Willamette engines Shays, knock offs or licensed or what was going on? I thought Shays were built by Lima but then I am not any Shay scholar. Eric,
Willamette in Portland (manufacturer of logging equipment) repaired many Shays wrecked by the loggers in the area. So they learned about the weaknesses of the design. After the original patents expired, they designed a "Shay" with lots of improvements. Unfortunately they did not sell huge numbers, as the depression was about to start. The Mt. Rainier Scenic Railroad, Mineral, WA runs a restored one. 

Bob,
is there any danger your loco could become a mantle queen and if yes is your mantle big and sturdy enough







(I think, now I get finally expelled from this forum...)
Regards




Darn, I have to store this thing somewhere between runs. Did not think of that.









According to the UPS tracking thing, parts and materials out for delivery this morning.


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

The CliShay trucks are unsprung arch bar. The arch bar sides pivot on a crosswise bolster assembly. The bolster assembly, in turn rides on a series of other bolsters and suspension members that keep the engine stable and squarely on the track. Today’s task is to get the arch bars sides down.

Start out by bending the arch bars from 1/8” x 3/4" hot rolled strap. The arch bar side assemblies get silver soldered together. Be sure to grind the hot roll scale off the strap. Layout 4 pieces. Make a pair of bending jaws from some 1/4" x 2” bar.










Clamp the bending clamps onto the stock. Space the bending clamps 1/4". Secure the assembly in the vice and use two crescent wrenches to bend. Don’t try to bend with just one wrench.










Have your adjustable bevel sets to check the bends. The CliShay trucks are 65 degrees from flat.










Bend all the arch bars identically and attach the top bar.










The CliShay plans calls for 2” inside between the bars. These came out right on. Sometimes it’s better to be lucky then good. They can be off a little, just make sure they are all the same.

Next make up a jig to assemble the pedestals and center truck supports. The square stock on the jig is the same material that will eventually make the axle boxes.










Cut and square up the pedestals and center supports










Cut some shallow hacksaw slots on the pedestals and center supports. They make sure the solder flows inside the joint. Cut 4 pieces of 0.003” shim stock. 










Clamp all the parts to the jig. Two shims go on the inboard sides of the jig. The shims provide a little standoff for the inboard pedestals. The axlesboxes in these trucks fit somewhat loose. Drill #41, two holes in each pedestal and center support, top and bottom.










Drive in 3/32” x 3/8” spring pins to secure everything. The spring pins will lock all the parts in place.










Tap the arch bar sides out of the jig. Clean everything up, flux all the joints and silver solder. After pickling, trim the arch bar sides to final length.










They turned out nice. It was 106F in the garage this afternoon, then I fired up the torch. I am so happy those are done.

Next time, more work on the trucks.


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## HMeinhold (Jan 2, 2008)

Bob, 
at this breathtaking speed you will have a rolling chassis in about a week. I am genuinely jealous! If you can't be stopped by 106F, what else can? Thanks for the step by step instructions. 
Regards


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## Dwight Ennis (Jan 2, 2008)

Looking good Bob!!


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## Shay Gear Head (Jan 3, 2008)

Bob is "Army Strong"!?


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Thanks fellas. My wife is hinting at a bathroom remodel job. She got me a tile saw for my birthday. That could put the brakes on any project.

Today we’ll get the axle boxes done. The axles boxes are made from 1 inch square steel a little shorter in length then the arch bar sides. They axle box retainers are from 1-1/2” x 1/8” plate and attach to the back of the axle box. Here are the parts:










Bob Maynard says to soft solder the axle box and retainer together. I tried to do that and it was a disaster. In the picture above the 2 holes in the retainer were to be “solder wells” with 0.005” gap between the parts. It did not work. Soft solder does not have the capillary properties of silver solder. So I cleaned I cleaned everything up and used screws to secure the retainers.










The bearings are hard bronze, alloy 932. They have a 1/2" ID, 3/4" OD and 3/4". The bearing holes need to be in the exact center of the axle box. Carefully lay out and center punch. Chuck in the 4 jaw chuck and center with your “wiggler” indicator.










Drill and bore the axlebox to 9/16” all the way through. The bearing sits in a bored 3/4" x 3/4" hole. Getting the depth of the bore is important. Set up a dial indicator bearing on the lathe carriage to determine the depth of the cut.










The diameter of the bore for the bearing is critical. The bearings need to go in with a “thumb” press tightness. Too loose and they rattle around. Too tight and they might get damaged during installation. Measure the diameter of the bearings using a good micrometer. These bearings are .753” diameter, not 3/4". You would never be able to drive these bearing into a 3/4" hole without ruining them.

To ensure an accurate bored hole, make a three-step “go, no-go” plug gauge. 










Use the plug gauge to check the bore as you creep up to the final inside diameter. The plug gauge will slide in on the .747” step and stop on the .753” step. Take very very very light “TT” cuts until the plug just goes in on the .753” step and stops squarely on the .754” step. You are done. You are going for the center step on the gauge. 










The plug gauge will slide smoothly on the .753” step and stop sharply on the .754” step. Plug gauges work very well. The boring bar has to be razor sharp, use a lot of cutting oil and patience. It will get there. And bearings drop in so nice with a press of the thumb.










To finish the axles make some journal covers from 20 gauge (1/32”) sheet brass. Bend the brass sheet over a 3/4" steel bar and trim to shape. The journal covers get attached to the axle boxes with small jewelry box hinges from Home Depot. Use 2 x 56 flat head machine screws and small pattern nuts to attach the hinges.










Drill and tap the axle boxes for 2 x 56. Polish those journal covers until they are radio active. And the axle boxes are done.










I went down the JD Locotomive and got with Jesse Banning on the boiler. He’s agreed to take on that part of the project. Also got the bed plate done. Had it water jet cut from 11 gauge plate by a shop in town. Turned out nice and saved a lot of work.










Next time we will get on the wheel sets.


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

I went lazy on the wheels and bought CNC cut steel wheels from Real Trains. Bill had them in a flat rate post office box and on the way toot sweet. For the price, it was not worth the work turning them from solids.










These wheels are 4-1/8” diameter. Just right. The center hole is slightly undersize from 0.625”. 

The axle material is “stress proof” steel, alloy 1045. It does not have a very good machining quality, but with razor sharp HSS tooling, light cuts and plenty of oil, it does OK. The axle has 2 turned steps. The first is exactly 0.625” for the wheels. The wheel hole is 0.6235”. The axle is 0.0015” over sized for a medium press fit of the wheel. The second step is a highly polished 0.499” for smooth running in the bearings.

The drive sprockets come with a 3/16” keyways and 2 set screws. Use a 3/16” x 5/8” woodruff cutter to cut keys in the axles.










The wheels get pressed on the axles. Make some bushings to slip over the machined journals so that the pressure from the press is riding on the shoulders of the axles. Make a bushing that slides inside the wheel hole and over the bearing surface on the axle. It keeps the wheel aligned during pressing. 










Get the press ready to go. Lubricate the wheel hole and axle. Don’t press dry. Get everything lined up, swallow hard and press it home.










My machine shop mentor told me that 800 to 1000 pounds pressure is ideal for a press fit. I don’t have any way to measure the pressure. Other then the wheels have not fallen off yet.










Was able to get the bolster spreader done today also. It goes between the arch bar sides.










Next time we will finish the trucks and get the chassis rolling.


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## HMeinhold (Jan 2, 2008)

Bob, 
you make everything look so easy. I still don't have the guts to tackle something that big.. 
Regards


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Henner, At least the parts are big enough handle, but this thing really getting heavy.

The rest of the truck bolsters are welded lengths of 1/4 x 2 bar stock. Both trucks pivot on kingpins welded to the center two spreaders of the frame. The front truck cants left and right on a rocking pin welded to the front most spreader. Here is the front bolster assembly without the arch bar sides.










And the front bolster on the kingpin. Be sure to paint everything black to cover up the not-so-perfect welds.










The rear bolster rides on a wide plate sliding on the rear most spreader. The rear truck keeps the engine from rocking side to side.










Now bolt the arch bar sides with wheel sets and axles boxes all together. Almost a rolling chassis










The counter shaft assembly transmits power from the motor to the inside axles of both trucks. The countershaft assembly is made up essentially the same way as the wheel sets and axles boxes. 










With the countershaft assembly installed, cut lengths of #35 roller chain to tie the truck axles together and to the counter shaft.










I ran into a little trouble with the roller chain. Bob Maynard’s plan tells exactly how many links to use for each chain. His link count was way too tight and the chassis would not roll at all. So I added a half link to each chain section. The countershaft chains sag a bit, but does not drag. I suppose they will stretch out over time and the half links can come out.

The pilot beams are next. The handrails are bent from 3/16” round stock. Bend both handrails at the same time using the bending clamps from the arch bar sides.










The coupler pockets have a bunch of parts to silver solder together. Drill and tap for 0 x 80 machine screws and bolt the coupler pockets together for soldering.










The footplates are straightforward. Saw the out from some leftover frame material, bolt together and silver solder. Bolt all the pilot beam parts onto the frame.










The pilot beam is just a 2 x 4 for now. I have a nice slab of cherry in "the stash" for the final wood.

Now we have a complete rolling chassis










I’ll get started on the motor unit next, but probably not for a couple of weeks. The wife has rearranged the work plan with a bathroom remodel job.


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## Dwight Ennis (Jan 2, 2008)

Looks terrific Bob! Very nice work, as always!


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## HMeinhold (Jan 2, 2008)

Bob,
do you use the citric acid also to prepare mild steel for brazing and clean it up afterwards? Does it attack the steel/cause it to rust. 
Your chassis looks really good!
Regards


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## Steve Shyvers (Jan 2, 2008)

Bob, 

It looks great. 

Steve


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## livesteam53 (Jan 4, 2008)

Bob, 
Looks to be coming right along. I will have to call you and set a day I could come and visit with you. Between you and Dwight I am thinking of jumping in next to 7.5.


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Thanks fellas. This is a major step. Looking forward to working on the motor. Have not talked with Jesse, but I think he's got the boiler about half done. We had our first Gauge 1 steam up of the 2011-2012 season today. Andy and I took the chassis to Clark Lord's for a test drag on a 10 foot section of track he has. Passed with flying colors.


Mark: Any time. We are always home. You need to get into 7.5" gauge. There is a new track under construction in Boulder City. Thursday is work day. They hope to have the first loop done by Christmas.

Henner: No, I don't put the parts in citric acid first. I wash in soapy water. But that's worth a try. More clean can't hurt. I discovered another trick. After pickle in citric acid, pickle again in full strength swimming pool acid. That removes the black scale from the torch. Swimming pool acid also cleans off the black scale on hot rolled steel and leaves it bare clean ready to solder.


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Got back on the CliShay project recently. Now that the rolling chassis is done, time to start on the motor. First the transmission. Forward, reverse and neutral are achieved with a geared transmission box mounted under the deck, directly below the engine. Here’s the inside guts of the transmission.










The small gear by itself goes on the engine crankshaft. 

The entire transmission unit rotates on its shaft to engage the drive gear on the crankshaft. The photo above is neutral. This is forward.










This is reverse










This is the entire transmission unit ready to install. Bearings are reach arms for the shifter ready to go. The roller chain sprocket leads down to the countershaft on the chassis.










Another view.










Everything went together good, and it rolls freely. Hopefully no binds or kinks when it goes on the engine.

Took delivery of the boiler this week. It was built by Jesse Banning at JD Loco Works here in Las Vegas. This boiler is a major departure from Bob Maynard’s original design. His boiler is an elaborate copper water tube core inside an insulated boiler shell. This is regular vertical firetube with a dryside firebox. 8” Sch 40 steel pipe with 5/8” diameter copper flues rolled in.










54 flues all together. 688 square inches of heating surface. This thing is heavy.










And inside the firebox.










Work starts this week on the motor unit.


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## Rail Planet (Jan 22, 2012)

This is looking great... it's going to be really sweet when done!


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## rkapuaala (Jan 3, 2008)

A bunch of thumbs up and clapping hands to you again Bob. I'm speechless.


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