# Piko 25 Tonner Diesel announced



## Sampug394 (Dec 30, 2010)

Haven't seen a post about them, so I'll take the initiative. Got an email the other day about several new items announced by Piko for upcoming production, one of which is a squat little monster of a diesel, being a model of a GE 25 Ton locomotive.


















And the yellow variant, which is apparently destined to clean your track somehow by operating on battery power. Haven't been able to wrap my head around what apparatus will be involved that will make this happen, but...










*GE 25-Ton Diesel Switcher Locomotive** (G-Scale) 120V*

Features:


Detailed GE 25-Ton diesel electric locomotive with lights
Powerful 5-pole precision can-type ball-bearing motor
Numerous molded-on details including lights, springs, bolts and more
Factory-applied handrails, coupler lift-bar, and steps
Digital DCC decoder and sound ready
Operating white directional lighting
Realistic cab interior with space for engineer figure
Heavy duty, durable hard chrome ball-bearing wheels
Hook and loop type couplers
Crisp and clean lettering and logo designs
Created with incredibly tough weather-resistant materials
Minimum recommended radius: 600mm / 23.6”
Made in Germany
 Due for release into the hobby wild in September or so. I personally plan on getting the blue variant, and i'm sure this little monster will be a boon for those modeling smaller operations utilizing squat, chunky motive power.




























Couple of real prototypes for y'all.


----------



## Randy Stone (Jan 2, 2008)

The blue one kinda reminds me of my little Penn Line HO switcher my dad got for me back in the early 50s. Guess, I'l need to get one of the blue ones to go with my little one.


----------



## Treeman (Jan 6, 2008)

It was covered briefly here. Good to see a new American prototype, even if a small one.


----------



## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

Cool! (Well, for a diesel.) Which is to say I'm glad to see a new, accurate US prototype model being released from anyone! Should be pretty easy to customize to give it that "funky, industrial" individualization, too. 

Later,

K


----------



## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

OK, some information still not clear, on another site, where people are reading the German stuff, there is apparently some "track cleaner" chassis that will bolt underneath to make it a cleaning car.

Also there is mention of AA batteries.

And to make it even more confusing mention of a DCC decoder.

So, we'll see what actually is delivered... a battery powered track cleaner makes sense.


Greg - 340


----------



## on30gn15 (May 23, 2009)

Ohh look at those!!!
Now, how to finance one from SSD income?
I don't _need_ one but then I also didn't need the raspberry pop tarts purchased yesterday.
Ahh, _"Realistic cab interior with space for engineer figure"_ that is an important factor to me.


----------



## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

Be interesting to find out what "G Scale" means to them.


----------



## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

Let's see... their 2-bay hopper is 1:32, their wood caboose is 1:24, the European stuff I've worked with of theirs comes in at 1:26, so I'm thinking this will be somewhere in that range...  

(ducking)

Later,

K


----------



## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Yeah, true, although to be a little kinder, all the freight stuff that is US prototype is 1:32... 

Their "old timey" US stuff looks 1:24, just like USAT, and the caboose is from that line... 

Hmm.. the tank cars are built on their flat cars, and they don't look quite 1:32..

Greg


----------



## Treeman (Jan 6, 2008)

Pete Thornton said:


> Be interesting to find out what "G Scale" means to them.


It will run on 45 mm track. And R1 curves.


----------



## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Chuckle, yeah Mike, was pretty sure it did not need 20 foot radius!

Let us know when you get some, especially to get some information about built in battery power, connections for dcc, and the track cleaning "add on".

Greg


----------



## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

Treeman said:


> It will run on 45 mm track. And R1 curves.


Nice one. I was actually wondering about this little dismal, not the whole range. What scale does it look like (as I assume you have one on hand.)


----------



## Treeman (Jan 6, 2008)

No, none of them have been shipped.


----------



## Treeman (Jan 6, 2008)

The yellow one is battery powered and a track cleaner. The blue and black are track powered and DCC and sound ready. Piko is saying they will ship in September.


----------



## Doug C (Jan 14, 2008)

"..._Piko is saying they will ship in September._.."

Hmmm, maybe they will 'show' at least the prototypes at our mid-April'18 show !?

Will try to keep on mind, and take pics+info to share. 

PIKO was at our show last yr., had acquired some booth space last 'moment' in conjunction with a local storefront for sales, but did not 'make it' into our 'FREE souvenir showguide'. I was not there, and did not know of their presence, till I saw the booth in a 'UTube video... months later !

doug c 


p.s. tad tired today so may not embedd'


----------



## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Thanks Mike, that solves the confusion on another site where the DCC and battery terms were apparently applied to the same loco... 

Will be very interested to see, since this will be one of the first "mainstream manufacturer's" battery operated locos (if you don't count the bug mauler)..

Greg


----------



## Michael789 (Sep 3, 2016)

I don't see any info on the DCC or speakers? Cant be much space for them in a little critter!

Also, some people have mentioned AA batteries. Piko's site says "Common household" batteries, so who knows what size. (Please tell me not 9volt!  )

other thoughts...
"Realistic cab interior with space for engineer figure"

What do they consider "realistic cab interior"? There can't be much space for an interior, and it's not like the previous American products have a detailed interior. (Maybe realistic was a carefully chosen word? Come to think of it, "space" for an engineer figure might be purposeful as well. It doesn't say you are getting one.)

At the price, it seems worth a shot for me. Maybe I will have time to review the track cleaner once I get it? (As long as it arrives before winter)


----------



## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

DCC ready will normally mean a connector for a decoder, or at the very least the track pickups are easily isolated from the motor. Since this is a small loco, you can pretty much assume that an HO scale decoder will suffice.

Yeah, speakers are often left out, since you add the decoder, you have to figure out the speaker location.

Greg


----------



## krs (Feb 29, 2008)

I discovered a neat trick to answer the questions that have come up in this thread - ask the manufacturer. 

Batteries used wil be AAA rechargeables (not AA's).

Batteries and chargers are not included as many people have them already.
I sure do. They are also readily available if one does not have them yet.

The battery compartment is easily accessible by sliding the front "radiator panel" up. So changing batteries, when required, is a breeze.

Because of the very small size of the prototype, the scale will be 1:24 so that it fits well with the other rolling stock and there is room for the batteries and such.


----------



## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Great news. Can you get the answer to whit I consider the more interesting part: what is the "cleaner" part, is it just felt pads? A picture? Cleaning fluid? Easy to put on and off?

My guess (because it is fun to guess and see if you can get good at it) is that this won't have a lot of weight nor traction nor run time, so a couple of spring loaded felt pads or rubber eraser material is all we will get.

Greg


----------



## krs (Feb 29, 2008)

The cleaning pads are fitted to what would be the pickup shoes on a track-powered loco. 
These are a more effective material than the rubberized abrasive pads other makers have used for cleaning blocks and cars. 
Cleaning works by the loco making multiple passes around the layout, much like a cleaning car. But the big difference is that a cleaning car typically needs a loco to push or pull it, which means the track needs to be clean enough for the loco to run - rather a "Catch 22" situation. 
The Clean Machine propels itself, even if the track is filthy. In roughly the time that an LGB 20670 will slowly crawl around a layout cleaning it's own path, the Clean Machine will have made many laps of the layout.

I thought I had a picture of these Piko cleaning pads but now cannot quickly find it.
There is a ton of interesting new G-Scale stuff being shown at the Nurnberg Fair that I haven't sorted out yet.

But in general, remember that this loco is only scheduled to be available in September/October time frame so there may still be small changes before it is actually shipped.


----------



## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

First, I am not trying to be argumentative, but some statements don't make a lot of sense, but getting the loco will prove it out.

" These are a more effective material than the rubberized
abrasive pads other makers have used for cleaning blocks and cars"
Very interesting, for all the decades people have been making cleaning pads for trains, someone has come out with something new and better. I hope that Piko really has done this. I'm skeptical though.

But the big difference is that a cleaning car typically needs
a loco to push or pull it, which means the track needs to be clean enough
for the loco to run - rather a "Catch 22" situation. The Clean Machine
propels itself, even if the track is filthy.
I suspect my problem with this paragraph is that "clean" and "filthy" here in the united states means not dirty, i.e. dirt, organic matter, etc. Clearly this little loco has much less traction and motive power than a larger loco, so substituting "oxidized" for "filthy" and making the assumption that "clean" means "not oxidized" will then make sense.

(It always amazes me that German/Austrian manufacturers cannot work more closely with English-speaking modelers to convey information.)

If that was re-written: "A track powered cleaning system is sort of a catch-22, you need good pickup to move the unit that is needed to creat the good pickup situation", for example a track powered "oxidation removal" car will run best when the rails completely clear of oxidation and run poorest when the rails are oxidized, thus when most needed the track power is the most difficult to obtain.


I guess I just like to discriminate between cleaning and oxidation removal, 2 different operations with 2 different results for different reasons. I "clean" my stainless rails, and NEVER use any abrasive. Brass rails need abrasive unless you are using acid. My track cleaning requirements match what battery people do, clear big obstructions.

Anyway, thanks for the information, really, too much speculation.

So my take is that the "big news" is that it is track powered. I will really look forwards to the new cleaning compound that must truly be groundbreaking if a tiny loco with no weight only a few driving wheels and tiny batteries can do better that an LGB track cleaning car (which by the way removes the oxide before the pickup wheels get there, so no catch-22).

Greg


----------



## Treeman (Jan 6, 2008)

I may be confused but, I don't think" that it is track powered".


----------



## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

It is not, the "brag" from Piko is that a track powered track cleaner is a catch-22. (I'm assuming you are talking about the Piko), the LGB track cleaner is powered:










Greg


----------



## krs (Feb 29, 2008)

I don't use my LGB 20670 very often any more.
Doesn't work as well in practice as in theory.

When the cleaning wheels are turning in the opposite direction than the driving wheels (which is the way the loco is normally wired), it's very easy to gouge the rails a bit if the loco hesitates when running - and it does.
I reversed the wiring so that the cleaning wheels turn in the same direction as the driving wheels and that works much better.

But the way I understand it, the new Piko cleaning loco is meant to run around the layout a number of times to "clean" the rails and it should do that consistently since it's battery powered.
In comparison the LGB track cleaning loco runs much slower and is supposed to clean the rails in a single pass.

But in the end, we will have to wait until the fall to see how well (or how poorly) the Piko unit works when it comes to cleaning the rails. I would imagine the performance is similar to the cleaning pads one can mount under an LGB freight car or the Aristo caboose with the cleaning pads.


----------



## krs (Feb 29, 2008)

Here is a first sample at the Piko stand at the Toy Fair - gives an idea of the size.


----------



## krs (Feb 29, 2008)

Here is a close up of the model at the fair.

It's just a basic shell using 3D printing to show the size of the unit.
Copied from a video with Piko boss Dr. Wilfer


----------



## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

> It's just a basic shell using 3D printing to show the size of the unit.


Huh. While I appreciate the problems of squeezing everything in to a small model of a small prototype, I do not appreciate them picking an obscure scale like 1/24. We already have lots of 1/22.5 and even 1:20. Why couldn't they be consistent with the rest of the industry.


----------



## krs (Feb 29, 2008)

Pete,

1/24 is not at all obscure in Large Scale.
There are a number of manufacturers stating that as their "official" scale
The Aristocraft Classic line was in 1/24
Hartland products are in 1/24
USA Trains Work train series is 1/24
Accucraft made 1/24 items
American Model Builders is 1/24
and there are a few more

I rather like true 1/24 scale products since it is easy to get accessories.
Have you ever tried to find a 1/22.5 or 1/29 automobile or truck to go with your trains.
Pretty much impossible whereas 1/24 die cast cars are a dime a dozen.

And btw - LGB states 1/22.5 scale for their narrow gauge equipment but when you actually measure the length of an RhB Ge 4/4 loco it's pretty much dead on in 1/24 scale. The LGB autocarrier has two cars on it that are also 1/24 scale - it's right on the cars when you turn them upside down.

I think for Piko this was the right way to go.
As someone said "G" for "Goofy"
People have no problem running 1/29, 1/24 and 1/22.5 box cars in the same consist.


----------



## on30gn15 (May 23, 2009)

krs said:


> I rather like true 1/24 scale products since it is easy to get accessories.


 Yes. I like it for freelance builds because it is a nice even measurement to work with - if you aren't using metric! 
A lot of my builds and bashes use HLW stock. 
1/25 scale is also used at times, true, it is several percentage points different from 1/24, but it can be handy for fudging the 25.4 millimeters per inch in to 1/25 scale inches.


----------



## vsmith (Jan 2, 2008)

I don't need one of these, so I'll try to get two.


----------



## Totalwrecker (Feb 26, 2009)

First definition online of Filthy: 
*1*. 
disgustingly dirty.

It's battery powered to go over that disgusting dirt! I can see a spun glass pad and a cleaning fluid being more efficient than wool...
Let's wait and see!


----------



## Michael789 (Sep 3, 2016)

It seems Piko America posted a video ... you can see a little bit of the track cleaning pad/system (for lack of a better term) in the video. He picks it up around 2:30. The pad mounts where the pick-up shoes are/would be.


----------



## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

It has a piece of silicon carbide drywall sandpaper stuck to the pickup shoes with double sticky tape. Clearly that is not how the real unit will work.

Look at it in high resolution on a big screen at about 3:10....

Greg


----------



## MJSavage (Dec 27, 2007)

That looks like a great platform for a GE 23 ton boxcab. Too many projects . . .


----------



## Doug C (Jan 14, 2008)

Might see them (or at least the 3d template) on display, and questioned about at; 
https://www.piko-america.com/pages/shows-and-events


nite, 
doug c


----------

