# Masterclass 2008?



## jtutwiler (May 29, 2008)

I am curious to know if and when will be the start of the 2008 Masterclass? Is this something that usually takes place in the fall or winter. I am still fairly new here, so I apologize if this is a stupid question 

thanks 
JT


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## vsmith (Jan 2, 2008)

I'm not sure if there will be one, nothings been mentioned since the Porter and the Porter only had a few takers. 

Part of the problem is finding a subject that has a ready source available for drive bricks and specialty detail parts, the Porter guys had to scramble for out of production Indy chassis, if you couldnt find one, you were out, the Mason-Bogie project got torpedoed by Barry's forced residence and business relocation and the ensueing delays that caused, some are still in progress, the CP Huntington and the Mogul worked out pretty well but then they used what at the time were all off-the-shelf components that were readily available. 

So any Masterclass Project has to something that, A: people want to build. B: we can easily get drives for. and C: there are available detail parts for if needed. Otherwise you have to scratchbuild everything, which is part of the fun, but if you've ever tried building an air pump or a cowcatcher from scratch, you know it can go from fun to PITA in about 30 minutes. 

I wouldnt mind doing another project myself, but what? 

I didnt do the Porter because I like my Indy and have a 1/20 cab kit awaiting it so I didnt want to scrap it. Maybe what we really need to do is assess what Masterclass projects still remain, who might want to do another, and what projects are within reason. 

Any comments from the rest?


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## ShadsTrains (Dec 27, 2007)

I'm open to suggestions and volunteers for leading the projects. Unfortunately, I lack both the modeling skills and time to lead a project.. I definitely want to get the flow of articles going again..


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## David Fletcher (Jan 2, 2008)

Still got loads of ideas for classes. I asked around last year, and the general comment was that people needed time to catch up, many still building Carter Bros cars. Not many Porters built yet, so I thought I'd hold any new roll outs. I still have the 2nd California Porter chapter to do. 

In the mean time I'm spending lots of time on colour research and drawing ideas for possible Acc models. 

David.


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## Dwight Ennis (Jan 2, 2008)

Howzabout some Carter Bros bullnose coaches? Something from the 1900 era?


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## astrayelmgod (Jan 2, 2008)

Fletch was considering a C-16 for awhile, and it sounded interesting, but there are so many commercial C-xx engines already available that I would hesitate to commit that huge amount of time to something I could buy. 

I should say here that I have been building the M-B for over a year now, and have only a handful of component bits made. Cab, boiler, cab and tender deck, pilot and pilot deck, a few others. No tender, backhead, ashpan or a thousand other details. Probably at least another year's work. Depends on my day job. 

So, I would be interested in something that I couldn't buy. Somebody posted a link to a tiny narrow gauge 2-4-4-2 that ran in New Zealand for awhile. That's more like it. For me, anyway. 

How about a MasterClass on how to do your own creation? Gathering data, and measuring from photos and... well, if I knew what else was needed, I wouldn't need a class, now, would I?


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## jtutwiler (May 29, 2008)

I agree building something unique that you cannot buy is the most appealing. BTW, does anybody know if there is a source to get the Carter Brother Coach Kits, or were they all sold?


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## Rich Schiffman (Jan 2, 2008)

Bronson-Tate Architectural Models has several of the kit types for sale. These are fine kits and well done. They include many parts like hinges, door handles, etc. Good luck.


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## Roland Seavey (Jan 4, 2008)

I still would like to build a 3 truck Shay in 1:20. Yes they are avaliable now but building one would be cool. But make the drive system work no motor blocks. 
Roland


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## DougArcher (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By astrayelmgod on 07/21/2008 5:32 PM
Somebody posted a link to a tiny narrow gauge 2-4-4-2 that ran in New Zealand for awhile. 





Whoa, Where? 

Id like to see any small articulated, or possibly a non modeled garatt


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## DKRickman (Mar 25, 2008)

I'll secont the request for a garratt. Maybe something other than an American prototype, for those of us with global interests. I've always liked the little 0-4-4-0 narrow gauge outside frame garratts, and have thought that the new B'mann diesel would be the perfect starting point. Heck, if you did that, the class would work for Fn3 and On30 at the same time!


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## wchasr (Jan 2, 2008)

Honestly, for me, at this point, without a layout to run on, and way too much motive power, I NEED rolling stock. 

So how about cars? Freight cars? Transtition era? or later diesel modern-ish freight? 

Chas


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## jnic (Jan 2, 2008)

I agree with vsmith. Deciding on a motive project is difficult. I likewise agree with Chas - how about rolling stock? How about some accurate, company specific logging cars (skeletons and disconnects)? I'd gladly pitch in on techniques for cutting scale lumber. Perhaps someone else could chime in on casting techniques.


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## vsmith (Jan 2, 2008)

While I would love to build one of these: 








I think I would be only one of about three others interested but... 

I was recently thinking what about this: 









Why not? 

We could use the same drive motor as the CP Huntington, it could be all styrene or a mix of styrene and metal, and its gear system is bulky enough it could be built so the bull gear mechanism could be operated the same way it is one the original. The Gazoo published a complete plans a couple years ago, so plans are not an issue. 

Yes I know Missouri Model Works is issueing one this year, but dammit I'm poor, and cant afford a $800 locomotive no matter how nice it is. 

Whatchya think? Anyone else intersted?


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## jtutwiler (May 29, 2008)

I would be very interested in building a Darjeeling. I could see great satisfaction coming from building such a locomotive that is not readily available and very unique. /DesktopModules/NTForums/themes/mls/emoticons/laugh.gif


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## vsmith (Jan 2, 2008)

Well, thats 2, I predicted 3 so who else to make the trio./DesktopModules/NTForums/themes/mls/emoticons/tongue.gif


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## jnic (Jan 2, 2008)

I'm already planning a Gypsy-ish freelance bash based on an LGB 2017. Love those runnning gears.


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## vsmith (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By jnic on 07/22/2008 9:26 AM
I'm already planning a Gypsy-ish freelance bash based on an LGB 2017. Love those runnning gears.




Ya mean like this?


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## DKRickman (Mar 25, 2008)

Posted By vsmith on 07/22/2008 8:44 AM
Well, thats 2, I predicted 3 so who else to make the trio./DesktopModules/NTForums/themes/mls/emoticons/tongue.gif" border=0>




I will, I will! I've always loved these little engines. 

The question is, what scale/gauge should it be? To me correct, shouldn't we work in 7/8n2 on 45 mm track, or maybe an O gauge mechanism and keep the scale 1:20.3? 

Or do we cheat, and turn it into a 3' gauge engine? Somehow, I don't think stretching the gauge by 50% will look right.


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## DKRickman (Mar 25, 2008)

A comment about the masterclasses in general might be in order here... 

I first found MLS because of the mogul masterclass, and I still refer people to it and the others whenever the subjects of kitbashing, scratchbuilding, or the toylike appearance of some large scale models are brought up. To me, the value of a masterclass is not in being part of a group of people building a given model, or of being able to purchase various parts as a bundle or at a discount. The greatest value is the fact that the information is there indefinitely so that, 5 years from now, when you're ready to start work, there it is, ready to go. The skills taught, the information given, the methods of work, all are valuable, even if you have no need for a Mason bogie, or a Mogul, or anything else that may be built. 

I am currently working on a scratchbuilding project of my own, with techniques learned in reading and re-reading every old masterclass article I can find. 

So no matter what the next subject may be, or how many people join in, there will be people like me who appreciate the work for years to come.


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## vsmith (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By DKRickman on 07/22/2008 11:48 AM
Posted By vsmith on 07/22/2008 8:44 AM 
Well, thats 2, I predicted 3 so who else to make the trio./DesktopModules/NTForums/themes/mls/emoticons/tongue.gif" border=0>" border=0>

I will, I will! I've always loved these little engines. 
The question is, what scale/gauge should it be? To me correct, shouldn't we work in 7/8n2 on 45 mm track, or maybe an O gauge mechanism and keep the scale 1:20.3? 
Or do we cheat, and turn it into a 3' gauge engine? Somehow, I don't think stretching the gauge by 50% will look right.




If I build one, its got to work with my other stuff on my layout, so it would for me need to be gummied to 3' at 1:20 or 1:22 scale, this is why I havent tried it yet and the main reason I didnt really see it working as a Masterclass project unless a common scale was agreed on, there are far too few people doing 7/8" to justify working in that scale for a group project and if we all try building one in different scales any detail material list will go right the window as each project would in essence become a custom scratchbuild...hence the problem of what to choose. There are all these considerations to account for. I just see alot of contention and aurgument over correct scale and gauge issues with a Darj class B. 

Thats why I thought the Bear Harbor #1 might be a better candidate, its already 3' gauge and could be built in 1/20 scale without any compromises.


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## vsmith (Jan 2, 2008)

BTW The Roundhouse live steam version is 1/22.5 scale running on 45mm track I beleive


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## astrayelmgod (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By DougArcher on 07/22/2008 12:55 AM 
Posted By astrayelmgod on 07/21/2008 5:32 PM 
Somebody posted a link to a tiny narrow gauge 2-4-4-2 that ran in New Zealand for awhile. 

Whoa, Where? 
Id like to see any small articulated, or possibly a non modeled garatt

Doug -- 
There is a picture of it here: 

http://narrowmind.railfan.net/2442_NZ_logger.JPG 

If you Google "Taupo Totara", you'll find photos of the preserved engine,and a side elevation.


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## DougArcher (Jan 2, 2008)

Thanks, astraylmgod. 












it reminds me of Bob Baxter's Pee-Wee. 

This Site: http://www.steaminthewoods.com, has some neat loco's as well


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## wchasr (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By DKRickman on 07/22/2008 12:06 PM
A comment about the masterclasses in general might be in order here... 
I first found MLS because of the mogul masterclass, and I still refer people to it and the others whenever the subjects of kitbashing, scratchbuilding, or the toylike appearance of some large scale models are brought up. To me, the value of a masterclass is not in being part of a group of people building a given model, or of being able to purchase various parts as a bundle or at a discount. The greatest value is the fact that the information is there indefinitely so that, 5 years from now, when you're ready to start work, there it is, ready to go. The skills taught, the information given, the methods of work, all are valuable, even if you have no need for a Mason bogie, or a Mogul, or anything else that may be built. 
I am currently working on a scratchbuilding project of my own, with techniques learned in reading and re-reading every old masterclass article I can find. 
So no matter what the next subject may be, or how many people join in, there will be people like me who appreciate the work for years to come.




To expound on these comments....the research and expertise and details put into these classes and other shared projects is one of the huge sellign factors of this site! The fact that so many folks freely share so much info so willingly! That and the fact that this site continues to share that same info even thru some adversity of a new format and server issues. I'm looking forward to building some of these in the future! 

Thanks folks! It truly is appreciated! 

Chas


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## Webber (Sep 4, 2008)

"How about a MasterClass on how to do your own creation?"

Great idea, I'd follow along that one!


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## DKRickman (Mar 25, 2008)

What about something with a little international appeal? I really like the lines of this loco, and I think it could be built using a 45-tonner (nice and cheap!) instead of a Connie.









Or perhaps something small and practical, with a little of that old-time flair? This ought to be useful for lots of folks, from 1:32 all the way to 1:20.3, with the apropriate modifications, and should work on all those tight radii.









And now for something completely different - a Baldwin flexibile beam engine. I think it's a safe bet that no manufacturer will be making this one any time soon, but I think they're neat, and they were relatively common in the mid 19th entury.


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## Kovacjr (Jan 2, 2008)

Id love to see a new masterclass but for now I have a Mason that is 75% done, but since I moved from my parents house I lost the shed for a workshop. Work on that stopped until I get a house. Currently in a townhouse and with this horrible market I dont think it will be soon. I also have 2 Bronson-Tate cars the combine is completed and the coach is in the box still. I also started 2 Porters in live steam using the Ruby running gear and wheels and 1/2" cylinders on a totally new frame. Work on that has been slow but I have a running chassis and am working on the boiler and boiler extension then a wrapper to cover it all. 

I have to build some orignal D&RG coaches too to go with my Ruby/Montezuma conversion I did about 2 years ago.


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## Guest (Oct 20, 2008)

Posted By vsmith on 07/22/2008 8:44 AM
Well, thats 2, I predicted 3 so who else to make the trio.







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I guess I'd be #4, but could prob save the $$$ and buy live steam before I could afford the time right now...

cale


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## Kovacjr (Jan 2, 2008)

#3 is Justin who also had set the project aside for paying work. He has a frame and a tender just started.


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## astrayelmgod (Jan 2, 2008)

I just realized that the picture of the Darjeeling that vsmith posted came directly off the Roundhouse web site, and it is in stock in various places. So, acquiring one is mostly a question of desire, and making one phone call. Now, see, that's exactly what I would not be interested in building. Yes, it's ~$3k, but with my limited time, there isn't any way I can justify building one.


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## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

I really like the lines of this loco


That's an old Baldwin sold to the UK and to Australia. You can buy the 2-4-2 version from Accucraft: 









http://www.accucraft.com/index.php?show_aux_page=119


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## vsmith (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Pete Thornton on 10/21/2008 8:59 AM
I really like the lines of this loco


That's an old Baldwin sold to the UK and to Australia. You can buy the 2-4-2 version from Accucraft: 









http://www.accucraft.com/index.php?show_aux_page=119



...or buy the old Bachmann LYN version and repower it with a Stainz driveblock


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## Fritz (Jan 11, 2008)

or buy the old Bachmann LYN version and repower it with a Stainz driveblock 


Now why in the world should someone want to repower a Bachmann Lyn with a Stainz driveblock? 
The Bachmann drive in it runs perfectly. Simply install some batteries and maybe RC. 

If you want to run it with trackpower, turn down the very rough wheels, have them chrome plated and off you go. 
Meter gauge ist not really prototypically for this machine. It ran on 2 Feet track. 

Have Fun 

Fritz / Juergen


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## Dwight Ennis (Jan 2, 2008)




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## DKRickman (Mar 25, 2008)

And, they're 3'6" gauge, perfect for 1:24!


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## Kovacjr (Jan 2, 2008)

Dwight Im with your option but it has to be in live steam!!! How good are you with the CNC now?? Hahah


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## Dwight Ennis (Jan 2, 2008)

Jason - that photo is a Backwoods Miniatures On3/On30 kit. Two Ruby chassis may work for this little logging articulated though the wheelbase would probably have to be shortened. That may be a little involved - new siderods, new frames, and new eccentrics. Still, it should be doable (especially with CNC).







I just don't have the ambition at the moment.


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## Kovacjr (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Dwight Ennis on 10/23/2008 7:53 AM
Jason - that photo is a Backwoods Miniatures On3/On30 kit. Two Ruby chassis may work for this little logging articulated though the wheelbase would probably have to be shortened. That may be a little involved - new siderods, new frames, and new eccentrics. Still, it should be doable (especially with CNC).







I just don't have the ambition at the moment. 

You mean involved like this???


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## railgeek (Jan 15, 2008)

*There are no 1:20.3 C-16s being produced. Only what Accucraft had produced in the past.*
*Aristocraft released the latest in the 1:24.1 scale.*
*So the C-16 would be a great master class*


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## astrayelmgod (Jan 2, 2008)

I see 1:20 C-1x's on Accucraft's web site. DSP&P C-16, and D&RGW C-19. Take your pick, send in your money.


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## Rich Schiffman (Jan 2, 2008)

You are correct of course. But the Accucraft models, although beautiful, are costly. The Masterclass would provide the ability to enjoy creating your own model and details to suit your era, prototype, and color scheme. All of that for a mere fraction of the cost of the Accucraft models. I for one would enjoy the C-16 project. Especially so if we can get a mechanism, cab and details from vendors. Bring it on, Oh David Fletcher, are you listening?????

Rich S


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## paintjockey (Jan 3, 2008)

Hey Vic where did you find a 1/20 cab for your indy? I have an indy I wanted to sell cause I didn't like the scale and I didn't really want to scratch build another cab. But if there is a cab available I may take it off the market. 
thanks 
Terry


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## vsmith (Jan 2, 2008)

Terry, I have perhaps the world's last 1/20.3 Bantaworks recabbing kit for the Indy, and I consider myself lucky I got it when I did off weaselBay as at the time the entire large scale lineup was dropped, but I checked the Banta Modelworks site, they still list the cab kit, maybe they've relisted them as its showing as still being available, give them a call maybe you'll get lucky. open the link, go to "1/20.3 cab kits", its the "Mongrel" cab listed bottom of that page: 

http://www.bantamodelworks.com/

Good Luck


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## paintjockey (Jan 3, 2008)

Just called Bantaworks, they still have the cab kit. Thanks Vic! You saved the lil loco from the auction block. 
Thanks 
Terry


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