# Quality of LGB vs USA Trains vs Aristocraft?



## shadowvfx (May 3, 2010)

I have been a long-time collector of LGB trains and locos for years now. However, since LGB's bunkruptcy, their products have been sparse and hard to find. I have been thinking about transitioning my future purchases to USA Trains or Aristocraft, but I don't have much experience with each. I have a few of USA Train's rolling stock and have been pleased with the quality (they seem just as good as LGB in my opinion), but I have no experience with Aristocraft. I'm not sure if I should save major money by buying Aristocraft, or if I should go with the slightly more expensive USA Trains.



Would the knowledgable people here care to describe some of the major pros/cons of the three different manufacturers? I'm interested in both rolling stock and locomotives.

Thanks!


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## Steve Stockham (Jan 2, 2008)

Before you get too far into the discussion, you _do_ know that LGB's American profile locomotives and rolling stock were of an "elastic" scale but nominally 1:22.5? USA and Aristocraft mainly deal in 1:29 standard gauge rolling stock and locomotives. Just an FYI...


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## cape cod Todd (Jan 3, 2008)

Hello: Are you strictly a collector or do you like to run your equipment? 
I think it narrows down to what do you like to run? old timey or modern and what scale. Maybe a particular road name is only offered by say USAT. I have several various pieces of rolling stock by LGB and USA and the 2 look good side by side. I also have pieces by aristo and I think they look a bit smaller than the LGB and USAT due to their scale We could debate motive power all day and in my opinion all 3 make fine engines that will last many years and look good. Each manufacturer has its plus and minus aspects and I'm sure that others will weigh in with opinions. 
In my opinion when it comes to rolling stock it is 
1 LGB 
2 USAT 
3 Aristo 
and don't forget Bachmann they make some nice equipment as well though it is not as robust as say a USAT but their new engines run well and are highly detailed though generally scaled to 1:20.


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## wchasr (Jan 2, 2008)

Also factor in the cost of metal wheels into that equation. USAT almost always at this point come with metal wheels. Aristo is hit and miss if they have metal wheels or not. I was replacing wheels on cars this past week with Metal and found that identical Aristocraft cars that I've bought over the years, that some had metal and some did not. LGB generally did not come with Metal wheels except IF they had lighting like passenger cars. Bachman too has added metals wheels in later production years but early stuff did not have them. AML & AMS cars generally have metal wheels too. 

What era are you following? Diesel or steam. Early or late? Scale? etc. All that factors in at some point too. in the end you accept or don't the foibles of each particular manufacturer. Not a one of them is perfect for everybody in all situations. 

Chas


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## eheading (Jan 5, 2008)

I think you are going to find that this question is much like the question,"which do you like better, a Ford or a Chevrolet?". You will get opinions that USAT is the only brand to get, others will tell you Aristo is the only brand, etc., etc. In my humble opinion the answers you have gotten so far are pretty objective. My personal experlience has been the most robust drives in diesel engines have been on my ARisto engines. Many here think the quality is more consistent with USAT products. The bottom line as others have said though is that you won't go very far wrong with any of the major brands. Also as others have pointed out, scale has a lot to do with the manufacturer choice.

Ed


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## shadowvfx (May 3, 2010)

Thanks for the input. To answer your questions; Compared to the rest of you, I would be an extreme amateur who is mostly looking to collect and run trains on a simple ceiling layout. Nothing strenuous or complicated. I mostly wanted to know if there was any reason to steer clear of Aristocraft or USA Trains with regards to their products. Specifically, I was thinking of buying a Burlington Northern diesel engine. I'm not positive which one, yet. But it will probably be a GP-9 or GP-30 or similar. Would you all suggest an Aristo or USAT locomotive in this case? I saw that USAT had a BN GP9 on some hobby sites, but I can't seem to find it on their corporate site. Did they stop making that model in that paint scheme?

In short, it sounds like both USAT and Aristo are reputable and probably won't be cheaply constructed products. That's pretty much what I was wanting to know.


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## Axel Tillmann (Jan 10, 2008)

Actually, I think the answer is more finite: 

1. LGB (old) 
2. TrainLine 45 (although their engines still have to be seen - but their rolling stock is up there) 
3. LGB (Hungary - today) 
4. Kiss, Accucraft 
5. LGB (China - today), USA Trains, Aristocraft (for the most part - especially for the more mature models) 
6. HLW, Bachmann 
7. Piko (their motors are really bad-some of the DB style cars are nice though) 
8. Keystone, Entry level Bachmann (also older stuff)


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## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

The older LGB cars and engines (pre China, I don't have any of the newer Chineese made material) are in my opinion the most robust. The USAT and Aristo cars and engines have more small detail parts. These are more easily damaged. If you like American Narrow Gauge, you can't go wrong with Bachmann Spectrum or anything in the Accucraft line. The Bachmann Spectrum and Accucraft engines and cars also have a lot of smaller detail parts that can be easily damaged.

If you are running around the ceiling LGB might be your best bet because the lack of true scale and high detail will be less noticeable. 


The bottom line is they are all very good and you will not go wrong with any of the. Go with the scale and type of cars and engines that appeal to you.


Chuck


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## eheading (Jan 5, 2008)

I think in a way, you have kind of answered your question. If you are looking at a GP9 or GP30, by definition it will be a USAT. If it were an Aristocraft it would have to be a GP40.

Ed


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

Quality could have a lot of meanings. In terms of scale accuracy, all three are relatively "low quality," because LGB tended to use a "rubber" scale and aristo and USAT are both _mostly_ in 1:29, which is too big for the track as standard gage. Aristo has a line that's in 1:24, and USAT has some 1:24 stuff as well. They also have some stuff, like the center cupola caboose, that looks to me to be closer to 1:32, but I haven't measured. Aristo and Especially USAT have better detail then most LGB. LGB stuff is very robust and built to run and run. Aristo has its share of quality control problems, and USAT does as well. Aristo is especially likely to mess up the wiring somewhere.


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## Spule 4 (Jan 2, 2008)

Avoid Accucraft if you run outdoors, in the sun, for an hour or more.....


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## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

I've had problems with the Accucraft flat cars distorting in the sun, but I've not had any problems with any other of their cars. I solved the flat car problem with a razor saw. I cut through the decking every 6 or so boards. Another way to solve the problem is to add a load. Anything to prevent the sun from directly hitting the deck.




Chuck


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## BodsRailRoad (Jul 26, 2008)

As far as rolling stock goes they both have nice stuff,
Aristo cost's less (you have to add $20 extra to the cost for metal wheels), has better couplers, but have plastic wheels for the most part and until recently only single road numbers but they do seem to be adding multiples now.
Usa's are more expensive (even if you add the $20 extra for Aristo to have metal wheels), but have metal wheels, greater detail on some cars, and do have multiple road numbers on most cars, but I don't like their couplers.

As for engines I like Aristo better, price is similar but three big things for me are 
1) the Aristo engines have a 5 year warranty (no questions asked in every instance I have had), USA only has 1 year warranty (to be fair though they do have a large parts stock on hand for there stuff)
2) The second thing is most newer Aristo engines have ball bearing motor blocks and can handle the extra weights which make them much better pullers than most USA engines. The USA engines I have (SD70,F3,PA's) use bushings on their axles, also there axle gears tend to split/strip if you overload them (my new PA stripped a gear on its first run of a 5 car streamliner set). They use traction tires and sliders to make up for the lack of being able to carry the extra weight. 
3) The newer Aristo engines have a Plug and Play DCC/REVO socket, which for me is huge since I am using DCC control and it takes about 15 minuted to drop in a QSI dcc sound/motor controller and your all set.
USA engines as of right now must be hardwired.

Ron


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## tacfoley (Jan 3, 2008)

Posted By Spule 4 on 15 Apr 2011 10:40 PM 
Avoid Accucraft if you run outdoors, in the sun, for an hour or more..... I'm glad I read the rest of the thread, else I would have been really worried. We had some sun last year here in yUK, and I have to admit that none of my AccuCraft stuff actually melted. AAMOF, ALL of my AccuCraft locos are steamers, and by rights should be safe to operate with a bit of heat....

Best

tac
www.ovgrs.org
Founding Member and Chairman/Supporter of the Swiss Watch Collectors' Association of East Anglia


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## eheading (Jan 5, 2008)

I am puzzled. I am not trying to start a war here, but I keep hearing how robust LGB locos are, and how they "run for ever". I have only two LGB Moguls, which I have been very fond of. However, BOTH of these locomotives have stripped out their geartrains. All of the rest of my locomotives are Aristo, predominantly diesel engines. I have NEVER stripped out a gear train in one of the Aristo engines. Right now, I'm not real enamored with the "ruggedness" of my Moguls.

Am I the only one who has experienced this??

Ed


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## NTCGRR (Jan 2, 2008)

" I am not trying to start a war here" 

Ed I'm surprised at you!!!!


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## Spule 4 (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By tacfoley on 16 Apr 2011 03:37 AM 
Posted By Spule 4 on 15 Apr 2011 10:40 PM 
Avoid Accucraft if you run outdoors, in the sun, for an hour or more..... I'm glad I read the rest of the thread, else I would have been really worried. We had some sun last year here in yUK, and I have to admit that none of my AccuCraft stuff actually melted. AAMOF, ALL of my AccuCraft locos are steamers, and by rights should be safe to operate with a bit of heat....

Best

tac
http://www.ovgrs.org/
Founding Member and Chairman/Supporter of the Swiss Watch Collectors' Association of East Anglia 




At that point I would be more worried about rust tac!

The LGB Mogul gears....are these the early/first prodcution ones perhaps? They did have some gear problems, otherwise, look at maintenance and overloading as the cause.


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## Dan Pierce (Jan 2, 2008)

The main reason any engine by any mfg strips a gear is usually overloading the engine.

Many add weights to engines and this compounds the gear failure.

SO, keep the loads light and double head if you want to pull more/heavier cars.


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## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

I've not heard of "early" moguls having gear problems vs. late. I've always thought they had the same gears and gearboxes from day 1. I know my dad's mogul (the first production--sorry collectors, the first thing we did was paint it reasonable colors) went for near 25 years before it needed a gear replacement. I'd agree, leaning towards overloading as the primary cause for gear failure. Alas, I think the mogul's traction tire gives people a false sense of power in terms of what the loco can pull. I've seen numerous railroads where the owners have the mogul pulling 20 car trains around 2' and 3' radius curves. Sure, it _can_ do it, but it's certainly not good for it. 

In terms of overall quality between brands, much depends on what you value. LGB is known for being robust, but the detail and scale fidelity is comparatively poor compared to other manufacturers. I personally place more value in detail and scale fidelity, so Aristo, USA, and Bachmann to me represent a better quality and value than LGB. In terms of how they run, none of the brands are anything to avoid. They all have had their individual quirks. Best in those cases to ask about a specific locomotive to see if there's a particular issue that should be taken into consideration. 

Later, 

K


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## Pterosaur (May 6, 2008)

If you like LGB you can still stick with it...There is tons still available on ebay. Patience pays off as you can still find some fair prices if you take the time/effort. LGB is short on American motive power though. 

I like USA for my American stuff though lately every engine I buy has one motor block that sounds like a dentist drill. I have replaced a couple of them with factory ordered blocks and problem solved. Love my SD-40's! 

My Aristo RS-3's can pull out stumps and run smooth as silk. Can't wait for the consolidation! 

I just don't see a real downside to buying any of them.


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## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

I've had problems with the Accucraft flat cars distorting in the sun, 
The problem with the flat cars is that they installed the truss rods too tight at the factory. [I had a thread on this somewhere . . probably lost by now. Wow - it's not - here it is: *My not-so-flat-car* ] 

Take off a truck, unscrew the bolster and the truss rod ends fall out - they are hooked behind the bolster. Unscrew the end from the turnbuckle a few turns, (I believe they are both threaded the same, so you can't adjust the turnbuckle like the prototype,) and put it all back together. Check that the truss is now almost loose.


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## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

Thanks Pete!! That is a lot better than using a razor saw. I'll do that with mine the next time I have them out.

Chuck


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## jgallaway81 (Jan 5, 2009)

As a collector to become runner (once tracks are on the ground) I collect what I want... regardless of the builder. I have a fleet of LGB's modern American equipment: 3-bay centerflow covered hoppers, unibody tank cars & 50' boxcars. I also have a few of USA's 4-bay centerflow hoppers, aluminum tank cars & all intermodal equipment, but no engines because I don't like sliders or traction tires (personal preference). I have a fleet of coal hoppers and boxcars from Aristo, and most of my engines are aristo. If I can ever get my hands on one, I'll add an LGB mikado.

The truth is, you need to decide what characteristics are important to you. I bought the USA hopper because I wanted some grain hoppers... then I found the LGB ones and decided I like the robust sturdy nature of the LGB version better. I like both USA and LGB modern tank cars equally, but for different purposes. As a general rule, if USA & Aristo compete on a product, Aristo usually wins out for me due to the fact that USA is nearly scale details which make then EXTREMELY fragile, something that doesn't work very well with me.

To each their own: there is no right or wrong when you get what you like. 
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## stevedenver (Jan 6, 2008)

im a LGB fan 
but it has taken a while- 
its been an acquired taste for a guy that is also a modeler 

its kind of a toy, but not really, kind of a model -but not a fine model-but its highly functional in many regards and 
pretty well engineered 

as noted often fidelity is poor -colors are comical-technology is antiquated but pretty reliable over all, over the years 
otoh some of the offerings are pretty darn close imho 

im busy, and 
im relatively competant when it comes to repairs-and some simple electronics 
but i really dislike having to repair or rework things unless its my idea 

even so 
i hate broken toys- i like stuff pretty much nice and ship shape in terms of running, function, original parts still there etc 

and the one thing that i like about LGB 
is it runs, can be put away for years, and will run without a hitch next time 

you can get parts 

you can handle them without breaking stuff 

its simply less managment and worry for me


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