# C-16 and layout questions from a newbie



## chipi999 (Nov 22, 2010)

Hi Everyone,

I'm a newbie and would appreciate any advice you could share.

I'm setting up a G-sale suspended train system for my twin boys (4 years old) - size of the layout is approximate 11 X 15.

I'm ordering the Aristo c-16 and some sierra cars but am unsure how to proceed with control and the sound card.

I'd basically like a remote control that the kids can hold and use to control speed and as many features as possible - bells, whistles, lights, smoke. I'd like to avoid an overly complicated system if possible as this will be the only layout we will have (for now).

I'd appreciate any recommendations as to what system DCC? Revolution? 27ghz train engineer? etc. would accomplish this for us, again with being able to trigger as many features as possible.

In regards to the sound card, I've looked a little at the Dallee, Phoenix, and Mylocosound systems but am having trouuble determining which is best for our setup. How about the Quantum Aristo?

Thanks,

Jason


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## Steve Stockham (Jan 2, 2008)

First off, welcome to MLS! I would assume from your title that you are new to large scale. I see that you are planning a suspended layout and want to have remote control. That's cool but i also see that you have 4 year olds that will be running them! It has been my experience that small children have only two speeds: dead stop and "devil may care damn the torpedos full steam ahead punch it Chewie when you're on the highway and Road Runner goes _beep beep_" Nascar all out full speed! With this in mind, an Aristocraft C-16 is a pretty nice engine and perhaps not as robust as some others. Depending upon the tightness of the curves, the C-16 can "jump the track" at high speeds and from a suspended layout, could be seriously damaged! Can you give us any more info about your proposed project? I'm not saying it's impossible but that you will have to take certain caveats into account when making purchasing decisions.


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## Gary Armitstead (Jan 2, 2008)

Welcome to MLS. 

I agree with Steve's suggestions to you. The C16 falling from a significant height will definitely damage that loco. But MY biggest concern would be the loco falling on your boys and causing some serious injury. Remote control in the hands of an adult can be "iffy" and "stuff happens". But with young boys, not good. Derailments WILL happen. 

Be safe and get this railroad on the ground or at the most, two or three feet off the floor. JMHO


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## blueregal (Jan 3, 2008)

Whatever you decide up or down go QSI/G-wire and NCE g-wire Procab throttle especially with an Aristocraft engine all Plug N Play!. You won't be sorry!! If you need any help feel free to contact me, and I will help, or get you to someone who will if I can't!! Take a look below at what the above will do for you!! Regal 

http://www.youtube.com/user/7485jerry 

http://www.livestream.com/crazytrainguyschannel/


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## Treeman (Jan 6, 2008)

If you go with the complete QSI system you will be able to limit top speed and quick reverse. If you would go with a Revolution just limit the voltage on the track to limit top speed.


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## aceinspp (Jan 2, 2008)

Welcome to the forum Jason. Onething I'd think about for now is going with the TE system seeing how you have two young boys. You can always expand when they get a little older and need more functions. You can install a Phoenix sound in the C-16 and use an Aristo accessory board to trigger the sounds. Once you feel like you like what you have then you can expand on the system esspecially if you decide to go with the Revolution. Later RJD


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## chipi999 (Nov 22, 2010)

Thanks for the great comments guys! 

I haven't purchased the loco and cars yet, but the suspended system is on order from ceilingtrainkit.com. 

Re: Safety. The suspended system has some safety wires (can be seen in the picture on the website) but I'm not sure if this is enough to prevent an engine from toppling down on my boys. I'm using 5 ft. diameter curves, and would definately be interested in a loco/cars recommendations to minimize derailing. 

Re: Loco selection: I'm definately open to any alternate recommendations on the loco and cars. I'd like a classic looking steam engine with lights and sound and smoke (althought I'm rethinking the smoke idea). I initially was looking at the HLW LaPorte due to its great looks, but I wasn't sure how hard it would be to add sound/smoke. I sure do like the looks of that one though. I then settled on the Aristo because of plug/play capabilities, smoke, general availability of add-on equipment etc (as well as the looks). 

I had thought about the TE Revo but was wondering if it would be too complicated - I was also unsure that I liked the Dallee sound, and was wondering about how easy it would be to install. The Phoenix seems great but pricey. I was looking at the QSI Aristo Board last night and was starting to think about going that with a g-wire. 

I'm open to all suggestions, please keep them coming!! Jason


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## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

I think that you should look into a 2 or three drive axle locomotive. 5' diameter curves are pretty tight for an engine with four axles in the motor block. I do not have a C-16, so I don't know the minimum diameter for that engine, but I would suspect a minimum of 5' or greater for that locomotive. If you are close to the minimum radius you will get a lot of black dust falling down from the grinding of the drive wheels on the inside of the outer rail on the turns. There have been discussions of worn rails and black dust on several of the forums here on MLS.


There are some nice starter sets with two axle engines that would be ideal for children of that age and some come with sound. There are still LGB starter sets out there which have short engines and cars.

I hope someone who has a C-16 can chime in and discuss the minimum radius for that engine.

Chuck N


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## Dave Meashey (Jan 2, 2008)

The C-16s have blind drivers on the middle two axles - just like their prototype. They will even handle R1 curves comfortably, but look a bit silly doing it. 

Hope this helps, 
David Meashey


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## cape cod Todd (Jan 3, 2008)

Hi Jason 
I would say get Daddy the C16 and hold off on the sound system for now and with the money you save you can buy the boys their own train. LGB makes very rugged starter sets and some have sound installed. Hartland makes a mack switcher that is very tuff. I think the boys would have lots of fun loading up small gondolas or flat cars with action figures etc.. and if you get the real short ones they will have 2 axles which will make them very easy to set back on the track when they fly off. A little oval of track with a siding or 2 can provide hours of fun plus be picked up off the floor and put away quickly. 
Happy Rail Roading 
Todd


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## aceinspp (Jan 2, 2008)

Forget about the Dallee you will be disappointed in the results. As the saying goes you get what you pay for. When you talk about G-wire now your back into more bucks. I'd do a little home work and compare the systems you are considering before jumping in. Later RJD


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

The request was: " I'd basically like a remote control that the kids can hold and use to control speed and as many features as possible - bells, whistles, lights, smoke. I'd like to avoid an overly complicated system if possible as this will be the only layout we will have (for now).
"

I'd go track power, the QSI, with the Gwire option and the NCE Gwire cab.

1. kids can hold it and easy to use, because it has buttons, not menus for virtually all normal operations.
2. tons of features, whistle, bell, coupler crash, air letoff, mute, doppler shift for whistle, steam blower, locomotive startup, locomotive shutdown, cylinder cocks, and verbal status report, all independently accessable from the function buttons 0-10 on the keyboard.
3. not overly complicated, all this works out of the box. Yes there's more features, but no one is holding a gun to your head to use them.

I'd say this meets your requirements. The decoder just plugs into the loco.

Regards, Greg


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## steam5 (Jun 22, 2008)

Just a thought... 

I don't own RCS, but I have used it. The controller is basic and easy to use, I think an RCS decoder can be used for constant track power... And it can be used with a simple or complex sound system.

I think it would be an easier option for a young child. 

What do you think?


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## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

For a 4-year-old, the RCS "Elite" is dead-nuts simple to use, they make one that will plug into the Aristo socket, and it will trigger sounds. It's the remote of choice for my not-quite-5-year-old daughter, though she's learning the Revolution controller, too. Either 4 or 8 buttons, depending on which transmitter you get. I don't think you can limit the top-end voltage of the motor output, but I don't recall what its minimum input is, either, but I know it will run on 12 volts. The C-16 isn't "breakneck" at that speed, though it does move at a decent clip (i.e., fast enough to keep a 4-year-old's attention, not fast enough to take flight.) Also, kids can be taught to keep the speed low. Suzi knows what I consider "too fast," and while she enjoys pushing the limit, she also enjoys slowing it down, too. 

The RCS is designed for on-board battery power, so you'll want to make sure your track stays clean if you're going to be powering it through the rails. I don't know if you could use a small capacitor board such as the one Aristo sells in conjunction with it or not. 


Later, 

K


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## Torby (Jan 2, 2008)

Your 4-year-olds understand technology like you never will. They'll learn to work anything. Having said that, I *really* like that little RCS remote, except it might be easy for your twins to misplace. Aristo makes an inexpensive remote in bright orange to make it easier to find. 

For basic, inexpensive sound, look at http://www.smallscalerailway.com/ it has nice character. The only "trigger" it has is the chuff sensor, but whatever I'm doing, it's always making appropriate sounds. I have phoenix in my big show off engine.


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## Totalwrecker (Feb 26, 2009)

Posted By Torby on 27 Nov 2010 09:49 AM 
Your 4-year-olds understand technology like you never will. They'll learn to work anything. Having said that, I *really* like that little RCS remote, except it might be easy for your twins to misplace. Aristo makes an inexpensive remote in bright orange to make it easier to find. 

For basic, inexpensive sound, look at http://www.smallscalerailway.com/ it has nice character. The only "trigger" it has is the chuff sensor, but whatever I'm doing, it's always making appropriate sounds. I have phoenix in my big show off engine. 

Torby, I also use the Smallscale sound cards and I am pleased with the sounds... onlyone thing, not sure why, but one of my 2 locos always blows the whistle in the tunnel! Luckily for the crew, they aren't covered in soot which such foolishness should cause!









John


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