# Elevated track systems



## York Santa Fe (Feb 2, 2011)

Hi Everyone

The nice thing about this hobby is that everyone can enjoy it in a different way. One thing I have noticed in recent posts here and on some other sites is that we should keep in mind that we are only constructing structures for a model railroad system and not something for a commercial walkway or deck. In many ways it seems that there is a real trend to over build using dimensional lumber. We are only dealing with very light loads, in most cases less than 50 pounds over a reasonable span. It seems to me that using 4 x 4 posts, digging 4 foot deep holes, filling the holes with concrete, using 2 x 6 lumber and 3/4 inch decking is way beyond what is needed. It becomes expensive in regards to material, is extremely labor intensive, and totally out of proportion to the trains and the roadbed itself. 

I get concerned that newcomers to this hobby can get scared away when they see these rather massive structures being fabricated for a simple elevated train layout. As I pointed out in a past comment, digging holes 4 foot deep to avoid frost heaves will not prevent frost heaves in the roadbed. Also using dimensioned lumber in many cases is going to result in a fair amount of twisting and warpage after a period of time. In both of these cases we are dealing with very light downward loads to prevent the heaving and warpage that will naturally occur.

I am sure that many will disagree with my comments and have many good reasons why they like what they did. I must admit that I am a firm believer in a composite elevated ladder system which in my case is pretty elaborate and has been in place for almost 6 years with virtually no maintenance.

Ralph


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Some of what you say seems to have a ring of truth to it, but my experience bears consideration.

But first, consider the origins of elevated lines.

Most were built to handle Live Steam. That really does not add any excess weight to what the structure is supporting, but it does mean that the Engineer/Fireman/Hostler/Owner/Operator is going to be working on the engine to prepare it for operation and thus will in all likelyhood be leaning on the structure; thus it needs to be robust enough to withstand that... not necessarily downward force (sitting on it) but sideways forces (leaning) against it. Then there are the children that WILL climb on it and "tightrope walk" it, regardless of the owner/builder's wishes. And the visitor that will want to get to the other side to get a better vantage point to take that perfect photo.

Frost heave is a consideration and some of the robustness presently advocated is because the original Live Steam Engines were very seldom remotely controlled and thus the Engineer either needed to run along side to control the speed, up and down the variations caused by frost heave or he had to set a speed and hope for the best (and possibly call for the five-fingered "Big Hook" when it decided to take flying lessons at the curve). Digging holes below the frost line is the first line of defense against excessive vertical undulations in the track. AND in addition, is a needed to counteract the physically destructive forces of heaving.


When I built my Elevated Mainline over the Eyeshudmowsoon Jungle I was too cheap to purchase robust lumber, thinking that "I" would know not to lean on it or attempt to climb (or do the one-handed vault) over it, but I forgot to take into consideration that there would be other people that will come into my yard, whether by invite or otherwise, and they won't know that the structure is not designed for such things.

I found that using 1x4 stringers with 2x4 studs in a "Ladder" form will sag even in a span of only 3 feet. And 1x6 boards laying flat for the surface of the structure will warp, curl, fold, spindle and in general mutilate themselves as the humidity changes from hard rain to weeks of unrelenting sunshine, and back. 


Since I had installed R/C in my engines I even deliberately added some grade to my structure so I would have good reason to actually control my steamers as they went back and forth between the two loop-backs on each end of the Elevated Mainline. A thick layer of chicken grit ballast helped to seperate the track from the random weather induced undulations of the understructure, so I was not too concerned with changes in grade over time.


I thought that if I used enough polyethylene glue and sound principles for screw placement that I could make it rigid enough to withstand frost heave and thus just stood the vertical supports on concrete blocks on the ground. And it did withstand about 6 Iowa cold winters and scorching summers, but the heaving eventually caused a lot of the thin boards to split, the screws to pull through the wood.

Then a late winter thaw followed by a sudden freese caught the snowmelt IN the joints and that caused the joints to split... the glue held, but the wood behind the glue gave way. The screws either pulled out (threads or heads) or snapped in two, leaving a couple of places where the board had this "wart" like mound on the end where the 2x4 was... the surface of the mound being the part of the 2x4 that was glued to the stringer as the two went their seperate ways.


I too, think that composite material would be much better than pressure treated wood, but it not only costs more, it is weaker against the constant pull of gravity and will sag more over a given length than wood will.

If you are talking about a structure that is installed indoors hanging from the ceiling, then I am sure much less expensive material can (and should) be used, but outdoors, Mother Nature cannot be scaled and a more robust structure will be better than "beanpoles and cornstalks" (to quote Abraham Lincoln about a bridge the military rebult quickly).


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## ROUTE 66 (Sep 26, 2008)

The real truth is...,* it is expensive!!!* Materials are expensive, track is expensive, but what hobby isn't ok collecting bottlecaps or match books are an exception unless you build a seprate room to house them! I'm planing on a backyard set-up between materials and loads of dirt for back filling to make something that is not an eyesore will cost money but than hey it is my entertainment. alot of times the fun is creating and building it is in the journey not the results of getting there. I have looked at some of these systems others have built on this site and others and I'm not talking huge systems either and I bet if ya asked them cost it was a whole lot more than they had wanted or expected to spend,but the results are a work of art. A lttle at a time,ground work,roadbed,track a year later as budget allows most of these systems weren't up and running in a week end project. And the ones that were the results will show it.


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