# Dependable Remote Switching with Auto-Uncoupling & Re-Coupling?



## Jerrys RR (Jun 28, 2010)

First let me say that what I am looking for MUST work dependably and consistently with a MAXIMUM of R3 (8' diameter) curves and turnouts.

With the current 100 degree heat I am looking for a way to fully automate switching operations where I can operate everything while I remain in the shade.

Of course the first suggestion will be body mount Kadee couplers and I could live with that for one single train with up to a dozen assorted freight cars PROVIDED that the body mounts would work easily and consistently on sidings fed by R3 turnouts (and the simulated hoses do not hang up on LGB Track Magnets etc.). 

If the body mounts will not work then the next step may be tongue mounted but that brings up the problem of the Kadee couplers HAVING to consistently match up vertically in tongue to tongue height and horizontally allowing for the swing of the trucks.

Hook and loops work very well regarding remote coupling and I could pick up and drop off cars on sidings with a LGB 21900 or 23900 Auto Uncoupling Switcher but I have not found a really dependable automatic or remote uncoupling device for hook & loop couplers (the LGB ones work fairly well on LGB and USA H&L couplers but not as well as I would want).

It has been my understanding (perhaps wrong) that body mounts require more than 8' diameter curves.

Does anyone have a really dependable remote coupling and uncoupling switching operation running with R3 curves and turnouts?

Thanks,

Jerry


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## Jim Agnew (Jan 2, 2008)

Jerry, the switching layout I had at HAGRS is R3 curves and turnouts with body mounted Kadee 820 couplers on the cars and engines, but I do tweek the couplers to get more than the standard amount of throw.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

I'd stay with the hook and loop and find a way to improve the uncoupler. 

I love Kadees and use them, but with your restrictions, you would need truck mount, and I think that the Kadee magnet is not good enough yet. I'm looking at using more powerful magnets. 

There's an article on this somewhere, and there is a guy selling a kit of magnets to use on HO. I'm going to contact him to do one for G. 

Regards, Greg


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## TonyWalsham (Jan 2, 2008)

Maybe you should be looking at something like THIS


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## Jerrys RR (Jun 28, 2010)

Posted By TonyWalsham on 03 Aug 2010 12:10 AM 
Maybe you should be looking at something like THIS


Thanks for the link but I could not find any sort of specifications such as minimum curves. I suspect that anything less than body mounts would be problematic in terms of lining up the couplers on sidings. That is even a problem with the large LGB knuckle couplers.

Jerry


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## Jerrys RR (Jun 28, 2010)

Posted By Greg Elmassian on 02 Aug 2010 10:49 PM 
I'd stay with the hook and loop and find a way to improve the uncoupler. 

I love Kadees and use them, but with your restrictions, you would need truck mount, and I think that the Kadee magnet is not good enough yet. I'm looking at using more powerful magnets. 

Regards, Greg 

Hi Greg,

I suspect that you are right. I had been working on a modification of the LGB uncouplers and I may need to work on that a bit more.

Perhaps the simplest solution which should be OK on the fairly flat caboose layout would be to go to single hook couplers which would be easy to line up and uncouple.

Thanks,

Jerry


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## Jerrys RR (Jun 28, 2010)

Posted By Jim Agnew on 02 Aug 2010 05:34 PM 
Jerry, the switching layout I had at HAGRS is R3 curves and turnouts with body mounted Kadee 820 couplers on the cars and engines, but I do tweek the couplers to get more than the standard amount of throw. 

Hi Jim,

Could you expand a bit on what you do?

I have an assortment of Kadees I removed from stuff I bought over the years. Is there an easy way to identify a Kadee 820?

Thanks,

Jerry


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## Jim Agnew (Jan 2, 2008)

Jerry, the 820 gear box is stamped with a #1 and is 1 1/4 x 7/8 x 5/16. By notching the box as shown in the following picture, I get the additional throw. 










Additionally, on the 820's I mount on my GP40's, I shaved the shoulders on the coupler shank. By doing both modifications, I can negotiate the R3 curves with the USAT 4 bay Hoppers.


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## Jerrys RR (Jun 28, 2010)

Posted By Jim Agnew on 03 Aug 2010 01:22 PM 
Jerry, the 820 gear box is stamped with a #1 and is 1 1/4 x 7/8 x 5/16. By notching the box as shown in the following picture, I get the additional throw. 



Additionally, on the 820's I mount on my GP40's, I shaved the shoulders on the coupler shank. By doing both modifications, I can negotiate the R3 curves with the USAT 4 bay Hoppers. 



Hi Jim,

Thanks,

Jerry


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

#820 is the #1 scale, #830 is the G scale. The couplers and the gearboxes are unique, the coupler shank has a long rectangular slot inside the draft gear box. 

The rest of the couplers have a shorter shank and just rotate, no "realistic slack action". 

As always, the Kadee site cannot be beat for pictorial representation of the various types. 

Regards, Greg


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## lotsasteam (Jan 3, 2008)

Hi Jerry! This remote uncoupling device is distributed by D-I-E-Z Germany,also easy to make :a small motor ,some twine and an off/on remote switch!

Manfred


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Manfred, isn't that D-I-E-T-Z ? 

Greg


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## lotsasteam (Jan 3, 2008)

Yeeph, Here comes the:t 

Thanks Greg!


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Just mentioned it because sometimes hard to search for them because they put the hyphens or sometimes periods in the name! 

Regards, Greg


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## jimtyp (Jan 2, 2008)

The Kadee site says they are coming out with something, but no date yet. 

If you want home made you can check out what someone did with a small motor and RC controller:  motor with R/C


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## Jerrys RR (Jun 28, 2010)

Posted By lotsasteam on 04 Aug 2010 10:10 AM 
Hi Jerry! This remote uncoupling device is distributed by D-I-E-Z Germany,also easy to make :a small motor ,some twine and an off/on remote switch!

Manfred


Hi Manfred,

I had heard that someone in Germany had come out with an automatic uncoupler. It makes sense that it would be Dietz as they make some very good sound systems. I have them in my LGB Ballenbergs because at the time they were the only one who made it.

I checked their website http://www.dietz-modellbahntechnik.de/

and downloaded their catalog http://1stclass.mylargescale.com/je...202008.pdf

but naturally it is in German. I may phone them to get more info (he does speak English).

Thanks,

Jerry


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## Jerrys RR (Jun 28, 2010)

Posted By jimtyp on 04 Aug 2010 02:59 PM 
The Kadee site says they are coming out with something, but no date yet. 

If you want home made you can check out what someone did with a small motor and RC controller: motor with R/C  

The bell was very nicely done but I'd better to stick to out of the box stuff (that works).

Thanks,

Jerry


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## toddalin (Jan 4, 2008)

Posted By Jim Agnew on 03 Aug 2010 01:22 PM 
Jerry, the 820 gear box is stamped with a #1 and is 1 1/4 x 7/8 x 5/16. By notching the box as shown in the following picture, I get the additional throw. 










Additionally, on the 820's I mount on my GP40's, I shaved the shoulders on the coupler shank. By doing both modifications, I can negotiate the R3 curves with the USAT 4 bay Hoppers. 

This is a great idea and I don't know that I've seen it posted before. I've certainly never used it (never really had to), although I have done the shanks as you mention.

Send it in to Marc Horovitz with ~100 words, get it out there, and get paid for your efforts.


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## Chucks_Trains (Jan 2, 2008)

I use MTH DCS and the remote fired Proto-Couplers work just fine and join up with Kadee G couplers but only the engines & tenders have them.


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## Jerrys RR (Jun 28, 2010)

Hi Chuck,

I have been waiting for years for MTH to come out with magnetic uncouplers like they have in O Gauge. I have used MTH and Lionel O Gauge automatic uncouplers for many years and have never understood why no one brought it to large scale.

Whether it is Kadee or LGB the result is the same in that you can only uncouple where there is a magnet or an uncoupling track. I love the LGB 21900/23900's but they are tiny and have little traction. I really wish LGB had come out with a full size switcher using the 21900 couplers. The MTH remote uncouplers come close but I have to admit that I never gave any thought to using MTH locos as switchers.

Jerry


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Jerry, you need to go to the Kadee site and read up on "delayed uncoupling", one magnet can server multiple tracks/locations. 

Regards, Greg


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## TrotFox (Feb 15, 2008)

Posted By TonyWalsham on 03 Aug 2010 12:10 AM 
Maybe you should be looking at something like THIS

Dadgumit! They stole my idea! Granted, I wasn't going to market it but I've been thinking of how to do this very thing for a while now. It's good to see that it CAN work. 

Trot, the imagineering, fox...


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## Jerrys RR (Jun 28, 2010)

Posted By Greg Elmassian on 07 Aug 2010 04:44 PM 
Jerry, you need to go to the Kadee site and read up on "delayed uncoupling", one magnet can server multiple tracks/locations. 

Regards, Greg 
Hi Greg,

My main reservation regarding Kadees is whether they can reliably couple with freight cars placed on a siding when the Kadee couplers are tongue mounted. 

Can anyone confirm if Aristo, USAT, LGB and Bachmann freight cars with tongue mounted Kadees that have been placed on sidings will or will not consistently couple with new cars coming through a R3 turnout?

How does one compensate for coupler droop with Kadee couplers? 
Jim's idea may work well but I have not tried it yet and I will have to figure out if I have enough Kadee couplers of the right type before I can attempt it. I would guess that since all but one pair of Kadee couplers I have came from truck mounts that only the ones that were body mounted before can be body mounted now. I really don't know much about Kadees.


It may be that the simplest and cheapest solution for me will be to change my switching cars to single hook coupling where the LGB Uncouplers should work reliably. That would also increase the switching complication in that the cars would have to be coupled in a consistent direction (hook to loop).

Regards,

Jerry


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## Andre Anderson (Jan 3, 2008)

Jerry,

I hate to be the bringer of bad news, but reliable coupling and uncoupling has not been achieved in HO or any other scale yet. Body mounted couplers do work best for backing cars in yards and other situations, so I would recommend body mounting the couplers. The reason that body mounting is better is that the pushing or pulling forces are on the car center line and are not transmitted to the truck. So once you have body mounted the problem is that some times they are cocked off center or on a curve. I am not sure of what a R3 curve is in feet and inches but trying to couple on a curve is always a problem, the greater the curve the fewer the problems. The uncoupling magnets that Kadee use do work well 90% of the time but again they have problems on curves also. Their new system would allow you to uncouple any where you might want to but it will probably be too expensive to use on every car.


Andre


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## Jerrys RR (Jun 28, 2010)

Hi Andre,

I am probably looking for something that does not as yet exist. 

What I probably need to do is to take the pair of body mount Kadees I have and put them on a couple of test cars (one on each car) and play with them to see how well they work.

I can also set up a string of cars with a hook and loop on one end and a loop only on the other end (I have plenty of couplers for that).

I did not explain myself well in that in this case I will not be trying to couple or uncouple on a curve but rather on a straight siding after the cars come out of the curve of an 8' diameter (R3) turnout.

The body mounted Kadees have an advantage because I believe it is the swing of the truck tongues that greatly affects the likelihood that they will match up on a siding but for cars with body mounted Kadees to be able to go around 8' diameter curves I would probably have to modify them according to Jim's suggestion.

In more moderate weather club members do not mind getting out and manually uncoupling the cars. It is this 100+ degree heat that keeps everyone from wanting to get out in the sun (including me).

Regards,

Jerry


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## Andre Anderson (Jan 3, 2008)

Jerry,

On straight track the Kadee's will work fairly well both coupling and uncoupling, it was the curves that I was concerned about. If they don't uncouple the first time just pull back and try again.


Andre


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