# Facebook versus Forums



## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

The debate over forum-based sites like this one, versus using Facebook, was quite evident in the recent brouhaha over bad behavior on these and other forums.

I use Facebook, (I moderate our community's closed group, amongst other FB activities,) and I do NOT think it is a good replacement for a forum system like this. 

Let's look at the pros and cons - maybe you can add a few.

1. Facebook only shows you the 'active topic'. Anything older gets scrolled down and lost. While you can search, it is hard to get the context.
- To replicate the different forums here, you'd need a different group for each topic. While some make sense [the G Scale Swap & Shop group is an excellent way to buy and sell, due to the large number of users] it seems that having to track 20 different FB groups would be a real pain.

2. Facebook adds bias and is invasive. It isn't benevolent or impartial. It thrusts adverts in your face (thread) based on what it knows about you. You do not get to decide what is done with the information it learns about you. [Ownership of the data is a serious topic that the EU is wrestling with. If you owned the data, maybe you would tell FB not to show certain items to other websites.]
- I personally prefer to keep my web browsing compartmentalized. I shop on eBay, Amazon, Aliexpress, and various specialist store websites. I hope/expect that they don't share the data they learn about me. If I did everything on FB, it (a) might get embarrassing [my wife gets me to make the online purchases - including her clothes] or (b) they might go away and lose all my data and history.

3. You probably don't realize this, but when you click the "Like on Facebook" tag on a 3rd party website, you are basically telling the website and Facebook everything about yourself. The "Like" button is a piece of code that reads your ID from the cookies on your computer, passes it back to FB who then transfers your email, name, etc., back to the 3rd party. (And records that you were at that site.)
I NEVER click a 'like' button. Or a 'share' button.
- a Forum website like this, all though most have social media attributes, isn't quite so invasive. (Remember when this site got a 'friends' feature and the default was to prevent messages unless you were 'friends' ? That got changed fairly quickly!) I assume they don't share data with other online vendors, though I know they sell email lists.

4. Facebook does an excellent job of keeping you in touch with your friends. Especially in this world of instant gratification, where you phone pings when someone on FB makes a comment.
- Discussions, on the other hand, are hard to track. People reply to each other in sub-threads which don't instantly show.

5. Facebook has no active policing process. If someone posts something libelous or untrue, you will get nowhere asking FB to remove it. [This is another topic of serious debate by many world governments.] It dates from the FCC rule that websites aren't responsible for content posted by their members; but the FCC didn't address erroneous or malicious content that, in the real world, would be easy to deal with.


I don't think Facebook is a good alternative to this kind of forum. You might argue that FB is easily accessible from a mobile device, but I find they are all equally good (except LSC, which currently has no mobile format version.)

If you want to try Facebook, here's my recipe for dealing with it.

A. You will have to 'friend' someone in order to communicate with them, and you may find (horror) that besides trains, they are a raving heavy metal nut and they post constantly about things you have absolutely no interest in. The trick is that you can "unfollow" them without "unfriending" them. [Hover over their name and move to the Following options at the bottom of the pop-up.]

B. NEVER 'like' or 'share' anything, or reply to a post saying "post OK if you agree" or similar. All those result in your personal data being shared with the original poster. Spam, anyone?

C. Read you Personal data choices and set up the various options to minimize intrusions.

D. Don't use the Facebook app on your mobile - it monitors everything you do, (I think.) FB works nicely in the mobile web browser without having access to your camera, photos, contacts, etc.

In the long term, we have to pressure our representatives to put boundaries on what these organizations can and cannot do with the data they learn about us. At the least, they should display everything to us and let us correct or delete it.


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## Scottychaos (Jan 2, 2008)

Thats a good write-up Pete. I also use Facebook a lot for hobby forums, here is some of my take on how it works:



Pete Thornton said:


> - To replicate the different forums here, you'd need a different group for each topic. While some make sense [the G Scale Swap & Shop group is an excellent way to buy and sell, due to the large number of users]


I dont see it like that..Most of the G-scale groups are "general purpose", any topic on the hobby is welcome. there are no "sub forms", so its all mixed up together..which IMO isnt really a bad thing, because of how facebook works (more on that further down) So generally, you can discuss any hobby related topic in the groups, track, power, locomotives, scenery, figures, etc..it can all go in most of the "general" groups..no sub-forums at all. And there are also a few more "specilized" groups, there is a specific 7/8n2 group for example.



Pete Thornton said:


> it seems that having to track 20 different FB groups would be a real pain.


Its actually *not* a pain!  at all..One of the main strengths of Facebook is making this potential problem not a pain..to explain:

In the old "traditional" forums, before facebook, you could join many individual forums for many different hobbies..using myself:

MLS
LSC
Bachmann Forum
Aristo Forum
7/8n2 forum ("SE lounge")
Ten yahoo groups
Two railfan forums
Carnivorous plant forum
bonsai forum
Wheel Horse tractor forum
Cub Cadet forum
Snowblower forum
Vintage audio forum
another vintage audio forum

Thats 22 individual forums..i wouldnt check them all every day, But several i would like to check daily. 
To read them all, you have to log into one..I usually use "active topic" to see new posts..read posts..
then..go to bookmarks..manually go into the next forum..
Read posts..
then..go to bookmarks..manually go into the next forum..
Read posts..
then..go to bookmarks..manually go into the next forum..
Read posts..
etc etc..

Its fairly tedious..you have to visit them all individually, they are not at all related..
Facebook actually *eliminates* that proplem completely! IMO, its the single greatest strength of Facebook groups. Now, I am a member of several facebook groups:

(These are all facebook groups)
Four seperate G-scale groups.
one 7/8n2 group.
Group for my hometown.
Two vintage audio forums.
Three antique garden tractor forums.
Fifteen different prototype railfan and railroad history groups. (LV, D&H EL, DL&W, Conrail, Western NY, Rochester area, Buffalo area, Binghamton area, Albany area..)

Thats 26 seperate groups/forums..actually MORE than the traditional forums! You would think it would have the same "problem" as the traditional forums? that you have to visit them all individually? one at a time? nope..

To visit ALL the groups, you need only visit ONE webpage..Your own personal Facebook "wall".
ALL new posts from all these groups show up one single page..its actually incredibly convient, and IMO it is probably the main reason that Facebook groups have taken over so much hobby discussion.

In adition to the groups, you can also have "facebook Friends", this is how facebook began (before facebook groups existed) real actual individual people that you know. (or dont know personally, you can "friend" anyone you like..they have to then in-turn accept your friend request..only when both sides commit are you actually "facebook friends")

Then you also see, in that same single-page "wall" where you see the posts from groups, all the new posts from your facebook friends..which, in my experience, is NOT a great feature!  because, if you have a lot of friends, you simply get overwhelmed with new posts, 95% of which you simply dont care about.

For example, I am facebook friends with many of my old college friends, most of whom I havent seen in person since 1992, and several distant cousins. I *like* these people!  and I like that Facebook allows me to keep in touch with them...but..I seriously do not care, at all, about my college friend's and cousins children and what the children, who I have never met or seen, are doing every..single..day. I dont want to see 10 posts a day about my college friends childrens soccer practice, or the two or three friends who post 20 "motivitional memes" every day..so boring, so pointless..

You can get rid of all of that by "unfollowing" those friends. You remain facebook friends with them! you dont "unfriend" them, instead, unfollowing means you are still friends, but you no longer see any of their posts in your main "wall" feed..you just stop seeing their posts. They dont know you "unfollowed" them, they have no idea..Then, if you do actually want to see what they have been up to, you can just go to *their* facebook wall, by clikcing on their name, and all their recent posts are right there for you to see, if you choose.

You can do the same with groups..you can "unfollow" a group, which means you are still a member of the group, but you stop seeing all the daily posts from that group on your wall. You can then just manually into the group if you want to check out new posts there. Friends and Groups work pretty much the same way in that respect.

the BEST feature of facebook, IMO, the "block"..You can "block" people on facebook, you dont need to be friends with them first, they can be total strangers..once you block them, they can no longer see you, you can o longer see them, they are wiped off the face of the (facebook) earth..They have completely ceased to exist for you..This is a fabulous feature for getting rid of trolls. you just block them! and they are gone forever..

They will still exist in a group, you just wont see them there..a group admin would have to ban them from a group to remove them from the group completely..Whats particularly great about the block for groups though is, if you start a new thread in a facebook group, and you have an obnoxious troll who starts posting in your thread, if you go and block the troll, your *entire thread* disappears for the troll!  brilliant...because you were the originator of the thread, they can no longer see the thread at all..even their own posts they made in the thread! its awesome..




Pete Thornton said:


> 5. Facebook has no active policing process. If someone posts something libelous or untrue, you will get nowhere asking FB to remove it.


Groups do..facebook groups have an admin, the person who created the group, and they can assign more admins if they want..basicalyl moderators in the traditional sense, they have the power to delete hreads, delete posts, and ban members from the group. I agree Facebook itself will do nothing, but group admins are generally good at moderating their forums. In that sense, its basicall the same as the traditional forum moderator concept, and they can do all the same things..



Pete Thornton said:


> You will have to 'friend' someone in order to communicate with them,


Outside of groups, yes, you need to "friend" someone in order to communcate..but inside groups, you can communicate with other group members without the need to be formal "facebook friends" with them..in a group, you can start your own thread, and you can reply to anyone elses thread within the group. 

So..I do like Facebook groups! but I also agree with Pete that dont work quite as well as the "traditional" forums..the main "Pro" of facebook groups is the ability to see all those groups in just one place..the main "Con" is what Pete mentioned, that once a thread has "ended", it tends to disappear forever..you can go back and search for it, but that doesnt work too well..

Facebook's main purpose for existing is that it's all about NOW!  Today only..yesterday is dead and gone, and Facebook no longer cares about yesterday..Facebook is all about keeping people on facebook every day, right now, so it encourges daily interaction..You *can* go back and reply to older posts, from friends and in groups, but its not what Facebook is built for..so that aspect makes the "traditional" forums better than Facebook..But facebook has its place, and since SO many are on it, its very convient to use, and the fact that everyone is already on it is what has led to the popularity of Facebook groups..

Facebooks ultimate goal would be keeping everyone ONLY on facebook!  and they are getting there..

So that's my take on all of it..
thanks,
Scot


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## Totalwrecker (Feb 26, 2009)

I suppose people will drift to where they are comfortable.

I'll miss all y'all.

John


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

I think one thing mentioned is the biggest one for me, that it's harder to follow a conversation.

Some things discussed on the forum may take quite a while to "solve" so in FB it would really be hard to follow something like a build thread.

It's also hard to be selective on what you read. For example I may not read all the details in a for sale thread, I can just look at the title. Another thread I may want to follow in complete detail. Yet another thread may have become long derailed, and is to me worthless to read.

I also find that IF you keep up with the forums, it is easy to just see the unread threads, so it's easy for me to see new posts, and when I have read all that I want, I can use the "mark forum read" tool. 

For me, who seeks information, or looks to help someone with a specific issue where I can help, this format works best.

Greg - 723


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

I agree with Greg here... using the "New Posts" and "Quick Links / Mark Forums Read" links (in the 2nd blue banner) keeps me current with all that is on here with no clutter... sure I might miss a post or two because the subject line does not tell enough as to why I might want to read it, but most of the time it tells me I am sure to not care about the thread, so I don't read those.

I belonged to Facebook for all of about 3 days a long time ago. I "friended" all my relatives and quickly discovered that the majority of my cousins (even 2nd and 3rd once or twice removed) and nieces and nephews were foul mouthed bigots that I am ashamed to say I am related to. So I just went bye-bye and will not ever join such again.

At least here, if someone gets foul mouthed or espouses illegal and immoral activities they quickly get squashed.

And I can also kill off most advertising that is intrusive and stop most of the "big brother" activities of such advertisers.


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## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

> Its fairly tedious..you have to visit them all individually, they are not at all related..


Scot, quite the opposite, I think. The 'active topics' here and on other sites lets me see who's talking about what, without needing me to visit individual forums. And I get to see the whole thread or just the place where I left it last time.

Each to his own.


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## Scottychaos (Jan 2, 2008)

> Its fairly tedious..you have to visit them all individually, they are not at all related..





Pete Thornton said:


> Scot, quite the opposite, I think. The 'active topics' here and on other sites lets me see who's talking about what, without needing me to visit individual forums. And I get to see the whole thread or just the place where I left it last time.
> 
> Each to his own.


Pete,
I was referring to visiting seperate "forums", individual seperate websites, one at a time.
MLS vs LSC vs Bachmann Forum vs Garden Railways forum, etc.
I wasnt talking about individual "forums" inside of MLS..

It can be confusing, because the one word "forum" can be used to describes both..
For the seperate "forums" inside of the one "forum" of MLS, I use the term "sub forums" 

Scot


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## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

> Thats 26 seperate groups/forums..actually MORE than the traditional forums!


Well, looking at it in that light, I have no idea how you find the time !! I have enough trouble getting off the honey-do list so I can fix a train. My coach #5 was supposed to be finished this summer, and the 2-6-0 in Florida is now 1 year late and still not finished.


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Pete, you are obviously frittering away your time by eating and sleeping. Give those things up and you will have more time for surfing the web!


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## Scottychaos (Jan 2, 2008)

Pete Thornton said:


> Well, looking at it in that light, I have no idea how you find the time !!


If you "do" facebook groups this way, you will find that you skim a lot! 
I dont actually read every post, only the ones that look interesting. Its not much different than here, not everyone reads every siingle individual post made, everyone learns to skip around.

And as I mentioned, you can also "unfollow" a group in the same way you can unfollow an individual facebook friend. Unfollowing means you are still a member of the group, but by unfollowing you stop seeing every post from that group on your main facebook page..useful for ridiculously busy groups with 100 posts a day, and especially "for sale" groups offering things for sale in your local city or town. If you are looking on a local sale group for model trains, you dont want to see the 50 posts a day for baby clothes, or whatever..so you unfollow, but you can then still go into the group manually when you want to, and just skim posts or do a search. Facebook offers a lot of filtering options.

Scot


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## up9018 (Jan 4, 2008)

Actually, I use both and it works pretty well. To put it in simple terms (which have already been mentioned) they work like so.

Facebook: Here is what I did today

Forums: Here is what I did this year.


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## snowshoe (Jan 2, 2008)

I have to agree with everything Scott says. I have been on FB and active for years now. Half the problem is most people that don't like FB, don't understand the ins and outs on how FB works. You have almost total control on what you want to see and not see. When it comes to FB groups you can add what groups you want to be a priority on your news feeds. You can delete anything you post or what others post on your FB page. You can have things people put on your timeline hidden. You can unfollow the annoying people with the memes but still stay friends. For me forums are annoying because of the amount of different threads. I don't have the time to go through all that, Id rather see it in one thread or use three groups to get what I need. Posting pictures is simple, just pic the photo from your phone or PC, add a text and post. Forums you have to upload to something else like tinypics or a freight shed. I can also take that photo from FB and copy/paste it to the forums. 
I think the biggest problem with people not liking FB is they don't know how to work it, even though they think they do. I hear people talk about adds, I get one add when I go on FB but its not a big deal. I come on here and adds pop up, videos play. 
If you want to spread the hobby, FB is the way to do it today. I have my own FB page for my layout and its amazing the amount of people my page and posts reach. One photo will reach over 3000 people in a few days, that's from an audience that are train people to non train people . Not that Im looking for likes etc. but it is nice to see that I'm helping spread the hobby and people enjoy what I post. You cant even get close to that on the forums in the photography section. I also like the fact that people can do live videos of their club meets or just running trains and you can have a conversation live. I love the amount of photos people post of their layouts and things they built. One thing that lacks in the forums. Forums tend to have the same few people always posting and responding and topics that go days with no activity. FB you are seeing new people all the time and new posts on a regular basis. The attitude seems to be much better. You don't really see the fights on FB and if it does occur the moderators are quick to diffuse it. . One of the reasons why a lot of the FB users left the forums. Plus most of the dealers have their own pages with updates. I even see a lot of the dealers posting on FB. You don't see them on forums often. 
Its not for everyone but I just think people don't understand how FB really works. You need to start out slow learn the secrets and then go from there. I have showed many FB haters how FB works, once I showed them the tricks, they were hooked.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Shawn, I'm reading what you are writing.

It seems to use facebook, I need to mentally shift gears. Since I read, or at least check ALL new posts each day, it's easy for me to follow or not follow the topics (threads) that I am interested in.

Since many things take a while, the chronological "story" is interesting, and this is key, I can look at one topic and follow it through. Within one thread there is basically one topic and I can follow that and stay focused. It's easy to follow multiple topics since I can visit them individually.

Now, how is this done in Facebook? I get that the "here and now" is easy in facebook, since the newest stuff is the latest, but I think the fundamental difference is that it's all organized by who posted last, and by the person posting, not by topic. Sure I follow that you can follow different groups, but within group "A" there is no further organization except by TIME, the last item commented on is the top one, right?

How would you advise me?

Greg - 719


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## snowshoe (Jan 2, 2008)

Greg Elmassian said:


> Shawn, I'm reading what you are writing.
> 
> It seems to use facebook, I need to mentally shift gears. Since I read, or at least check ALL new posts each day, it's easy for me to follow or not follow the topics (threads) that I am interested in.
> 
> ...





Post are done by the most recent post or unless someone commented on that post. Yes the post with the most recent comment goes to the top. Its hard to explain in words but ill try. If you are involved in that conversation you get a notification when someone comments, like forums but its also a way to get onto that topic without scrolling. Just click the notification and it brings you to the post. FB has no sub forum threads or whatever you want to call them. There is no specific live steam section, photography etc..... That's what I like and from my understanding that's what you don't like about facebook. For me I don't have time to click on all those sub forums. I rather just scroll one thing and when I come across something that interest me I read. Plus things never get stale or old. How many times you click on here only to see no updates in months. I just wasted my time going onto here only to find no updates or new posts. With FB they get buried. I also like the fact that every day there is something new. I would say the majority of stuff is videos, pictures of people running. That's another thing I enjoy. Also any in depth conversations tend to say on top but once interest is lost it gets buried. 
I heard a certain person say FB is the dumbing down of society. That is false because I have learned a wealth of info from trains to history. Thanks to all those FB group pages. They focus on something more specific like local history etc... Something forums don't have. Again I understand its not ever ones cup of tea. If you like the format of forums that's fine. But I also believe people just don't know how to use FB and if they did they would like it more. I wish I could physically show you the ins and outs because I think you would get a better understanding. Its just too difficult to do here.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

I am on facebook and I see that the post with the most recent comment is on top.

The question I asked perhaps needs re-explaining... I explained how I want to find information, on a topic... how do I do this on facebook?

Your response says here that "click the notification you get" or it's hard to find what I want.

Also you indicate that once interest is lost (really becomes less popular, not lost) it "gets buried"...

So, given my desire to find information I want, rather than rely on notifications on "subscribed topics" I CANNOT do this with Facebook.

So, I have to modify my desires for going after what I want to change to a mode where I try to tailor FB to tell me when there is something I want available, and I have to still filter that.

OK, so this further reinforces the fact in my mind is that Forums let me direct what I read, and Facebook directs me what I read, and it must be tuned to work well.

So yes, it really does sound like FB is dumbing down society, by society taking the choices FB provides.

I won't stop using FB, but for my information gathering and directed desires for information, the FB "method" clearly does not work.

*I do appreciate you explaining it*, although you have actually just reinforced what I already know, and have experienced. I've probably been programming computers before you were born, AND I have kept up with technology. I use computers as tools, they do NOT get to use me.

Greg - 728


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## armorsmith (Jun 1, 2008)

Snowshoe, I am the culprit of the dumbing of America statement, and I stand by it. I am barred by my employer from participating in Facebook, they consider Facebook a security risk. My family is not. I have been shown all sorts of 'stuff' by family members, and almost all of it (other than family picures being shares about) is useless tripe. Having read this thread start to finish, the conclusion I have come to is that Facebook is for the NOW folks. The folks who have no intereste in what happened yesterday. The instant gratification folks. I also called Facebook shallow. A useless popularity contest based on who has how many 'likes'.

A second conclusion I got was that if you don't some how immediately save what information is posted on Facebook, you may never find it again. What benefit is that? Oh...here today, gone tomorrow. You yourself stated in the last post that if it gets the least bit stale, the conversation is 'burried'. That format only works for people who can 'act' on the information immediately. Those who looke to research that topic later are pretty much out of luck. The ability to retrieve data on older posts...like your micro layout ... are here in these forums, not on Facebook.

As for security, please tell me how many times Facebook has been in the news for major PII data breeches, and consider how many may have not been reported. Then tell me how may of the Forums we frequent have had data breeches spilling PII? From what I have experienced with Facebook, I will stick by my company policy of 'hands off'.

My opinions and my experiences, yours may not be the same.


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## Randy Stone (Jan 2, 2008)

I'm on facebook most likely more than I should be, but I read info in several groups.

First: If you post something, respond to something or hit like, you automatically get notifications anytime someone responds or like that post. That is how I keep track of stuff I'm interested in.
Second: Posting photos is so much easier on FB than this website and as a lot of you found out, storing photos on someone's server is asking for trouble.
Third: Dummying down? Yea face book is full of stuff that isn't true. Especially on the political end of it. But you have to be smart enough to begin with not to believe everything you hear or read in life and that isn't just on FB.
Fourth: Security? In today's society when you have hacks getting into our highest government agencies? I hear people say don't use Google because they sell your info. ****, truth be known, this website most likely is selling your info. They all are tracking your every move. Do you use a credit card? If so you're being tracked. By your groceries at Walmart? You're being tracked. Get your oil changed at Jiffy Lube? You're being tracked. Unless you pay cash for everything and give false names and addresses, you're being tracked.


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## Randy Stone (Jan 2, 2008)

I just noticed something. Under my name. Senior Dish Washer. LOL

Everyone else is a Junior or Senior Member. Not me. I'm the Senior Dish Washer.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Yes, they are indeed selling your information since the site has been sold.

Randy, you gotta change your signature, we get the huge "error picture" from PhotoFuggit...

Greg - 727


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## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

> There is no specific live steam section, photography etc..... That's what I like and from my understanding that's what you don't like about facebook. For me I don't have time to click on all those sub forums. I rather just scroll one thing and when I come across something that interest me I read.


I think that's why we have an "Active Topics" option - on all the forums I know about. [MLS, LSC, GSC.] It lists the active threads by time, not by sub-forum, so you can see what everyone is talking about.



> was that if you don't some how immediately save what information is posted on Facebook, you may never find it again. What benefit is that? Oh...here today, gone tomorrow. You yourself stated in the last post that if it gets the least bit stale, the conversation is 'burried'. That format only works for people who can 'act' on the information immediately. Those who looke to research that topic later are pretty much out of luck. The ability to retrieve data on older posts...like your micro layout ... are here in these forums, not on Facebook.


I think that's a major issue. I often search MLS for a specific item that I recall was mentioned 10 years ago. Try doing that on FB !


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## greghile (Jun 10, 2008)

Actually, aside from the advantages to FB already mentioned, searching for a specific item CAN be done on FB and in some respects it is even easier than searching on a forum. For example, I just went to one of the RR groups I subscribe to on FB and there is a search box, just like here and other forums. I entered the term "bluetooth" and I immediately got every post that ever had the word in that group. I could filter the search by date, by poster, etc.

I could also see in one place every single photograph that had ever been posted in the group, which could also be broken down into albums to make it even easier.

I then went to another non-train historical society FB page and, admittedly, it was a little harder to find the search box, but it was there and I could also view all of the photos on the group.

As for myself, I like both the forums and FB and use both. I probably prefer the forums simply because that is what I am used to. I also prefer hard copy books and magazines, too, but I also take advantage of Kindle and such things as the complete DVD collection of Garden Railways. I also get both the hard copy and digital version of GR. But I also understand that if we want to grow and sustain our hobby we need to be able to attract younger people and we will do that through the use of digital media such as FB, Twitter, and the like. Get used to it, folks. Shift those mental gears, because digital media is not going away.

The Other Greg


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## Nick Jr (Jan 2, 2008)

If I may add, on an open forum one can get opinions that may differ with the original line of thought. That is how we learn new things.. With FB one has to be accepted as a "Friend' so only those with like minds will be admitted, and if I express a different opinion I am removed. No new ideas = no improvements. Also, it has been published that Social Media is one of the best sources for info for ID theft. LG


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## Scottychaos (Jan 2, 2008)

Nick Jr said:


> With FB one has to be accepted as a "Friend' so only those with like minds will be admitted, and if I express a different opinion I am removed. No new ideas = no improvements.


That's not how facebook groups work..
in a facebook group, you ask to join, and are approved by a moderator. you do not need to be Facebook friends with every individual group member. And there is no real issue with "different opinions"..Its no different than this group, or any other forum, as long as the moderators and admins do a good job.

Scot


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## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

> And there is no real issue with "different opinions"..Its no different than this group,


Scot,
While I believe that is generally true of the FB Groups, it isn't true of FB in general, and I think that puts many people off. 

On your 'wall', FB decides what to show you and what to suggest, and it has been proved that significant biases are involved. If you are a member of the NRA group, you will get pro-gun 'suggested posts'; if you are a fan of a certain politician, you get only his/her 'suggestions'. All very insidious unless you stick to the groups.


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## John 842 (Oct 1, 2015)

I've just spent a very frustrating couple of hours trying to open a facebook account with no success.

I guess I kind of got partial access to some areas, but then the site locked me out for some reason like 'unusual activity'. 

This thread has gone a long way to explaining some of the mysteries to a newcomer like me - however, the problem I now have is that they are demanding my phone number to let me back in - and I've heard from several sources not to give them my number under *any* circumstances.

So my question is - can I open a FB account without giving them my phone number? Many sources on the net say how I can, but non of them seem to work for me.

Many thanks!


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## ThinkerT (Jan 2, 2008)

John 842 said:


> I've just spent a very frustrating couple of hours trying to open a facebook account with no success.
> 
> I guess I kind of got partial access to some areas, but then the site locked me out for some reason like 'unusual activity'.
> 
> ...


I did so...but then again, my FB account came about by accident. My daughter told me one day that she'd sent me a picture. I went to access it, but to do so, had to fill out multiple internet forms. At the end, the last one told me I'd successfully created a Facebook account, and the daughters photo was my profile pic.

More on point, if you carefully scrutinize the page that demands your phone number, there should be a link underneath it that says something like 'not now' or 'maybe later.' It can take a moment or two to appear sometimes - I have to go through this during log-ins every month or so.


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## Nick Jr (Jan 2, 2008)

So, if the moderator doesn't like me, or disapproves of something I have posted on an open forum, I am not allowed to join, so again, only like minded people can be part of the discussion, opposing view points are frowned upon. Thank You for confirming that.


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## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

Nick Jr said:


> So, if the moderator doesn't like me, or disapproves of something I have posted on an open forum, I am not allowed to join, so again, only like minded people can be part of the discussion, opposing view points are frowned upon. Thank You for confirming that.


I don't think the Moderator will stop you joining, as you haven't done anything to upset him (yet.) But you are correct - all groups have an "owner" (probably the person who started the group,) and maybe more than one, who can delete posts, kick people out, etc. Just like this forum.

After about a year of membership of G Scale Swap and Shop and the G Scale Trading Group (UK) I have not seen any Moderator interference, nor any really bad behavior.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

I started a facebook group, for Zimo DCC stuff, will see how it works, might be a better alternative to Yahoo groups...

The yahoo search facilities and the fact you can't edit a post are negatives, besides the slowness of the system and the inability to "browse"...

So, I'll give it a try, what the heck..

Greg


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