# Flat wheelsets



## GN_Rocky (Jan 6, 2008)

* I was just curious if anyone had tried to file down some of their wheelsets on cars to simulate the flat wheel bang, bang, bang as the cars roll down the line. I was thinking about doing a few extra wheelsets I could change out to simulate this oddity we hear from time to time while watching trains. Was curious on how well it worked out and if it causes any problems - derailments, etc.*

*Rocky*


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## David Leech (Dec 9, 2008)

Try it and let us know!!!!
I wonder IF it would actually sound any good, or just be an annoying 'click'.
Maybe there's a sound system for it.
Cheers,
David Leech, Delta, Canada


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## Scottychaos (Jan 2, 2008)

It wouldnt sound remotely prototypical..
would be better to simulate it with a sound system.
Scot


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## GN_Rocky (Jan 6, 2008)

*Sound systems are too $$$ just for the one effect, unless your a yuppie with loads of money to burn. I may try a wheelset or two in the future to see what it might do. I was just curious as I had the passing thought go thru my head last night. Rocky*


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## ewarhol (Mar 3, 2014)

I don't have the money to burn, but I'm curious who makes a sound system like this? Does it mount inside the car?


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## Scottychaos (Jan 2, 2008)

I dont think anyone actually offers this sound effect..but there are ways you could do it yourself..
people have put sound effects on ipods, attach to a speaker, and run it in a boxcar..
its certainty doable...not worth the effort IMO!  but its possible..

Rocky, give it a try! IMO it wont make a reasonable representation of the real thing at all..
it will probably just be a very quiet high-pitched "click click click" that wont sound anything at all like the real thing..
you cant scale down physics..but its worth a try! 

In case anyone might not be sure, this is the sound we are talking about..at 0:48 to 0:53 in this video:






if a train brakes hard, like an "emergency stop" wheels can lock-up and "slide" along the rail, 
which creates a flat spot, which then results in that sound..railroads will swap out the bad wheel set as soon as they can, 
but cars will have to run that way until they can make it to the shop..

Scot


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## Dave Meashey (Jan 2, 2008)

And then there is the dreaded opposite of flat spots - unrestrained wheel slip. (The example below is an extreme case, I'm sure.)










Best wishes for your experiment, Rocky. It shouldn't cost too much, so let the rest of us know about what you discover.

Regards,
David Meashey


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## SD90WLMT (Feb 16, 2010)

Flat wheels ..or ...bad bearings..
I can hear...n ..."feel" them...about a1/4 mile away...

You may file in steps trying each time...
I'm thinking you may need a larger flat spot to enhance the effect here in G..
And if this works half way at all...
In a single car...how 'bout adding a lot of weight over that truck, just to help enhance it further along!!
Keep trying.....

I'm all for 'sperimentation Rocky....have fun!!

Dirk


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## Paul Burch (Jan 2, 2008)

Rocky,
Well, kind of.. A few years ago I was running a three unit diesel lashup when unnoticed one of them lost battery power and was dragged around the layout and least once. It did cause a small flat spot on all eight wheels. After discovering it I ran it by itself. I could certainly hear the flat spots but not as distinct as a prototype freight car. Glad it happened when the USA wheel sets were still cheap.


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## SD90WLMT (Feb 16, 2010)

So you were "hitting" on all 8, were you Paul!!

LOL...

Dirk


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

There was a guy on LSC who mentioned that he did file flat spots in some wheels to add to the sounds.

He did not say how much or how many wheels he did on a car.

Greg


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

I think I'd add some metal bars, rods and/or tubes to the car (and bend them up so they don't nest with each other and the bigger and lighter the better) so there would be something to "rattle" due to the flat wheels.


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## bnsfconductor (Jan 3, 2008)

Scottychaos said:


> if a train brakes hard, like an "emergency stop" wheels can lock-up and "slide" along the rail,
> which creates a flat spot, which then results in that sound..railroads will swap out the bad wheel set as soon as they can,
> but cars will have to run that way until they can make it to the shop..
> 
> Scot


Actually Scott, 
Flat spots are more common from someone leaving a handbrake on and dragging it, rather than an emergency application. And a wheel set isn't changed out until the flat spot is 3" long. Most of the flats spots that you hear are only 1/2"-1" long. Yes I've measured them! Part of doing a airbrake inspection. IF the railroads changed out wheel sets every time they got a flat spot, the RIP track would be full in every single yard.
Craig


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## Michael L (Mar 18, 2014)

*Flat wheels and old drill bits*

Hey guys...here is the link to a local guy here in Niagara who did this using old drill bits in metal tins inside box cars. He then flatspotted some plastic wheels to make the drill bits rattle. Check out his blog...there are instructions there





Mke


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Looking at the photo of his "flat spot"... Me thinks the FRA would require that the train run at restricted speed to the first siding to set it out to get it replaced... that is WAY OUT of spec!


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## s-4 (Jan 2, 2008)

Rocky,
I have a few flat-spot wheelsets actually! I like the sound, although its not quite perfect. I find my heavier cars sound the best, but my favorite so far has been the Aristo 3 dome tank. Once it gets to a certain speed all the handrails start resonating from the wheel vibration. The only downside, at indoor train shows many folks think I have a derailment, when its really just the flatspots clattering away.


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## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

Nice, Michael. The rattling drills definitely adds to the effect! 

I remember on a trip back from Winter Park on the Ski Train, some drunk idiot pulled the emergency brake and dumped the air on the train. Naturally the wheel that locked up and went flat was on _our_ car. What had been a nice, quiet, smooth ride was now "bump, bump, bump" for the last hour of the trip. 

Later,

K


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## ewarhol (Mar 3, 2014)

Michael-

Thanks for sharing that. Gives me some great ideas!!!!

Simple and no wiring


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## armorsmith (Jun 1, 2008)

Rocky,
I am thinking along the same lines a Dirk on needing to have a fairly large flat spot to be heard and weight would of course enhance that. The down side as I see it will be the additional vibration that will cause. Most of the trucks we use are unsprung and the vibration will translate directly through to the entire car.
FWIW
Bob C.


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