# MRC Dual-Phase DC and DCC 6A Transformer



## mack0238 (Feb 18, 2009)

Hi, I called MRC Inc. today, and they tell me that they are going to have a new product out after the 1st of the year. It is a "large scale" 6 amp DC Transformer with a switch to go to DCC when needed. Since none of my LGB locos are equipped with DCC decoders, does anyone know if this would be a good buy seeing as I want to slowly convert my engines one at a time (worth it?), and still be able to use my DC engines in the meanwhile? Does MRC's equiptment seem the way to go, or does LGB/Marklin offer a better product themselves? I really only "need" DCC SOUND for now. The DC motors in my locos could still run on Analog DC, while I access different sounds in a decoder inside a box car near the engine. Is this idea a waste of time? Any suggestions would be GREATLY appreciated for a newbie like me. 

Sorry if this question has already been asked... couldn't seem to find it.

Thanks,

-Pete in Minnesota


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

1. Not really sure what "a switch to go to DCC" means. If it means the power supply can also be used as a DCC booster, it might make some sense. Do you have any details?

2. "Is it worth it"? You need to consider if 6 amps will be enough. It's easy to hit 5 amps especially with lighted passenger cars. You need to consider how many locos you will run at once to determine if 6 amps will be the right amount for you, and of course if my guess in #1 is right.

3. MRC makes lower end products, some ok, some not good at all. For entry level, their stuff is ok in my opinion, but I would look elsewhere in large scale.

4. LGB is defunct, but their DCC system is not up to par in ease of use or features. I'm not aware that Marklin has a significant large scale offering.

5. If you are running DC on the rails, how do you intend to get DCC commands to the sound cards?

One option is a DCC decoder that works on DC. The QSI, for example has ways to control sounds from DC, but is also a full DCC decoder, when you make the switch to DCC.

You can do simple control of the horn and bell with the reversing switch... for control of 30 sounds, you can buy an inexpensive ($45) box that goes between the DC power and the track... handles up to about 3.5 amps. For higher current, you can buy a booster ($189) that will allow 30 amps... (I have all of these, although I run DCC).

That's just one example, but probably the best choice of controlling "DCC sounds" from DC.

Regards, Greg


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## Trains West (Oct 4, 2008)

*4. LGB is defunct, but their DCC system is not up to par in ease of use or features. I'm not aware that Marklin has a significant large scale offering.* 

this statement is wrong lgb is not dead


but I agree with every thing else you said


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Actually messed up: 

4. LGB is not defunct, but their DCC system is not up to par in ease of use or features. I'm not aware that Marklin has a significant large scale offering. 

(without the "not" the "but" makes no sense in the original sentence) 

Thanks for catching that Scott. 

Regards, Greg


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## StanleyAmes (Jan 3, 2008)

The MRC unit is intended for the DC users who also want to control the sound features of their DCC locomotives. In DC more it is a DC power pack, In DCC mode it is a one address command station.

Very simple and very easy to use. 

Remember DCC is a protocol so a who lot of different options are available to the manufacturer on how to provide the features to the user.

Stan Ames


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Ahh... the MRC "Blackbox" ... yes now I understand. 

It's a solution when you want to control one DCC sound system on a DC track, although I'm darned to know how it works. It must send out some DCC function commands. 

Regards, Greg


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## Cougar Rock Rail (Jan 2, 2008)

LGB is not defunct, but their DCC system is not up to par in ease of use or features. I'm not aware that Marklin has a significant large scale offering. 

I have to disagree with you on this, Greg. The current MTSIII may be more limited than some others in terms of maximum locos etc., but it is still a full featured and NMRA compliant system. When combined with the MTS software and a Massoth navigator it's hard to beat for simplicity and ease of use. It may not be ideal for guys wanting to pull as many amps as an arc welder but for what it was designed for it's still a good system, IMHO. 

Keith


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Keith, using a Massoth Navigator is not what I think you can call a MTSIII system... it is DEFINITELY not what I was referring to, I said LGB.

I will agree using a Massoth Navigator is much more sophisticated, but that's really not what people mean by a MTSIII system, it's buying "off the shelf" LGB components. 

That's like using an NCE booster with a Massoth Navigator and calling it an NCE system... 

I will stand by my statement an LGB system (no Massoth, LGB only) is not up to par on ease of use or features. 


Features are not just NMRA compliance... things like dedicated buttons for tasks instead of levels of menus or arcane button sequences. Features like more information on the display. Features like more programming options. Features like programming shortcuts built in for SoundTraxx and QSI decoders. 


In the picture below, the MTS throttles are red[/b]... I think it's evident that they are not capable of showing more information or having a larger number of dedicated functions, just by visual inspection!










left to right: US dollar, Zimo, Massoth, LGB, LGB, NCE 


Regards, Greg


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## Cougar Rock Rail (Jan 2, 2008)

I guess we look at things differently. In my mind, dedicated buttons or decoder specific shortcuts don't necessarily equate to ease of use. They can just add clutter or complexity when it's not needed. And the last time I tried an NCE throttle after five minutes I was ready to toss it through a window I was so frustrated. Also remember that the navigator was promoted in the last LGB catalog as part of the LGB family for users who wanted even more versatility. Given the MTSIII was made by Massoth and is just a simplied version of their system, I think you have to take them together. Even the MTSIII with the loco remotes (which I started with) are very nice and easy to use, especially for kids. For high end users, maybe not, but that's why they were promoting the navigator as an option. I'm not interested in getting into a pi&*ing match over it, but I do think there is a lot of generalization about the MTS system out there that puts people off it when it might actually fit them well. That's all I'm trying to say.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Did not really want to get in the discussion of what "easier" equates to. 

LGB is LGB... no matter who the OEM may be, what I MEANT was what most people recognize as LGB MTS. 

If someone was using the Massoth, I think they would not think of the system as LGB.. the hardware says Massoth. 

So, my statement about "LGB" stands. 

In answering the original question on the thread, I was addressing options, the poster asked: 

"Does MRC's equiptment seem the way to go, or does LGB/Marklin offer a better product themselves?" 


So, I "feel" that you want Massoth "represented"... 

I will add this additional answer: 

If you consider the Massoth Navigator to be LGB, then yes, it's better than MRC, hands down, there's no comparison in my mind, nice stuff, and very capable. Note that it's significantly more expensive than the more popular DCC systems in the US, and WAY more expensive than the less capable and less friendly MRC systems. 

Regards, Greg


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## Road Foreman (Jan 2, 2008)

Greg, 

Some time back we talked about the MRC black box & some body said it puts out address #3 when it sends out a command.. Will only talk to that address.. 

BulletBob


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Yep, I remember that, the interesting thing is how it sends a DCC signal... does it modulate the DC voltage in sort of a "positive half only DCC", or does it interrupt the power long enough to send real dcc, or does it use polarity reversals, and only work with the QSI style DC protocol? I'd sure like to know. 

Regards, Greg


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## Peter Osborne (Jan 5, 2008)

Greg, you seem to be a little tough on MRC. I know they have a broad range of products which may confuse people, and their decoders leave a lot to be desired, but I personally find the Advance Wireless to be a great solution to my GR needs. I use the older version 8 amp booster to provide enough juice, and wait with great interest for the new 8 amp Advance series booster that has been promised for most of the years. The handset is as intuitive as any on the market and I think helps remove much of the mystik of DCC for new users. 

Peter.


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## Bills (Feb 20, 2008)

I agree with Pete (not about the being harsh part)the MRC Advanced is an excellent choice when paired with their 8 amp 20 volt booster . It will do everything at half the cost of anyone’s else system. The booster contains it's own power supply and will accept the output of any dcc control system to drive it. Their decoders leave a lot to be desired, but the new 1800 series are silent, make a sound that somewhat resembles a train (including horn and bell), and can be bought for around $60. This makes them a reasonable addition to that $125 engine you bought off of E-bay.


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## mack0238 (Feb 18, 2009)

I appreciate all the wisdom on different DCC (and DC) systems. As a person new to DCC, I feel more informed now that I understand a few different companies!!!

Thanks,

-Pete in Rochester, MN


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

I was more speaking of the MRC decoders, there are often firmware "quirks" and hardware reliability issues. The sounds on them can be pretty weird. 

They just don't seem to have all the kinks worked out of the more sophisticated features, again in the decoders. 

Regards, Greg


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