# My First (Gulp) Aster!!!



## Dwight Ennis (Jan 2, 2008)

This weekend, I'll be taking delivery of my first Aster locomotive. I'm buying *Lon's Aster Reno* - painted up as V&T's Inyo.

Here she is at the NSS a few weeks back...









(Mike Martin Photo)

I saw her run at last year's NSS and she's a gorgeous locomotive. And one can never have too many old-time 4-4-0 Americans!









This will also be my first (gulp) alcohol-fired locomotive, so I will need advice on what I will need to add to my steamup kit and where I can buy it (fan, alcohol bottle, etc.). I already have nose plugs and a respirator. hehehe









Needless to say, I'm rather excited!


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## stanman (Jan 4, 2008)

What a gorgeous loco!

I assume you've had to sell most of you assets, but hope you've been able to hold on to your home.


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## steamupdad (Aug 19, 2008)

Yes indeed! It is a very nice looking loco. I just hope the guy your buying it from isn't selling you a lemon(?). Hehe... 
Is the tender included in your purchase?


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## Charles (Jan 2, 2008)

Dwight
Just remember to keep the two containers of *alcohol* well marked and separated during your recreation time!


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## JEFF RUNGE (Jan 2, 2008)

You will need to request an A.S. number... From Steve S.


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## Steve S. (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By JEFF RUNGE on 04 Aug 2011 05:59 AM 
You will need to request an A.S. number... From Steve S. 








*--------------------------------------------------------------------------*


*ASTER SNOB that is, and........................ welcome to the club. You will have to learn to walk with your nose held high in the air. If you ever come to Diamondhead you will be allowed to stand along the Aster wall where the tracks are that high end Asters are parked on static display. You should always be allowed to run first and pick your track at any steam event. Others can look.......But......NEVER touch. Remember though, use only high end water provided by Zubi. Make sure that your steam oil is pure and only the finest. You must be dressed properly when running your Aster because now you are being noticed by all. Most IMPORTANTLY ............... You can never admit that your Aster has had problems, or......... it's even hard to say...........has broken down. These sort of things do not happen to an Aster. *


*Again, welcome.*


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## Dwight Ennis (Jan 2, 2008)

Just remember to keep the two containers of alcohol well marked and separated during your recreation time!Two containers? Why two? Remember, when it comes to alcohol firing, you're talking to a total dweeb here.








Jeff and Steve - you crack me up!!







If you see me walking around with my nose in the air, it will be because I got a big wiff of fuel. hehehe

Seriously though, I wasn't kidding about needing to know where to get a fan and supplies - and what else I may need to get.


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## Charles (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Dwight Ennis on 04 Aug 2011 07:58 AM 



Just remember to keep the two containers of alcohol well marked and separated during your recreation time!Two containers? Why two? Remember, when it comes to alcohol firing, you're talking to a total dweeb here.










Jeff and Steve - you crack me up!!







If you see me walking around with my nose in the air, it will be because I got a big wiff of fuel. hehehe

Seriously though, I wasn't kidding about needing to know where to get a fan and supplies - and what else I may need to get.

Dwight
I did not want that " First (Gulp)" going down the wrong tube.... Accucraft has a very good fan. We run racing fuel in our alcohol fired engines (good price). As to marking be sure to mark container alcohol vs. water, yes there has been situation when the substance has been switched!
So-
Fan
Fuel
Of course water, oil, etc 


Firing- prior to lighting the wicks make sure to let them soak by opening the valve. Put the fan on the stack, open the firebox door, lite (fan on) it the wicks do not catch lift the fan and reset it. Once pressure is about 25 PSI,off with fan and open the blower. Once safety lift, open the throttle and close blower and enjoy the ride.


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## tacfoley (Jan 3, 2008)

I think they mean to keep the container marked 'Jack Daniels', well away from the one marked 'locomotive alcohol', else your loco will smell like an old speakeasy. 

tac 
www.ovgrs.org


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## JEFF RUNGE (Jan 2, 2008)

Dwight, As the Reno has no fire box door you will need to light this from under the burner, A long BBQ style lighter works well for this. Also a small mirror you can slide under the burners to inspect them, to ensure they are all lit. 

That engine is slip eccentric, I think, so you need to push it one full driver revolution to set or change the direction.


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## jfrank (Jan 2, 2008)

From my recollection, the Reno has an on/off switch for a throttle so be careful when you start it up. Caleb was going to run his one day and he had it all steamed up and ready to run. He opened the throttle a little and nothing happenned. He turned his back in it for just a second and it shot off down the track 100mph and flew off the first curve it came too. Put some cars behind it to hold it back. lol


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## David Leech (Dec 9, 2008)

Well done Dwight. 
A few thoughts: 
1) This has a Smithies boiler (unless Lon has fitted a new boiler which he seems very good at) so the flame actually is in contact with the inside of lower portion of the boiler shell. 
There will be some insulation there, but if you want to keep it looking nice - don't run it!!!! Just kidding, check with Lon if he expects the paint to discolour. 
2) I saw Aster SNOB shirts on sale somewhere, but I can't remember where. 
3) Contact Aster to see if they have any of the original Reno paint, so that you can return it to it's perfect collectable colour. Why would you want to as Lon did a fantastic paint job on it. 
4) You have to have an 'original' Aster suction fan where the fan and motor are separate from the battery pack, to keep the period look! 
I also saw it running two years ago, and I know that you will be very happy with it - enjoy, and welcome again to the Aster club. 
All the best, 
David Leech, Delta, Canada


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

If anybody deserved an Aster, you do. Congratulations.

But you should have kept it a secret until your first steamup at a ride-on track. You could pull this one out, fake a horrified look on your face and say your 7.5-inch gauge American must have shrunk after you washed it.


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## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

must have shrunk after you washed it 
ROFL!! Yes, what a missed opportunity. 

Dwight - I have an original 8550 Mogul kit, one of their first models, and it gets built sometime this winter, I hope. My second alcohol loco - I fitted a Mamod with a Kingfisher alcohol burner many years ago. Looking forward to hearing of your adventures.


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## artgibson (Jan 2, 2008)

Accucraft suction fan, mirror, as has bben said separate container for alcohol, separte hose for putting fuel in engine, do not use water hose.
There is no switch on engine. Once it is fired up, unless Lon put steam gauge on her, you will get pop off of steam and when you open the throttle she will be off and running.
While you have the suction fan on the engine you will have the draft turned off. Once proper steam pressure obtained,shut off fan and open draft slightly until full pressure obtained.
I need to get my Reno out for a run. I have run it a couple of times and as was mentioned above it can get real hot and burn your beautiful paintjob.
Enjoy and welcome to the AS crowd.


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## Steve S. (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Charles on 04 Aug 2011 08:06 AM 
We run racing fuel in our alcohol fired engines (good price). 



*------------------------------------------------------------------------*

*Jeff and Chuck gave me a couple of gallons of the stuff and it is awesome. Maybe Jeff and or Charles can tell more about it.*

*However,............... Me being the lazy sort, I just get SLX brand denatured alcohol from Home Depot. I think that most around here will agree that amongst the "Easy to obtain brands" it is the cleanest burning.*
*And yes, some Renos can take off on you.
*


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## Ray Cadd (Dec 30, 2008)

Nice looker, Dwight. I have a spirit fired loco too (LBSC), and it's a bit different deal than running butane. Of course, your experience in 7.5" will set you pretty straight on things. One question I have that someone might be able to answer here, what's the trick with wicks, ie how should they be properly packed, trimmed, best wick material, etc?


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## Charles (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Steve S. on 04 Aug 2011 10:38 AM 


Posted By Charles on 04 Aug 2011 08:06 AM 
We run racing fuel in our alcohol fired engines (good price). 



*------------------------------------------------------------------------*

*Jeff and Chuck gave me a couple of gallons of the stuff and it is awesome. Maybe jeff and or Charles can tell more about it.*

*However,............... Me being the lazy sort, I just get SLX brand denatured alcohol from Home Depot. I think that most around here will agree that amongst the "Easy to obtain brands" it is the cleanest burning.*
*And yes, some Renos can take off on you.
*

Last fill up of a 5 gallon container was $3.33 per gallon of methanol (race track, go-carts, performance shops). As to store brand I prefer Sunnyside over the SLX (can be find at True Valve or Ace Hardware). As with all the denatured alcohol fuels there is a potential health hazard (sorry to spoil the moment for Dwight). Like many volatile chemicals, methanol does not have to be swallowed to be dangerous since the liquid can be absorbed through the skin, and the vapors through the lungs. Methanol fuel is much safer when blended with ethanol, even at relatively low ethanol percentages (therefore, I have met my legal obligations to inform anyone of potential harm if one choose to burn it in a live steam locomotive).


Sunnyside brand denatured alcohol.
MSDS dated 1/25/06, Percentage by weight.
Ethyl Alcohol: 85.7%
Methanol: 3.6%
Methyl Isobutyl Ketone: 1.9% 
Ethyl Acetate: 1%
Naphtha: 0.8%

SLX
48% ethanol
48% methanol
4% Methyl isobutyl ketone


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## Steve S. (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Charles on 04 Aug 2011 11:48 AM 
Posted By Steve S. on 04 Aug 2011 10:38 AM 


Posted By Charles on 04 Aug 2011 08:06 AM 
We run racing fuel in our alcohol fired engines (good price). 



*------------------------------------------------------------------------*

*Jeff and Chuck gave me a couple of gallons of the stuff and it is awesome. Maybe jeff and or Charles can tell more about it.*

*However,............... Me being the lazy sort, I just get SLX brand denatured alcohol from Home Depot. I think that most around here will agree that amongst the "Easy to obtain brands" it is the cleanest burning.*
*And yes, some Renos can take off on you.
*

Last fill up of a 5 gallon container was $3.33 per gallon of methanol (race track, go-carts, performance shops). As to store brand I prefer Sunnyside over the SLX (can be find at True Valve or Ace Hardware). As with all the denatured alcohol fuels there is a potential health hazard (sorry to spoil the moment for Dwight). Like many volatile chemicals, methanol does not have to be swallowed to be dangerous since the liquid can be absorbed through the skin, and the vapors through the lungs. Methanol fuel is much safer when blended with ethanol, even at relatively low ethanol percentages (therefore, I have met my legal obligations to inform anyone of potential harm if one choose to burn it in a live steam locomotive).


Sunnyside brand denatured alcohol.
MSDS dated 1/25/06, Percentage by weight.
Ethyl Alcohol: 85.7%
Methanol: 3.6%
Methyl Isobutyl Ketone: 1.9% 
Ethyl Acetate: 1%
Naphtha: 0.8%

SLX
48% ethanol
48% methanol
4% Methyl isobutyl ketone 



*---------------------------------------------------------------------------*

*Thanks for the info Charles. I would think that you would prefer the SLX because it contains a higher percentage of methanol then the Sunnyside. Am I reading something wrong here ??*


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## Charles (Jan 2, 2008)

Steve
Cost wise and safety/health Sunnyside is the best bet: Methanol fuel is much safer when blended with ethanol; thus more ethanol the better. On the other hand the low exposure rate when engaging the live steam engine lessen the health hazard thereby cheaper is better buy: racing fuel.


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Ethanol BTU/Gal = 84,400
Methanol BTU/Gal = 62,800

Thus Sunnyside should have more heat energy per unit quantity, but the fumes from burning the other adulterants in it nearly put me on the ground (if it weren't the chair nearby I would have been on the ground!). Yet, Methanol will absorb through the skin and will damage the liver, so the less Methanol the better!

Pure (unadulterated) Ethanol, will be taxed heavily as an intoxicant and thus will be more expensive that the alcohols sold at the hardware and home improvements stores for cutting Shellac.


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## scottemcdonald (Jan 11, 2008)

4) You have to have an 'original' Aster suction fan where the fan and motor are separate from the battery pack, to keep the period look! 

I still have an 'original' Aster Fan set. In perfect, near new condition. Since they have become sooooooooo rare, I'm sure they are worth a King's ransom by now! (nudge, nudge, wink, wink) ;-) 

Scott


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

I believe Reno came out in Aster's first year, along with Schools. This is an heirloom piece. Really looks sharp. 

Add a fire extinguisher to the tool box. A CO2 bicycle tire inflator. They come in 2 sizes, get the small one. It uses regular BB gun CO2 cylinders. A good "toot" down the chimney puts out the fire.


Put a drop of red food coloring in the alcohol bottle.


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## steamupdad (Aug 19, 2008)

Here is "Dwight's new reno" in action....http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fHzckBN1PY8&feature=youtube_gdata_player


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## JEFF RUNGE (Jan 2, 2008)

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Dwight, if you use a CO2 device to blow out the fire at the end of the run you will get very good a replacing the wicks. They are however a good fire extinguisher.


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## Steve S. (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By steamupdad on 04 Aug 2011 02:45 PM 
Here is "Dwight's new reno" in action....http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fHzckBN1PY8&feature=youtube_gdata_player 

----------------------------------------------------------

Seems to[/b] run as good as it looks. Awesome loco. But take note. Needs a few cars behind to help control speed.[/b]*


*


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## artgibson (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By JEFF RUNGE on 04 Aug 2011 02:51 PM 
@import url(http://www.mylargescale.com/Provide...ad.ashx?type=style&file=SyntaxHighlighter.css);@import url(/providers/htmleditorproviders/cehtmleditorprovider/dnngeneral.css); Dwight, if you use a CO2 device to blow out the fire at the end of the run you will get very good a replacing the wicks. They are however a good fire extinguisher. 

Amen to that, best to shut off fuel and let run out of fuel and not damage the wicks.
By the way I have extra Truckee cars. Passenger and fright.


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## steamupdad (Aug 19, 2008)

Steve,
The throttle has had the 'bluntness' removed so as to help regulate speed. Plus it is R/C'd. And I have always shut the fuel off and let the fire burn out. This wicks are a newer fiberglass based material.


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## iceclimber (Aug 8, 2010)

Posted By Steve S. on 04 Aug 2011 07:19 AM 


Posted By JEFF RUNGE on 04 Aug 2011 05:59 AM 
You will need to request an A.S. number... From Steve S. 








*--------------------------------------------------------------------------*


*ASTER SNOB that is, and........................ welcome to the club. You will have to learn to walk with your nose held high in the air. If you ever come to Diamondhead you will be allowed to stand along the Aster wall where the tracks are that high end Asters are parked on static display. You should always be allowed to run first and pick your track at any steam event. Others can look.......But......NEVER touch. Remember though, use only high end water provided by Zubi. Make sure that your steam oil is pure and only the finest. You must be dressed properly when running your Aster because now you are being noticed by all. Most IMPORTANTLY ............... *You can never admit that your Aster has had problems*, or......... it's even hard to say...........has broken down. These sort of things do not happen to an Aster. *


*Again, welcome.*


See underlined words. That must explain why there is little discussion when I point out a few problems with my Mikado Kit I have experienced while building it.


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## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

I still have an 'original' Aster Fan set. In perfect, near new condition. Since they have become sooooooooo rare, I'm sure they are worth a King's ransom by now! 

Does anyone have any experience using computer fans instead of the ($$) Aster fan? I have a few small ones lying around from PCs that fell apart. I'm hoping I can persuade it to work on the Mogul - otherwise the accessories are going to cost more than the loco!


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## JEFF RUNGE (Jan 2, 2008)

Jeremiah, when you successfully complete you mikado kit you will also need to ask Steve S. for an A.S. number... 

BTW I don't have one...


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## Charles (Jan 2, 2008)

Pete
I would like that the heat up the stack might melt the plastic of a computer fan. Secondly, the fan would have to be modified in order to fit into the stack, thus metal to plastic conducting more heat to plastic frame and blades.


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## Charles (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By xo18thfa on 04 Aug 2011 02:23 PM 
I believe Reno came out in Aster's first year, along with Schools. This is an heirloom piece. Really looks sharp. 

Add a fire extinguisher to the tool box. A CO2 bicycle tire inflator. They come in 2 sizes, get the small one. It uses regular BB gun CO2 cylinders. A good "toot" down the chimney puts out the fire.


Put a drop of red food coloring in the alcohol bottle. 

+1 on the Co2 unit. Many ol' timers us a tube to blow out the wicks. We have not had any adverse effects using the Co2 on our wicks as the Berk, GS4, etc having their original ones and running just fine. I wonder if letting the wick burn out might draw the flame on top of the wick material thus making the ends somewhat burnt and hard. We have seen wicks of that condition needing to be replaced. Lastly, one has to be careful "letting it burn out" if the throttle is accidentally open. I have seen engines run many a lap with the fuel shut off due to the fuel in the cups.


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Pete Thornton on 04 Aug 2011 03:45 PM 
I still have an 'original' Aster Fan set. In perfect, near new condition. Since they have become sooooooooo rare, I'm sure they are worth a King's ransom by now!

Does anyone have any experience using computer fans instead of the ($$) Aster fan? I have a few small ones lying around from PCs that fell apart. I'm hoping I can persuade it to work on the Mogul - otherwise the accessories are going to cost more than the loco! 

YES, I used one for several years to supply draft for my Aster Mikado. I bought a 1.75 inch square 12-Volt fan from Radio Shack and a battery holder for Eight 1.5 volt Penlight batteries. I then folded a thin sheet of brass into a box with one side missing that just fit the fan. I drilled a hole in the side opposite the missing side and inserted a brass tube about 1 inch long that was a slip fit into the Mike's smokestack. I sealed all the seams with the same bathtub silicon caulk that came with the Mike. The fan is aimed to blow air out of the box so that air is sucked in through the tube.

It worked very well for several years, and then one day I noted a fast "ticking" sound coming from it. I cut the caulking away so I could pull the fan out of the box and found that the leading edge of the fan blades had slightly melted and the plastic had extruded into a thin strand off the outer edge. It was that strand hitting the box sides making the ticking sound.

Unfortunately, in cutting the caulking, I manged to nick one of the electrical wires and in man-handling the whole thing I broke that wire. I tried to repair the break but it was so close to the fan housing that I had to dissassemble it to get at the wire and that act broke the fan completely.

So I went to Radio Shack to get another fan. The new fan (same part-number) is of a completely different construction that leaves the fan circuit board exposed to the steam and hot oil and the fan lasted through just 2 or 3 startups of the engine. A 3rd fan died during its first use! Way too expensive to buy a new fan for nearly every startup of the engine!

Here is a video that shows the 1st fan in use. It was a cool day, so there is a lot of water vapor visible, both from the boiler and from the alcohol fire... I always open the internal blower as soon as I light the fire and when I hear the hissing from it I know that it is about time to remove the external blower. (I am sure that this practice did not help the longevity of the 2nd and 3rd fans, but it didn't seem to hurt the 1st one!)




I then went in search of some other fans but could not find one that either would withstand the heat (one fan lost the blade within minutes of lighting the fire!) or handle the steam wetness and oil without damage to the circuit board that takes the 12 V DC and drives the fan coils. I have not found any.

I finally setttled on using an air compressor to supply air flow into a home made venturi that fits the stack. This is a drawing of that venturi.










It is simply two brass tubes, one to fit the smokestack and a much smaller one (1/8 inch dia.) that is plugged on one end and inserted through the large one at about the mid point. A small hole is drilled in the middle of the small tube that penetrates only one wall and is oriented to aim UP the larger tube. Silicone tubing leads from the small tube to the air supply. It does not take much air flow to produce plenty of draft over the fire. I normally used a cheap battery powered air compressor designed to inflate a car tire or beach toys (even though it would take all day to inflate a swiming pool raft!). In use with the venturi it never built up enough pressure to register on the built-in pressure gauge on the tire inflator. The only problem with this is the noise of the compressor which some would find unacceptable. It bothered me, but not enough to make me try other methods with any sort of urgency.

I did think upl other methods of making the venturi. This is one:










This is a bit simpler, but bending the "J" shape tight enough to fit down the chimney could be a problem, as well as frabricating some method of holding it in the appropriate position.


Before I even tried to use the computer fan, I started my Loco many times using a 5-gallon compressed air tank (that I filled at the local gas station, because I didn't yet have that battery powered compressor) and I attached it to the water inlet clack valve on the boiler (this was before I had either the axle pump or tender pump, so the clack valve was unused). I just MADE SURE that the air tank valve was never opened before I had the blower valve open on the engine so that the boiler would not pressurize to the 80-lbs I put in the portable tank (The safety valves should have prevented it anyway, but I didn't want to take a chance!). I could start the engine 2 or 3 times on an 80-lbs fill of the portable air tank.


I have since made some measurements of how much air needs to be injected into my venturi (the top image) and found that if I could pick up a 1.5-inch square piece of printer paper using the vacuum produced at the bottom of the venturi tube that was enough air. I have since acquired (a gift from the late Ron Brown of SitG) a Wada Works fan (same design as the Aster brand fan) and have determined that it moves slightly less air than my venturi design running on the air compressor (it will pick up a 1-inch square of paper but not the 1.5 inch square).

Unfortunately I am not able to measure the air flow from the compressor to give any sort of idea what it produces in some meaningful meaurement units. I think the piston in the air compressor is very small, probably less that 1/2-inch in diameter and probably 1/2-inch stroke, but I don't have any idea how fast the motor makes it move.

You could probably make the venturi work on lung power, but you'd get pretty light headed before there was enough boiler pressure to let the internal blower take over







.


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## David Leech (Dec 9, 2008)

Posted By xo18thfa on 04 Aug 2011 02:23 PM 
I believe Reno came out in Aster's first year, along with Schools. This is an heirloom piece. Really looks sharp. 



Bob,
I hate to be an Aster Rivet Counter, but actually the Schools and the Japanese Mogul were the first year, 1975, and the Reno was the second year, 1976.


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## David Leech (Dec 9, 2008)

Posted By Pete Thornton on 04 Aug 2011 03:45 PM 

Does anyone have any experience using computer fans instead of the ($$) Aster fan? I have a few small ones lying around from PCs that fell apart. I'm hoping I can persuade it to work on the Mogul - otherwise the accessories are going to cost more than the loco! 
Pete,
Yes, it may seem like a lot to pay up front, but they will last you a life time of Alcohol locos.
I bought mine in 1975 when I bought a Schools, and it is still going strong, so that's 36 years, and in todays dollars if a fan is $125 (or whatever) that's only $3.47 per year.
So don't have one fancy coffee a year and that will pay for it. 
Aster, or Accucraft, they are convenient and are designed for what they do.
It's really not worth trying to make other things do the same job.
AT least, that's how I see it.
All the best,
David Leech, Delta, Canada


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## Kovacjr (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Pete Thornton on 04 Aug 2011 03:45 PM 
I still have an 'original' Aster Fan set. In perfect, near new condition. Since they have become sooooooooo rare, I'm sure they are worth a King's ransom by now!

Does anyone have any experience using computer fans instead of the ($$) Aster fan? I have a few small ones lying around from PCs that fell apart. I'm hoping I can persuade it to work on the Mogul - otherwise the accessories are going to cost more than the loco! 

Well Pete I once heard you can adapt a shop vac for a fan on a Mikado...


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## Dwight Ennis (Jan 2, 2008)

Anyone know what scale the model is built to? Is it 1:32?


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

See Southern Steam Trains web site "Roster" page. http://www.southernsteamtrains.com/roster.htm

1:28 scale is what is listed.


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## steamupdad (Aug 19, 2008)

Dwight, it is in the odd scale of 1/28. When I arrive at your place for delivery, I will go through every nook and cranny with you on this engine. (It's almost like sellin off one my kids....not that I've done that before, but been tempted)


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Charles on 04 Aug 2011 04:08 PM 
Posted By xo18thfa on 04 Aug 2011 02:23 PM 
I believe Reno came out in Aster's first year, along with Schools. This is an heirloom piece. Really looks sharp. 

Add a fire extinguisher to the tool box. A CO2 bicycle tire inflator. They come in 2 sizes, get the small one. It uses regular BB gun CO2 cylinders. A good "toot" down the chimney puts out the fire.


Put a drop of red food coloring in the alcohol bottle. 

+1 on the Co2 unit. Many ol' timers us a tube to blow out the wicks. We have not had any adverse effects using the Co2 on our wicks as the Berk, GS4, etc having their original ones and running just fine. I wonder if letting the wick burn out might draw the flame on top of the wick material thus making the ends somewhat burnt and hard. We have seen wicks of that condition needing to be replaced. Lastly, one has to be careful "letting it burn out" if the throttle is accidentally open. I have seen engines run many a lap with the fuel shut off due to the fuel in the cups.

Alcohol definitely requires more attention to operate. All the things you mention, plus a blower valve. I use ordinary cotton candle wick for the wicks. Can't let them burn out or they are gone. Cotton works well. Does not crust up, maintains a good shape, really soaks alcohol up. Just don't let the fire burn out!


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Somebody around here one time suggested using a 1 gallon pump up garden sprayer with a "J" tube instead of a suction fan.


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## iceclimber (Aug 8, 2010)

@import url(http://www.mylargescale.com/Provide...ad.ashx?type=style&file=SyntaxHighlighter.css);@import url(/providers/htmleditorproviders/cehtmleditorprovider/dnngeneral.css); Posted By xo18thfa on 04 Aug 2011 08:10 PM 


Alcohol definitely requires more attention to operate. 





The very reason I like alcohol over butane fired engines.


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## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

I used one for several years to supply draft for my Aster Mikado 
Thanks for the support - I thought it was a possibility. Nothing ventured, nothing gained - and the computer fans were free. 

Yes, it may seem like a lot to pay up front, but they will last you a life time of Alcohol locos 
David, 

Thanks for the advice, but as a retired nobody, I can't afford a lifetime of Asters. There's just enough in the 'train fund' account to pay for my EBT #12, but not for a bunch of magnificent alcohol-fired locos. The EBT had a nice 2-6-0 just like the 8550 with the 6-wheel tender ,so I had to have one to go with my Business Car #20 'Orbisonia". 

I'm much more the type of guy who will try the computer fan until it melts, then decide if I want a 'proper' Aster fan.


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## xo18thfa (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By iceclimber on 04 Aug 2011 08:14 PM 
@import url(http://www.mylargescale.com/Provide...ad.ashx?type=style&file=SyntaxHighlighter.css);@import url(/providers/htmleditorproviders/cehtmleditorprovider/dnngeneral.css); Posted By xo18thfa on 04 Aug 2011 08:10 PM 


Alcohol definitely requires more attention to operate. 





The very reason I like alcohol over butane fired engines. 

Butane is kind of like decaf.


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## zubi (May 14, 2009)

Posted By Semper Vaporo on 04 Aug 2011 05:01 PM 
[...] 
I did think upl other methods of making the venturi. This is one:










This is a bit simpler, but bending the "J" shape tight enough to fit down the chimney could be a problem, as well as frabricating some method of holding it in the appropriate position.





Semper Vaporo,
That was a good brainstorming we had on the blowers! To solve this problem with J-tube I suggested an L-tube:











Both are actually effectively replacing a standard steam blower pipe with an externally driven blower pipe. Both very simple approaches at generating draft. But live steamers are so used to the standard suction fan that this wil probably never catch on.
Best wishes, Zubi


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## Charles (Jan 2, 2008)

Zubi
As to catching on.....several coal firing members of the hobby by the National Summer Steamup do not use suction fans engaging compressors. Of course this requires electric connection and having to lug around the apparatus but it does work very well. 


Not sure if I have a photo of that arrangement but prior conversation was about a garden pump unit:


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## zubi (May 14, 2009)

Charles, Wow, thanks for the photo! Talk about reinventing the wheel;-)... Well, anyway, the idea is so obvious, but I have never seen anyone using the concept before. Best wishes, Zubi


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## JEFF RUNGE (Jan 2, 2008)

Aster sells a very nice compact easy to use ( no hoses or wires to get caught in and pull the loco to the ground) drafting/suction fan. You can view it on the Aster USA web site. They last a long time, mine is about 14 years old.


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## Steve S. (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By steamupdad on 04 Aug 2011 03:15 PM 
Steve, The throttle has had the 'bluntness' removed so as to help regulate speed. Plus it is R/C'd. And I have always shut the fuel off and let the fire burn out. This wicks are a newer fiberglass based material. 


----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------[/b]


Well it sure did the trick. That is one beautiful looking and fine running Loco that Dwight will soon receive.[/b]


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## zubi (May 14, 2009)

Posted By JEFF RUNGE on 05 Aug 2011 06:49 AM 
Aster sells a very nice compact easy to use ( no hoses or wires to get caught in and pull the loco to the ground) drafting/suction fan. You can view it on the Aster USA web site. They last a long time, mine is about 14 years old. 
Jeff, of course. And, you can superpower it using Tamada-san's trick. Best, Zubi


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## Steve S. (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By JEFF RUNGE on 04 Aug 2011 03:54 PM 
Jeremiah, when you successfully complete you mikado kit you will also need to ask Steve S. for an A.S. number... 

BTW I don't have one... 





--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------[/b]


Mr. Grunge, there are a select few, and yourself included in this hobby that are far beyond the "Aster Snob" status and are actually looked up to and revered so much as to be classified as :[/b]


Drum roll please,[/b]


Mr. Jeff Grunge.............. AG #1........Aster GURU that is.[/b]


Us lowly Snobs can only hope and dream that some day we could obtain such Aster status.[/b]


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## JEFF RUNGE (Jan 2, 2008)

Steve, ROFLMAO


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## zubi (May 14, 2009)

Guru, or 'teacher' is highly positive, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guru and indeed there are not that many of those "who is regarded as having great knowledge, wisdom, and authority in a certain area, and who uses it to guide others" Well done Jeff!! Zubi


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## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

Aster sells a very nice compact easy to use ( no hoses or wires to get caught in and pull the loco to the ground) drafting/suction fan. 
And it is so expensive that nobody has the price on their website? $100 I recall - for a fan?


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## JEFF RUNGE (Jan 2, 2008)

Pete, I think a bit over $100 now ( I think I paid about $60 for mine back in 1998, in fact mine says WADA on it not ASTER, same fan) If you like alcohol or coal firing it is an investment in you "steaming tools" I think you could make your own for less, but for me building a fan would not be cost effective.


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## Dan Pantages (Jan 2, 2008)

List is $120 in North America.


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## c1run1 (Aug 4, 2011)

Dwight ,
Good luck with the reno she's a looker : )


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## Dwight Ennis (Jan 2, 2008)

Thanks c1run1 - I see you are getting one too. Congrats!!!


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## GaugeOneLines (Feb 23, 2008)

Lug around compressors and equipment Charles? I guess you're too young to know,







but when I started in G1 live steam in 1960 the standatd blower kit was a T pipe as illustrated and we used a bicycle pump......very low tech, cheap and easy.
Maybe it was on another thread but some were debating alcohol/gas.......personally I dislike the roar of gas engines, they seem to sound like dimented bunsen burners, whereas on an alcohol/coal fired engine you hear the pure stack-talk.
David M-K
Ottawa


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## David Leech (Dec 9, 2008)

It was only just a couple of years ago at a Get Together in the UK, one of the 'older' members was still using a bicycle pump through the tender pump, to make pressure in the boiler, so that he could then use the locomotive blower to create the draft to get up steam. 
Modern collapsable bike pumps would even fit in our tool boxes, and I thought how simple and effective, as the blower often creates a better draught than the suction fan anyway, and NO BATTERIES. 
I just never get around to trying it! 
All the best, 
David Leech, Delta, Canada


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## JEFF RUNGE (Jan 2, 2008)

Hey David,The guys in Houston want you to give a demonstration on alcohol firing with a bicycle pump in the 107 degree heat. "EASY" ?? Now I like low tech, but if it was that good how come I never see anyone using it ?


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## David Leech (Dec 9, 2008)

Jeff, 
Lets see - water in Canada boils at 100 degrees, so I guess you don't need to 'steam up' as you are already boiling! 
1) Can I wear a hat to keep me cool? 
2) Will you pay for the return first class airfare? 
3) I just need to make up the adapter for the tender and try it out. 
4) I think that as soon as someone developed an electric suction fan, the idea of pumping to get up pressure was less popular. 
All the best, 
David Leech, Delta, Canada


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## JEFF RUNGE (Jan 2, 2008)

Sorry I should have specified "David M-K", 

But Mr Leech, 
#1 yes, 
#2 No if you can operate a bicycle pump, you can ride a bike home ( low tech transportation ) 
#3 Please have the adapter made before you get there and you better bring your own pump, from the looks of the tires on Steve's bike tires when we were there, I think his is broken. 
#4 Modern technology at it's finest. 

As part of China, will we be allowed to have this much fun on MLS ???


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## Dwight Ennis (Jan 2, 2008)

Ordered me an "Aster" fan. Figured is I wanted to avoid being harassed by Steve S, *A.S. Extraordinaire*, I better not use anything else in my Inyo.







Besides, I heard they were lighter and smaller than others, and you only have to buy it once. Also ordered a couple of alcohol bottles - all from Pete Comley.

Lon is bring her down tomorrow. Today I'm making the sides of my cab. Pictures at Eleven...


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Several visitors to my track have SERIOUSLY questioned me about using my portable electric tire pump "to pressurize my boiler", when I was actually using it to run my homemade venturi "Auxiliary Blower". A couple needed several different explanations before they understood the boiler was not being pressurized by the air compressor.

One neighbor argued that it was very dangerous to use air to pressurize the boiler and was upset that it seemed the pressure gauge on the compressor was broken since it was not registering anything at all. He kept asking how I knew how much pressure I was putting in the boiler. (He would not believe the tiny pressure gauge on the boiler, claiming it was too small to be reliable or even "real".) I had to remove the venturi and cover both ends with my fingers to cause the pressure to build enough to show the pump gauge rise off of zero (and before it got much over 5 lbs, the hoses blew off the hose barbs!). Then he could not understand how I was pressurizing the boiler with the venturi in the stack! I explained the draft over the fire twice and he decided it was just too dangerous to be around my boiler being pressurized by air and he left (talk about DENSE... sigh!)

The small Aster (or Wada) stack fan used as an auxiliary blower is smaller than the portable air compressor (and a WHOLE LOT LESS noisy!) and although it is a bit top-heavy in the stack, it has no hoses or wires to catch a hand on, etc. which might knock the Locomotive over.

I really liked using the small CPU fan, but it did require wires to the 8 Penlight batteries, and I wish I could figure out a way to use one again; it was small and very unobtrusive to use and I kept the wires just long enough to stand the battery pack next to the loco on the opposite side so as to keep them out of the way.


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