# Anyone with a live steam rotary snow plow?



## ChaoticRambo (Nov 20, 2010)

I have been thinking about the idea of a rotary snow plow, and then it occurred to me that building a real working steam rotary snow plow in gauge 1 would actually be possible. I was wondering if anyone had ever attempted this or done this?

I looked it up online to see how the inner workings of a steam rotary worked, and I found that the early ones basically used a simple steam engine with the two cylinders mounted a little bit higher up and had gearing to translate the motion. Now, the more modern ones (1950s) used a double bank of 3 verticle cylnders taken directly from the Pacific Coast Shay engine (http://limalocomotiveworks.com/).

I love the idea of this, but I lack the money, time, and knowledge to even remotely attempt this. Just wondering if anyone had ever done this. 


I have seen some of the amazing things you guys can make from scratch, so I would imagine this might be a challenge for someone ;-)


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## steamtom1 (Jan 2, 2008)

Jim Hadden did it years ago, powered by a Frank S motor...


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## Gary Armitstead (Jan 2, 2008)

I believe I saw a picture of one in Narrow Gauge Gazette a couple of months ago. 1/20.3, boiler and all! A real beauty!


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## ChaoticRambo (Nov 20, 2010)

That's cool, but what about an actual steam engine powering it?, that's actually what I was referring too.


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## Gary Armitstead (Jan 2, 2008)

^^^^That's what I said!! Jeesh.


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## ChaoticRambo (Nov 20, 2010)

Posted By Gary Armitstead on 26 Feb 2011 09:12 PM 
^^^^That's what I said!! Jeesh. 
hehe sorry, you replied while I was typing that message, I was referring to the post above yours


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## HMeinhold (Jan 2, 2008)

See:
http://www.buntbahn.de/modellbau/viewtopic.php?t=1180
Regards


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## Dr Rivet (Jan 5, 2008)

CR 

As Tom said above; Jim Hadden built Rotary OM using the boiler and motor [cylinders, pistons,valves, drive rods] from an Aster/LGB Frank S 0-6-0 to drive the blade. It is live steam, butane fired. I am sure that somewhere in the archives are photos of it from Diamondhead showing the unit with the roof off.


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## ChaoticRambo (Nov 20, 2010)

Posted By Dr Rivet on 26 Feb 2011 09:16 PM 
CR 

As Tom said above; Jim Hadden built Rotary OM using the boiler and motor [cylinders, pistons,valves, drive rods] from an Aster/LGB Frank S 0-6-0 to drive the blade. It is live steam, butane fired. I am sure that somewhere in the archives are photos of it from Diamondhead showing the unit with the roof off. 
OH ok awesome, if someone could find any of those pictures, that would be great! I didn't understand a reference to a Frank S motor.


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## steamtom1 (Jan 2, 2008)

I knew I had it somewhere. It took a while to find, and it is not a great video, but here it is...


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## rdamurphy (Jan 3, 2008)

That looks a tad dangerous to have running at a public meet! Especially with kids around. I'd love to see it plow snow, though! 

Thanks! Robert


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## tacfoley (Jan 3, 2008)

Posted By rdamurphy on 27 Feb 2011 12:16 PM 
That looks a tad dangerous to have running at a public meet! Especially with kids around. I'd love to see it plow snow, though! 

Thanks! Robert 

Every one of those locomotives shoving that plough has two high-pressure butane gas jets fizzing away at around 2400F...how many children climbed up onto the track to stick their fingers into them?
Health and Safety issues are going to put us in a position where all we can do is watch something happening remotely from the safety of a bunker.

tac
www.ovgrs.org


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## steamtom1 (Jan 2, 2008)

At 3:03 minutes into the following DH 2008 Video you can see another of Jim's magnificent creations...


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## Charles (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By rdamurphy on 27 Feb 2011 12:16 PM 
That looks a tad dangerous to have running at a public meet! Especially with kids around. I'd love to see it plow snow, though! 

Thanks! Robert 
Robert
You might be over stating the concern....in the many meets I have attended and the numerous photographs I have yet to get a visual of kids and/or parent running out the door in horror having been exposed to live steam and the perception of "danger" at a public event. In fact I am not sure what the "danger" would be if there are responsible operators and proper running equipment in place.

Here is a bit of photo essay that gives a snapshot of what the public really thinks of being around live steam

Public reaction


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## David BaileyK27 (Jan 2, 2008)

Not every one of those engines has gas jets, one is my coal fired K27.
David Bailey


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## tacfoley (Jan 3, 2008)

Posted By David BaileyK27 on 28 Feb 2011 01:20 AM 
Not every one of those engines has gas jets, one is my coal fired K27.
David Bailey

Apologies, Mr Bailey - sadly, it is not apparent from the movie clip shown that one of those locomotives is coal-fired. It must be added that the vast majorty of K-27 models are gas-fired, and I admit that I can't tell which one is your own-built version. 

Notwithstanding the method of firing, I'm still waiting to hear about all the children who were hospitalised or otherwised traumatised as a result of a visit to DH and those famously dangerous steam trains.

tac


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## zubi (May 14, 2009)

Hmm, I remember the beautiful rotary by Jim Hadden from the time when it was still au naturel, I see he painted it since;-)... And it occurred to me that perhaps it would NOT be a bad idea if, say Accucraft management considered adding one of these to their MOW range. The flangers are already there, right? Best wishes, Zubi


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## tacfoley (Jan 3, 2008)

Great idea, that, Zubi! A Colorado live-steam rotary snow-plough....................sigh.................................................. 

tac 
www.ovgrs.org 
Supporter of the Cape meares Lighthouse Restoration Fund


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## zubi (May 14, 2009)

@import url(http://www.mylargescale.com/Provide...ad.ashx?type=style&file=SyntaxHighlighter.css);@import url(/providers/htmleditorproviders/cehtmleditorprovider/dnngeneral.css); 
I am glad you like it Terry!! Now, that I gave it more thought, they have a 3 cylinder shay power, if they double that, six cylinders with some gearing should provide sufficient torque to do some plowing. The boilers are there too... Dream Colorado rotary now... and check these for some visual help, operational:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PPwPcb7CBgo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ha59KFvCQUY
http://www.photosbystevenjbrown.com/steam/ctsrr/cumbres.html 
and preservation info http://drgw.free.fr/DRGW/MOW/Snow/Rotary/ChasseNeige_en.htm 
....but WAIT, there is more than Colorado to the rotary; WP&Y;-)))), scroll down this page: http://drgw.free.fr/WP&YR/Engines/Steam/Vapeur_en.htm Best, Zubi


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## steamtom1 (Jan 2, 2008)

Zubi,

I remember Jim's unpainted snowplow from it's debut, at the Denver Garden Railway Convention, in the early '90s. Jim had entered, and won, the model building contest. He then took his snowplow out to the live steam track, where he ran it for the crowd. Near the end of the run I witnessed something I have never seen, either before or since. The crowd spontaneously broke into a standing round of applause.


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## zubi (May 14, 2009)

Tom, Wow, I did not know that fact, Thank you for sharing it, Zubi


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## steamtom1 (Jan 2, 2008)

USA Trains makes a rotary snowplow, and a video was posted here about a year ago. I'll bet someone, with more skill than me, could easily convert it into live steam.


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## zubi (May 14, 2009)

That is true Tom, and the video shows a great action. But I am talking about a heavy, scale mode, full size, RTR 15mm (1:20.3) with state of the art (Accucraft) boiler, preferably two Shay engine combo and a big gas tank;-)... Well, I don't know, but perhaps I and Terry are not the only two who like this idea??? Best wishes, Zubi


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## rdamurphy (Jan 3, 2008)

Actually, I was referring to the spinning blades on the rotary, not the live steam... 

The last train show I went to, I saw several models damaged by kids who were pretty much uncontrolled - actually uncontrollable - by their parents. Just Friday, at Union Station in Denver, I saw a kid climb up, lean over the glass, and pick up a caboose off the track... 

Robert


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## Michael Glavin (Jan 2, 2009)

These maybe pictures of the plow Tom mentions? Truely a nice piece of equipment...

Michael


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## Gary Armitstead (Jan 2, 2008)

That's the one I remembered seeing!


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## steamtom1 (Jan 2, 2008)

We, at Michigan Small Scale Live Steamers, use two methods for keeping little fingers from the trains...

1. We cordon off about a three foot path around the layout, as seen in the background here...












2. We built a stand for the peanuts, so they can better see the trains without reaching up for the track... 
























And just in case, we are a 100% NMRA club, and carry liability insurance through them. Not a bad idea for any club that has displays open to the public.


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## Dan Pantages (Jan 2, 2008)

Actually the painted version, shown here, is the one that Jim built for Pete Olson. Jim has not painted his but left it natural. This is why he purchased the Aster Gold Mogul, so the engine and plow match. Michael, the pictures you show are of Jim’s plow.


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## ChaoticRambo (Nov 20, 2010)

Very nice rotaries here.

Guess I just got in the thought of plowing snow next winter (our layout is still under construction). We have a basic wedge plow right now, which should be perfect though for the next engine I plan to buy (Accucraft 2-6-0 Mogul).


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## steamtom1 (Jan 2, 2008)

CR,

You mean like this one...


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## ChaoticRambo (Nov 20, 2010)

No, we don't have one that looks that good.

We have the Aristo-Craft plow:











Ours is painted different, but same thing. We have it filled with gravel to give it some weight when we used it with our electric diesel on our small loop we used to have outside.


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