# USAT Big Boy Review?



## dave2657 (Feb 25, 2008)

Could anybody please tell me if there has been a review done on the USAT Big Boy loco. If there hasn't been, would somebody please have the following information :---

Tractive effort (in lbs and ounces) , current draw (light and at full load) , approximate hauling capacity in number of 4-axle wagons. I have checked the Garden Railways magazine and ,strangely , could not find a review of this major loco model anywhere.

Thanks. 
dave2657


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## altterrain (Jan 2, 2008)

Do a search and you should find around a 10 page thread on the big boy. 

-Brian


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## NTCGRR (Jan 2, 2008)

Just buy one, you'll love it. couple of us have them in our club. they will work you. not a girl-man's machine. 

Chilicharlie did a video on mine pulling 64 100 ton hoppers.
Can't remember the title name


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

Bigboy SWEET here s mine.... you wont regret it....


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## Nick Jr (Jan 2, 2008)

Come on Chuck, show them what you have done with yours??? Nick Jr


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## Chucks_Trains (Jan 2, 2008)

Ok Nick Jr.









I just checked my USA Big Boy and the drawbar pull is 7 lb. 12 oz. and peaked at 8 lb. 10 oz. on stainless steel track









I have a 50 car freight train on the rails that is a mix of Aristo & AML 40' boxcars & Aristo & MDC 2-bay hoppers and all have steel wheels. My digital fish scale showed that it takes 1 lb. to get them rolling so that means that the USA Big Boy should be able to start a 350 - 400 car train









That other thread about the USA Big Boy is 15 pages long and the last time I checked it hd over 23,000 views and it could possibly be the largest thread on MLS









My USA BB has been converted to MTH PS2 and with full smoke, sound & lights will only draw like 3.5 amps at full driver slip.

By comparison my USA 0-6-0T has a drawbar pull of only 2 lb. 1 oz. but it will take the 50 car freight train mentioned above and haull ass with it


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## Chillicharlie (Jan 2, 2008)

Here is the link for the old guy that can't remember http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fRusAC997Xg 

Chillicharlie


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## Rayman4449 (Jan 2, 2008)

To provide some perspective too on the drawbar pull force test, my Aristocraft Mallets can only do about 2.5lbs avg. My MTH Big Boy does 7lbs 6oz avg with peaks in the 8lb range so it's the only engine I've seen that is in this range. So it's a lot of pulling power.

I don't have much in the way of videos to share of it running but do have quite a few high quality photos and did methodical photo steps so you could see every inch of the engine: 

http://www.rayman4449.dynip.com/USA_Trains_Big_Boy.htm

It's the most impressive largescale model I've ever seen. If you can afford the price you won't regret the purchase. Just note the engine weighs 45lb 13.5oz and the tender 16lb 3oz so it is heavy. You will need good track work to run it too.

If you click on Nick's Youtube video I think he has a bunch other videos of it in action.









While the engine pulls relatively lower amp levels converted to DCS, a non-converted engine I recall mine was pulling much higher amperage levels just controlling with the transformer even under no load but don't remember what they were when I test ran mine. 

Chuck do you recall what your engine pulled amp wise before conversion?


Raymond


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

2.5 amps with 58 cars SWEET............. Have i told you how SWEET the USA bigboy is.......







The 2nd finest loco ever built next to the USA Hudson of course? DAAAAAAAAAAAA


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## Rayman4449 (Jan 2, 2008)

Duh sorry that's right, you're still running yours on analog!


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

Well if you got up off you a-s and converted mine we'd be done NO?????????????? HE HE HE





















Haaa you know im waiting???????


HELLO......... he he he


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

Hee hee Hee.............














Top shelf Vodka Thursday in my house you know.......


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## Rayman4449 (Jan 2, 2008)

LOL Well I tell you what, once I do mine then I'll do yours! hehehe

Besides, I'm not done extracting all of Chuck's trade secrets yet...


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## NTCGRR (Jan 2, 2008)

heres Char's 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fRusAC997Xg


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## Splicer (Nov 29, 2008)

Posted By NTCGRR on 11 Dec 2009 06:33 AM 
heres Char's 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fRusAC997Xg

Only 10 hours behind Chili, Marty.


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## Chucks_Trains (Jan 2, 2008)

Chuck do you recall what your engine pulled amp wise before conversion? 
No I don't but I do know that it would blow a 7.5 amp fuse when I grabbed the tender coupler to "feel" what kind of pull it had.


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## H-man (Jan 4, 2008)

I have a USA BigBoy and love it. Great sound and pulls like a horse. The loco weighs 68 pounds and the tender weighs another 30 pounds. This loco pulls what ever you throw at it. I'm on 20 foot diameter cyrves and the track as balanced as possible. another words leveal as possible side to side. I wory about a derailment with this loco due to the expense and I would just cry to turn it over in the rocks. This loco will never be just a shelf queen! 

Howard in AZ


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## Rayman4449 (Jan 2, 2008)

I've weighed mine on my digital scale and the engine came out at 45lb 13.5oz and the tender 16lb 3oz.





















Raymond


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## Mik (Jan 2, 2008)

Can somebody please explain to me the logic of building a model of a prototype that only 1 road used, and only a handful were built? Wouldn't a Yellowstone or Challenger type be more broadly appealing, useful to more modelers and therefore possibly sell better?? 

No, I'm not trying to start a fight, I'm truly puzzled. Yes, I would pose the same argument against the Erie Triplex.


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## Rayman4449 (Jan 2, 2008)

This has been discussed at length before on here and Aristocraft.com. Because it's an icon, big and most people know it sells and will sell, but it all depends on what you appreciate. You either get the romance that surrounds these designs or you don't. 

Aristocraft followed the logic you presented, pick agenerally used by a large number of lines (not just one). I've heard more than once that they ended up not being good sellers. The MTH Big Boys on the other hand have sold out on all the production runs they had planned for now and sold relatively quickly and then didn't need to clearance or blow them out. I know more than one person who doesn't even have a layout buy one because it was a Big Boy. I've also heard many folks say, once they have a Big Boy, nothing else will do, why run a 2-8-8-2 mallet? When the UP introduced the 4-8-8-4 back in the day it afforded them much publicity just as it does today. One of the gentleman involved in the making of the UP video Last of the Giants said they never expected it would have the interest it does even to this day. Some have a strong appreciation for the mechanical engineering and massiveness is that is engines like the Big Boy and uniqueness that is the Triplex. So in short, it's because it was the biggest of the big, it's unique, the only 4-8-8-4 wheel arrangement made, required many special provisions to run, etc. The same question could be asked "why make an eggliner?". How many RRs ran those? But Aristo makes them and they apparently sell pretty well. Even though I have no interest in them I could care less if a mfg makes them and/or if people buy them. Buy what you like and don't waste engergy worrying about what you don't or what other people do. 

In the end the iconic engines are ones that will sell the highest numbers. You can see by why MTH is choosing to make that they are picking the biggest sellers to make first: Hudson, Challenger, GS-4, Big Boy, Triplex...


Raymond


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Mik on 19 Dec 2009 08:33 PM 
Can somebody please explain to me the logic of building a model of a prototype that only 1 road used, and only a handful were built? Wouldn't a Yellowstone or Challenger type be more broadly appealing, useful to more modelers and therefore possibly sell better?? 

No, I'm not trying to start a fight, I'm truly puzzled. Yes, I would pose the same argument against the Erie Triplex. 

I have always wondered the same thing about many of the models that come out. Most are of the obscure, almost one-offs, that were seldom seen. But apparenly us modelers want the unique engines, not the run-of-the-mill, everyday seen, ones. go fig.


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

Im going too answer this questoin but not tonight as it is Vodka Saturday ............. I will reply sooooooooon







Sorry my bad HE HE HE......


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## Chucks_Trains (Jan 2, 2008)

Raymond, That's what I always thought was 45lb. for the engine & 15lb. for the tender..Well kind of sort of rounded out to 60lbs of beautiful USA quality machinery...


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## Chucks_Trains (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By H-man on 19 Dec 2009 03:27 PM 
I wory about a derailment with this loco due to the expense and I would just cry to turn it over in the rocks. 

Howard in AZ 

Howard, You mean like this...


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## NTCGRR (Jan 2, 2008)

Everyone needs to call Ro and request 844 for the next run. its a must have.


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## Rayman4449 (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Chucks_Trains on 20 Dec 2009 07:07 AM 
Posted By H-man on 19 Dec 2009 03:27 PM 
I wory about a derailment with this loco due to the expense and I would just cry to turn it over in the rocks. 

Howard in AZ 

Howard, You mean like this...



















Chuck, was that picture taken on your outdoor layout?


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## paintjockey (Jan 3, 2008)

Who had the video of the big boy draggin' the mallet backwards to "long train"? I have a friend who said his mallet could outpull anything, that video shut him right up.


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## aceinspp (Jan 2, 2008)

I think that one happened on Marty's layout.







Later RJD


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## Rayman4449 (Jan 2, 2008)

hehe That was mine. It's on my website under the videos link. 

http://www.rayman4449.dynip.com/Hmmmm_2100kbs.wmv 


Raymond


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## Rayman4449 (Jan 2, 2008)

And if we're talking about my video, it was on my layout.


Raymond


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## Enginear (Jul 29, 2008)

Maybe not the right place to post but since diff models have been brought up... I would like for MTH to make an affordable Allegheny. I see the Accucraft but it's out of my league. How many would buy an MTH version? By the way I'm a diesel guy but I respect these monsters. Joe


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Me too, I want Aristo to make a Northern, and USAT to make more alcos and AML to make a SD7..

Greg

by the way:


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## tacfoley (Jan 3, 2008)

Posted By Greg Elmassian on 20 Dec 2009 02:07 PM 
Me too, I want Aristo to make a Northern, and USAT to make more alcos and AML to make a SD7..

Greg

by the way:












Greg - you and me, both, and a whole bunch of others, too Rex Ammerman makes a great job of converting a few for his friends, but a genuine factory job would be a lot easier to get hold of!!

To me, with my interests, the SP&S E-1 would be the ticket, but I'd allow that the Santa Fe's 3751 is a handsome beast, too. In fact ANY of the Baldwin Northerns ticks the boxes for me - imagine a GN S-2 in Glacier Park colour scheme - in 1/29th scale!

I'm going to have to go sit down in a dark room for a while.....

tac
www.ovgrs.org


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## stumpycc (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By paintjockey on 20 Dec 2009 08:22 AM 
Who had the video of the big boy draggin' the mallet backwards to "long train"? I have a friend who said his mallet could outpull anything, that video shut him right up. 



It wasn't to " Long Train ", it was to Brick House!!! Every time I hear the song Brick House, that image goes thru my mind.


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## Rayman4449 (Jan 2, 2008)

Cliff: LOL









Joe: I agree, I'd like to see one of those too. I've been trying to guess where they were going from here from a steam perspective and think they could go a number of directions. Not sure what the next best seller would be (after what's been made). Dreyfuss Hudson? They already know from their O guage line what's next in line in popularity. 

Since this has gotten off topic I hope Dave has gotten all of his questions answered.


Raymond


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## Chucks_Trains (Jan 2, 2008)

Raymond, That is an all time "Greatest Hits" video









Hmmm, I sure would like to see a Consolidation get produced in 1:29









Piss on those little engines as I vote for a USA Trains DD40X or any of the mighty U.P. Veranda Turbines but I suppose that I'll have to kitbash one out of a USA PA & B and a Big Boy tender..hmmm


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## Dave Meashey (Jan 2, 2008)

Gee, I could do a video like Raymond's, only in my case it would be my 1:24 HLW Dunkirk dragging my 1:20.3 Bachmann Heisler backwards. Big John may be ugly as sin, but he sure can pull.









David Meashey


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## Enginear (Jul 29, 2008)

Posted By Chucks_Trains on 20 Dec 2009 09:42 PM 


Piss on those little engines as I vote for a USA Trains DD40X or any of the mighty U.P. Veranda Turbines but I suppose that I'll have to kitbash one out of a USA PA & B and a Big Boy tender..hmmm








DD40X or Veranda
Yeah, that would be huugggggeee.







and Diesel too. Right up my alley. How much would that cost??? I'd have to fabricate from scratch and broken engines for my wallet. Joe


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## Santafe 2343 (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By paintjockey on 20 Dec 2009 08:22 AM 
Who had the video of the big boy draggin' the mallet backwards to "long train"? I have a friend who said his mallet could outpull anything, that video shut him right up. 
I'll tell you what, You bring the Big Boy and I'll bring the Mallet. I'll place a 20lb weight over each set of drivers on my Mallet and we'll see what happens then. Any bets on that one. I know the answer, because we tried it. It wasn't the Big Boy that won. Although we did break a KaDee coupler on our third try.
The video that your talking about isn't much to brag about. Its like a Kenworth pulling a Volkswagon weight wise.


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## Rayman4449 (Jan 2, 2008)

Good grief. 

The video had nothing to do with bragging rights I own both of these engines and like them both. When the MTH Big Boy was first released a good number of folks felt the Mallet would output it. After providing the weight data (I recall the Mallet weighed stock about 14.5lbs) and the MTH at 18lbs, plus provided that the Mallet having all metal drives with the MTH having 8 traction tires there was no way it could. Even provided drawbar pull tests which at the time the mallet pulled 2.5lbs avg (if I recall correctly) and the MTH 7lb 6oz avg and that still didn't convice some so I decided to pull one backwards and video it. If you have two engines of equal weight the one with traction tires will outpull the one that doesn't. It's one of the benefits of them and why some mfg use them so you don't have to put excessive amounts of weight on your engine to get it to pull the load. This is now set to become a traction tire debate which is not what's intended. We know some don't like them. 

The bottom line is the video was intended to have a little fun and try and settle the disagreement on which one would outpull the other right out of the box, that's all.


Raymond


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

Posted By Santafe 2343 on 21 Dec 2009 04:07 PM 


Posted By paintjockey on 20 Dec 2009 08:22 AM 
Who had the video of the big boy draggin' the mallet backwards to "long train"? I have a friend who said his mallet could outpull anything, that video shut him right up. 
I'll tell you what, You bring the Big Boy and I'll bring the Mallet. I'll place a 20lb weight over each set of drivers on my Mallet and we'll see what happens then. Any bets on that one. I know the answer, because we tried it. It wasn't the Big Boy that won. Although we did break a KaDee coupler on our third try.
The video that your talking about isn't much to brag about. Its like a Kenworth pulling a Volkswagon weight wise. 





Rex il take that bet, you know and i know that the bigboy will win period.... and i dont need to guess.........CARE TO TAKE MY BET??????????? i didnt think so............. you put 20 pounds on a mallet and it will fall in half........ that why they dont make them anymore rite, thats why at one time you could buy them all day long on ebay for 350.00 lot less than the Polkyman thought he could get for them. but when you build and sell crap you get a bad rep, so people dont buy your stuff RITE? RITE................ I think we should leave this topic alone now or some folks going to get there fellings hurt and it wont be me...........







Now ive been not bashing a certain company lately trying to be nice and all BUT now someone went and got me fired up again thanks a fringin lot and Merry FRIGIN Xmas. GAMES ON AGAIN


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

This is getting crazy guys! 

The thread is on the USAT Big Boy, and now we have people arguing about an MTH Big Boy vs. an Aristo mallet. 

I see a quote of a post about putting 40 pounds on an Aristo mallet, but the original post is gone/edited. 

I don't have a USAT Big Boy, nor an MTH one. I have an Aristo Mallet, and several drivers have slipped on their axles and it is gathering dust in storage. 

You might be able to put 40 pounds on an Aristo Mallet once, but the drivetrain would come apart in short order. Without cheating, locos of equal weight, but one with traction tires will win. 

Nick, don't get upset, just offer to "race" for pink slips! Whoever wins takes both loco home! 

Regards, Greg


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

I guess id be going home with 30 E8s for my junk yard diaroma........


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Actually, if you stuff the E8's with the originally designed weights (3 of the 2 pound lead ones) they pull pretty darn well, I was surprised. Of course the ones finally supplied were zinc and were half the weight of the originals (and twice the cost!) .... 

Yep, I don't think your big boy will be outpulled by anything right now! 

Greg


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

My dearest of Nicks.... time for a change of venue... 

This is not about the best of the best locos... we all know who that is...







Be confident here ... 


This is about SMILIES and before 2010 is out.... I will have your secrets. 

GG


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## dave2657 (Feb 25, 2008)

Hello again. Just wanted to let you know that you have answered my question (thanks for remembering me Raymond, I thought it had gotten side-tracked with all that debate going on). I have to agree with Chuck, it has got to be a Centennial or a Turbine next from USAT,that is natural progression,surely,lol..I actually sent them an e-mail some time ago asking if they had any plans to bring them out but I didn't get a positive response,pity. By the way I have taken the plunge and bought a USAT Bigboy, it is amazing. 

Finally, may I wish all of my fellow large-scalers a very Happy Christmas and a train-full New Year. 

dave2657


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

Posted By dave2657 on 22 Dec 2009 04:52 AM 
Hello again. Just wanted to let you know that you have answered my question (thanks for remembering me Raymond, I thought it had gotten side-tracked with all that debate going on). I have to agree with Chuck, it has got to be a Centennial or a Turbine next from USAT,that is natural progression,surely,lol..I actually sent them an e-mail some time ago asking if they had any plans to bring them out but I didn't get a positive response,pity. By the way I have taken the plunge and bought a USAT Bigboy, it is amazing. 

Finally, may I wish all of my fellow large-scalers a very Happy Christmas and a train-full New Year. 

dave2657 

Good for you , Enjoy it. its a sweet loco....


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