# Bash or Play



## Dave Hottmann (Jan 2, 2008)

Can we all play in the same sand box like good little steamaholics? An "A" toy is an "A" toy. The only bashing should be kit bashing


----------



## JEFF RUNGE (Jan 2, 2008)

In 4 pages of an Accucraft 4-4-0 thread, I did not read anyone but OWNERs say anything bad about Accucraft. But in a Aster BB thread we can't go one page without the Accucraft fans jumping on the chance to bash Aster, for of all things, they cost a little more. If you think Accucraft on a better deal because they are cheaper, fine, buy them, fix them, sell them, give them away, ship them 1/2 way around the world to have them up fitted, I don't care. But don't bash Aster to make your self feel better about your purchase. I don't mind paying a little more for Aster's quality.


----------



## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By Dave Hottmann on 08/05/2008 8:30 PM
Can we all play in the same sand box like good little steamaholics? An "A" toy is an "A" toy. The only bashing should be kit bashing" border=0>




The obvious answer is, "No". 

But, then, you haven't seen the result of my "kit bashing" either!/DesktopModules/NTForums/themes/mls/emoticons/sick.gif


----------



## JEFF RUNGE (Jan 2, 2008)

Looks like it's time to get out of the sand box.


----------



## Kovacjr (Jan 2, 2008)

But what about the people like me that own both Aster and Accucraft???? I'd own more Asters but there are none that match my Accucraft rolling stock....


----------



## dbwenrichjr (Jul 31, 2008)

Kovacjr, 

I am in the same boat as you. Although I only have one each...right now.  



I really dont see the point in preferring a specific manufacturer over another as most engines perform much differently than thier "brothers and sisters" in the same product lines. Fortunately I have had great success with the 2 engines I have bought so far. I have an Accucraft K-28, which in my opinion is AWESOME, although, it does have a short list of minor but fixable flaws. I also am in the process of building an Aster Mikado which I also think is AWESOME. However, in my opinion, it too has its small list of minor but fixable flaws. I have come to the conclusion that sometimes these companies produce a perennial All-Star, and then their next loco could be #1 draft pick BUST. You never know. 

But to me, I see no point in bashing another company and trying to discourage people from purchasing products of any specific manufacturer. Each company is different. The more the better to me. Because that means more locos and more toys to add to the roster! Plus with more competition, you would think that quality would improve, right?


----------



## Kurt Sykes (Feb 28, 2008)

I don't want to get out of the sandbox. 
Not when I can get help from Dave. 
Between my dad and I we have 9 Accucraft live steam locos, 
And I would not trade them for anything.( Except for a live steam Accucraft Big Boy)


----------



## Dan Pantages (Jan 2, 2008)

I didn't know Accucraft made a live steam Big Boy. :>) Kurt, we going to see you at Staver's in September?


----------



## NHSTEAMER (Jan 2, 2008)

OK GENTLEMAN. Don't you all think this has gone to far? I am a Happy owner of 6 Accucraft locomotives 1 Aster Locomotive and a small fortune of Accucraft rolling stock. I know that ALL!! of these locomotives have one problem or another. This is not to say that we should not talk about the problems and how to fix them, but this constant bashing is all that is being done. Let's please accept the fact that yes Accucraft has there problems (I myself have returned a loco) But so dose Aster! If you are a Aster snob then so be it! If are happy with your Accucraft then so be it! If you have a problem with either then lets use MLS for what it is meant for, and discuss the problem and how to fix it! NOT for this loco/your loco sucks! I for one am tired of this being the only subject on MLS. 
My two cents do with it as you please!


----------



## artgibson (Jan 2, 2008)

Bill 
That is the reason I post videos on MLS. It lets people see the engines run and leaves the imagination as to how they run so well to the individual. . As you have seen in the videos we have Aster's, Accucraft's, Roundhouse's, Argyle's ,Ed Hume's, 
Charlie Myner's(sic) and probably other's. We do not descriminate against any body so maybe we shud take heed and do the same on these threads. Nuff Said. Enjoy life and whatever you have to run except our ------.


----------



## vsmith (Jan 2, 2008)

As the proud owner of ZERO live steamers/DesktopModules/NTForums/themes/mls/emoticons/sad.gif, I think y'all should all count your *lucky stars* for the engines you DO have, warts and all.../DesktopModules/NTForums/themes/mls/emoticons/w00t.gif 

...'cause to po' folks like me, who have to beg for a $50 Mack, it sure sounds like a bunch of whining about whether this Ferrari is better than that Maserati or that model Porsche is a peice of junk.... /DesktopModules/NTForums/themes/mls/emoticons/crying.gif 

Back to under my rock... /DesktopModules/NTForums/themes/mls/emoticons/blink.gif


----------



## Havoc (Jan 2, 2008)

They should all make their own engines, then all faults are their own. Problem solved. They might actually be able to solve their own problems, who knows?


----------



## seadawg (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By gibs035 on 08/06/2008 9:30 AM
Bill 
That is the reason I post videos on MLS. It lets people see the engines run and leaves the imagination as to how they run so well to the individual. . As you have seen in the videos we have Aster's, Accucraft's, Roundhouse's, Argyle's ,Ed Hume's, 
Charlie Myner's(sic) *and probably other's. *We do not descriminate against any body so maybe we shud take heed and do the same on these threads. Nuff Said. Enjoy life and whatever you have to run except our ------.




Yes, there are others. I love my Regner engines. I build them from kits and have no one to blame by myself if they don't run properly when I'm finished. Now all I gotta do is figure out how to digitize my videos in the proper format to post on youtube. But that's more computer junk than I really want to do after working hours.


----------



## Kurt Sykes (Feb 28, 2008)

Yes Dan, 
I will be at Stavers 
I think it is a wonderful railroad. 
See ya there. 

Kurt


----------



## voxnut (Jul 16, 2008)

I'm probably too new to the live steam hobby to have an opinion, but with my other mechanical hobbies, at least in my experience, I have never come across the perfect machine. They all have their quirks and flaws, but to me that's part of what gives them character. 

I actually enjoyed sorting out the issues with my Ruby kit and it gave me a good opportunity to interact with many of you fine folks. Seems to me that it helps build the sense of community. Plus nothing ever seems like it's truly mine until I have some sweat equity in it. I wouldn't know what to do with something that is perfect right out of the box. With the building and sorting, the Ruby is certainly mine! ;-) 

As much as I admire the Asters, economic reality will probably keep me at the lower end of the Accucraft line. But that won't stop me from being a non-denominational steam-head and enjoying seeing everyone's stuff. 

Dean


----------



## insanerocketkid (Jan 2, 2008)

I agree with the notion that if you've issues with everyone's products, perhaps you might be better off making your own (or modifying your equipment to make it a better runner). 

I bought the ruby kit for the purpose of upgrading it a la Dave Hottman's bigger cylinders. I manufactured my own cylinders, installed them, and they work well. I have my ruby running quite well, and I have fun with it. It's at the point where I prefer to run it once a day and enjoy watchin 'er run and do a good job, then letting others play with their toys (sometimes I let the newbies run my Ruby -- but others such as Mr. Bowdler beat me to the punch, usually). 

If I weren't so busy building my 1" 0-4-0, club projects (such as a 20' long bridge, etc), I would build my own G'er. But as it is, I'm more attracted to the larger scale right now. 

Mike


----------



## Pauli (Jan 3, 2008)

Perhaps our experiences of different designs from different manufacturers, are very prototypical indeed! 

From what I have understood, reading about 1:1 steam locomotives, the various designs all had their quirky characteristics - and they were often not foreseen by the designers. Every once in a while, some unusually successful design would emerge. But trying to improve those successful designs, often failed. 

Also, I think every livesteamer agrees, getting to know and master your engine is a key part in the satisfaction we get from this hobby.


----------



## steam8hack (Feb 11, 2008)

In all attempts to cleanse those "negative" spirits that bedevil this forum, still there is the a very big elephant in the room no one ever wants to talk about - those pesky agendas. 

Hard to believe! Shocked some may be, or now realize they've been stepped on. Two things agenda pushers have a blind eye to, they always betray themselves repeating their pattern of delivery thread after thread, and pushers think they are clever and no one notices. 

Step out of the moment sometime and reread any previous thrashing thread, the same players are delivering the same stuff. And with so much history there is plenty of elephant dung to shovel. 

Agendas come in lots of disguises: the Trojan Horse; the magician's misdirection; damn with faint praise; anything positive make it suspect; trust me I have nothing to gain; I'm just looking out for...; I'm not knocking _____ ; "...it's not about _____ - it is; etc. 

Not everyone attacking has an agenda - some just hate. Of course, sadly, it's its own scheme, they want everyone to hate; a people, a country, or a company. 

And if you think there aren't any agendas, you've had the coolaid.


----------



## voxnut (Jul 16, 2008)

Okay, I'll bite... why would anyone have an agenda about toy trains? Not refuting your assessment, just puzzled at how toy train brands and ego or agendas get intertwined. Is the agenda to impress other people with how expensive/sophisticated/exclusive your toy is greater than just simply playing with your toy and your friends to amuse yourself?


----------



## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

It is often nothing more than an attempt to convince themselves that we really didn't waste our limited dollars buying what we have. Few have enough spare cash to get one of everything to see if which one is best for our own purposes, so we have to defend our ego by putting down that which we didn't happen to purchase. 

Then again, consider the nerds talking about the latest and greatest computers... one brags about how wonderful his new PC is and others will chime in with how much better their's is... then let someone complain about some deficiency and the same folk will chime in with a worse problem in their PC. It is often just a matter of "whut I gots is better'n your'n." 

What was that dog food jingle... 

"My dog's better'n your dog. 
My dog's better'n yours. 
My dog's better cuz he eats Kennel Ration, 
My dog's better'n yours." 

I often sang it a bit different, just to bug my neighbor... 

"My dog's better'n your dog. 
My dog's better'n yours. 
My dog's better cuz I ain't got one, 
My dog's better'n yours."


----------



## Steve S. (Jan 2, 2008)

Not everyone attacking has an agenda - some just hate. Of course, sadly, it's its own scheme, they want everyone to hate; a people, a country, or a company.

This is getting way too deep................../DesktopModules/NTForums/themes/mls/emoticons/blink.gif


----------

