# Pullman 2410 Truck



## Johnbergt (Sep 12, 2011)

Hello

Does anyone have any drawings or photos of the Pullman 2410 heavyweight Passenger Truck? I am designing trucks for 1.5 inch scale cars, and am having a hard time finding good plans that show the geometry of the trucks, and how all the parts worked together. I keep searching and finding pictures of trucks under cars, but never good enough pictures of the trucks themselves to get all the suspension components correct. Any help is appreciated. Thanks.


----------



## David Leech (Dec 9, 2008)

John,
In the Car Builders Cyclopedia 1916 is a drawing (top and side) of an earlier type truck with a wooden frame, but no builder mentioned.
The same drawing is in 100 Years of Railroad cars, but says that it is a Pullman Standard truck.
Except for the wooden frame, it does look very similar to the 2410.
In the 1925 Car Builders Cyclopedia is a drawing (top and side) of a truck built by the Bethlehem Shipbuilding Corporation, and to my eyes looks identical to the 2410.
Did Pullman actually build their own trucks, or were they contracted out I wonder.
I found a reference that the 2411 truck was built by Commonwealth.
Let me know if I can be of more help.
Merry Christmas,
David Leech, Delta, Canada


----------



## Johnbergt (Sep 12, 2011)

Hi David

Merry Christmas to you as well. I have found the drawings you refer too, but the big thing is they don't do a very good job of describing how things work, and what is connected to what, and what moves in which direction. It is especially difficult to tell from the pictures what component was attached to what. I am using SolidWorks to model it all, so when it's done, I can post some pictures and video.

I don't know if Pullman built their own trucks or not, or if that was just the model number they used to refer to them.


----------



## David Leech (Dec 9, 2008)

John,
I think that it is fairly straight forward really.
Two separate things are happening.
The frame is rigid with the journals sliding up and down in the pedestals.
The equalizers are resting on top of the journals and have the coil spring to provide downward pressure.
This pressure is at the ⅓ and ⅔ distance along the equalizer, so that the same total force is equal on all six journals.
The leaf springs are a separate part of the suspension which is holding the top plate and the side bearing arches assembly to the frame.
I hope that description helps.
Merry Christmas,
David Leech, Delta, Canada


----------



## Johnbergt (Sep 12, 2011)

David Leech said:


> John,
> Two separate things are happening.
> The frame is rigid with the journals sliding up and down in the pedestals.
> The equalizers are resting on top of the journals and have the coil spring to provide downward pressure.
> ...


That actually helps a lot. I have the frame rigid as you say, with the journals moving up and down. The equalizer bar rests on top of the journal. The coil spring takes the movement from the equalizer bar and passes it on to ?? Right now, I have it going back to the frame, is that correct?

How do the leaf springs come into play? That is the area I am still having issues with. Also, I have a swing link bolster design, which I believe the be correct, but maybe some of the geometry is wrong. I have attached a picture of what I have so far.


----------



## Gary Armitstead (Jan 2, 2008)

John,

I have been working on and building rolling stock and locomotives (BOTH steam and electric) for the past 36 years. The company you want to contact is Railroad Supply Corporation in Nashua, New Hampshire. Talk to Mike McClure who is the owner. Since Railroad Supply Corp. started doing business in 1970, they have sold 6-wheel trucks (Common Wealth) for heavy-weight passenger cars. They also sold a complete set of heavy weight cars including 85 ft. coaches, 72 ft. baggage and a 80 ft. observation. I believe they still sell these cars and trucks. They used to sell these trucks and car parts in fit form. Many years ago, the heavy wieght passenger cars were sold RTR for about $8000 to $10,000 each. I have a 1980 catalog from RRSC when they were still located here in Burbank, CA. If I can find the catalog, I can scan the pages that have the photos and price lists of the cars and trucks. They are pricey. Most on this forum who model in 1/29, 1/20.3 and 1/32 will have major sticker shock when they see what those prices are. In 1980, a set of heavy weight, 6-wheel trucks were shown as $1600 a pair. Judging from inflation 35 years later with items I have purchased from him in the past six months, you are looking at over $3000 a pair or one car! The nice part is that he has prints available for these trucks and you might talk him into selling a set to you to make your own OR to use some of his castings as part of your design. I try to call him to make my orders from California, at about 3:30 pm PST (6:30 pm EST) He answers the phone himself. You can also talk to him on weekends at that same time. Tell him I suggested for you to call him and discuss this. Great guy to deal with. He runs the company along with his son. His daytime job is a fireman with the Nashua Volunteer Fire Department. Here is the link to his website.

http://www.railroadsupply.com/

Quite a few of the items he sells, such as rolling stock parts (trucks, couplers and detail parts are NOT shown online. You would have to talk to him about these things. BUT the items are still available because I still buy caboose marker lamps and locomotive classification lamps from him (bought my last three sets of them from him about two months ago). He also has cast aluminum box car/refrigerator car ends available to scratch-build these cars and also cast aluminum ends for gondolas to build your own riding cars.


----------



## Johnbergt (Sep 12, 2011)

Hi Gary

Sticker shock is a real thing. That is why I am looking at making my own trucks, a little more basic, I guess, with flat stock, etc to keep some of the costs down. Thanks for the referral.

John


----------



## Gary Armitstead (Jan 2, 2008)

Johnbergt said:


> Hi Gary
> 
> Sticker shock is a real thing. That is why I am looking at making my own trucks, a little more basic, I guess, with flat stock, etc to keep some of the costs down. Thanks for the referral.
> 
> John


Like I said, he might be able to sell you the prints for his trucks and then possibly use some of his castings to help you fabricate the more difficult parts of your trucks (pedestals, journal boxes, etc.) and then use flat stock to do the more easily self-fabricated parts yourself. If your buy his rough cast wheels and do the lathe work yourself, you can save a bunch of money. He also sold at one time the aluminum sides for these heavy-weights. Also the cast aluminum ends for the cars including the clerestory roof end sections. They were very nice castings. W have four or five sets of these heavy-weights owned by some members of Los Angeles Live Steamers on the facility now.


----------



## David Leech (Dec 9, 2008)

Hi John,
Okay, you are missing a part!
The coil springs allow for the suspension of the wheels just as you have it.
Remember to get the ⅓ and ⅔ distances accurate.
The leaf springs are the suspension of the car itself onto the truck.
So, where you have the 'plate' suspended by the swing links directly, there is no suspension.
The swing links should be longer and go to a lower plate, and then the top plate has the leaf springs between the two.
Check the books again (if you have them - if not send me a pm) and there are similar cross sections that should make this clear.
Merry Christmas,
David Leech, Delta, Canada


----------



## Johnbergt (Sep 12, 2011)

Hello David

Thank you for the missing link. I will be busy drawing tonight, while waiting on Santa to swing by. Merry Christmas!

John


----------



## Gary Armitstead (Jan 2, 2008)

David Leech said:


> Hi John,
> Okay, you are missing a part!
> The coil springs allow for the suspension of the wheels just as you have it.
> Remember to get the ⅓ and ⅔ distances accurate.
> ...


John,

This is EXACTLY why you need the prints from Railroad Supply! Just sayin". Try not to "re-invent the wheel". You can easily back yourself into a "corner". It CAN cost you time AND MONEY!


----------



## Johnbergt (Sep 12, 2011)

well, here it is, with the missing piece now added in, and everything makes perfect sense now. Thank you again for the help.


----------



## David Leech (Dec 9, 2008)

Merry Christmas John,
Looks quite correct to me.
Now you just have to build them.
All the best,
David Leech, Delta, Canada


----------

