# ESC for large scale use?



## Chompers (Jan 8, 2008)

I am looking into battery powering my LGB and Bachman Moguls. the track cleaning with electrics and live steam is just no fun 

I already own a Spectrum Dx7, and plan on using it for this conversion, along with the battery systems i have for my Rc airplanes. specifically lion cells


my quesstion is about the ESC for this instilation. I cannot find an ESC that will handle the voltages need to operate a large scale train.

The over all wattage is not high, qround 100 watts max, but the unusually high voltages (higher than most rc vehicles) required is making the search quite difficult.


My question to everyone here is what Electronic Speed Controller With BEC are you using?



Any information to point me in the right direction would be appreciated

Thanks
Philip 


oh and slightly off topic, about how many Amp hours for a battery should i be looking for? at 2 amps a 4 amp-hour battery would last 2 hours, not very long....


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## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

Chompers - If you've already got the Spektrum radio, check out RCS's "Beltrol" system--designed specifically for that R/C system. Look in the "News" forum here. It will do speed, direction, sound, etc. From the description, pretty slick. I've not used it personally, but those who have seem pleased with it. I looked into using car/plane/boat ESCs for trains not too long ago pursuing a wild idea, and basically got laughed out of the hobby shop. They're far too coarse of control for what we want in the garden. 

As for batteries, what are you pulling to draw 2 amps continuous through either the B'mann or LGB mogul? I run both, with sound, and don't draw anywhere near that much. For example, I've gotten 7+ hours run time on a 4.4 a/h battery on my LGB mogul. My B'mann mogul will run for two to three hours on its 1.6 a/h batteries. 

Later, 

K


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## Del Tapparo (Jan 4, 2008)

G-Scale Graphics (me) will be releasing the 2.4GHZ Enhanced RailBoss any day now (Still working on the manual). You will be able to use your present Spektrum radio and a receiver of your choice; the AR500 works well. In additiion to speed control with momentum functions, direction control, directional lighting, and manual sound triggers, you can also enjoy automated station stops and randomization of your sound system. I should have all the details on my website in the next day or so. Input voltage range is 8-30 volts. Motor driver is PWM, 5amps. If you look at the present 75MHZ Enhanced RailBoss, all of the electrical specs will be the same. The biggest improvement is the use of the super reliable and low cost 2.4GHZ radios now becoming available.

Your current draw will be about 1 amp or less, so 4000 mah will last you 3-4 hours at least. Here is what I use now ... Li-Ion Batteries


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## pagosarr (Jan 5, 2008)

Think this is as good a time and place as any to ask: what is an ESC? 

I have been following forums related to RC/battery power and haven't been able to determine what an ESC is. 

I am wanting to abandon track power for battery power and have been looking forward to the release of the 2.4GHZ Enhanced RailBoss in hopes that it would be the most current solution for RC/battery power applications. 

Is there a primer somewhere on RC/battery power that would describe what an ESC is (and perhaps other items I'm uninformed about)? 

Many thanks. 

Roger Bush 
Texas Hill Country


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## Del Tapparo (Jan 4, 2008)

Roger - An ESC is an "Electronic Speed Control". It takes the signals from a radio control receiver which are normally used to control servos directly, and instead converts them into a signal suitable for driving a DC motor directly. In model aircraft, the servos rotate to the position commanded from the transmitter and move linkages, which in turn move the control surfaces ( rudder, elevator, aeilrons, etc.). The ESCs designed for model cars and aircraft have unique requirements best suited for those applications, and not necessarily good for control of model trains. Hence, finding something designed specifically for large scale trains, such as the 2.4GHZ RailBoss, and others, is likely to lead to the most satisfaction in the long run.

It has been busy around here, but I hope to have the manual done and up on the web site tomorrow. Selling price will be $107 for the RailBoss control board (ESC), 4 Rx cables, and 1 reed switch. Customer must supply their own 2.4GHZ radio system. For the time being, I am recommending the Spektrum DX5E/AR500 combo ($99). However, a lower cost alternative which works quite well is the Hobby King 2.4GHZ 4 or 6 channel radios.About $30 for both a transmitter and receiver! (Hard to beat). 


Edit: As to "most current solution". Yes, in terms of real time, but you will need to examine each system out there closely to determine exactly which one you want. They all have unique features. Mine can't do some of the things others can do, and vice versa.


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## TonyWalsham (Jan 2, 2008)

Hello Roger.

You might also like to check out my BELTROL R/C website for a range of ESC's suitable for use with 2.4 GHz R/C.

There is a beginners page with a glossary of commonly used terms. R/C Beginners page.


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## pimanjc (Jan 2, 2008)

Chomper,
I have been field testing the Beltrol system from RCS for a couple of months. It is very smooth, responsive, and versitle. I have tested range up to 180 feet. My F3 has an RCS 9A ESC installed. It powers both the A and B unit. It has pulled 25 freight cars or 9 heavyweights around a layout full of curves and grades.










I have posted two threads in this Battery forum illustrating the Beltrol system. There is a video link posted from Youtube in one of the threads. 

This train will be run at Marty's this weekend.

Link to previous thread: *Beltrol video*

Jim C.


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## pagosarr (Jan 5, 2008)

Del Tapparo - Thanks for your reply. Your response clears up several problems I have had. I am familiar with those little DC servo motors which controlled rudders, etc., from decades past when I flew RC planes - but never was able to make the transition of the application of ESC to the world of trains. Maybe I'm not the brightest porch light on the block - but at age 76 I'm trying hard. I'm not thrilled about playing trains on the ground anymore and would rather sit in a chair with a Bud Lite and a remote control. So I'll look forward to your announcements. 

Later, Roger Bush


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## Chompers (Jan 8, 2008)

Posted By Del Tapparo on 22 Sep 2009 01:20 PM 
G-Scale Graphics (me) will be releasing the 2.4GHZ Enhanced RailBoss any day now (Still working on the manual). You will be able to use your present Spektrum radio and a receiver of your choice; the AR500 works well. In additiion to speed control with momentum functions, direction control, directional lighting, and manual sound triggers, you can also enjoy automated station stops and randomization of your sound system. I should have all the details on my website in the next day or so. Input voltage range is 8-30 volts. Motor driver is PWM, 5amps. If you look at the present 75MHZ Enhanced RailBoss, all of the electrical specs will be the same. The biggest improvement is the use of the super reliable and low cost 2.4GHZ radios now becoming available.

Your current draw will be about 1 amp or less, so 4000 mah will last you 3-4 hours at least. Here is what I use now ... Li-Ion Batteries


do you think you could send me some more information on how your system opperates?
espexcially on how it interfaces with the TX?
This system seems promicing


my email address is: 


ptifone @ gmail . com 

with out any spaces thanks


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## Chompers (Jan 8, 2008)

My 2 ah figure was really pulled out of thin air, i guess my invovemnet in RC aircraft has really distorted my view about how much power is needed to move things. the general rule of thumb is 140 watts/ ounce makes for good flying. so every thing in RC aircraft tends to pull quite a few amps  
The main reason i wish to stick with the dx7 is that i am quite fermiliar with it, and not to mention that it provides 1024-bit resolution for each channel : responce is quite nice.



that is good new that my mogul will run an entire day on a single charge, but hey its also good to know that for a meager 1K i can get a 40,000 amp hour 14.4 volt battery, i might never need to recharge  

i have been looking around for other ESC and although i have found a few that fit the bill i am not about to spend $250+ on a 500 AMP esc, for that price i might as well get one of the fully featured controllers posted above. 


BUT after looking at the two systems above i am thurally confused. i am trying to distimguish which systems have which features, and how they are integrated. as for programming features like constant brightness on the head lights , it seams that neither of these systems offer it. 


but hey if any one finds a cheep and worth wile solution please let me know.


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## TonyWalsham (Jan 2, 2008)

Hello Chompers. 
Directional constant brightness lights are an optional extra with the BELTROL ALPHA series. Thes ALPHA series are offered that way to keep the cost down. For example, the AL-3r is about US$70 plus radio. 
BELTROL OMEGA series ESC's do have constant brightness directional lighting built into the hardware. There is also a PnP version for use in AristoCraft and Bachmann locos fitted with the PnP socket. 
Perhaps if you could outline what you need to "fit the bill" we could more easily advise you what is the most suitable ESC for your purposes.


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## Del Tapparo (Jan 4, 2008)

Chompers - The manual and website info for the 2.4GHz Enhanced RailBoss is now complete and available on-line. Click here for info.

The RailBoss provides for directional lighting (front/rear) using either incandescent lamps, controlled by the RailBoss, but powered from the battery; or LEDs powered from a RailBoss current source (thus, there is no need to add external resistors). You will also find opto-isolated sound trigger outputs, which allow you to interface directly to any sound system with reed switch inputs.


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