# Puzzled by qsi lighting



## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

So I finally got a bunch of qsi titans. First the screw terminals are great. The stereo sound effect is cool.

But the lighting options are driving me nuts. I can't figure out how to map a light to a funtion.

I managed to set it up so the headlight and the lights above the number plates (not sure what those are called. I'm more of a steam guy) both light up in response to the headlight function key, FO. Now I'd like to be able to light the cab and the number plates independently, say, for example F3 for the number plates and F4 for the cab light. 

I can't figure out ow to do that, and what's more, I can't figure out what function keys turn on any of the other lights or any of the other lighting groups.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

What outputs do you have connected? Specifically which one for the cab light and which one for the number plates? 

What programming did you do to connect those outputs to F3 and F4? 

(by the way, F3 and F4 are already assigned, why not use higher number functions?) 


Greg


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

Greg, I have the headlight and marker light connected as shown in the manual, and they work on FO. I connected the cab light as shown, but could not figure out what function key triggered it. I still can't. Also it kept trying to be a rotating beacon. 

I never managed to get anything mapped to F3 or F4--I can't figure out how to map the functions.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Are you using the latest manual? The one that works for all units including the Titan? 

The diagrams I have do not indicate which port the cab light is on... which terminal did you use? or the led number, or the port number... 

Greg


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

I'm using the manual that came with the decoder, which is this one:

http://www.qsisolutions.com/pdf/Tit..._Rev_B.pdf 

The headlight is in terminals 4 and 6 of the strip with the motor terminals (J1A), and the marker lights, following the diagram, are in 8 on the strip with the speaker terminals (J2A), and 11 on J3.

The cab light I've been putting into J2 #11 and J3 #11.

There's no indication of what function triggers the cab light, or any other light. And there's no indication at all of how to map them. On CV Manager, the function map page is grayed out and inaccessible


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

Also Greg thanks for taking the time to work on this


The only Quantum programmer manual on the QSI website is form 2008.


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## krs (Feb 29, 2008)

The poor documentation by QSI has come up in this forum before. 

With all the capabilities QSI has built into the Titan, good, clear and accurate documentation is more important than ever and that is unfortunately sadly lacking at this time. 
I wonder if QSI is addressing that issue. 

Function mapping is a pretty basic procedure for any DCC decoder installation; I don't see any clear description how to do that on the Titan in any of the on-line documentation either. 

The latest full QSI Reference Manual I see on line is this one: 

NMRA DCC Reference Manual 
for 
QSI Quantum® FX, Q2, and Q1 Equipped Locomotives 
Version 5.0.2 For Firmware Versions 7 and 8 7-September-2011 

But it's not really clear if that is the latest and covers the TRitan. 


I suppose one can always do what QSI recommends if there is a question: 

"At QSI Solutions we pride ourselves in offering our unequaled Customer support. If you need help please call 800-671-0641" 


Knut


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

Yes, I've always thought they need to hire an English major or two. 

The manual that came with the titans said nothing at all about function mapping, and of course I've done it many many times before with other decodes. One of the things I'd like to try is the fan driven smoke generator, but there's no way to tell how you'd turn the smoke on and off, and there's no apparent way to set the function button.


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

So I posted my problem on the QSI yahoo forum and got this response from Lee Wheelbarger:

"Go to the Ports tab, and change your ports. Keep in mind that you must> cycle the power after you make your changes, before they will take affect.> Have you been able to watch the videos from the NMRA?? Those videos cover> everything that you need to know on how to program a QSI Emulator." 


I have no idea what to do with this. I have no idea what the relation of "ports" to function buttons is, and I have no idea what video he is referring to. I've never had to deal with "ports" before. Is a "port" the same as a function button? I did mess with the "ports," but you can't have two things assigned to a single por, while with most decoders you can assign multiple things to a single function button

Sigh.... I really want to like QSI. In so many ways it's an excellent product. But it's been TWO YEARS in development and they can't still explain how to do something that's dead simple with other decoders?

Seriously, QSI, go hire an English major. They work for cheap. But get somebody who has experience with simple explanations!


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## krs (Feb 29, 2008)

Writing a good manual is not easy. 
We hire competent external writers who are NOT very technical, give them a product to work with and the engineering documentation. 
That was the only way we ended up with decent documentation for ourproducts (nothing to do with DCC or trains) 

I'm sure Lee meant well referring you to the NMRA video, but that is not really a solution even if it explains everything needed to program the Titan decoder.


BTW - Part 1 of the YouTube video is here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z0isUAPu7DI

You need to search around for the next parts - they are just called Part 2 NMRA etc., no mention of QSI or Titan in the title.
I also couldn't find part 6, part 5 jumps to part 7 and then I thought there would be a part 8 since part 7 doesn't seem like the end of the presentation, but after part 7, part 1 came up again.

If the video answers your questions I can't tell - too much marketing hype in the video, I wasn't patient enough to go through the whole set completely to see if they explain how to do function mapping.


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

That was my reply to Lee--thank you, but do I need to wade through 2 hours of video to find something that's dead simple with most decoders? 

As someone whose published two books on complex subjects, i understand how hard it is to write and express complex ideas and procedures simply. I also know it can be done. You'd think the two years this was in production would have been enough time to get something written. I'll try calling them tomorrow, see if I can can a simple answer. 

Odd that Greg has not replied


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Mike... I have never gotten you to say you read my page on my site.... if you did, you would probably know that ports are connected to outputs... in fact this is common terminology in DCC decoders. 

And what he said is not completely accurate... there are other ways. 

The NMRA video he speaks of is a talk he gave in multiple videos... 

Anyway, READ my page... you are almost becoming obstinate...really... 

So another question you did not answer is where did you connect the cab and number board lights... just give me the pin number on the connector... I asked that before and you did not tell me either. 

Also, come to think of it, you never replied to me asking you if you were using the newest and latest manual.. 

I'm trying to help you but so far you have taken NONE of my advice. 

Greg


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

Greg, I've read your page several times, in great detail. You can rest assured that before I ever post a question here, I've looked at your site. It's an extremely valueable resource. 

I think that what seems clear to you is not always clear to your readers. I am deeply grateful for the information you post but I saw nothing there that spoke to my problem. If you could point me to the relevant text I would be very grateful. 

I've never seen "ports" used before. It may indeed be common in some circles, but I dn't recall seeing it in the manuals of NCE, Digitrax, lenz or ESU or, for that matter, QSI. For what it's worth, below is pasted, as far as I could tell, the information on your site pertaining to my issue with the Titan. I simply cannot make use of it: I have ZERO idea what the relation between a "port" and a function button is. I'm happy to chalk this up to ignorance on my part, but as mentioned, I've managed to remap the functions on dozens of decoders before. 


"Lighting port control: 
Diesel: Need to double check steam but this perfectly matches the Titan 
U configuration for diesel so I assume it will be the same for steam. 
Will confirm shortly.
The LED number on the drawings matches the port number in the documentation.
Port 1: HL
Port 2: RL
Port 3: Front Mars
Port 4: Rear Mars
Port 5: Front Left DL
Port 6: Front Right DL
Port 7: Rear Left DL
Port 8: Rear Right DL
Port 9: Front OHBL (set for strobe)
Port 10: Rear OHBL (set for strobe)
Port 11: Not assigned by default (need to modify for smoke use)
Port 12: Not assigned by default (=)


Steam:
Verified same as Titan U.
Port 1: HL
Port 2: RL
Port 3: Front Mars
Port 4: Front number boards
Port 5: Front Markers
Port 6: Rear Markers
Port 7: Front cab light
Port 8: Rear cab light
Port 9: Firebox 1
Port 10: Firebox 2
Port 11: Not assigned by default
Port 12: Not assigned by default.

As I had mentioned all the lights are grouped into multiple light sets. 
We have 3 assignable sets.

Multiple Lights 1 is controlled by F0 and contains:
Steam:
Headlight
Reverse Light
Mars Light
Diesel:
HL
RL
Mars Light (front and rear)
Ditch Lights (front and rear)
OHBL (front and rear)

Multiple Lights 2 is not assigned to a function by default (was F11 on 
Q1a before support for alternate horn was added) and contains:
Steam:
Front Number Boards
Marker Lights (front and rear)
Diesel:
Number Boards (front and rear)
Marker Lights (front and rear)

Multiple Lights 3 is not assigned to a function by default (was F12 in 
previous versions until support for smoke was added) and contains:
Steam:
Cab Lights (front and rear)
Firebox lights 1&2
Diesel:
Cab Lights (front and rear)

If you'd like to assign these to functions we have F16-25 with nothing assigned to them currently. We can certainly start using these functions if you like.

The default behavior for the cab light is to come on automatically if the locomotive is in NFF/NFR. After accelerating the cab light will stay on for 10 seconds and then fade out. The behavior works in reverse when you come to a stop, the light will remain off until the loco has been stopped for 10 seconds and then come on bright. There is no discreet control over the cab light unless it is assigned by the user.

There is no discrete function to turn on or off the fire. We're operating under the real world idea that if the loco is fired up, the firebox is glowing. You can change the programming to give it a button to turn it on and off, but again, seems a little unrealistic."


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## krs (Feb 29, 2008)

Posted By Greg Elmassian on 20 Aug 2012 05:48 PM 
Mike... I have never gotten you to say you read my page on my site.... if you did, you would probably know that ports are connected to outputs... in fact this is common terminology in DCC decoders.

"Port" - common termnology in DCC decoders?

If you look in the QSI Diesel Sound Installation and Operation Manual Rev B: 8/9/12, the word "port" does not show up even a single time, at least my pdf search tool couldn't find it.
Neither is it a common term when it comes to DCC decoders.

In any case, I still can't follow the explanation.

Greg - on your web site for the diesel loco you state for example that the Rear Right Ditch Light is connected to port 8.
In the QSI diesel manual, there are no port designations to start with, but also the Rear Right Ditch Light is connected to p[in 4 of J3 in the decoder diagram.

Where does the "port" come in and how does port 8 as an output relate to J3 terminal 4?

Knut


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## krs (Feb 29, 2008)

Ha.... 

Just found the word "port" in a table in the Diesel manual. 

It's shown as CPU Port # LED 8

Brings up the next question - why do I care about a CPU port number - that's internal to the decoder - or it should be.
I'm guessing here but I bet this is somehow related to function mapping.


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

Knut, thanks for confirming my sense of reality. I've never seen "port" used before in this context, and can't get any sense of the relationship between a "port" and function mapping. There is nothing whatsoever in the manuals that explains anything about ports or about function mapping. 

I finally managed to get a cab light by using one of the mars light setting. But now it goes on and off with the headlights, not a good arrangement. I suspect, from Greg's page, that you can't get manual control of the cab light, you can only have it come on when the loco is in neutral. I could not get it to behave as a cab light though--it kept flashing like a rooftop beacon. I suspect that the cab light function is only for Steam? 

I couldn't get number board lights to work at all. It's not clear it the listed 200 ohm resistor is for each led, or for two in series. Neither way worked. 



Greg has this on his page:

*Multiple Lights 2 is not assigned to a function by default* (was F11 on 
Q1a before support for alternate horn was added) and contains:
Steam:
Front Number Boards
Marker Lights (front and rear)
Diesel:
Number Boards (front and rear)
Marker Lights (front and rear)


Ok, so all I want to know is, how do I assign it to a function? 

It's been two years. There's a lot to like about the decoders--they sound great. But in terms of documentation, I'd have to say they are not ready for prime time.


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

I went back down to the workshop, rebooted my computer into windows, and took another look. I got the cab light isolated and working, but only in tandem with the headlights. There is absolutely no apparent relationship between "ports'"and function numbers. I tried assigning the cab light to various ports but no luck. I did some searching on the Yahoo group and yes, ports ave to do with mapping the lighting outputs, but I could find no clear answers.

If I ever figure out this cab light thing, I've got a couple of smoke generators I'd like to try. But I have zero idea how I'd assingn them to a function button


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## krs (Feb 29, 2008)

Well, I sure hope QSI does something about their documentation real quick. 
It would be a shame if people get so pissed off trying to get their Titan decoders to work that they stop buying them. 
It looks like a very capable unit and a bit more competition in the Large Scale sound decoder area never hurt. 

But it doesn't look as if anyone at QSI even read through the Diesel manual before it went to print. 
The English sentence structure in part sounds like the manual was translated from a different language which I rather doubt, but there are also obvious unnecessary duplications like the bottom og page 3 where reference to the fan voltage and current draw is made twice in the same section....and why the comments about mounting it into an HO loco, none of those require 6-10 amp motor current which is where the fan is required according to the table on that same page. 

As to your question - the 200 ohm resistor is for one LED in series. Since QSI also specifies that one can use a 5 volt incandescent bulb, the output driving the LED I assume is 5 volts and if you need to connect two LEDs in series you can calculate the required resistor value. I don't really understand why QSI is suggesting a 20ma bulb considering the outputs are rated at 2.5 amps. 

As to assigning function keys to control the various lights - yes, it does sound that certain lights are permanently grouped and some lights can't be controlled at all via function keys. 
I'm not sure how one for instance would be able to control the colour of the marker lights from white to green to red as needed. Easy enough to change the colour of the light itself but no way to control the colour via the QSI decoder it seems. 

Knut


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

OK guys, so I ask several things and no one answers. Sorry to sound grouchy, but there is a lot of whining and very little reading of the manual... 

You need to look at the new all in one manual... the small manuals are for getting started... to do more sophisticated functions and understand outputs, functions, and everything you NEED TO LOOK AT THE MANUAL I SPECIFIED SEVERAL TIMES... THE BIG ONE ON THEIR SITE THAT IS FOR ALL QSI... 

I am going to post that link... it is CLEARLY designated on the downloads page, under General as the "Full DCC Reference Manual For All QSI Decoders " 

http://www.qsisolutions.com/pdf/QuantumDCCRefManual_5_0_2.pdf 

In there it talks about function remapping, etc. 

The port numbers are the same as the LED numbers, AGAIN on my page in the drawing... 

This is sort of like buying a Ferrari, and then complaining that the owners manual in the glove box does not have the torque specs for the intake manifold if you change to a different type. 

RTFM... 

Then I will be happy to help, since I have asked the same questions over and over and not gotten answers... 

Remapping function buttons that are already in use is not something most people should do... they are already defined with some sounds... 

I would advise FIRST looking at what the default mapping is. Then decide on which function buttons... and since you have a NCE, you can pick some of the higher, unused functions... then you map that light port to the physical output (although if you pick it right you won't have to), then map a function button to it, and lastly you can play with lighting effects if you want. 

Greg


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

Greg, what questions have you asked over and over that have not gotten answers? 

The ferrari comparison is absurd. I'm not looking for anything complicated, I'm looking for something like HOW TO TURN THE SMOKE GENERATOR ON AND OFF. Why would you ship a decoder, and a manual, which shows _how to hook up a smoke generator _BUT NOT HOW TO TURN IT ON? It's as if the ferrari manual didn't explain how to unlock the doors, and the doors were unlocked by some complex procedure that was only available in a 350 page manual. 

Remapping function buttons isn't hard on other decoders, and it's explained in the manuals that come with other decoders. Apparently with QSI its something you say "I shouldn't really do." 

I shouldn't really use the smoke generator feature? I shoudn't try to establish manual control of the cab light? Are you seriously advancing that as an argument? 

An again, I love your site. It's the first place i go. But your site DOES NOT EXPAIN HOW TO DO WHAT I WANT TO DO. I'm not bothered by that: your site is a generous gift and it's not obliged to answer all questions. But there's no reason to get annoyed with me because it doesn't have the answer.

Now I'm off to read the 358 page manual, in order to try and do something which, again, is dead simple in other decoders. 

But in the meantime, what questions have you asked that I have not answered?


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

Ok, so it turns out the manual you specified IS NOT the manual i need to answer my question, according to page 18:
 
 


"Lights and other features can be assigned to function keys and configured to different kinds of operation and initial conditions in CV 53 (Output Feature Assignment) and CV 55 (QSI Feature Configuration). See the Quantum DCC Reference Manual, version 4."




The Quantum decoders, in large scale, didn't support lighting functions. But now I'm going to try to find that manual, and read it. 
 
OOPS! That manual, "Quantum DCC Reference Manual, version 4" can't be found on the QSI Solutions website!
 
For interested persons, pages 59-60 of the manual Greg linked to above give kind of an explanation of function mapping. It's not very clear. I'll be reading it for the next hour or so, till it's time to go to work. There's this:
 


The NMRA standard provides for fourteen Outputs, numbered from 1 to 14. CV’s 33 through 46 specify which Function Input is connected to which Output. 











"Note: Q2 firmware built after 1-June-08 does not support CV’s 33-46. The following fixed mapping is used: FL(f) -> Output 1 











FL(r) -> Output 2











F1 -> Output 3 ...









F12 ->Output14" 









 
 
 

I'm going to give up on trying to control the cab light, and just go with QSI's automatic implementation. This is too much of a PITA
 
But I'd still like to know how to turn the smoke generator on and off, by assigning that function to a function key. And I still can't find the answer. QSI's manual is not written clearly enough. From Greg's page, WHICH I HAVE READ MULTIPLE TIMES., it appears that the smoke generator shares the same state as the number boards lights, that is, always on


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## krs (Feb 29, 2008)

That DCC reference manual version 5 is actually mentioned at least twice in the Diesel manual that came with the Titan decoder. 
But the reference is buried in the text and the reference also isn't mentioned when looking at the light set up in the manual that came with the decoder. 

I had actually looked at it a few times but then decided because it was almost a year old and had no reference to the Titan decoders anywhere, it wasn't the updated general QSI manual to use - that there was either a newer one or a different one for the Titan. 

As was mentioned a few times in this thread and months ago in other threads, the QSI documentation is a mess. 
That the DCC Reference manual is part and parcel of the required documentation for the new Titan should be spelled out right at the beginning of the Diesel manual that came with the decoder. 

As to function mapping, it's a bit hard to believe that QSI doesn't support function mapping via CV33 to 46 considering that this has been the "standard" for DCC since day one....but there is CV 53 which seems to have taken on that function - just a lot more complex.


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

On page 60, the version 5 manual directs you to "appendix VI" for more information on the interaction of function buttons and ports. But when you go to appendix five, it turns out to be about wiring blocks under DC!


Here's what it say at the bottom of page 50:



"50 See Appendix VI Interaction of Function Keys, Function Groups, Function Inputs and Outputs and Feature Assignments for additional technical explanation."



Then here's what you see at appendix VI




"Appendix VI
Application Notes:
Using DC Power Conversion for Block Signal Control"




The manual has been a great help!


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## Del Tapparo (Jan 4, 2008)

Greg - As a Psuedo (perhaps unofficial) representative of this product and company, you have a lot to learn about customer relations. It doesn't matter if the customer has read the manual or not. You don't help them by telling them to RTFM ! You just piss them off and lose a customer. You tell them what they need to know, and then you may point out where to find this same information in the manual. 

I know you will say you don't represent them, but this whole thing has just been one big promotional advertisement from the git-go. Now that is takes a wrong turn, you turn on your defense and start repremending those that can't read and understand from an apparently poorly written manual, what you already know.


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

It seems worth pointing out there is no entry in the version 5 index for "port" or "ports." Nor is there an entry for "smoke" or "smoke generator."

There is a table, starting on p. 113, which describes functions which can be reassigned. It seems to suggest, on p. 114, that the cab light can't be reassigned, and can only work in automatic. On Greg's page, the firebox light is described as working the same way. No mention of a smoke generator.


Greg, I'm gong to stick with my earlier conclusion: not ready for prime time. The manual has offered me no comprehensible explanation. IF there is an explanation, could you point mne to the right page(s)?

I like the decoder a lot--it sounds great, the stereo feature works, there are some nice new tweak available, some of the lighting options are great. But it's increasingly clear that there are a bunch of things you can't do, or at least can't do without having access to some other information than is provided in the manual. 




It's especially irritatting to be told "RTFM" and then find out that the manual in fact does not answer the question, and makes references to sections which don't exist.


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## SteveC (Jan 2, 2008)

Mike

In the DCC Reference Manual v5.0.2 at the following location you'll find additional information on the mapping of Function (Fnn) keys to outputs.
[*] Section 4 - Page 59
[*] CV’s 33-46: Output Locations
[*] Page 60 (5th paragraph) you'll find the following reference

"On modern decoders, even those features that do require external wires, such as lights and smoke generators, are not necessarily “hardwired” to any particular Output. Outputs are now virtual and can be connected internally by firmware in the Quantum microprocessor to any physical driver, such as a power output for a lamp or a controller for a smoke generator. The connection between a virtual output and a physical feature is called a control port or simply “port”. For consistency with NMRA definitions, virtual outputs are called simply “outputs”."
[/list]


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

Steve, thank you, I have read that section several times and mentioned it several posts back. It is not still not clear how you assign an output to a function key. The relevant page in QSI's CV Manager software is not operable


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## krs (Feb 29, 2008)

Steve - 

Mike's point was that there is no entry for the term port in the * index * 

It seems worth pointing out there is no entry in the version 5 index for "port" or "ports." 

Very valid I think - the index is where people check if they look for something specific. 

Knut


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

Yes and I can assign a function to a "port," for example, assigning " front cab light" to port 3. But then I have no idea what would trigger that light, and no idea of the relationship between "ports" and function buttons.


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## SteveC (Jan 2, 2008)

Knut

No argument from me, to me the documentation is poorly written for "model railroader" individuals that don't also have a strong background in computer terminology and concepts.

Mind you the following is my description of how I believe it works.









However, take notice of the note in red on page 59, my understanding of what is said; is that the QSI Quantum-2 firmware (i.e. program stored in ROM (Read Only Memory)) dated 01-JUN-2008 or later, no longer supports the user programming of NMRA CV's #33-46. They are locked down by the QSI program as per the light gray colored boxes in the table.

Instead QSI uses the concept of "*Virtual Outputs*" (i.e. "Control Port", "Port", or in the NMRA vernacular "Outputs") via the Quantum microprocessor firmware. So the end user can make the desired connection between a *Virtual Output* and any *Physical Output* (i.e. the respective pin or screw terminal), within the limits imposed by QSI firmware.

This programming of a connection between a Function Key, Virtual Output, and Physical Output is accomplished using the CV's #49 (Primary Index), #50 (Secondary index), # 53 (two dimensional table (array) 256x256).
[*] Section 5
[*] Explanation of Primary & Secondary indecies (i.e. computer term 'look up table').
[*] Explanation of one and two dimensional tables (i.e. computer Term array)
[*] Explanation of CV #49 (page 93) & #50 (page 94) to access CV #53.
[*] Explanation of CV #53 (two dimentional table).
[*] QSI Feature Identification Numbers used with CV 53 (page 113-117)
[*] CV #53 - Factory Default Settings (page 11
[/list][/list][/list]


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## krs (Feb 29, 2008)

Steve, 

I agree with what you wrote above, but that in itself is a big problem. 
The majority of Large Scale Railroaders are not that computer literate when it gets into two and even three dimensional matrices and arrays. I hear constant complaints that basic DCC decoders are too complex to program, this QSI decoder is even worse and the documentation sure doesn't help. 
I think QSI should have retained the NMRA CV's 33-46 the way they had them and the way people understand them using every other DCC decoder and made the concepts of virtual outputs, ports, etc. an option selected via a CV - either pick the NMRA way or the QSI way. 
Forcing people to go the QSI route just leads to frustration and customer dissatisfaction. 

One of the functions Mike was looking for was to be able to turn the cab light on and off via a function key of his choice. That's pretty much the simplest operation I can think of in DCC, turn a decoder output on and off by pushing a function key. 
Even after all of this discussion I still don't know if that is even doable with the QSI Titan and if so how and what the limitations of function key assignments are for that scenario if any. 

Maybe someone who has studied the manual can just explain which CVs to program to which values and why. 

Knut


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

Posted By lownote on 21 Aug 2012 01:38 PM 
I got this from Gerry Prussia at qsi. Gerry is always a good source and not prone to hype

Function Keys -(A)-> Features -(B)-> Ports -(C)-> Pins on the Board

(A) Assign features to function keys using CV53.PI.SI.

(B) Assign light features to ports using CV115.PI.SI.

(C) Each port corresponds to a pin on the board. If you use QuantumCVManager, the pin designation for each port is shown in the "Ports" tabbed page. 

For example, if you want a cab light connected to "L9" assign CV115.116.0 Front Cab Light to port 9.

If you want to explicitly turn the front cab light on/off with a function key, do this: (1) Set CV55.116.0 to "0" (disable automatic control for the front cab light). (2) Assuming you want to use F12 to turn the front cab light on/off, set CV53.14.0 to "117" and set CV53.14.1 to "117". 

Gerry Pruss QSI 



I'm going to try doing exactly what Gerry said as soon as I have a chance. I'll try later


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

Well that didn't work. I'm going to try a hard reset of the decoder and see if that works 


Ten minutes later. Nope, no luck. I suppose it's possible a solder joint broke somewhere. I'm done messing with it. My bottom line is that qsi has produced a very capable decoder thats almost impossible to configure. I have a couple more to install in steamers.


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

Posted By lownote on 21 Aug 2012 01:40 PM 
Posted By lownote on 21 Aug 2012 01:38 PM 
I got this from Gerry Pruss at qsi. Gerry is always a good source and not prone to hype

Function Keys -(A)-> Features -(B)-> Ports -(C)-> Pins on the Board

(A) Assign features to function keys using CV53.PI.SI.

(B) Assign light features to ports using CV115.PI.SI.

(C) Each port corresponds to a pin on the board. If you use QuantumCVManager, the pin designation for each port is shown in the "Ports" tabbed page. 

For example, if you want a cab light connected to "L9" assign CV115.116.0 Front Cab Light to port 9.

If you want to explicitly turn the front cab light on/off with a function key, do this: (1) Set CV55.116.0 to "0" (disable automatic control for the front cab light). (2) Assuming you want to use F12 to turn the front cab light on/off, set CV53.14.0 to "117" and set CV53.14.1 to "117". 

Gerry Pruss QSI 

Still trying to make sense of this. I started on a different loco, a steamer. Now I want to be able to control the marker lights independent of the headlight. No luck at all so far. Above Gerry wrote: "For example, if you want a cab light connected to "L9" assign CV115.116.0 Front Cab Light to port 9." What is "L9?" Did he mean F9? I can't seem to get any clear answers on the relation of function buttons to ports.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Whatever Del, the tale does not take a wrong turn.... I'm pissed because I asked questions in the second post that are still not answered. You guys can do some of the work yourselves. I'm busy working on a couple of projects which used up my entire weekend and I'm in the garage now working on it... and helping people who appreciate my help. After I'm done with this project, I'll make a simple to understand article on my site, and show mapping... but I won't show it mapping to F3 and F4 as I have already said it's not a good idea, and at least I take my own advice. Greg Posted By Del Tapparo on 21 Aug 2012 08:30 AM 
Greg - As a Psuedo (perhaps unofficial) representative of this product and company, you have a lot to learn about customer relations. It doesn't matter if the customer has read the manual or not. You don't help them by telling them to RTFM ! You just piss them off and lose a customer. You tell them what they need to know, and then you may point out where to find this same information in the manual. 

I know you will say you don't represent them, but this whole thing has just been one big promotional advertisement from the git-go. Now that is takes a wrong turn, you turn on your defense and start repremending those that can't read and understand from an apparently poorly written manual, what you already know.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Posted By Greg Elmassian on 19 Aug 2012 07:02 PM 
What outputs do you have connected? Specifically which one for the cab light and which one for the number plates? 

What programming did you do to connect those outputs to F3 and F4? 

(by the way, F3 and F4 are already assigned, why not use higher number functions?) 


Greg 

alright, my original post, 3 questions still not answered at all or properly and this is post #2 in the thread.

No more.... I'm not coming back to this whiny thread, and Dell, YOU have a business, and YOU should learn customer relations, and YOU should read the manual rather than take someone's word for it, it's not poorly written, it's just big and technical.... 

BYE


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

Greg , I answered your damn questions! I have no idea what you ae talking about when you say that I never answered your questions? I asked you twice mwhat questions you think i didnt answer. But it's pretty clear to me who is whining here, and who is throwing a tantrum.


Can anyone reading this thread understand any of the explanations offered?


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

Here, for what it's worth, is my answer to Greg's questions



"Greg, I have the headlight and marker light connected as shown in the manual, and they work on FO. I connected the cab light as shown, but could not figure out what function key triggered it. I still can't. Also it kept trying to be a rotating beacon. 

I never managed to get anything mapped to F3 or F4--I can't figure out how to map the functions.
"


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## krs (Feb 29, 2008)

Since Greg stated: .......... I'm not coming back to this whiny thread,...... and none of the suggestions re programming worked for you so far, I would suggest you call tech support at QSI to find out how to program these few simple functions you're after. 

If you reach someone at QSI who sounds technically competent, maybe you could also ask them for me where one would find the technical specification for the Large Scale Titan, like maximum DCC voltage, power output of the audio section, minimum speaker impedance - that kind of basic information. 

Knut


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

I find Greg's behavior completely astonishing. All that stuff about me not answering his questions "properly?" I really don't understand, it's that simple. the manual not answer my question, and neither does Greg's page, and this causes him to take his ball and go home in a huff. 

My guess is that in fact I can't do what I want to do, and the reason has to do with the "emulator" Lee Wheelbarger keeps hyping. It's a software upgrade that's supposedly coming in a couple months which will "completely revolutionize" etc etc. The emulator is all about automating locomotive behaviors, as far as I can tell. 

That's just a guess. I find this whole thing completely inexplicable--Greg's tantrum, the total lack of documentation, the two year wait, the odd deviation from standard DCC practice.


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## krs (Feb 29, 2008)

Have you ever called QSI? 
I'm sure others reading this thread are interested to find out how to do this basic function key assignment on the Titan. 

QSI invites you to call them if you have problems and need help - and you sure do need help. 
Call is toll free!! 

At QSI Solutions we pride ourselves in offering our unequaled Customer support. If you need help please call 800-671-0641


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

Haven't called them, but I'm pretty sure the answer is gong to be no, you can't actually do that. The more I look into the more I think it's like this: QSI has just created three "Multiple automatic light groups." You can add or subtract lights from these groups, but you can't map individual lights to individual function buttons. Group 1 is triggered by F0. Group 3 is triggered by F12. Group 2 is a mystery to me. I've been able to add lights to group 1, but I've had no luck adding them to group 3. 

Meanwhile, I just set up an NCE 408 so that I could control the firebox, the cab light, and the marker lights all from different function buttons. Took five minutes


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

I called qsi, all operators were busy. They are supposed to call me back. Meanwhile, the marker lights are pulsing like mars lights when the loco goes forward, even though I've tried to remove the mars lights from multiple lights group 1.

What a pita


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## krs (Feb 29, 2008)

Posted By lownote on 22 Aug 2012 12:44 PM 
Haven't called them, but I'm pretty sure the answer is gong to be no, you can't actually do that. The more I look into the more I think it's like this: QSI has just created three "Multiple automatic light groups." You can add or subtract lights from these groups, but you can't map individual lights to individual function buttons.
You might be right but if that is actually true then I don't understand QSI's overall strategy.
On the one side they push that concept of "emulator" going into very minute details to try to reflect exactly what a real loco is doing when it comes to sound and then they don't follow through with that strategy on the light control end.
In a real diesel the engineer controls pretty much all the lights manually - the cab lights don't automatically go off after 10 seconds for instance.
Nothing wrong if one wants to automate things like that a bit but it can't possibly be the only option.

Knut


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

I agree, but then why can't it be clear how you do it? I had a chance earlier to work on it in decoder pro, which is vastly better than qsi's programmer. It looks like it might be possible to do. I'll have more time to work on it tomorrow.


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

I went at it tonight with Decoder Pro. It's just a really confusing deal. As far as I can tell, QSI REALLY wants you to run everything in automatic mode. The lights seem to have a high degree of interaction and I suspect that's part of the emulator deal. I had a long phone call from someone on the QSI yahoo list who tried to step me through it, but he was almost as puzzled as I was. 

I'll try to call QSI again tomorrow.


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## krs (Feb 29, 2008)

If I filter out the relevant information for a Diesel loco on Greg's web site I get the following:



All the lights are grouped into 3 assignable sets.
Multiple Lights 1 is controlled by F0 and contains:


HL


RL


Mars Light (front and rear)


Ditch Lights (front and rear)


OHBL (front and rear)





Multiple Lights 2 *is not assigned to a function by default* (was F11 on 


Q1a before support for alternate horn was added) and contains:


Number Boards (front and rear)


Marker Lights (front and rear)





Multiple Lights 3 *is not assigned to a function by default* (was F12 in 


previous versions until support for smoke was added) and contains:


Cab Lights (front and rear)





If you'd like to assign these to functions we have F16-25 with nothing assigned to them currently. We can certainly start using these functions if you like.





The default behavior for the cab light is to come on automatically if the locomotive is in NFF/NFR. After accelerating the cab light will stay on for 10 seconds and then fade out. The behavior works in reverse when you come to a stop, the light will remain off until the loco has been stopped for 10 seconds and then come on bright. *There is no discreet control over the cab light unless it is assigned by the user. 
*

So for instance, F0 turns all these lights on and off as a group:
Headlight
Rearlight
Front and Rear Mars light
Front and rear ditch lights

This seems incredibly inflexible....
How would one run a loco with the headlights on but the ditch lights off until the loco approaches a crossing?
Or how does one dim the headlights when approaching another train or entering a station without also dimming the ditch and rear lights
Or control the rear red lights of a Genesis independently - on if loco is running by itself, off if pulling a train or if run as a double header.


Hmmm.... my quote tags didn't work the way I expected them to....


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

Yes I'd gotten that from Greg's page, and I'm convinced that you can ONLY operate the lights in these three groups. Lee Wheelbarger made a couple interesting posts in the other qsi thread. The answer to my initial question, on the cab light, is no, you can't do what I was trying to do. But according to lee, support for the cab light will be added.


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## krs (Feb 29, 2008)

Posted By lownote on 23 Aug 2012 04:51 AM 
Yes I'd gotten that from Greg's page, and I'm convinced that you can ONLY operate the lights in these three groups. Lee Wheelbarger made a couple interesting posts in the other qsi thread. The answer to my initial question, on the cab light, is no, you can't do what I was trying to do. But according to lee, support for the cab light will be added. 
That contradicts what Greg has posted on his site, the very last statement that I bolded because it states that you can control the cab light separately if you set it up that way as a user - the automatic function is the default but it can be changed.
Here again is what Greg wrote:
There is no discreet control over the cab light *unless it is assigned by the user.*

So you - as a user - can assign discrete control over the cab light, it's just not clear to me how.

Forgive me for asking, but who is Lee Wheelbarger, is he an official spokesman for QSI?


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

He works for qsi, not clear to me in what capacity exactly. The cab light shows up in the software as configurable--you can add it to multiple automatic lights group 3, which is triggered by F12. I could not get it to work though. As I read lee's message, it isn't possible now, but might be later.


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

Success! I figured out how to do it--sort of.

I went back to my original problem trying to assign the Cab light on a USAT F3 to a function key. I was able to assign the cab light to F9 by using Decoder Pro.

First, I would not have been able to do it without using Decoder Pro. QSI's CV manager was much harder to deal with.


In Decoder Pro I went to the tab for "multiple automatic lights" and set the cab light to group #3. I then went to the "function output" tab and assigned "multiple automatic lights #3" to F9. It worked!

I could not manage to assign just the cab light, rather than the cab light in a set (Multiple lights #3). Partly that's because there are too many variables: in the pull down menu there's "Front Cab Lights;" "Automatic Front Cab Lights;" "Rear Cab lights;" "automatic rear cab lights" and it was extremely difficult to figure out which one pertained. Since only the cab lights are in group #3, it works. 

I also had to do some port switching--I'll explain later. I should really do a tutorial with pictures. If I have time this afternoon, I'll do that. It will be an interesting challenge to see if I can make it explicable.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Important finding I am posting in every QSI thread: 

You MUST have a motor connected to the Titan when programming. The original QSI did not require this. The Titan does. Just spent quite a few hours with someone who used his existing bench programming setup that did not include a motor connected. 

Greg


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## josephunh (Mar 27, 2013)

Hate to resurect this thread but I came across this as I was having the same issues mentioned here. Since there has been no answers on the web I called QSI yesterday and talked to Josh Shedaker who is apparently the new owner of the large scale department. He adknowledged that there has been real issues with the documentation on the QSI titan that he is working on now as the previous owners released the Titan without any peer review through the QSI company so there is a lot they are trying to correct and decipher. Now in regard to the lighting issues here is the solution I have for the cab lights and number boards.

On USAT desiels ensure that you wire the cab and board lights serpate from the circuit board they mounted to as these have resistors that are meant for 18V. The cab return gets wired to connector J2 on pin 10 and marker lights on J2 pin 8. The old wiring diagram doesn't make this overly clear and these ports are also marked for and function as mars lights and OHBL. To over come the original programming and have the posts function as the cab and marker lights you need use the following programming. 

First we need to clear out the Mars Light information from Port 3 (J2 Pin 8)

This is done by setting CV 115.76.0 to 0 to do this program the following CVs in the following order:
CV50=0
CV49=76
CV115=0
Port 3 is now free to be reprogrammed for another function.

To assign it as the Front Number Board Lights you need to set CV115.100.0=3 (for Port 3) to do this program the following CVs in the following order:
CV50=0
CV49=100
CV115=3

Next we’ll do a similar operation to remove the Beacon information from Port 9. This is done by setting CV115.92.0=0 to do this program the following CVs in the following order:
CV50=0
CV49=92
CV115=0
Port 9 is now free to be reprogrammed for another function.

To assign it as the Cab light you need to set CV115.116.0=9 (for Port 9) to do this program the following CVs in the following order:
CV50=0
CV49=116
CV115=9

Hope this helps others.


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