# Why train won't start without push



## mickey (Jan 28, 2009)

I've been noticing that once I stop the train, then try to restart it, it won't move until I give it a little tap. Running aristo brass, track power and testing with big hauler. Doesn't matter what section I stop on, same issue. Track all jumpered and recently cleaned. Just a little tap and boom full speed.


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## Totalwrecker (Feb 26, 2009)

Dirty track and wheels often cause this. I remember banging my HO train table to make them start. 
Greg E has recomended a wet swifer for that job. 

John


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Could also be binding in the gear train, but try what John says first. Check the wheels especially, since they are pot metal. 

Greg


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## Dan Pierce (Jan 2, 2008)

Sometimes it is the motor. 
I have found LGB motors do not solder the motor windings to the commutator, they just 'pinch' the enamel wire in a 'U' shaped bracket. 
This connection goes bad and the motor will stop turning. 
If the motor turns just enough t move the armature, the motor will turn again until stopped. 

Solution was not a new motor, but solder the bad connection, Fixed 3 motors in the last 5 years that did this.


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## Garratt (Sep 15, 2012)

Is it just the Big Hauler that's having this problem?
Go read George's page regarding their flaky pick-up problems.
There seems to be 3 different versions of power pick-ups on the Big Haulers. 
Older Wiper, Piston and Bushing. Which one do you have?

http://www.girr.org/girr/tips/tips1...ml#pickups 

Andrew


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Did not think of that Dan the first time, yes one bad "segment" can cause this, but it would be random too, not always happening... also a motor with a bad segment runs poorly.


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## mickey (Jan 28, 2009)

Posted By Garratt on 14 Apr 2013 04:50 AM 
Is it just the Big Hauler that's having this problem?
Go read George's page regarding their flaky pick-up problems.
There seems to be 3 different versions of power pick-ups on the Big Haulers. 
Older Wiper, Piston and Bushing. Which one do you have?
 
http://www.girr.org/girr/tips/tips1...ml#pickups 
 
Andrew 

It is about 18 years old but very little mileage.


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## Dan Pierce (Jan 2, 2008)

How poorly a motor with a bad segment runs vs fails randomly is dependent on number of poles. 
LGB has 7 poles so random happens here. 
5 pole motors would fail more often and 3 pole (most likely not in any G scale engines) all the time. 
Just mentioned as a possibility as I have seen it and it would occur quite often if running an engine slow.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Completely agree... but since he says he has a big hauler, I'm pretty sure it's a 5 pole or worse, we'll see if he comes back with the locomotive info, and more explanation. 

Greg


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## Garratt (Sep 15, 2012)

You probably have the older one with the wipers. They have the problem of losing contact because of the side play on the axles. 
Have a a closer look there with wires from a power pack to the wheels. A fix to limit the side play is in the link I have above.
Maybe the wheels center themselves while running but go to one side when stopped each time. 

the later ones are a 7 pole motor. the older ones have a 5 pole motor with a crown gear rather than a worm so pushing it a little is likely spin the motor. 

Andrew


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## BigRedOne (Dec 13, 2012)

I experienced a similar problem with Marklin HO locomotives, and they required some "force" to get them to start - enough pressure that I felt it was jostling the motor through the gearing to get it to break loose. One locomotive failed completely; it clearly draws current (enough it dim the lights) but won't run at all.

Thanks for the information, it may help me diagnose the problem.

One of my motivations for large scale was to reduce the number of annoying problems and failures.


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## Dick Friedman (Aug 19, 2008)

This sounds like dirty wheels to me too. Clean them the best you can with a brush and some solvent. Then I'd take a cloth damp with Dexron III automatic transmission fluid and rub the rails themselves for a foot or so. The wheels will spread the fluid along the RR. This should (at least it works for me and my friends who have tried it) improve the situation. 

Let us know how you solve the problem.


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## mickey (Jan 28, 2009)

Probably will have to wait for weekend to play some more. I plan on trying some of my other engines and see if it is limited to just the big hauler. Will also check wheels. On the ATF stuff, won't that just attract more dirt dust etc and become a mess?


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## Totalwrecker (Feb 26, 2009)

Some swear by it, some swear at it. I didn't like it outdoors, I did way back in On3 when it was called Rail Zip. Only a thin film is present after a train spreads it around. 

When you say low milage, you may be deceiving yourself. As I understand it the plastic in the press on gears shrinks as it ages. So run or not, cracks are still likely. 

Check for old dried out grease, it could make connections stiff until juice flows... 

John


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## avlisk (Apr 27, 2012)

I found this sort of problem in my HO diesels that had broken/split gear axles. I've also seen it happen in my USAT GP38, and I see that it, too, has broken/split gear axles on 2 of its axles. It might be this? 
Ken S.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

split gears usually cause slipping the motor spins but the loco does not move 

this seems completely different from the op's description 

greg


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## toddalin (Jan 4, 2008)

My thought is lousy wiper contacts that have lost tension, possibly due to excessive heat, coupled with corrosion/pitting. This creates a multitude of minute good/bad contact spots but as long as the wheels are spinning, they power through and hit enough pick-up spots to keep going due to momentum and the metal-on-metal motion that digs into the corrosion.

When you physically push the engine, you make the metal-on-metal motion that digs into the corrosion or find a good spot and the engine is off and running.


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