# A new guy



## Deeker (Oct 13, 2009)

Hello all. I recently got into this hobby to do with my to small children that love trains, and now am hooked. I have a few questions for anyone that is willing to help out with any advice. I bought a Bachmann G scale starter set called the Royal Blue. This set is pretty basic but has all I need to get going and run some trains on the floor for the boys. I then just bought a USA Train EMD F3A to get my stock ready for the spring when I will start to construct our outdoor layout. I tried to run this beast on the Bachmann track and it ran very slow for a few minutes and then it stopped. I am thinking that the controller that came with the set is not powerful enough to run this USA Train. What is a good transformer/controller for me to get to run this train and others outside once I get going? I looked at an Aristo Craft 10 amp thing but am unsure really what I need. Also which track should I buy for my starting layout? Do I buy USA track since I run that train or should I get Aristo brass, LSB brass? Then there is these rail clamps I see, do I need to get 2 of those for each piece of track that I connect? Also do I run 2 12 gauge wires for the controller to the track and solder them the the track. I am sorry for all the stupid questions, I am just excited to get going on this and there is no local store near me that I can ask for help or purchase from. Thanks for any help or suggestions. D


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

Royal Blue nice set, F-3 best loco on the planet!!!!!!!! buy a bridgewerks power pack you wont regret it? brass ok SS better and railclamps well you cant beat them. Welcome to the forum. you should upgrade to 1st class membership lots of perks, only 24.00 dallors


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

And please use your REAL name...................................


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## TonyWalsham (Jan 2, 2008)

Welcome Deeker. 
Before you actually spend big $$$$$$$ look carefully into all the options of powering and controlling your trains outdoors. 
There are other alternatives to track power that could be less expensive.


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

As you asked about transformers in your post, nothing cheaper than good old track power, and the most reliable........ HAVE FUN with the kids thats what its all about!!!!!!!!!








Down towards the bottom of the forum we keep the other form of power..... At the end of the day we all start with track power and end with it because it is in my opionion and most others, the best and most cost effective form of train control..... and you dont have to walk around with a huge controller around your neck


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)




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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

Welcome! I started as a complete beginner 3 years ago, with nothing more than a couple LGB starter sets a relative had given my son. 

I bet just as you thought the F3 was drawing too many amps for the bachmann power pack. USAT trains are known to be power-hungry 


Once you start building, you can do like I did and make a lot of mistakes and learn by experience. I asked a lot of questions here and got a lot of help. 

The Bachmann track won't hold up outdoors--but you can use any brand of track--Aristo, USA, LGB, Peco--any brand of track that's the same gauge. 

There is a BIG divide between people who run their trains via track power and those who run by using rechargeable onboard batteries. There are advantages to both, and in practice it's hard to tell which is cheaper. it depends on a bunch of other factors. In some instances battery is cheaper, in some instances track power is cheaper. I use track power--for various reasons battery never really appealed to me. But it has advantages. 

If you use track power, you don't have to have clamps. But it will run better and with less frustration if you do. I still have one section of my RR that has no clamps, only Aristo screw in joiners, and it's holding up well. Putting a little anti-corrosion paste in the joint will help. The less track joints the better, so if you can use long sections of track you are better off. 

What you need in a power pack is amperage--the more the merrier. I ended up buying a MeanWell power supply on ebay, and adding an aristocraft 10 amp throttle. Before long I started installing wireless decoders in the locos and just leaving constant track power on the rails. It worked well until I switched over to DCC. 

You might want to think about what you want to do with it. If you just want to run one train at a time, basic track power is fine. if you want to get more fancy, then there are a lot of options


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## Steve Stockham (Jan 2, 2008)

Hey, welcome to MLS! (By the way, there _are_ no dumb questions!) As you can see, there are plenty of members ready to help! I would echo Tony's comments and advise you to take the time to research your power options as there are a bunch!


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## Torby (Jan 2, 2008)

Pleased to meet you, Deek! 

"Hey, there's a new kid."


"Are you a new kid?"


"No, I'm 6 years old!"


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## Madstang (Jan 4, 2008)

Welcome!

If I can induldge you with my 2 cents.

Beware of the lust buying that attacks all of us in the beginning! Truly think about what you want to do with the hobby. Give serious thought about just what it is you want to do with your trains, plan before you begin and just as important, how much money you want OR can spend...that will be a governing factor!
I always have trouble with the later of the above thought..money is always a consideration.

I am a dyed-in-the-wool battery fan, I have a test track in my train shop that is track powered, and I power it with a Mag 15 from Bridgewerks. I used to be track power outside before my dark days..I had 2 mag 15s' for my 2 seperate loops..sold one and keep the other for testing and a quick winter fix of train running! 
I agree maybe the bridgewerks is a little pricy but well worth it in the long run if you ever sell it you will get pretty much what you paid for it back.

I always suggest to new people that if they do not know what they want to do, or need advice check to see if there is a G scale train club nearby. Usually you don't have to join to attend meetings..in the beginning but there you will see a variety of track power and possibly R/C battery control options, and maybe, as we do in our club let new people try out the controllers, so that they may get an idea of the differences availiable...not to mention the networking that you can do there and the brains you can pick!

You have found the perfect starting place here at MLS..everyone is willing to help out a new guy or seasoned members that may have run into a issue that this forum helps.

We are all just kids still playing with toys, expensive, but just the same toys...If you have any questions that can be answered..they will be answered..or directed to the proper place for an answer.
Anyway I have been on my journey for 9 years and am still learning from the members and friends I have made here..you too will start your own journey...have fun and dream away! 


Daydreaming in Belleve

Bubba


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## altterrain (Jan 2, 2008)

Welcome D, 

As noted above, there's lot of homework to do. My primary layout is track powered with stainless steel track (easy to keep clean) but I also run some battery powered trains on it. On it I run either 1:29 scale standard gauge trains (like your F-3) or 1:22.5/1:24 narrow gauge trains (like your Big Hauler) but usually not together. Most of my buildings, vehicles and people are in the 1:24-1:29 scale range. 
Most folks these days either go narrow gauge with 1:20 scale which is the correct scale for 3 foot narrow gauge (unlike the 1:22.5/24 trains) or 1:29 scale standard gauge which is an incorrect scale but the most popular (1:32 scale is the correct scale). 
I also have a smaller layout which is dirty brass track and is just for battery powered locos. On it I run a quirky scale known as 7/8's scale or 1:13.7 scale. On the standard 45 mm, "G" track that works out to 2 foot narrow gauge. 
Some info that may help - 
http://www.btcomm.com/trains/primer...scalegauge 
http://www.lsceverything.com/index....hich_scale 










-Brian


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## Totalwrecker (Feb 26, 2009)

Since the track is your foundation, I'd start there. 
Where do you live and what ae your usual weather conditions? 
I live in the Az desert and have a very dry environment. I use the Arsitocraft Stainless Steel track and use the screws in the joiners for my power connections. Afer 5 years, no problems, while others in more humid climates swear by the rail clamps. I only used them where I cut the rail or the screw holes don't line up (got a couple of those). I went with the SS because I'm on a migration rout for Javalinas, 300# of cloven hoof appeal! lol My track is on the ground and for the most part they are good at stepping over it. 

I'm converting to battery power because I don't want to wire it like I did my HO and On3 layouts. Was a lot easier running those wires under the bench work than digging trenches and running it through conduit. Packrats and other critters love to eat wiring. I parked my sportscar when I moved here and a later check under the hood revealed a completely missing sparkplug wire; gone from distributor to plug! Also with battery there is no reverse loop wiring and special electronics. 

The max # of trains I'll ever run at once will be 2, so my expenses are controlled, however if you forsee a large Empire and yourself as a Rail Baron, you should also look into DCC. The cost comes down as you add to it But and that's a big butt for me, there is some wiring to do. 
For me batteries allow me to stay with the train or allow me to manually throw switches and have the controller with me. I'm converting all switches to sping switches that I can throw standing up with a pusher stick, move the points and it snaps over. Again no wires! 

Welcome to our group of railnuts, we all started with the basics and there is a friendly group of helpers here. Asking for help is a smart move. 

John


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

A good piece of advice I often repeat is "what's the story?" What's the story your railroad tells? It might be a story about narrow gage logging in 1880, with tight curves and grades, or a story about mainline passenger service in the 1950s, with diesels replacing steam, or modern day freight on big, brad curves. Like madstang said, instead of just rushing out and buying stuff, think about what story you want to convey. That constrians your choices a little. You dont' have to stick to any story, but I find it helps to make the whole thing work visually and operationally.


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## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

Let me echo the others and wish you a warm welcome to the world of large scale. Remember that all of us started as beginners and those of us who have been at this for 25 or more years made many of the same mistakes. There wasn't a group of knowledgeable people to ask questions. As I've said before, the only dumb question is the one that you didn't ask.

There are probably two reasons for your F3 to trip the power pack: first there are two motors on the F3 and most starter set power packs will barely handle one motor, second, unless I'm mistaken the Bachmann track in the starter set is 2 foot radius (4 foot diameter) The F3 is a large engine and while it will go around 4' diameter curves, it isn't very happy about it. This small diameter adds friction to the engine and this then causes the motors to draw more current.


When you go outside, use the largest diameter curve that will fit into the area you are planning to use, you won't regret it and make your passing sidings 50 to 100% longer than you think that you will need. I've had to increase the length of may passing sidings several times.


I have used track power for more than 25 years and I'm happy with it. I have one engine that has RC and batteries. I did that so that I could run on some layouts that don't have track power. There are pluses and minuses for all power systems. It is confusing at the beginning, but talk to fellow garden railroaders both here and at a local club if there is one in your area.


If you could give us a hint as to what part of the country you call home, someone here will be able to direct you to local layouts and clubs. All you really need to say is the region such as northern Virginia, central Kansas, etc., or you can be as specific as you want. 


Chuck N


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## post oak and otter lake (Dec 27, 2007)

Welcome to the group. I still consider myself a novice in Large Scale even though I've bee in for 4 years. I'm never too old to learn something new. 
I agree on getting rid of the Bachmann track. I use LGB and Aristocraft brass. I bought 5 stainless steel switches at the 2007 NGRC in Las Vegas with the intention of converting to SS. Then the price skyrocked, so I have 5 SS switches mixed with my brass track. I use clamps on my switches & LGB track and screws with my Aristo track. 
Track vs Battery. I have both. I use Aristo's Train Engineers & Lith Ion Batteries in the tenders of my battery powered locos. 
Joining a local club is a great idea. If there isn't one close think about starting one yourself. Visit club web sites. Go to train shows look & ask questions. 
Have fun, that's what it's all about. 
Roger 
Post Oak & Otter Lake Railroad 
North Central Texas All Scale Group 
Caddo Mills, TX


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## Deeker (Oct 13, 2009)

Thank you all for the answers. I live in northern Wisconsin where it is very cold in the winter with lots of snow (not lately, but normally). For now I know I want to run wired track. I am going to do a pretty basic set up to start with in my back yard. I am planing on an L shaped area that will be 12x20 and 8-10 feet wide. I am not sure if this is a good enough area to start with, but I think I will try to start with this general space. Over the winter I will layout the track on the ground in my basement to get an idea of how I would like it to look once spring comes. I am pretty sure I know how to build the layout using concrete as the base for the track bed. I only plan on running 1 to 2 trains at a time to start. I was leaning to buying the Aristo brass track, but many keep talking of the SS track. I am not sure what the difference is between them. As far as budget is concerned I am not to worried about cost, but don't really want to get the Rolls Royce model to start with, I also don't want to get the junker either. I was thinking of the Aristo 10 amp controller to start with, but am unsure if I need the other 10 amp piece to go along with it. Also what is the min. radius I need for the F3A unit and what is the best to run it on. Thank you all for the help. Derek


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## Torby (Jan 2, 2008)

For wired track, you want something with a remote like Aristo's trackside TE. The freedom to move around the garden is great.


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## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

For the size area you are using, I would recommend Aristo 10' diameter track. That is what I am using on my layout which is similar in size to the one you are planning. The F3s don't have any problems going around those curves. Most freight trains look OK on the 10' curves. If you are going to run longer passenger cars (Aristo heavyweights or USA streamliners) they look a little funny entering and leaving the 10' diameter curves, but they do handle those curves without any problems. I would not recommend 10' diameter turnouts. I switched from the Aristo wide radius switch (10' diameter) to the LGB 18000 series switches. They are about a 17' diameter curve on the turnout. I think that the LGB switch is a better product. You could go to #6s, but they are probably a little big for the space you are planning to use.


I'm not to sure about using a concrete roadbed in your climate. Any frost heaving could crack it. I would let it float on a trench filled with ballast. There are a number of people on this site who live in Canada. I'd see what they recommend for a road bed. 


Chuck N


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## aceinspp (Jan 2, 2008)

Deeker:

Welcome to the MLS forum. Like most have said lots of folks to help you here. I'd go with the 10 ft diameter for now as you have the room for it in your plan however if you are thinking bigger layout then think bigger curves to start will save you money. One option of course is to invest in a rail bender that what you can always do some re bending of curves. I would look at using SS track as a more maintenance free rail requiring less cleaning and better over all performance. I would also recommend using rail clamps to to connect the track sections. I would look at using the Aristo TE system or there new revolution system that allows better independent train control at a reasonable cost. However DCC is also a reliable option for out door use. I would also do some more research on the methods available to lay track for your part of the country. Just some more food for thought. Later RJD


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## rreiffer (Jan 14, 2009)

Welcome aboard! 
I was new back in January when I bought my first large scale set and I have been hooked ever since. If you want to see what you can do the first year here is what my wife and I have been working on: 

http://www.mylargescale.com/Community/Forums/tabid/56/aff/23/aft/111500/afv/topic/Default.aspx 

Bubba is right about the lust of buying (sorry Bubba but it still attacks me!). I would suggest at a minimum that you move to a good brass (or stainless steel) track and also the longer the track the less joints and hence issues that you will have to deal with. 

I would pick up a good power supply as your trains will run better with them. Battery, DCC, Radio control are all very nice to add but not required to get up and going so your kids can enjoy them. Look for a local train show and keep your eyes open for good used gear. I just purchased two MRC Control Master 20's with the walk around controller for $45 each. Great G scale power supply for a beginner. 

Look on the classified items on this forum (you should upgrade to first class as this forum is WELL worth the $ to support). 

Good luck and send us pictures as you get stuff going! 

Rich


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