# What to plant?



## wombat457 (Jul 15, 2015)

Afternoon All,

I am sure this question has been asked before but couldn't find an answer sorry.

I live in the Finger Lakes Region of New York State and am wanting to "landscape" my layout with trees and so forth that look fairly realistic for our area. I have looked at "dwarf trees" but they all seem to grow to heights in feet rather than inches and seem to be confined to the conifer variety of tree.

I have also looked at Bonsai Plants, which do look to be perfect for what I am after; HOWEVER, do seem to be cost prohibitive ($30 - $70+) per plant.

So, can someone give me some ideas for tree's and general bushes etc for the layout please.

I am also "grassing" the area using a seed designed by my local Golf Club for their Greens, a seed that can be cut as low as a 1/4", or perhaps a little lower. I can already hear the what the heck thoughts - what a nightmare to keep cut


----------



## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

For trees, dwarf Alberta spruce is a very slow grower. I have some that started out about a foot tall 20 years ago and are still under 3'. In our Virginia climate they do get aphids. 

Box wood is also very slow grower, don't know if it can handle the winters in your part of the world. It can be pruned to look more like a tree and less like a shrub.

Chuck


----------



## Scottychaos (Jan 2, 2008)

You do NOT want to use anything advertised as "bonsai".. 

bonsai are regular trees that are kept in a dwarf state with *constant* care and fuss to keep them small..if you plant a "bonsai" and stop trimming it, it will just turn into a regular *very large* maple tree, or oak tree, or pine tree..because thats what they are..
the only difference between a 50 foot maple tree in your front yard, and a 1-foot tall maple tree bonsai, is that the bonsai owner has done a ton of work to create the bonsai tree and keep it small..
they are genetically identical..they are the exact same trees.

there are also "indoor bonsai" sold..you cant use those either, because they are tropical houseplants and wont survive the winter.

I'll post more later!  I have to get going right now..just wanted to comment on the bonsai! its no good for a garden railroad..totally wrong concept for a garden railroad. 

you can use "bonsai techniques" on a few trees, to keep them small, but that's best kept for one or two "specimen" trees, not a whole railroad full of trees, because its very labor intensive.

Scot


----------



## Homo Habilis (Jul 29, 2011)

Wombat:

Welcome to the world of Garden Railroads and this site in particular.

I might suggest that you subscribe to Garden Railways magazine if you don't already. They have many informative articles on planting and actual layouts.

Also, since I'm guessing that you're relatively new to the States, you may not know about the USDA hardiness zones. Most of the articles in GR will mention a plant's zone and that should help with your decision.


----------



## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

WB457

If you look at the first picture I posted in your building/scale thread, the tree on the right side is a 20 year old Alberta Spruce. The shrubs behind the water tower are unpruned 20 year old box wood plantings, from Mount Vernon.

Cheers mate,

Chuck

Been down under several times, Melbourne, Lorne, and Taz.


----------



## wombat457 (Jul 15, 2015)

chuck n said:


> For trees, dwarf Alberta spruce is a very slow grower. I have some that started out about a foot tall 20 years ago and are still under 3'. In our Virginia climate they do get aphids.
> 
> Box wood is also very slow grower, don't know if it can handle the winters in your part of the world. It can be pruned to look more like a tree and less like a shrub.
> 
> Chuck


Thanks Chuck I will definitely hit the local nurseries for those two tree types in particular. Have also taken another look at the first photo you posted and liked the tree's shown and as mentioned here. Thanks again mate.



Scottychaos said:


> You do NOT want to use anything advertised as "bonsai"..
> 
> bonsai are regular trees that are kept in a dwarf state with *constant* care and fuss to keep them small..if you plant a "bonsai" and stop trimming it, it will just turn into a regular *very large* maple tree, or oak tree, or pine tree..because thats what they are..
> the only difference between a 50 foot maple tree in your front yard, and a 1-foot tall maple tree bonsai, is that the bonsai owner has done a ton of work to create the bonsai tree and keep it small..
> ...


Thank you for saving me who knows how much money. I really thought bonsai's would be the way to go BUT did not realize how much work was going to be involved in keeping them the bonsai size. Believe me, I am not a green thumb either 



**** Habilis said:


> Wombat:
> 
> Welcome to the world of Garden Railroads and this site in particular.
> 
> ...


I am not a subscriber to the magazine but does seem to be something that I should do, and will. I am not totally new to the US, have been here 8 years almost; however, am not familiar with the US plant zones. So having that information will be worth the subscription.



chuck n said:


> WB457
> 
> If you look at the first picture I posted in your building/scale thread, the tree on the right side is a 20 year old Alberta Spruce. The shrubs behind the water tower are unpruned 20 year old box wood plantings, from Mount Vernon.
> 
> ...


I was born and raised in Melbourne, had a holiday property in Taz (my favorite state I should add) and have an Uncle who lives on the outskirts of Lorne... what are the chances of that do you think ?


----------



## Scottychaos (Jan 2, 2008)

Wombat,
you have three garden railroad clubs surrounding you, each only an hour or so away, depending on where you are in the Finger Lakes. (im originally from Waverly NY, south of Ithaca, and I now live in Rochester.) You picked a great place to migrate too!  The Finger Lakes is a beautiful region..

Rochester area club:
https://sites.google.com/site/1991gggrs/

Syracuse area club:
http://cnylsrs.net/

Binghamton area club:
http://www.ray-taylor.com/stgrs/

Some of them have tours of clubs members railroads..my club (Genesee G Gauge) doesn't have any home-tours scheduled this summer, but the other clubs might..

We are having a 2-hour run at a Rochester layout tomorrow, this one:

https://sites.google.com/site/1991gggrs/pictures/st-johns-meadows-photos

St. Johns is a senior/retirement community, they own the railroad, and the GGGRS helped build it...but its not landscaped with the kinds of plants you are asking about..still, you are always welcome to come up and visit!  we have more scheduled there through the rest of the summer.. (schedule is on our calendar page.)

I second the suggestion to subscribe to Garden Railways magazine..each issue always has an article about gardening and plants..

Scot


----------



## toddalin (Jan 4, 2008)

Scottychaos said:


> You do NOT want to use anything advertised as "bonsai"..
> 
> bonsai are regular trees that are kept in a dwarf state with *constant* care and fuss to keep them small..if you plant a "bonsai" and stop trimming it, it will just turn into a regular *very large* maple tree, or oak tree, or pine tree..because thats what they are..
> the only difference between a 50 foot maple tree in your front yard, and a 1-foot tall maple tree bonsai, is that the bonsai owner has done a ton of work to create the bonsai tree and keep it small..
> ...


Bonsai trees are _miniature_ trees, get regular attention, and the root ball is typically trimmed over time.

But most bonsai trees are just miniature trees and woody plants that we use on our railroads anyways including crepe myrtles, elms, serissa, cypress, tea plants, and box woods. Some require lots of attention and some require almost none.

My trees were planted in 1998-1999 and are no taller than my hips, because that's the level that I keep them at. When you stop the vertical growth with trimming, the plants can really fill in nicely.

I don't do anything to the roots, just the branches. Also, if you keep them well trimmed, including the flowers, they will live much longer than their life expectancy. Nancy Norris, _Garden Railways Magazine_ "Plant columnest" tells me that my dwarf crepe myrtles, trimmed as in topiary balls ("pom" trees) and squares ("box" woods), should have been dead many years ago, but every year, they just get nicer!

And, yes, the whole railroad is done this way AND with topiary! Some of us find the look to be worth the effort.

Unfortunately, I would have no idea what would work in New York.


----------



## wombat457 (Jul 15, 2015)

Scottychaos said:


> Wombat,
> you have three garden railroad clubs surrounding you, each only an hour or so away, depending on where you are in the Finger Lakes. (im originally from Waverly NY, south of Ithaca, and I now live in Rochester.) You picked a great place to migrate too!  The Finger Lakes is a beautiful region..
> 
> Rochester area club:
> ...


Scott,

Thank you and yep the Finger Lakes area is certainly a beautiful place. My moving here wasn't exactly my idea though, it is where my wife has lived all her life 

Thank you for the list of Clubs, Rochester is probably going to be the closest, or easier of the 3 for me to get to. Ironically, my wife and I are looking for something to do tomorrow, so your having the open house just might give us that "something to do", so long as I can convince my wife to go to Rochester!



toddalin said:


> Bonsai trees are _miniature_ trees, get regular attention, and the root ball is typically trimmed over time.
> 
> But most bonsai trees are just trees that we use on our railroads anyways including elms, serissa, cypress, tea plants, and box woods. Some require lots of attention and some require almost none.
> 
> ...


I have just finished watching your video and ****, I feel so inadequate ahh Model Railway wise I mean.

I think I need to clarify something though. I got to build this G Gauge layout because I (pretty much) promised my wife that it would ONLY be a railway running through a GARDEN  So, any gardening work that is needed will be expected.

With that being said, I might buy a few bonsai's and see how they go and look and exactly how much work they will require to be kept at a "scale" size. Worse case scenario, if they become too much work I can pull them out and plant them else where. 

Thanks though for all of your thoughts and input. Appreciate it all and when the time comes I will hopefully have some photo's of what has been done, landscaping wise.


----------



## chuck n (Jan 2, 2008)

A statistican friend of mine said that there are statistics and coincidences. What brought that conversation up was that a few years ago Nancy and I got an email from a friend in Norway. She ask if I could drive her to my place of employment, the U.S. Geological Survey. I said yes. I live in the greater Washington DC area. I picked her up at a home about 200 meters from mine from a family I knew. Go figure.

Enjoy the hobby and keep us busy answering questions. We all want you to have a wonderful experience in this hobby. 

One of the nice aspects to this part of the hobby is that in many families it is not just a male activity. Nancy is involved in the landscaping and buildings. As a result of that she enjoys going on tours of Garden Railways when the opportunity arises.

Chuck

In addition to plantings, you need to think about drainage. Where will the 1:1 water go? Over, under or around your carefully laid track? 

Poor drainage can lead to excessive frost heaves, that lead to very uneven trackage. I don't know if you are planning to run in the winter, but it can be done, under appropriate conditions. I've lived in Lakewood, Colorado (6000' above sea level) with 60 + inches of snow a winter, and Virginia with usually less than 10" a winter. I have been able to run all year. Some of my most enjoyable run times has been plowing snow with my MOW equipment. Then running a regular consist through the snow.

This worked better in Colorado with dry powder snow.










I can occasionally run in snow in Virginia.


















There is other snow fighting equipment I can call upon.










If all else fails there is always a "plastic" shovel. DO NOT USE A METAL ONE.

Chuck


----------



## Scottychaos (Jan 2, 2008)

wombat457 said:


> Ironically, my wife and I are looking for something to do tomorrow, so your having the open house just might give us that "something to do", so long as I can convince my wife to go to Rochester!


that would be great if you could make it!
I just sent you a PM with some directions..
Scot


----------



## wombat457 (Jul 15, 2015)

Chuck,

Incredible! My intention is to run trains for as long as I possibly can so running them in winter is a definite probability. Here in the Finger Lakes District we get some pretty fickled weather. Some years, like last, we get up to 3' of snow, other years we might be lucky to get a foot.

Getting a Plow is going to be a must, regardless of the amount of snow - I just think watching a train run in the snow is incredible and adds to the reality of the hobby.



> "...Enjoy the hobby and keep us busy answering questions...."


I have enjoyed my HO layout so I most certainly will enjoy this new venture as well; however, you may regret telling me that 

Scotty,

Thanks for the PM and have replied.


----------



## East Broad Top (Dec 29, 2007)

Dwarf Alberta spruces will do well in western NY. Some varieties of boxwood as well. I'd love to tell you which ones, but I don't remember. That, and I'd plant two of the same variety and two of another, and only one of each would survive. Go figure. I also used burning bush as a larger hedge, and also forsythia. Ground covers consisted of mosses, various varieties of sedum, and also sweet woodruff. I also used alyssum, which is advertised as an annual, but it came back from year to year. I didn't have a lot of evergreen-type bushes (juniper, etc), though they did well in general landscapes.

This is hardly an exhaustive list; just what I had planted on my line in Avon when I lived up that way. Despite the miserable winters, western NY is surprisingly temperate when you look at the USDA charts--oddly a warmer zone than here in Colorado, though my "long john" index says otherwise. (I don't need long johns near as often here as I did in western NY!) 

I tend to be somewhat experimental with my plants, but I'm also a cheapskate when it comes to buying them. I figure if I buy 'em cheap and they die, I'm not out much more than the cost of a light lunch. I tried the "listen to the 'experts' at the local garden center at $30/plant" route, and it just ended miserably. 

Good luck!

Later,

K


----------



## wombat457 (Jul 15, 2015)

East Broad Top,

Think you guys have me convinced on the Dwarf Alberta's and Box woods as well - that'll be a good start I think.


----------



## toddalin (Jan 4, 2008)

When I buy plants, I always buy at least three of a type. In addition to the aesthetics of threes in groupings;

If one dies, it could be the plant and if I like them, I'll get more.

If two die, I'm probably doing something wrong. So, change things up a bit, and/or nurse it back with _Super Thrive_, and if it continues to live/thrive, if I like if I'll get more.

If all three die, forgetaboutit! I just can't grow it for whatever reason and there is no sense in getting more.


----------



## wombat457 (Jul 15, 2015)

toddalin said:


> When I buy plants, I always buy at least three of a type. In addition to the aesthetics of threes in groupings;
> 
> If one dies, it could be the plant and if I like them, I'll get more.
> 
> ...


That has made me smile - I like the logic, a lot


----------



## Bob Pero (Jan 13, 2008)

My wife has been very successful with standard plants such a boxwood. She buys small "scale sized" plants and replants them in clay pots.The whole pot is them planted on the layout and covered over. This restricts the roots and keeps the plant small. She trims them to look like trees and has been very successful with this approach. We give them a yearly trim and they have done well.

www.liveoakrr.com


----------



## wombat457 (Jul 15, 2015)

Bob,

Keeping whatever I plant in pots is a good idea. Thank you.


----------



## Zoemacrossan (Apr 17, 2017)

If you are working and can't give proper attention to you plants, then you should plant some low maintenance plant.


----------



## Zoemacrossan (Apr 17, 2017)

I just can't take my eyes off of this garden rail you all have made. I am in love with and possible will make mine soon.


----------

