# opinions of 7.5 indoors



## cjsrch (May 29, 2010)

long story short. 12-20k sq ft building with 20 ft ceilings. concreate construction. cant really say why or what for right now as it is not my project to talk about.
Currently these people are looking at running a 7.5 inch gauge RR indoors and are looking at battery powered trains ( including the 2-6-0 battery "steamer") and other electrics with body conversions
can any one recomend some good brands ?
Also what is your take on doing LIVE STEAM indoors? what about legalities ?

Sorry ill post details once i know what im allowed to talk about


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## Charles (Jan 2, 2008)

7.5 indoors would need a warehouse!


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## armorsmith (Jun 1, 2008)

Live steam indoors?? I hope they have really long arms and deep pockets for the insurance. The club I belong to had to remove the coal fired switch engine and purchase a gasoline switcher. It was THAT MUCH of a liability issue. 

Have you heard of Dollywood in Tennessee (ya know Dolly Parton?). Sixteen or seventeen years ago, the insurance company for the park make her remove a stationary steam powered saw mill that had been part of the park for a long time. And to add insult to injury, she had just had the boiler repaired and re-certified. 

As for the suppliers, I can't help there. 

Bob C.


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## HMeinhold (Jan 2, 2008)

It has been done. Google for "Sinsheim indoor live steam". They used to run several miles of track (mostly 5"), but also 7 1/4" and road steam. Last year they moved to Karlsruhe with a reduced layout. See the track plan (5" and 7 1/4") here:

http://www.echtdampf-hallentreffen-...ge und kombinierte 5 und 7,25 Zoll Anlage.pdf 




No carbon monoxide poisoning nor problems with insurances/fire department reported (About 20000 visitors!)

Regards


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## llynrice (Jan 2, 2008)

If you want to run live steam indoors, you'll need a really impressive ventilation system to avoid doing folks in with carbon monoxide. For electrically powered models, you might want to look at Roll Models at http://www.rmirailworks.com/


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## cjsrch (May 29, 2010)

LOL that is very true high ceilings with vent would not help since CO is heavier then air. 

However that also had me thinking about two things 
1- air powered "steamers" i saw this advertised somewhere once. instead of a boiler it is a air tank. 
2- electric heating element steamers- a 20k btu equivlent 'burner' would be apx 8 700 watt 12 volt heaters , either fire tube style or watertube could be used. 
could run each element for 1 hour on a deepcycle marine. adding 380 lbs apx tothe engine. Im crazy i know. but its not fun unless you boil water. 

Ok back to reality.


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## HMeinhold (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By cjsrch on 21 Feb 2011 08:45 PM 
''''. 

Ok back to reality.  
Sorry to contradict,
but reality is that the largest live steam indoor event of the world in Germany is now in its 10th+ year without any reported incidents. I guess you get carbon monoxide only when you run low on oxygen. If you have plenty of ventilation, there seems to be no problem.
Regards


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## Kovacjr (Jan 2, 2008)

There is a show in I think Texas every year that is a temporary 7.5" track indoors in some arena. A friend Mike Venezia attended it and I had seen the photos. If you have the size bulding you posted there is no issue getting it in there. Just look at Diamondhead, there is a smokescreen for the whole week. Its all about having enough ventilation


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## ChaoticRambo (Nov 20, 2010)

I am sure it could be done with some thinking and a good plan for how the layout will work.

You will also want to take into consideration space for an unload / loading area (the big thing right now is rolling transfer tables that can vertically raise and lower). Yard space is always a consideration too even for the smallest railroad.


In my opinion, part of the charm of the "ride on" class of model railroading is that it is outside. Not to mention the size of the building you are talking would barely hold a loop. Keep in mind that most 7.5" live steam clubs build to a minimum mainline radius of 60ft. Although you can do it with much less, it will narrow what type of engines you can run.


As for your question on brands, here are some good site to take a look at:

Two small battery engines (good pullers for their size): 


http://www.mr-motion.net/
http://www.plumcovestudios.com/index2.html 


Great site for all things live steam:

http://discoverlivesteam.com/


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## tacfoley (Jan 3, 2008)

Maxitrak here in UK MIGHT be a good place to start, although I have to say that their electric locos are based on British NG rather than US practice. There are numerous companies in the US who will build just about anything you care to name to run of this gauge track - from a DD40-X down to an NW2. 

Here are a few prices from one manufacturer - 



SW-7 $6494.25 (gas/hydraulic only)


GP-9 High hood $11,497.50 Gas or Electric $13123


GP-9 Low nose $12,022.50 Gas or Electric $13374


GP-38 $11,546.85 Gas or Electric $12450


SD-9 $12,757.50 Gas or Electric $14334


SD-45 $13,275.75 Gas or Electric $14144


SD-40-2 $13,675 Gas or Electric $13429


C-415 $11,250 Electric $13162


C-420 $11,597 Gas or Electric $13263


RS-1 $12,425 $11,151 Electric $12,651


RS-3 $11,745 $11,278 Electric $12,778


FA-1 $11,975 Gas or Electric $12,756


PA-1 $14,995 Gas or Electric $15,623


Dash 840CW $12,875 Gas or Electric $13,768


Dash 840 C $12,275 Gas or Electric $13,190 


Dash 9 $13,484 Gas or Electric $15,176


AC 4400 $12,897 Gas or Electric $14,750 


Trainmaster $15,950 Gas or Electric $16,500


E-2 $23,453 Gas or Electric $24,578


Engineer cars.... Half Gondola .. $1,475 Flat with low seat.. $1,475


6 foot steel gondola w/trucks and couplers... $985


"Track Snapper".......$135 (includes ground shipping)

If you intend to run NG prototypes on this track, then capacious pockets will be needed - live steam NG on this size track is humungous - a well-built K-27 will set you back around $100K.....plus the cars. 

You really need to have a better idea on what they have on their minds ere you go any further. Knowing what the budget for track and locos is vital information that you don't have right now. 

The post above this one has a great link, BTW, much of what you want to know can be found there.

In this scale, NOTHING can be done on the cheap - health and safety issues are paramount, especially where the public has access, so braking cars to the appropriate standard is required for a start. Have a look at the Train Mountain site to see what we mean. 

tac 
Secretary - RMSRS [www.fenlandlightrailway.co.uk]


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## Pete Thornton (Jan 2, 2008)

The Accucraft Ride On Plymouth is very inexpensive. (They moved their websites around again - it's now called http://www.accucraftrideon.com.)


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## cjsrch (May 29, 2010)

Really no comment on the electric burner lol no one wants to correct my math that I'm sure I got wrong 


Btw I can say this is not a club track and it won't be open for any meets so we are ok with tight turns


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## ChaoticRambo (Nov 20, 2010)

The prices given in an above posting are from railsystems:

http://www.railsystemsco.com/

Keep in mind also - that if you are running real live steam engines indoors, you will have to designate that they must be diesel or propane fired (or anything else besides actually burning coal or wood).

Shays will probably be the only real steam engine you could use on super tight radius, although you might be able to get an American or other small engines to work well.

The above posting about the K-27 is also a bit on the high side. Not to mention it is one of the biggest engines you can get for this gauge, these types of engines would require steel rail instead of aluminum since they are so heavy, they can crush aluminum rail. There are companies out there that will literally make you any engine you want to perfect scale if you have enough money, more realistically you can look through discover live steam and find a lot of good engines for 10-25k.

http://discoverlivesteam.com/forsale/locomotive.html

That page will give you a good idea on pricing of engines and such.


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