# Construction has started !



## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Well and not without surprises and frustrations: 


[*]Frost is still in the ground [/list] 
[*]Nothing is level [/list] 
[*]Joints are stressed. [/list] 
[*]Flower bed is muddy and messy [/list] 
[*]Screwing into my thumb nails. ! [/list] 

And anything else that can go wrong









Enjoy


gg


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Good for you Gavin! 

Greg


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## Engineercub (Oct 18, 2008)

GO GAVIN GO!!!!! I'm glad you are starting your layout ^^ 

-Will


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## ralphbrades (Jan 3, 2008)

Well as I have set out bigger sites than the one you have perhaps you could allow me to offer some suggestions...

The first one is to establish a *DATUMN POINT*. This is a fixed point from which all things on the site are measured from. In your case I would put a big screw hook into the fence and hang a long length of wood from it -onto that you put a spirit level on the movable end of it. Regardless of the shift in the ground or the squelch of the mud etc, you will know that the datumn line -from the datumn point is *TRUE*. 


Insert your posts, wait for it to settle, then mark off the level from the datumn line and *then* saw to length.


The second point is to use Bright Zinc Plated screws (BZP). These will not rust and when the time comes -you will be able to unscrew them and add the next section of benchwork. Use soap, not oil, to lubricate your screws as you put them in. If you use oil, this can congeal and "glue" your screws to the wood.

The traditional "topping" for trackwork here in the UK is to use "Roofing Felt", and to nail the flaps to the edges of the planks. This gives waterproof seal and helps preserve your planks against rot. However remember to paint all your timbers with waxy preservative or bituminous paint before you apply the felt. I use the stuff that you apply adhesive to and "carpet lay" the rolls onto the planks. Other people prefer the stuff you have to heat with a torch and it then melts to the timbers.


regards

ralph


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## Torby (Jan 2, 2008)

hehe When I'm working on something, it's about like watching "Tim the Tool Man Taylor."


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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

I'll be watching this--did you post your final track plan?


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Posted By lownote on 04/19/2009 7:38 AM
I'll be watching this--did you post your final track plan?



Lownote, this rough was posted earlier. I forms the basic idea. As things come together, I will be making changes re overall length and location of spurs, sidings etc.


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Posted By ralphbrades on 04/19/2009 1:45 AM
Well as I have set out bigger sites than the one you have perhaps you could allow me to offer some suggestions...

The first one is to establish a *DATUMN POINT*. This is a fixed point from which all things on the site are measured from. In your case I would put a big screw hook into the fence and hang a long length of wood from it -onto that you put a spirit level on the movable end of it. Regardless of the shift in the ground or the squelch of the mud etc, you will know that the datumn line -from the datumn point is *TRUE*. 


Insert your posts, wait for it to settle, then mark off the level from the datumn line and *then* saw to length.


The second point is to use Bright Zinc Plated screws (BZP). These will not rust and when the time comes -you will be able to unscrew them and add the next section of benchwork. Use soap, not oil, to lubricate your screws as you put them in. If you use oil, this can congeal and "glue" your screws to the wood.

The traditional "topping" for trackwork here in the UK is to use "Roofing Felt", and to nail the flaps to the edges of the planks. This gives waterproof seal and helps preserve your planks against rot. However remember to paint all your timbers with waxy preservative or bituminous paint before you apply the felt. I use the stuff that you apply adhesive to and "carpet lay" the rolls onto the planks. Other people prefer the stuff you have to heat with a torch and it then melts to the timbers.


regards

ralph







Ralph, thanks for for your input. Never really did think about a datumn or reference point. Will do










As for toppings etc, I am using what I call the "Brian Ladder" technique. ( Brian gets the cudos here as I read his article first ). Trellis PVC trim, 1" x 0.75" c/w treated and cut 1.825" 2"x2" spruce. Overall width approx 3.5" to create the track bed. My support posts will be 4"x4" pressure treated, modified floating using strategic fence spikes in the flower bed proper and alternating floating bases on terra firma like the grass. 




The risk I see is a loco going over the edge..... thinking fish net if need be ... open to suggestions. 




Finally, landscaping themes. Tough when the whole layout is suspended in air. Open to suggestions. 




gg


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Another comment: 

Errant locos leaping off the track and plunging to their death... I get nightmares and think "Semper"









See the Dog house in the pics.... soon to be modified and converted to a rolling stock shed... Another project in the making. 


gg


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Errant switches don't necessarily cause the engine to leave the track... often it is what is on the track that the switch is pointing at...


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## Torby (Jan 2, 2008)

Ow!


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

On the screws used, going from ordinary screws to galvanized (I don't think we get them as zinc plate, but galvanized has zinc I think) is good. 

One step better is deck screws, they have coatings that are often guaranteed for 10 to 25 years... slightly more expensive but worth the cost to avoid rust. 

Regards, Greg


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## aceinspp (Jan 2, 2008)

Give him an A for effort at least he is starting. Then all of a sudden he gets all these horror stories about trains falling of track. Yikes what a bummer. Later RJD


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Ahh, that won't slow Gavin down! He's survived this far ha ha! 

Greg


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

They say: The sign of a good woodworking craftsman is a craftsman that is able to hide his/her mistakes. This I am good at. 


I be no different here and in my defence: 

[*]I am using channel PVC. When clamped will bend inwards which distorts the ladder ( no solid PVC in my area ) . This means a new technique for anchoring and leveling the ladder to the 4x4's. [/list] 

[*]The screws I used were purchased a while back and before this thread started. I chose a #10 x 1.5 "laminate" screw with a wide pitch and almost self tapping. Bites into the PVC easily. The screw has a black powder coat on it. [/list] 

[*]The challenge is to get this ladder level on the 4x4's c/w positive position locks. [/list] 

[*]Ralph: I think that if I look hard enough, I have a lazer level that when mounted on my tripod should be able to shoot all positions for final cuts. [/list] 

Memorize the pics. When I'm done lets count the mistakes.... 

Thanks for the input. Any and all comments are appreciated. 


gg


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

*Yes looking good, Gster







*


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

I need the motivation to make it happen ! 

Nick, I really do need your smilies... class act, adds humour and fun and why am I stuck with the boring forum jobbies or am I missing something here ! 

gg


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Posted By aceinspp on 04/20/2009 4:05 PM
Give him an A for effort at least he is starting. Then all of a sudden he gets all these horror stories about trains falling of track. Yikes what a bummer. Later RJD




Sidebar comment: 

Yes RJD, bummer and I thank Semper for his video and sharing of same to make me sensitive to these potential "misfortunes". Live steam or otherwise, elevated trackage creates issues and challenges. Thanks to the great feedback on this forum and including your input, I am able to "forecast" risk and am trying to minimize same. Especially with 1.5K (CAD) locos running around and effectively suspended in air. 


Once I get Nick's smilies coupled with ongoing support from the forum, all will be compleat.









Regards and "bring it on" (comments good, bad or otherwise). This is the essence of my own business/life be it professional or otherwise. The comments by the group says all and contributes to a successful project. 


gg


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## ralphbrades (Jan 3, 2008)

The problem with a Laser Level is that you ever get the position ONCE. Which if you are surveying a site is reasonably OK -but if it is a site that is going to e added to -then the Datumn point method is still the best. If you are having problems mounting your ladders to the tops of your post -could I suggest you use a variant of a "Swivel Plate" (?) 

This is a square plate that screws into your PVC ladder and a central hole with 4 holes around it for the post.


regards

ralph


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Posted By ralphbrades on 04/20/2009 11:23 PM
The problem with a Laser Level is that you ever get the position ONCE. Which if you are surveying a site is reasonably OK -but if it is a site that is going to e added to -then the Datumn point method is still the best. If you are having problems mounting your ladders to the tops of your post -could I suggest you use a variant of a "Swivel Plate" (?) 

This is a square plate that screws into your PVC ladder and a central hole with 4 holes around it for the post.


regards

ralph






Ralph, I need to know more. My goal is to "shim" and lock the PVC ladder to the top of the 4x4. As you can see shimming will be necessary and the loads on top of the post at the shim points will not be that great. Can you give me a better understanding of your square plate concept? How it works that is... Right now I'm a tad lost ... 

Regards, 


gg 


PS: Good point on the laser level


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## ralphbrades (Jan 3, 2008)

"Swivel plates" are used to accurately position 42U computer cabinets -to within 0.5mm in a lateral. There is a central screw which raises and lowers the plate. At each of the 4 corners there is a nut and bolt. The plate is threaded on all holes. First raise/lower the plate to the correct height. Then lower one screw, and an adjacent one. The three points now form a "plane". Lower the cabinet onto the swivel plate. lower the remaining two screws and adjust for level. With 5 points you have 25 "planes" -when they are all at the same position you have 1... 

A simple "Swivel Plate" would be a steel plate with nuts welded /epoxied to it. 

Drill a hole down the centre of you post, extend the width of the hole at the top to take a nut -which you would epoxy to it. Wind down a length of threaded bar into the hole -this will leave you with a stud sticking out. Wind down the plate on its thread onto the stud. Turn the plate until you have the correct height. Bolt the ladder to the plate through the remaining bolt holes. Your only problem now is how you want to fill the gap between the top of the plate and the post. Expanding foam filler is normally the best bet -but I have known people use Glass Fibre Putty. To quote the last person who used Putty; "Yon bugger ain't bloody going nowhere once this lot has gone off". *(And she was right!!!)* 

regards 

ralph


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Ralph, understood. Thanks. 

Will advise on this. I was thinking of conventional cedar "shims" to reach Y-elevation and also for lateral adjustments. Then clipping the shims and then using anchor plates on each side to lock in the settings. Call this the poor man's fix. I saw adjustable spikes at the hardware store and they are somewhat sloppy. Will check this out. 

Regards, 


gg


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## Engineercub (Oct 18, 2008)

Sounds like a good plan GG ^^ I can't wait to see it grow. See my thread for more construction progress =) 

-Will


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Yo Will, 

I have your thread flagged (incoming email ) and when do you plan to update? As you can see above I winged it with setting up the layout... did not use garden hose, just a piece of 8' 2x2 , staked the rough in posts and then laid out the first string of pvc stringer. ( Lazy) 

As I said in an earlier post, I'm counting on everyone to count the mistakes for review at the end of this saga. ( Just gave one away ) 


Your approach is much more accurate and I suspect will bode you well as you are laying concrete. 


Updates are important as we are both in construction mode and I need to pick up on tips and techniques. 

gg


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## Engineercub (Oct 18, 2008)

About 50% of the way GG I realized the elevation was not accurate as it is hard to keep a level straight on PVC pipe. In hind sight I should have used wooden stakes with flat tops for accuracy. I'll have to get it right before laying concrete, that's for sure. 

-Will


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Will, 

The first array of wood stakes served the purpose of establishing the rough layout of the dogbone and allowed for clamping of the first set of stringers at the "approximate" height or elevation. The conversation that Ralph and I are having rotates around establishing final elevations for the layout as well as making the track level when examined from the plan view. 

How's that for a "cover up"? 


I call it sales "spin" 


What fun.

gg


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Posted By Engineercub on 04/21/2009 9:05 PM
Sounds like a good plan GG ^^ I can't wait to see it grow. See my thread for more construction progress =) 

-Will




This is my plan and do I know what I'm doing? .... heck no....

oops... just let another mistake out of the bag.... construction incompetence. 


Time to retire for the evening.. 








gg


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

small comment: 

Can't work the project due to time, weather and temperatures below zero C. 

As the photos show, temp surveyors stakes with pointed ends were used to set up the ladder. Effectively and due to this time of year the stakes were banged into the ground till frozen ground was felt. 

Tonight... I see real changes in track elevation Vs this time last week. Wow. 

Frost at its best. 


fyi

gg


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## Engineercub (Oct 18, 2008)

I'm still trying to figure out what to do about elevation Gavin. I think I may implement the ladder system with concrete since the track is going to be 2' above the ground at some points. What is your ladder made out of Gavin? Will it rot? 

-Will


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Hi Will, 

My ladder system max elevation is at 30 inches over the grass and approx 22 inches over the flower bed. As to how I landscape up to this, I am thinking a combination of rock and dirt combined with shrubs landscaped in. When you review the pics, there is room for bridges, aqueducts, ponds, fountains etc and other types of suspended systems. The real fun and labor will indeed be with the landscaping. The final design will be created on the fly. 


I am effectively using Allterrain's (aka Brian's) ladder system. I believe his article(s) are in the archives. Failing that maybe he will read this posting and give you a quick link. In my case I needed to modify his design to meet my Zone 3 area and other things. PVC stringers, not solid ( solid trim not available up here ) but channel Trellis trim. 2x2" pressure treated spacers on 2' centers. I am not using PVC electrical pipe to peg the ladder, but am using 4x4 fence post spikes and 4x4 pressure treated posts to bring the ladder to final elevation. Posts on 2' centers. I have a frost concern and I'm trying to keep this railroad on a floating basis where possible. 


In your zone I suspect that Brian's ladder as designed would do you well. 


Later I will take a pic of these fence post spikes. 

gg



PS: Just bought a new Bachman Spectrum 4-4-0 Centennial Denver & Rio Grande on Ebay.... 1:20.3 SCALE Perfect scale for pre 1900's..... 


Yes Will..... 1:20.3 to "match" my 1:32 triplex (LOL) just need to "DCS" it.


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Gents, 

Change in tune after severe comments from the CFO... 

Although I remain CEO of the GR&G railroad, I have been fired as *Chief Engineering and Survey Manager* for this Railroad. 


I will post new pics as I drop the existing layout to grade. 

This CFO claims that I will save money and yes... save my expensive locos from* SEMPER type derailments. 
*

What in heck does she know !!!

GG


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Updated, 

The back has yet to be settled in and yes my back yard is not level but round like the earth.


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## GarryNCGRR (Jan 18, 2008)

Hey GG.....I like the new look better...looks more staple at that height! Should still be easy enough to work on and if you decide to fill it all or even mostly in...it won't take near as much fill to do it. Looks really good, nice flow to the roadbed.....I.just hope the frozen ground doesn't cause you any problems later. Keep at it and you'll have trains running...( and hopefully not falling







) in no time at all. Looking forward to more pictures, so we know how things are proceeding.

Garry NCGRR


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Thanks Garry, 

It is indeed to read about the technique and then .... try to do it ! WOW. Two different worlds. 

My bones ache (bending over and stooping.) ... and yes I returned material to the hardware store to replace it with other material due to "my original engineering". My world is not flat, my world continues to be frozen in May..... ( As for the saga, do I hear any sympathy here? ) 


Fun stuff... I have taken concepts from this forum and used them. Thanks guys for allowing me to learn. 

Brian's pics makes it look easy... ummmm ... 


As for frost heave"Y" will move however I can bang in or shim out. Z axis is OK... I have slip in the 4" 4x4 concrete anchors ( pinning to the surface ground only) ... X axis... bit of slip availability too if I undo a screw. 

gg


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

Yup looks great







keep up the good work and you will be runnin in no time...


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Posted By Nicholas Savatgy on 05/10/2009 7:32 PM
Yup looks great







keep up the good work and you will be runnin in no time... 




Yo Nick, those custom trailer transports....How many could I fit on the 9' diameter track here???? They are a VERY nice piece of work. Call them "beyond my scale" !


gg


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

*No Gavin they wont fit on 9ft dia but theres plenty of stuff out there that will. look forward to seeeing some stuff run on your layout







*


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## GarryNCGRR (Jan 18, 2008)

One thing I have managed to learn while working on my layout is at first things move along really slowly...as we figure things out for the first time. Later...at least with me....you get into a system of knowing what you are doing ....learning what works and what does not.....and then working from that. Little by little it all seems to get easier....really it does!







No matter what...IT IS fun.....especially to see what was planned on paper come to life in front of you, even if it might need a little tweaking here and there, or repair from time to time. Always something you see that someone else did that you want to try...I now know I have to live to over 100 to get it all done the way I want it done, no, with the speed I go....well over 100








Anyway....have fun.....and......WE will be watching!!!

Garry


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## aceinspp (Jan 2, 2008)

Looking good. The fun is in the challenge of building. Some times plans don't always work as it should







Later RJd


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Totally agree with all. Trial and error and some frustration. However was it ever satisfying to sit back at the end of the day and admire the wonderful way in which I was able to hide my mistakes !















gg


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Well, managed to complete the rough in for the ladder and effectively laid my first section using the bender. 

Not bad.... 

Those split jaw joints: I only have one operating eye... any tricks for installing these guys as I don't want to lie on my belly trying to line the buggers up? 


Using the Aristo #6's and thanks to Train Li's frog inserts very smooth. Will probably refit the switches using Train Li stuff as time moves on. 

Count the mistakes and be correct and I will give you a free "Semper Errant Loco" ! 


gg


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Rather than counting all those little nit-picky little errors, how about if I just point out the first and most important one?


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Posted By Semper Vaporo on 05/15/2009 5:20 PM
Rather than counting all those little nit-picky little errors, how about if I just point out the first and most important one? 





Oh Semper, spare me grief and I promise to be nice to you...


gg


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Daing! I wanted the "errant loco"...

Wait a minute... I already have it!


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Posted By Semper Vaporo on 05/15/2009 6:17 PM
Daing! I wanted the "errant loco"...

Wait a minute... I already have it!







LOL and plus !!!!!!!! 



Thanks to you I KNOW....


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

You knew that getting up this morning was your greatest mistake and that all the others are the result of it?

Well... Hmmm....


Pkgs.


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Yup... low life I am... 

need to demo beginnings of GR&G to the CFO who just got home and was calling her shrink.... 


gg


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Semper , 

Did a Earth google on Cedar Rapids Iowa and I really do think that you are in the boonies... Do you have water out there? 

Searched the area for trains. No go... They are all errant out there... 


ooohhhh !!














gg
















PS: check out my area of St Albert Alberta..... "water" and trains....


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By GG on 05/17/2009 5:48 PM
Semper , 

Did a Earth google on Cedar Rapids Iowa and I really do think that you are in the boonies... Do you have water out there? 

Searched the area for trains. No go... They are all errant out there... 


ooohhhh !!














gg
















PS: check out my area of St Albert Alberta..... "water" and trains....












In the "boonies"? 

Water? Hey we had the 5th worst natural disaster in U.S. history last June... the Red Cedar River destroyed 5000 homes in a flood that "could never happen".

Trains? If you followed the Rail lines in the area you will find the Union Pacific running east/west on the south side of town. The Canadian (or Canadien... wish you folk would make up your minds) National has a line in from the Northeast to exchange with U.P. The Iowa Northern comes in from the Northwest to do the same. The CRANDIC has the lines from C.R. to Iowa City to the south as well as a west line to the Amana Colonies, both of which exchange with the Iowa Interstate RR.

The Iowa Interstate is the company that purchased two Chinese QJ locomotives and here is a video I took of them turning a passenger excursion train on the Amana Wye junction with the CRANDIC.





There is also the Steam Locomotive at the Boone and Scenic Valley RR 130 miles to the west.

The Midwest Central RR (narrow gauge) is in Mt. Pleasant, Iowa 80 miles south (Midwest Old Settler's and Thresher's Reunion... 5 days ending on Labor Day every year!... GREAT PLACE! 3 steam locomotives, hundreds of Steam as well as gasoline farm tractors... better than the Iowa State Fair and the Iowa State Fair is the Greatest State Fair of them all! so just think how great "Thresher's" is!!!)






---------

P.S.: 

Okay... I checked out Street Albert Alberta... (did the Canuk that named it stutter a lot? And "St" is the abbreviation for "Street" ain't it?) I suppose it is a nice little burg, but I see only one measly RR line on the west side and it seems to keep itself as far away as it can and flees to the north west as soon as possible. 

I did find lots of nice Rail yards in Edmonton to the south... even added a Roundhouse and a Turntable to my list of such places (#'s 287 nd 288) I have found on Google Earth... interesting that the turntable is not at the focal point of the roundhouse! They are in two different yards separated by about 5 miles and a river!


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Kripes Semper.... what a reaction ! 

Bloody good. keep it up ! 


More to come 


gg


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Well, finished off the track install. 

Weather was warm 21C +. Used 3/4" washers to shim, 1" finishing nails to tack the track down. The Train Li bender made it all sooooo easy. 
Finally caught on to split jaw installation... a real snap. Am wary of the split jaw re-railer with slider expansion capability. (Dirt can foul this puppy up) 

Kept on breaking the dremel cutting wheel so took out big brother with the diamond cutter. Cuts like butter. 

Did a fantastic job covering up mistakes. I am so pleased with my creativity..... 


My back is killing me. Next project mount the Hudson on the line an do a continuity check. 

I will post more pics showing my gaffers later. 


gg


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

More shots: 



I was was about an inch short on the final section install. I hope that the train will run through the switches ok. 

Will advise when I do the test. 

gg


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

I do have rear tender protocoupler issues that may be related to the track design. Time will tell. 


Curves need tweeking as the Hudson was sweating a bit. The real test will be the TRIPLEX !!!


Update, blew out my 5 amp fuse so put in the max 10 amp.... will evaluate... 





gg


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

*HAAAAAAAAAAAA...Whats that stuffed DOG doing in the back round?*


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Posted By Nicholas Savatgy on 05/23/2009 7:40 PM


*HAAAAAAAAAAAA...Whats that stuffed DOG doing in the back round?*






Yes Nick, this one fearless canine aka "Shiba-Innu" has been in training with said loco over the past 3 months on the floor. Please note the dexterity at which this 10 year old canine "bounds" ahead of the fierce and ferocious locomotive as it ruthlessly bears down on her. 


And please note that this one fierce beast is called "Bagheera" and is so named after the sleuth "black panther" in Rudyard Kipling's book "The Jungle Book". 

Finally may all large scale fear this ruthless beast for her ability to dance and prance around any locos out there... 



gg


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By GG on 05/23/2009 8:20 PM
Posted By Nicholas Savatgy on 05/23/2009 7:40 PM


*HAAAAAAAAAAAA...Whats that stuffed DOG doing in the back round?*






Yes Nick, this one fearless canine aka "Shiba-Innu" has been in training with said loco over the past 3 months on the floor. Please note the dexterity at which this 10 year old canine "bounds" ahead of the fierce and ferocious locomotive as it ruthlessly bears down on her. 


And please note that this one fierce beast is called "Bagheera" and is so named after the sleuth "black panther" in Rudyard Kipling's book "The Jungle Book". 

Finally may all large scale fear this ruthless beast for her ability to dance and prance around any locos out there... 



gg






Sleuth? I thought it was a Pink Panther... and his name was Inspector Clouseau... well... never mind, same-o, same-o.


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Semper, you have hit the nail on the head. 

Thus, a one "Inspecteur Clouseau" will fill zeee forum with great "nothings and errants"..... 

This be sleuthed by the one and only.... "Inspecteur... Bagheera .... zeee dog..... " 


Not good for you or Nick I say...












gg


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By GG on 05/23/2009 9:57 PM
Semper, you have hit the nail on the head. 

Thus, a one "Inspecteur Clouseau" will fill zeee forum with great "nothings and errants"..... 

This be sleuthed by the one and only.... "Inspecteur... Bagheera .... zeee dog..... " 


Not good for you or Nick I say...












gg



















"Hit the nail on the head." ??? Why would I do that? Everybody knows that a nail is something to aim at while you hit your thumb.


Oh yeah... uhhh... Is that the video you want me to be suitably "Pectin'd lice" about? I ain't sure.










(Weird having a conversation in two different threads!)




Of course, you need to remember the conversation with the hotel manager... (Read with appropriate French English accent):

"Does your dog bite?"

"No."

(Growl, Snap, BITE!)

"I thought you said your dog didn't bite!"

"That is not my dog."


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Good one. 

Now the fun starts: 

[*]Tweak the railroad. Needs more leveling [/list] [*]Install ballast over the roadbed [/list] [*]Landscape with rocks, - create the theme [/list] [*]Get the station built [/list] [*]Figure out where the tunnel will be... [/list] [*]etc [/list] 
In the future, my railroad will be a waist level ! 


gg


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Just make sure you hire a good "Switch Tender"... otherwise you mght find your layout is actually a "waste level".


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Posted By Semper Vaporo on 05/24/2009 4:02 PM
Just make sure you hire a good "Switch Tender"... otherwise you mght find your layout is actually a "waste level".







Somehow I get the feeling that you do not qualify for this particular and critical job. ...


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By GG on 05/24/2009 4:45 PM
Posted By Semper Vaporo on 05/24/2009 4:02 PM
Just make sure you hire a good "Switch Tender"... otherwise you mght find your layout is actually a "waste level".







Somehow I get the feeling that you do not qualify for this particular and critical job. ... 




The "Official" FRA (Family Railway Administration) report on the accident did not identify the individual by name, but, since I am a professional "scape goat" (ya cain't lay-off the "scape goat" because then you would have nobody to blame the next time!) I admitted culpability in that minor little wheel/rail seperation incident on the CMBY RY. I am sure I could stay awake long enough to get your train out of the yard, but you do realize that the Engineer has some responsibility to look where he is taking the train!


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Agreed. 

Key is to make sure that the Engineer understands what those funny colored signs / lights means on the Railroad. 

I have a problem...


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Lights? Signs? ????


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Posted By Semper Vaporo on 05/24/2009 5:40 PM
Lights? Signs? ????




Now I understand... we both have a problem...


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## Engineercub (Oct 18, 2008)

Go GG GO!!! How is the layout coming along mister? 

-Will


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Well Will, the photo shots here says all... 

Making progress. 

How is your layout coming along. You have a big project, mine looks small and I look forward to seeing your progress. 


Regards, 

gg


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## Engineercub (Oct 18, 2008)

Well GG progress has stopped for financial reasons. CSX isn't running enough trains per day to keep a good income coming in so I am at a standstill. I'm lucky I haven't been cut back to a Conductor. There are 65+ people on my division furloughed right now. Things aren't looking so good at the moment. =( 

-Will


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Will, 

I am very involved in the oil-patch up here in Canada and yes... "dirty oil" so *some* would say. Those *"some"* people do not know the facts (distorted by way of convenience) and should stop driving their cars if they indeed want to make an impact. 


Better yet, supply both China and India with catalytic converters... free of charge! 


Moving beyond that and given that the resource industry can lead the way here I know that Capital dollars are once again about to be released into the economy. I have been told this. 

So, stock markets and resource funds will recover and yes you see this happening now. 


6 months from now you will see this reflected in your industry and if not sooner. 


This is a recession. And anyone who reads the papers knows that this is a deep one however one can't say that this is a "depression" like the dirty '30's.. The social networks and conditions are simply not there re comparitive unemployment etc. 


I am with you.. Stay stong. 


Still need photos !!!



gg


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Some videos of the triplex. Thanks to Ray my slider shorts on the #6 switches are resolved.


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Construction continues: 

Lava rock to ease the pain on the back and knees, 

Peonies and zone 3 blueberry bushes to sweeten the air and the palate in August. 


And a Japanese Yew for a bit of oriental flare. 

gg


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## jmill24 (Jan 11, 2008)

Gavin, it is looking good and thanks for videos. Looks like you are going to have a pleasant summer............Jim


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Jim, I have been looking at your Memorial Day videos and wow. A lot of work and effort. You must be proud. 


Is everything you run DCS or do you have DCC as well. 

That Green loco... what is it??? Is it MTH and I LOVE the sound. I need a couple of those as I have yet to get a Diesel. Plans are for MTH Diesels. 


Are you running 1:32 cars after everything including the Triplex? Or do you have a mix? 

What is your tightest radius? What is the tightest for the Triplex that you have run. My video you can see that 9' diameter curves is very tight for the Triplex ! 


The pic below is my other place where I will have more room for a proper setup. 

Regards, 


gg


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Almost ready for phase 2...


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

*I dont see that peein dog around anywere, did you stuff him yet? he he he







*


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)




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## lownote (Jan 3, 2008)

Looking very nice--now let's see some trains running!


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Film coming once the pee'n dog shows up for the shoot.... ;


gg


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## jmill24 (Jan 11, 2008)

Jim, I have been looking at your Memorial Day videos and wow. A lot of work and effort. You must be proud. 


Is everything you run DCS or do you have DCC as well. 

That Green loco... what is it??? Is it MTH and I LOVE the sound. I need a couple of those as I have yet to get a Diesel. Plans are for MTH Diesels. 


Are you running 1:32 cars after everything including the Triplex? Or do you have a mix? 

What is your tightest radius? What is the tightest for the Triplex that you have run. My video you can see that 9' diameter curves is very tight for the Triplex ! 



GG,
I run mostly DC track current with trackside TE, some R/C battery and now DCS with the triplex and GG1. I even have run battery loco on same track with DCS running.
Don't know which green loco you are talking about, the GN Mallet or Reading SD45. Both are Aristo and the SD45 was on battery power that day.
The triplex was pulling all my 1:29 GN freight cars.
The tightest radius I have run triplex on is 4 foot on my porch layout. The tightest on my large outdoor layout is 6.25 foot radius. I have some 5 foot on sidings.

Your layout is looking good...............Jim


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Thx Jim

8 foot diameter is tight for the Triplex however given its freight status... 10 SMPH is OK... I plan for an assembly of coal cars behind this lumbering loco... The sound that it produces is absolutely something else. ! 

Regards, 

gg


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## jmill24 (Jan 11, 2008)

*GG, The Aristo 2 bay look great behind the triplex as shown in my video............Jim
*


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Yes 2 bay... 

I need metal wheels and the Bachman comes recommended. 

Other options here? Metal wheels... 1:29 and cost effective? 

Not asking for the world am I??????????????












gg


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## jmill24 (Jan 11, 2008)

GG,
Check AML wheels at RLD. They fit Aristo................Jim

http://rldhobbies.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWCATS&Category=177


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Thanks Jim, Solution at hand ! 

gg


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## Totalwrecker (Feb 26, 2009)

Great lead thanks,
What is the profile on the wheels, flat or tapered?

Thanks,

John


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Posted By Totalwrecker on 06/23/2009 8:02 AM
Great lead thanks,
What is the profile on the wheels, flat or tapered?

Thanks,

John






Good question. Which design is better? 

gg


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

All wheels have taper on the treads. There are opinions on how much, but in my opinion, the "toylike" radical taper is no longer necessary. With a good fillet at the flange, close to a prototypical taper works, which is 2 degrees, if I remember right. 

What's more important is your back to back measurement, and your switches. This is what makes things work or derail. 

Regards, Greg


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Closer to 3 degrees (Arctan of 1 in 20 taper = 2.86 degrees), but that is still a far cry from the toy like slope on some wheels. Still that prototypical taper allows trucks to traverse 5 degree curves without the flanges producing friction on the rails, so greater taper should improve (reduce) rolling resistance in sharper curves in the typical garden RR.


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

*As Jim said, AML wheels work quite well on aristo cars but you do need to shim them with nylon washers to get a lot of the side to side play out, but for the money they are great wheels i bought 3 cases and saved a bunch over buying aristo wheels. i also like painting the wheels and couplers before installing.*


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

*And yes Aristos 2 bay still needs to be shimmed to get it to the rite kadee hieght, i used spare kadee box covers to make this happen. *


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

I also have some LGB cars with plastic wheels. 

Would these AML metal versions fit as well or am I off the mark here re scale?

gg


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

Posted By GG on 06/23/2009 11:38 AM
I also have some LGB cars with plastic wheels. 
 
Would these AML metal versions fit as well or am I off the mark here re scale?
 
gg


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Well....


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## Totalwrecker (Feb 26, 2009)

Might be dragging your knuckles... 

1:20.3 vs. 1:29 

D'oh


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

umm..... twas a nice idea while it lasted....


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## Totalwrecker (Feb 26, 2009)

Thanks for the notes on the wheel profile. I don't need a lot of taper... in the toylike catagory, but I do like watching them track. 

Since I converted to on board batteries, my loco is a lot lighter, so eliminating drag is important. 

Sometimes cheaper means less.... 

John


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## Totalwrecker (Feb 26, 2009)

We sort of skipped your question.
Wheel profile slopes down from flange fillet (a radius of metal) to the outer edge of the wheel. As the truck enters a curve, centrifical force pushes the flange up against the outer rail, because the wheel is at it's greatest diameter and the smaller diameter is on the other rail the axle rolls like a cone and is some what self steering. With a solid axle and flat wheels one or both wheels will slip a tad...

Think of a car's differential...accurate name eh? Around a corner the wheels turn at different speeds.

Back to your wheels, they might work, but wouldn't look right. 

John


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## Nicholas Savatgy (Dec 17, 2008)

Posted By GG on 06/23/2009 12:16 PM
Well....

















Yes they will work with no problem and will look fine... [*Did you stuff that pee'n Dog yet?]







*


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

NIck, that Pee'n dog is stuffed from breakfast.... She needs the day for resting and digesting and maybe later I can get her to chase some trains. 










gg


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## silverstatespecialties (Jan 2, 2008)

Looks good! 

Beautiful dog too!


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Gents, 

This is turning out to be a fun thread. 

This is not about my layout developmento over time, however it is about the way the thread "drifts" from one subject to another. 

Casual, with spikes of jokes/fun included. Including drifts into tangental topics which are VERY relevant to the hobby type person.

Direct or indirect.... all applies. 

However should the thread be tech and solution based... I for one recognize that I should shut up...  

I am trainable.... 

gg


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Posted By Semper Vaporo on 06/23/2009 11:26 AM
Closer to 3 degrees (Arctan of 1 in 20 taper = 2.86 degrees), but that is still a far cry from the toy like slope on some wheels. Still that prototypical taper allows trucks to traverse 5 degree curves without the flanges producing friction on the rails, so greater taper should improve (reduce) rolling resistance in sharper curves in the typical garden RR.


Semper... this is not protypical of an errant loco here... 

I plan to "tan my arc" rather than "Arctan" so as to induce a 2.86 degree slope on my wheels.. 

I have ethics here and your 3 degree slope is indeed a challenge for us people who have a true interest in GR "curves" ... 

Shame... 

gg


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## Semper Vaporo (Jan 2, 2008)

Posted By GG on 06/30/2009 7:10 PM
Posted By Semper Vaporo on 06/23/2009 11:26 AM
Closer to 3 degrees (Arctan of 1 in 20 taper = 2.86 degrees), but that is still a far cry from the toy like slope on some wheels. Still that prototypical taper allows trucks to traverse 5 degree curves without the flanges producing friction on the rails, so greater taper should improve (reduce) rolling resistance in sharper curves in the typical garden RR.


Semper... this is not protypical of an errant loco here... 

I plan to "tan my arc" rather than "Arctan" so as to induce a 2.86 degree slope on my wheels.. 

I have ethics here and your 3 degree slope is indeed a challenge for us people who have a true interest in GR "curves" ... 

Shame... 

gg



As long as nobody "tans yer hyde" you'll be okay.


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

I get my hide tanned on a regular basis on this forum...


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Going back to my first posting comment: "Nothing is level"










gg



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1NJaOxXfg0E


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## GG (Jan 1, 2009)

Proof is in the video









gg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gp1iCrC2AJA


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