# How Does One Gauge the Wheels on AristoCraft FA Motor Blocks?



## toddalin (Jan 4, 2008)

I am trying to add additional pick-ups to the AristoCraft FA/FB motor blocks and note that three of the four axles are under-gauge. The axles with the motors are just a bit wider than their counterparts.

How does one go about adjusting the gauge on these?

Thanks


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

The easiest way that works ok is use a thin piece of brass shim stock and cut a piece that will wrap but not overlap on the axle.

Greg


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## toddalin (Jan 4, 2008)

Then what? Pry on it from the block? Are the wheels just a press fit?

At this point, none of the integral pick-up function any longer. My intent is to simply take a piece of brass/copper ~3" long x 1/4" tall x ~1/64" thick sheetstock and cut a length that will wedge down into the slot where the outter frames meet the block and let it protrude between the wheels. A piece of foam tape will then secure each side and provide "spring" to push the sheetstock against the inside of the wheels. A piece of wire would be soldered to this sheetstock and meet the connector that is already in place. This would be a whole lot cheaper than replacing all of the motor blocks on three units.

But it is important to get all of the wheels at a similar distance from the motor block to equalize the contact pressures so the wheels need to be in gauge.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Sorry, thought you knew that the aristo wheels and axles are a taper fit. Over gauge you can lap the wheels further onto the tapered axle.

But the "standard" is under gauge. So you remove the wheels and make a shaped piece of maybe 2 to 4 thousandths brass shim, form it over the tapered axle, without overlapping itself, and then put the wheel back on.

Ok, now on to your next question... are these ball bearing units or not? 

Did you go to my site, under motive power...aristo...2 axle motor blocks? Info there.

Greg


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## toddalin (Jan 4, 2008)

So, if I understand correctly, you basically pry the wheels off, make a "cone" of the thinnest brass you can find, put the cone over the axle, and try to put the wheel over the cone pressing it to the correct depth.

Now I'm thinking that rather than making cones, one could pry the wheels off, coat the axle with CA. Let it dry, and do this a couple times, then press the wheels back on with the CA taking up the slop. Over time, the CA may even help bind the wheel to the axle when it takes the final cure. Assuming that the wheels pry off easily, this is very do-able.

Bearings? Never entered my mind.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

if you can get a consistent coat thickness of CA you are a better man than me.

Did not say thinnest, the thickness will depend on how much you need to increase the gauge.

I gave you a range, but it's a guess based on past experience. 4 thou did it for me. But there are huge variations.

Not understanding your bearings comment at all... to address your pickup problem, I asked you if you had the ball bearing version of the motor block... answer on your question depends on the answer. I referenced my site in case you did not know how to spot.

Greg


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## toddalin (Jan 4, 2008)

I would not expect a constant thickness on the CA. I just want to build up the thickness and I'll let the wheels' centers "turn it down" by virture of being pressed on.

Nor did I know or even care about bearings just so that I can get the wheels off to apply the CA and pressed back on. I don't even want to open the motor blocks if it's not necessary. I didn't even want to remove the side frames if I didn't have too.

If there are bearings that would interfere with this, that's why I was asking about it before trying to pry off the wheels.

Would they come into play in wheel removal/replacement from the axle or is it something I don't need to be concerned with? I think these are the earlier units.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

I'm going to try one last time...

Your comment about power pickup from the wheels, to help give suggestions, I need to know if you have ball bearing wheels or not.

I will give up after this email if you still don't read what I am saying.

Depending on which block type you have, there may be a much easier fix than what you are proposing to do. If you don't want any suggestions on how to restore the power pickup to the motor blocks, just say so, and I will quit trying to help.

Greg

p.s. coating the axles with CA should _*ensure *_no power pickup from the wheels using the existing system. I would advise my suggestion of the brass (conductive) shim.


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## Ted Doskaris (Oct 7, 2008)

Something to check:

For track power users, there can be an open circuit or intermittent power pickup applicable to old version fully sprung motor blocks that have wheel axle tips that go into the sideframes.

The factory wire in an eyelet located on the "A" frame that houses the truck may have no or intermittent electrical continuity due to poor crimping exacerbated by oxidation. I have discovered many with this condition. The connecting eyelets are suppose to make contact with the sideframe's buss bar.

See illustration below.










-Ted


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## toddalin (Jan 4, 2008)

Thanks guys,

Most of those parts have worn out and I have always had problems with the brass bar and eyelet continuity. The joint where the eyelet meets gets hot and melts the plastic and the eyelet "sinks back into the melted area" loosing contact and increasing oxidation because as the contact patch gets smaller, the more current is forced through the ever smaller area making it hotter further increasing oxidation, etc.

I propose a completely different approach and CA on the axles has absolutely no bearing on the workings. (OOOH did I make a pun?)

So what could be easier than this??? Just remove the wire from the eyelet and solder it to the bar. You don't even need to remove the side frames. And I guess that while it would be nice, I really don't need to regauge the wheels either.


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## Dan Pierce (Jan 2, 2008)

I have found the wires inside the heat shrink stop conducting to the eyelet. Fixed many power issues by removing the heat shrink and resoldering the wires.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Yeah, simple fix, and not a bad idea to do to the loco when first getting it.


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## toddalin (Jan 4, 2008)

Could it really be any easier? 

I already have the brass and in the past a forum member had sent me several bags of various sizes of relay contacts.

Cut the brass to length and sand clean.

Drill a hole in either end.

Put a contact in the hole and solder from the rear.

Grind down the contact/solder joint and slip it in place between the wheels.

I'll probably solder a thin piece of brass wire to the existing pick-up wire and just slip it under the main bar (with a similar, but unconnected wire under the other side) to provide a "spring action" and ensure constant tension as the contact wears. Then I can easily remove the bar to change the contacts when necessary or move the brass wire to increase/decrease the tension against the wheels.

The wheels aren't binding and ohm meter says I'm good to go.

I may need a piece of double sided tape to hold it in place when the wheel revolve.

Sorry for thinking outside of the box/block Greg, but that's what I do.


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## Ted Doskaris (Oct 7, 2008)

Very clever, Todd!

Observations:

It may be the "floppy axle" is limited in how much it can rock when the loco traverses less than ideal track work.
The wheel treads look typical for Aristo - plating gone & oxidation, likely pitting, thereby, compromising electrical from the rails.

Thank you,
-Ted


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## toddalin (Jan 4, 2008)

Ted Doskaris said:


> Very clever, Todd!
> 
> Observations:
> 
> ...


I guess we'll see.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Actually, it looks like traction tires still in place.


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## toddalin (Jan 4, 2008)

No traction tires. That's all wear. As I said, the existing pick-up parts are worn out, but the motors still function fine.


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## Greg Elmassian (Jan 3, 2008)

Well, I gave up on trying to help you with an easy solution... wearing out of the pickup parts is not necessarily true, but I prefer to think inside the box first, i.e. make a fix with the existing proven system, used by thousands of Aristo users.

There's often a simple fix, but your snappy comment and our history makes me give up before it gets worse.

I tried 3 times. Enough.

Greg


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## toddalin (Jan 4, 2008)

I know you did and I appreciate it.

But I've had the sideframes apart many times and got tired of trying to fix the problem that way only to have it manifest itself again almost immediately. I felt that something new was called for and this seemed the easiest solution with what I had at hand and no $$$ outlay.


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## toddalin (Jan 4, 2008)

Actually, one of the pick-ups was a bit too tight against the back of the wheel. But I simply put screwdrivers between the back of the wheel and the motor block at the front and rear and pryed on both simultaneously and the wheel popped out a hair right into place.

Thanks again guys.


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## toddalin (Jan 4, 2008)

Ok, I made four and found a problem in that the wheels don't run true and as such, they get loose and tight about the contacts enough to cause loss of contact then bind during a rotation.

So, I'll try to use thinner, and much more flexible, copper "extensions" keeping the brass for thickness in the center to keep things inplace. The extensions can then be bent out a bit to contact the inner wheel and will flex with runout rather than bind up the axle.

I also ordered a gear puller that I should be able to use to better distance and plane the wheels to the motor blocks reducing runout so that they run truer to stay in contact with the pickups. I should be able to do this only removing the sideframes.


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## toddalin (Jan 4, 2008)

This is what I've found to work in gauging the FA/FB wheel sets. This may also work on other engines.

I used a Dremel to cut slots to the center of two fat fender washers and these serve as spacers during the "big squeeze." The tape serves both as a shim to get the gauge right, and as a means to pull the washers out once the wheels are in gauge. You don't even have to remove the trucks, just undo the sideframes and let them flop to the sides during this operation.

If the wheels are to tight, move the closer one out a hair using a couple flat bladed screwdrivers to pry against the motor block then drop in the spacers and do the squeeze.


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