# live steam LMS Turbomotive



## Werner Jeggli (Jan 3, 2008)

Dear all,

Anybody interrested in - or scratch building - live steam turbine locos? I've put a video of my latest efforts on you tube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tt7wVtmT3Cw . Exchange of ideas and experiences would be very welcome!

Werner Jeggli


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## HMeinhold (Jan 2, 2008)

Werner,
welcome to the forum. I have been following your adventures with steam turbines for some time. So please keep us informed. Unfortunately the number of scratch builders in this forum has dwindled somehow over time. I am not sure if someone will join you in building a steam turbine loco, as most of us are busy with current projects. But as I said at least I am very interested in your project.
Regards


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## David Leech (Dec 9, 2008)

Hi Werner, 
Yes, welcome to MLS. 
I have had the LMS Turbomotive going as a project for about 20 years. 
Possibly after you came to visit me in Canada - Has it been that long? 
It started when I bought an unfinished 'to be electric' LMS Princess, and then managed to get a couple of vacuum powered aircraft instrument cores, with the idea of using the rotors as the turbine. 
I was concerned that as the cores are fairly heavy, that at speed there might be enough gyroscopic effect to cause the loco to derail, depending on the attitude of the spinning rotor. 
I was also not sure that if geared for a decent scale 100 mph maximum, whether it would be able to actually start from a standing start. Maybe it will need a centrifugal clutch to allow the rotor to get up to usable rpm? 
And then there is reverse - do you have as on the real one, a second turbine for reverse, or use a gearbox. 
Well, anyway, that's as far as the project went as have not made time to do any experiments with the rotor. 
One day I may get around to it. 
All the best, 
David Leech, Delta, Canada


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## Phippsburg Eric (Jan 10, 2008)

that is an interesting project! It will be a nice looking engine too! Please keep us informed of your progress.

here is his video:


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## Werner Jeggli (Jan 3, 2008)

Gentlemen, thank you for your welcome and your interrest. David, I remember visiting your place very well. It was in May 1998. I was much impressed by your method of making excellent coaches by relatively simple means! 
If you send me a couple of pictures of your prospective rotor, give me the main dimensions and tell me what material it is made of, I'll be able to tell you how big your chances of success would be. With the rotor shaft arranged vertically, you will not have an adverse gyroscopic effect (on level tracks). As for reversal of rotation - I have an inner row of crude, reverse oriented "blades" in the same rotor. (I still tap myself on the shoulder for having had this idea, I have not seen any such solution in the real world!). See also the description in G1MRA Newsletter 212, Winter 2006 - 7. In addition, I can assure you that the starting torque poses no problem. 

Eric, how do I insert a video directly into the Message? 

regards Werner Jeggli


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## steveciambrone (Jan 2, 2008)

Werner, 
What is the total gear reduction on your engine? 

I really like your engineering efforts. Very well done. 

Thanks 
Steve


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## Werner Jeggli (Jan 3, 2008)

Steve, 
The reduction gear ratio is 84:1 . The 1/32nd scale speed of 160 km/h corresponds to an actual speed of 83.3m/min. The driver diameters are 0,062m. At this speed, the drivers have to rotate at 428 rpm. This means, that the turbine rotor then spins at 35'952 rpm !!! 
regards Werner Jeggli


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## steveciambrone (Jan 2, 2008)

Thanks Werner, it is a very interesting project. 

Thanks 
Steve


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## deltatrains (Nov 25, 2010)

http://www.mylargescale.com/Communi...fault.aspx
Hello Werner. I have admired one of your previous projects in Garden Railways magazine and mentioned in the above link in this forum at that link. I am very happy to view some more of your work. Thank you for your post and looking forward to more of this project. 
All the best, Peter.


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## Werner Jeggli (Jan 3, 2008)

Here is the progress report nr.2. Turbomotive interim report nr.2 The video sequences were taken on the occasion of a 10 day coach trip to England by a group of 20 G1MRA members, inluding engines and stock. The performance of my engine was quite satifactory.

regards Werner


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## Cougar Rock Rail (Jan 2, 2008)

What an excellent example of engineering and craftmanship! 

Congratulations on a very successful project Werner, and looking forward to report #3! 

Keith


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## placitassteam (Jan 2, 2008)

Werner, That is fantastic! I wouldn't have thought that a gage1 boiler could generate enough steam to run a turbine. I don't need to see the finished model to be very impressed! Thanks for posting.


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## BigRedOne (Dec 13, 2012)

Very neat project!


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## Accucraft UK (Sep 16, 2013)

That is very, very impressive! It makes me wonder what the original locomotive sounded like.... 

Graham.


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## Werner Jeggli (Jan 3, 2008)

Keith,

Here it is: 




regards Werner




Cougar Rock Rail said:


> What an excellent example of engineering and craftmanship!
> 
> Congratulations on a very successful project Werner, and looking forward to report #3!
> 
> Keith


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## placitassteam (Jan 2, 2008)

Fantastic! Looks like it has lots of power.


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## Beddhist (Dec 17, 2013)

I was wondering about the orange steam generator car. Then I stumbled upon Werner's previous project: 




Very impressive.

Cheers,
Peter.


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## Werner Jeggli (Jan 3, 2008)

Peter,

The turbine driving the Turbomotive now previously powered the "Mathematiker". That was before its conversion to turbine-electric drive.

By the way - my third turbine loco is the "Dampfsprinter", seen below

regards Werner




Beddhist said:


> I was wondering about the orange steam generator car. Then I stumbled upon Werner's previous project: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rA1pB6aohAM
> 
> Very impressive.
> 
> ...



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9AeL31nCRrA&feature=youtu.be


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## Werner Jeggli (Jan 3, 2008)

Gentlemen,

With the exception of the cab fittings, the engine is now finished and performing well. See video :






regards Werner


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## seadawg (Jan 2, 2008)

So is that the actual sound it makes at 4:42 in the video? Sounds like a steam turbine spinning up to me!

AWESOME!


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## Cougar Rock Rail (Jan 2, 2008)

That is an amazing accomplishment--great work Werner!
A unique and beautiful locomotive.

Keith


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## Garratt (Sep 15, 2012)

Very impressive Werner.
I have pasted the video below which I eventually found in your first post.
Seeing what is under the hood satisfied some of my curiosity. 

Andrew


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## Beddhist (Dec 17, 2013)

Werner Jeggli said:


> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9AeL31nCRrA&feature=youtu.be


This video is private.


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## Werner Jeggli (Jan 3, 2008)

Hi Peter,

I don't know why the link does not work in your case. Search in Youtube under *Turbomotive Longjumeau" and you should have another access!

regards Werner


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## Garratt (Sep 15, 2012)

Werner, the video link above does not work for me either. As Beddhist said, it is set as 'Private' in YouTube. 
Only you can see it. You can change the setting for that particular video in YouTube. 
I did find another video on your YouTube channel that works, pasted below. 






Andrew


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## Beddhist (Dec 17, 2013)

You have to click "publish" or "share". Uploading is not enough...


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## Werner Jeggli (Jan 3, 2008)

Beddhist said:


> You have to click "publish" or "share". Uploading is not enough...


Peter, 

It is on "Public" and works in Europe and the US! In your comment Nr.17 of this thread you posted one of my older video - and that one I cannot see (privat).

here is the direct adress, maybe this works?






regards Werner


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## Beddhist (Dec 17, 2013)

Thanks Werner, that works.


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## BigRedOne (Dec 13, 2012)

Remarkable project! Thanks for letting us know about it.


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## Joe Johnson (Jan 2, 2008)

Dankeshoen!

Just curious, how does the steam usage compare to a similar piston engine?


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## steamtom1 (Jan 2, 2008)

I'm trying to search the dark corners of my memory, but didn't Charlie Meihner have a steam turbine locomotive @ DH back in the mid '90s? Anybody remember that?


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## Werner Jeggli (Jan 3, 2008)

Joe Johnson said:


> Dankeshoen!
> 
> Just curious, how does the steam usage compare to a similar piston engine?


Joe, you'r wellcome.
The relatively small boiler of this english outline engine is the same as for piston locos. The burner jet is the same (0.2 mm dia). Therefore steam demand is also comparable.

regards Werner


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## du-bousquetaire (Feb 14, 2011)

Hi Werner:
I am glad that you could share this beautiful acheivement on myLargescale.com . It is a wonderfull model of a fantastic prototype that you did. I am glad that the Longjumeau video could be shown, as I was following you at block with my Chapelon and 6 J&M, and it was difficult to keep up with your LMS turbo.
Concerrning an earlier post about the possibilities of turbines with the larger scales there is a famous French model engeneer who did it: Monsieur Bender unfortunatly very ill nowdays. His turbo locomotive was like your mathematiker shrouded to look more like a diesel than a steam loco but I remmeber seing it haul quite a few passengers around the Rambolitrain musum 71/4" gauge railway while we ran gauge one inside it. More recently he experimented gaz turbine motors using truck engines turbo parts with quite explosive success. But unfortunatly his illness prevent him applying this to a locomotive, he just ran the power unit. Denis knows him also, I sure would love to see you run your turbo locoomotive at my steam up in Valmondois Saturday. Keep up this fascinating development . Simon


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## Werner Jeggli (Jan 3, 2008)

Hi Simon,

I'd love to talk to this Peter Bender. Do you know in what area he lives in ? 
Thank you for your invitation to the Valmondois steam up. Can not make it - sorry.

Werner



du-bousquetaire said:


> Hi Werner:
> I am glad that you could share this beautiful acheivement on myLargescale.com . It is a wonderfull model of a fantastic prototype that you did. I am glad that the Longjumeau video could be shown, as I was following you at block with my Chapelon and 6 J&M, and it was difficult to keep up with your LMS turbo.
> Concerrning an earlier post about the possibilities of turbines with the larger scales there is a famous French model engeneer who did it: Monsieur Bender unfortunatly very ill nowdays. His turbo locomotive was like your mathematiker shrouded to look more like a diesel than a steam loco but I remmeber seing it haul quite a few passengers around the Rambolitrain musum 71/4" gauge railway while we ran gauge one inside it. More recently he experimented gaz turbine motors using truck engines turbo parts with quite explosive success. But unfortunatly his illness prevent him applying this to a locomotive, he just ran the power unit. Denis knows him also, I sure would love to see you run your turbo locoomotive at my steam up in Valmondois Saturday. Keep up this fascinating development . Simon


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